What does Suh get?

[Guiness]

Watching the half time show during the Dallas/Miami game, and they were talking about the Suh stomp incident.

Deon was the most lenient, but still said he was being untruthful (by saying he was trying to regain his balance). Someone else said Schwartz either condones this, or takes a stand.

Cowher had the most interesting thing to say - Haynesworth had no history of 'after the play' bullshit, and got 5 games. Suh should get at least that.

[mmmdk]

Suspended like Haynesworth; hopefully for games.

[Upnorth]

I thought minimum 2 before his after game statement. Now it must be at least 4, and possibly more. His fine should be minimun 100k and paid direct to EDS.

[gbpackfan]

Couple of things:

1. He has no remorse.
2. He is lying about it. I guess he thinks everyone is an idiot.
3. He refuses to apologies or admit he did anything wrong.
4. He has a history of being dirty.
5. He had a meeting with Goodell already, at his request. He should know EXACTLY what is expected of him.
6. Schwartz is partially to blame. He allows this shit to happen all too often.

[gbgary]

considering the fact that he's already been in the commissioner's office for his bullshit it should be a big fine and at least 5 games...maybe more.

[SkinBasket]

I thought minimum 2 before his after game statement. Now it must be at least 4, and possibly more. His fine should be minimun 100k and paid direct to EDS.

My thoughts exactly. The comments after the game deserve an extended penalty. I think the 5 Hayneworth got is about as good of an example you can use. End his season.

[George Cumby]

Why during his presser, am I reminded of me at eight years old trying to explain why I was in a fight on the playground?

Criminy, the guy is so full of crap. So immature, if not outright delusional. Does he think everyone is blind?

Clearly he's never been taught accountability.

Four games.

[denverYooper]

Haynesworth stomped a guy's head, and it looked much more deliberate. Suh stomped EDS's arm. It was bush league but I'd say not anywhere near as bad as Albert's.

He has been fined several times, though, so that will probably factor into the decision. 3 games is my guess.

[Gunakor]

Sit his ass until week 17. Let him play in the rematch at Lambeau. Our guys can take it from there.

[denverYooper]

Suh was just upset he was getting handled by a backup lineman.

[denverYooper]

Sit his ass until week 17. Let him play in the rematch at Lambeau. Our guys can take it from there.

LOL. There you go. Or they could just say that anyone blocking Suh gets a penalty exemption. For Anything. Prison rules for the OLineman.

[Freak Out]

LOL. There you go. Or they could just say that anyone blocking Suh gets a penalty exemption. For Anything. Prison rules for the OLineman.

Lol....go "The longest yard" on his ass.

[Guiness]

wow, I haven't seen this accord on PR since...well, never. Some around here even miss Tyronne, so you know there's generally no amity here!

Any links to his post-game presser?

[MadtownPacker]

What does suh get?

He gets to watch his team miss the playoffs!

[MadtownPacker]

Haynesworth stomped a guy's head, and it looked much more deliberate. Suh stomped EDS's arm. It was bush league but I'd say not anywhere near as bad as Albert's.

He has been fined several times, though, so that will probably factor into the decision. 3 games is my guess.
This pig was being just as much a shit as the haynesworth. He try to put a stomp on our Guys chest. He didn't connect but who is to say he wouldn't have broke a rib if he had got his shot in.

[mmmdk]

What does suh get?

He gets to watch his team miss the playoffs!

:lol: Funny stuff!

[Guiness]

Just saw the replay again, he was smashing EDS's head into the ground first.

This is getting enough airplay, I think he's going to get slapped hard for this.

[MJZiggy]

*wants it noted for the record that I called this before the season and was heavily ridiculed for it. I think he gets at least three games and $75K. I don't know that he'll get the five Haynesworth did because he didn't connect with the head and the NFL is being way more careful with the heads (not so much with the headcases). Did anyone see him on the sidelines trying to convince his asshole coach that it wasn't his fault?

[Upnorth]

What does suh get?

He gets to watch his team miss the playoffs!

Excellent, subtle way of implyingrest of season suspension.

[Pugger]

Suh was just upset he was getting handled by a backup lineman.

This might be closer to the truth plus the fact that his team was losing. :lol:

[MJZiggy]

This might be closer to the truth plus the fact that his team was losing. :lol:

They were losing a lot worse AFTER he did that than before.

[Pugger]

*wants it noted for the record that I called this before the season and was heavily ridiculed for it. I think he gets at least three games and $75K. I don't know that he'll get the five Haynesworth did because he didn't connect with the head and the NFL is being way more careful with the heads (not so much with the headcases). Did anyone see him on the sidelines trying to convince his asshole coach that it wasn't his fault?

This is the thing. He doesn't get it that this kind of behavior is unacceptable and until this message registers he's gonna continue to act like a Neanderthal. It doesn't help that his idiot coach seems to condone this behavior, at least pubically.

[Pugger]

They were losing a lot worse AFTER he did that than before.

True...

[gbgary]

looks like he'll have to keep driving a chrysler.

[Harlan Huckleby]

Something wonderful will come out of this ugly incident: we no longer have to read or listen to "Is Suh a dirty player?" discussions.

Yes, he is a dirty player. He is talented and aggressive, but also dirty.

[LEWCWA]

st8t punk

[MadtownPacker]

He is talented and aggressive, but also dirty.
You drool at the thought of him being agressive and dirty with you, huh you sorry whore?

[Harlan Huckleby]

what a way to talk on thanksgiving. do you kiss your mother with that mouth?

[MadtownPacker]

what a way to talk on thanksgiving. do you kiss your mother with that mouth?

Don't worry, the tequila sanitizes it.

[Cheesehead Craig]

He'll be gone for four games and big fine. Then he'll whine about it some more like a little bitch. Be a man and stand up for the shit you do.

[PaCkFan_n_MD]

Suh is a dirty piece of shit. He tried to lie after the game and say he didn't do anything on purpose. I hope he misses the rest of the season.

[retailguy]

He might get suspended for a game. That's probably the most. We'll see.

[CaliforniaCheez]

Before his press conference, a hefty fine or one game. Because of his denial and refusal to apologize, 2 games.

[ND72]

Besides the fact I fucking hate him....own up and take responsibility! Don't give me this horse manure I was off balance, he was holding my foot bullshit you're trying to get out. Nobody buys that from you and you look like a bigger horses ass for thinking we're stupid. All you gotta say is I fucked up, my emotions ran high, and I shouldn't have done it. Until then, shut up and save it....and tell your dickhead coach I'm sick of listening to him also.

[PaCkFan_n_MD]

Besides the fact I fucking hate him....own up and take responsibility! Don't give me this horse manure I was off balance, he was holding my foot bullshit you're trying to get out. Nobody buys that from you and you look like a bigger horses ass for thinking we're stupid. All you gotta say is I fucked up, my emotions ran high, and I shouldn't have done it. Until then, shut up and save it....and tell your dickhead coach I'm sick of listening to him also.

Couldn't have said it better.

[mmmdk]

Besides the fact I fucking hate him....own up and take responsibility! Don't give me this horse manure I was off balance, he was holding my foot bullshit you're trying to get out. Nobody buys that from you and you look like a bigger horses ass for thinking we're stupid. All you gotta say is I fucked up, my emotions ran high, and I shouldn't have done it. Until then, shut up and save it....and tell your dickhead coach I'm sick of listening to him also.

Great post! :tup:

[digitaldean]

Detroit Free Press is just skewering this punk-ass. They are already expecting him to be gone for next week vs. NO.

To be honest, since he made that special trip to visit Commish Goodell PLUS he had that moronic non-denial denial explanation, he HAS to get a multiple game suspension. Even Bill Cowher called Coach Jim "the Schwartz" responsible for Suh's actions. A single game will equate to a slap on the wrists, IMO.

[Jimx29]

He's in complete denial. He needs to be out for the rest of the season, W/O pay, minimum.....including any post season games if by some miracle they get that far. I personally see this thing gaining speed and it will put the lions season in complete turmoil (well, maybe that's wishful thinking)

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000d5d8246eec7/article/lions-dt-suh-says-thirdquarter-ejection-was-unwarranted?module=HP11_headline_stack

[mraynrand]

Robison only got a fine for a kick in the shnuts. Suh didn't even draw any blood like Haynesworth. EDS had his helmet on when Suh repeatedly bashed it into the turf, so he was adequately protected. There's nothing much to see here. Suh should get a 30,000 fine and a 'good job' from the Shwartz. This is football, not patty-cake.

[MJZiggy]

Robison only got a fine for a kick in the shnuts. Suh didn't even draw any blood like Haynesworth. EDS had his helmet on when Suh repeatedly bashed it into the turf, so he was adequately protected. There's nothing much to see here. Suh should get a 30,000 fine and a 'good job' from the Shwartz. This is football, not patty-cake.

That might fly if he didn't have a history of trying to remove body parts from offensive players, to include $45K in fines and a meeting with the league commissioner to discuss his behavior.

[channtheman]

Robison only got a fine for a kick in the shnuts. Suh didn't even draw any blood like Haynesworth. EDS had his helmet on when Suh repeatedly bashed it into the turf, so he was adequately protected. There's nothing much to see here. Suh should get a 30,000 fine and a 'good job' from the Shwartz. This is football, not patty-cake.

I'm sorry (actually, not sorry :D) but that is just a horrible opinion that is completely wrong. This is a guy who has repeatedly done stuff like this with no regard for the rules. He hurts his own image, his team, and he looks like a shit stain on the NFL (something the commish won't like). I can easily see a 100k fine and 2-4 game suspension.

[mraynrand]

That might fly if he didn't have a history of trying to remove body parts from offensive players, to include $45K in fines and a meeting with the league commissioner to discuss his behavior.


I wasn't really all that serious. Just tossing in an alternative view to balance the thread.

http://www.crossfitmendota.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/10/see-saw-fat-guy.jpg

[channtheman]

I wasn't really all that serious. Just tossing in an alternative view to balance the thread.

http://www.crossfitmendota.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/10/see-saw-fat-guy.jpg

:lol: fucker

[Willard]

Albert's was a lot worse. 30 stitches to that lineman's melon. Judge Judy says 1 game for the stomp, and maybe 1 more because of your lame denial.

[Lurker64]

One thing to keep in mind, when Haynesworth was tagged for five games the commissioner was Tagliabue who is not half the disciplinarian that Goodell is. I wouldn't be surprised if the meeting Suh had with the commish earlier in the season actually makes things worse for the defensive tackle.

I could see Goodell just going with "five games is the precedent for a deliberate stomp on a prone player."

After all, if you think that's excessive... just don't stomp on people when they're down. There's absolutely no place for that in football.

[Smidgeon]

I think that it will be one game at most. I think it should be five. As to Ziggy's comment, the head attention wasn't being paid in Haynesworth's day, so I don't think that's a relevant point. But sadly I think he gets off light. Just like Roberson got off light two weeks ago.

[Jimx29]

Robison only got a fine for a kick in the shnuts. Suh didn't even draw any blood like Haynesworth. EDS had his helmet on when Suh repeatedly bashed it into the turf, so he was adequately protected. There's nothing much to see here. Suh should get a 30,000 fine and a 'good job' from the Shwartz. This is football, not patty-cake.
So are you saying that getting your bicep stomped on by a 300lb guy with cleats is part of the game and should be expected? Had this been a game on real grass, the metal cleats would of/could of done some serious damage

[King Friday]

I'm guessing he gets a one game suspension...although it is possible we could see more depending on exactly what the commish told Suh and Schwartz at their little meeting earlier in the year. This was dirty, but really didn't threaten injury. That kick wouldn't have hurt a grandma. The head pounding was more questionable than the kick IMO.

[smuggler]

One thing I haven't seen mentioned: This was a nationally televised game that was seen in millions upon millions of households. Suh has a responsibility to be a good sportsman, even if he feels like EDS is holding him. Personally, I don't think EDS was holding until after Suh body slammed him, but there aren't really any good angles to confirm or deny that.

The fact that he embarrassed the NFL is going to make his fine an suspension worse. I think what he did on the field is worth 1 game. That he is unrepentant and/or delusional about it merits another game to get the message across. And one more game for the fact that he did it in front of millions of kids.

Now if he takes a look at the film today and comes out and says he was wrong, and tells the country that he was wrong and people shouldn't follow his example, I am happy with 1 game for the act on the field. Remember, he already missed almost half a game because of it.

We'll see.

[Kiwon]

The headbanging is one thing, the stomp is another. That's where the controversy starts and he continued it with his lame fictional account of what happened.

Well, bless his 6-4, 300 pound heart. Those mean refs are picking on him again. Give me a break! I found a new way to spell "narcissist" - "S-U-H"

Suspend his rear end until he retracts his non-apology apology and joins the rest of us in the real world where actions have consequences. The league needs to humble this guy for his own good.

[Pugger]

One thing I haven't seen mentioned: This was a nationally televised game that was seen in millions upon millions of households. Suh has a responsibility to be a good sportsman, even if he feels like EDS is holding him. Personally, I don't think EDS was holding until after Suh body slammed him, but there aren't really any good angles to confirm or deny that.

The fact that he embarrassed the NFL is going to make his fine an suspension worse. I think what he did on the field is worth 1 game. That he is unrepentant and/or delusional about it merits another game to get the message across. And one more game for the fact that he did it in front of millions of kids.

Now if he takes a look at the film today and comes out and says he was wrong, and tells the country that he was wrong and people shouldn't follow his example, I am happy with 1 game for the act on the field. Remember, he already missed almost half a game because of it.

We'll see.

I'm not gonna hold my breath...

[Harlan Huckleby]

Robison only got a fine for a kick in the shnuts. Suh didn't even draw any blood like Haynesworth. EDS had his helmet on when Suh repeatedly bashed it into the turf, so he was adequately protected. There's nothing much to see here. Suh should get a 30,000 fine and a 'good job' from the Shwartz. This is football, not patty-cake.

Robison should have drawn a suspension, that was bizarre decision. Cleats are dangerous, stomping with cleats is outside the game. Suh should get longer suspension becuse of pattern of behaviour. Also, Robison is nice white man with lovely, flowing hair.

[Pugger]

Robson doesn't have the reputation Suh has. Plus he apologized and admitted he was an idiot. Suh's problem is he doesn't seem to understand that his behavior is unacceptible. Because of this I have a hard time believing he'll change his ways any time soon.

[wpony]

I was reading at another site and found out that Schwartz IS an enabler. People may not remember this, but he was the DC in Tennessee when Albert Haynesworth stomped on Andre Gurode's face it usually does start at the top.

[Scott Campbell]

What does suh get?

He gets to watch his team miss the playoffs!


There might be some truth to that. It's a shame really. Those Lions fans have been waiting forever.

[smuggler]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TbhZJKtDJNQ

[yooperfan]

I felt bad for my friend yesterday who is a life long Lion fan. He's been trying to defend his team
for the last couple weeks and sounded so defeated after the lose. Well........not that bad.

[sheepshead]

I was reading at another site and found out that Schwartz IS an enabler. People may not remember this, but he was the DC in Tennessee when Albert Haynesworth stomped on Andre Gurode's face it usually does start at the top.

I have been saying this for a while. Its a top down thing in Detroit I believe. The whole Harbaugh thing was because Schwartz was giving him crap sideline to sideline during the game. I think Jim Schwatz is a tool and we're not going to have to worry about the Lions as long as that guy is on the sidelines.

[George Cumby]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TbhZJKtDJNQ

I just can't find it in my heart to fault Lee for swinging on that one. The Kitty just about takes his head off just prior to the punch.

[mraynrand]

So are you saying that getting your bicep stomped on by a 300lb guy with cleats is part of the game and should be expected? Had this been a game on real grass, the metal cleats would of/could of done some serious damage


The "repeatedly bashing it into the turf" should have been a giveaway that I wasn't completely serious. But three excuses that Suh can use in his defense are 1) he was being driven into the turf by EDS and his actions were an immediate reaction to that 2) Robison kicked someone in the family jewels and didn't get suspended and 3) it wasn't a kick to an unprotected melon.

I think he'll probably get a game or two suspension, using these arguments to say it isn't as bad as Haynesworth. Plus Harlan is right - he'llget more games suspended than Robison because he has really big guns, is black and 'looks sinister.'

[mraynrand]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TbhZJKtDJNQ


I just can't find it in my heart to fault Lee for swinging on that one. The Kitty just about takes his head off just prior to the punch.

There's at least three holding and one illegal hands to the face penalties on Detroit in just that one sequence.

[ThunderDan]

There's at least three holding and one illegal hands to the face penalties on Detroit in just that one sequence.

Welcome to the life as a gunner in the NFL.

[mraynrand]

Welcome to the life as a gunner in the NFL.


:lol: tru dat

[GrnBay007]

:lol: tru dat

:) fo sho

[George Cumby]

I have been saying this for a while. Its a top down thing in Detroit I believe. The whole Harbaugh thing was because Schwartz was giving him crap sideline to sideline during the game. I think Jim Schwatz is a tool and we're not going to have to worry about the Lions as long as that guy is on the sidelines.

Yesterday was the first time I paid much attention to The Schwarts. What a spazzy clown. Totally outmatched by the culture of accountability and professionalism fostered by TT and McCarthy.

[Carolina_Packer]

He's in complete denial. He needs to be out for the rest of the season, W/O pay, minimum.....including any post season games if by some miracle they get that far. I personally see this thing gaining speed and it will put the lions season in complete turmoil (well, maybe that's wishful thinking)

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000d5d8246eec7/article/lions-dt-suh-says-thirdquarter-ejection-was-unwarranted?module=HP11_headline_stack

After watching the video link above and seeing Suh's reaction, I can't come away with any other feeling than he's trying to cover his tracks and does not see things for how they really are. The guy blocks him hard and they end up on the ground. Suh gets up and is on top of him pushing his head into the turf. He doesn't stop there. Once he stands up, he moves back towards EDS and stomps on his chest. Then he has the audacity to say he was just trying to get his balance. What? Stomping on someone's chest helps you regain your balance? He could have slipped and fallen down trying to do that instead of just walking away which he looked perfectly capable of doing once he stood up after being on top of EDS. He just doesn't get why his actions were so bush league. Perhaps the NFL will suspend him and show him the error of his ways.

[Guiness]

There's at least three holding and one illegal hands to the face penalties on Detroit in just that one sequence.

when I saw it live (the camera was on Lee for some reason, I think) I was waiting for the flag to come out against Detroit. Then Lee retaliated and I thought 'damn, they're going to be offsetting'. I was shocked when Lee got it, and the Lion players got nothing. Don't know what the refs were thinking there.

[Guiness]

Suspend his rear end until he retracts his non-apology apology and joins the rest of us in the real world where actions have consequences. The league needs to humble this guy for his own good.

There's an idea, kind of like the 'contempt of court' thing.

Suspend him until he elocutes his wrongdoings and apologizes. Every week, he talks to the commissioner. If he doesn't fess up, another week of suspension!

[smuggler]

Plus he got ejected. I watched it many times, he never used a closed fist. Since it was live play, it should have been a penalty, but not an ejection. Bad form by the zebras on that one.

[ThunderDan]

Plus he got ejected. I watched it many times, he never used a closed fist. Since it was live play, it should have been a penalty, but not an ejection. Bad form by the zebras on that one.

While I didn't like the ejection I understood why the refs did it. The refs at that point had seemed to have lost control of the game. By ejecting Lee they sent a message to the other players that the extra "play" after the whistle was no longer going to be tolerated. Of course Suh isn't able to figure that one out.

[Guiness]

The NFL has already announced that any reviews and disciplinary action will take place after all of the week-end's games have been reviewed...so Tuesday.

I wonder if Lee might be in line for a fine? I can't see it, but it would sure make the refs look bad if a player who got ejected didn't even deserve a fine.

[mmmdk]

The NFL has already announced that any reviews and disciplinary action will take place after all of the week-end's games have been reviewed...so Tuesday.

I wonder if Lee might be in line for a fine? I can't see it, but it would sure make the refs look bad if a player who got ejected didn't even deserve a fine.

I see a minor fine going to Lee and a heavy one to Suh added with games suspended. Anything from 2-5 games would fit the bill.

F@ck you Suh, you filthy player!

[gbgary]

one of goodell's deals is protecting the shield. image is very important. if this was suh's first offense i could see just one game but, with his history and having already been called in for a face-to-face with goodell just a couple of weeks ago, it should be five. he's got to learn a lesson and be made an example of.

[mmmdk]

one of goodell's deals is protecting the shield. image is very important. if this was suh's first offense i could see just one game but, with his history and having already been called in for a face-to-face with goodell just a couple of weeks ago, it should be five. he's got to learn a lesson and be made an example of.

I agree & I sure hope you're right.

[Deputy Nutz]

One game and 50,000 dollars. It was bad, but it was no where near Haynesworth stomping on a guys head with his helmet off.

[pbmax]

I felt bad for my friend yesterday who is a life long Lion fan. He's been trying to defend his team
for the last couple weeks and sounded so defeated after the lose. Well........not that bad.

The Lion fan I know has a new takeaway from the game;that Aaron Rodgers is now untouchable after the KVB roughing the passer.

[pbmax]

Another takeaway; the decision to keep EDS looks good compared to McDonald's preseason struggles.

[mraynrand]

The Lion fan I know has a new takeaway from the game;that Aaron Rodgers is now untouchable after the KVB roughing the passer.


He's achieved Bert Favra status

[MJZiggy]

The Lion fan I know has a new takeaway from the game;that Aaron Rodgers is now untouchable after the KVB roughing the passer.

It's about freaking time.

[gbgary]

One game and 50,000 dollars. It was bad, but it was no where near Haynesworth stomping on a guys head with his helmet off.

i agree...but you have to look at his whole body of work. he either doesn't get it or he doesn't care. either way he's got to be made to understand or care.

[channtheman]

There's at least three holding and one illegal hands to the face penalties on Detroit in just that one sequence.

Those refs were holy fucking shit bad. Pat Lee deserves a letter of apology from the NFL for that kind of bull shit. I'd like to hear the refs explanation for the ejection. I believe with every ejection they have to do some write up about why they felt it was necessary, etc.

[Gunakor]

one of goodell's deals is protecting the shield. image is very important. if this was suh's first offense i could see just one game but, with his history and having already been called in for a face-to-face with goodell just a couple of weeks ago, it should be five. he's got to learn a lesson and be made an example of.


He wasn't called in to meet with Goodell. Suh himself requested the meeting.

[MadScientist]

One think I don't want is for Suh to get a 4 game suspension, and come back for the final game against the Packers rested, pissed off and not giving a damn who he hurts because the Lions are out of the playoffs. Suspend him for 2-3 games, or 5. and give him a full battery of drug test to see if he has some sort of roid-rage going on.

[gbgary]

He wasn't called in to meet with Goodell. Suh himself requested the meeting.

heard that a few of hours ago. it was never put that way in anything i'd heard or read in the last few weeks.

[channtheman]

heard that a few of hours ago. it was never put that way in anything i'd heard or read in the last few weeks.

Suh requested the meeting. Regardless, I think having the meeting reflects extremely negatively on Suh. He just met with the commish and still comes and does this?

[gbgary]

Suh requested the meeting. Regardless, I think having the meeting reflects extremely negatively on Suh. He just met with the commish and still comes and does this?

exactly! he must have been pleading his case like he was yesterday to his coach. he can't spin his bullshit when the camera's got him cold. he's deluded or lying.

[channtheman]

Don't know if anyone else saw, but per ESPN bottom screen scroll, Suh apologized for his actions on facebook. I'll see if I can find some sort of link.

edit: found a link

http://www.facebook.com/suh90?sk=wall

Suh--

In the past few hours, I have had time to reflect on yesterday’s game and I want to sincerely apologize for letting my teammates down, the organization, and especially to my fans who look to me for positive inspiration.

Playing professional sports is not a game. It is a profession with great responsibility, and where performance on and off the field should never be compromised. It requires a calm and determined demeanor, which cannot be derailed by the game, referee calls, fans or other players.

I want to reiterate my commitment to working to become a better player, and professional—on and off the field. My reaction on Thursday was unacceptable. I made a mistake, and have learned from it. I hope to direct the focus back to the task at hand — by winning.

[King Friday]

Those refs were holy fucking shit bad. Pat Lee deserves a letter of apology from the NFL for that kind of bull shit.

Why? Lee threw a punch...and that is normally an automatic DQ just as much as stomping on a guy's arm. Yeah, the Lions are a bunch of dirty jackasses...just like their HC...and Lee was roughed up well beyond what should have been tolerated by the refs. It doesn't excuse a punch though. You have to be smarter than that.

[packrulz]

The Lions and Suh are backpedalling:
Lions say Suh “failed to meet the level of sportsmanship we expect”

Posted by Michael David Smith on November 25, 2011, 8:56 PM EST


A day after Ndamukong Suh was ejected from their annual Thanksgiving game, the Detroit Lions have released a statement condemning Suh for stomping on Green Bay’s Evan Dietrich-Smith.

“The on-field conduct exhibited by Ndamukong Suh that led to his ejection from yesterday’s game was unacceptable and failed to meet the level of sportsmanship we expect from our players,” the statement read. “Ndamukong has made many positive contributions to the Lions on and off the field. We expect his behavior going forward to consistently reflect that high standard of professionalism.”

There was no name attached to the statement, which makes it unclear who the statement comes from: Lions owner William Clay Ford? General Manager Martin Mayhew? Coach Jim Schwartz? There’s no word on who wrote the statement, or whose opinion was being expressed.

But someone in the Lions’ front office has been talking to NFL Commissioner Roger Goodell’s office, and the Lions know discipline is coming.

“We have been in contact with Commissioner Goodell’s office and were advised that, like any on-field matter, Thursday’s incident is subject to review by the league office and that subsequent discipline would be determined by the league office,” the statement read.

For his part, Suh has changed his tone from defiant to apologetic, writing on Facebook today that he’s sorry for what he did.

“In the past few hours, I have had time to reflect on yesterday’s game and I want to sincerely apologize for letting my teammates down, the organization, and especially to my fans who look to me for positive inspiration,” Suh wrote Friday evening. “My reaction on Thursday was unacceptable. I made a mistake, and have learned from it. I hope to direct the focus back to the task at hand — by winning.”

The NFL is expected to inform Suh of his discipline by Tuesday.


I think he'll be suspended for 3 games.

[Fritz]

I have a few thoughts on various posts here....

First, regarding Suh's "new and improved" Facebook apology: if you read it carefully, it's a cleaned-up statement of what he said after the game. Note that he says that "I want to sincerely apologize for letting my teammates down, the organization, and especially to my fans who look to me for positive inspiration.” He also says about professional sports that "It requires a calm and determined demeanor, which cannot be derailed by the game, referee calls, fans or other players."

This is similar to what he said after the game about apologizing only to his teammates and organization and fans for letting them down - he's not apologizing for having a dickhead moment; he's not apologizing to the world. He's apologizing that he let the bad ref calls and the other players' actions push him over the edge. I still don't really see him taking responsibility. To me, some pubic relations guy (yes, pubic) wrote this up for Suh, and Suh made sure that the parts about apologizing only to his team and "his" fans and that he was nudged into his actions remained implicit in whatever public apology (pubic apology?) he issued.

But I think he'll get a $50,000 fine and one game.

I also am glad that Schvantz is mis-handling this. Not to dust up old dirt, but I think TT cemented control of Green Bay's team when he held Favre accountable for his constant wishy-washy attitude about coming back. The easiest thing in the world woulda been for TT to allow Favre to remain retired until after mini-camps, then rejoice publicly when Favre returned for camp. But TT drew a line with the popular superstar, and in the end it was best for the team and for Thompson's ability to do his job. I think Schvantz, by letting the league handle it, is nurturing Suh's petulant defensiveness, and in doing so there's a chipping away of Schvantz's control of the team.

Marshall Faulk and a couple others have noted that Suh tends to lash out when teams are able to contain him. And does he get held and abused constantly? Sure. But what good defensive lineman doesn't? Is EDS noted for grabbing and holding? Sure, but so's Dominic Raiola of the Lions. I think Suh is very, very used to getting his way, and when he doesn't someone else has to pay.

Finally, please note PBMax's post about how the Leos fans are taking all this "dirty Lions" talk: many of them have decided that what all this means is that Aaron Rodgers gets preferential treatment now. I listen to the Detroit sports talk stuff, and many callers are arguing that Suh was being held and grabbed all day and what he did looks bad but is understandable, though he shouldn't have done it - because it hurt the team. It's weird here. The fans are simultaneously whining about the Lions unfairly having a bad reputation and being punished for it and crowing about their team's nastiness.

Do not feel sorry for Lions' fans. Sure, when the team is bad for so long you're tempted to feel badly for them, but the second they get a whiff of a winning team, they become unsufferable. They are now feeling put-upon by refs, the media, and the world.

[Fosco33]

Why don't we have a great Dlineman? Suh, Allen, Peppers... Mean, aggressive, talented and a little dirty. That's the definition of a dlineman.

50K - maybe 1 game because of history and sorry ass apology.

[Fritz]

"Mean, aggressive, talented and a little dirty."

I had a girlfriend like that last year. In the short term it was hot, hot, hot, but that act wore out quickly and she's way gone now, thank god.

I don't think it's that much different with a team and a defensive lineman like Suh. He's a great talent but will the Lions' enabling act cost them in the long run?

[MJZiggy]

I think it's telling that the people he DIDN'T apologize to were the league and EDS. I bump into someone at the mall and I apologize. He stomps on a guy's arm and that doesn't warrant even a mention to him?

Funny about the Leo fans thinking Rodgers gets preferential treatment when he wasn't involved in this.

[mraynrand]

"Mean, aggressive, talented and a little dirty."

I had a girlfriend like that last year. In the short term it was hot, hot, hot,

Can I have her number?

[Fritz]

I did not know you were the kind of guy who likes to be manipulated and used, mraynrand.

[mraynrand]

I did not know you were the kind of guy who likes to be manipulated and used, mraynrand.

Only for a few hours at a time.

[Fritz]

Well, if you have deep pockets and don't mind being treated badly, then you'll have a great time - for a while. And my lord, she was hot!

Back to the topic...the Lions' forum on Football's Future is interesting. A few intelligent posters, and a lot of excuse-making homers. A couple posters suggested, in all seriousness, that the refs "gave" the Packers the game, and the Lions were actually the better team.

[mraynrand]

Well, if you have deep pockets and don't mind being treated badly, then you'll have a great time - for a while. And my lord, she was hot!

Those quips were for entertainment purposes only.


Back to the topic...the Lions' forum on Football's Future is interesting. A few intelligent posters, and a lot of excuse-making homers. A couple posters suggested, in all seriousness, that the refs "gave" the Packers the game, and the Lions were actually the better team.

There was plenty of mugging by the Lions that wasn't called. I'm sure there was some good holding going on within the interior lines, but I think at some point the refs decided they couldn't call everything or the game would last four hours.

[Pugger]

Those quips were for entertainment purposes only.



There was plenty of mugging by the Lions that wasn't called. I'm sure there was some good holding going on within the interior lines, but I think at some point the refs decided they couldn't call everything or the game would last four hours.

If they called everything we'd still be playing...

[Guiness]

Don't know if anyone else saw, but per ESPN bottom screen scroll, Suh apologized for his actions on facebook. I'll see if I can find some sort of link.

[snip...]




Does anyone, for one second, believe he composed and wrote that?

Favre should've used a PR guy that good to issue a statement about how he felt about the Packer's winning the SB, instead of the 'should have done it sooner' shit he spouted.

[smuggler]

Why? Lee threw a punch...and that is normally an automatic DQ just as much as stomping on a guy's arm. Yeah, the Lions are a bunch of dirty jackasses...just like their HC...and Lee was roughed up well beyond what should have been tolerated by the refs. It doesn't excuse a punch though. You have to be smarter than that.

I'm not saying he shouldn't have been tossed, but he never used a closed fist. There are plenty of players week in and week out who do what he did and do not get ejected. He happened to do it right in front of the ref (who ignored all those penalties against him).

[Harlan Huckleby]

Lee got jobbed. The other boys were punching him first.

[Freak Out]

Suh gets 1 game and some cash.

[Harlan Huckleby]

and he loses millions in potential endorsement money

off the field, Suh is very intelligent, charming even. Its shocking. He should be one of the big faces in ads.

[Brandon494]

I'm thinking one maybe two games because of his reputation and some cash. Anything more than 2 is too much, yea he kicked the guy and it was a bitch move but there was no damage done. In the Haynesworth incident the guy he kicked without a helmet had to get 30 snitches, EDS didn't even need a band aid.

[wootah]

I'm thinking one maybe two games because of his reputation and some cash. Anything more than 2 is too much, yea he kicked the guy and it was a bitch move but there was no damage done. In the Haynesworth incident the guy he kicked without a helmet had to get 30 snitches, EDS didn't even need a band aid.

Snitches get stitches. I think it's not right to judge based on the result, instead of on the act itself.

[Brandon494]

Snitches get stitches. I think it's not right to judge based on the result, instead of on the act itself.

So you think he should get more than 2 games? haha and nice catch on the stitches typo

[wootah]

So you think he should get more than 2 games? haha and nice catch on the stitches typo

I haven't got a clue what a correct punishment should be; Goodell's rulings have been all over the place since he became comish, so it's difficult to predict what will happen. What I do know is that judging based on result is a dangerous way of working. Do you think he should be punished more severe if blood had flown?

[channtheman]

I haven't got a clue what a correct punishment should be; Goodell's rulings have been all over the place since he became comish, so it's difficult to predict what will happen. What I do know is that judging based on result is a dangerous way of working. Do you think he should be punished more severe if blood had flown?

I agree. Penalizing based on how badly someone is hurt is a bad way to go about things. I think since Haynseworth got 5 for his stomp, Suh should get that, especially since he met with Goodell and has a bad history of not learning. He needs something that will teach him. A big suspension might be just that.

[mission]

I'm with Brandon... Thinking 2 games and a big fine. Wouldn't be surprised with only 1 game since the Haynesworth situation is the only multi-game suspension handed out for on-field offense.

[Smidgeon]

Why? Lee threw a punch...and that is normally an automatic DQ just as much as stomping on a guy's arm. Yeah, the Lions are a bunch of dirty jackasses...just like their HC...and Lee was roughed up well beyond what should have been tolerated by the refs. It doesn't excuse a punch though. You have to be smarter than that.

A punch isn't automatic disqualification. It can be, but it's within the rules to allow a ref to keep the guy in.

[pbmax]

Goodell's rulings have been all over the place since he became comish, so it's difficult to predict what will happen.

Precisely. Its one, very legitimate reason he should not be his own appeals court for Personal Conduct. In the realm of on field rulings, they have been a mess as well.

Good ol' Rog flies too much by the seat of his pants.

[swede]

$75,000 and 3 games.

Suh has shown zero inclination to accept responsibility. Your average kindergartener displays more sophisticated moral reasoning than Suh has shown. He called for the meeting with Goodell, ostensibly, to help clarify the confusing expectations for play within the rules: he wasn't seeing the connection between ripping the helmets off of quarterbacks and yellow flags.

Since Suh has an astonishing inability to reference any point of view other than his own, the consequences need to escalate rapidly.

$75K and 3 games.

Suh has the body of a god, the mind of a man, and the moral reasoning of a child. Goodell has talked to this goon face to face and knows all too well what a tool the guy is. A shock collar, though possibly effective on an organism that operates at such a basic level of moral reasoning, would be out of the question for many good reasons. A three game suspension might get the attention of the coaches, although I doubt it will have much effect on the stompmeister.

$75,000 and 3 games.

[Bretsky]

IMO he'll get no more than two games
Probably a 75-100G fine
I would not be surprised at all if he gets 1 game....I'm about 50-50 as to whether it'll be one or two

[Jimx29]

One game and 50,000 dollars. It was bad, but it was no where near Haynesworth stomping on a guys head with his helmet off.

Thing is though, it's not meant to be a comparison dealio. His actions need to be addressed for what he did Thursday and nothing else


Don't know if anyone else saw, but per ESPN bottom screen scroll, Suh apologized for his actions on facebook. I'll see if I can find some sort of link.

edit: found a link

http://www.facebook.com/suh90?sk=wall

Suh--

In the past few hours, I have had time to reflect on yesterday’s game and I want to sincerely apologize for letting my teammates down, the organization, and especially to my fans who look to me for positive inspiration.

Playing professional sports is not a game. It is a profession with great responsibility, and where performance on and off the field should never be compromised. It requires a calm and determined demeanor, which cannot be derailed by the game, referee calls, fans or other players.

I want to reiterate my commitment to working to become a better player, and professional—on and off the field. My reaction on Thursday was unacceptable. I made a mistake, and have learned from it. I hope to direct the focus back to the task at hand — by winning."BUSTED" is all i read there. He knows he's screwed and gonna take a significant fine and/or suspension, and he's just trying to sound like he's not the bad guy.

[Fritz]

It's hard to say. If Goodell comes down in a way that's seen as too hard, then Suh becomes a sympathetic figure and that's not what the league wants since the guy has shown no remorse. Too soft and Suh will be back at it soon enough.

It would be highly interesting to see what The Schvantz would do if Suh is not suspended at all. He did, after all, bench his starting right tackle for a game - or at least a good part of it - for a dumb penalty at the end of the Leos' Tampa Bay game.

[Scott Campbell]

Obviously the meeting with Goodell worked. Ok, maybe it didn't.

Fines have failed. Meetings have failed. Time for a suspension.

[Joemailman]

Obviously the meeting with Goodell worked. Ok, maybe it didn't.

It was all just a big understanding. Goodell said, "You need to stop doing so much harm", but Suh thought he said "You need to stomp on somebody's arm".

[Harlan Huckleby]

I wonder what Goodell told Robison.

[Patler]

The league could look at this almost like two separate incidents. First, while both were on the ground, Suh slammed ED-S's head and helmet into the ground three times. Then, after getting up and with ED-S still on the ground, almost as an afterthought Suh turned back and stomped on ED-S's arm. It really was not one continuous act.

[Harlan Huckleby]

If there was a folding metal chair nearby, I have no doubt Suh would have smashed it over somebody's head.

Is there still professional wrestling, or has UFC squuzed it out?

[MJZiggy]

The league could look at this almost like two separate incidents. First, while both were on the ground, Suh slammed ED-S's head and helmet into the ground three times. Then, after getting up and with ED-S still on the ground, almost as an afterthought Suh turned back and stomped on ED-S's arm. It really was not one continuous act.
This.

[Brandon494]

Looks like it will be 2 games, sounds about right.

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/7286514/at-least-2-game-ban-likely-ndamukong-suh-detroit-lions-sources-say

[Cheesehead Craig]

Looks like it will be 2 games, sounds about right.

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/7286514/at-least-2-game-ban-likely-ndamukong-suh-detroit-lions-sources-say
The article said "at least 2". I still think he should get 4 but 3 will probably be the number.

[channtheman]

It was all just a big understanding. Goodell said, "You need to stop doing so much harm", but Suh thought he said "You need to stomp on somebody's arm".

Pure Gold :lol:

[mraynrand]

If there was a folding metal chair nearby, I have no doubt Suh would have smashed it over somebody's head.


:lol:

[Smidgeon]

The league could look at this almost like two separate incidents. First, while both were on the ground, Suh slammed ED-S's head and helmet into the ground three times. Then, after getting up and with ED-S still on the ground, almost as an afterthought Suh turned back and stomped on ED-S's arm. It really was not one continuous act.

I think they should view them as separate, but I think he'll get off light for what he deserves...

[mraynrand]

The league could look at this almost like two separate incidents. First, while both were on the ground, Suh slammed ED-S's head and helmet into the ground three times. Then, after getting up and with ED-S still on the ground, almost as an afterthought Suh turned back and stomped on ED-S's arm. It really was not one continuous act.


This is a good post. The discussion on the networks seems to be about the forearm stomp, but the head slams are ignored. Those were just as bad, in many ways because they were repeated. The league is going to see those - all of them - and not be able to ignore them. I don't think they will treat them as separate in any public/formal way (i.e. the NFL won't say "For two counts of unsportsman-like actions, Suh is suspended and fined ...."), but they will both contribute to the fine/suspension. That's why I would guess 2 games instead of 1.

[sharpe1027]

This is a good post. The discussion on the networks seems to be about the forearm stomp, but the head slams are ignored. Those were just as bad, in many ways because they were repeated. The league is going to see those - all of them - and not be able to ignore them. I don't think they will treat them as separate in any public/formal way (i.e. the NFL won't say "For two counts of unsportsman-like actions, Suh is suspended and fined ...."), but they will both contribute to the fine/suspension. That's why I would guess 2 games instead of 1.

Considering the emphasis on concussions and neck injuries, one would think that repeatedly slamming an opponent's head into the ground would be frowned upon.

[Fritz]

What about the incident earlier in the game in which Suh supposedly ripped Josh Sitton's helmet off but did not get called because VandenBoscch got a late hit or hands in the face penalty for what he did to Rodgers? Should this be part of the review?

[sharpe1027]

What about the incident earlier in the game in which Suh supposedly ripped Josh Sitton's helmet off but did not get called because VandenBoscch got a late hit or hands in the face penalty for what he did to Rodgers? Should this be part of the review?

Supposedly? He shoved Sitton's helmet off clear as day.

[mraynrand]

What about the incident earlier in the game in which Suh supposedly ripped Josh Sitton's helmet off but did not get called because VandenBoscch got a late hit or hands in the face penalty for what he did to Rodgers? Should this be part of the review?

I think they should review the entire game game film with the same attention to detail as the Zapruder home video.

[Freak Out]

That was a grassy knoll kind of game after all.

[Freak Out]

Goodell = Ruby? :)

[pbmax]

Goodell = Ruby? :)

That would make the Packers either the mob, pro-mob Cubans or the CIA. Because the Lions' fans and Packer doubters all think this is some kind of Goodell coverup to give Green Bay a Super Bowl win or at least cover for Woodson's punch earlier in the season. One poster at PFT said something along the lines of: "everyone knows the Packers are truly dirty team...."

[Pugger]

What about the incident earlier in the game in which Suh supposedly ripped Josh Sitton's helmet off but did not get called because VandenBoscch got a late hit or hands in the face penalty for what he did to Rodgers? Should this be part of the review?

Hmmm, this is an interesting question. Suh wasn't flagged - for some reason I can't fathom because his act was a lot more egregious than VandenBosch's - so I don't know if the league will address it or not.

[denverYooper]

Hmmm, this is an interesting question. Suh wasn't flagged - for some reason I can't fathom because his act was a lot more egregious than VandenBosch's - so I don't know if the league will address it or not.

Speaking of egregious, someone should tell KVB that colored contacts haven't been cool since the 90's.

[George Cumby]

Speaking of egregious, someone should tell KVB that colored contacts haven't been cool since the 90's.

Don't like the red eyes, eh?

Love your Avatar. I had that posted on my wall when I was an undergrad.

[George Cumby]

Per PFT:

"Adam Schefter of ESPN reports that Suh called NFL commissioner Roger Goodell on Sunday to apologize for his actions during the Thanksgiving game."

Ya think he might want to call EDS and apologize to him? Tweet him, fer chrissakes, anything.

What a fucking turd.

[Fritz]

There is, as Michael Irvin or Marhsall Faulk suggests, a weird disconnect with this guy. He's intelligent, for sure, and well-spoken. He appears self-aware and reasonable when you hear him speak - at least when he's not defending his actions on the field. Yet when he feels frustrated (I think when he's getting blocked well and probably held and all that) he changes. He seems to feel that it's not right that he's being stopped - whether legally or not. And he lashes out.

Looks like it'll be a two-gamer. Interesting to see how this does or does not define the Lions' season.

[MadtownPacker]

Fritz I now see why you get played by hoes.

Anyone believing that this sorry mfer is not some kinda scum is blind. He is a fraud and reminds me of prisoners. Fucking loony, in denial and swearing God is on his side. I believe he feels/believes his truth is real. I also believes he is a dangerous person.

[gbgary]

Per PFT:

"Adam Schefter of ESPN reports that Suh called NFL commissioner Roger Goodell on Sunday to apologize for his actions during the Thanksgiving game."

Ya think he might want to call EDS and apologize to him? Tweet him, fer chrissakes, anything.

What a fucking turd.

he's not going to apologize to eds because, in his mind, its eds' fault that he got mad in the first place. he's probably waiting for eds to apologize.

[GrnBay007]

The league could look at this almost like two separate incidents. First, while both were on the ground, Suh slammed ED-S's head and helmet into the ground three times. Then, after getting up and with ED-S still on the ground, almost as an afterthought Suh turned back and stomped on ED-S's arm. It really was not one continuous act.

Don't know anything about his background, and don't care enough to look it up. Is he reverting to past street behavior? Ever see a thug take care of matters on the street? Head to the ground, stomp on em and walk away.

[pbmax]

Don't know anything about his background, and don't care enough to look it up. Is he reverting to past street behavior? Ever see a thug take care of matters on the street? Head to the ground, stomp on em and walk away.

Have you seen this?

[MadtownPacker]

Have you seen this?

I'm gonna bet she has cuz I've seen fools do that and that is exactly what it reminds me of.

[Brandon494]

Fritz I now see why you get played by hoes.

Anyone believing that this sorry mfer is not some kinda scum is blind. He is a fraud and reminds me of prisoners. Fucking loony, in denial and swearing God is on his side. I believe he feels/believes his truth is real. I also believes he is a dangerous person.

Going a little far arent we? If he was playing 20+ years ago no one would even say anything. Mike Ditka even said he stomped and got stomped on while he was playing. Obviously he needs to control his emotions on the football field but comparing him to a prisoner? LMAO easy essay

[Freak Out]

He deserves the chair!

[pbmax]

Past street behavior and observed thug justice aside, Suh has had a poor reputation before his pro career. A teammate of his at Nebraska recently recalled several battles with Suh for after the whistle altercations (this was an account by the teammate who was named) and there was another, unnamed and unsubstantiated claim that Nebraska covered up several practice incidents while at Nebraska.

PFT had two rumors, one that people from across the league had chimed in and encouraged the league to step in and that Lions teammates actually thought it would be a good thing as well.

Suh's parents are both immigrants (mother from Jamaica and father from Cameroon). She is an elementary school teacher and he is an HVAC technician/installer. He has 3 sisters, the oldest of which played Division 1 soccer and now plays for the National Cameroon team. His parents divorced around the time he changed sports from soccer to football. I haven't seen an article that relays his circumstances growing up, but to judge from what is reported, it seems exceedingly working/middle class in the Portland, Oregon area. Though there is a tale that he once had four players "bounce off" him playing soccer while Suh attempted to score a goal. His family thought it was simply his natural gift of size; the opposing coach took his team off the field.

Perhaps more telling is that he struggled a bit at Nebraska until the Pellini brothers showed up. The Pellini brothers have what you might call some anger management issues, Bo Pellini's bother Carl got caught on tape knocking a few people around after a game a while back. The same Sporting News article mentions that Suh took advice from Jason Peter, a former Cornhusker and a man who struggled for years to beat drug addictions. Jason's brother, Christian, also a former Cornhusker, is famous for his eight convictions* in seven years that culminated in a release one week after being drafed in the fifth round by the Patriots (on talent alone he was expected to go higher, but word had leaked before the draft). The commonly held belief is that the Patriots were willing to take a risk on him in that round, but that Myra Kraft was not. While Christian did not suffer the same degradations his brother survived, the older brother was only signed by the Giants after agreeing to undergo counseling for alcohol abuse, attention deficit disorder and anger management.


The Pelini brothers weren't the only people Suh learned from. One of his mentors was and is a former Blackshirt named Jason Peter. Peter, who spent four years in the NFL, wanted Suh to play meaner. "We're talking about the Blackshirts. There's a swagger, and there's an attitude," Peter says. "After you get hold of the quarterback, you're whispering in his ear, 'The next time, you're not going to get up.' It's that change of mentality. That's what we saw him play like last year and this year."

Peter recounts a game from 2009 in which Suh sunk his meat hooks into Virginia Tech quarterback Tyrod Taylor. "The old Suh would have just made sure he was taken down. The new Suh took him and slammed him- I mean like on his head. Not that he was trying to hurt him, but he was making a point: Every time Iget ahold of you, this is what you 're going to have to deal with. It put a smile on my face."

Read more: http://periodicals.faqs.org/201003/1981685421.html#ixzz1f3hGF8An


* wikipedia has it as eight convictions, though I thought they some were merely arrests. I am close to positive the incident closest to the draft was a conviction.

[MadtownPacker]

Going a little far arent we? If he was playing 20+ years ago no one would even say anything. Mike Ditka even said he stomped and got stomped on while he was playing. Obviously he needs to control his emotions on the football field but comparing him to a prisoner? LMAO easy essay
Maybe you arent as street as you talk. You sure you aint the token brother?

The stomping isnt what bothers me at all actually. Anyone can lose their temper. Most show regret though. Listening to him talk after the fact tells me everything I need to know. You really can't see what I see in this fool?

[George Cumby]

Maybe you arent as street as you talk. You sure you aint the token brother?

The stomping isnt what bothers me at all actually. Anyone can lose their temper. Most show regret though. Listening to him talk after the fact tells me everything I need to know. You really can't see what I see in this fool?

The head bashing and stomp (why is it being called a "kick", that was no "kick") all bother me.

But I agree, had he just proffered an honest, sincere apology, like the dude from the Vikings a few weeks ago, much of this would not be happening.......

[MadtownPacker]

The head bashing and stomp (why is it being called a "kick", that was no "kick") all bother me.

But I agree, had he just proffered an honest, sincere apology, like the dude from the Vikings a few weeks ago, much of this would not be happening.......
He is use to missing the point after (the fact).


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ULW1AI_e2Sc

[Brandon494]

Maybe you arent as street as you talk. You sure you aint the token brother?

The stomping isnt what bothers me at all actually. Anyone can lose their temper. Most show regret though. Listening to him talk after the fact tells me everything I need to know. You really can't see what I see in this fool?

I guess I just don't care that much that, its football and violent shit is going to happen. Yea he lied but I'm not going to throw a hissy fit over it (not saying you are before you actually do throw a hissy fit). Fans get too emotional with this shit like it affects their life, give the guy a 2 game suspension and lets get back to football.

[GrnBay007]

Have you seen this?

Yeah and it made me feel sick. Something I didn't get out of my head for a long time.

[MadtownPacker]

I guess I just don't care that much that, its football and violent shit is going to happen. Yea he lied but I'm not going to throw a hissy fit over it (not saying you are before you actually do throw a hissy fit). Fans get too emotional with this shit like it affects their life, give the guy a 2 game suspension and lets get back to football.
There you go with that telling people what to talk about shit. Why you gotta let your White blood shine through? :lol:

This is a great subject and I enjoy talking about it. I guess that means we should all thank suh otherwise we would just have the Walden biz to talk about for 10 days.

[mraynrand]

Suh's parents are both immigrants (mother from Jamaica and father from Cameroon).

I am surely unpleased with the football antics of my son!

http://content7.flixster.com/question/56/92/96/5692961_std.jpg

[GrnBay007]

I guess I just don't care that much that, its football and violent shit is going to happen. Yea he lied but I'm not going to throw a hissy fit over it (not saying you are before you actually do throw a hissy fit). Fans get too emotional with this shit like it affects their life, give the guy a 2 game suspension and lets get back to football.

Yes, football is a violent SPORT. What he did was way out of the context of what should happen in this particular, or any SPORT! It's not about "hissy fits" or getting too emotional. It's about right and wrong and about your children watching (and learning) this type of behavior while they watch a sport they love. Professional athletes are being paid to perform and do their job in a certain manner. Would you get a suspension or fired if you behaved in a manner outside the context of your "job"?

And like others have said, at LEAST acknowledge that you LOST it momentarily, take your punishment and go on. In other words, be a MAN!

[channtheman]

As others have pointed out, Suh's lack of an apology to EDS is really bothersome. It boils down to Suh apologizing for getting caught, not for doing wrong. If he thought he was wrong, he would call up the guy who he stomped on and apologize to him.

[Harlan Huckleby]

I heard Ditka say today, "I've been stomped on before, and I stomped on a few." He didn't defend Suh, but football certainly has changed. I don't like dirty play.

[pbmax]

I am surely unpleased with the football antics of my son!

http://content7.flixster.com/question/56/92/96/5692961_std.jpg

Beef Jerky!?

[pbmax]

At this point an apology to EDS is meaningless. More interesting is why he thinks he is entitled to engage in this behavior. Even after the Goodell meeting (and all his comments after acts in which he was flagged or fined) he seemed to be saying either he did nothing wrong by the letter of the law or he was going to ignore it for the good of the team.

If the Nebraska theory up above holds any water, the team (the Lions, that is) is going to have to tell him that 15 yard penalties and ejections hurt worse than not having their best player being mean, tough or nasty.

[SkinBasket]

I thought I heard someone mention he comes from a good family. So if he's acting "street," then he's acting. He's just another oversized baby who's been told to act hard.

[Little Whiskey]

remember this gem?


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kw6vxVVXWUM&feature=player_embedded

[Pugger]

HOFer, was this Loin/bare game earlier this season?

[Little Whiskey]

HOFer, was this Loin/bare game earlier this season?

All-Pro, I think this was from the game last year.

[sheepshead]

2 games!

@JayGlazer Jay Glazer
Lions have been informed by league office that Ndamukong Suh has been suspended by Commissioner 2 games without pay.

[pbmax]

He has 3 days to decide appeal and then it can take 10 days to get a hearing. Glazer thinks the hearing will be expedited. But which would the Lions prefer he miss: @Saints and Vikes or Vikes and @Oak?

I would bet he files for an appeal on Friday to help ensure he plays versus the Saints.

And this assumes the penalty is not reduced. PFT notes that unlike the Personal Conduct Policy, the appeal is heard by reps hired and paid for by the players and the league. They have changed penalties before.

[mmmdk]

I think Suh has not and will not learn from this suspension; there will be a "next time" for Suh and the hammer will fall even harder. What a selfinflicted Lions mess...yet gets no sympathy from me.

[Harlan Huckleby]

2 games is light

[mmmdk]

2 games is light

Yeah but had it been a dame Suh stepped on it's a different story...and probably not during a football game. :?:

[sharpe1027]

Haynseworth was suspended 5 games for stomping on a player's unprotected face. I believe that was the longest suspension ever for an on-the-field act. IMO, two days for slamming a guy's head into the ground and stomping on his arm is in the ball park.

As a comparison to the Loins non-reaction, Fischer said from the beginning that the team would punish Haynseworth themselves if the NFL punishment was not enough.

[Brandon494]

2 games is not light, he doesn't get paid for those games. That's pretty much a million dollar fine for stomping on a player's arm, how the hell is that light? Any other player besides James Harrison it would have only been one game.

[pbmax]

If Haynesworth pulling off a helmet and stomping on a players face is worth a five game suspension, how much could this have been?

Goodell claims that he is defending the shield are mitigated by the fact that he has lackluster support from coaches so far in trying to re-engineer how defenses are hitting (and in other rules changes). He has far wider latitude for the off the field stuff. And as much as Suh's act was outside the bounds of football, its still an in game act.

Its readily apparent his message is being received only by a subset of players (like Danny Woodhead in the Pats-Eagles game) and some are actively resisting. Roger might have been better off conceding some ground on Personal Conduct appeals to get better buy-in and more leverage for the in game enforcement. As it stands now, he will simply need to move to more suspensions and entire game checks. And the suspensions hurt the on the field product. And the entire thing puts negative headlines on the internet.

[Zool]

2 games is not light, he doesn't get paid for those games. That's pretty much a million dollar fine for stomping on a player's arm, how the hell is that light? Any other player besides James Harrison it would have only been one game.

Suh does not make $8mil/season in salary.

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/7286514/at-least-2-game-ban-likely-ndamukong-suh-detroit-lions-sources-say

"Suh makes $82,000 per game. If he's suspended two games, he would lose $164,000 in salary."

[mraynrand]

If Haynesworth pulling off a helmet and stomping on a players face is worth a five game suspension, how much could this have been?

Goodell claims that he is defending the shield are mitigated by the fact that he has lackluster support from coaches so far in trying to re-engineer how defenses are hitting (and in other rules changes). He has far wider latitude for the off the field stuff. And as much as Suh's act was outside the bounds of football, its still an in game act.

Its readily apparent his message is being received only by a subset of players (like Danny Woodhead in the Pats-Eagles game) and some are actively resisting. Roger might have been better off conceding some ground on Personal Conduct appeals to get better buy-in and more leverage for the in game enforcement. As it stands now, he will simply need to move to more suspensions and entire game checks. And the suspensions hurt the on the field product. And the entire thing puts negative headlines on the internet.

So are you saying three/four head slams and an intentional stomp are not worth two games? What are they worth? A 50K fine? Just asking - put your number on it.

Refs are outlawing the hard hitting. That's just a fact. There was a perfectly legal shot taken on a receiver who just caught a pass last night, breaking up the completion; separating receiver from ball. because the receiver was 'defenseless' the defender can no longer hit this hard, without being penalized. That's just a fact. I don't understand how reducing the fine for things like what Suh did will help coaches stomach backing off on hard-hitting football. If they allow more stuff after the whistle, how can they have credibility for reducing hard hits before the whistle? As far as personal conduct stuff completely of the field, that seems to me to be even more separated, and I wouldn't trade more severe 'enforcement' there for reduced fines on the field.


edit: I should have written it used to be a perfectly legal hit

[Harlan Huckleby]

I think Suh should have gotten 3 games because of his pattern of ignorance, and the shitty way he and his coach responded. I can live with 2 games.

Robison should have sat for 1 game because of the potential for injury.

[Brandon494]

Suh does not make $8mil/season in salary.

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/7286514/at-least-2-game-ban-likely-ndamukong-suh-detroit-lions-sources-say

"Suh makes $82,000 per game. If he's suspended two games, he would lose $164,000 in salary."

I stand corrected, I thought top picks made more than that.

[mraynrand]

I stand corrected, I thought top picks made more than that.

That's just another reason why Suh is a very angry man. I bet his Dad never took him fishing either.

[Smidgeon]

I stand corrected, I thought top picks made more than that.

He bagged $40 million as a signing bonus. So he won't lose much from the games and is still making bank.

[Smidgeon]

2 games is light

I agree. I think I would have been happier with 3. And if they reduce the suspension on appeal, then I think the system is broken.

[pbmax]

So are you saying three/four head slams and an intentional stomp are not worth two games? What are they worth? A 50K fine? Just asking - put your number on it.

Refs are outlawing the hard hitting. That's just a fact. There was a perfectly legal shot taken on a receiver who just caught a pass last night, breaking up the completion; separating receiver from ball. because the receiver was 'defenseless' the defender can no longer hit this hard, without being penalized. That's just a fact. I don't understand how reducing the fine for things like what Suh did will help coaches stomach backing off on hard-hitting football. If they allow more stuff after the whistle, how can they have credibility for reducing hard hits before the whistle? As far as personal conduct stuff completely of the field, that seems to me to be even more separated, and I wouldn't trade more severe 'enforcement' there for reduced fines on the field.


edit: I should have written it used to be a perfectly legal hit

No, I agree with the 2 games. I am saying Goodell is boxed in by his previous action against Haynesworth and the current resistance to the other League Office dictates about illegal hits, etc. Haynesworth's action was vastly worse and by comparison, Goodell could not offer much more than a 3 game suspension and defend it. I thought he would get 1 game plus time served in the Packer game. The 2 game suspension is an improvement on that option.

I am not claiming that the refs won't call the points of emphasis, though like everything else that has recently gone through the committee, they are calling much of it inconsistently. At least last night's WR hit at least shows that the refs can get the helmet to helmet stuff on receivers correct. The QB hits are still a mess along with catch/not a catch.

I am claiming that a significant portion of the league is currently ignoring the points of emphasis on hitting. And fines and suspensions (though there have been precious few suspensions for hits) aren't winning the battle. Suh's action is outside the scope of the new emphasis, but it illustrates how Goodell has handicapped himself. He can do more to out of game offenders than he can to in game offenders. Its completely backward. The fear of suspending players in a 16 game season is tying his hands.

[pbmax]

He bagged $40 million as a signing bonus. So he won't lose much from the games and is still making bank.

Yes, that is the problem with going after game checks. Though with the new rookie slots, this will be less of an issue.

[mraynrand]

No, I agree with the 2 games. I am saying Goodell is boxed in by his previous action against Haynesworth and the current resistance to the other League Office dictates about illegal hits, etc. Haynesworth's action was vastly worse and by comparison, Goodell could not offer much more than a 3 game suspension and defend it. I thought he would get 1 game plus time served in the Packer game. The 2 game suspension is an improvement on that option.

I am not claiming that the refs won't call the points of emphasis, though like everything else that has recently gone through the committee, they are calling much of it inconsistently. At least last night's WR hit at least shows that the refs can get the helmet to helmet stuff on receivers correct. The QB hits are still a mess along with catch/not a catch.

I am claiming that a significant portion of the league is currently ignoring the points of emphasis on hitting. And fines and suspensions (though there have been precious few suspensions for hits) aren't winning the battle. Suh's action is outside the scope of the new emphasis, but it illustrates how Goodell has handicapped himself. He can do more to out of game offenders than he can to in game offenders. Its completely backward. The fear of suspending players in a 16 game season is tying his hands.


Good post. I see what you're saying. I think the key is that everyone wants to reduce injuries, but the league just can't bring itself to suspend guys for hard hits and/or hits specifically on vulnerable players - esp. QBs and receivers happening before the whistle. I do think that eventually, the 15 yard penalties, once consistently applied, will change how coaches teach tackling and hitting. But the operative words are 'consistently applied.' All that being said, you still can't prevent injuries like what happened to Collins and Polamalu.

[mraynrand]

Yes, that is the problem with going after game checks. Though with the new rookie slots, this will be less of an issue.

Just write it another way and it looks much more severe: Two game suspension and a $164,000 fine. I think the commish got it right.

[mraynrand]

An interesting idea (at least to me) might be for especially severe (flagrant) penalties to have the player sit out a series.

[pbmax]

Good post. I see what you're saying. I think the key is that everyone wants to reduce injuries, but the league just can't bring itself to suspend guys for hard hits and/or hits specifically on vulnerable players - esp. QBs and receivers happening before the whistle. I do think that eventually, the 15 yard penalties, once consistently applied, will change how coaches teach tackling and hitting. But the operative words are 'consistently applied.' All that being said, you still can't prevent injuries like what happened to Collins and Polamalu.

I meant to post about Polamalu. I can't believe that a player with a history of concussions and who has had two reported incidents of "concussion-like symptoms" will be playing this week. The Steelers alumni have been adversely affected by the brain trauma under discussion and I suppose its both surprising and consistent that they will allow Polamalu to play.

My question is this: since he was suspected of having a concussion (the team specifically said he would have returned if not for league rules) during the game, will he be required to pass the tests this week? Reports out of Pittsburgh already indicate the decision has been made, or at least, expected.

[sharpe1027]

Yes, that is the problem with going after game checks. Though with the new rookie slots, this will be less of an issue.

Maybe they should pro-rate the signing bonus into the suspension. It would be similar to what happened to Vick when the Falcons were going after his bonus.

[gbgary]

Suh does not make $8mil/season in salary.

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/7286514/at-least-2-game-ban-likely-ndamukong-suh-detroit-lions-sources-say

"Suh makes $82,000 per game. If he's suspended two games, he would lose $164,000 in salary."


plus $50k for being tossed. should have been 3 or more games considering his history and rep.

[mraynrand]

Maybe they should pro-rate the signing bonus into the suspension. It would be similar to what happened to Vick when the Falcons were going after his bonus.


If it were analogous to the Atlanta/Vick deal, it would be Detroit going after a prorated signing bonus, but that would just create animosity between Suh and the Lions. And the league doesn't need to go after this, since they are already essentially fining him $164,000 (am I correctly assuming the league takes his game checks?). That's an enormous fine.

[sharpe1027]

If it were analogous to the Atlanta/Vick deal, it would be Detroit going after a prorated signing bonus, but that would just create animosity between Suh and the Lions. And the league doesn't need to go after this, since they are already essentially fining him $164,000 (am I correctly assuming the league takes his game checks?). That's an enormous fine.

That's one way to look at it, but I'm not suggesting that the lions (vs. the NFL) go after it because it is not 100% analogous. Rather, I'm suggesting that a similar principle be applied. The Falcons went after the pro-rated portion of the signing bonus because it represented money paid for the games Vick was unable to play because he messed up. Arguably, a similar argument could be made for suspended players. They failed to meet their obligations and should not be paid for games they do not play.

You can look at it as fining him $164,000, or you look at it as just not paying for games he doesn't play because he F'ed up. The way I look at it, it is not so much an enormous fine but instead it is an enormous amount of money to pay a guy for doing nothing for two games (when he is doing nothing because he broke the rules).

[Guiness]

I stand corrected, I thought top picks made more than that.

they do, just not in a straight forward fashion.

5 years, $40 million guaranteed, $60 probable, so ya, avg $12mil/year. But like many big contracts, signing and roster bonus' make up a big %age of that.

The league has shot themselves in the foot a bit here with non-guaranteed contracts. They can cut a guy and get out from under the salary, but because of them, players want the money in some other form than game checks - so suspensions like this don't touch it.

edit: looking at the intervening posts...so he essentially gets fined just over $200K. Not sure why anyone thinks this is a big deal to a guy who, over that same stretch of games, will make about $1.5 million if you average out the value of his contract over those games. Shit, the fines are probably even tax deductible.

[hoosier]

Suh's suspension probably won't have any direct affect on the Lions post-season chances. They will lose at NO with or without him, and they probably beat Minnesota without him. At Oakland is the game where they really need him, so I cannot imagine he appeals it.

[RashanGary]

I'm a fan of a little "dirty" in football. Football is played with raw, back against the wall, emotion. Sometimes the guy with the most fear is the guy who plays with the biggest chip. There's nothing like being backed in a corner to bring out the fighter in a person.

I forgive him, but guys who do things like that. . . . . they tend to be a little unstable. Too much of that "back against the wall" edge makes a person over reactionary. We'll see how he pans out. He has a "self destruct" red flag IMO.

[jdrats]

I think Suh should have gotten 3 games because of his pattern of ignorance, and the shitty way he and his coach responded. I can live with 2 games.

Robison should have sat for 1 game because of the potential for injury.

Agree 100% with both points here. NFL made huge mistake not suspending Robison. I'll add that I was leaning towards 2 games until I read his supposed apology from Friday--he still was blaming others, and never really apologized at all.

[retailguy]

they do, just not in a straight forward fashion.

5 years, $40 million guaranteed, $60 probable, so ya, avg $12mil/year. But like many big contracts, signing and roster bonus' make up a big %age of that.

The league has shot themselves in the foot a bit here with non-guaranteed contracts. They can cut a guy and get out from under the salary, but because of them, players want the money in some other form than game checks - so suspensions like this don't touch it.

edit: looking at the intervening posts...so he essentially gets fined just over $200K. Not sure why anyone thinks this is a big deal to a guy who, over that same stretch of games, will make about $1.5 million if you average out the value of his contract over those games. Shit, the fines are probably even tax deductible.

fines and penalties are not tax deductible.

[sharpe1027]

I'm a fan of a little "dirty" in football. Football is played with raw, back against the wall, emotion. Sometimes the guy with the most fear is the guy who plays with the biggest chip. There's nothing like being backed in a corner to bring out the fighter in a person.

I forgive him, but guys who do things like that. . . . . they tend to be a little unstable. Too much of that "back against the wall" edge makes a person over reactionary. We'll see how he pans out. He has a "self destruct" red flag IMO.

This wasn't part of the football play. It was outside of the normal play. It has nothing to do with playing tough.

[mraynrand]

You can look at it as fining him $164,000, or you look at it as just not paying for games he doesn't play because he F'ed up. The way I look at it, it is not so much an enormous fine but instead it is an enormous amount of money to pay a guy for doing nothing for two games (when he is doing nothing because he broke the rules).

I'm not exactly getting you here. Suh is out 164K. OK, so he gets two games 'off' and still collects the prorated bonus, but he's still short 164K. Maybe it should be even more?

[sharpe1027]

I'm not exactly getting you here. Suh is out 164K. OK, so he gets two games 'off' and still collects the prorated bonus, but he's still short 164K. Maybe it should be even more?

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think you are saying that Suh is effectively "fined" 164K. I'm basically saying that I don't look at it as being a fine. He doesn't need need to pay the amount of lost salary. You can look at it as a "fine," but I simply look at it as if he was being paid to do a job that includes playing in 16 games. From the owner's perspective, that's a lot of money to pay a guy sitting on the bench because he broke the rules.

If you hired someone to paint four rooms in your house, would you pay them the full value if you had to kick them off the job for stealing something and they had not finished three of the rooms? If you paid them for most of the job up front, would you be justified in asking for at least part of that back? Think of the games as being painted rooms and the up front money as the singing bonus.

[mraynrand]

In your painting analogy, your painter not only would lose part, if not all the fee in a small claims court (probably not recoverable), but would also be jailed for theft. Suh is going to presumably be seeing some of these types of effects also. I would assume he has incentives in his contract for playing in games, for making the pro bowl, and even for making playoffs, etc. all of which are being put at risk or are lost due to his actions, just like the housepainter. He's not being paid for the games he missed, and that money is being sent (I assume) to the NFL as a fine. So it's paid as a fine. You're arguing he should be penalized even more, since he's getting those two games off. I'm arguing he is being penalized more in all those other things, but if you think he should be fined above and beyond his two-game check, you have a point there. But, perhaps that's excessive.

[sharpe1027]

Look at it from an owner's perspective. They effectively are paying him $X amount per game based upon the salary + pro-rated bonus. They still are going to be effectively paying him a lot of money to sit on his ass for two games. It's not about how much Suh is "out," it's about how much he is still getting paid.

[Smidgeon]

Per PFT:

"Schefter explains that Suh has been encouraged by the NFLPA to pursue the appeal, in order to ensure that players who engage in similar behavior won’t be suspended in the future."

So the NFLPA thinks that players shouldn't be suspended for kicking people while they're down? Pretty sure the NFLPA isn't actually paying attention to the players who have been saying he deserves suspension...

[mraynrand]

Look at it from an owner's perspective. They effectively are paying him $X amount per game based upon the salary + pro-rated bonus. They still are going to be effectively paying him a lot of money to sit on his ass for two games. It's not about how much Suh is "out," it's about how much he is still getting paid.

The team isn't recovering the fine money. The league is. So the team is out the money and out Suh's services. The team is getting hammered for the terrible actions of it's employee, but they still desperately need his services. From my perspective, both Suh and the Lions are being punished, but that makes sense. Both are responsible/accountable for Suh's actions. In that way it's not quite like your housepainter. The Lions aren't subcontracting Suh - he is an integral employee, who they can't easily fire.

The bottom line is how much exactly should Suh and the Lions be punished? It's pretty clear from what you write that you think it should be much more. How much?

[Smidgeon]

I'd also like to see the appeal process tell Goodell he went light and mete out an extra game of suspension. :D

[pbmax]

Per PFT:

"Schefter explains that Suh has been encouraged by the NFLPA to pursue the appeal, in order to ensure that players who engage in similar behavior won’t be suspended in the future."

So the NFLPA thinks that players shouldn't be suspended for kicking people while they're down? Pretty sure the NFLPA isn't actually paying attention to the players who have been saying he deserves suspension...

I just came back to comment on this. It almost makes no sense in any fashion except to argue it as precedent.

Suh is in trouble partly because he has been fined and flagged for unsportsmanlike behavior before. I would guess that the NFLPA wants to be clear the precedent is a pattern of penalties, fines and ejection. Not simply a single penalty and ejection, especially since the ejection carries its own fine if I remember correctly.

[sharpe1027]

The team isn't recovering the fine money. The league is. So the team is out the money and out Suh's services. The team is getting hammered for the terrible actions of it's employee, but they still desperately need his services. From my perspective, both Suh and the Lions are being punished, but that makes sense. Both are responsible/accountable for Suh's actions. In that way it's not quite like your housepainter. The Lions aren't subcontracting Suh - he is an integral employee, who they can't easily fire.

The bottom line is how much exactly should Suh and the Lions be punished? It's pretty clear from what you write that you think it should be much more. How much?

Is Suh's unpaid salary is sent to the NFL? I don't think so. I think that a suspended player should not be paid for the games they are suspended, and I think that their signing bonus could be reasonably included as part of this valuation. I'm not advocating anything else.

[pbmax]

Look at it from an owner's perspective. They effectively are paying him $X amount per game based upon the salary + pro-rated bonus. They still are going to be effectively paying him a lot of money to sit on his ass for two games. It's not about how much Suh is "out," it's about how much he is still getting paid.

The owner's gained additional means to recover bonus money after the last CBA compared to 2006. And their unavailability (whether retired, incarcerated, or suspended) might subject them to forfeitures. But the team wants Suh back and to play at 100% for them. Going after his signing bonus now would simply make a bad situation worse.

It wouldn't happen unless his behavior was so egregious that the team contemplates terminating his services.

[pbmax]

Is Suh's unpaid salary is sent to the NFL? I don't think so. I think that a suspended player should not be paid for the games they are suspended. I'm not advocating anything else.

Yes, it is. The NFL collects all the fines for the year and distributes it through NFL Charities to make videos of players dancing on School buses.

[sharpe1027]

Yes, it is. The NFL collects all the fines for the year and distributes it through NFL Charities to make videos of players dancing on School buses.

Is unpaid salary considered a fine?

[sharpe1027]

The owner's gained additional means to recover bonus money after the last CBA compared to 2006. And their unavailability (whether retired, incarcerated, or suspended) might subject them to forfeitures. But the team wants Suh back and to play at 100% for them. Going after his signing bonus now would simply make a bad situation worse.

It wouldn't happen unless his behavior was so egregious that the team contemplates terminating his services.

Under the current agreement, it would never happen. My point was that hypothetically, the suspension process might be more evenhanded if it included the bonuses. Should a player be "fined" more simply because they structured their contract differently and have higher game checks and a lower signing bonus?

[mraynrand]

Under the current agreement, it would never happen. My point was that hypothetically, the suspension process might be more evenhanded if it included the bonuses. Should a player be "fined" more simply because they structured their contract differently and have higher game checks and a lower signing bonus?

Life ain't fair, is it? I'm just guessing Suh knew this was going to happen, and structured his deal to reduce a potential fine to 164K with a couple extra bye weeks to boot. What a country!

[sharpe1027]

Life ain't fair, is it? I'm just guessing Suh knew this was going to happen, and structured his deal to reduce a potential fine to 164K with a couple extra bye weeks to boot. What a country!

Your right. Life is not fair. I guess we might forget about fixing any problems, life's not fair after all. ;)

Suh's a smart man if that's what he did since he'll likely have more problems in the future.

[mraynrand]

Your right. Life is not fair. I guess we might forget about fixing any problems, life's not fair after all. ;)

Suh's a smart man if that's what he did since he'll likely have more problems in the future.

I was just messing around.

Here's where I think we are: I think Suh got hit pretty hard - not just the 164K, but all the other stuff, plus I would bet at least some of his fellow players and the organization will be pissed at him more than they are at the league, and will seek to shut this crap down. You want him hit harder in the pocketbook. I don't really have a problem with that, but he got what he got. I doubt that the league will dip into fining based on a fractional signing bonus formula UNLESS guys try to structure their way out of this stuff, and I doubt that's ever realistically gonna happen.

[sharpe1027]

I was just messing around.

Here's where I think we are: I think Suh got hit pretty hard - not just the 164K, but all the other stuff, plus I would bet at least some of his fellow players and the organization will be pissed at him more than they are at the league, and will seek to shut this crap down. You want him hit harder in the pocketbook. I don't really have a problem with that, but he got what he got. I doubt that the league will dip into fining based on a fractional signing bonus formula UNLESS guys try to structure their way out of this stuff, and I doubt that's ever realistically gonna happen.

Pretty good summary. I don't really care if he gets hit harder, but it does seem unnecessarily arbitrary to have the biggest loss/penalty being tied to the game check. Especially when the game check is is only a portion of the real value of the contract.

[MadtownPacker]

So now the question is, does he take a cheap shot if the lions are out of the playoffs in week 17?

[Scott Campbell]

So now the question is, does he take a cheap shot if the lions are out of the playoffs in week 17?


No.

And anyway, a suspension would probably carry over into next year.

[MadtownPacker]

Next year??? Didnt he get two games? How long is the appeal?

[Scott Campbell]

Next year??? Didnt he get two games? How long is the appeal?


I meant that a cheap shot in week 17 would lead to a suspension in 2012. So no, I don't think he will. Unless he's really, really stupid.

[LP]

Just read on NFP that the Lions are being fined $50,000 for being over $100,000 in fines as a team. Nice to see they are being held at least a little bit accountable.

[MJZiggy]

I meant that a cheap shot in week 17 would lead to a suspension in 2012. So no, I don't think he will. Unless he's really, really stupid.

And it would be a long, long suspension.

[swede]

Just read on NFP that the Lions are being fined $50,000 for being over $100,000 in fines as a team. Nice to see they are being held at least a little bit accountable.

Ehh...they can make that up by firing three restroom attendants and looking for change in the luxury box couches.

[gbgary]

edit

[George Cumby]

I meant that a cheap shot in week 17 would lead to a suspension in 2012. So no, I don't think he will. Unless he's really, really stupid.

uuuuhhhhhhhh, based on what I've seen, I think he's really, really stupid.

[Pugger]

I stand corrected, I thought top picks made more than that.


He bagged $40 million as a signing bonus. So he won't lose much from the games and is still making bank.

I wonder how many of his endorsements will dry up from here on out?

[Zool]

I wonder how many of his endorsements will dry up from here on out?

"Subway, eat here or I'll stomp on you."

[MadtownPacker]

"Subway, eat here or I'll stomp on you."

Maybe the commercial can have him going into a McDonalds and slamming some customers head against the counter for not "eating fresh".

[mraynrand]

Suh on Broadway!

http://www.theculturemom.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/11/stomp.jpg

[Cheesehead Craig]

Smashburger? He could be in the kitchen just smashing the hell out of those things.

[mraynrand]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?NR=1&v=FKitvyywkG8

[MadtownPacker]

Looks like Suh hasnt learned his lesson.


http://packerrats.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=59

[gbgary]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G_OXHUtBJVo&feature=player_embedded

[mission]

that is hilarious gb!

[Guiness]

Nice animation!

Suh has filed his appeal, and it will be heard before this week-end's game.
http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/story/16296321/suh-appeal-hearing-to-be-held-thursday

Not sure what he could possibly base his appeal on! Wouldn't it be great if he got extra punishment tacked on because of the appeal? Kind of like losing a timeout for a lost challenge?

[Patler]

Nice animation!

Suh has filed his appeal, and it will be heard before this week-end's game.
http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/story/16296321/suh-appeal-hearing-to-be-held-thursday

Not sure what he could possibly base his appeal on! Wouldn't it be great if he got extra punishment tacked on because of the appeal? Kind of like losing a timeout for a lost challenge?

So his appeal is being heard by a former offensive lineman! Good thing it isn't being heard by Warren Sapp!

When the suspension was announced, I thought to myself that he could begin repairing his reputation a lttle by gracefully apologizing again while saying that he accepted the leagues ruling and would serve his suspension without appeal. It would have been a start anyway.

Instead, he remains defiant to the end.

[Guiness]

Good thing it isn't being heard by Warren Sapp!

obligatorySappQuote: His tweet to Ochocinco after Ochocinco tweeted he was hurt "How'd you get hurt on your year off?"
Don't much like the guy, but damn, that was funny.

[gbgary]

So his appeal is being heard by a former offensive lineman! Good thing it isn't being heard by Warren Sapp!



yeah...watched him in on inside the nfl...he's all over suh. funny to hear sapp condemning a cheap shot though.

can't believe kyle vanden bosch didn't get a fine for his helmet to helmet on rodgers. :/

[Cheesehead Craig]

So his appeal is being heard by a former offensive lineman! Good thing it isn't being heard by Warren Sapp!

When the suspension was announced, I thought to myself that he could begin repairing his reputation a lttle by gracefully apologizing again while saying that he accepted the leagues ruling and would serve his suspension without appeal. It would have been a start anyway.

Instead, he remains defiant to the end.

The NFLPA told him to appeal it. They tell every player that gets a suspension to appeal it. The punishment won't go up and can best case get reduced.

[Smidgeon]

Didn't PFT say something about Goodell encouraging Suh to appeal? Florio is guessing the suspension gets reduced to 1 game to prove "the appeal process works". Which I think is a load of hooey. If the suspension gets reduced, the appeal process is broken.

[Pugger]

If the suspension is reduced Suh, who still doesn't think he did anything wrong, will take that as a sign of weakness on the part of the league and his behavior will NOT be modified. Next time he won't miss and will stomp on something other than somebody's arm.

[Joemailman]

Didn't PFT say something about Goodell encouraging Suh to appeal? Florio is guessing the suspension gets reduced to 1 game to prove "the appeal process works". Which I think is a load of hooey. If the suspension gets reduced, the appeal process is broken.

It appears to be just speculation on PFT's part:

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/11/30/suh-appeal-hearing-coming-tomorrow/related/

As to Suh, it’s possible that the league would prefer to have the suspension reduced from two games to one, since that would demonstrate to the players, the media, and the fans that the appeal process is meaningful and independent.

[pbmax]

So his appeal is being heard by a former offensive lineman! Good thing it isn't being heard by Warren Sapp!

When the suspension was announced, I thought to myself that he could begin repairing his reputation a lttle by gracefully apologizing again while saying that he accepted the leagues ruling and would serve his suspension without appeal. It would have been a start anyway.

Instead, he remains defiant to the end.

Has he apologized? I don't think he has mentioned his target yet. His initial statement and the Facebook statement offer apologies to the team and fans for letting others influence his actions. Its an acknowledgement that something went wrong without remorse for the recipient.

He apparently told the Commissioner that he would serve the suspension without appeal, which seemed odd since that would have put him of the Saints game when he could have avoided a ruling long enough to play in the game. But the commish offered an expedited appeal and a resolution before Sunday. And apparently both the commish and the NFLPA wanted to have an appeal hearing.

One possible reason for the hearing (at least on the NFLPA's part) is to ensure Suh is being punished for an accumulation of violations and not simply the single act in the game. I imagine they want a clear demarcation that an ejection in a game does not immediately trigger a suspension. This ground probably has been covered before (Haynesworth and any other run of the mill :) ejection) but perhaps with a new CBA, there are new precedents to set.

The League would clearly like this dealt with completely inside of a week so it is no longer in the news cycle each day.

[gbgary]

It appears to be just speculation on PFT's part:

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/11/30/suh-appeal-hearing-coming-tomorrow/related/

As to Suh, it’s possible that the league would prefer to have the suspension reduced from two games to one, since that would demonstrate to the players, the media, and the fans that the appeal process is meaningful and independent.


then make it three games.

[pbmax]

It appears to be just speculation on PFT's part:

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/11/30/suh-appeal-hearing-coming-tomorrow/related/

As to Suh, it’s possible that the league would prefer to have the suspension reduced from two games to one, since that would demonstrate to the players, the media, and the fans that the appeal process is meaningful and independent.

Florio has been all over the board with this one and every time he posts one bit of news and then speculates, he hits another dead end.

The part about the Commish urging him to appeal (along with the NFLPA) and to do it quickly was from Adam Schefter, apparently. But in Florio's hands, it became just the NFLPA encourage him in order to be sure future players in the future do not receive any suspension for similar behavior.

His mention on the PA's motivation was speculation (he mentioned no rumor or source) and it was mainly a swipe at the bad PR the PA was taking over HGH testing.

He later amended the item to include the Commish's offer to expedite the hearing, but never gave any reasonable thought to why the NFLPA is interested.

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/11/29/suhs-willingness-to-sit-on-sunday-night-could-be-a-leverage-pla/

[LP]

I imagine they want a clear demarcation that an ejection in a game does not immediately trigger a suspension. This ground probably has been covered before (Haynesworth and any other run of the mill :) ejection) but perhaps with a new CBA, there are new precedents to set.



Pat Lee isn't being suspended, so that should be cleared up.

As far as his apologies, I still believe he doesn't think he did anything wrong. Everything has been straight from the PR dept with his name attached. The fact that they took so long says Detroit's front office still isn't quite there yet. Just like the product on the field.

[Smidgeon]

then make it three games.

+1 If the league (NFL & NFLPA) are intent on making sure the game is respected, then the appeal should have the possibility of saying the suspension was not enough. Instead, the NFLPA is protecting one of its star players instead of representing most of the players who have made their opinions known. Oh well. I guess it doesn't really matter in the scheme of things.

[pbmax]

Pat Lee isn't being suspended, so that should be cleared up.

As far as his apologies, I still believe he doesn't think he did anything wrong. Everything has been straight from the PR dept with his name attached. The fact that they took so long says Detroit's front office still isn't quite there yet. Just like the product on the field.

Quite right. but precedent is set in two ways. When you don't do something and then when you do something. And the NFLPA could be intererted in getting the "why" down on paper during the Suh appeal when they do it.

[Guiness]

Does anyone have video of the actual play before the event?

I saw some claims (from Lions fans, of course) that EDS swiped at his knees, tried to injure him, etc. Did anyone see anything that showed EDS doing anything untowards? Anything that might have made him lose his cool?

Not an excuse, and even if Smith did, Suh should apologize for going over the line, I'm just curious what set him off. If it was just getting beat, and some run of the mill holding, we're definitely going to see this out of him again.

[sharpe1027]

Does anyone have video of the actual play before the event?

I saw some claims (from Lions fans, of course) that EDS swiped at his knees, tried to injure him, etc. Did anyone see anything that showed EDS doing anything untowards? Anything that might have made him lose his cool?

Not an excuse, and even if Smith did, Suh should apologize for going over the line, I'm just curious what set him off. If it was just getting beat, and some run of the mill holding, we're definitely going to see this out of him again.

I don't know about the play before, but on the play it happened, Suh was the one that threw EDS to the ground. Look at the 49 sec mark:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZXDmCVSnn1U

[Fritz]

Don't forget too that by this point in the game Suh has already ripped Josh Sitton's helmet off him.

[gbgary]

Don't forget too that by this point in the game Suh has already ripped Josh Sitton's helmet off him.

he's a helmet grabbing muthafuk.

[Guiness]

I don't know about the play before, but on the play it happened, Suh was the one that threw EDS to the ground. Look at the 49 sec mark:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZXDmCVSnn1U

Not a lot to go on there with all the bodies in the way, but it does look like he took EDS to the ground. Smith may have had a hold of the back of his shoulderpads and dragged him down on top of him.

[pbmax]

I don't know about the play before, but on the play it happened, Suh was the one that threw EDS to the ground. Look at the 49 sec mark:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZXDmCVSnn1U

On that play, there is no shot at his knees that I saw but EDS did shove him ALL the way to the ground, bent a bit, when Suh first hit the ground.

That's just old fashioned finishing your block there boys. :lol: And I am pretty sure that is what Suh was objecting to.