DEFENSIVE PLAYERS DISAPPOINTING ? Your list .......

[Bretsky]

It's hard to believe we've went from one of the best to one of the worst
Losing Cullen Jenkins surely hurt and losing Nick Collins really hurt but way more than that is wrong.

I'm curious which players on active roster have been the most disappointing to you. I'm starting with two and if these guys pick up their game to where it was last year it's likely we win another title. We still have a good shot


Tramon Williams- No pro bowl talk for this guy lately. No top ten cover guy talk. He's been roasted way too often. Last year it appeared he was a shutdown CB. He's paid pretty well right now. This year he seems very average.

Sam Shields- Gotta love finding those gems. Last year a few went as far as comparing him to Haden from Cleveland....silly talk.........but he was a pretty good CB who looked like a solid future starter. I'm not sure where his game went this year. He's alright but doesn't seem to make the plays he made last year.

[mission]

Everyone, really.

I'll give passes to Woodson and Matthews.

[HarveyWallbangers]

I agree with Shields. He still flashes, but he's just not as consistent this year. He's still pretty good for a third corner.

Tramon was awful after the shoulder injury. He was rounding into form until this last game. Then again, the Giants are tough matchup on deep throws. Tramon got roasted my Manningham last year. I think Tramon is ready to finish the year strong.

Woodson has also been exposed in coverage. They haven't been able to play him in that rover role as much this year.

B.J. Raji has disappointed.

Our safety play has been poor. I think that's been our biggest issues, coupled with the corners not playing as well as last year.

[pbmax]

Peprah and Raji. Wood isn't young enough to be outside so I would stick Shields out there until he plays his way back to form as Tramontana is doing. If you need std 3-4 package, put in Corner Oakie.

And its a weird position to be in but Walden is driving me nuts. He has gotten better almost every game but each game there are two run plays he seems to disappear on and then 2 more pass rushes where he seems just a step late. He is playing better than he did at the end of last year but its still driving me nuts.

[gbgary]

if we had a rush those boys in the back wouldn't be in such shape. they're at a huge disadvantage because of the blitzing, injuries, and lack of d-line pressure. i'm not really disappointed in anyone. they're all doing their best.

[mission]

Outside of Sam's tackling, he really hasn't been too bad for a nickel back. The difference between this year and last is that he just doesn't seem to make that final play on the ball to knock it down. Looks like he's in good position a lot but that last-minute two-arms-straight-in-the-year defense in the endzone or on deep passes never works out well. Gotta get his head around sooner.

[Bretsky]

If Tramon finds his form this defense will improve

It's hard to put Raji on the list; his snap count is insanely high this year to our lack of quality DL.
Neal has been hurt and his amount of snaps is a reflection that we have a couple JAG's on the DL

Peprah is hard for me to put there; he is what he is. Underwhelming talent but reliable overall. If you have a pass rush you can hide him. If you don't he'll get exposed. He's a perfect last safety but not the perfect starter.

[mission]

if we had a rush those boys in the back wouldn't be in such shape. they're at a huge disadvantage because the blitzing, injuries, and lack of d-line pressure. i'm not really disappointed in anyone. they're all doing their best.

thanks for ruining the thread.

[gbgary]

thanks for ruining the thread.


:lol:

made you feel guilty huh?

[Bretsky]

. they're all doing their best.



Now enough of this middle school everyone is a winner because they tried talk and get to the criticism :)

[gbgary]

Now enough of this middle school everyone is a winner because they tried talk and get to the criticism :)

ok...it's tt's fault.

[mission]

:lol:

made you feel guiltly huh?

:lol: well ya... it was the anti-my-post !!

[Bretsky]

It is kind of interesting that the coaches many thought the most of (secondary coaches) have some disappointing players while one of the two coaches many think the least of (OL) has put a Marshmellow and other backups out there and survived.

Let's all say it together.........it will make you feel better..........James Campen might be an OK coach !

[pbmax]

If Neal continues to make progress, then I predict this thread will become a mea cupla thread. :)

Not promising anything, just saying ....

[pbmax]

It is kind of interesting that the coaches many thought the most of (secondary coaches) have some disappointing players while one of the two coaches many think the least of (OL) has put a Marshmellow and other backups out there and survived.

Let's all say it together.........it will make you feel better..........James Campen might be an OK coach !

Jerry Fontenot was the entire problem all that time!

[gbgary]

I predict this thread will become a mea cupla thread.



wasn't she in The Godfather III?

http://images.askmen.com/entertainment/movie/1244058198_the-godfather-part-iii_1.jpg

[Bretsky]

If Neal continues to make progress, then I predict this thread will become a mea cupla thread. :)

Not promising anything, just saying ....


been a bit too ez around here so I'm stirring some shit up
I'm hopeful this it's a mea culpa
For the record I was always "ok" with the Sherrod pick.
Not at all surprised he's not ready because most scouts noted he needed development but was a great future prospect if he does develop.

I've always liked Neal more than most. Dude has more ability in his pinky fingers than all of sweet Justine Sallymae Harrell

[pbmax]

been a bit too ez around here so I'm stirring some shit up
I'm hopeful this it's a mea culpa
For the record I was always "ok" with the Sherrod pick.
Not at all surprised he's not ready because most scouts noted he needed development but was a great future prospect if he does develop.

I've always liked Neal more than most. Dude has more ability in his pinky fingers than all of sweet Justine Sallymae Harrell

You're doing good B.

[HarveyWallbangers]

It's hard to put Raji on the list; his snap count is insanely high this year to our lack of quality DL.

I'm pretty sure he's played fewer snaps than last year. I know they've reduced his snaps the last few games. I think the different approach is an indication of how the coaches feel Raji is playing. They're trying something different to see if he'll snap out of his funk. I don't think he's playing bad, but I was expecting All Pro caliber play out of him. I thought he was close to that at the end of last year.

[Bretsky]

I'm pretty sure he's played fewer snaps than last year. I know they've reduced his snaps the last few games. I think the different approach is an indication of how the coaches feel Raji is playing. They're trying something different to see if he'll snap out of his funk. I don't think he's playing bad, but I was expecting All Pro caliber play out of him. I thought he was close to that at the end of last year.

There was an article two or three games ago that he was on an insane pace and they feared they were wearing him down and/or it was hurting his production. They were going to make it a focus to draw the snaps back

[HarveyWallbangers]

There was an article two or three games ago that he was on an insane pace and they feared they were wearing him down and/or it was hurting his production. They were going to make it a focus to draw the snaps back

He couldn't play much more than he did last year. I think it was over 90% of the defensive snaps. To me, it sounds like the coaches are a bit disappointed in Raji and are trying to keep him fresh to see if that will give him a boost (grasping at straws).

[RashanGary]

Burnett

[Patler]

Based on my own expectations for them, to greater and lesser degrees, I am disappointed in the performances of:
Raji, Neal, Wilson
Hawk, Matthews, Zombo, Jones
Williams, Shields, Woodson, House
Peprah


Based on the expectations I had for them, I am not disappointed in the performances of:
Pickett, Wynn, Green
Bishop, Walden, Smith, Francois, So'oto, Lattimore
Bush, Lee
Burnett, Jennings

[Patler]

It's hard to put Raji on the list; his snap count is insanely high this year to our lack of quality DL.


I'm pretty sure he's played fewer snaps than last year. I know they've reduced his snaps the last few games. I think the different approach is an indication of how the coaches feel Raji is playing. They're trying something different to see if he'll snap out of his funk. I don't think he's playing bad, but I was expecting All Pro caliber play out of him. I thought he was close to that at the end of last year.


There was an article two or three games ago that he was on an insane pace and they feared they were wearing him down and/or it was hurting his production. They were going to make it a focus to draw the snaps back


He couldn't play much more than he did last year. I think it was over 90% of the defensive snaps. To me, it sounds like the coaches are a bit disappointed in Raji and are trying to keep him fresh to see if that will give him a boost (grasping at straws).

Per the JS, Raji played 85% of the defensive downs in 2010, and was playing just over 88% until a few weeks ago when the conscious effort was made to play him less. While the 3% increase would have amounted to an increase of about to 2 plays per game based on 2010 performance, as we all know the defense is playng more poorly this year, and is playing more snaps per game than last year.

So, while Raji's participation level was up only 3%, at the time he was actually playing almost 6 plays per game more in 2011 than he did in 2010.

[Bossman641]

Raji, Wilson, Hawk, Tramon, Shields, Peprah

On the flip side, who has exceeded my expectations? Both Wynn and Burnett early in the year but they have since fallen off.

[pittstang5]

Jarrett Bush when he's playing defense. (Special Teams he's been decent).

Shields was recently added to my $h!t list. That touchdown he gave up late in the fourth quarter against the Giants really bugged me. All he had to do was turn around and he could have intercepted or at least knocked the ball down. I think it was the Tampa Bay game where he was doing the same thing...not getting his head around.

[Brandon494]

Bush? You actually expected him to play well this year?

[pbmax]

Raji also had a position switch again, but McGinn has not consistently detailed how many "Eagle" snaps they have played.

[RashanGary]

The DL have said many times this year, they're not rushing up field at the QB very often so you can't gauge pass rush. The Packers are playing far less 8 in the box football. The DL are both 2 gappers right now, with very little leeway to turn it up.

This week Raji was let loose a little. He had a lot of pressure.

It's a different defense this year. The DL have less freedom.

I hear it said quite a bit from the football guys. . . . there is more to it than numbers and impressions from outside. None of us knows what a guy is being asked to do. I learned that again with my Finley hate.


My hunch. . . . Raji is just fan-fuckin-tastic. He's a victim of piss poor safety play that's taking a defender away from run support and forcing him to be a "stay square - 2 gapper" on most of his snaps.

[Upnorth]

On defence it is every LB except Mathews, Raji, Sheilds and Peprah, and bush as an after thought (I dont really think of him as a defensive player anymore which is sad).
On Offence it is Lang, Sherrod, Jones, Finley, Grant, Starks and Greene.

Not saying any of these players are sh@tty (well some are) just some had very high expectations.

[Brandon494]

Jones and Starks?

[Upnorth]

Jones and Starks?

I expected Jones to be at the very least a quality #3 wr. Starks I was hoping to continue where he ws in the playoffs. Really the running game in general has been disappointing (to me).

[pbmax]

The DL have said many times this year, they're not rushing up field at the QB very often so you can't gauge pass rush. The Packers are playing far less 8 in the box football. The DL are both 2 gappers right now, with very little leeway to turn it up.

This week Raji was let loose a little. He had a lot of pressure.

It's a different defense this year. The DL have less freedom.

I hear it said quite a bit from the football guys. . . . there is more to it than numbers and impressions from outside. None of us knows what a guy is being asked to do. I learned that again with my Finley hate.


My hunch. . . . Raji is just fan-fuckin-tastic. He's a victim of piss poor safety play that's taking a defender away from run support and forcing him to be a "stay square - 2 gapper" on most of his snaps.

But some of these suppositions are contradictory. Your Capers quote earlier suggested he called more Cover 2 recently. Versus the Giants, that was seven in the box, base 3-4. But you suggest Raji had more on gap freedom versus the Giants which is supposed to be antithetical to 7 in the box. Also, I do not think the D line is two gapping on any pass downs unless they are facing a fearsome running QB or Rothliesberger.

The other thing is that Capers doesn't play a lot of straight 2-gap Okie in base. He often reduces that front (I think that is the term) to shade the nose tackle and play one end in a wider technique. That front, if you count the OLB, looks exactly like Fritz Shurmur's 4-3 Under defense with Gilbert and Reggie.

I suspect, in addition to adjusting for lack of pass rush/safety play, Capers has had to adjust to trouble with the running game.

We need data. Does anyone have any stats from McGinn about the amount of nickel versus base this year?

And I would still like a link to an example of the quotes because I find the possibility of more 2 gapping to be intriguing as one of the differences between this year and last.

[Smidgeon]

Neal. I expected something more than the last three games have shown. He's had time to get healthy, so maybe he just has to play into football shape. I expect him to start flashing in either the Chiefs game or the Bears game. If not, I'll start wondering if the injury took something out of him.

Peprah. After last year's solid play, I expected more of the same. Turns out two things are true: Nick Collins had enough range to make up for Peprah's limitations and Burnett is no Nick Collins. I'm not saying Burnett doesn't have potential to be all-pro (I'm not saying he does either), but he's playing his first full season and Collins is better than I had appreciated.

Raji and Woodson. For whatever reason, the plays don't quite seem to be there. Now Raji just had his best game (after the reduced snap count) and could light it up down the stretch. And I'm only disappointed in Woodson because I expect an outstanding play or two every game.

Matthews gets a pass because he's been leading the league in QB pressures since early on (I'm assuming that pace continued) even though the sacks aren't coming.

Shields gets a pass from me because I expected a sophomore slump. He's still new and depending on speed too much last year. I think he's working on technique a lot and is therefore seeming to slump. But when he completes "changing his swing", I think he'll be fine again.

Tramon gets a pass because of his shoulder.

Jones gets a pass because as of a couple weeks ago, he was still ahead of his 2010 catching pace (haven't checked it since).

[gbgary]

I expected Jones to be at the very least a quality #3 wr. Starks I was hoping to continue where he ws in the playoffs. Really the running game in general has been disappointing (to me).

running would be better if the o-line wasn't crippled and inexperienced. they're doing their best. we're a passing team anyway. i'm not disappointed. :)

[Patler]

I thought this thread was supposed to be about defensive players. Why are we mentioning/discussing Starks and/or James Jones?

[Upnorth]

I thought this thread was supposed to be about defensive players. Why are we mentioning/discussing Starks and/or James Jones?

Are you trying to limit our ability to complain about people with far superior athletic talent to ourselves? Come on a thread title is more of a suggestion than and order. Rules, i've had it up to here with your stinkin' rules.

[mraynrand]

Per the JS, Raji played 85% of the defensive downs in 2010, and was playing just over 88% until a few weeks ago when the conscious effort was made to play him less. While the 3% increase would have amounted to an increase of about to 2 plays per game based on 2010 performance, as we all know the defense is playng more poorly this year, and is playing more snaps per game than last year.

So, while Raji's participation level was up only 3%, at the time he was actually playing almost 6 plays per game more in 2011 than he did in 2010.

That was a double Whammy!

http://i453.photobucket.com/albums/qq254/mraynrand/Patlerized.jpghttp://i453.photobucket.com/albums/qq254/mraynrand/Patlerized.jpg

[pbmax]

Still does not explain his dropoff in performance earlier in the year. However, both Justin and McGinn noted that Raji had some of his best rushes this week against the G-Men. And the G-Men can pass block. Even if they had to play musical chairs to find a center.

[mraynrand]

if we had a rush those boys in the back wouldn't be in such shape. they're at a huge disadvantage because of the blitzing, injuries, and lack of d-line pressure. i'm not really disappointed in anyone. they're all doing their best.

I hope you're wrong about this!

[Fritz]

Brad Jones and CJ Wilson. I didn't expect them to be world-beaters, but I expected Jones to flash a little more ability and maybe take on some snaps with coverage responsibilities once Zombo was done. CJ Wilson was supposed to take the next step and be able to handle some snaps at end so the d-line guys like Wynn could stay fresh.

Fuckers.

[denverYooper]

I've been somewhat disappointed in Hawk. He has often seemed pretty slow and been prone to getting faked out. He's never been a speedster but he seems even slower this year. I sort of wonder if Francois might see more snaps in obvious passing downs over Hawk.

Of course, I base that on the "one play" rule -- Francois had that memorable interception in the Lions game--so I could very well be way off base in thinking that this would be more successful.

The other thing that I have been disappointed in is Safety play in general. I suppose they're doing the best they can given their limitations -- I think Burnett will be a fine safety in another year or two once he's seen enough and Peprah is a good backup -- but they both seem to get lost at times. IIRC, Pittsburgh struggles quite a bit when Polamalu is out, so maybe replacing a Pro-Bowl Safety is harder than other positions.

[Fosco33]

2010 Packers Defensive Stats-

240 points allowed (15/game) - 2nd in NFL
6 games where held to 7 points or less (or 21 points/game in the other 10 games)
5.1 yards/play allowed (5.4 net yards/attempt passing; 4.7 y/a rushing)
24 INTs

Point differential - 2nd in NFL

Net yards/pass attempt differential - 1.7 (one of the most key stats in football) - 2nd behind Chargers

2011 Packers Defensive Stats (thru 12 games)
Pace for 350 points (21.8/game) - 17th in NFL
2 games held to 7 or less (pace for one more)
6.3 yards/play allowed (7 net yards/passing attempt; 4.9 y/a rushing)
Pace for 31 INTs

Point differential - 1st in NFL

Net yards/pass attempt differential - 1.4 (one of the most key stats in football) - 3rd in NFL (behind Houston and Steelers)

[Fosco33]

In short...

Pack is still top of league in point differential and net yards/pass attempt differential. And we've improved in forcing INTs (and not throwing them).

Biggest concern is obvious - degraded in yards/pass attempt by 1.6 yards and point/game by 6.8.

We're still fucking good.

[denverYooper]

In short...

Pack is still top of league in point differential and net yards/pass attempt differential. And we've improved in forcing INTs (and not throwing them).

Biggest concern is obvious - degraded in yards/pass attempt by 1.6 yards and point/game by 6.8.

We're still fucking good.

I can agree with that.

It seems that the identity of the team has changed to become the passing juggernaut they were supposed to be.

[mission]

I can agree with that.

It seems that the identity of the team has changed to become the passing juggernaut they were supposed to be.

As simple as that is, it's probably the best point in the whole thread. Think back to last year--we're struggling to score points, Rodgers is trying to find his way, guys like me are calling for MM's head because he "can't playcall". We have pretty short memories and associate last year's team with the one that ran through the playoffs. The defense was strong and we barely made the playoffs... played some close post season games where the defense came up big when it mattered and the offense was starting to really pull it together.

Now we're playing some nail biters but generally proving we're betting than everyone else, but our defense has taken a step backwards at first glance. Their identity is different this year and it's all working together. I'd like to see some defensive growth from here on out this season -- and expect some -- but think our makeup accounts for this in some way. The result can't be argued with.

[vince]

Still does not explain his dropoff in performance earlier in the year. However, both Justin and McGinn noted that Raji had some of his best rushes this week against the G-Men. And the G-Men can pass block. Even if they had to play musical chairs to find a center.
Agreed. The last two games, Raji has been disruptive. It seems as if the reduced snaps strategy is working. Also, Raji paradoxically seems to play better later in the year. Last year he collected most of his sacks in the last 5 or 6 games and was a beast in the playoffs.

Here's what PFW has to say about him as they preview the Raiders game.


Coming off back-to-back particularly lackluster outings, it won't get any easier this Sunday for Oakland's interior line matched up against Raji, who is coming off his best overall performance of the season vs. the Giants. The reduced snap count that Raji has received in recent games — a tactic designed to make him fresher down the stretch — appeared to pay huge dividends against the Giants. While Raji had only one tackle in the Meadowlands, he won practically all of his one-on-one battles (five QB hurries) and came up with a key fumble recovery late in the first half following a sack of Eli Manning by Clay Matthews. Raji showed off his rare athleticism on a number of occasions in the game, confounding the Giants with an assortment of moves, in addition to utilizing his great combination of speed and quickness to the max.

Raji also had some gaffes defending the run vs. the Giants though. On one occasion, he gave up his gap control attempting a spin move as if he read pass and the Giants runner ran untouched through the hole he vacated for a big gain. That'll need to get cleaned up this week.

The wall of Pickett, Raji and Green hasn't been as effective as they should be in controlling the LOS in running situations lately. That's a bit disappointing.

[Upnorth]

I bet that with the raiders, kc and cubs on the slate by the time we get to det we are all confident in our d again. If not oh oh.

[Bretsky]

Brad Jones and CJ Wilson. I didn't expect them to be world-beaters, but I expected Jones to flash a little more ability and maybe take on some snaps with coverage responsibilities once Zombo was done. CJ Wilson was supposed to take the next step and be able to handle some snaps at end so the d-line guys like Wynn could stay fresh.

Fuckers.

Brad Jones ? I can't be disappointed in a guy who sucks. He flashed a bit his rookie yr and had been a JAG starting with the Arizona playoff game when he was miserable. Brad Jones is the Bush of the LB crew ! Out with him....lol

CJ Wilson has not taken a step forward. I still haven't figured out of Wynn is a player or a JAG.

Perhaps none of this matters if we keep scoring nearly 40pts per game

[Smidgeon]

Brad Jones ? I can't be disappointed in a guy who sucks. He flashed a bit his rookie yr and had been a JAG starting with the Arizona playoff game when he was miserable. Brad Jones is the Bush of the LB crew ! Out with him....lol

CJ Wilson has not taken a step forward. I still haven't figured out of Wynn is a player or a JAG.

Perhaps none of this matters if we keep scoring nearly 40pts per game

I was enamored with Brad Jones after his rookie year. But he's done nothing except disappoint me since.

[Pugger]

Neal. I expected something more than the last three games have shown. He's had time to get healthy, so maybe he just has to play into football shape. I expect him to start flashing in either the Chiefs game or the Bears game. If not, I'll start wondering if the injury took something out of him.

Peprah. After last year's solid play, I expected more of the same. Turns out two things are true: Nick Collins had enough range to make up for Peprah's limitations and Burnett is no Nick Collins. I'm not saying Burnett doesn't have potential to be all-pro (I'm not saying he does either), but he's playing his first full season and Collins is better than I had appreciated.

Raji and Woodson. For whatever reason, the plays don't quite seem to be there. Now Raji just had his best game (after the reduced snap count) and could light it up down the stretch. And I'm only disappointed in Woodson because I expect an outstanding play or two every game.

Matthews gets a pass because he's been leading the league in QB pressures since early on (I'm assuming that pace continued) even though the sacks aren't coming.

Shields gets a pass from me because I expected a sophomore slump. He's still new and depending on speed too much last year. I think he's working on technique a lot and is therefore seeming to slump. But when he completes "changing his swing", I think he'll be fine again.

Tramon gets a pass because of his shoulder.

Jones gets a pass because as of a couple weeks ago, he was still ahead of his 2010 catching pace (haven't checked it since).

This.

It also doesn't help our secondary that we have a pretty anemic pass rush. Walden is getting some pressure as is CM3 but they seem to often get there a second too late. Will Neal help? I still think he's still trying to play his way into shape and we'll hopefully see some improvement there in the coming weeks.

[Pugger]

I thought this thread was supposed to be about defensive players. Why are we mentioning/discussing Starks and/or James Jones?

No chit.

[Pugger]

I've been somewhat disappointed in Hawk. He has often seemed pretty slow and been prone to getting faked out. He's never been a speedster but he seems even slower this year. I sort of wonder if Francois might see more snaps in obvious passing downs over Hawk.

Of course, I base that on the "one play" rule -- Francois had that memorable interception in the Lions game--so I could very well be way off base in thinking that this would be more successful.

The other thing that I have been disappointed in is Safety play in general. I suppose they're doing the best they can given their limitations -- I think Burnett will be a fine safety in another year or two once he's seen enough and Peprah is a good backup -- but they both seem to get lost at times. IIRC, Pittsburgh struggles quite a bit when Polamalu is out, so maybe replacing a Pro-Bowl Safety is harder than other positions.

Hawk hasn't been as stellar as last season but I think he's better than Francois and AJ was missed in the Giants game.

Is Burnett still wearing a cast on his hand? If we think about it he is still basically a rookie and one-handed for all these weeks. He went on IR early last season so he's still trying to figure out how to play safety at an NFL level.

[Brandon494]

I don't think Hawk was as much missed as Bishop was. Both backup LBs looked like Hawk missing tackles in the Giants game.

[mraynrand]

I don't think Hawk was as much missed as Bishop was. Both backup LBs looked like Hawk missing tackles in the Giants game.

Pretty much. Although François almost had another ¡intercepción!

[smuggler]

People listing Raji are way off. He can't help that the guys on the line with him are marginal or worse. Pickett and Wynn/Wilson are just not good. And, Walden hasn't looked that good, and Zombo's been hurt. And Peprah has been burnt repeatedly, Burnett missed tackles due to his cast and taken some bad angles. TWilliams has been burnt a few times, Shields has been slightly better than TWill but has missed a ton of tackles.

The 3 guys that are pretty much untouchable are Woodson, Matthews, and Raji.

[mraynrand]

People listing Raji are way off. He can't help that the guys on the line with him are marginal or worse. Pickett and Wynn/Wilson are just not good. And, Walden hasn't looked that good, and Zombo's been hurt. And Peprah has been burnt repeatedly, Burnett missed tackles due to his cast and taken some bad angles. TWilliams has been burnt a few times, Shields has been slightly better than TWill but has missed a ton of tackles.

The 3 guys that are pretty much untouchable are Woodson, Matthews, and Raji.


There have been mentions in several articles that the coaches are expecting more from Raji. But the fact that they've been reducing his snap count suggests that the coaches may realize they're the ones to blame for his loss of productivity due to overwork.

[hoosier]

People listing Raji are way off. He can't help that the guys on the line with him are marginal or worse. Pickett and Wynn/Wilson are just not good. And, Walden hasn't looked that good, and Zombo's been hurt. And Peprah has been burnt repeatedly, Burnett missed tackles due to his cast and taken some bad angles. TWilliams has been burnt a few times, Shields has been slightly better than TWill but has missed a ton of tackles.

The 3 guys that are pretty much untouchable are Woodson, Matthews, and Raji.


Why do you think Pickett is marginal?

[Smidgeon]

Why do you think Pickett is marginal?

Agree with this question.

[Upnorth]

Someone wondered why Raji is on some peoples list. My reason is at the beginning of the season I expected amazing things. He has played very well, but not as disruptive as he was in the past

[pbmax]

Neal was on the radio today saying he thought he could help by simply saving Pick and Raji snaps and pointed to Raji's pass rush penetration as proof.

Maybe a small sample size, but perhaps Mike and the other players/coaches are hoping to see. Could help explain why they were so cautious with Neal; ie they REALLY wanted him for playoffs.

If so Busari, I retract my criticism.

[denverYooper]

Cullen Jenkins has been a disappointment lately.

[smuggler]

The answer to Upnorth's question is also the answer to hoosier and smidgeon's questions. I will admit that Raji hasn't been as stellar as we'd hoped against the run. But the reason he hasn't wowed you, Upnorth, is because none of the other 3 down lineman require more than a single-team to consistently beat in pass protection. I pray Neal can come in and change that.

I really do like Pickett, but I feel like his time is drawing to a close. I hope we can get some capable guys in here next season and see if we can find a gem.

[Bretsky]

I was enamored with Brad Jones after his rookie year. But he's done nothing except disappoint me since.


He showed some really nice flashes in about three games in his rookie year. I actually thought we were getting another pass rusher. Then the AZ game occured and if you look at that game and his body of work after I'm unsure why he's even on the roster.

[Upnorth]

Brad Jones frustrates me as well, he looked phenomenal for that short stretch in 09 but not much since. Last year was just a meh year for Jones, and this year I can't really remember him playing. Is he on special teams?
For the lb's only Mathews and Francois (frenchy?) Have not disappointed. I expected very good things from Walden and So'to.
Picket is being Picket so unlike Raji I am not disappointed in him. I am in away disappointed in Neal, but you can't help and shouldn't rush an injury.
Can Neal do what Jenkins did, if so our secondary will substantially improve. We have a mid level pass rush with an opportunistic secondary. Get us an above average pass rush and that stops at least 3 more points a game.
(We stop 3 more points in NY and we could still say MM can't win a close one hehe)

[King Friday]

I think our defense is really dinged up this year. While our offense has escaped injury outside of Clifton, the defense has been hit hard. I don't really view the loss of Jenkins as being the reason we can't rush the passer anymore. I don't think Capers is getting too creative this regular season. He doesn't need to. I expect Capers to dial up some new looks come January that might catch some teams off balance.

The ultimate report card for this team will come in the postseason anyway. Our defense is playing well enough for us to probably go undefeated...so who's complaining?

[Upnorth]

I am. I like the take aways, like the ppg, but don't like how we have allowed late game drives for important points two weeks in a row. For many games we did not give up any points on drives in the 4th when the game was within 7. That changed in the last two weeks. Just when I was getting a lot of faith in this d they stopped stopping in the fourth.
That needs to stop in the playoffs.

I think we will look good the next three weeks and get exposed @home against det again.

[Smidgeon]

Brad Jones frustrates me as well, he looked phenomenal for that short stretch in 09 but not much since. Last year was just a meh year for Jones, and this year I can't really remember him playing. Is he on special teams?
For the lb's only Mathews and Francois (frenchy?) Have not disappointed. I expected very good things from Walden and So'to.
Picket is being Picket so unlike Raji I am not disappointed in him. I am in away disappointed in Neal, but you can't help and shouldn't rush an injury.
Can Neal do what Jenkins did, if so our secondary will substantially improve. We have a mid level pass rush with an opportunistic secondary. Get us an above average pass rush and that stops at least 3 more points a game.
(We stop 3 more points in NY and we could still say MM can't win a close one hehe)

I think Francois gained rep points with that interception. If he hadn't made it, I don't think anybody would be crowing (not saying you are) about how good he's playing.