The Moll train?!?

[Partial]

Yeah, I don't buy this one bit. They're trying to light a fire under Colledge. That's all.

[Bretsky]

Colledge was getting overpowered in the game the other night. If he's not strong enough or doesn't have the technique to utilize his strength it might be a while.

Veteran help needed.

[Deputy Nutz]

Your making a mountain out of a Moll Hill.

[Willard]

They need to keep their eye on the Moll. An irregularly shaped Moll or a Moll that continues to grow can be a very dangerous thing.

[digitaldean]

Yeah, I don't buy this one bit. They're trying to light a fire under Colledge. That's all.

He was publicly anointed a starter the day he was drafted. He had a subpar game vs. SD.

Purely motivational move. Moll may surprise fans, but he still lacks the strength to consistently play at guard.

There are going to be vets cut in the next week or two, wouldn't be surprised to see TT pick somebody up.

[MJZiggy]

I just watched all the interviews from yesterday's practice and EVERYONE said the exact same thing: they're just switching stuff around to see what works best. Don't expect any of it to be permanent.

I'd expect a little shuffling this week and then they'll settle into something depending on what we see when Atlanta comes to town.

[HarveyWallbangers]

I just watched all the interviews from yesterday's practice and EVERYONE said the exact same thing: they're just switching stuff around to see what works best. Don't expect any of it to be permanent.

I'd expect a little shuffling this week and then they'll settle into something depending on what we see when Atlanta comes to town.

That's what I thought initially, but all of the reports I've read sound like this came about because they want to take a legit look at Moll--not just get him some reps at another position. That tells me they are very concerned with Colledge.

http://www.packersnews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060815/PKR0205/608150461/1989

I think Colledge will be a good OL eventually. Maybe it was asking too much to assume he was ready to be a starter as a rookie.

[Partial]

Your making a mountain out of a Moll Hill.

Moll may have shot the sheriff, but he didn't shoot the Deputy!! Hop aboard the MOLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLl TRAINNNNN.


Moll and Cole on the way to the pro bowl?

Ok i'm retarded

[gbpackfan]

HOLY MOLY!

[mmmdk]

No MOLLS allowed :wink: as to TROLLS :mrgreen:

[Bretsky]

I just watched all the interviews from yesterday's practice and EVERYONE said the exact same thing: they're just switching stuff around to see what works best. Don't expect any of it to be permanent.

I'd expect a little shuffling this week and then they'll settle into something depending on what we see when Atlanta comes to town.

That's what I thought initially, but all of the reports I've read sound like this came about because they want to take a legit look at Moll--not just get him some reps at another position. That tells me they are very concerned with Colledge.

http://www.packersnews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060815/PKR0205/608150461/1989

I think Colledge will be a good OL eventually. Maybe it was asking too much to assume he was ready to be a starter as a rookie.

Is it asking too much for us to assume Moll or Spitz are ready as rookies ?

Yes

Which is exactly why I'm so perplexed as to TT's lack of interest in quality OL in free agency. And I know there were no great ones besides a couple, but there was plenty of depth with more quality than we went into training camp with.

[Patler]

Perhaps TT was interested, but the players were not interested in coming to GB.

[Bretsky]

Perhaps TT was interested, but the players were not interested in coming to GB.

This is pure speculation, but IMO TT makes calls and the GM's often discuss figures with agents.

TT was very tight with his change early on and my gut tells me he was not willing to pay for any of the decent ones; money talks. I have a hard time believing we could not have signed a starter if we were offering the best contract. Sometimes it will take that to get a solid player to GB. Reality Bites.

[Patler]

Perhaps TT was interested, but the players were not interested in coming to GB.

This is pure speculation, but IMO TT makes calls and the GM's often discuss figures with agents.

TT was very tight with his change early on and my gut tells me he was not willing to pay for any of the decent ones; money talks. I have a hard time believing we could not have signed a starter if we were offering the best contract. Sometimes it will take that to get a solid player to GB. Reality Bites.

CC claimed today that Green Bay offered more to Vinatieri than Indy did.

The reality is that money does not always talk, especially with players who have been smart with their money. Some know they are financially secure anyway and really do want a shot with a playoff contender. They will be paid well, regardless.

Most realize that GB is not a contender, and they are not just a player or two away. If they can be close to 8-8 with a young roster, then, maybe, they will again be attractive. For the time being, GB is probably a hard-sell.

[HarveyWallbangers]

Patler,

A large majority of the time... money talks.

[MJZiggy]

Not when the warmth of a dome is involved. AV froze his ass off for years. I can blame him for screwing GB, but not for wanting a heated place to kick.

[Deputy Nutz]

I just watched all the interviews from yesterday's practice and EVERYONE said the exact same thing: they're just switching stuff around to see what works best. Don't expect any of it to be permanent.

I'd expect a little shuffling this week and then they'll settle into something depending on what we see when Atlanta comes to town.

That's what I thought initially, but all of the reports I've read sound like this came about because they want to take a legit look at Moll--not just get him some reps at another position. That tells me they are very concerned with Colledge.

http://www.packersnews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060815/PKR0205/608150461/1989

I think Colledge will be a good OL eventually. Maybe it was asking too much to assume he was ready to be a starter as a rookie.

Is it asking too much for us to assume Moll or Spitz are ready as rookies ?

Yes

Which is exactly why I'm so perplexed as to TT's lack of interest in quality OL in free agency. And I know there were no great ones besides a couple, but there was plenty of depth with more quality than we went into training camp with.

TT doesn't want to shell out money for an offensive guard. He has shown in it in the two years that he has been in Green Bay. You got 5 starting positions on that offensive line, and you can't give all of them 10 million plus in guarantees. It would have been nice to keep Wahle, it would have been nice to sign Hutchinson, but realistically, but realistically, but realistically, wait a minute, why the hell didn't we sign those fellas?

[Bretsky]

Perhaps TT was interested, but the players were not interested in coming to GB.

This is pure speculation, but IMO TT makes calls and the GM's often discuss figures with agents.

TT was very tight with his change early on and my gut tells me he was not willing to pay for any of the decent ones; money talks. I have a hard time believing we could not have signed a starter if we were offering the best contract. Sometimes it will take that to get a solid player to GB. Reality Bites.

CC claimed today that Green Bay offered more to Vinatieri than Indy did.

The reality is that money does not always talk, especially with players who have been smart with their money. Some know they are financially secure anyway and really do want a shot with a playoff contender. They will be paid well, regardless.

Most realize that GB is not a contender, and they are not just a player or two away. If they can be close to 8-8 with a young roster, then, maybe, they will again be attractive. For the time being, GB is probably a hard-sell.

I would argue that the K situation was unique. There were several OL that could have helped us. Adam V was the cream of the crop and knew it. He also know he had options from Super Bowl contenders and he knew he was going to get his payday where he wanted to play. Vandy was next and one could argue the same for him. Those are elite guys at their postions.

But TT could have and should have brought in some OL help, and I'm very confident if they threw the money at a few they could have succeeded.

Heck, look at the diamond those choking Viqueens :wink: brought in.

Now I'm not saying bring Hutch in at that wage, but for God sake Bring Help when help is Desperately Needed.

Or maybe TT just overvalued his ability to pick NFL ready draft picks ?


B

[Bretsky]

I just watched all the interviews from yesterday's practice and EVERYONE said the exact same thing: they're just switching stuff around to see what works best. Don't expect any of it to be permanent.

I'd expect a little shuffling this week and then they'll settle into something depending on what we see when Atlanta comes to town.

That's what I thought initially, but all of the reports I've read sound like this came about because they want to take a legit look at Moll--not just get him some reps at another position. That tells me they are very concerned with Colledge.

http://www.packersnews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060815/PKR0205/608150461/1989

I think Colledge will be a good OL eventually. Maybe it was asking too much to assume he was ready to be a starter as a rookie.

Is it asking too much for us to assume Moll or Spitz are ready as rookies ?

Yes

Which is exactly why I'm so perplexed as to TT's lack of interest in quality OL in free agency. And I know there were no great ones besides a couple, but there was plenty of depth with more quality than we went into training camp with.

TT doesn't want to shell out money for an offensive guard. He has shown in it in the two years that he has been in Green Bay. You got 5 starting positions on that offensive line, and you can't give all of them 10 million plus in guarantees. It would have been nice to keep Wahle, it would have been nice to sign Hutchinson, but realistically, but realistically, but realistically, wait a minute, why the hell didn't we sign those fellas?

HERE IS A RADICAL THOUGHT, BUT ONE I HAVE.

GREEN BAY SHOULD HAVE SIGNED FLANAGAN.

HE WAS SERVICEABLE AS A C OR OG, AND HE WAS A GOOD LEADER AND GOOD PLAYER WHEN HEALTHY.

ALL OF THE POSTS ABOUT HIS DEMISE WERE OVERDONE.

JUST A REMINDER: WE'RE SITTING ON 7MIL NOW WITH SERIOUS WEAKNESSES.

[HarveyWallbangers]

Weren't you a proponent for letting Flanagan go?

Flanny is milktoast. Marco Rivera is just about milktoast in Dallas. He didn't play that well last year--despite the fact he got good pub. Wahle was the damaging one. For what the Packers asked of him, he was a top five OG in the league.

[Bretsky]

Weren't you a proponent for letting Flanagan go?

Flanny is milktoast. Marco Rivera is just about milktoast in Dallas. He didn't play that well last year--despite the fact he got good pub. Wahle was the damaging one. For what the Packers asked of him, he was a top five OG in the league.


I NEVER BLESSED LETTING FLANY GO; I THINK THE FORUM TALK ABOUT HIM BEING JELLO IS CRAP AND WHEN HEALTHY HE IS STILL ABOVE AVERAGE AT C AND AVERAGE AT OG AND WAY WAY BETTER THAN WHAT WE HAVE AT OG. YES, HE WAS FINE AT GUARD WHEN PLUGGED IN THERE.

I BLESSED LETTING WAHLE (A MISTAKE IN RETROSPECT) AND MARCO GO, ALTHOUGH I DID FIGURE THEY'D KEEP ONE.

BUT IF YA LET THEM GO YOU HAVE TO FIND COMPETENT REPLACEMENTS. TT FAILED US THERE.

[Bretsky]

Weren't you a proponent for letting Flanagan go?

Flanny is milktoast. Marco Rivera is just about milktoast in Dallas. He didn't play that well last year--despite the fact he got good pub. Wahle was the damaging one. For what the Packers asked of him, he was a top five OG in the league.

CLIFF OUTSMARTED US ALL ON WAHLE.

FROM THE GET GO CRISTL SAID YOU DON'T LET A 26YR OLD STAR AT HIS POSITION GO FREELY INTO FA.

HE WAS RIGHT.

[HarveyWallbangers]

QUIT YELLING AT ME!

[Bretsky]

Sorry,

Your thread put me in a bad mood..............................cause........... .....
I agreed with the content.

[Patler]

I NEVER BLESSED LETTING FLANY GO; I THINK THE FORUM TALK ABOUT HIM BEING JELLO IS CRAP AND WHEN HEALTHY HE IS STILL ABOVE AVERAGE AT C AND AVERAGE AT OG AND WAY WAY BETTER THAN WHAT WE HAVE AT OG. YES, HE WAS FINE AT GUARD WHEN PLUGGED IN THERE.


You got me on this one Bretsky, did Flanagan play guard in this century, or back in his real early years?

[Bretsky]

I NEVER BLESSED LETTING FLANY GO; I THINK THE FORUM TALK ABOUT HIM BEING JELLO IS CRAP AND WHEN HEALTHY HE IS STILL ABOVE AVERAGE AT C AND AVERAGE AT OG AND WAY WAY BETTER THAN WHAT WE HAVE AT OG. YES, HE WAS FINE AT GUARD WHEN PLUGGED IN THERE.


You got me on this one Bretsky, did Flanagan play guard in this century, or back in his real early years?

Unless I'm losing my mind (certainly a possibility) he filled in at OG in earlier years. He also filled at OT; both injury related.

[MJZiggy]

I NEVER BLESSED LETTING FLANY GO; I THINK THE FORUM TALK ABOUT HIM BEING JELLO IS CRAP AND WHEN HEALTHY HE IS STILL ABOVE AVERAGE AT C AND AVERAGE AT OG AND WAY WAY BETTER THAN WHAT WE HAVE AT OG. YES, HE WAS FINE AT GUARD WHEN PLUGGED IN THERE.


You got me on this one Bretsky, did Flanagan play guard in this century, or back in his real early years?

As TT put it in today's press conference, "back in the days of leather helmets..."

He's really been cuttin' it up in those conferences lately. Anyone who worries about his relationship with the media should really check them out.

[LEWCWA]

If Moll starts for Green Bay, we are all in trouble! As if alchohalism isn't already a big enough problem in Wisconsin!

[Patler]

Patler,

A large majority of the time... money talks.

I'm not sure I agree with that. For some, yes, but many of these guys are more wealthy than they ever dreamed they would be, and for some another $500,000 or $1,000,000 really doesn't make a difference.

Look at Andruzzi last year. Decided that if NE couldn't keep him, the only place he wanted to go was Cleveland. Didn't shop himself at all. Made one visit and signed with Cleveland immediately when the league allowed FA signings to start. Something like literally within hours.

Even Bentley this year didn't make a lot of visits. Openly admitted he wanted to go home to Cleveland after the fact. I know, he got huge money, but I have to wonder if he would have gone there anyway

When the Packers were legitimate contenders, it seemed every year there was an FA or two who signed for a low amount to have a chance at a ring. They don't get that now.

[Patler]

I NEVER BLESSED LETTING FLANY GO; I THINK THE FORUM TALK ABOUT HIM BEING JELLO IS CRAP AND WHEN HEALTHY HE IS STILL ABOVE AVERAGE AT C AND AVERAGE AT OG AND WAY WAY BETTER THAN WHAT WE HAVE AT OG. YES, HE WAS FINE AT GUARD WHEN PLUGGED IN THERE.


You got me on this one Bretsky, did Flanagan play guard in this century, or back in his real early years?

Unless I'm losing my mind (certainly a possibility) he filled in at OG in earlier years. He also filled at OT; both injury related.

The last I remember of Flanagan playing anywhere but center was when he filled in for Clifton after Clifton was injured. But the Packers even said last year that Flanagan was no longer an option at guard because of his knee problems.

[HarveyWallbangers]

Patler,

You aren't going to convince me that for a large majority of players money isn't the primary factor. Sorry! I tend to agree with you, but not on this one. Sure, there are players that will stay put for similar money, and there is a smaller group that will go somewhere for less money than other places. That's the exception... not the rule.

[Patler]

CLIFF OUTSMARTED US ALL ON WAHLE.

FROM THE GET GO CRISTL SAID YOU DON'T LET A 26YR OLD STAR AT HIS POSITION GO FREELY INTO FA.

HE WAS RIGHT.

But you can't always stop it. Hutchinson, Bentley, Kearse were all just as young and just as accomplished, or more so than Wahle, and left in free agency.

[Patler]

Patler,

You aren't going to convince me that for a large majority of players money isn't the primary factor. Sorry! I tend to agree with you, but not on this one. Sure, there are players that will stay put for similar money, and there is a smaller group that will go somewhere for less money than other places. That's the exception... not the rule.

I don't have nearly as strong a belief as you do about the strength of money as a motivating factor, especially for people who will not want financially regardless of their decision. I have too many personal experiences that contradict that.

[MuttnJeff]

I think Packers are taking s serious look at Moll at guard.

Colledge could very well be Adrian Klemm II, another left tackle that Thompson declared to be a guard. Both Colledge and Klemm are said to be athletic, good feet, but kinda top-heavy. Sounds like left tackle to me.

The good news is that the Packers may have found their backup LT in Colledge. And maybe that's where Colledge ought to be. Clifton is getting old and vulnerable to injury, developing a replacement is important.

[Partial]

I think Packers are taking s serious look at Moll at guard.

Colledge could very well be Adrian Klemm II, another left tackle that Thompson declared to be a guard. Both Colledge and Klemm are said to be athletic, good feet, but kinda top-heavy. Sounds like left tackle to me.

The good news is that the Packers may have found their backup LT in Colledge. And maybe that's where Colledge ought to be. Clifton is getting old and vulnerable to injury, developing a replacement is important.

I think the difference between a guard and tackle seems to be much lesser schematically then it was in the old scheme. At least in the sense of run blocking. Klemm did't appear to have too many problems in pass blocking.

[MuttnJeff]

A left tackle has to deal with defensive ends in space. A guard has to be able to hold ground against 325 pound defensive tackle. The skills are going to be different for the positions in any scheme. I'm sure there are some guys who can play either position. But I doubt, for instance, that Clifton would be a good guard. Colledge might be better at LT.