MM: Establishing a culture of winning

[swede]

Just a thought I tossed into another thread and I'd be interested in knowing your opinions.

Preseason, one would suppose. is for finding out which of your players can play and for installing your base offense and defense. Does anyone think, in the unfair clarity of hindsight, that it was a mistake for MM to pump up the importance of winning this meaningless game?

Normally you'd just say if the team can get learn and get better from this ass-whipping, then the game, though ugly, can be a stepping stone to helping the team improve.

I hope this is still the case despite MM's publically highlighting the need to win at San Diego in order to reestablish a culture of winning.

My own thought is that this is no biggie.

But he has left himself open, unnecessarily, to silly questions about a losing preseason record and what that says about reestablishing the culture of winning.

He don't need that noise and he should have left that dog lie.

Speaking of lying dogs, where has HH been?

[No Mo Moss]

Swede your monkey is an ass-kicker!

[FavreChild]

Yeah, that was a mistake. If he was seriously trying to "win" that game, he doesn't have an excuse for that performance, not to mention the clueless game plan.

Is it a big deal right now? No. And remember, this is a guy (M3) who went on and on when he was hired about how this was HIS dream job, etc. It was all about him - not about making the team better or reassuring the fans that better times are ahead. Yes, when you're an NFL HC, your words are going to get over-analyzed. But the guy has been clueless at this point on answering media questions and setting himself up for scrutiny.

Not to mention Jags' interview comment deferring to TT on the number of snaps each QB will get.... :mad:

[chewy-bacca]

just so you know, they dont game plan for presason. it would take to much time from practice, also they dont have film to go over.

I would rather him come out and say he wants to win, than come out after the game and say its meaningless blah blah...b\c they lost. Its a mindset.

Ill admit, TT should not be in on the # of snaps people get, or when and were they play.

Good thing is we faceed a TUFF "D" (3-4 is no joke) and we know what needs work, and we have 3 more "meaningless" games to fix it.

[vince]

Being a new coach, dealing with the press will obviously be a learning experience for MM, and it's one with which he's not real comfortable yet.

And it doesn't matter one iota. What matters is what ultimately happens on the field.

As the season, progresses, and if the team sucks, everyone will latch onto every little thing and use it to bash MM. If the team shows promise, everyone will dismiss his ill-timed comments to the press...

I think the Packers will improve immensely, ultimately showing promise for the future, and everyone will forget about the first (and probably the second) preseason games. And everyone will forget about MM's comment about setting a winning tone prior to the first game.

You do have to set a winning tone. This team though, still has a lot to learn about it's new offensive scheme before it will begin to win consistently.

[pbmax]

just so you know, they dont game plan for presason. it would take to much time from practice, also they dont have film to go over.

I would rather him come out and say he wants to win, than come out after the game and say its meaningless blah blah...b\c they lost. Its a mindset.

Ill admit, TT should not be in on the # of snaps people get, or when and were they play.

Good thing is we faceed a TUFF "D" (3-4 is no joke) and we know what needs work, and we have 3 more "meaningless" games to fix it.
I agree its no reason to be overly concerned, but the fact that you post that they don't game plan for this game and then played uninspired, raises a serious question.

What the hell was McCarthy talking about? What did he expect to happen? If you don't game plan, maybe you leave your starters in for longer? Is this wise with Favre?

And if you aren't game planning, and you want to win, shouldn't you be sure that the players are breathing fire?

I think McCarthy talks through his hat sometimes and doesn't know how to actually prepare for the goals he publicly sets.

He might coach a mean version of football. But if you compare public comments and goals with results (remember that Al Harris was going to be at OTAs according to Carnac) he's been overmatched so far.

[pbmax]

Actually, and I admit its probably a bad mood due to the loss, I am getting a Mike Tice "Meathead" vibe right now. And I don't like it.

[chewy-bacca]

pbmax-

your missing the point....NO ONE game plans for preseason. of course both teams think they are gonna win. As I have read in other stories, they spent maybe 2 hours on Thurs. going over SD plays.(O and D) there just isnt time this time of year to plan anything. you have plays and players you want to see and thats about it. It would be silly for MM to say he didnt care about winning, of course they were tryin to win. Yes some things raise a flag, but hey, its the 1st time they saw anyone but themselves. If there is no improvment, and they get knocked around by the bears, then its panic button time.


edit - IMHO, they didnt play uninspired, they got schooled by a fine "D" thats one of the best front 7 in the AFC.....combine with a lil seen 3-4 and its bad.

[swede]

Not to mention Jags' interview comment deferring to TT on the number of snaps each QB will get.... :mad:


Thanks for bringing that up, Favrechild. I caught that in a J/S article also and wondered about it as well.

The GM wants to see guys play in preseason games because he has to make roster decisions. Fair enough.

The coach wants to see guys play because he has to get information about how much players are learning and will need to make decisions about starters and which combinations of players are going to work well on the field.

I would think that the HC needs to have the greater say on preseason playing time b/c he is involved in a teaching process. Jag's comment made me think, and not for the first time, that TT is too much of a micromanager.

A little friendly advice, Ted: Get off the field. Sit in a box way up high with the quality control coaches. Take notes. Don't tell Mike how many snaps every player needs. Let Mike at least think he's in charge or he won't take charge and lead your team.

[pbmax]

pbmax-

your missing the point....NO ONE game plans for preseason. of course both teams think they are gonna win. As I have read in other stories, they spent maybe 2 hours on Thurs. going over SD plays.(O and D) there just isnt time this time of year to plan anything.
I agree with you on preseason prep, for the most part. But then you don't launch the culture of winning message of the day before you take this approach.

Banking on delivering a preseason win is foolish, IMHO, because you can risk your starters and it may depend on the camp bodies in the end.

But McCarthy all but explicitly said this was his goal. The message he delivered is that I don't know how to back up what I am promising.

And not every team does minimal game plannning. If I recall correctly, Schottenheimer goes overboard, he treats preseason almost like it matters.

[pbmax]

And of course its only a small step and there is time to improve.

But one of the ways you teach people to succeed is to break tasks down to component parts and successfully complete the small steps on the way to something bigger.

Some coaches (Holmgren included) would all but admit that they wanted to evaluate in preseason, not win, but of course smart coaches never say we aren't here to win.

McCarthy's message two days before the game was, I want to win and change the culture. That's a goal, and he missed it. In and of itself, not a big deal, but its another opportunity missed.

[chewy-bacca]

Marty went overbard with the blitzing....I could have done that. :lol:

and I have to think if asked, MM is gonna say he expects to win. Wouldnt make much sence to be neg. about the team.

Like Herm say..."you play to win the game" :smile:

its really all about how improved they are this week. sat. is water under the bridge, lets fix the problems. Like I said, if this crap is still here in week one, PANIC!!

[swede]

Thanks pbmax,

You've said twice now what I've been trying to say.

In a way the promise MM made doesn't matter much b/c it is just a preseason game and will be long-forgotten if this team goes .500 or better.

But, if MM wants to win the hearts and minds of his players, making public statements that end up making him look ridiculous later is very unhelpful.

[cheesner]

I have no problem with MM comments. Letting his team know that winning is important is what he is suppose to say. Not following threw with a win is troubling, but it is something to build on. We all knew that the Pack was a work in progress, MM will be judged on if the Packers show steady improvement.

As far as TT calling some shots, this is very common in preseason. If the Pack signs someone, they have to cut someone else. There may be players coming available anytime. TT needs to know if any particular guy is showing promise. If not, he needs to be ready to add someone else to that spot, or if the position is deep, there is a roster spot that could be used to try someone else at.

OR if TT has a trade in the works he may have an agreement with another GM to show what a player can do - or in general to develop some trade interest.

[jack's smirking revenge]

I think its all relevant. Preseason is training for regular season. Not that MM won't gameplan for regular season, but perhaps the whole system needs to be tooled and tested during preseason--including gameplanning. It's like running your emergency evac plans at work. You have to run them even when there's no urgency to make sure the plans work fine.

I didn't see and postgame interviews and haven't read many reviews of the game, but my impression of the game is that we were sloppy ALL over--coaching, offense, defense. I'm hardpressed to find a positive out of the game. Granted, we started against one of the best teams in the AFC, but if we're going to avoid another 4-12 year, we've got to come out of the gate with attitude and tenacity.

tyler