All-around crappy football

[Patler]

No, not just the Packers. So far the games I have watched this year come down to who plays the least poorly, not who plays the best. There have been a lot of close games, mostly because both teams are playing poorly.

Just seems to be a lot of mediocre football being played this year. The only excitement has been from close scores, not from seeing good football. One team doesn't win it, the other one loses it; if you know what I mean.

Particularly in the NFC North. Has any team really played well yet in any game?

[denverYooper]

No, not just the Packers. So far the games I have watched this year come down to who plays the least poorly, not who plays the best. There have been a lot of close games, mostly because both teams are playing poorly.

Just seems to be a lot of mediocre football being played this year. The only excitement has been from close scores, not from seeing good football. One team doesn't win it, the other one loses it; if you know what I mean.

Particularly in the NFC North. Has any team really played well yet in any game?

Lions vs. the Rams?

[mmmdk]

No, not just the Packers. So far the games I have watched this year come down to who plays the least poorly, not who plays the best. There have been a lot of close games, mostly because both teams are playing poorly.

Just seems to be a lot of mediocre football being played this year. The only excitement has been from close scores, not from seeing good football. One team doesn't win it, the other one loses it; if you know what I mean.

Particularly in the NFC North. Has any team really played well yet in any game?

Yup and that's yet another reason why the sulky injury card is useless, dear McCarthy apologists.

The above not aimed at you, Patler.

[Joemailman]

Parity has hit the NFC this year. The good teams from last year are mostly struggling, and the bad teams from last year are better. So for instance, when the Lions almost beat the Packers, we don't really credit the Lions. We say the Packers played bad. In a few weeks, I think we'll start to see some teams separate themselves from the rest of the pack. (No pun intended). :D

[Bossman641]

Sulky injury card?

Look at our fuckin team. Anyone who doesn't acknowledge that injuries are clearly holding this team back is more blind then any TT or MM apologist.

[Patler]

Sulky injury card?

Look at our fuckin team. Anyone who doesn't acknowledge that injuries are clearly holding this team back is more blind then any TT or MM apologist.

Were they playing well before Mathews, Barnett, Burnett, Tauscher, Finley, Picket and Neal got hurt? Not really.

This team was being "held back" even before the injuries hit it in the last two weeks.

[Bossman641]

Sulky injury card?

Look at our fuckin team. Anyone who doesn't acknowledge that injuries are clearly holding this team back is more blind then any TT or MM apologist.

Were they playing well before Mathews, Barnett, Burnett, Tauscher, Finley, Picket and Neal got hurt? Not really.

This team was being "held back" even before the injuries hit it in the last two weeks.

I wouldn't really say they were playing well, but certainly better then now. Insert cliche but "this is the NFl and it is difficult to win games." Especially this year, anyone who has played pick 'em can tell you that.

It seems like 90% of games I've watched this year (not just Packers) comes down to the final 5 minutes. When you don't have 1/3 of your starters and a lot of your impact players it is tough to win. Nearly every game this year, we can point to a handful of plays that decided the game.

On top of that, McCarthy's teams have always started slowly, which is a discussion for another time. This year, with all the injuries, I doubt they can make the second half jump they normally do.

[mraynrand]

Anyone who doesn't acknowledge that injuries are clearly holding this team back is more blind then any TT or MM apologist.

How many injuries did they have when they ran up 18 penalties against Chicago?

Shouldn't an offensive genius like McCarthy be able to generate more than 20 points from this group, even without Finley and Grant? Shouldn't the offense be able to adjust to protect Rodgers from the same D lineman beating the same O lineman, the same way, again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again ?

[channtheman]

Injuries are a factor yes, but not as big as some want to say. Very good point made by mranyrand. Before the injuries we racked up 18 penalties agains the Bears. Today, we couldn't coach up a player to not line up over a center on a punt (probably because the coaches didn't even know the rule).

I know though, injuries are the reason we have bad coaching and players who can't execute. I mean, how can you possibly expect James Jones to actually catch a ball when Finley is out? Can you really expect Rodgers to not run into a sack or not throw to the open guy in the flat when Chillar, Barnett, Burnett, Bigby, Pickett, and Matthews are all out on defense?

This team flat out sucks and injuries are only a convenient excuse.

[bobblehead]

Sulky injury card?

Look at our fuckin team. Anyone who doesn't acknowledge that injuries are clearly holding this team back is more blind then any TT or MM apologist.

Were they playing well before Mathews, Barnett, Burnett, Tauscher, Finley, Picket and Neal got hurt? Not really.

This team was being "held back" even before the injuries hit it in the last two weeks.

weren't we 3-1 with one game the refs took away from us while being "held back"??

[pbmax]

Sulky injury card?

Look at our fuckin team. Anyone who doesn't acknowledge that injuries are clearly holding this team back is more blind then any TT or MM apologist.

Were they playing well before Mathews, Barnett, Burnett, Tauscher, Finley, Picket and Neal got hurt? Not really.

This team was being "held back" even before the injuries hit it in the last two weeks.

weren't we 3-1 with one game the refs took away from us while being "held back"??
While you and I might disagree on the cause, McCarthy clearly has not yet figured out how to ignite the offense. Even when Finley was available, they were leaving points on the table. Capers seems to be getting about the most that could be expected out of his 2nd team D, but M3 has a way to go.

[Tarlam!]

Miami had its way with the Packer defense yesterday, or at least it looked that way (I only have the drive tracker and your comments to go by). Still, the makeshift, injury ridden defense held Miami to a manageable 20 points. That's on Capers, IMHO.

Now TT is getting hammered for the OL woes, while he was being lauded for re-signing the vet OTs earlier in the year. Rodgers isn't making it easier on them with his "sack me" play. And when he does throw it between the numbers, it gets dropped.

It must be frustrating for the "D", that when they do get a stop either ST screw it up, or the "O" can't sustain a drive.

Everybody's coming down hard on M3, I know I am. But to try and remain objective, I've decided to see how he leads this team out of adversity, before I call for his head.

As Patler pointed out, the league is full of crappy teams this season and maybe lady luck will return to the team.

I think TT should consider sacrificing Slocum in an attempt to appease the Football Gods, but a goat might be enough.

[pbmax]

I think this year has shown that Thompson has put together a very good roster with depth. Tackle looked like a problem this week with Bulaga, but he is a rookie starting for a vet, its going to take some time for him. And while the D has a pass rush problem with Matthews and Neal out, it wasn't entirely overmatched against the Skins or Fins.

What is not excusable, is that we seem to be on track for McCarthy to start making serious changes to the offense by week 8 like last year and slightly earlier in 2007. I never figured out what caused slow starts or the inevitable 3 game losing streak under Sherman, but with McCarthy, he is stubborn about altering the plan.

[Fritz]

Sulky injury card?

Look at our fuckin team. Anyone who doesn't acknowledge that injuries are clearly holding this team back is more blind then any TT or MM apologist.

Were they playing well before Mathews, Barnett, Burnett, Tauscher, Finley, Picket and Neal got hurt? Not really.

This team was being "held back" even before the injuries hit it in the last two weeks.

weren't we 3-1 with one game the refs took away from us while being "held back"??
While you and I might disagree on the cause, McCarthy clearly has not yet figured out how to ignite the offense. Even when Finley was available, they were leaving points on the table. Capers seems to be getting about the most that could be expected out of his 2nd team D, but M3 has a way to go.

I agree with this point. Since MM is the defacto offensive coordinator, you can say that the Packers' defensive coordinator is outcoaching his offensive counterpart, despite losing more pieces - and m ore key pieces - than the offense has lost. And on top of that, going into the season most people believe the offense was more talented than the defense any way.

[Patler]

Sulky injury card?

Look at our fuckin team. Anyone who doesn't acknowledge that injuries are clearly holding this team back is more blind then any TT or MM apologist.

Were they playing well before Mathews, Barnett, Burnett, Tauscher, Finley, Picket and Neal got hurt? Not really.

This team was being "held back" even before the injuries hit it in the last two weeks.

weren't we 3-1 with one game the refs took away from us while being "held back"??

Yes, but playing the way they did getting there didn't lead me to believe they would keep it up, especially when playing teams better than Buffalo and less snake-bit than Detroit. They self-destructed against Chicago, for example.

[packerbacker1234]

Grant. Enough said.

Our offense has completely changed without him on the field. I think we all underestimated his value to our offensive scheme.

[ThunderDan]

The team we almost beat last week at FedEx field was 2 inches from beating the big bad IND Colts last night. Maybe WASH isn't as bad as we all think.

We need Clay back on defense.

We need to shorten up our passing routes. More 3 step drops. Run delays at the DE on 2nd downs in passing situations. We easily could have turned Bulaga's problem with the bullrush into an advantage by letting the DE get up field and run right into the position he vacated.

All in all on the NFL level there has really been no team that has been dominant week in and week out.

[denverYooper]

Grant. Enough said.

Our offense has completely changed without him on the field. I think we all underestimated his value to our offensive scheme.

Losing Grant certainly hurt our offense but it's not clear whether it's because they won't give 20 carries to another back or not. BJack played pretty well the last 2 weeks but they only gave him 22 carries total in the 2 weeks:
10/115
12/53

Maybe they think that BJack won't be as effective on 20+ carries. I don't know. It's almost as if one of Rodgers or M3 took the loss of Grant as a mandate to get nuts with the passing game.

[Tarlam!]

The team we almost beat last week at FedEx field was 2 inches from beating the big bad IND Colts last night. Maybe WASH isn't as bad as we all think.

I didn't see the game, but I picked them to win, actually. And thee Packers hard fought win over Detroit shouldn't be underestimated, nor the win in Philly. The losses were all winnable heartbreakers. If the Packers get a call or two go their way, the result might be different. Maybe.

One thing is for sure; I don't want the Packers to win the SB next September again.

[denverYooper]

The team we almost beat last week at FedEx field was 2 inches from beating the big bad IND Colts last night. Maybe WASH isn't as bad as we all think.

I didn't see the game, but I picked them to win, actually. And thee Packers hard fought win over Detroit shouldn't be underestimated, nor the win in Philly. The losses were all winnable heartbreakers. If the Packers get a call or two go their way, the result might be different. Maybe.

One thing is for sure; I don't want the Packers to win the SB next September again.

Philly smoked the new NFC darling Falcons yesterday. With Kolb at the helm.

If they're going to get bit by the injury bug, this year seems like a good one for it. With some bodies back in the next few weeks, they're certainly not out of it yet.

[mraynrand]

The team we almost beat last week at FedEx field was 2 inches from beating the big bad IND Colts last night. Maybe WASH isn't as bad as we all think.

I didn't see the game, but I picked them to win, actually. And thee Packers hard fought win over Detroit shouldn't be underestimated, nor the win in Philly. The losses were all winnable heartbreakers. If the Packers get a call or two go their way, the result might be different. Maybe.

One thing is for sure; I don't want the Packers to win the SB next September again.

Philly smoked the new NFC darling Falcons yesterday. With Kolb at the helm.

If they're going to get bit by the injury bug, this year seems like a good one for it. With some bodies back in the next few weeks, they're certainly not out of it yet.

Philly is just a well-run organization and Andy Reid can coach the hell out of a team. But he hasn't won the prize yet either. Lotta luck plays into the Lombardi Trophy

[Tarlam!]

Maybe they think that BJack won't be as effective on 20+ carries. I don't know. It's almost as if one of Rodgers or M3 took the loss of Grant as a mandate to get nuts with the passing game.

Honestly, this baffles me. I just saw the game and he some good gains. And where was Nance?

[pbmax]

Maybe they think that BJack won't be as effective on 20+ carries. I don't know. It's almost as if one of Rodgers or M3 took the loss of Grant as a mandate to get nuts with the passing game.

Honestly, this baffles me. I just saw the game and he some good gains. And where was Nance?
The goal was to get him 18 carries according to the pregame.

[rbaloha1]

Its disappointing that the Packers have enough talent to be at 6-0. Poor decision making on offense and special teams are the culprit.

[Pugger]

Grant. Enough said.

Our offense has completely changed without him on the field. I think we all underestimated his value to our offensive scheme.

+1

Over the last couple of years many fans have dismissed Grant's contributions on our offense even tho last year he was the 7th ranked RB in the league when it was all said and done. I guess you don't know what you have until its gone. :(

[Pugger]

Maybe they think that BJack won't be as effective on 20+ carries. I don't know. It's almost as if one of Rodgers or M3 took the loss of Grant as a mandate to get nuts with the passing game.

Honestly, this baffles me. I just saw the game and he some good gains. And where was Nance?

Good question. Was he even active yesterday? Is he having problems learning blitz pickups? :?:

[Joemailman]

I'm not surprised Nance isn't playing yet, given that he was not here during training camp. In 2007, MM didn't go with Grant until about halfway through the season. What still mystifies me is that MM doesn't give Jackson the chances Grant would get. The Packers are 7th in the NFL in YPC, but 29th in rushing attempts per game. Jackson is 22nd in the league in rushing yards, but only 7 of the guys ahead of him have a better YPC than his 4.6.

[MichiganPackerFan]

...

Particularly in the NFC North. Has any team really played well yet in any game?

Lions v bears? :roll:

[bobblehead]

Sulky injury card?

Look at our fuckin team. Anyone who doesn't acknowledge that injuries are clearly holding this team back is more blind then any TT or MM apologist.

Were they playing well before Mathews, Barnett, Burnett, Tauscher, Finley, Picket and Neal got hurt? Not really.

This team was being "held back" even before the injuries hit it in the last two weeks.

weren't we 3-1 with one game the refs took away from us while being "held back"??
While you and I might disagree on the cause, McCarthy clearly has not yet figured out how to ignite the offense. Even when Finley was available, they were leaving points on the table. Capers seems to be getting about the most that could be expected out of his 2nd team D, but M3 has a way to go.

definately not debating that, but I think the players are more to blame (even with the lack of running calls). JJ fumbling in crunch time against chicago, false starts, holding calls, dropped passes.

I'm not disagreeing with you, and even penalties falls on MM a bit. We definately need to capitalize on offense to have a chance at the playoffs.

PLAYOFFS, PLAYOFFS....

[channtheman]

Grant. Enough said.

Our offense has completely changed without him on the field. I think we all underestimated his value to our offensive scheme.

Absolutely. I was talking to my dad on the phone last night and we both agreed that we had underestimated the impact that losing Grant would have on this team. I would have never imagined this team would not be able to do anything on offense without Grant, but he was a 1200 yard rusher (which was good for number 2 leader in yards since he started behind only AP, right?)

[Joemailman]

Grant. Enough said.

Our offense has completely changed without him on the field. I think we all underestimated his value to our offensive scheme.

Absolutely. I was talking to my dad on the phone last night and we both agreed that we had underestimated the impact that losing Grant would have on this team. I would have never imagined this team would not be able to do anything on offense without Grant, but he was a 1200 yard rusher (which was good for number 2 leader in yards since he started behind only AP, right?)

Brandon Jackson is averaging 4.6 YPC. He's be on pace for a 1200 yard season if he were averaging 17 carries a game. MM's abandonment of a reasonably efficient running game is more of a problem than the loss of Grant.

[channtheman]

Grant. Enough said.

Our offense has completely changed without him on the field. I think we all underestimated his value to our offensive scheme.

Absolutely. I was talking to my dad on the phone last night and we both agreed that we had underestimated the impact that losing Grant would have on this team. I would have never imagined this team would not be able to do anything on offense without Grant, but he was a 1200 yard rusher (which was good for number 2 leader in yards since he started behind only AP, right?)

Brandon Jackson is averaging 4.6 YPC. He's be on pace for a 1200 yard season if he were averaging 17 carries a game. MM's abandonment of a reasonably efficient running game is more of a problem than the loss of Grant.

I think someone said it in this thread, but it appears the loss of Grant has made MM go pass crazy. You are right, Jackson could probably be competent in the run game but MM doesn't give him enough chances. I really wish MM would get an offensive coordinator because he sucks at play calling.

[Joemailman]

This is the problem of going into the season with 2 RB's and 3 FB's. Once Grant went down, Jackson became the starting RB and the 3rd down back. MM I think is limiting his carries to avoid overworking him. Probably should have kept Kregg Lumpkin.

[Tarlam!]

This is the problem of going into the season with 2 RB's and 3 FB's. Once Grant went down, Jackson became the starting RB and the 3rd down back. MM I think is limiting his carries to avoid overworking him. Probably should have kept Kregg Lumpkin.

True, Joe, but how many teams go with 4 TEs and 2 QBs? How many teams have 2 FBs? Some don't even have one, IIRC.

TT's ways are a mystery to me, but I can't fault the depth he's collected at most position. I know, I know, "the OL".

[woodbuck27]

No, not just the Packers. So far the games I have watched this year come down to who plays the least poorly, not who plays the best. There have been a lot of close games, mostly because both teams are playing poorly.

Just seems to be a lot of mediocre football being played this year. The only excitement has been from close scores, not from seeing good football. One team doesn't win it, the other one loses it; if you know what I mean.

Particularly in the NFC North. Has any team really played well yet in any game?

Bears over the Panthers and Vikings over the Lions.

Yet I certainly agree with you overall as It's been thus far in the NFL as a whole. Ohh, the Saints dominated 'the Buc's this week and the Tamps Bay Bucaneer's are one of the surprise teams in the NFL to date along with 'the Chiefs' who looked for real yesterday until they blew it in Houston ... an up and down team.

This is a very strange season to date. It's wide open right now, The cream will come to the top. Pittsburg looks really good and the Jets arn't going away. In the NFC...The Saints will be there.as will the Falcons and Philly is getting better.

GP PACKERS! Must win Vs Minny this week or it's possibly a 'see yaa' next season (maybe again). Still time to recover but MM has to get it going fast.

[pbmax]

The team we almost beat last week at FedEx field was 2 inches from beating the big bad IND Colts last night. Maybe WASH isn't as bad as we all think.

I didn't see the game, but I picked them to win, actually. And thee Packers hard fought win over Detroit shouldn't be underestimated, nor the win in Philly. The losses were all winnable heartbreakers. If the Packers get a call or two go their way, the result might be different. Maybe.

One thing is for sure; I don't want the Packers to win the SB next September again.

Philly smoked the new NFC darling Falcons yesterday. With Kolb at the helm.

If they're going to get bit by the injury bug, this year seems like a good one for it. With some bodies back in the next few weeks, they're certainly not out of it yet.

Philly is just a well-run organization and Andy Reid can coach the hell out of a team. But he hasn't won the prize yet either. Lotta luck plays into the Lombardi Trophy
Philly fans would disagree with you on Reid, but the grass always looks greener somewhere else. Reid has notched a ton of wins.

[pbmax]

Sulky injury card?

Look at our fuckin team. Anyone who doesn't acknowledge that injuries are clearly holding this team back is more blind then any TT or MM apologist.

Were they playing well before Mathews, Barnett, Burnett, Tauscher, Finley, Picket and Neal got hurt? Not really.

This team was being "held back" even before the injuries hit it in the last two weeks.

weren't we 3-1 with one game the refs took away from us while being "held back"??
While you and I might disagree on the cause, McCarthy clearly has not yet figured out how to ignite the offense. Even when Finley was available, they were leaving points on the table. Capers seems to be getting about the most that could be expected out of his 2nd team D, but M3 has a way to go.

definately not debating that, but I think the players are more to blame (even with the lack of running calls). JJ fumbling in crunch time against chicago, false starts, holding calls, dropped passes.

I'm not disagreeing with you, and even penalties falls on MM a bit. We definately need to capitalize on offense to have a chance at the playoffs.

PLAYOFFS, PLAYOFFS....
Agree with the player mistakes. There would be joy in Packerland if penalties alone got cleaned up with turnovers.

I think M3has clearly failed in Special Teams.

[Bossman641]

No, not just the Packers. So far the games I have watched this year come down to who plays the least poorly, not who plays the best. There have been a lot of close games, mostly because both teams are playing poorly.

Just seems to be a lot of mediocre football being played this year. The only excitement has been from close scores, not from seeing good football. One team doesn't win it, the other one loses it; if you know what I mean.

Particularly in the NFC North. Has any team really played well yet in any game?

Bears over the Panthers and Vikings over the Lions.

Yet I certainly agree with you overall as It's been thus far in the NFL as a whole. Ohh, the Saints dominated 'the Buc's this week and the Tamps Bay Bucaneer's are one of the surprise teams in the NFL to date along with 'the Chiefs' who looked for real yesterday until they blew it in Houston ... an up and down team.

This is a very strange season to date. It's wide open right now, The cream will come to the top. Pittsburg looks really good and the Jets arn't going away. In the NFC...The Saints will be there.as will the Falcons and Philly is getting better.

GP PACKERS! Must win Vs Minny this week or it's possibly a 'see yaa' next season (maybe again). Still time to recover but MM has to get it going fast.

Bears over the Panthers??? :shock:

The same Bears that had 32 yards passing and 4 INT?? I watched that game. The Bears did not play well at all. The Panthers are just awful.

[Mazzin]

I'm not surprised Nance isn't playing yet, given that he was not here during training camp. In 2007, MM didn't go with Grant until about halfway through the season. What still mystifies me is that MM doesn't give Jackson the chances Grant would get. The Packers are 7th in the NFL in YPC, but 29th in rushing attempts per game. Jackson is 22nd in the league in rushing yards, but only 7 of the guys ahead of him have a better YPC than his 4.6.

Now I certainly could be wrong....Ppatller could probably help, but have we had many plays in the second