So I was looking through old posts...

[Smidgeon]

A while back, I made a list (below) of what I thought the Packers would have to do going forward to improve the team/stay competetive. I thought it would be interesting to see if I could accurately prognosticate.


Must-Needs:
* A cornerback because both Woodson and Harris are over 33 and Tramon Williams can only replace one of them. Sam Shields
* An effective starting WR to take over once DD retires which could be Jordy Nelson or James Jones if either takes a step in the coming offseason or the next season. Still need one
* Two starting offensive tackles. Bryan Bulaga and...?

It-Would-Be-Nice-To-Haves:
* A safety to replace Bigby who--while consistent--doesn't appear to be special. He's solid, but good CBs and Nick Collins can hide his or any other safety's similar limitations. Morgan Burnett (fingers crossed)
* A RB who at least forces the opposing defenses to account for him on every play, either as a nasty blitz-picker-upper, a receiving threat, or a shifty homerun running threat. Ryan Grant is serviceable and picks up a lot of yards over the year as an under-average used runner, but I don't think he makes defenses account for him on every play. m.a.y.b.e James Starks
* A kick returner who both is a threat to take it to the house every once in a while, like Blackman, and who isn't going to end up on IR every year, unfortunately unlike Blackman. Still need one

Icing-On-the-Cake:
* A third CB like Williams has been the last couple seasons and Harris was early in his career. Someone who doesn't embarrass himself on the field in coverage (see Bush, Jarrett.) Will need one after Woodson retires (please not soon)
* A stud punter. Tim Masthay
* Another linebacker, just because. Desmond Bishop and...?

In one year, by my count TT has put together a team that is going to the Super Bowl by filling 5 of 10 positions, plus adding another TE (Quarless) and DT (Neal) that figure heavily into the future. Which would leave:

Must-Needs:
* An effective starting WR to take over once DD retires which could still be Jordy Nelson or James Jones if either takes a step in the coming offseason or the next season. Neither has stepped up, but it could still be Jones if he finds any consistency.
* One starting offensive tackle. Could be Lang or Newhouse.
* Another linebacker opposite Matthews. Can we combine Jones, Zombo, and Walden into one player?

It-Would-Be-Nice-To-Haves:
* A RB who at least forces the opposing defenses to account for him on every play in one way or another. Could be Starks, but could also not be.
* A kick returner who is a threat to take it to the house every once in a while. And not Cory Rodgers.

Icing-On-the-Cake:
* A third CB like Shields has been this year and Williams has been the last couple seasons. Someone who doesn't embarrass himself on the field in coverage. Not Bush, Underwood, or Lee.

And I still like Crosby.

Am I missing anything? What is necessary to ensure this isn't a flash in the pan team?

[vince]

At this point I'd say the primary needs are:

Returner, CB, 2 OL, WR, Maybe QB, Maybe ILB, Maybe OLB

I can see Thompson starting to trade current picks for future ones.

I think they're set at RB.

[Patler]

Unless they keep Flynn to the bitter end and lose him in FA, they might need a backup QB next year.

Guard - they could use a better starter than Colledge, if they keep him; and will need a backup. Could be that they re-sign Spitz to backup at G/C, or McDonald might turn out to be effective. Chances are they will need a body here.

Center - Wells is awful small (smaller then the roster suggests) and is getting to an age where the size he gives up might start to hurt him. At least he stayed healthy this year. At any rate, they need a backup to groom as his eventual replacement, if nothing else.

A better travel planner to keep everyone happy?

[vince]

A better travel planner to keep everyone happy?
:lol: And we need a new game-changing freak of a TE without the drama.

[Joemailman]

Unless they keep Flynn to the bitter end and lose him in FA, they might need a backup QB next year.

Guard - they could use a better starter than Colledge, if they keep him; and will need a backup. Could be that they re-sign Spitz to backup at G/C, or McDonald might turn out to be effective. Chances are they will need a body here.

Center - Wells is awful small (smaller then the roster suggests) and is getting to an age where the size he gives up might start to hurt him. At least he stayed healthy this year. At any rate, they need a backup to groom as his eventual replacement, if nothing else.

A better travel planner to keep everyone happy?

TT doesn't draft guards . He drafts tackles and moves them to guard. I suspect either Newhouse, Bulaga or Lang will be moved to LG next year. Therefore. expect another OT to be drafted this year. I think Spitz is probably gone. I think they're pretty high on McDonald and see him as an eventual replacement for Wells. Now that EDS is back, he could figure in as well.

[steve823]

Von Miller or a good pass rushing OLB to pair with Clay would be great. This year's draft has A TON of d-lineman that are top round talent so I wouldn't be surprised at all to see TT get one that falls to him. Still need another T and CB to groom too.

[swede]

At this point I'd say the primary needs are:

Returner, CB, 2 OL, WR, Maybe QB, Maybe ILB, Maybe OLB

I can see Thompson starting to trade current picks for future ones.

I think they're set at RB.
I hadn't considered this before, but, with the team getting closer to fully stocked, trading for future picks is a possibility.

Is there a formula for the "interest" a team earns? In other words does this years 4th get traded for the trading partner's 3rd? That would be cool. Or is it more likely that teams swap this year/next year 4ths with a 6th rounder thrown in? That would barely be worth the paperwork.

[vince]

Typically this year's pick is worth next year's pick one round higher, although they can obviously do whatever makes sense to both parties.

[Lurker64]

Typically this year's pick is worth next year's pick one round higher, although they can obviously do whatever makes sense to both parties.

That's generally the rule, i.e. a 2011 2nd round pick costs you a 2012 first.

If you trade away your first round pick for future picks, you generally get a first next year plus additional picks to make up the difference in this year's draft.

[Patler]

TT doesn't draft guards . He drafts tackles and moves them to guard. I suspect either Newhouse, Bulaga or Lang will be moved to LG next year. Therefore. expect another OT to be drafted this year. I think Spitz is probably gone. I think they're pretty high on McDonald and see him as an eventual replacement for Wells. Now that EDS is back, he could figure in as well.

Spitz was a guard. So was Will Whitticker. They need a guard, but I don't care if he drafts a WR if he is able to play guard.

Basically, they need O-linemen at any/all positions, They will always need O-linemen. When you start 5 and keep 9 or 10 there is always room to add one or two, because some will be getting old, or will be injured or will have used up their opportunity without showing enough. Wolf said you have to draft one just about every year, at least for a look.

[gbgary]

more/better beef on both sides but especially the o-line. AR's health is the most important thing.

[Bretsky]

They could use ten picks IMO and they call could make our team

Add a KR, CB, S, OLB, two OL, and DL (figuring Cullen Jenkins is leaving for money), maybe a WR, another developmental CB, and a TT gem to boot

[bobblehead]

That's generally the rule, i.e. a 2011 2nd round pick costs you a 2012 first.

If you trade away your first round pick for future picks, you generally get a first next year plus additional picks to make up the difference in this year's draft.

In todays game I'm a huge fan of doing this if you draft in the latter part of a round. For instance if we draft 32nd and we can trade a 2nd for next years first its huge. Add to this that many teams the figure to draft late NEXT year end up picking rather early....see Dallas and Minnesota this year.

[Patler]

They could use ten picks IMO and they call could make our team

Add a KR, CB, S, OLB, two OL, and DL (figuring Cullen Jenkins is leaving for money), maybe a WR, another developmental CB, and a TT gem to boot

DL? Are you expecting them to keep Green? Or get Jolly back? If they do there isn't a big need even if Jenkins leaves, but an upgrade is always good.

Safety? - Remember the name Anthony Levine. I am giving him my nod as a player to watch next year. Call him Patler's "Atlas Herion" nominee for 2011. Should be the kiss of death for him as a player!

[bobblehead]

The only thing I see the packers needing to do is resign as many of the players they can that are up, and add a new OLB to play opposite clay. I'd be thrilled with a good OL as well, but beyond that we are drafting guys that would have to play very well to get a starting gig. This may be the year TT spends a higher pick on a good return man as well, but I doubt it as serviceable ones can be found in a variety of ways.

[Lurker64]

I think a top tier OLB, another OT, and a punt and kick returner who's not only competent by occasionally a threat are the biggest immediate needs.

[Smidgeon]

In todays game I'm a huge fan of doing this if you draft in the latter part of a round. For instance if we draft 32nd and we can trade a 2nd for next years first its huge. Add to this that many teams the figure to draft late NEXT year end up picking rather early....see Dallas and Minnesota this year.

I'm pretty sure TT's been on the record before saying that he doesn't see much point in trading for future picks as he wants players who can upgrade his team now. I could be wrong, but that seems to be what I'm remembering. Anyone have anything to confirm/deny that?

[Bretsky]

DL? Are you expecting them to keep Green? Or get Jolly back? If they do there isn't a big need even if Jenkins leaves, but an upgrade is always good.

Safety? - Remember the name Anthony Levine. I am giving him my nod as a player to watch next year. Call him Patler's "Atlas Herion" nominee for 2011. Should be the kiss of death for him as a player!


I do like Green, but I don't see them keeping him next year. Hasn't he been around a while ? I see TT always looking for younger blood with more upside and we do have Raji and Pickett as big bodies vs. the run. Jolly....who knows....just not counting on him. .........it should really be our duty to get in touch with Levine and tell him if he wants a football career he needs to go elsewhere.

You've just put the Curse of Atlas on Him !

[Bretsky]

I think a top tier OLB, another OT, and a punt and kick returner who's not only competent by occasionally a threat are the biggest immediate needs.

It'd be pretty cool to get Matthews Brother and get him on the outside.

I remember back when we had Sterling Sharpe and I LOVED Shannon Sharpe coming out of college. The NFL missed the boat on how good that guy was going to be.

[Bretsky]

I think a top tier OLB, another OT, and a punt and kick returner who's not only competent by occasionally a threat are the biggest immediate needs.

TT put in a claim for Logan from Detroit. It's too bad we didn't nab him or draft Jacoby Ford. That guy is an explosive buzzer as well.

[Lurker64]

It'd be pretty cool to get Matthews Brother and get him on the outside.

I remember back when we had Sterling Sharpe and I LOVED Shannon Sharpe coming out of college. The NFL missed the boat on how good that guy was going to be.

From what I've seen, Casey Matthews isn't near the prospect that his big brother is (I watch a lot of Pac-Ten football, as I'm an alumnus of the other Oregon school) and is best suited to playing interior linebacker (in the "Jack" position, the same one that Barnett and Hawk have played this year). Still, he'd be a quality special teams player and may bloom into a player a few years down the line. Wouldn't take him before about round 4 though.

Personally, I'd like to see them spend their first two picks on an OT and an OLB in whichever order the board suggests, then drafting BPA but making sure to take at least one WR, RB, or DB who is an accomplished kick returner. Tramon Williams, Charles Woodson, and Sam Shields are too valuable to the defense to have them back there returning punts/kicks on a weekly basis, and nobody else on this roster seems to be worth a damn returning kicks or punts.

Though, I will admit that I consider OT to be less of a need after seeing how well Lang did in spot duty replacing Clifton against the Bears. He wasn't perfect, but he'd probably be better next year at RT than anybody we'd draft at #32 or #64.

[wootah]

TT doesn't draft guards .

He even takes them in the 1st.
http://images.usatoday.com/sports/football/nfl/_photos/2006-08-30-hutchinson-toppe.jpg

[swede]

Still, he'd be a quality special teams player and may bloom into a player a few years down the line. Wouldn't take him before about round 4 though.


And that's the problem with "wouldn't it be cool if" scenarios with players that we like a lot. There are 31 other teams that will jump Casey Matthews objective draft value just to have Clay Matthews little bro on their team.


I'd love to have Pouncey's brother as a guard/center in the next draft also, but he won't fall to us for the same reasons.

[Smeefers]

I actually think Jordy Nelson has really stepped it up the last couple of weeks and has been a go to guy for Rodgers lately. He seems a lot more consistant than JJ, just not as explosive. Perhaps I'm looking at him through rose colored glasses though, am I wrong? We need to pick up OL like they're going out of style. One of them would have to end up being good enough to be a starting LT or RT (if Bulaga is up for the LT job), right? I don't think our team has ever drafted someone to specifically be a returner, but this would be the year to do it. Hell, i'd be happy if we spent a first rounder on the guy. I'd even be happy to move up in the draft to do it.

[wootah]

I don't think our team has ever drafted someone to specifically be a returner, but this would be the year to do it. Hell, i'd be happy if we spent a first rounder on the guy. I'd even be happy to move up in the draft to do it.

Cory Rodgers from TCU was drafted in the 4th round in 2006. They tried to change his way of catching punts, it didn't work out...

I'm all for drafting a return specialist, but not in the first rounds; history shows that decent ones can be had later on.

[Packers4Glory]

They don't need a WR if they keep JJ. Jones could rival GJ as the best WR on the team if he can find any level of consistency. If they go the WR route, go late and perhaps look at the small school guy which has worked well for us.

but of course you almost gotta go w/ the strategy of drafting the BPA in the 1st round where we will be picking.

[Tony Oday]

kicker, LT, RB, CB

[Smidgeon]

From what I've seen, Casey Matthews isn't near the prospect that his big brother is (I watch a lot of Pac-Ten football, as I'm an alumnus of the other Oregon school) and is best suited to playing interior linebacker (in the "Jack" position, the same one that Barnett and Hawk have played this year). Still, he'd be a quality special teams player and may bloom into a player a few years down the line. Wouldn't take him before about round 4 though.

Personally, I'd like to see them spend their first two picks on an OT and an OLB in whichever order the board suggests, then drafting BPA but making sure to take at least one WR, RB, or DB who is an accomplished kick returner. Tramon Williams, Charles Woodson, and Sam Shields are too valuable to the defense to have them back there returning punts/kicks on a weekly basis, and nobody else on this roster seems to be worth a damn returning kicks or punts.

Though, I will admit that I consider OT to be less of a need after seeing how well Lang did in spot duty replacing Clifton against the Bears. He wasn't perfect, but he'd probably be better next year at RT than anybody we'd draft at #32 or #64.

Hang on a tic. I thought Hawk and Barnett played different ILB positions. What am I missing?

[Lurker64]

Hang on a tic. I thought Hawk and Barnett played different ILB positions. What am I missing?

At the beginning of the year, Barnett and Hawk played different positions because they were on the field at the same time. After Barnett's injury ended his season, Hawk took over Barnett's role and Bishop took over Hawk's old role.

Think of the ILB positions as follows:
The Jack (Barnett to start the season, Hawk now) is the defensive signal caller, the chaser, and the tackler.
The Buck (Hawk to start the season, Bishop now) is the thumper, block eater, and gap filler.

[Smidgeon]

At the beginning of the year, Barnett and Hawk played different positions because they were on the field at the same time. After Barnett's injury ended his season, Hawk took over Barnett's role and Bishop took over Hawk's old role.

Think of the ILB positions as follows:
The Jack (Barnett to start the season, Hawk now) is the defensive signal caller, the chaser, and the tackler.
The Buck (Hawk to start the season, Bishop now) is the thumper, block eater, and gap filler.

Okay. I didn't know Hawk took Barnett's position when he took the playcalling. I thought Bishop was Barnett's backup and just took that position (but not the playcalling) when Barnett went down.

Thanks for the clarification.

[pbmax]

At the beginning of the year, Barnett and Hawk played different positions because they were on the field at the same time. After Barnett's injury ended his season, Hawk took over Barnett's role and Bishop took over Hawk's old role.

Think of the ILB positions as follows:
The Jack (Barnett to start the season, Hawk now) is the defensive signal caller, the chaser, and the tackler.
The Buck (Hawk to start the season, Bishop now) is the thumper, block eater, and gap filler.

Are you sure about that? I though Bishop (preseason and after Barnett's injury) was strictly the Jack like NB. I thought AJ stayed at Jack.

[Lurker64]

Are you sure about that? I though Bishop (preseason and after Barnett's injury) was strictly the Jack like NB. I thought AJ stayed at Jack.

I'm not actually sure, in fact watching some of the week 11 tape I might actually be wrong. For some reason I thought that when Hawk took over signal-calling duties from Barnett, he took over the position as well. We spend so much time in nickel with the ILBs playing the pass that the distinction is somewhat vacuous anyway.

But disirregardless, IMO Casey Matthews is better suited to the inside than the outside.

[Fritz]

"A stud punter. Tim Masthay"

Who'd a thunk, early in the year, that this statement could be made in a thread and go unchallenged???

TT found a stud punter! Dayum!

[Scott Campbell]

Spitz was a guard. So was Will Whitticker. They need a guard, but I don't care if he drafts a WR if he is able to play guard.

Basically, they need O-linemen at any/all positions, They will always need O-linemen. When you start 5 and keep 9 or 10 there is always room to add one or two, because some will be getting old, or will be injured or will have used up their opportunity without showing enough. Wolf said you have to draft one just about every year, at least for a look.

I feel the same way about WRs in this offense.

[Smidgeon]

"A stud punter. Tim Masthay"

Who'd a thunk, early in the year, that this statement could be made in a thread and go unchallenged???

TT found a stud punter! Dayum!

And remember how some people were saying letting Jon Ryan go was TT's biggest mistake...?

[Lurker64]

And remember how some people were saying letting Jon Ryan go was TT's biggest mistake...?

Any time "cutting a punter" is your GM's biggest mistake, your GM has done a pretty good job so far.