This man can hit ! LB Vontaze Burfict...The Meanest Man in College.

[woodbuck27]

http://aol.sportingnews.com/ncaa-football/story/2011-07-28/the-meanest-man-in-college-football-vontaze-burfict


The Meanest Man in College Football: Vontaze Burfict


PUBLISHED Thursday, Jul 28, 2011

"A Pac-12 coach calls Vontaze Burfict “deliciously violent.” An NFL scout calls him “what you get after you kick Ray Lewis’ dog.”

[MadScientist]

Seems like he let that article go to his head and seriously regressed last year.

On the field, things aren't much better. Weight fluctuation throughout his Arizona State career have furthered the idea that he's undisciplined, and his play - which was always highlight-reel worthy but lacking in substance - deteriorated as a junior. Watch any YouTube reel of Burfict's, and you're likely to come away impressed, as he made plenty of big hits in his career. Watch him throughout the course of a game, however, and you'll see those hits as the window dressing distracting from a hot-headed kid who struggles to diagnose plays, isn't particularly instinctual, acts tough but doesn't play tough, and who struggles to take on and shed blocks despite being one of the bigger and more athletic players you'll encounter.

Burfict has also been disastrous in the pre-draft evaluation process, even without considering his poor interviews with teams and with reporters. Even though he got down to 248 pounds for the Combine, Burfict still managed unofficial 40-yard dash times of only 4.93 and 5.09 seconds, and was slightly worse than pedestrian in other athletic tests (specifically jumps) and in field drills. He was no better at his pro day, where he managed just 16 bench press reps, was generally terrible in positional drills, and where he was outshone by several lesser-talented teammates.
http://www.buffalorumblings.com/2012/4/9/2935565/2012-nfl-draft-vontaze-burfict-buffalo-bills

Some suggest he may not get drafted, but since he has some talent, a late round flyer might be worth it.

[woodbuck27]

Seems like he let that article go to his head and seriously regressed last year.

http://www.buffalorumblings.com/2012/4/9/2935565/2012-nfl-draft-vontaze-burfict-buffalo-bills

Some suggest he may not get drafted, but since he has some talent, a late round flyer might be worth it.

Yup...that's Lurker64's position as well MadScientist. See Lurker64's MOCK draft (under construction) and posted yesteday.

Some sites have him ranked very high or 'ready to go' early in the second round.

I've seen him ranked in the Pick #140 - #150 range.

[Fritz]

he sounds Burfict for Detroit...

[Lurker64]

He, in all seriousness, probably has an undiagnosed mental illness. He also played amazingly poorly last year, declared for the draft because he wasn't welcome back at Arizona State (his coaches hated him) and handled the pre-draft process as poorly as I've seen.

[smuggler]

He's either crazy or has the worst agent ever. He cost himself millions of dollars by slipping down from rd. 1 to rd. 5-7

[red]

this guy is uncontrollable, and completely insane.

i read in a few places where he screwed up so bad at the combine and at his pro day, that he might go undrafted

[Deputy Nutz]

If he got on some mood control vitamins along with some anti-depressants he might actually be a viable NFL linebacker. Currently he plays the game on and off the field like he has several disorders.

[Joemailman]

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/players/1664141/vontaze-burfict


Burfict has displayed the ability of a first-round prospect, but as an overall package some teams say they won't draft him, period. On the field he flashes excellent instinct and ferocity. He diagnoses and blows up plays with brutish hits, against the run and even as a pass rusher. But he committed so many unnecessary and ill-timed penalties that he was actually kept off the field at times in college. He reportedly even punched a smaller teammate in the locker room.

Last year Burfict led ASU with 68 tackles, but when he failed to make even the conference honorable mention list it was thought that his bad conduct was the reason. At the Combine, scouts wanted questions answered about his maturity and athleticism. He had all the wrong answers. He blamed ASU coaches for his inconsistent 2011 season and then he flopped in workouts, including an unofficial 40-yard time of 5.03 seconds, slowest among linebackers. To be clear, he has the ability to play. It will be interesting to see who gives him a chance and if/how he takes advantage of it.

He'd probably be a great special teams guy. I just don't know if anyone could tame him though to make him a starter on defense.

[smuggler]

No. And this guy will shit up a locker room while he's clamoring to be the starter. There are some people like this, but I'm not sure if it's really a diagnosis, or if it's just extreme cosmetic narcissism and self-centered attitute.

[Fritz]

Too bad Al Davis is gone. This guy is perfect Raiders' material.

But the Lions are the new bad guys, so this is their purview now.

[woodbuck27]

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2011/writers/tony_pauline/10/24/top.50/


Posted: Monday October 24, 2011 1:27PM ; Updated: Monday October 24, 2011 3:22PM


http://i.cdn.turner.com/si/.element/img/4.0/global/writer_headshots/new/tony_pauline.jpg
Tony Pauline>INSIDE THE NFL



Midseason Top 50 draft board


Read more: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2011/writers/tony_pauline/10/24/top.50/index.html#ixzz1rjpYsAuP


" 17. David DeCastro, G, Stanford*: DeCastro looks like a man amongst boys most days and is dominant in every aspect of the game. He's been compared to Olin Kreutz, but will be selected much earlier in the draft than the former All Pro.


18. T.J. McDonald, S, USC*: The next top safety from USC, McDonald is a complete player who defends the run and covers the pass. He lacks classic safety size, but his top-notch ball skills intrigue NFL decision-makers.


19. Devon Still, DT, Penn State: The big defensive lineman can play in a variety of systems and is well thought-of in the scouting community.


** 20. Vontaze Burfict, LB, Arizona State*: When on his game, Burfict is a dominant linebacker who outclasses the opposition in all areas. Unfortunately, the junior is also known as a loose cannon on and off the field, which has raised red flags. **




** Comment woodbuck27:


So what happened to this young man to see his draft stock value drop fr. a projected Round 1 prospect all the way down to a Round 4-7?


Is it a mentle disorder or something else all together?


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vontaze_Burfict#2012_NFL_Draft


( Vontaze) " Burfict entered the NFL Combine rated as the No. 3 inside linebacker, behind Luke Kuechly and Dont'a Hightower, but his "disappointing" performance—he ran a 5.09 sec in the 40-yard dash, slowest among linebackers—caused some analysts to project him as a third day (Rd. 4-7) draft pick." Wikipedia LINK




21. Landry Jones, QB, Oklahoma*: Cool, calm and collected, Landry is a terrific college passer who almost always makes the right decisions on the field. But though the junior is a solid NFL prospect, he's not the can't-miss franchise QB some make him out to be.


22. Devin Taylor, DE-OLB, South Carolina*: Taylor is a gifted prospect who can be a game-changer in the defensive front seven. He's mired in a very mediocre campaign, but can make a big move up boards should he turn it around.


23. Luke Kuechly, LB, Boston College*: Kuechly is tough, instinctive and football smart. He's a terrific run defender, but possesses ordinary size and speed, which will undoubtedly hurt his draft stock.


24. Vinny Curry, DE-OLB, Marshall*: Curry thought long and hard about entering the 2010 draft, but ultimately made the proper call and returned for his senior season. He's a dynamic pass rusher who can line up at defensive end in a conventional scheme or play outside linebacker in a 3-4 alignment. " FR. Article

[Cheesehead Craig]

He'd probably be a great special teams guy. I just don't know if anyone could tame him though to make him a starter on defense.
I don't think he'd want to just play ST and be a backup. Just a train wreck mentally so I don't think he could handle it.

[woodbuck27]

I don't think he'd want to just play ST and be a backup. Just a train wreck mentally so I don't think he could handle it.

You claim that he's 'a train wreck'. Have you met this man? Know anyone that your TRUST that has met him?

Can you seperate 'fact' from fiction (rumor)? Help me out here as I want to know exactly what happened to this man in something less than 2 years.

I'm assuming from your commentary that you have 'the inside scoop ' on Vontaze Burfect'.

Enlighten me... 'us' please.

[MadtownPacker]

Woody, I know you had a rough go around here recently but you aren't being very nice either for jumping all over Cheesehead Craig for stating his opinion.

[Cheesehead Craig]

You claim that he's 'a train wreck'. Have you met this man? Know anyone that your TRUST that has met him?

Can you seperate 'fact' from fiction (rumor)? Help me out here as I want to know exactly what happened to this man in something less than 2 years.

I'm assuming from your commentary that you have 'the inside scoop ' on Vontaze Burfect'.

Enlighten me... 'us' please.
Have YOU met him? Do YOU know "the TRUTH"?

I don't appreciate the talking down that you're doing. Does it make you feel like a big man? Go look at the mirror yourself and take a good look at what kind of person you're being here. What about your post was helpful to those here at Packerrats? Say something constructive or else get off my back. If you imagine that I'm impressed or intimidated by your CRAP... you're sadly mistaken.

[Zool]

This isn't new WB behavior. It's same old same old. But WTF do I know, it's not like I've been here since the start and observe this shit.

Anyway, taking a flier on this guy with a free 7th round pick is fine I suppose. He doesn't seem to be a good locker room guy so it wont happen.

[Fritz]

You claim that he's 'a train wreck'. Have you met this man? Know anyone that your TRUST that has met him?

Can you seperate 'fact' from fiction (rumor)? Help me out here as I want to know exactly what happened to this man in something less than 2 years.

I'm assuming from your commentary that you have 'the inside scoop ' on Vontaze Burfect'.

Enlighten me... 'us' please.


As a matter of fact, I do know a guy - my cousin in New Jersey - who has a friend whose daughter attends Arizona State. Her roommate's best friend (who by the way is related to the Ben-Gals' Sarah Jones) dated Burfict a few times. It turns out he has a slight, pea-sized brain tumor, which presses on his medial-frontal cortex when he doesn't take his tumor-shrinking medication. This alone, however, does not account for his erratic behavior - or so his neurologist has apparently told him, at least according to the roommate's best friend. She also said even when on his meds, he would sometimes strip naked during a full moon and run the concrete steps at Sun Devil Stadium. She also said his penis flopped crazily around, glinting in the moonlight, and Burfict would curse like a sailor, swearing he was going to punch the student-assistant in the kidneys for not bringing him his water quickly enough during breaks and for not participating in the team sing-along after the first practice.

My cousin's friend's daughter's roommate's best friend also says that Burfict is as erratic in the back seat of a car as he is on a football field. Shooting off his mouth is not the only thing he does too quickly, she says.

So there ya go. The inside scoop.

[MadtownPacker]

Thank you Fritz for restoring order!

[Scott Campbell]

Have YOU met him? Do YOU know "the TRUTH"?

I don't appreciate the talking down that you're doing. Does it make you feel like a big man? Go look at the mirror yourself and take a good look at what kind of person you're being here. What about your post was helpful to those here at Packerrats? Say something constructive or else get off my back. If you imagine that I'm impressed or intimidated by your CRAP... you're sadly mistaken.



Well played. :lol:

[Deputy Nutz]

He ran a 5.09 forty what more really needs to be said?

[Scott Campbell]

He ran a 5.09 forty what more really needs to be said?



So where is the disconnect here? All this talk about great closing speed, but even Harlan could run a 5.09 forty.

[Fritz]

Good point, Nutzy. The really fat guy in Im Bruge was really pissed and mean, but he couldn't catch anyone.

[Lurker64]

The following statements are entirely uncontroversial:

1) Burfict flashed dominance in college in 2010, but was guilty of freelancing and had a lot of personal fouls called on him.
2) Contrary to expectations, Burfict played terribly in 2011, and was repeatedly benched for it.
3) At the combine, and at his pro day Burfict displayed athleticism that was far below what was expected or acceptable for a linebacker.
4) Many reports have Burfict's interviews at the combine going very poorly.
5) Overall, the arrow is pointing down.

It is not at all uncommon for a player to be highly rated before the college football season and end up falling precipitously (in terms of his draft stock) by the time the draft occurs. This is the other side to players really coming on in their last year of college ball and getting drafted highly. It's not just Burfict this has happened to. In Todd McShay's initial mock draft dated May 4, 2011 he had Donte Paige-Moss going 6th overall to the Cardinals. Currently Paige-Moss is not in McShay's top 150 (or so) and Rob Rang of CBS Sports has him as the 21st best DE, which puts him as a late round prospect.

[red]

4) Many reports have Burfict's interviews at the combine going very poorly.


from what i've seen and read, that would be putting it nicely

[red]

this is how my favorite draft site puts it.

from draft ace

http://draftace.com/blog/2012/01/11/vontaze-burfict-scouting-report/

" At worst, he’s flat-out dirty; at best, he’s just plain stupid. Either way, Burfict is often a detriment to his team."

[woodbuck27]

Woody, I know you had a rough go around here recently but you aren't being very nice either for jumping all over Cheesehead Craig for stating his opinion.

Mad here is the post your refer to and the post I'm responding to above it:

Originally Posted by Cheesehead Craig http://packerrats.com/images/buttons/viewpost-right.png (http://packerrats.com/showthread.php?p=662096#post662096)
I don't think he'd want to just play ST and be a backup. Just a train wreck mentally so I don't think he could handle it.

"You claim that he's 'a train wreck'. Have you met this man? Know anyone that your TRUST that has met him?
Can you seperate 'fact' from fiction (rumor)? Help me out here as I want to know exactly what happened to this man in something less than 2 years.
I'm assuming from your commentary that you have 'the inside scoop ' on Vontaze Burfect'.
Enlighten me... 'us' please." woodbuck27

Mad:

Your position is that my post isn't nice. If that's the case I disagree. I've a side of me that I will not allow that certainly 'isn't nice'.

That post to Cheesehead Craig is nothing even remotely NOT vaild in terms of my interest in trying to learn something about this once highly touted prospect. My interest in Vontaze Burfict is now clearly centered on why? Why he's fallen from grace. Falllen in terms of his once lofty draft staus to possibly not being draftable.

The focus of this thread....... as I would enjoy seeing it. Isn't on any poster here. It certainly isn't on Cheesehead Craig or any other poster that can't contribute something entirely focused on the question.

Back to your concern Mad.

Is there really anything even remotely unmannerly in my post to Cheessehead Craig? Is my post outside of what's considered mannerly or ethical? Please?

Now look carefully at how members here post me. Do you have time for that? Be truly honest with yourself as you examine this to see if there's a difference in my manner of posting Vs some members here. Can you find the time?

There's the rub.

You don't have the time to deal with the CRAP that some members here choose to push onto this forum. It's posters like me that must deal with these clowns; go on hiatus or leave Packerrats permanantly.

How many good posters. People that really contribute have we lost because of these 'rotten attitude people' that love to gang up on a poster with their judgementle ridiculing insensative stinking ways.They smell shit and love it. They hang on the dirtiest street corners of Packerrats. These are the haters and the absolutely most ignorant and insulting posters we have here. These are the people that would stab you in the back so fast; your stupid if you turn sideways to them.

Those posters....create a monster out of really 'little to nothing'. Personally....I've never seen such a bunch of sissys... drama queens 'no CAPS'. These are the posters here that can dish it out; but for 'the sake of Job', don't ever come back with anything. You have to just take...take ...take it. Take their rotten manners and need to stir up trouble.

You have to wither like a caterpiller when these fellas piss on you. Ohh don't stand in for yourself. Ohh be Jaysus that's just not acceptable. That becomes a ... " Look at Woody ... the CRAZY Canuck."

Mad and all of you at Packerrats....I'm not crazy. I'm not even remotely close to not being able to handle this garbage these posters get away with here. Their IMO mostly out to lunch and incapable of understanding the real issues and how I'm tring my best to be a [positively contributing member. These fellas are salivating to get a few licks in on me and what does that amount to but pain for Packerrats.


I'm not suggesting that Cheesehead Craig is among that group. I don't name these posters as their obvious and 'only attract their kind. Am I a poster here that whines to you about anything? I take care of my own affairs Mad. I take em on one at a time and capably so. This latest barrage isn't any more challenging...hahaaha. (-:

RE: Cheeseheasd Craig:

If my response to him is one that could even remotely be judged by him and any other member of Packerrats as unkind or intimidating....they should be looking out the window of 'my house'. Maybe that member might try to deal with 'a sensativity issue'.

Time after time I have to deal with what is clearly defined as bullshit from where I come from from. Bullshit... innocuous claims against me from noone who's ever met me; but in the clearest sense are insults and FLAMES. I deal with that garbage. What makes me strong?

I clearly understand why they get away with forcing their CRAP down my throat. Why their behaviour is condoned.

Mad....You certainly know me. You know that they do NOT threaten me.

If my post to Cheesehead Craig affronts his ego. I recommend the following;

Being sensative is challenging. There are plenty of 'self help' books out there that are available to read and learn from.

Mad I'm sick of posters here coming to packerrats with litle more to offer this Green Bay Packer HOME. This NFL Team site with litel that's overall positive to contribute but derision, insults and stirr the pot sicko attitudes. I'm tired of posters unfamiliar with the way it has to be done criticizing what is done exactly right.

I'm really sick of the 'piss assed attitude' of any poater that can jump into a thread and try to command attention that's off topic. I realize some of us are guilty of that but lately it's become just ridiculous in terms of the extent of that lousy way of dealing with an issue.

As always I'm a member here that's totally prepared to do all I can to help make Packerrats GREAT.

What can I do....short of bending over and taking it up .................. ?

[MadtownPacker]

Fair enough. You have been treated wrong at times and I have admitted as much to you. But CC was just stating HIS OPINION on the topic. Was it backed up by an article? I guess not even though lots of sources say this dude is a POS. It was just his thoughts. That why we are here man. He didnt come crying to me, he even responded to you well IMO. I just hate to see things dissolve to the point where opinions are spit on. You know how it feels so why would you do it to someone else?

[woodbuck27]

Have YOU met him? Do YOU know "the TRUTH"?

I don't appreciate the talking down that you're doing. Does it make you feel like a big man? Go look at the mirror yourself and take a good look at what kind of person you're being here. What about your post was helpful to those here at Packerrats? Say something constructive or else get off my back. If you imagine that I'm impressed or intimidated by your CRAP... you're sadly mistaken.

Cool man. I couldn't help notice some familiarity in your post and funny how the issue of plagerism is coming to the forefront here. Not a problem with me CC.

Then reading your post a couple of times. I realizse that you and I are exactly on the same page. Welcome aboard. I appreciate it man. Can you help keep this thread on task (TOPIC)? I really appreciate that.

[woodbuck27]

He ran a 5.09 forty what more really needs to be said?

You don't take any time to consider why he ran that 5.09 40 yard dash? I want to know what happened to that man on that day Deputy Nutz. What has been happening to that man? I believe there's something for us to learn here centering on this once so highly touted prospect.

It's not enough for me to just read posts her likie...'Ohh he was crazy (went crazY) or insane or has Bi-Polor Disorder or Borderline Personality Disorder or has this or that mentle illness'. What are the facts concerning such claims or rumors
RE: Vontaze Burfict Vs 'a reality'?

That's where I desire to have this thread focused. Thanks. (-:

GO PACKERS !

[Cheesehead Craig]

Cool man. I couldn't help notice some familiarity in your post and funny how the issue of plagerism is coming to the forefront here. Not a problem with me CC.

Then reading your post a couple of times. I realizse that you and I are exactly on the same page. Welcome aboard. I appreciate it man. Can you help keep this thread on task (TOPIC)? I really appreciate that.

I wasn't offended at all by your post. I just felt like quoting you and see if you would recognize it.

[Cheesehead Craig]

As a matter of fact, I do know a guy - my cousin in New Jersey - who has a friend whose daughter attends Arizona State. Her roommate's best friend (who by the way is related to the Ben-Gals' Sarah Jones) dated Burfict a few times. It turns out he has a slight, pea-sized brain tumor, which presses on his medial-frontal cortex when he doesn't take his tumor-shrinking medication. This alone, however, does not account for his erratic behavior - or so his neurologist has apparently told him, at least according to the roommate's best friend. She also said even when on his meds, he would sometimes strip naked during a full moon and run the concrete steps at Sun Devil Stadium. She also said his penis flopped crazily around, glinting in the moonlight, and Burfict would curse like a sailor, swearing he was going to punch the student-assistant in the kidneys for not bringing him his water quickly enough during breaks and for not participating in the team sing-along after the first practice.

My cousin's friend's daughter's roommate's best friend also says that Burfict is as erratic in the back seat of a car as he is on a football field. Shooting off his mouth is not the only thing he does too quickly, she says.

So there ya go. The inside scoop.

You had me at "penis flopped crazily around, glinting in the moonlight"

[woodbuck27]

Fair enough. You have been treated wrong at times and I have admitted as much to you. But CC was just stating HIS OPINION on the topic. Was it backed up by an article? I guess not even though lots of sources say this dude is a POS. It was just his thoughts. That why we are here man. He didnt come crying to me, he even responded to you well IMO. I just hate to see things dissolve to the point where opinions are spit on. You know how it feels so why would you do it to someone else?


I posted Cheesehead Craig with certain manners. Manners that should be acceptable. I do call him out in terms of his claims Vs Vontaze Burfict in respect to what CC has that supports his judgement on Vontaze Burfict. Is it your position Mad that it's not in good taste at Packerrats for me or any other poster here to request 'call out' another poster RE: backing him/herself up as concerns a stated position.

Must I simply accept all that any poster posts?

This isn't anything RE: ' Geee poor me ..I'm being mistreated.' I'm used to the CRAP Mad. I've always dealt with their CRAP. Sometimes posters here see it my way but I never ask anyone here to come to my aid. You know that's the TRUTH.

RE: Cheesehead Craig and any issue with me. I certianly don't ponder what he takes to you or not.

I react to the post Mad. Not 'the poster'. I can't even imagine many of us here at Packerrats is 'qualified' to make a mentle assessment of Vontaze Burfict. I have seen a post fron Fritz that is interesting and I'm trying to wade out to read it again without the fricken aligators chompin' at my ass.

Mad don't let this get to you. We'll work it out. Greater minds and well spirited peope will prevail.

See this should never come down to anything woodbuck27 Vs MadtownPacker. Tha's 'just what some here salivate' to get it to. Mad simply shuuusssshh them away.

Again and read my previous post. I do not imagine or infer that Chesehead Craig is one of them. The TRUTH now?

Don't alow them to get to you Mad. WE CAN WORK THIS OUT. We meaning 'Packerrats' and that is bigger than 'a pack of hooligans' and their never changing attitudes and self preserving ways.

Mad .Let's be just this way man............. c o o l. (-:

GO PACK GO !

[woodbuck27]

I wasn't offended at all by your post. I just felt like quoting you and see if you would recognize it.

Yes well I knw who i am. I certainly recall what I write when I wrote it not so long ago. (-:

[woodbuck27]

this is how my favorite draft site puts it.

from draft ace

http://draftace.com/blog/2012/01/11/vontaze-burfict-scouting-report/

" At worst, he’s flat-out dirty; at best, he’s just plain stupid. Either way, Burfict is often a detriment to his team."

Thanks red. I'm a little tied up here but look forward to reading that soon.

[woodbuck27]

As a matter of fact, I do know a guy - my cousin in New Jersey - who has a friend whose daughter attends Arizona State. Her roommate's best friend (who by the way is related to the Ben-Gals' Sarah Jones) dated Burfict a few times. It turns out he has a slight, pea-sized brain tumor, which presses on his medial-frontal cortex when he doesn't take his tumor-shrinking medication. This alone, however, does not account for his erratic behavior - or so his neurologist has apparently told him, at least according to the roommate's best friend. She also said even when on his meds, he would sometimes strip naked during a full moon and run the concrete steps at Sun Devil Stadium. She also said his penis flopped crazily around, glinting in the moonlight, and Burfict would curse like a sailor, swearing he was going to punch the student-assistant in the kidneys for not bringing him his water quickly enough during breaks and for not participating in the team sing-along after the first practice.

My cousin's friend's daughter's roommate's best friend also says that Burfict is as erratic in the back seat of a car as he is on a football field. Shooting off his mouth is not the only thing he does too quickly, she says.

So there ya go. The inside scoop.


All 'Righty Then' I recomment that we hire Jim Carey to investigate this story for verification.

Mad ..... do we have 'the $ funds $'? Jim doesn't come cheap. He's Canadian.

[woodbuck27]

Hey Mad it's this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RWWMO--pVKs&feature=endscreen&NR=1

You cannot 'ever' put 'a good man' down. (-:

woodbuck27..... My name is Ed.

GO PACK GO !

[Scott Campbell]

Mad and all of you at Packerrats....I'm not crazy.

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_GJE8MjSmTUk/Rq4q8O-v8qI/AAAAAAAAAB8/-AL1ZO56GdI/s400/grumpy%2Bold%2Bman.jpg

[woodbuck27]

I don't need to read a Scott Campbell post. I can easily imagine it's lack of genuine wit and decency. It's 'low life' attempt at humour at another person's expense.

I always feel sad for Scott Campbell. He can never get his gun clear of his holster.

'Damn! Shot myself in the foot again' ...Scott Campbell.

Scott Campbell again demonstrates his sparse wisdom combined with a weakened state of constitution to demonstrate just what 'Public Relations' isn't.

Scott Campbell always reminding me of 'a lesser form of the pesky black fly' we often 'spit out' up here in Canada.

You cannot ignore em....when their around and they will always be around.

SO YOU 'just' IGNORE HIM.

[Scott Campbell]

I don't need to read a Scott Campbell post. I can easily imagine it's lack of genuine wit and decency. It's 'low life' attempt at humour at another person's expense.

I always feel sad for Scott Campbell. He can never get his gun clear of his holster.

'Damn! Shot myself in the foot again' ...Scott Campbell.

Scott Campbell again demonstrates his sparse wisdom combined with a weakened state of constitution to demonstrate just what 'Public Relations' isn't.

Scott Campbell always reminding me of 'a lesser form of the pesky black fly' we often 'spit out' up here in Canada.

You cannot ignore em....when their around and they will always be around.

SO YOU 'just' IGNORE HIM.



Nice job! :lol:

[woodbuck27]

Hi Scott. Have a lovely day. (-:

Ohh...

My 'side of the street'. It's generally 'the sunny side'; often very nice over here.

[woodbuck27]

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000d5d8283a774/article/report-browns-interested-in-lb-vontaze-burfict-?module=HP11_around-the-league

Report: Browns interested in LB Vontaze Burfict




By Marc Sessler NFL.com
Writer
Published: April 11, 2012 at 11:46 a.m.
Updated: April 11, 2012 at 01:01 p.m.
Comment woodbuck27: ** I'll follow up on this as it may change as sometimes what appears to be 'a TRUTH' is otherwise 'just' rumour.** 2 Updates on Thurs. 12 April 2012. woodbuck27

I noted this portion of the article:

Burfict generated negative press in 2011 for a locker-room scuffle with teammate Kevin Ozier, a wide receiver. I sat in on a conversation with Burfict (http://blogs.nfl.com/2012/02/26/burfict-wont-table-talk-about-his-on-field-off-field-run-ins/) at the combine where he said he learned from the incident. In the same conversation, Burfict cast blame on his college coaches for an "average" junior season.

"The coaches kind of messed me up, like, I didn’t know if I was going to start a game, I didn't know if I was going to be benched," Burfict said. "So, it hurt me at times, but I tried to fight through it." Fr. Article


woodbuck27:

It might be best for this man to 'just' hope he gets drafted. I believe that he once at least 'flashed' the certain skill and tools it might take to contribute positively to an NFL team willing to take a chance with him.It would more than likely come form a teaqm suchas 'the Browns' that has a lot of picks in this draft. They have one more than our twelve. The draft is serious business and no team should waste 'a pick'. Every pick has to be carefully considered as valuable to that teams future. IMO one of the most valid reasons for electing to pick any prospect is that man's attitude,charactern and possible ability to contribute overall to a team in and out of the locker rom. On and off the field.

Can that pick contribute to 'the leadership' of any team?

A team such as 'the BROWNS' may one day really decide he's worth 'a risk'; but IMO must examine that risk with due prudence. They should talk to that man. There's certain advantage in really meeting a person.

************************************************** ********************************************

** Update: **:

http://www.rotoworld.com/content/playerpages/playerbreakingnews.asp?sport=NFL&id=7435&line=231362&spln=1

************************************************** *********************************************

** Update: **

http://www.sbnation.com/2012-nfl-draft/2012/4/11/2941136/nfl-draft-2012-cleveland-browns-vontaze-burfict

GO PACKERS !

[Scott Campbell]

Am I a poster here that whines to you (Madtown) about anything?



Errrrr.......yes. Constantly.


Or was that supposed to be one of those rhetorical question thingies?

[Fritz]

All 'Righty Then' I recomment that we hire Jim Carey to investigate this story for verification.

Mad ..... do we have 'the $ funds $'? Jim doesn't come cheap. He's Canadian.


"Jim/ Jim Carrey? This is Madtown. We'd like to hire you here at Packerrats to investigate a flopping-penis allegation against a former College football player. Whaddya say?"

[woodbuck27]

"Jim/ Jim Carrey? This is Madtown. We'd like to hire you here at Packerrats to investigate a flopping-penis allegation against a former College football player. Whaddya say?"

Can't you see Jimmo scratchin' his head and with that weird 'The Joker' smile responding:

"OK Mad thanks so much for calling me in. I'll get back to yaa pronto. I just have to check out my wardrobe closet. I'll beeeee underrrrrcoverrrr 'of courrrrse'. Seeeee yaaa !"

[woodbuck27]

Errrrr.......yes. Constantly.


Or was that supposed to be one of those rhetorical question thingies?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paranoia

NO Scott. I act in terms of myself I don't load CRAP on Mad's plate. Sometimes it gets there but it's not there because of an intentional stab at a member here in the manner in which you FLAME constantly.

It's never there because you or any other member here can intimadate me. You've known me long enough to realize that's the TRUTH.

[woodbuck27]

http://www.csnwashington.com/04/09/12/Burfict-back-in-the-picture/landing.html?blockID=685560&feedID=6703

“He just hasn’t tested well; he hasn’t performed well in the measuring sticks off the field. It happens from time to time. Guys do fall,” Ravens college scouting director Joe Hortiz said last week at the team’s pre-draft luncheon. “It’s just he’s a junior who came out with a lot of buzz and he’s had such a hard time that the media is swallowing it up and eating it and running with it. It happens, but this one seems a little bit more magnified.”

But an interesting happened when Burfict’s name came up at the pre-draft event. Erc DeCosta, the team’s (Ravens) director of player personnel, jumped into the conversation.

“What I would say is we don’t drop him (in the rankings); you (media) guys drop him.

We watch the tape, and we know where they belong,” DeCosta said.

“We look at all the various things and say, ‘That’s crazy. That’s never going to happen.’ And usually it ends up that way, but we just watch the tape. We don’t have any kind of a flowing list where a guy goes from being second in the draft to being 100th in the draft overnight. Nobody knows, but it doesn’t work like that for us.”

I’m hearing that to mean that while Burfict might have fallen to a third-round prospect, don’t discount the possibility of the Ravens grabbing him at that slot as a classic “value” pick, a guy with first-round talent whose stock dropped for reasons ...

that might not matter once he is playing in the NFL." Article

Comment woodbuck27:

There is where I'm trying to get to Packerrats in terms of this thread. This particular once dominant National College talent. This Super First Round Pick>>>>>> to the cellar. Why? That didn't make sense to me. I need to know why? If I know that I can factor that mkan in or out of my plans. That's all that makes sense to me.

Talent and production is just what it is? If you can get this man and pay attention to why? he blows or why? he ran a slow 40 yard time?

You might have a really incredible asset for your team. I'm not here informing you 'that's the case'. I'm just informing you that any of the ...'well he's CRAZY so forget him' commentary doesn't work for me. That's unacceptable in terms of me needing to know.

[MadScientist]

I get the bad-ass nature that you like about him. He definitely has that, and it is a good thing to have in a LB. Haven't seen it around here since Wayne Simmons. The problem is the red flags. Enough that it is a huge risk to take him early. His production was down considerably last year, in large part because his coaches couldn't trust him. Because of that the combine was very important for him. Had he prepped better and put up better numbers then his stock would not have dropped so much. Because his numbers were not good that will make some concerned that he is not as talented as the initial impressions were. The bad interviews suggest that the problem was more him than his coaches, so there is a real risk that the NFL coaches won't be enough to mold him correctly. If I were a GM I would start considering him in from the 5th round on. That's a good place to start with the hit and miss prospects. He could be the next Ray Lewis, but he could also easily be the next training camp cut.

Not that there is nothing to indicate that the Baltmore guy actually has a high or even mid-round grade on the guy, you can read his statement several ways.

[Joemailman]

I wouldn't mind taking him in the 5th or later. Just tell Greene to knock the shit out of him if he gets out of line. You never know if being surrounded by players with more stature than him might cause an attitude adjustment.

[Deputy Nutz]

You don't take any time to consider why he ran that 5.09 40 yard dash? I want to know what happened to that man on that day Deputy Nutz. What has been happening to that man? I believe there's something for us to learn here centering on this once so highly touted prospect.

It's not enough for me to just read posts her likie...'Ohh he was crazy (went crazY) or insane or has Bi-Polor Disorder or Borderline Personality Disorder or has this or that mentle illness'. What are the facts concerning such claims or rumors
RE: Vontaze Burfict Vs 'a reality'?
That's where I desire to have this thread focused. Thanks. (-:


GO FAVRE!

I took the time to recognize the 5.09 forty is average for a defensive linemen, 5.09 forty for a linebacker means he is slow, regardless of his mental handicaps. He wasn't vastly overweight, he didn't report any injuries, and he chose to run regardless if he was injured or not.

They guy crapped out, and that can't be changed, he is talented, but he failed the most important test of his life at the combine, what does that tell you? He can't handle the pressure? He cracked up? He has a psychological disorders that he is not seeking the appropriate help with? Seems like another case of wasted talent, even if that talent can only run a 5.09 forty.

I was a big fan of his, but his play on the field was a chaotic mess, even in 2010, he would test his instincts too much. what happens in the NFL when he doesn't like his coaches? Is he going to free lance, and play like a retard? He isn't special enough to draft at this point. If he would have at least passed the physical test at the combine then he would at least be intriguing, right now he is just a failure. Janoris Jenkins is a criminal that has 4 children with 3 different women, he is a loser, but at least he is intriguing because he proved he has the tools to perform on the field.

[Lurker64]

There is where I'm trying to get to Packerrats in terms of this thread. This particular once dominant National College talent. This Super First Round Pick>>>>>> to the cellar. Why? That didn't make sense to me. I need to know why? If I know that I can factor that mkan in or out of my plans. That's all that makes sense to me.

Talent and production is just what it is? If you can get this man and pay attention to why? he blows or why? he ran a slow 40 yard time?

You might have a really incredible asset for your team. I'm not here informing you 'that's the case'. I'm just informing you that any of the ...'well he's CRAZY so forget him' commentary doesn't work for me. That's unacceptable in terms of me needing to know.

I think what honestly what DeCosta really means is "we didn't get as excited about his 2010 tape as you guys did. Sure, he made some plays splashy plays, and that's what the media pays attention to, but he also freelanced, was out of position a lot, and made a lot of stupid mistakes. The 2011 tape wasn't good either, since he freelanced, played stupid, and also played timid. I mean, if he was as good a player as the media thought going into 2011, he wouldn't have gotten benched by his coaches as often as he did, right?"

Which is to say, the Ravens aren't dropping him because he had a bad combine, the Ravens likely already had him down around where he's ranked before the combine.

Since sure, he had a terrible combine and that alone shouldn't torpedo you, but some combination of "bad combine", "bad interviews", "bad 2011 tape" and "his coaches hated him" is going to indicate some problems with a prospect.

This is a key difference between media scouts and actual scouts. Media scouts don't hate anybody, because they work in the media and don't want to damage their relationship (or their employers' relationship) with any player in case that guy turns out to be great. Actual scouts hate almost everybody, since it's basically their job to figure out why a guy is a bum, since the overwhelming majority of the players they look at will not be drafted by the team that employs them. If you've ever talked to one, you will know that they can be ornery cusses, since "being opinionated" is a plus in this business (for example professional scout, who has worked for the Packers, Dave-Te Thomas hates Perry, Poe, Still, and doesn't like Upshaw.) No one who works at ESPN in a draft capacity will admit to disliking all four of those guys, at least not on camera.

[Cheesehead Craig]

Another story of a guy with a million dollar body but a 2 cent head. There's been loads of those throughout the years in every sport. Why they are that way who knows, but it's not like this guy is some anomily.

[woodbuck27]

I get the bad-ass nature that you like about him. He definitely has that, and it is a good thing to have in a LB. Haven't seen it around here since Wayne Simmons. The problem is the red flags. Enough that it is a huge risk to take him early. His production was down considerably last year, in large part because his coaches couldn't trust him. Because of that the combine was very important for him. Had he prepped better and put up better numbers then his stock would not have dropped so much. Because his numbers were not good that will make some concerned that he is not as talented as the initial impressions were. The bad interviews suggest that the problem was more him than his coaches, so there is a real risk that the NFL coaches won't be enough to mold him correctly. If I were a GM I would start considering him in from the 5th round on. That's a good place to start with the hit and miss prospects. He could be the next Ray Lewis, but he could also easily be the next training camp cut.

Not that there is nothing to indicate that the Baltmore guy actually has a high or even mid-round grade on the guy, you can read his statement several ways.

I would simply get that fella in for a workout. I want him to run faster than what 5.09 Seconds in the 40 yard sprint. This fella ..that position. I don't even spend a minute wondering about some slow timed speed wherever. he's in now for me to look at. I certainly believe by now or because he's in Green Bay that we both know he will motor. He'd better motor. If he doesn't then lunch will be simple.

After the workout and lunch maybe a stroll in a park with loads of pedestrian traffic. Don't forget the muzzle!?

Nope don't need that caution....unless I observe him filing his teeth.

Then....take Mr. Burfict out for some decent food and maybe a beer or two. Ask him if he had any preference for some later entertainment ie bowling/maybe shoot some stick? Get him to bed a tad late. Give him an alarm clock.

Inform him of the morning workout 'in pads'. Get him salivating that Mike Mccarthy will be in attendance and wants to belly bump with him. See if he has......a sense of humour.

Yup ! Vontaze....up at 9 AM. Hangover!?? Too bad ...so sad. Wanna be a PACKER?

Ask him how he enjoyed yesterday in Green Bay? Ask him all kinds of questions to see his cool.

Ask him about his family and Friends. Any 'Special relationships' questions are 'off limits'. Sorry Fritz.

Has he ever imagined being a Green Pay Packer? Does he know anything about Packer history and who was Vince Lombardi? Ask him to finish the sentence..."Show me a good loser and ...."

Get him some lunch ...some really spicy food. Tacos might get there if there's a half decent Mexican joint in The County....

Maybe a couple of hot dogs 'all dresed' as well. This boy looks like he can eat hahaaha.... ' DO NOT'.... SERVE HIM anything raw...like Sushi ....OK fish might be fine... but RARE Steak with lots of blood running all over his plate and drippin' off his chin...NOPE! We do NOT need to see that........ ever !

and .....well again.... feed him a couple of beers. Maybe a shooter or two something like...tee kill yaa. Then observe him...quietly and unassumedly ........observe him.

I would check this man out !!! If he checked out A..OK. Then I would inform him that 'the Green Bay Packers' have an interest in him and >>> 'just' demonstrated that TRUTH.

I would compare this man to many many others including those I might draft in rounds 1-3. Really it comes down to limiting RISK. It has sweet 'D' all to do with media driven hype 'positive or negative'. Ignore the bullshit.

It comes down to ...YOU the GM or Scout or Head of Player Personal or the Special Assistant 'to whatever' and >>> giving every prospect you might have a real interst in:

A FAIR SHAKE !

By the way I'm not high on this possible prospect. I'm 'only really interested' in Votaze Burfict 'the human being'...the person. I would show an interest in him if he was on my radar as a possible prospect.

Maybe I will keen up on Vontaze Burfict the LBer and 2012 Draft prospect if i could assess him more deservedly.

[woodbuck27]

I wouldn't mind taking him in the 5th or later. Just tell Greene to knock the shit out of him if he gets out of line. You never know if being surrounded by players with more stature than him might cause an attitude adjustment.

Just walking into Lambeu Field will cause an attitude adjustment as long as he recently visited the mens room he shoud be OK for about 45 minutes before he gets the shits again.

[woodbuck27]

I took the time to recognize the 5.09 forty is average for a defensive linemen, 5.09 forty for a linebacker means he is slow, regardless of his mental handicaps. He wasn't vastly overweight, he didn't report any injuries, and he chose to run regardless if he was injured or not.

They guy crapped out, and that can't be changed, he is talented, but he failed the most important test of his life at the combine, what does that tell you? He can't handle the pressure? He cracked up? He has a psychological disorders that he is not seeking the appropriate help with? Seems like another case of wasted talent, even if that talent can only run a 5.09 forty.

I was a big fan of his, but his play on the field was a chaotic mess, even in 2010, he would test his instincts too much. what happens in the NFL when he doesn't like his coaches? Is he going to free lance, and play like a retard? He isn't special enough to draft at this point. If he would have at least passed the physical test at the combine then he would at least be intriguing, right now he is just a failure. Janoris Jenkins is a criminal that has 4 children with 3 different women, he is a loser, but at least he is intriguing because he proved he has the tools to perform on the field.

Good post Deputy. Your saying that based on your honest assessment of Vontaze Burfict that he's NOT worth future consideration.You back up why? you came to that conclusion. Nice job.

[Fritz]

But you can't assess him more deservedly, Wood. None of us can. You'd have to be an actual scout, watch hours and hours of film, talk to the guy's coaches, talk to friends and acquantances, and talk to the guy himself. You'd have to watch him at the combine or at his pro day, having also watched dozens and dozens of other guys playing the same position. You'd have to talk with other scouts from other regions and compare notes.

That's why Thompson - and the Ravens scout - are correct when they say most of us, including the so-called experts like Mike MayCock or SMell Pipejob, don't know a damn thing about how players are actually assessed.

[woodbuck27]

" If you've ever talked to one, you will know that they can be ornery cusses, since "being opinionated" is a plus in this business (for example professional scout, who has worked for the Packers, Dave-Te Thomas hates Perry, Poe, Still, and doesn't like Upshaw.) No one who works at ESPN in a draft capacity will admit to disliking all four of those guys, at least not on camera. " Lurker64

There is the kind of reporting that IMO makes Packerrats awesome and backs up my feeling that we have some of the very BEST NFL fans of any internet site.

Let's make it better Packerrats. Let's GROW.

[woodbuck27]

But you can't assess him more deservedly, Wood. None of us can. You'd have to be an actual scout, watch hours and hours of film, talk to the guy's coaches, talk to friends and acquantances, and talk to the guy himself. You'd have to watch him at the combine or at his pro day, having also watched dozens and dozens of other guys playing the same position. You'd have to talk with other scouts from other regions and compare notes.

That's why Thompson - and the Ravens scout - are correct when they say most of us, including the so-called experts like Mike MayCock or SMell Pipejob, don't know a damn thing about how players are actually assessed.


Exactly Fritz and in this thread like many others. When we focus on the key issue (s) We can arrive at a conclusion in concert here. It damn hard to do that when some clown offers no more than peanut shells.

I'm fun .... I'm also serious. I'm serious about the health of the Packers. I don't want to have to wait ** another 14 seasons before they get to another Super Bowl Championship. In 14 years my time in the 40 yard sprint will likely be in the 5.09 seconds range. Isn't that ridiculous ! I 'only' weigh in at about 182 lbs.

** I don't ever imagine that TT can accomplish enough to get that done this season but maybe? in three. I hope so. If TT takes longer than 3 seasons I still won't hate him. I promise.

[MadScientist]

Few more tidbits. He did manage to improve his 40 times at a workout on March 30th to ~4.8, so he is not hideously slow, but not all that fast. He did not do the 3 cone or shuttle at the combine (which seem to be TT's preferred numbers). At the pro-day on March 16th he did about 16 reps on the press, and reportedly did poorly in the position drills.

I don't see anything else to be gained by bringing him in for a workout. There just isn't that much more to learn since they've had several chances to see him and interview him if they wanted to (I don't have any list of who the Packers interviewed at the combine). TT usually reserves the limited number of allowed private workouts for 7th round to UFA's that they haven't had a good chance to see in person. Given the Packers success with the UFA's, I wouldn't want that to change.

[Lurker64]

This is worth a look on Burfict: http://brophyfootball.blogspot.com/2012/03/dusting-off-cobwebs-of-this-thing.html

[woodbuck27]

But you can't assess him more deservedly, Wood. None of us can. You'd have to be an actual scout, watch hours and hours of film, talk to the guy's coaches, talk to friends and acquantances, and talk to the guy himself. You'd have to watch him at the combine or at his pro day, having also watched dozens and dozens of other guys playing the same position. You'd have to talk with other scouts from other regions and compare notes.

That's why Thompson - and the Ravens scout - are correct when they say most of us, including the so-called experts like Mike MayCock or SMell Pipejob, don't know a damn thing about how players are actually assessed.

Fritz:

I've been thinking about this post since I first read it. It took me to school. Thanks.

[pbmax]

This is worth a look on Burfict: http://brophyfootball.blogspot.com/2012/03/dusting-off-cobwebs-of-this-thing.html

That video of him versus Wisconsin is a good example of why the highlight videos can be misleading.

[woodbuck27]

This is worth a look on Burfict: http://brophyfootball.blogspot.com/2012/03/dusting-off-cobwebs-of-this-thing.html

Thanks Lurker64...this is a good find.

http://brophyfootball.blogspot.ca/2012/03/dusting-off-cobwebs-of-this-thing.html

"The definition of production at the position is directly relational to the player’s competency in fundamentals (position, leverage, tackling, hustle, etc). The player here (#7 - Vontaze Burfict) routinely stays blocked, misses tackles, fails to anticipate routes as they develop around him, and worst of all, just flat out gives up if he’s not immediately around the ball." brophyfootball.blogspot.ca

"If we’re not judging players (in The Draft or on the field) for what they can produce,

then we’re just bullshitting ourselves….." brophyfootball.blogspot.ca

So Packerrats watch this video. see what you discover. Do you 'simply' believe the author? What is your opinion?

Give Mr. Vontaze Burfict 'a fair shake'. Is he blocked out of plays? Yes he is and that's the job of the Wisconsin Badgers offense 'to target this inside LBer'. Is it unusual to be blocked?

Is he always running 'a high motor'even when he's not where the ball is? No ! Does he knows when to pace himself. He's not killing himself when he likely can't make a difference. Is that a serious fault considering the role he must play for his defense?

The question I ask myself as I view this video is whether he's generally in the action..'in the game' Vs just taking up space or lloooking lost on the field? Does he try to and 'in fact' make plays? Does he block running lanes and make solo and assisted tackles? Does he ever put bressure on the QB or penetrate the offensive backfield?

Do you 'see no merit' in ever considering Vontaze Burfict as a contributor to our teams defense based in what you observe viewing this video? I'll warn you this video covers the entire Badgers Vs Sun Devils game and it's length is 30:03.

I'm stil assessing it to make up my mind if the autor of the BLOG is serious or pulling my leg. That's just the kind of fellow I am. My own person. Careful ...as I determine a position that's 'just' my own.

[woodbuck27]

That video of him versus Wisconsin is a good example of why the highlight videos can be misleading.


pbmax...based on what you see in this video does Vontaze Burfict look like a terrible choice as an ILB prospect? I'm not putting you on 'the spot here'. I'm just interested in what your analysis is of him overall in this game?

[pbmax]

pbmax...based on what you see in this video does Vontaze Burfict look like a terrible choice as an ILB prospect? I'm not putting you on 'the spot here'. I'm just interested in what your analysis is of him overall in this game?

I have a history of being completely incorrect in trying to judge who will be able to make the leap to the pros. So take this with a grain of salt.

Play after play he is slow to get out of his stance (slower than other backers) and then waltzes into his gap. He does engage blockers, but only long enough to see where the RB is going. If the running back heads to a different gap, he stops and walks around. I did not see enough coverage to make any kind of guess. A middle linebacker who offers no assistance or pursuit is pretty useless. I don't remember enough about the game to know whether this tape is sequential or a lowlights package.

In terms more familiar to me, he looks like the kid who declares that he will be the free safety when you play a game of pickup football. 5 on 5 or 7 on 7, this guy decides he wants to free lance and leave a player uncovered. He is uninterested in actually playing to help the team win, he wants to deliver a kill shot somewhere, headed downhill, and is putting that agenda ahead of the team.

I have seen this kid twice, so nothing here can be taken as authoritative. But the terms uninterested and selfish do come to mind.

[woodbuck27]

I have a history of being completely incorrect in trying to judge who will be able to make the leap to the pros. So take this with a grain of salt.

Play after play he is slow to get out of his stance (slower than other backers) and then waltzes into his gap. He does engage blockers, but only long enough to see where the RB is going. If the running back heads to a different gap, he stops and walks around. I did not see enough coverage to make any kind of guess. A middle linebacker who offers no assistance or pursuit is pretty useless. I don't remember enough about the game to know whether this tape is sequential or a lowlights package.

In terms more familiar to me, he looks like the kid who declares that he will be the free safety when you play a game of pickup football. 5 on 5 or 7 on 7, this guy decides he wants to free lance and leave a player uncovered. He is uninterested in actually playing to help the team win, he wants to deliver a kill shot somewhere, headed downhill, and is putting that agenda ahead of the team.

I have seen this kid twice, so nothing here can be taken as authoritative. But the terms uninterested and selfish do come to mind.

Thanks. I'm cautious in making up my mind but I will be back on this. I did notice he seems a bit one tracked minded and that he can come in a bit late on some plays....tackles. I question his intelligence as his play translates to that.

[woodbuck27]

http://espn.go.com/college-football/team/_/id/9/arizona-state-sun-devils

2011 Arizona State Sun Devils Schedule

They started out 5-1 and 6-2 and lost their last four games to finish the 2011 season at 6-6.

How did ILB Vontaze Burfict contribute to those four end of season loss's?

By the way that game Vs the Wisconsin Badgers came on 18 Sept. 2010. RECAP and Box Score for that 20-19 Badger win:

http://scores.espn.go.com/ncf/recap?gameId=302610275

http://scores.espn.go.com/ncf/boxscore?gameId=302610275

[Deputy Nutz]

There have only been a few players in the NFL that were able to free lance on defense in the NFL, Lawrence Taylor, and Primetime Sanders. I don't think I would but Burfict in that class.

[3irty1]

His workout numbers are absolutely pathetic:
40: 5.09
Vert: 30
Broad: 8'08"
SS: 4.56
3C: 7.51

Even if these numbers didn't suck, I watched all the videos in this thread and still haven't seen him in coverage. I'd like to have him on the practice squad as it sounds like a lot of his wow moments come in practice, but I can't believe that he is physically capable of being a 3 down linebacker. His skill set would seem to limit him to a role like Brady Poppinga had in the 4-3 or AJ hawk has in the current 3-4. Kind of a Full-back of the defense as it seems like taking on blockers is what he does best. If he can do anything on special teams then perhaps he'd be that intimidating practice player that lights a fire under AJ Hawk.

[Lurker64]

If he can do anything on special teams then perhaps he'd be that intimidating practice player that lights a fire under AJ Hawk.

The problem with that is that I don't think he's the sort of player that's going to light a fire under anybody, since "motivation" is near the top of his list of issues. He's more a player that you have to actively work to set a fire under him and if he's a late round pick relegated to a backup role, he'll probably just sulk.

[woodbuck27]

http://www.pac-12.org/portals/7/images/Football/2011-Stats/HTML/asu.htm#team.def

2011 SEASON ... Overall Defensive Statistics NOTE: ILB Vontaze Burfict was second on this team in tackles inspite of limited game action according to reports.

Compare to the 2010 Season when Vontaze Burfict led his team in tackles... See Below please.

2010 SEASON ...ARIZONA ... STATE DEFENSIVE STAT'S:

http://www.pac-12.org/portals/7/images/Football/2010-Stats/HTML/ASU.HTM#team.def

Pac-10 Football Arizona State Overall Defensive Statistics (Through games of Jan 16, 2011)

[woodbuck27]

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/04/15/burfict-gets-the-cold-shoulder/

Burfict gets the cold shoulder

Posted by Mike Florio on April 15, 2012, 1:54 PM EDT

" There are not-so-subtle signs of piling on, however. For example, Walters regards as significant the notion that friends caution against calling or texting Burfict before 10:00 a.m., because he will still be asleep. Anyone with a son or nephew in the range of 15 to 25 will readily describe such behavior as “normal.” ..........

And former Arizona State teammate Brandon Magee raves about Burfict. “He knows he is going to be a starter in the NFL,” Magee said, adding that Burfict plays with a lot of passion and despises losing. “Tez is going to prove everybody wrong.”

The bar will be low and the ceiling will be high, and there’s a chance that the negativity will give Burfict precisely the wake-up call that he needs in order to turn his career around." Article

[Guiness]

pbmax...based on what you see in this video does Vontaze Burfict look like a terrible choice as an ILB prospect? I'm not putting you on 'the spot here'. I'm just interested in what your analysis is of him overall in this game?

My analysis is similar to pbmax's. I don't think it's a matter of him 'pacing himself' but just being lazy and unmotivated when he's not in the thick of it. How is he going to behave when he has to drop into coverage? Is he going to be like a defensive version of Moss, figuring the ball isn't coming his way so he can get away with a half effort? In college, probably. In the pros, any QB will see that, and his 3rd string TE will eat him alive.

[Cheesehead Craig]

The Badgers OL is the closest thing you're going to find to a NFL OL in college. The multiple draft picks from the line year after year support this fact.

So the question is if Burfict cannot handle the Badgers OL, how is he supposed to handle an actual NFL OL? Is he going to get too frustrated by getting controlled by the OL and simply start giving less effort as is a knock on him? The thought that if the play is not at him he gives up to save energy is poppycock. Either you hustle or you don't. Even the guys the Packers have at the other OLB to Clay don't give up on plays. If a player gets lazy on the NFL field, he'll be very likely to be lazy on the home couch come Sunday afternoon real quick.

I question his mental toughness. The notes of giving up on plays, blaming others for your shortcomings, committing stupid personal foul penalties all of which have been documented about this guy lead me to the conclusion he's mentally weak as these are glaring symptoms of that.

Someone else can take a flyer on him, I personally don't want the Packers to have any part of this guy.

[woodbuck27]

My analysis is similar to pbmax's. I don't think it's a matter of him 'pacing himself' but just being lazy and unmotivated when he's not in the thick of it. How is he going to behave when he has to drop into coverage? Is he going to be like a defensive version of Moss, figuring the ball isn't coming his way so he can get away with a half effort? In college, probably. In the pros, any QB will see that, and his 3rd string TE will eat him alive.

I don't see a lick of coverage skils but in that Wisconsin game he certainjly flashes a lot of hussel and determination.

I looked at that video carefully and when 'the Wisconsin Badgers' take the lead at about the 23 minute mark of the video... Vontaze Burfict is trap blocked outside superbly (by I think it was #54) as the runner takes it inside of this solid block to go house.

Did he look bad on that play? I see it as he was the victim of a terrific block.

Yes he takes plays off but alot of those plays are to the outside of the field. He also shows loads of hussel and a strong ability to tackle. He makes alot of terrific tackles in that 30 minute video. He led his team in tackles that season. He was showing leadership in 2010. his team was off like a grey hound last season at 5-1 and 6-2 and the roof caved in with the Arizona State Sun Devils finishing with four loss's.

Was the fact (maybe?) that for some reason Vontaze Burfict had lost favour with his coach's a factor in that collapse? Can that collapse be blamed on Vontaze Burfict?

Is the hype on this player more overkill then real? That's the question I'm trying to see answered in this thread.

He will NOT be in my MOCK. That decision bugs me somehow. I feel that he's a risk just reading all the negative hype.

What's the TRUTH?

[ND72]

Mayock just called Burfict "The most undraftable kid"

[woodbuck27]

Mayock just called Burfict "The most undraftable kid"

He'll be in someone's camp.

[Guiness]

He'll be in someone's camp.

No doubt he'll be in a camp. But what a fall, unthinkable to go from probable first rounder to possible UDFA! What happened to that kid?

Myself, I can't see him going undrafted - someone will take a Clarett style shot at him, although I doubt it will be in the third round this time - 5th seems likely.

edit: I decided to have a peek at Clarett's Wiki page to see what he's been up to since getting cut by Denver. All I can say is wow, I had no idea.

[woodbuck27]

No doubt he'll be in a camp. But what a fall, unthinkable to go from probable first rounder to possible UDFA! What happened to that kid?

Myself, I can't see him going undrafted - someone will take a Clarett style shot at him, although I doubt it will be in the third round this time - 5th seems likely.

edit: I decided to have a peek at Clarett's Wiki page to see what he's been up to since getting cut by Denver. All I can say is wow, I had no idea.

Yes Guiness this 'fall from grace' and this young man is interesting. If he suffered an onset of 'mentle illness' it would add up and if that's the case he cannot be judged. He also shouldn't be drafted with alot of expectation.

** Maurice Clarett. Havn't thought of that fella for some time. I'll follow up this post with a look see. Maybe he's running a successful entrepreneurial venture. Your an NFL GM and get high on a fella like him............ and WHAM!


It's all about reduced risk.

** This fella keeps on chugging. He was back to football in 2010:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maurice_Clarett

Omaha Nighthawks and Maurice Clarett

"On August 30, 2010, the Omaha Nighthawks of the United Football League signed Clarett. On October 1, 2010 he played his first meaningful game of any sort in eight years, rushing for 12 yards on 5 attempts against the Sacramento Mountain Lions. As the Nighthawks' #2 running back, Clarett finished the season with 154 yards on the ground on 37 attempts and a touchdown. He also caught 12 passes for 98 yards, and returned one kickoff for 13 yards." Fr. Wikipedia

"Understand my struggle so you can respect my hustle. I am never coming back here, believe that. Never, I am cool on this. It is first-class living from the day I get out. I WILL NEVER SETTLE FOR LESS, EVER AGAIN. That goes for communication, personal relationships, housing, education, friendships, and travel arrangements. Everything. I have the fire in my eyes" Maurice Clarette from prison

You know ........... it's sad.

[Scott Campbell]

If he suffered an onset of 'mentle illness' it would add up and if that's the case he cannot be judged.


Yes he can.

People don't get a free pass for their crappy behavior just because they're mentally ill Woody.

[woodbuck27]

Yes he can.

People don't get a free pass for their crappy behavior just because they're mentally ill Woody.

OK SC your off IGNORE.....imagine I'm posting your from 'the Meadow'. I must address your slander...your sicko abusive manners.

I've an issue with your sick ways. Any inference from you that I suffer a mentle illness is over the top out of line. Without a detraction of your nonsence .... you suffer your own fall.

RE: your sick obsessions and disregard for common decency ...youir slander RE: me and mentle illness. BIG ERROR Scott.

I am not mentally ill. I expect an apoligy.

Secondly:

Your Avatar....

You can take your indignance and shove it ...... From observing your avatar. It obvious to me that at least you won't dirty your elbow.

I've suspected that you have a secret man love for Brett Favre but never has it become so obvious to me. I know it was tough to lose him Scott but like Brett Favre and any mature and competent folk. We get on with our best efforts at living decently. We move beyond nonsence and obsession.

Sometimes I actually wonder if your not maybe well...30% of the way there Scott. Then I come back to earth.

When it comes to 'Dirty Deeds Done Dirt Cheap' you exceed all head shaking assessments of any other here at Packerrats. Actually Scott Campbell ... in my lifetime your certainly one of the lowest people I've ever had to try to deal with........ That's NOT a compliment.

Again your Avatar Scott. Maybe I'm mistaken?? That avatar certainly had me scrathin' my head. My initial reaction to it and you Scott Campbell:

I hadn't realized that Brett Favre had gone so diverse with his line of merchandise and goods. Good for Brett Favre and Deanna. There are so many ways to ensure your future.

THANKS for advertising for him Scott. Favre would certainly appreciate you for that.

Sometimes you almost get it Scott.

[Scott Campbell]

I am not mentally ill. I expect an apoligy.


I expect a second opinion. From a sane person.

[Zool]

I expect a second opinion. From a sane person.

He's not crazy, just an internet caricature of a sane person.

[Scott Campbell]

Undrafted.

Signed as an UDFA by the Bengals.

[Fritz]

Ah, the Bungals. How long before he's sexing up Sarah Jones?

[Lurker64]

No doubt he'll be in a camp. But what a fall, unthinkable to go from probable first rounder to possible UDFA!

This happens more often than you think. At around this time last year, there were first round projections by the media for four prospects who ended up being undrafted: Donte Paige-Moss, Vontaze Burfict, Jeff Fuller, and Cliff Harris.

This is purely a media creation, since you see a guy make splash plays the year before they're eligible and you assume this is him "finally coming on" and ESPN thinks you're going to get drafted in the first on upside (and to be fair, this does happen sometimes: c.f. Aaron Maybin). But NFL teams aren't going to take guys with suspect character and athleticism that high, ever.

[woodbuck27]

This happens more often than you think. At around this time last year, there were first round projections by the media for four prospects who ended up being undrafted for four prospects: Donte Paige-Moss, Vontaze Burfict, Jeff Fuller, and Cliff Harris.

This is purely a media creation, since you see a guy make splash plays the year before they're eligible and you assume this is him "finally coming on" and ESPN thinks you're going to get drafted in the first on upside (and to be fair, this does happen sometimes: c.f. Aaron Maybin). But NFL teams aren't going to take guys with suspect character and athleticism high, ever.


Yup and in terms of Vontaze Burfict the accusations of him using a baned substance what...within a week of the DRAFT.

It's never smart to try to deal with anyone that's plainly stupid.

[mraynrand]

It's never smart to try to deal with anyone that's plainly stupid.

hard to argue with ya on this one yogi.
http://houndstoothnyc.files.wordpress.com/2009/11/yogi-berra.jpg?w=450

[woodbuck27]

http://news.cincinnati.com/article/20120513/SPT02/305130018/Bengals-rookie-minicamp-wraps-up?odyssey=tab|topnews|text|Bengals

Bengals' rookie minicamp wraps up.



5:13 PM, May. 13, 2012


Bengals head coach Marvin Lewis on Vontaze burfict's performance in the Bengals Mini-TC:

“There were a couple of other guys that did well. We can't fit everybody in. We might fit a couple in now and look for a couple of other spots later and see what happens,” Lewis said.

Lewis was also pleased with how linebacker Vontaze Burfict did over the weekend, especially in his consistency on plays and what he displayed on special teams.

Said Lewis: “He's in great football position. Those are things that, if you watch the tape of him you see him do it two or three times a game. Now you're seeing him do it three plays in a row. That's the key. He'll be fine.” Fr. LINK

GO PACK GO !

[woodbuck27]

http://news.cincinnati.com/article/20120511/SPT02/305110126

Burfict leaves past behind, seeks opportunity

2:22 AM, May. 12, 2012

"The former Arizona State standout is lining up at middle linebacker this weekend, which is where the Bengals will keep him once the full-squad OTA practices begin on May 22.....

...... Arriving here closes the chapter on a tumultuous year for Burfict, who experienced a Lehman Brothers-type plummet. Thought to be one of the top linebacker prospects going into his junior season, Burfict went from a projected early round pick to undrafted.......

...... Burfict said he was more mature compared to this time a year ago and ready to take care of his responsibilities. During nearly 10 minutes with the media following Friday’s morning practice, Burfict politely answered questions and didn’t shy away from anything." Fr. LINK

PACKERS !

[KYPack]

http://news.cincinnati.com/article/20120511/SPT02/305110126

Burfict leaves past behind, seeks opportunity

2:22 AM, May. 12, 2012

"The former Arizona State standout is lining up at middle linebacker this weekend, which is where the Bengals will keep him once the full-squad OTA practices begin on May 22.....

...... Arriving here closes the chapter on a tumultuous year for Burfict, who experienced a Lehman Brothers-type plummet. Thought to be one of the top linebacker prospects going into his junior season, Burfict went from a projected early round pick to undrafted.......

...... Burfict said he was more mature compared to this time a year ago and ready to take care of his responsibilities. During nearly 10 minutes with the media following Friday’s morning practice, Burfict politely answered questions and didn’t shy away from anything." Fr. LINK

PACKERS !

There is some scuttlebutt around town about this kid. Evidently, he fell victim to one of the oldest tricks in the book. He believed his own press clippings. He went into last season out of shape and a little heavy. Then he didn't get in shape for the combine.

Slow 40 time, a little heavy means you ain't a #1 pick like some projected, it meant he didn't even get drafted. He's real green and has learned a big lesson, maybe.

I'll give a full report after the Pack plays the bungals August 23. It's a Thursday nite game, just 7 miles from my house. That's so convenient for me, why don't they do that more often?

[woodbuck27]

There is some scuttlebutt around town about this kid. Evidently, he fell victim to one of the oldest tricks in the book. He believed his own press clippings. He went into last season out of shape and a little heavy. Then he didn't get in shape for the combine.

Slow 40 time, a little heavy means you ain't a #1 pick like some projected, it meant he didn't even get drafted. He's real green and has learned a big lesson, maybe.

I'll give a full report after the Pack plays the bungals August 23. It's a Thursday nite game, just 7 miles from my house. That's so convenient for me, why don't they do that more often?

Thanks KY. I'm pulling for this young man. I also wouldn't lay down a big bet on him making the Bengals roster in 2013. He has to really want an NFL career and to be a positive influence as a team player. He'll have to have a mentor and live a decent disciplined life off the field.

I'm also interested in this Detroit LIONS draft pic:

http://www.detroitlions.com/news/lions-insider/article-1/Ronnell-Lewis-eager-to-put-on-the-pads-and-do-some-hitting/4c1d694d-a28e-40a3-ab53-10a282625c46

Ronnell Lewis. I didn't enjoy seeing him drafted by a division rival. I'm concerned he'll be a terror for 'the Lions' on ST's play.

GO PACKERS !

[woodbuck27]

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1238211-the-biggest-story-from-every-nfl-minicamp?utm_source=newsletter&utm_medium=newsletter&utm_campaign=nfl#/articles/1238211-the-biggest-story-from-every-nfl-minicamp/page/8

Cincinnati Bengals: Vontaze Burfict Making a Name for Himself

''Apparently the rookie linebacker has impressed the Cincinnati Bengals so much that he isn't even on the roster fringe at this point.

There wasn't ever any question about the talent and physical ability that Burfict possesses. Rather, his slide down the draft and completely out of it was due to off-field issues and character concerns.

If the Arizona State product can continue to progress, there is no reason to believe that he cannot become a starter in the National Football League. He needs to become more aware of the nuances of the defense and play much more contained football in order for that to become a reality.''

[Lurker64]

There is some scuttlebutt around town about this kid. Evidently, he fell victim to one of the oldest tricks in the book. He believed his own press clippings. He went into last season out of shape and a little heavy. Then he didn't get in shape for the combine.

Slow 40 time, a little heavy means you ain't a #1 pick like some projected, it meant he didn't even get drafted. He's real green and has learned a big lesson, maybe.

I'll give a full report after the Pack plays the bungals August 23. It's a Thursday nite game, just 7 miles from my house. That's so convenient for me, why don't they do that more often?

I think the real kiss of death for Burfict as far as his draft stock goes was the "Endorsement" that his college coaches gave him. Mayock cited an unnamed ASU assistant as saying "he sucks the life out of your football team" and if media members can get that sort of report, I'm sure outgoing Sun Devils coach Dennis Erickson was happy to say some unkind things about Burfict.

Sometimes you can have a lot of talent, but you won't make it because you're a pain in the butt and your coaches don't like you. Who was that kid, Meredith, that the Packers drafted in the fifth who had a "second round grade" and ended up getting cut awful quick because he was a pain in the butt?

[KYPack]

I think the real kiss of death for Burfict as far as his draft stock goes was the "Endorsement" that his college coaches gave him. Mayock cited an unnamed ASU assistant as saying "he sucks the life out of your football team" and if media members can get that sort of report, I'm sure outgoing Sun Devils coach Dennis Erickson was happy to say some unkind things about Burfict.

Sometimes you can have a lot of talent, but you won't make it because you're a pain in the butt and your coaches don't like you. Who was that kid, Meredith, that the Packers drafted in the fifth who had a "second round grade" and ended up getting cut awful quick because he was a pain in the butt?

I'd think so, too, Lurk.

All the pro Scouts have back door access to the college coaches and a negative rating from the college guys leads to a college player dropping like a lead balloon on draft day. As far as Burfict, he is getting rave reviews in early camp. ASU coaches aside, Burfict has kept his mouth shut and played his ass off, so it's obvious he knew he had to work on buttoning his big yap. As far as the Bengal lb's lb's helping him? I doubt it. This kid is going after some jobs. All the vets say they are working with the kids. In the papers. On the field, more than one rook has discovered that an old vet is spooning him mis-information just to screw the kid up. Most of 'em figure this out about a week too late.

[pbmax]

Meredith made it through most of camp, then was signed to the practice squad. He left GB for a promise of a roster spot in Buffalo. If he was giving the coaches trouble in camp, it wasn't in the coverage I remember.

[Lurker64]

Meredith made it through most of camp, then was signed to the practice squad. He left GB for a promise of a roster spot in Buffalo. If he was giving the coaches trouble in camp, it wasn't in the coverage I remember.

Well, I think "Meredith is a pain in the ass" is the reason that a guy who media scouts had as a second round talent was available in the fifth round. It's possible that was also the reason that he was put on the PS instead of getting a roster spot (though I hope not.)

[Cheesehead Craig]

Cool article on this guy and it reminded me about this thread. A lot of us didn't want any part of this guy and I was in that group too. He's turning out to be a pretty good player. So I'll eat some crow on this.

Burfict says "Screw you PackerRats, I'm a stud!" (http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/10478179/hot-read-how-scouts-avoid-missing-next-vontaze-burfict)

[mraynrand]

That's why Thompson - and the Ravens scout - are correct when they say most of us, including the so-called experts like Mike MayCock or SMell Pipejob, don't know a damn thing about how players are actually assessed.

LOL. Who is SMell Pipejob? I assume Mel Kiper...

[woodbuck27]

http://espn.go.com/blog/cincinnati-bengals/

With Vontaze Burfict done, Bengals feel leadership void

December, 9, 2014 5:40 PM ET

By: Coley Harvey | ESPN.com