Special Teams

[RashanGary]

Football outsiders has a total ST's breakdown. The Packers are 14th out of 32. They broke it down into 5 categories. . . Kick, Punt, Kick Return, Punt Return, FG. I'll just give the Packers a 1-5 based on memory of last years team and based on football outsiders for how they rank this year.


Kick
2010 - 1 - Fire slowcum
2011 - 3 - Middle of the league right now



Kick Return
2010 - 2
2011 - 4



Punt
2010 - 2 (I remember Masthay struggling early)
2011 - 1 (A couple big returns killing our stats right now. Masthay is starting to come on again)



Punt Return
2010 - 3 - I thought Tramon was average
2011 - 3 - We're in the middle of the league right now



Field Goal
2010 - 3
2011 - 5



2010 Average
2.2

2011 Average
3.2


Perspective:

Nobody is horrible at everything or great at everything. Indy is the worst this year. They have below average FG, average kick coverage, bad kick return, awful punt coverage and below average punt return. That's a 2,3,2,1,2. That's a 2.0 average. So the Packers 2.2 last year is awful.


Does Pathetic ST's to Average ST's make a 1 or 2 game difference in 7 games?

[Fritz]

I'm still thinking Slocum is not exactly setting the world on fire as a coach.

[Joemailman]

I'm still thinking Slocum is not exactly setting the world on fire as a coach.

Perhaps, but if they can maintain their current level of play, that is a major improvement over last year when they finished 26th. http://www.footballoutsiders.com/stats/teamst2010

It's not like the packers need to be dominant on special teams to be successful.

[RashanGary]

And they "finished" 26th. Masthay really came on in those last few games of the regular season and miraculously, the coverage units stopped being horrible at that time too. . . . We might have been more like 30th for most of the year.

[woodbuck27]

Slocum has to be a tad concerned. What is going on with ST's?

It's TIME.

For an assesment and conclusion strategy.

[Pugger]

Slocum isn't the greatest coach in the league by a long shot but I wonder if some of our problems last year were because we had different guys in there almost every week? With starters and their backups dropping like flies we had street FAs in there literally learning on the fly. We had fellas playing ST that normally wouldn't be on an NFL payroll so we lost at least 2games because of ST gaffs. I'm not giving Slocum a pass here, but offering a plausible reason for our crappy ST play last season.

[pbmax]

I'm still thinking Slocum is not exactly setting the world on fire as a coach.

He is much more like a wet blanket.

[MJZiggy]

Slocum has to be a tad concerned. What is going on with ST's?

It's TIME.

For an assesment and conclusion strategy.

It was time for an assessment and conclusion strategy three years ago. Now they're starting to get better.

[Fritz]

Of course, it'd be crazy to fire the guy during the season, but at the end of the season I would hope it'd be reviewed very carefully.

[pbmax]

Of course, it'd be crazy to fire the guy during the season, but at the end of the season I would hope it'd be reviewed very carefully.

There are some overreactions I am willing to live with. This is one.

[Upnorth]

If we had decreased from 2009 to 2010 I would be okay with slocum but we sucked in 2009. Masthay is having a great year but has a below average net due to coverage team. Cobb has amazing potential but our blocking scheme does not help. We have great talent but it does not show up on game day. That is coaching. There are better out there let's get one in the offseason after we win SB #5.

[Joemailman]

If we had decreased from 2009 to 2010 I would be okay with slocum but we sucked in 2009. Masthay is having a great year but has a below average net due to coverage team. Cobb has amazing potential but our blocking scheme does not help. We have great talent but it does not show up on game day. That is coaching. There are better out there let's get one in the offseason after we win SB #5.

Who do you have in mind? Teams that have a good ST coach probably aren't going to release them from their contract so they can go help the poor beleaguered Packers.

Slocum isn't great, but things seem to be getting better.

[sheepshead]

This could be the best punter/field goal kicker combo in Packer history. Just sayin'

[Upnorth]

Who do you have in mind? Teams that have a good ST coach probably aren't going to release them from their contract so they can go help the poor beleaguered Packers.

Slocum isn't great, but things seem to be getting better.

I must admit I don't have anyone in mind, but I would go to a mid level college which does not have all world recruits but does have consistently really good special teams and start from there.
Also mathsay and crosby is the best packer kicking combo I can think of.

[Joemailman]

So Slocum gets credit for developing the best Packer kicking combo ever?

[Upnorth]

So Slocum gets credit for developing the best Packer kicking combo ever?

I will give him credit for mathsay, although I don't know who has developed his kicking. I would argue mister aim for the goal post held crosby back, and that shortly after a MM presser mentioned slocum would not be working on crosby's kicking he started getting better.

[vince]

Maybe Hentrich and Jacke were as good or better as a combo...

The "aim for the goal post" strategy may be a bit misunderstood. Slocum never coached Crosby to aim for the goal post when kicking within the field of play. He coached him to pick an aiming point in the middle of the post, and drilled it into him by having him kick from the side of the field where he could only see one post and had him try to hit the post - from the side of the post - if that makes sense.

[Smeefers]

Maybe Hentrich and Jacke were as good or better as a combo...

The "aim for the goal post" strategy may be a bit misunderstood. Slocum never coached Crosby to aim for the goal post when kicking within the field of play. He coached him to pick an aiming point in the middle of the post, and drilled it into him by having him kick from the side of the field where he could only see one post and had him try to hit the post - from the side of the post - if that makes sense.

What you're saying makes sense. What he had him do doesn't.

[vince]

I'm no Slocum apologist, but kicking obviously isn't an area in which the team is struggling at this point. Credit goes to Crosby, but whatever his coach has done working with him over the last couple years seems to have worked pretty well.

[Smidgeon]

It was time for an assessment and conclusion strategy three years ago. Now they're starting to get better.

Agreed. It seems like special teams have been making progress each and every year. They were awful three years ago. Now they seem adequate. No longer are there five penalties a game, constant fear of blocked punts, and enough shanked field goal attempts to worry everyone every time the kicker trotted out. Now it's better than that. I'll take it and expect continued improvement.

[vince]

I will give him credit for mathsay, although I don't know who has developed his kicking. I would argue mister aim for the goal post held crosby back, and that shortly after a MM presser mentioned slocum would not be working on crosby's kicking he started getting better.
I usually make it a point to listen to each of McCarthy's press conferences and have for years. I don't recall him ever stating that Slocum would not be working on Crosby's kicking. I'd be interested to hear that as that would indeed change the situation. It's hard for me to imagine McCarthy saying that the Special Teams Coordinator was no longer allowed to do a part of his job... Can you remember when this was or maybe link it up?

[vince]

I do wonder about Slocum as it pertains to the coverage and return schemes. I think the ability is there but the results have been inconsistent to say the least.

[sheepshead]

Maybe Hentrich and Jacke were as good or better as a combo...

The "aim for the goal post" strategy may be a bit misunderstood. Slocum never coached Crosby to aim for the goal post when kicking within the field of play. He coached him to pick an aiming point in the middle of the post, and drilled it into him by having him kick from the side of the field where he could only see one post and had him try to hit the post - from the side of the post - if that makes sense.

Masthey is better. Crosby is better taking these long kicks into account. The rest of these squads not so much.

[pbmax]

I usually make it a point to listen to each of McCarthy's press conferences and have for years. I don't recall him ever stating that Slocum would not be working on Crosby's kicking. I'd be interested to hear that as that would indeed change the situation. It's hard for me to imagine McCarthy saying that the Special Teams Coordinator was no longer allowed to do a part of his job... Can you remember when this was or maybe link it up?

I know Slocum gave Crosby a to-do list this offseason before the lockout and he said Crosby has nailed each of the points since early in camp.

[sharpe1027]

It is a bit of an apples and oranges comparison from last year. Changing the kick off rules has diminished the value of coverage and returns. I would imaging that Crosby's leg strength benefits the Packers more than most teams. One would expect the Packers to get better by virtue of the rule change alone. How much of the remaining improvement does Slocum deserve credit for?

[Upnorth]

I usually make it a point to listen to each of McCarthy's press conferences and have for years. I don't recall him ever stating that Slocum would not be working on Crosby's kicking. I'd be interested to hear that as that would indeed change the situation. It's hard for me to imagine McCarthy saying that the Special Teams Coordinator was no longer allowed to do a part of his job... Can you remember when this was or maybe link it up?

After one of Corsby's near misses someone asked if they would would be reworking Crosby's motion (or something along those lines) and MM responded that Slocum would not . I am not sure which game it was so, I wont be able to help there. Sorry.

Also I think we have a very good kicking game this year. My problem is with and has been with the coverage units. We have talented depth but nothing to show for it on special teams. To me that is scheme more than anything.

[RashanGary]

It is a bit of an apples and oranges comparison from last year. Changing the kick off rules has diminished the value of coverage and returns. I would imaging that Crosby's leg strength benefits the Packers more than most teams. One would expect the Packers to get better by virtue of the rule change alone. How much of the remaining improvement does Slocum deserve credit for?

Good point.

[Cheesehead Craig]

I do wonder about Slocum as it pertains to the coverage and return schemes. I think the ability is there but the results have been inconsistent to say the least.

That's where Slocum should be judged the most.