And the PackerRat gameball goes to.......

[PA Pack Fan]

Jordy Nelson. Three incredible clutch catches, and no dropsies (like some of the other recievers). We dont win without him today. Did JJ even play?

On the flip side, the Farvey choke award goes to the entire secondary.

What do you think?

[gbgary]

cool. Packerat gameball...great idea. it's your baby so keep up with it.

jordy? arod? dd? got to go with AR.

three stars would a lot easier. :D

[yooperfan]

I agree with the radio post game guys......

Tim Masthay has become a weapon.

[Joemailman]

Game ball to Nelson. Unbelievable catches in the clutch.

Choke award to Peprah. He's the best we got, and that's a problem

[Brandon494]

Gameball goes to Aaron Rodgers just like every other game

[Brando19]

Gameball goes to Clay Matthews. He had an INT return for a TD and a forced fumble. Can't forget about him today.

Choke award goes to the secondary. Horrible...just like every other game.

[channtheman]

Jordy has turned himself into an unbelievable receiver. Gotta go to him.

It's getting annoying watching Finley drop a ton of passes every week (which just leads to everyone else on the team not name Jordy Nelson to drop passes). Finley should get the "Stop doing YOTTO until you catch passes that hit your hands" award.

[gbgary]

Gameball goes to Clay Matthews. He had an INT return for a TD and a forced fumble. Can't forget about him today.

Choke award goes to the secondary. Horrible...just like every other game.

clay did have a great game. many did. AR touches the ball every play though and was the best player out there.

[Upnorth]

Great idea, hope to see this become a regular feature. My vote is jordy, arod did great, but with all the drops jordy stands out. Also some of the misses are arods fault as well, he was behind a few times. Is it just me or did the ref's really let them play this time? No ticky tacky calls this week.

[PA Pack Fan]

clay did have a great game. many did. AR touches the ball every play though and was the best player out there.

AR did play great as usual, but I'm seeing a disturbing trend in the number of ludeballs per game. And the fact that he has 11 gameballs already, he's ineligible.

[pbmax]

Driver

[MJZiggy]

Great idea, hope to see this become a regular feature. My vote is jordy, arod did great, but with all the drops jordy stands out. Also some of the misses are arods fault as well, he was behind a few times. Is it just me or did the ref's really let them play this time? No ticky tacky calls this week.

Mini gameball goes to upnorth for not spiking the baby when they blew the two point stop.

Otherwise gameball to Donald for those toes...

[mmmdk]

Hard to give just 1 game ball.

AR being clutch, especially those runs for 1st down were paramount.

DD with 2 zen TDs.

Nelson catching the most dire passes from AR.

Clay scoring, forcing turnovers & sack!

[Upnorth]

Mini gameball goes to upnorth for not spiking the baby when they blew the two point stop.

Otherwise gameball to Donald for those toes...

She was safely being fed by mom at that point, I was free to act like a retard on my own.

If we are giving more than one game ball, it should be one on O and one on D ( and one on special teams when they fire slocum). My choices would be Nelson and Clay.

[Lurker64]

I think Nelson deserves a game ball just for this catch: http://www.packers.com/media-center/videos/Nelsons-sideline-catch/a7ead971-e328-4e8d-a35b-b9980030f14c

[smuggler]

On the TD pass to Nicks (the last NYG score) Matthews beat his man and hit Manning in under 2 seconds. Too bad it was a quick throw. =(

[Harlan Huckleby]

The Favrey choke award goes to Newhouse, who lost all composure and nearly sent AR to hospital throughout the game. Really, that was a total meltdown like we occassionally saw in HumperDome back in John Randle era. AR's improvising kept debacle from being quite so obvious..

I would award the gameball to Newhouse, because he is all we got and we have to keep his confidence up.

[smuggler]

He's a 2nd year 5th or 6th round LT. He's been okay for us, so we can let one bad game slide.

[Deputy Nutz]

He is pretty bad. Sure he doesn't get beat on every pass play, but he give up way to many pressures and doesn't know how to set his feet and stop backpedaling. I am sure he will get better but he is a professional and he ain't real good. Sherrod must be shit.

[pbmax]

He is pretty bad. Sure he doesn't get beat on every pass play, but he give up way to many pressures and doesn't know how to set his feet and stop backpedaling. I am sure he will get better but he is a professional and he ain't real good. Sherrod must be shit.

Newhouse was the midseason leader for the Bruce Wilkerson Thanks For Saving Our Ass Award, but he is stepping backward. EDS and Saine are gaining on him, though EDS did not do much run blocking yesterday. I counted three times someone (he or Wells) let the DT through the line and block someone else.

Darkhorse candidate is Sherrod, who I think is on the bench because of habit. He looked FAR better in pass pro after a slow couple of snaps in his stint when Clifton went out.

[George Cumby]

Jordy has turned himself into an unbelievable receiver. Gotta go to him.

It's getting annoying watching Finley drop a ton of passes every week (which just leads to everyone else on the team not name Jordy Nelson to drop passes). Finley should get the "Stop doing YOTTO until you catch passes that hit your hands" award.

I was thinking the exact same thing.

Between ARod, DD and Jordy it's so hard to choose. What an embarassment of riches for Aaron, "hmmmmn, which clutch receiver do I go to on THIS play?"

I say give it to the Old Pro.

[mraynrand]

Newhouse was the midseason leader for the Bruce Wilkerson Thanks For Saving Our Ass Award, but he is stepping backward. EDS and Saine are gaining on him, though EDS did not do much run blocking yesterday. I counted three times someone (he or Wells) let the DT through the line and block someone else.

Newhouse got a lot of blocking right. Some of the problems with the interior protection were from assignment mistakes, not being physically beaten. Newhouse's game is to mostly direct the outside pass rush up the field and past Rodgers. He struggled on pass rushes to his interior shoulder. If Rodgers couldn't step up, it was a disaster.

[KYPack]

I was thinking the exact same thing.

Between ARod, DD and Jordy it's so hard to choose. What an embarassment of riches for Aaron, "hmmmmn, which clutch receiver do I go to on THIS play?"

I say give it to the Old Pro.

DD was a clinic out there. He leads that personnel group and is real cool about passing the torch to Greg as "group leader". One of my favorite moments in the SB was DD staying involved in the game after his injury. In the 2nd half, Nelson made a big catch when we needed it. DD was on the sidelines hollering "way to go Jordy"! It was real, not some rah rah bullshit. those guys work and play as a group, helping each other and pulling for one another.

Hey, what did happen to Jones? Is he dinged or what? 0 targets 0 catches.

Where are the participation logs? Did he even hit the field?

[Harlan Huckleby]

Newhouse got a lot of blocking right. Some of the problems with the interior protection were from assignment mistakes, not being physically beaten. Newhouse's game is to mostly direct the outside pass rush up the field and past Rodgers. He struggled on pass rushes to his interior shoulder. If Rodgers couldn't step up, it was a disaster.

Newhouse did fine on about half the plays, but you need the LT to bat about .950

Ya, he did get confused/beat on inside move a lot, but plenty of times they ran around his outside shoulder too.

What we saw is the Giants have a great defensive line.

[mraynrand]

Newhouse did fine on about half the plays, but you need the LT to bat about .950.

I only watched him for the first half. He blew three protections. I'll watch the second half another time.

[HarveyWallbangers]

I'm not sure what game I was watching, but I didn't think the pass blocking was quite as bad as it has been made out to be. We had 48 dropbacks, 2 sacks allowed. You're going to allow some pressure with that many passes--especially with a lot 3-4 WR sets. The pass blocking wasn't great, but it wasn't that bad. I've seen some bad pass blocking games (see the games in Minnesota the first couple of years ARod was starting for examples), and I don't think this was it. Especially considering we have probably our two best pass blocking OL injured. I think other teams might be in a lot worse shape, if you take away their two best pass blockers.

[Guiness]

I think Nelson deserves a game ball just for this catch: http://www.packers.com/media-center/videos/Nelsons-sideline-catch/a7ead971-e328-4e8d-a35b-b9980030f14c

great vid. Look at him though...did you know he's white??? I never would've guessed:taunt:

[Harlan Huckleby]

I think other teams might be in a lot worse shape, if you take away their two best pass blockers.
AR is very cagey, he moves in correct direction almost every play, he has quick release to unload ball, often completing pass even though it is out quickly. the sacks stat doesn't tell story.

I thought the line problems were mostly Newhouse. Half the time, I would say he did inadequate job.

[Zool]

I'm not sure what game I was watching, but I didn't think the pass blocking was quite as bad as it has been made out to be. We had 48 dropbacks, 2 sacks allowed. You're going to allow some pressure with that many passes--especially with a lot 3-4 WR sets. The pass blocking wasn't great, but it wasn't that bad. I've seen some bad pass blocking games (see the games in Minnesota the first couple of years ARod was starting for examples), and I don't think this was it. Especially considering we have probably our two best pass blocking OL injured. I think other teams might be in a lot worse shape, if you take away their two best pass blockers.

First half was worse than the second. The infographic at one point had 27 drop backs, a couple sacks, a couple knockdowns and 13 hits. Probably had better pad level in the second half.

[MadtownPacker]

Youre fucking hating if you dont give this to DD. When all the "weapons" like Finley where dropping shit left and right Driver was just being OG about it and catching his passes. It was his day IMO.

[George Cumby]

DD was a clinic out there. He leads that personnel group and is real cool about passing the torch to Greg as "group leader". One of my favorite moments in the SB was DD staying involved in the game after his injury. In the 2nd half, Nelson made a big catch when we needed it. DD was on the sidelines hollering "way to go Jordy"! It was real, not some rah rah bullshit. those guys work and play as a group, helping each other and pulling for one another.



The overall success of that group I attribute, in part, to Drivers' leadership. The standard of professionalism the man has set has got to rub off on his understudies. And what a great compliment to him for them to surpass him. And what a testament to DD that he has so gracefully accepted his role. As MTP says, OG.

I digress, but what if He-who-shall-not-be-named had taken the high road as DD has? He might still be on the roster, still be idolized and respected not just for his playing record but for grooming and passing the torch to the nascent Rodgers. Woulda', coulda', shoulda'. I digress

[pbmax]

Newhouse got a lot of blocking right. Some of the problems with the interior protection were from assignment mistakes, not being physically beaten. Newhouse's game is to mostly direct the outside pass rush up the field and past Rodgers. He struggled on pass rushes to his interior shoulder. If Rodgers couldn't step up, it was a disaster.

Rodgers was also bailing early to his right because he was sensing pressure that sometimes wasn't there.

[pbmax]

Some of the improvement in the second half came from 3 man pressure that Fewell was using much to his eventual chagrin.

[PA Pack Fan]

Youre fucking hating if you dont give this to DD. When all the "weapons" like Finley where dropping shit left and right Driver was just being OG about it and catching his passes. It was his day IMO.
A good day yes, but 4 for 34 gets the gameball??

[George Cumby]

Rodgers was also bailing early to his right because he was sensing pressure that sometimes wasn't there.

I was slightly distracted during the game but got the impression that Aaron was kind of nervous back there. Is that accurate?

[Smidgeon]

Hey, what did happen to Jones? Is he dinged or what? 0 targets 0 catches.

Where are the participation logs? Did he even hit the field?

Jones was on the field for a couple plays, but I'm guessing that he either isn't that good against a zone or Rodgers had other better options on the plays Jones was in on.

[Smidgeon]

First half was worse than the second. The infographic at one point had 27 drop backs, a couple sacks, a couple knockdowns and 13 hits. Probably had better pad level in the second half.

I read afterwards that Rodgers only had about 8 hits all game. The infographic I saw had Eli with 12 hits by the third quarter (or thereabouts--maybe it was the fourth). I remember looking at that in shock because I was surprised he had been hit that much.

[pbmax]

I was slightly distracted during the game but got the impression that Aaron was kind of nervous back there. Is that accurate?

Yes, it was purposeful, as he moved to clear areas while keeping his eyes downfield and he had a few step ups. But he was moving more and more quickly than previous weeks. Newhouse seemed to have trouble trouble both inside as someone mentioned AND he lost Tollefson to an outside move I think. So he was unpredictable as well.

[mraynrand]

Yes, it was purposeful, as he moved to clear areas while keeping his eyes downfield and he had a few step ups. But he was moving more and more quickly than previous weeks. Newhouse seemed to have trouble trouble both inside as someone mentioned AND he lost Tollefson to an outside move I think. So he was unpredictable as well.

Yeah, Newhouse looked shocked that Pierre-Paul would actually come straight at his inside shoulder - and so quickly. I think that probably threw him off-balance - more mentally than physically. I think the prospect of the quick inside move had him a bit freaked out.

But you have to hand it to Pierre-Paul. That guy got chipped hard on one rush, and still managed to pursue and almost catch Rodgers running to the left side of the packers offense. P-P is sudden, fast, and strong. Wish the Packers had him.

[George Cumby]

Yeah, Newhouse looked shocked that Pierre-Paul would actually come straight at his inside shoulder - and so quickly. I think that probably threw him off-balance - more mentally than physically. I think the prospect of the quick inside move had him a bit freaked out.

But you have to hand it to Pierre-Paul. That guy got chipped hard on one rush, and still managed to pursue and almost catch Rodgers running to the left side of the packers offense. P-P is sudden, fast, and strong. Wish the Packers had him.

Yeah, I have to give Marshall a pass on this game. PP ain't no slouch.

[LEWCWA]

I'm not sure what game I was watching, but I didn't think the pass blocking was quite as bad as it has been made out to be. We had 48 dropbacks, 2 sacks allowed. You're going to allow some pressure with that many passes--especially with a lot 3-4 WR sets. The pass blocking wasn't great, but it wasn't that bad. I've seen some bad pass blocking games (see the games in Minnesota the first couple of years ARod was starting for examples), and I don't think this was it. Especially considering we have probably our two best pass blocking OL injured. I think other teams might be in a lot worse shape, if you take away their two best pass blockers.

I thought Rodgers was pretty antsy the whole game. He just didn't trust his blocking and it showed with his passes not being on the money. Yeah I know, tough problem to have when your QB's off game is for 370 and 4 td's....

[LEWCWA]

Oh sorry my vote goes to Jordy for sure. The guy is turning into a nightmare for other teams....

[Upnorth]

I'm with Harv and George on this, Newhouse was not as bad as many are saying. He got beat a few times, but firmed up in the second half. The line could be better as a whole but our tackles played well.
I still can't get over the series of drops in the third (I think third). Arod had four bad throws I saw (and one into turf he tried to pull down) but five drops on the wr/tes is not good.

[mraynrand]

I have Newhouse for 6 bad plays in the second half. 2 didn't affect the plays (Jennings TD and Rodgers first down scramble), two were pressures, and two were sacks, but one sack was inside and probably was 1/2 Newhouse's fault. So not the 90% perfect some want from a LT, but probably 80% effective; certainly not 50%.

[pbmax]

I have Newhouse for 6 bad plays in the second half. 2 didn't affect the plays (Jennings TD and Rodgers first down scramble), two were pressures, and two were sacks, but one sack was inside and probably was 1/2 Newhouse's fault. So not the 90% perfect some want from a LT, but probably 80% effective; certainly not 50%.

Fire Campen!

[Cheesehead Craig]

The Giants front four give even good OL fits. It may be a bit harsh to judge Newhouse so poorly. He needed help more often.

[Harlan Huckleby]

I have Newhouse for 6 bad plays in the second half. 2 didn't affect the plays (Jennings TD and Rodgers first down scramble), two were pressures, and two were sacks, but one sack was inside and probably was 1/2 Newhouse's fault. So not the 90% perfect some want from a LT, but probably 80% effective; certainly not 50%.

A bad play is when the defensive opponent has Newhouse off-balance, or is not being slowed down sufficiently. That was happenning most plays in first half, regularly in 2nd half.

[pbmax]

I may be off my rocker, but several times I have thought that Newhouse has struggled because of stature and size. Literally not being able to reach far enough, push further, punch or swallow a rush.

It could be wishful thinking but Sherrod looks like a Clifton clone from a size perspective. I don't think you are getting around Derek without him getting a mitt on you. And that mitt will feel like a ton of bricks.

[Tarlam!]

My gameball goes to Clay Mathews. Without his effort, there is no win. All due repect to putting 4 TDs and over 300 yards on the Giants. All due respect to Jordy Nelson's catches, which were workks of art at times. But if the Claymaker isn't in Eli's face all night, there is no win.

[Smeefers]

Game ball to Nelson. Unbelievable catches in the clutch.

Choke award to Peprah. He's the best we got, and that's a problem

Peprah's actually having a pretty fair season if you look at his stat line. A helluva lot better than a lot of other back up safeties there in the NFL.

[Joemailman]

Peprah's actually having a pretty fair season if you look at his stat line. A helluva lot better than a lot of other back up safeties there in the NFL.


When he gets beat deep for a TD, there is no stat.

[Smeefers]

When he gets beat deep for a TD, there is no stat.

I understand, but I have a hard time saying a guy sucks because he gives up one play. Tramon Gave up a couple deep balls and we're not calling for a replacement on that guy.

Oh, and I'd give the game ball to Crosby. His second game winner. His first game winner was the first game he ever played in. I actually remember saying "well, I guess we don't have to worry about this guy being clutch." Then he never had to be clutch again until yesterday.

The choke award goes to Finley. Sorry, 4 drops equals choke in my book, even if he did have one clutch reception.

[mraynrand]

A bad play is when the defensive opponent has Newhouse off-balance, or is not being slowed down sufficiently. That was happenning most plays in first half, regularly in 2nd half.

In my view a bad play is one that disrupts the play.

That's not what I saw. He was effective on the majority of plays. He was responsible for about 3-4 pressures, a sack or two, and one or two bad runs. Not a good day, but it wasn't a disaster.

I'll be interested to see McGinn's evaluation. He may agree with you.

[RashanGary]

Yeah Smeefers, Finley seems to be dropping them more and more this year. This is his 2nd or 3rd really bad game in 12 games where he just flat out dropped multiple catches he should have made.

When AR was forcing the ball to Finley, sure, he was making great catches while AR was racking up INT's. But AR is an elite QB. He doesn't have throw up jump balls. He's aware enough to throw guys open, to throw away from leverage. Guys like Nelson, Jennings, Welker, Gronkowski. . . . they get it. They're on the same page. They're ready for the ball to be thrown away from the leverage and they adjust accordingly.

I don't remember who AR was throwing to when he threw that pick, but my bet is Jermichael Finley. Honestly, I know the rest of the league loves him. I know he's a Packer fan favorite for his physical prowess and circus catches. . . . We were as good down the stretch last year without him as we are this year with him. He's not an elite player though. He's an elite talent who hurts you a lot with his route running mistakes. I'd compare him to old #4. Not even as talented, but he's a guy who does great things, and then fucks up 1 or 2 times every game in a way that costs you. 4 was a QB. 88 is a TE. The impact is far less, but the more you want to get Finley involved, the more you have to rely on him adjusting and the worse it gets. The guy is a million dollar talent with a ten cent head.

[mission]

We're undefeated-- Finley hasn't cost us much JH.

[Harlan Huckleby]

In my view a bad play is one that disrupts the play.

That's not what I saw. He was effective on the majority of plays. He was responsible for about 3-4 pressures, a sack or two, and one or two bad runs. Not a good day, but it wasn't a disaster.

I'll be interested to see McGinn's evaluation. He may agree with you.

McGinn uses the term "bad play" the same way you are. If McGinn disagrees with me, I will not post his grades this week.

A player ought to have less than 3 such flubs per game to stay out of my crosshairs.

Newhouse was overmatched against Pierre-Paul, its not so remarkable that Newhouse would struggle on half the plays.

[mraynrand]

McGinn uses the term "bad play" the same way you are. If McGinn disagrees with me, I will not post his grades this week.

A player ought to have less than 3 such flubs per game to stay out of my crosshairs.

Newhouse was overmatched against Pierre-Paul, its not so remarkable that Newhouse would struggle on half the plays.

McGinn:

DE Jason Pierre-Paul, the Giants' best defensive player, was way too quick for Marshall Newhouse, beating him repeatedly both outside and inside. On two "bad" runs totaling minus-7, Newhouse couldn't handle Pierre-Paul at the point of attack. Newhouse gave up 1½ sacks, three knockdowns and two hurries to Pierre-Paul and had another sack wiped out by penalty. Until Newhouse starts using his hands more consistently, he will struggle against top players.

---

The Giants were credited with two sacks, one by Tollefson, who burst by Newhouse and one by Tuck, who I believe stunted. I don't know how McGinn credited Newhouse with 1/2 that sack. I credited Newhouse with the sack that was wiped out by penalty.


I see it as Newhouse having a rough day against a very good DE. I don't think that he struggled on half the plays, but we can just disagree there. He's going to have to play better to not be a liability against some of the better defenses, or they have to give him more help. I think Stubby really hates the idea of having to waste an option on offense by chipping or leaving a TE in the backfield.

[Upnorth]

If newhouse level of play does not improve I doubt he will start next year, but for a backup asked to play lt for a team every defence gets jacked up playing he has done well. JPP did beat him, but it was not a beat down. Look forward to an upgrade, but Newhouse is playing at a level much better than most backups.

"I think Stubby really hates the idea of having to waste an option on offense by chipping or leaving a TE in the backfield. " -Mraynrand

I would think that against a hard charging D like NYG using a TE to chip then release could help a lot with teh big plays later in the game. Also if you get JPP thinking he is taking on two blocks it will change his first step which might help Newhouse set and get his hands in the right position. Mcginn and I believe PB (could be wrong) mentioned Newhouses hands need to rest quicker, that early assistance would help out.

[Brandon494]

So Nelson has 4 catches and no TDs but gets the game ball because he beat single coverage against Will Blackmon? Not trying to be a hater but come on man. Game ball should go to AR without a doubt.

[Deputy Nutz]

I have Newhouse for 6 bad plays in the second half. 2 didn't affect the plays (Jennings TD and Rodgers first down scramble), two were pressures, and two were sacks, but one sack was inside and probably was 1/2 Newhouse's fault. So not the 90% perfect some want from a LT, but probably 80% effective; certainly not 50%.

Yes but that is like a short stop that boots one out of every ten plays. Newhouse is not consitent enough to be more than a struggling left tackle at this point.

Evan Detrich Smith was terrible in the run game.

[Upnorth]

Yes but that is like a short stop that boots one out of every ten plays. Newhouse is not consitent enough to be more than a struggling left tackle at this point.

Evan Detrich Smith was terrible in the run game.

So playing fairly well for a number of weeks and only having 'bad' games against Allen and JPP you would imply he is not playing up to snuf? That is a pretty steep grade curve you have. Newhouse is in the top 15 in the league so far from what I have seen.

[Harlan Huckleby]

Newhouse had two god-awful games in a row, he is not ok. The only difference between Newhouse and the Allen Barbre meltdown of a couple years ago is that AR is now a magician, able to cover for a leaky line.

Last week McGinn suggested the packers might have to consider trying Sherrod. I wish they would (especially since I am not responsible for consequences.)

All you Newhouse apologists should go fuck yourselves, except Upnorth who is still healing from birthing.

BTW, I have mostly been understanding of Newhouse's struggles, he has sometimes played well. Certainly he is a keeper. Maybe Sherrod has more size for position, longer arms.

[Harlan Huckleby]

Newhouse is in the top 15 in the league so far from what I have seen.

You and I are watching different games.


You're right, tho, Newhouse did fine against lions, it was Jason Allen where he melted down last, that's where McGinn raised the red flag.

I guess Newhouse is not Allen Barbre, but he's pretty bad.

[mraynrand]

Newhouse is not consitent enough to be more than a struggling left tackle at this point.

I agree. But he's only struggled it seems against the top DE talent, like Allen and Pierre-Paul. But that's who he's going to face as the LT. He's had better games.

His big challenges to come:

Melton, Peppers, Bears
Venden Bosch, Lions

Divisional: ? Cowboys DeMarcus Ware
NFC Championship
Will Smith, N.O
Aldon Smith LB, 49ers
Jarret Johnson, Suggs, Ravens
Harrison, Woodley, Steelers

I think he'll have problems with the 3-4 defenses. I'm scratching my head to think of a 3-4 defense he's handled. ?San Diego? They had nothing. Peppers normally won't line up over him. DeMarcus Ware and Will Smith won't be friendly.

[mraynrand]

Newhouse had two god-awful games in a row, he is not ok. The only difference between Newhouse and the Allen Barbre meltdown of a couple years ago is that AR is now a magician, able to cover for a leaky line.

Last week McGinn suggested the packers might have to consider trying Sherrod. I wish they would (especially since I am not responsible for consequences.)

All you Newhouse apologists should go fuck yourselves, except Upnorth who is still healing from birthing.

BTW, I have mostly been understanding of Newhouse's struggles, he has sometimes played well. Certainly he is a keeper. Maybe Sherrod has more size for position, longer arms.

You engage in strawmen with annoying routine. Who is apologizing for Newhouse? Saying he had a rough game isn't exactly making love to the guy. I'm interested in understanding just how bad it is. Last night I saw the third string DT for the Chargers basically do an impression of a revolving door or a matador. But a very good QB and offense was able to bail him out, much like AR does from Newhouse. however, Newhouse wasn't beaten like a rag doll, like the Charger LT.

Good teams tend to have good right defensive ends who get sacks, correct? Allen gets sacks, Will Smith gets sacks, DeMarcus Ware gets sacks. If they get one or two against the Packers, is that all that surprising? Does it mean Newhouse is garbage or just not that good. Engage in hyperbole if you wish, but do it with someone else. Oh, and go fuck yourself too. I know you enjoy it. For kicks use a cucumber instead of a carrot.

[mraynrand]

If newhouse level of play does not improve I doubt he will start next year, but for a backup asked to play lt for a team every defence gets jacked up playing he has done well. JPP did beat him, but it was not a beat down. Look forward to an upgrade, but Newhouse is playing at a level much better than most backups.

"I think Stubby really hates the idea of having to waste an option on offense by chipping or leaving a TE in the backfield. " -Mraynrand

I would think that against a hard charging D like NYG using a TE to chip then release could help a lot with teh big plays later in the game. Also if you get JPP thinking he is taking on two blocks it will change his first step which might help Newhouse set and get his hands in the right position. Mcginn and I believe PB (could be wrong) mentioned Newhouses hands need to rest quicker, that early assistance would help out.

Stubby doesn't like it because it limits his options. One of the reasons the Packer O is so tough for teams is that they have all those receivers coming from every angle. Chipping means you have to use a TE, and then only have him on a short route in the flat. Or having to keep a TE in to block. If your LT neutralized the RDE or OLB, the offense is at a considerable advantage (I know, I just pulled a Troy Aikman™ totally obvious statement®).

[pbmax]

Yes but that is like a short stop that boots one out of every ten plays. Newhouse is not consitent enough to be more than a struggling left tackle at this point.

Evan Detrich Smith was terrible in the run game.

He had two obvious whiffs (it was so bad I thought Wells might have been responsible) on runs to the right. McGinn dinged him for 3 bad runs, 2.5 pressures and no sacks.

[Harlan Huckleby]

McGinn dinged him for 3 bad runs, 2.5 pressures and no sacks.

stats like that are valuable because they make evaluations simpler and comparable, but they are so incomplete. I'm much more interested in whether McGinn says the guy sucked or not. The eyes tell the story.

[Harlan Huckleby]

You engage in strawmen with annoying routine. Who is apologizing for Newhouse?
lighten up


Engage in hyperbole if you wish, but do it with someone else.

man, you sound like Clint Eastwood. Maybe you should use the ignore feature, tough guy.

[mraynrand]

lighten up



man, you sound like Clint Eastwood. Maybe you should use the ignore feature, tough guy.

Go fuck yourself, you Clint Eastwood apologist.

[pbmax]

Go fuck yourself, you Clint Eastwood apologist.

Now that is something you do not see written very often.

[mraynrand]

Now that is something you do not see written very often.

I try to add something new and fresh every day.

[KYPack]

Newhouse had two god-awful games in a row, he is not ok. The only difference between Newhouse and the Allen Barbre meltdown of a couple years ago is that AR is now a magician, able to cover for a leaky line.

Last week McGinn suggested the packers might have to consider trying Sherrod. I wish they would (especially since I am not responsible for consequences.)

All you Newhouse apologists should go fuck yourselves, except Upnorth who is still healing from birthing.

BTW, I have mostly been understanding of Newhouse's struggles, he has sometimes played well. Certainly he is a keeper. Maybe Sherrod has more size for position, longer arms.

I was gonna jump you, but you covered some of this in a follow-up post. Newhouse had a rough day at the office. He's far from a solid LT, but he's not Barbre bad, either.

When Barbre fell apart, he showed major weaknesses and completely lost it. Barbre went flat footed and went into a shell. The only thing left to do was get him off the field. Newhouse got beat and made mistakes too and had a poor game. But the kid never gave up. Oh he got beat so bad on a couple plays, he was lost and shit. But, he battled all day, scrambling and hustling, trying to hang. He showed me he's got the spirit to try and make it.

After that big guy went out hurt for a few plays (Christ, where do the Giants get all these guys?) Newhouse redeemed himself and gave decent protection in that final drive. We had to chip and do some fancy pass pro stuff to help our kiddie line along, but MM and Arod lashed together an offense with a less than NFL caliber starting Oline.

I hope we get a 70% or so Sitton back for the play-offs. Our offensive brain trust can figure things out to cover for one kid over his head, but not two. Espec in the play-offs.

[HarveyWallbangers]

Newhouse isn't nearly as bad as Barbre. I don't know what game HH is watching. Didn't Barbre give up back-to-back 5 sack games? Toss in a boatload of pressures on top of that.

[Harlan Huckleby]

When Barbre fell apart, he showed major weaknesses and completely lost it. Barbre went flat footed and went into a shell. The only thing left to do was get him off the field. Newhouse got beat and made mistakes too and had a poor game. But the kid never gave up. Oh he got beat so bad on a couple plays, he was lost and shit. But, he battled all day, scrambling and hustling, trying to hang. He showed me he's got the spirit to try and make it.

Newhouse fell apart too. He lost his composure against Pierre-Paul and Allen in Barbre-like fashion. The fact that he didn't give up as many sacks is due to AR. It wasn't just a matter of a few bad plays, which is understandable against elites, Newhouse was on ice skates.

I pulled-back from equating Newhouse to Barbre because Newhouse has proven he can play the position with several decent games. Barbre had little agility.

Looking back, we might be in a better place now if Sherrod was allowed to compete strictly at LT, see how far he could go. Nutz was right. Clifton's old body really screwed the team, he stayed healthy just long enough to keep team from developing replacement. Well, maybe Newhouse would have beaten-out Sherrod at LT anyway, but I'd sure would have liked to have seen that competition.

[RashanGary]

Newhouse is fine. He gets destroyed by the best of the best. . . . . He's young, improving. . . . . He'll get us through.

[Brandon494]

So you guys still think Clifton is going to have to fight to get his starting job back from Newhouse? :)

[Deputy Nutz]

First off Newhouse has gotten Rodgers flattened in almost every game he has started at left tackle. Again you can write off two knockdowns or two sacks out of 60 some plays and say that ain't to bad, but in terms of %s as an offensive lineman that is a bad day, combine those over 8 weeks you are not having a very good season.

Newhouse isn't horrible enough for the Packers not to get to the Super Bowl, if is funny how a good QB can cover the mistakes of his offensive line. Rodgers is mobil, his pocket awareness has gotten better and he doesn't get creamed, he knows where the pressure is coming from.

Barbre was terrible.

Sherrod must be way off track this season. I heard it mentioned in another thread and I understand draft and develop but apparently there is way more development needed with this guy.

I don't think Clifton is going to be back, he is falling apart. He can't even rehab without hurting another part of his body.

[RashanGary]

And Clifton sucked when he was in too. He didn't get all idiot awkward like Newhouse does. His technique was good. He just got shoved straight backwards every game. To his credit, his body was between Rodgers and the defender on just about every play, except the plays where he was in Rodgers lap.

At best, we have Clifton, a barely average LT at this point. At worst, we have Newhouse, probably a bottom 3 LT in the league.

I'm not a fan of Newhouse right now. Everything for HH is so damn dramatic, it makes it hard to come into a thread and agree with him when he's so over the top about it. I'm in the boat that thinks he still has some promise. He flashes, but some OL, especially the ones who haven't grown up with NFL style technique, take a year or two to develop. I'm not convinced Newhouse is close to his ceiling.

[mraynrand]

Newhouse fell apart too. He lost his composure against Pierre-Paul and Allen in Barbre-like fashion. The fact that he didn't give up as many sacks is due to AR. It wasn't just a matter of a few bad plays, which is understandable against elites, Newhouse was on ice skates.

This just isn't true.

[Upnorth]

So you guys still think Clifton is going to have to fight to get his starting job back from Newhouse? :)

No I don't thionk their will be a fight, I unfortunatley think Cliffy is done. I hope I am very wrong, but it looks that way as his rehab seems to be going the same way Tauschers did.

HH, he did not get destroyed by JPP or Allen. Against Allen he was fairly settled in the second half (he did get some help but allen is a top 5 DE) and he had a few strong series against JPP (without much help at all). They did beat Newhouse, but did not destroy him. He is the best backup LT in the league and to me is still in the top 15 of starters (ie about average as a starter). I don't have a lot of fancy stats to back this, but I do have two points. One read your weekly posting of Mcginn's review and that tells you a fair amount. Two Arod has a Passer rating of 125(ish) and has had Newhouse as his LT for most of that time. If Newhouse was crap two things would have happened by now; he would have been replaced or Arod would be doing much much worse.
Just wastching the games tells me he passes the tests most of the time and if he continues to develop he may become our starter for a decade. If he has reached his potential then he is the best backup in the league and we have him thank god. He is still learning and improving, not great but good enough right now.

[pbmax]

This just isn't true.

I will offer that while McGinn said he was too far forward over his toes and unable to recover, his worst play I saw he was sitting back on his heels unable to pivot or move quickly. But this got better the farther into the game he went. Could be a combination of his growing comfort and JPP being a little out of gas.

But on the subject of losing his composure, no. Barbre looked at times willing to commit a penalty (personal foul variety not simply holding) but Newhouse stayed with his technique. Newhouse struggled, Barbre collapsed.

[Upnorth]

One last point, Buluga is one hell of a RT, but who here thinks they would leave him there if the team really thought Newhouse was as bad as some of you think? They would not risk ARod just to keep Buluga at RT.

[mraynrand]

I will offer that while McGinn said he was too far forward over his toes and unable to recover, his worst play I saw he was sitting back on his heels unable to pivot or move quickly. But this got better the farther into the game he went. Could be a combination of his growing comfort and JPP being a little out of gas.

But on the subject of losing his composure, no. Barbre looked at times willing to commit a penalty (personal foul variety not simply holding) but Newhouse stayed with his technique. Newhouse struggled, Barbre collapsed.

I think this is on the money. Newhouse blew a bunch of plays but hung in there. And he did end up winning the war of attrition

[mraynrand]

One last point, Buluga is one hell of a RT, but who here thinks they would leave him there if the team really thought Newhouse was as bad as some of you think? They would not risk ARod just to keep Buluga at RT.

True, but they did help Newhouse. Chips here and there and a few double teams with Lang. I don't have numbers, but Bulaga seemed to be completely on his own most if not all the time.

[Harlan Huckleby]

Newhouse is fine. He gets destroyed by the best of the best. . . . . He's young, improving. . . . . He'll get us through.

maybe

[Harlan Huckleby]

One last point, Buluga is one hell of a RT, but who here thinks they would leave him there if the team really thought Newhouse was as bad as some of you think? They would not risk ARod just to keep Buluga at RT.

Remember, Barbre blew-up at right tackle. Its not not like you can really hide a weak pass blocker there. Moving Bulaga would weaken two positions. There is a small amount of truth to what you are saying.

Some of you who are calling me Chicken Little need to look to my good friend Bob McGinn. His reviews of Newhouse were just as damning in tone after MN & NY as I have been. After MN, he said the pack might have to consider crazy legs Sherrod.

[mraynrand]

Bob McGinn: His reviews of Newhouse were just as damning in tone after MN & NY as I have been. After MN, he said the pack might have to consider crazy legs Sherrod.

Your review and McGinn's were not the same. And yes, the Packers might have to look at Sherrod. But they did that in the ATL game and found him lacking. That's why they moved him to the right and Newhouse to the left in that game in the first place.

The obvious conclusion is that Newhouse can't be trusted to stand up to top tier RDE or ROLB talent all on his own for an entire game. On pass plays with deeper routes, he will often need the help of a double team or a chip.

[Harlan Huckleby]

Your review and McGinn's were not the same. Wrong, your spin not withstanding, McGinn identified Newhouse's weaknesss as a major problem, in contrast to the "What, me worry?" tone by many here.

[mraynrand]

Wrong, your spin not withstanding, McGinn identified Newhouse's weaknesss as a major problem, in contrast to the "What, me worry?" tone by many here.

Kindof a strawman there. Who doesn't think it's a problem? The relative seriousness of the problem is where the disagreement lies, and we just differ. hasta luego

[Harlan Huckleby]

Newhouse is fine. He gets destroyed by the best of the best. . . . . He's young, improving. . . . . He'll get us through.what, me worry?

[Harlan Huckleby]

HH, he did not get destroyed by JPP or Allen... He is still learning and improving, not great but good enough right now.what, me worry?

[mraynrand]

Thanks for proving my point

[Harlan Huckleby]

Thanks for proving my point
the point about newhouse being fine, and newhouse not geting destroyed by Allen & Pierre-Paul? Check.

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3214/2701942685_44695c2026.jpg

[mraynrand]

the point about newhouse being fine, and newhouse not geting destroyed by Allen & Pierre-Paul? Check.

the guy who said 'fine' said he gets destroyed by the best of the best. The guy who said he didn't get destroyed by Allen and P-P said he's not great but good enough. Those aren't ringing endorsements if you didn't get it. And that's the best you can come up with. Again, who thinks it's not a problem? maybe one guy? Keep proving my point. Your over-the-top rhetoric isn't convincing.

[Harlan Huckleby]

The guy who said he didn't get destroyed by Allen and P-P said he's not great but good enough.

He's not good enough, he's a real problem, as McGinn pointed out, and head-in-sanders avoid facing. And he did get destroyed in those two games.

[mraynrand]

Harlan, did you get a good look at Sherrod versus Newhouse? What did you think? We were partying at the house during the game, so I haven't looked closely at the film. We should compare notes. Don't worry - even if you agree with me, I will still hate you.

[pbmax]

McGinn had Sherrod on his butt one play and losing a guy inside one other time, but otherwise held up OK with some help sent his way with Wimbley across from him.

[Fritz]

Newhouse tries to steer his guys around the back end of the QB on pass plays, and he gets messed up when DE's change direction in mid-rush. Newhouse seems to lack the killer part - when he thinks the QB is safe, he kind of lets up, which has cost Arod some yards from time to time when he's scrambling. Newhouse needs to learn to keep after his guy, and if his guy falls down, Newhouse needs to fall on top of him.

[Harlan Huckleby]

I had no take on Sherrod, I sorta lost interest in the game about the time he got in. I was very happy to see him in the game, though, he really looks like an LT with his height & wingspan & enormous head.

I've been happy with Newhouse through most of season, hoped he would hold job over Cliffy, who is over-the-hill. But the two bad games really changed my mind, I have hunch packers will see giants in playoffs. Cliffy is best option, and I suspect MM was wondering if Sherrod might be second best option.

[Upnorth]

I really really hope Sherrod is better than Newhouse as that would make the line better overall. I am all for an upgrade and as I have said before do not expect to see Newhouse as the starter next year. If Sherrod overtakes him in time for the playoffs that is even better. Newhouse is still an average starting LT.

[mraynrand]

I had no take on Sherrod, I sorta lost interest in the game about the time he got in. I was very happy to see him in the game, though, he really looks like an LT with his height & wingspan & enormous head.

I've been happy with Newhouse through most of season, hoped he would hold job over Cliffy, who is over-the-hill. But the two bad games really changed my mind, I have hunch packers will see giants in playoffs. Cliffy is best option, and I suspect MM was wondering if Sherrod might be second best option.

There can be no doubt Stubby is figuring out which guy will be his second, assuming Clifton is ready by Divisional weekend. Newhouse could go from starting to being a game day inactive if Sherrod outplays him the final three games.