Nick Collins

[HarveyWallbangers]

I'm one of the biggest Nick Collins fans out there, but he was absolutely terrible tonight. Check out most of the big plays, and you'll find Collins out of position or appearing to miss an assignment. I'm not sure I like this multi-faceted Collins. :) I want him back playing deep and making big plays in the passing game.

[Iron Mike]

I'm feelin' you, dawg.........every time I wanted to rip Erik Walden for being the second coming of Nick Barnett, making tackles 5 yards downfield, he was the only player to make it into the Aints backfield....

[Joemailman]

He definitely bit on play fakes at times. However, he did force a fumble to set up the 2nd TD.

[RashanGary]

Yeah, the core of the Packers defense last year was Collins using his speed to play centerfield while the corners and Woodson jumped routes with Collins protecting deep.

Maybe it's Burnett not knowing what he's doing, I don't know. Hopefully they get it worked out.

[mission]

If Collins is the crap performer of the night that you have to mark a thread about, then I think we're going to be OK.

[HarveyWallbangers]

It was a great win. Just hope Tramon is okay. Just something I noticed in the game. I'm the biggest Collins guy around. I think he's at the top of the next tier of safeties in the NFL behind Reed and Polamalu. However, I'd say if Collins plays his normal Pro Bowl safety, the game could have been won a lot more easily. Honestly, I don't know what the assignments were, but I find it hard to believe that on two of these three plays a safety was designed to double a TE in the flat.

Meachem's TD:

http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-game-highlights/09000d5d8221026d/Meachem-31-yard-TD

Collins come up to double a TE in the flat? Absolutely, no safety help deep on the play. I doubt the play was designed to have Collins come up to double team the TE.

Henderson's TD:

http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-game-highlights/09000d5d82211008/Henderson-s-29-yard-touchdown

Looks like Collins has the deep half on the right. No other receiver in the vicinity to draw his attention away from that assignment. Collins much too late to help out.

Graham's TD:

http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-game-highlights/09000d5d82211590/Graham-s-five-yard-touchdown

Looks to me like Woodson was set to take the outside guy here, but Collins came up to double a TE that he had no chance of reaching, so Woodson came off to guard the wide open receiver in the middle.

BTW, has anybody heard any news regarding Tramon? We could probably survive the next three games without him, but it's gets dicey after that.

[Guiness]

There were some mixups in coverage that seemed to be his responsibility. On the first TD, Collins came up to the line of scrimmage like he was playing run support. Williams had outside coverage on his man and the WR broke across the middle. Williams didn't react right away, and you could almost see the moment when he realized he had no support there. Sure looked like he expected help from the safety.

I'm not terribly worried. It's early, and Capers will go over that piece of film I'm sure...

edit: I'm talking about the first clip HW posted.

[HarveyWallbangers]

I'm not worried about Collins either. I just hope he doesn't go out of his way to prove what type of all-around safety he is. I like the way he's played for the last several years.
:)

[bobblehead]

Yeah, the core of the Packers defense last year was Collins using his speed to play centerfield while the corners and Woodson jumped routes with Collins protecting deep.

Maybe it's Burnett not knowing what he's doing, I don't know. Hopefully they get it worked out.

combination. When Nick came into the league it took him 2 YEARS to learn his assignments well. He is a slow learner. This year with Burnett's speed they are trying to use nick around the line more often and I would bet its confusing him a bit. I hope they stick with it as much as they can get away with though because he has sick talent and it can pay off big in the long run.

[Fritz]

The defense did seem to look confused often last night - guys pointing and talking and moving even as the ball was being snapped. I know the defense came through at the end, and in the red zone, and I know the Saints have a great offense. Still, the defense just didn't look good last night. Outside of a couple plays, Walden looked pedestrian. Bishop seemed invisible. Collins has been mentioned here. After the early part of the game, very little pressure on Brees for long stretches. They've got work to do.

[smuggler]

So much for defenses having the edge to start the season.

[pbmax]

Collins spent a significant amount of time last year playing closer to the LOS, though he was required at times to stay back to help and support Peprah in coverage. Collins role may be a change of emphasis this year with Burnett, but its not like he hasn't been in these situations before.

The Saints do try to create confusion in alignment and routes (see both TDs mentioned above) and I do think the Packers were having trouble diagnosing some of that stuff. On one play, the Saints successfully broke an outside receiver on their left inside for a slant, despite the fact that there was another receiver to his inside. There is no way the DB is supposed to let the WR break inside in this coverage, but the alignment and routes gave this WR the room to break off the line with inside leverage and made the easiest catch on a slant I have ever seen. If they can do that, they can confuse a backfield.

More problematic was the 2 minute drive. With some kind of man coverage underneath and no pass rush, each Saints receiver was not only able to make a catch, but then run unimpeded to the sideline.

Collins did hurt his wrist in the first half but came back.

Williams has a shoulder injury but was not in a cast, splint or harness after the game. So its likely a sprain unless an MRI reveals something they did not detect last night.

[King Friday]

The Saints are a confusing offense to figure out...that's why they rack up the most yards in the league on an annual basis. Collins created the only non-downs turnover of the game with a textbook tackle that helped give Green Bay the early momentum. Yeah, he had some lapses in coverage...but he never has been a fabulous coverage safety. He will always look better against a more run oriented team than he will against a team that slings the ball all over the field.

[gbgary]

he forced a fumble that led to 7. it's just the first game of the season and he was hung out to dry a few times, as were others, by all the unsuccessful blizing...oh, and by the way, that was drew brees out there throwing the ball, not an elderly bf.

[Brandon494]

Elite QBs are going to make defensive players look bad some games but that doesn't mean Collins play as fallen off. What Rodgers did to Polamalu in the SB is a great example.

[HarveyWallbangers]

he forced a fumble that led to 7. it's just the first game of the season and he was hung out to dry a few times, as were others, by all the unsuccessful blizing...oh, and by the way, that was drew brees out there throwing the ball, not an elderly bf.

He did, but I expect more out of Collins. To me, he's probably the third best safety in the NFL. It happens. Polamalu struggled against us in the Super Bowl, but it's easy to pile on lesser guys when they don't play up to par. I don't think Collins played up to par for him. I expect much better performances out of him the rest of the way. It's also a reason that I think a rematch against the Saints could go better than this one.

[RashanGary]

He did, but I expect more out of Collins. To me, he's probably the third best safety in the NFL. It happens. Polamalu struggled against us in the Super Bowl, but it's easy to pile on lesser guys when they don't play up to par. I don't think Collins played up to par for him. I expect much better performances out of him the rest of the way. It's also a reason that I think a rematch against the Saints could go better than this one.

In the deep middle, Collins has one primary job and after that, he's given a lot of freedom without all of the grey area up near the line. . . . His job is "don't let anyone get deep." After that, he can play off his instinct (something he's amazing at.) So he sits deep, uses his range to get to both sides of the field (we played a lot of cover 1 last year with Collins deep.) When Collins is just playing ball, he's right up there with the best tacklers in the game. He's one of the fastest DB's in the game. When it's a run, he's great at sifting through traffic, somehow bending off blocks and making a bad ass tackle. When a run or run after the catch break down, when there's no time to sit and think about formations, tips, hints, etc. . . Collins is a guy who finds a way to get to a point and bring a guy down, even when he has no business making the play.

One on one, two on one, three on one even. . . . Collins dominates. I watch mostly the Packers, but to me, he's the most dominant player I've seen that way. There's more to coming off blocks, leverage, setting up a blocker on the fly, sifting through traffic, tackling, etc. . . . than being an athlete. Cliff Christl and that Eric Barzasack had an article recently that said good tacklers are born, not made. There's a feel to combat that you have or you don't. Collins was born a fucking gladiator. He's a destroyer. Let's keep it that way. We have Wood and Hawk to keep that grey area in the middle sowed up. Some guys just need to be let loose. Collins needs to be let loose AND he's the best in the game and patrolling the deep middle first. He locks his "mentally simple", but ultra important job down first.

I think he's also the best runner on our team. With the ball in his hands, his toughness, agility, speed, instincts. . . . He's so physical, so instinctive, such good hands. . . . . He's not that thinking football player. He's the dominator, the guy with the natural feel for space, for combat.

[RashanGary]

I watched some old school clips of Tony Gonzalez. Finley looks like more of a bad ass baller to me. Gonzalez though, he was a route runner. He'd run routes and have safeties turned around, running the wrong way as he made his cut and nabbed the ball. . . kind of the way Jennings does. Gonzalez is to Woodson as Finley is to Collins IMO. Rodgers is to Woodson as Collins is to Favre. . . That kind of thing. Favre was one of those guys. . . He wasn't cerebral until late in his career and even then, Rodgers has flown past him already. . . . Favre was a dominator though. He had a feel for space, a feel for combat. . . . He was a baller.

Favre, Collins, Finley. . . . . Ghetto tough, natural, backyard/farm/street tough . . . .

Woodson, Rodgers, Gonzalez. . . . Smart, effective, bring the system to a new level. . . .

[mraynrand]

Yeah, Finley is a great talent, but he needs to extract his head from his posterior - if he doesn't do blitz pick up better and doesn't line up correctly, he's a detriment too. It's like F**** throwing those crazy picks after an entire game of exceptional play. Maddening! http://everythingishistory.com/wp-content/uploads/Madden_John_07.jpg

[HarveyWallbangers]

Since when has Finley chronically not lined up properly or not picked up blitzes? He's made himself a decent blocker. He'll never be great, but I have no problem with Finley's play on the field. It's all about availability.

[Brandon494]

Since when has Finley chronically not lined up properly or not picked up blitzes? He's made himself a decent blocker. He'll never be great, but I have no problem with Finley's play on the field. It's all about availability.

You know how people love to overreact after one game. Finley and Starks were both poor in blitz pickup last night but they'll get better with more game experience.