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View Full Version : Second Draft Second Round: 2(A) (#1) Reed vs. (#4) Hankerson



Lurker64
04-21-2011, 04:40 PM
In our mock second draft ( http://packerrats.com/showthread.php?21986-2011-PackerRats-community-mock-second-draft ) we decided that rather than a free for all poll, we would try a bracket. Since there are two more rounds to go through, we have to move quickly. As such voting for this draft will close in three days.

Let's meet the prospects (All Scouting reports are shamelessly cribbed from Wes Bunting at the excellent National Football Post).

Brooks Reed OLB, Arizona
6'2 1/2", 263 lbs.
http://www.scardraft.com/images/BrooksReed.jpg


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=32KAqii4lrk


An undersized pass rusher who plays 100 miles per hour on every down. Exhibits a good first step off the snap, gets off the ball quickly, keeps his pad level down and is consistently one of the first defensive linemen moving off the line. Has the ability to threaten the edge and get into offensive tackles quickly. Looks comfortable keeping his pad level down into contact, extending his arms and can create a bit of a surge on his bull rush. Plays with good leverage and can be a bit more physical than his frame would suggest.

However, lacks balance and body control at this stage and really struggles when asked to change directions, keep his feet under him and break off any type of counter move. Also seems to routinely overextend into blocks and doesn't have the type of coordination to drop his shoulder and really accelerate around the corner. Is a real linear pass rusher at this stage who hasn't figured out how to maintain his balance off his initial rush.

Isn't a guy who can stack and shed vs. the run game at the next level, but does play with good leverage when run at and will chase the football in pursuit. Works very hard, fights and scraps for every inch and can work his way into the backfield toward the football, but fails to disengage consistently.

Impression: Plays hard and at least has the explosion to be a threat as a pass rusher at the next level. However, his ability to develop a counter move and become more than a one-trick pony off the edge is key. Looks more like a nickel rusher or potential 3-4 OLB prospect who I would take a shot on because of his initial burst and overall work rate on the field.


Leonard Hankerson, WR, Miami
6'1 1/2", 209 lbs
http://www.bleed-green.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2011/02/Leonard_Hankerson.jpg


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dOBsUJk-jLA


Possesses good size for the position and really seems to be strapped together well. Exhibits long arms and strong, powerful hands in which he uses to pluck just about every football thrown his way. Displays impressive hand/eye coordination when asked to go up and get the ball and looks natural attacking the throw at its highest point. Consistently is able to contort his body and come down with some really tough grabs on all levels of the field while maintaining the concentration to keep his feet in bounds.

Now, possesses average initial explosiveness off the snap and is a bit of a strider. But, has the ability to build speed as he goes and can be tough to cover the further down the field he gets. Knows how to use his big frame to shield defenders from the throw and adjust to the football. However, doesn't exhibit the ability to consistently generate much separation as a route runner vs. man coverage. Does a nice job changing gears, but isn't real explosive in and out of his breaks and has a tendency to start to drift into his routes and gets a bit leggy when trying to change directions. Is more graceful than explosive/sudden at this stage and needs to do a better job setting up defenders, lacks a real understanding/savvy to his game and the route tree. Nevertheless, displays some shiftiness and power to his game with the ball in his hands. Looks natural making a man miss, putting his foot in the ground and accelerating up the field. Displays a dramatic improvement in his ability to slip press and quickly get into his routes as a receiver. Is physical and smooth when asked to work himself free and lose defenders off the line.

Impression: I love his frame, hand/eye coordination and ability to pluck the football. Isn't ever going to generate a ton of separation for himself in the NFL, but could mature into a capable possession-type guy because of his ability to attack the throw.

Bretsky
04-21-2011, 05:54 PM
another ez choice; the next one should be tougher

Freak Out
04-21-2011, 06:08 PM
I chose Reed....the thought of crazy Aryan bookend pass rushers was to hard to resist.

Tarlam!
04-21-2011, 08:26 PM
I chose Reed....the thought of crazy Aryan bookend pass rushers was to hard to resist.

Me too. It's obvious TT is racist so this is a no brainer. I mean, who else has two whit WRs on their roster? I'm a TT homie and if racism is good enough fo him, it's good enough for me.

Deputy Nutz
04-21-2011, 09:41 PM
Honestly, not a big fan of Reed. His highlight tape didn't really show case a lot of technique or ability to beat guys off the ball. A lot of easy sacks, and pursuit tackles, which is a good thing, but in the NFL you need high effort guys that also can beat guys with technique as well.

TennesseePackerBacker
04-22-2011, 12:55 PM
I'm just thankful Ted probably won't pick any of the four we have remaining. Too many weaknesses in the lot of them.

Lurker64
04-22-2011, 01:17 PM
I'm just thankful Ted probably won't pick any of the four we have remaining. Too many weaknesses in the lot of them.

You don't get immediate superstars when you pick at #32. As with every Ted pick, part of you will be disappointed and part of you will grow to appreciate the pick.

That being said, I wouldn't rule out Green Bay trading up to Seattle's spot which would make this whole exercise even sillier than it is.

Freak Out
04-22-2011, 01:24 PM
You don't get immediate superstars when you pick at #32. As with every Ted pick, part of you will be disappointed and part of you will grow to appreciate the pick.

That being said, I wouldn't rule out Green Bay trading up to Seattle's spot which would make this whole exercise even sillier than it is.

....and draft who?

3irty1
04-22-2011, 01:28 PM
Its a long shot that Hankerson will be here at this point.

Tarlam!
04-22-2011, 02:02 PM
Its a long shot that Hankerson will be here at this point.

Maybe you're right, but there's really only two WRs worthy of a 1st round label according to the draftniks.

Lurker64
04-22-2011, 02:44 PM
Its a long shot that Hankerson will be here at this point.

Well, the #3 WR race is wide open. Baldwin, Young, Smith, Cobb, and Hankerson could be #3-#7 in any order. Personally, I think of all the people I named Hankerson is the closest to a TT prospect (good hands, thick, runs good routes). But there are those who will like Baldwin's huge frame and blazing speed enough to ignore his diva issues. There are those who will like Young's shiftiness and explosion enough to ignore his limited mastery of a route tree. There are those who will like Smith's great speed and good attitude enough to ignore the fact that his hands are not so good. There are those who will fall in love with Cobb's incredible versatility enough to ignore the fact that he's just not that special. There are those who will like the fact that Hankerson is tough, sure-handed, and a selfless hard worker enough to ignore the fact that he's not especially fast.

If we're in one of those camps, my money's on the latter.

RashanGary
04-22-2011, 02:55 PM
Honestly, not a big fan of Reed. His highlight tape didn't really show case a lot of technique or ability to beat guys off the ball. A lot of easy sacks, and pursuit tackles, which is a good thing, but in the NFL you need high effort guys that also can beat guys with technique as well.

To be fair to Reed, 90% of Matthews plays aren't technique plays. That was Aaron Kampman style. Matthews blows past people or makes people flat out miss him

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g9VuQdmUJqQ

I like Brooks Reed. Matthews is one of a kind, but Reed has a quick first step too. That's usually the starting point of good edge rushers. Clay Matthews starts with an amazing first step. His next best quality is probably his hustle. Those are probably Reeds top two qualities too.

AJ Hawk was the guy in college who had flat out easy sacks. Nobody was even assigned to him. They were surprise blitzes. Brooks lined up over and blew right past OT's, TE's and RB's. That's what Matthews does in the NFL. He flat out beats his guy. AJ was a guy who had easy sacks where he was a free blitzer and if you watch him in the NFL, he still can't beat his guy. Brooks does, at least at the college level. The common denominator on all of Reed's plays in his clip is that he beat the pants off his guy. Whether he does it Clay Matthew style or Aaron Kampman style is hardly relevant. The point is, can you line him up against OT's, TE's and RB's and expect him to win? I think the answer is yes.

I think he's a little better than you give credit. He's no AJ Hawk when it comes to pass rushing. He's probably no Matthews either, but does anyone think Hankerson is the next Andre Johnson? Reed is a good prospect. What he did in college, there would be no reason not to be excited if we drafted him.

Bretsky
04-22-2011, 03:44 PM
Its a long shot that Hankerson will be here at this point.


I doubt Hankerson is gone by pick 40

Bretsky
04-22-2011, 03:45 PM
Well, the #3 WR race is wide open. Baldwin, Young, Smith, Cobb, and Hankerson could be #3-#7 in any order. Personally, I think of all the people I named Hankerson is the closest to a TT prospect (good hands, thick, runs good routes). But there are those who will like Baldwin's huge frame and blazing speed enough to ignore his diva issues. There are those who will like Young's shiftiness and explosion enough to ignore his limited mastery of a route tree. There are those who will like Smith's great speed and good attitude enough to ignore the fact that his hands are not so good. There are those who will fall in love with Cobb's incredible versatility enough to ignore the fact that he's just not that special. There are those who will like the fact that Hankerson is tough, sure-handed, and a selfless hard worker enough to ignore the fact that he's not especially fast.

If we're in one of those camps, my money's on the latter.


my money is on none of the above

Bretsky
04-22-2011, 03:47 PM
Honestly, not a big fan of Reed. His highlight tape didn't really show case a lot of technique or ability to beat guys off the ball. A lot of easy sacks, and pursuit tackles, which is a good thing, but in the NFL you need high effort guys that also can beat guys with technique as well.


curious if you have watched a lot of Reed; I don't agree with too much of this

RashanGary
04-22-2011, 03:52 PM
curious if you have watched a lot of Reed; I don't agree with too much of this

I agree. That clip above, Reed lined up right over a guy as a declared pass rusher. Whether he blew the fucking pants off his guy from the first step or used power technique, he still lined up across from other college athletes and whipped their fuckin asses. Sure, he made it look easy a few times. Those guys weren't even able to really get their hands on him a few times, but if you watch Matthews, that's what he does. He never overpowers guys, he just blows right past them or knifes inside on them. It's never a pure power leverage thing.

If Reed is a bad prospect because he doesn't use traditional leverage pass rushing technique, Matthews would have been a bad prospect too. The new breed of edge rusher (LT style) is more about explosion and speed than power and leverage technique.

swede
04-22-2011, 04:00 PM
You don't get immediate superstars when you pick at #32. As with every Ted pick, part of you will be disappointed and part of you will grow to appreciate the pick...

Which part of me will grow to appreciate Justin Harrell?

red
04-22-2011, 04:56 PM
reed, i would rather have a guy like titus young or torrey smith in the second for a wr. plus i'll go ahead and admit it, TT has mad skills finding wr's after the first round. even when he drafted jordy when he could have stayed put and drafted the guy i wanted, brandon flowers.

there i said it

it would be nice if we could get a wr or cb at some point in this draft that can be a damn fine return man

Lurker64
04-22-2011, 05:28 PM
Which part of me will grow to appreciate Justin Harrell?

I'm saying "you grow to appreciate the pick" between the point at which it is made and the start of training camp. Once TC starts, you can start hating a guy, but remember that a lot of people thought Rodgers was worthless based on TC.

swede
04-22-2011, 06:18 PM
Which part of me will grow to appreciate Justin Harrell?

I'm saying "you grow to appreciate the pick" between the point at which it is made and the start of training camp. Once TC starts, you can start hating a guy, but remember that a lot of people thought Rodgers was worthless based on TC.

Naww you had a really good point. I was being a smart-ass referencing Harrell. He is the exception that proves your point.

(Edit) Bulaga, Raji, and Matthews also inspired some immediate happiness. I had been in church during the end of the first round last year and I tuned the radio in to hear that the Patriots had traded their pick to GB. I listened to the Matthews pick live and was very, very happy, and this was before I even knew that we had BJ Raji as well. When I found THAT out I was stoked--unbelievably stoked.

get louder at lambeau
04-22-2011, 06:23 PM
Which part of me will grow to appreciate Justin Harrell?

Maybe your spine? He's been a pretty good guinea pig for spinal research.

Bretsky
04-22-2011, 07:56 PM
truth be told in terms of how most rats felt about 1st rounders AROD was the one some of us were wrong on. If you look back at the draft threads I think you'd find
Some were disappointed in AROD
Many were disappointed in Justine
Most liked Hawk
Most liked Raji
Most liked Matthews although some thought TT gave up too much
About everybody liked Buluga

RashanGary
04-22-2011, 07:59 PM
Jennings and Collins were two picks people hated. Mike Neal too. I think Neal is going to be a stud for us.

Lurker64
04-22-2011, 08:05 PM
Jennings and Collins were two picks people hated. Mike Neal too. I think Neal is going to be a stud for us.

I definitely remember "why did we reach for a nobody from some college nobody has ever heard of?" when we picked Collins and "TT is an idiot, he passed on Chad Jackson for a kid from Directional Michigan" when we picked Jennings.