Cullen Jenkins and the Bears?

[Smidgeon]

Are we okay with this rumor?

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/04/06/cullen-jenkins-looks-like-a-target-for-bears/

[Brandon494]

Damn, thought for sure he was going to the Vikings

[Tony Oday]

Well he will be an asset for 12 games for the Bears...

[Tarlam!]

Well he will be an asset for 12 games for the Bears...

On the field. But even off of it, he knows Dom's defense, he knows how his position coach teaches and worse, he knows what he teaches! He also has ample ammo on how to beat the Packer's OL. Am I the only one who wants him out of the conference?

Message to Cullen: Think Kampman!!!

[Lurker64]

I don't think you need to worry Tarlam, Dom Capers is a lot smarter than Cullen Jenkins.

[swede]

Bid that price way up before letting him go.

[Patler]

On the field. But even off of it, he knows Dom's defense, he knows how his position coach teaches and worse, he knows what he teaches! He also has ample ammo on how to beat the Packer's OL. Am I the only one who wants him out of the conference?

Do you actually think there are any "secrets" about the past? Capers has been around the league, coaches who coached under him are scattered around the league, and players who played for him are scattered around the league as players yet or now as coaches. With all of the film available and coaches to study it, nothing that has been done in the past from a coaching or strategy perspective is a secret.

That's why coaches continually try to revise and change, why they try to respond differently than they have in the past to similar situations, because that is the only way to surprise an opponent; by doing differently this year than you did last year.

[KYPack]

He's a good hand in a 3-4 or a 4-3. Can play both end and DT in a 4-3 and end in a 3-4. He wouldn't be the first guy to parlay SB free agency into a fat contract. Most teams know he's older, but Cullen is a better player than most teams have on the DL in those spots.

Funny Tar mentioned Kamp. Like Aaron, I wouldn't begrudge Jenk getting a good contract. There outta be 4-5 teams sniffing around, looking to sign him.

[Patler]

For as good of a player as he has been, Jenkins has never had a super pay day. At his age, and with a bit of an injury history, this is likely his last chance for a big payday. I expect he will go where the guaranteed money is the best even if it ends up a shorter deal with a lower total value.

[HarveyWallbangers]

For as good of a player as he has been, Jenkins has never had a super pay day. At his age, and with a bit of an injury history, this is likely his last chance for a big payday. I expect he will go where the guaranteed money is the best even if it ends up a shorter deal with a lower total value.

He got a pretty nice pay day on his last contract--for the pay that was being doled out then. $15-16M for 4 years was pretty good money four years ago. A lot of people felt Green Bay overpaid for him. Now, $4M/year is a bargain.

[Teamcheez1]

Well he will be an asset for 12 games for the Bears...

I think your being optimistic with 12 games.

[Patler]

He got a pretty nice pay day on his last contract--for the pay that was being doled out then. $15-16M for 4 years was pretty good money four years ago. A lot of people felt Green Bay overpaid for him. Now, $4M/year is a bargain.

I don't agree. Free agent and proven DEs were getting big bonuses by then already. Freeney got a $15 million signing bonus, Adams got $13M, Abraham, Kearse and Grant got $12M, Geathers $11M, White, Ogunleye and Kearney got $10M. Jenkins got $4 million. In 2007 he was #17 on the list for DEs salary and 38th for cap value, In 2008 he was #52 for DE salary and 34th for cap value. In 2009 he was #39 for salary and 38th in cap value.

On the 2007 list of DE salaries, 31 had higher bonuses than Jenkins $4 million.

What enticed Jenkins at the time was that he was still a restricted free agent, with only 3 years in the league. The Packers could have kept him very cheaply for another year for him to prove that the end of 2006 wasn't a flash in the pan. I think that is why some felt the Packers paid too much, not because it was a lot for a good DE. No one was sure about Jenkins yet, and the Packers didn't have to pay that to keep him.

The three years before that contract, he was a minimum wage player. Basically, he got about $17 M for his 7 years in Green Bay.

[SkinBasket]

I think your being optimistic with 12 games.

That was my first thought as well. 6-8 games maybe. 10-12 with some sort of cast and/or brace.

[mraynrand]

Draft status seems to stick with most guys their whole career.

[HarveyWallbangers]

I don't agree. Free agent and proven DEs were getting big bonuses by then already. Freeney got a $15 million signing bonus, Adams got $13M, Abraham, Kearse and Grant got $12M, Geathers $11M, White, Ogunleye and Kearney got $10M. Jenkins got $4 million. In 2007 he was #17 on the list for DEs salary and 38th for cap value, In 2008 he was #52 for DE salary and 34th for cap value. In 2009 he was #39 for salary and 38th in cap value.

On the 2007 list of DE salaries, 31 had higher bonuses than Jenkins $4 million.

What enticed Jenkins at the time was that he was still a restricted free agent, with only 3 years in the league. The Packers could have kept him very cheaply for another year for him to prove that the end of 2006 wasn't a flash in the pan. I think that is why some felt the Packers paid too much, not because it was a lot for a good DE. No one was sure about Jenkins yet, and the Packers didn't have to pay that to keep him.

The three years before that contract, he was a minimum wage player. Basically, he got about $17 M for his 7 years in Green Bay.

$15M for 4 years was good money back then. I don't care about cap value or signing bonus. He signed a contract that made it likely that he'd see all of the money because there were no tricks to it. He saw all of that $15M. That was good money. 17th highest paid DE is about what he should have made. He's not an elite DE. He'll probably sign a new contract that pays him in a similar range as that contract this time. The only difference is that salaries have gone up. Pickett got a solid contract in 2006, and he only got 4yr, $14M. Last year, Pickett signed a contract for 4yr, $24M. And he's older and not the player he was 5 years ago. Shows you how much contracts have gone up. It seems like a $4M/year contract from 4 years ago is similar to A.J. Hawk's contract and better than Desmond Bishop's contract in today's dollars.

I'm not saying he got elite money, but it's not like he hasn't gotten paid.

[Patler]

$15M for 4 years was good money back then.

I don't think it was. Not for a DE with some pass-rush ability. Top DEs were signing for nearly as much in signing bonus and first year money as Jenkins had for his full four-year contract value. KGB's contract was was already four years old, and he was making a lot more than Jenkins in 2007, was performing poorly, yet the Packers kept him around and paid him his salary which could have been avoided by cutting him. As you said, it was a contract Jenkins was likely to complete, but that is because it was flat when everyone knew the salary cap would escalate significantly. It started out as middle of the road value, but was certain to drop significantly because it was flat. His average salary would have put him in the mid 30's for 2006 salaries of DEs, the year before he signed his contract.

Basically, the Packers waived $4 million at Jenkins when he was a RFA, and he jumped at what was a very team-friendly contract. He got some extra money a year earlier than he otherwise would have, but in return he gave them three years very cheaply. In 2007 the first round tender to a restricted free agent was $1,850,000 and the second round tender was $1,300,000 for one year contracts. The Packers threw in some extra in guaranteed money and tied up Jenkins for three extra years.

Jenkins has made about $17 million in his 7 year career. He is already 30 years old. This will be his last shot at a decent contract and I expect will go for the best guaranteed money.

[Smeefers]

Did you just compare Jenkins with the packers all time leading sack artist and then say he was paid less? Hrm. Yeah. Hands down KGB was a far better player than Jenkins ever will be and that's why he got paid more. Oh, and in 2007 KGB had 9.5 sacks as a third down specialist. It was 2008 where he took a dive and we released him because we felt a pressing need to bring back Justin Harrell. That year (08) cullen started 15 games and had 1 sack. Well, he did have 6 pass deflections, which I just think is amazing, but, well, it wasn't really until 2009 that he went back to his 6.5 sack performance level of 05 and 06.

I'm not saying Jenkins isn't worth the money we've given him. He's pretty good at what he does, he's just not the disruptive force everyone seems to paint him as. I guess the best way I can put it is this. He's a good player, but he'll never get into the Packer HOF. If we loose him, even to the bears, it'll suck, but he can easily be replaced. He might not be a dime a dozen... more like a quarter.

[get louder at lambeau]

$15M for 4 years was good money back then.

We really only got three years for $15 million, since he missed 17 games during that 4 year contract. Not sayin, just sayin.

[PaCkFan_n_MD]

I think Jenkins is a beast in the 34 defense though. You can't really find a better DE to play this scheme. I don't think he is as valuable in the 43 defense at DE. He would still be a good addition for any team, but with his age and injury history this would be a good time to let him go. Although I think Jenkins is a lot more valuable than Pickett is. Had Jenkins been a free agent last year and Pickett was the free agent this year, they would probably have kept Jenkins and let Pickett go. I think that would have been an ideal situation.

[Smidgeon]

I think Jenkins is a beast in the 34 defense though. You can't really find a better DE to play this scheme. I don't think he is as valuable in the 43 defense at DE. He would still be a good addition for any team, but with his age and injury history this would be a good time to let him go. Although I think Jenkins is a lot more valuable than Pickett is. Had Jenkins been a free agent last year and Pickett was the free agent this year, they would probably have kept Jenkins and let Pickett go. I think that would have been an ideal situation.

Except Jenkins isn't a backup NT. Pickett is and can play it. That means his value is higher, especially in the 3-4.

[Patler]

Did you just compare Jenkins with the packers all time leading sack artist and then say he was paid less? Hrm. Yeah. Hands down KGB was a far better player than Jenkins ever will be and that's why he got paid more.

Not any more than I was comparing him to Freeney, Adams, Abraham, Kearse, Grant, Geathers, White, Ogunleye and Kearney who I mentioned in an earlier post. I was not suggesting that Jenkins should have been paid as much, but cited those to show that DE salaries were very high, and that Jenkins contract was not big. It was pretty ordinary. The significant thing with KGB is that he was a one trick pony, yet the Packers were willing to pay him a lot more even four years before Jenkins, and they were willing to pay him a lot more to hang around after his one trick began to fail and after Jenkins replaced him in the starting lineup. It was suggested that when Jenkins signed, DE salaries were not high and Jenkins' contract was "big" for the time. I think the contract to KGB years earlier, and the huge contracts to others at the same time show that Jenkins did not get a big contract from the Packers four years ago.

[Fritz]

Two things: first, someone called Jenkins a "sack artist." I would disagree; that title belongs to Skinbasket.

Secondly, no big-name free agent thread is complete without these two words: Dan Snyder.

[Tarlam!]

Cory Williams has ended back in the NFC North (Detroit), so I'm sure Jenkins will - it seems to be a habit.

[PaCkFan_n_MD]

Except Jenkins isn't a backup NT. Pickett is and can play it. That means his value is higher, especially in the 3-4.

I thought of that too, but I think Howard Green could be a decent backup NT. Jenkins pass rushing ability is very unique. I personally would still rather have Jenkins than Pickett even though both are valuable to the team. Oh well the point is moot anyways.

[Smidgeon]

I thought of that too, but I think Howard Green could be a decent backup NT. Jenkins pass rushing ability is very unique. I personally would still rather have Jenkins than Pickett even though both are valuable to the team. Oh well the point is moot anyways.

If Green could be a decent backup NT, he wouldn't have been shuffled off the Jets by Rex. NTs are worth their weight in gold (I believe 3 NTs got the franchise tag last year). I think he's an adequate run stuffing DE, but I wouldn't trust him in the middle at such a crucial position.

[Smeefers]

Not any more than I was comparing him to Freeney, Adams, Abraham, Kearse, Grant, Geathers, White, Ogunleye and Kearney who I mentioned in an earlier post. I was not suggesting that Jenkins should have been paid as much, but cited those to show that DE salaries were very high, and that Jenkins contract was not big. It was pretty ordinary. The significant thing with KGB is that he was a one trick pony, yet the Packers were willing to pay him a lot more even four years before Jenkins, and they were willing to pay him a lot more to hang around after his one trick began to fail and after Jenkins replaced him in the starting lineup. It was suggested that when Jenkins signed, DE salaries were not high and Jenkins' contract was "big" for the time. I think the contract to KGB years earlier, and the huge contracts to others at the same time show that Jenkins did not get a big contract from the Packers four years ago.

Fair enough. It was a point well made, unfortunately I flew past it in accusations. I conceed, his salary was not huge. I suppose the point I was trying to make is that I believe that Jenkins deserved the oridinary contract and I think he still does. KGB might appear to be a one trick poney, but his tackle numbers stack right up with Jenkins. Once again, I think this might be more of a conception vs. reality thing. Jenkins came in and didn't really make a splash against the QB's like KGB did, but he seemed to be in on every run play. In all reality, KGB was in on just as many run plays and got to the QB about 50 times more in the same amount of time. The reasons we don't think of KGB as a run stopper is because he was so good against the pass that when he didn't produce that highly against the run, it was a knock.

note: Later in his career, KGB was getting beat, especially later in the game and it was understandable why they replaced him and moved him to a third down specialist. I also believe Jenkins is a disruptive force in the pocket and so I believe he should earn a bit more than average, which I believe is what he is currently earning.

[SnakeLH2006]

Snake is A-Ok with the rumor and hope it happens. Why?

Jenkins is very talented but will command $10 million yearly at the inflated DE rate for UFA's at his position. He's a guy that is VERY talented but has ALWAYS been hurt and is lucky to play 10-12 games....now that he's gonna be 31 next year....why commit that much scrilla to a dude that is past his prime when he NEVER really had a prime (never played 16 games consistently). If he could stay healthy I'd pay the dude....He sure can't in his 20's....so why the hell pay the guy a 6 year deal till 36 or so when he can't do it now. I'd rather use our first on a pass-rusher for cheap and see what happens....It's not like Jenkins at $10 million in 2011 will play more than 10 games anyway. Fuck him. Go to the Bears.....HAHAHAHAHAHAHA! They have Quitler at QB. They will suck no matter what.