Grant could find new team soon

[Brando19]

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000d5d82860e93/article/agent-ryan-grant-in-talks-with-team-other-than-packers?module=HP11_headline_stack

I've never been a fan of Grant. He was exciting during the 2007 playoffs, but that was it. I hear Reggie Bush and maybe Jonathan Stewart is on the trade market. Maybe TT trades a pick. If not...hopefully Starks will stay healthy.

[Fritz]

Maybe Jonathan Stewart...for a fifth rounder.

[Brandon494]

You know damn well TT's not going to trade for either of those guys.

[Smidgeon]

He lost flexibility with his ankle injury. He had wiggle and juice before that. After? He was just a guy. :\

[Bretsky]

It seemed like yesterday some of da homers were claiming Grant was a top 10 RB in the NFL

[pbmax]

It seemed like yesterday some of da homers were claiming Grant was a top 10 RB in the NFL

He's still better than AP.



Today, anyway. :lol:

[Patler]

In four years and 1 game Grant became the fifth in all time rushing yards for the Packers, surpassing Dorsey Levens and being less than 200 yards behind Canadeo, looking up at only Brockington, Taylor and Green.

Yet, for many fans he is just extra baggage. His biggest fault is that he was not Ahman Green, and that's what fans expected from him.

[Bretsky]

In four years and 1 game Grant became the fifth in all time rushing yards for the Packers, surpassing Dorsey Levens and being less than 200 yards behind Canadeo, looking up at only Brockington, Taylor and Green.

Yet, for many fans he is just extra baggage. His biggest fault is that he was not Ahman Green, and that's what fans expected from him.


Point to ponder; is Ahman Green considered great ? I know he was very good.......maybe my pedastal is higher.

But I've watched GB for 30 plus years and I'm still not sure I've seen greatness at RB for the Pack

Ryan Grant was a nice system guy; he was very average

[Brando19]

You know damn well TT's not going to trade for either of those guys.

Yes...yes I do.

[Joemailman]

Point to ponder; is Ahman Green considered great ? I know he was very good.......maybe my pedastal is higher.

But I've watched GB for 30 plus years and I'm still not sure I've seen greatness at RB for the Pack

From 2000-2004, Ahman Green had over 9000 yards rushing/receiving and 65 touchdowns. Tough as hell and could take it to the house. He was great until his knee injury in 2005.

[Scott Campbell]

Ahman Green was a great player.

[HarveyWallbangers]

Ahman Green was great.

[Smidgeon]

Point to ponder; is Ahman Green considered great ? I know he was very good.......maybe my pedastal is higher.

But I've watched GB for 30 plus years and I'm still not sure I've seen greatness at RB for the Pack

Ryan Grant was a nice system guy; he was very average

Ahman Green was an earlier version of AP. Except more dominant in the passing game. My opinion.

[Guiness]

Ahman Green was a great back, and a real tough act to follow for sure. My favorite thing to watch was him making a linebacker levitate. When he hit them, they seemed to float off the ground for half a second!

[mission]

Ahman Green was a great player.

He was unbelievable at times during his prime. Like most RBs, he didn't have a 10 year+ window. The HOF guys are usually the ones that can stick around.

Grant is no where near Green.

[Pugger]

But I don't think Grant is as wanting as some here think.

[pbmax]

Ahman was great.

Ryan was very good.

[Packers4Glory]

i feel like the few times MM let Grant do what he does best and gain more carries you saw more of what he was in the past. He's not going to look great w/ 8-10 carries a game, he gets better as he gets more.

[woodbuck27]

In four years and 1 game Grant became the fifth in all time rushing yards for the Packers, surpassing Dorsey Levens and being less than 200 yards behind Canadeo, looking up at only Brockington, Taylor and Green.

Yet, for many fans he is just extra baggage. His biggest fault is that he was not Ahman Green, and that's what fans expected from him.

Isn't that 'the TRUTH'.

" Grant had a successful first season with the Packers, rushing (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rush_(American_football)) for almost 1,000 yards, including five 100+ yard games, in 10 starts. He set franchise records with 201 rushing yards and 3 touchdowns in the Packers' divisional playoff game win against the Seattle Seahawks (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seattle_Seahawks), a performance for which he was heavily praised, as they went on to reach the NFC Championship Game (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NFC_Championship_Game). " Wikipidea ** for More.

** http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ryan_Grant#Green_Bay_Packers

BEST Green Bay Packer 'Rushers' ... ALL TIME:

1) Ahman Green ... Rushed for 8322 yards as a Green Bay Packer . . . . http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ahman_Green

2) NFL HOFer and GB Packer HOFer Jim Taylor... Rushed for 8207 yards as a Green Bay Packer . . . . http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jim_Taylor_(American_football)

http://www.profootballhof.com/hof/member.aspx?PLAYER_ID=211

3) GB Packer HOFer ... John Brockington Rushed for 4634 yards as a Green Bay Packer.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Brockington#Professional_career

http://www.totalfootballstats.com/PlayerRB.asp?id=440

4) NFL HOFer and GB Packer HOFer ... Tony Canadeo ...Rushed for a total of 4197 Yards as a Green Bay Packer.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tony_Canadeo (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tony_Canadeo)

http://www.profootballhof.com/hof/member.aspx?PlayerId=41
Tony Canadeo with 4,197 yards rushing, was one of 'only Five Packers to have his number retired.That number was 3. The others were Don Hutson (14); Bart Starr (15); Ray Nitschke (66) and Reggie White (92).


and . . . .

5) RYAN GRANT is among that 'Fast Company' of ALL TIME Green Bay Packer Greats with a total of 4016 YARDS Rushing. NOT too shabby for this oft injured RB.

[Upnorth]

Point to ponder; is Ahman Green considered great ? I know he was very good.......maybe my pedastal is higher.

But I've watched GB for 30 plus years and I'm still not sure I've seen greatness at RB for the Pack

Ryan Grant was a nice system guy; he was very average

Green was great, full stop.
I guess you could call Grant a system back, if the system relied on a RB who could hold on to the ball, consistently gain tough yards, have a second gear in the back field and make decent blocks. He was easily a top 10 RB until he was injured and I would argue top 5. He unfortunatly never recovered from his injury or we would be even more unstoppable on offence.

[woodbuck27]

Green was great, full stop.
I guess you could call Grant a system back, if the system relied on a RB who could hold on to the ball, consistently gain tough yards, have a second gear in the back field and make decent blocks. He was easily a top 10 RB until he was injured and I would argue top 5. He unfortunatly never recovered from his injury or we would be even more unstoppable on offence.

Ahman 'Batman' Green WAS GREAT........FULL STOP !

Awesome.

Yes he sometimes fumbled the football. (-:

[Tony Oday]

Green fumbled the ball too much. I mean I still remember the Eagles game where his forearm black sleeves made him fumble in the first half at least twice maybe three times then the second half he had different cloth white ones never fumbled again.

[Guiness]

Green fumbled the ball too much. I mean I still remember the Eagles game where his forearm black sleeves made him fumble in the first half at least twice maybe three times then the second half he had different cloth white ones never fumbled again.

I remember that game - I think it must have been Monday night, because I'm pretty sure it was Madden that was saying the sleeves were making him fumble? Then he went on in the second half about how they listened to him and took them off!

[Fritz]

Point to ponder; is Ahman Green considered great ? I know he was very good.......maybe my pedastal is higher.

But I've watched GB for 30 plus years and I'm still not sure I've seen greatness at RB for the Pack

Ryan Grant was a nice system guy; he was very average

Yes, you have. Twice.

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_Pk49mVrUKD0/TM9trwyAhLI/AAAAAAAADzA/0t5__WQXmz8/s1600/1972-John+Brockington.jpg

http://www.mkrob.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/10/green.jpg

[woodbuck27]

Yes, you have. Twice.

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_Pk49mVrUKD0/TM9trwyAhLI/AAAAAAAADzA/0t5__WQXmz8/s1600/1972-John+Brockington.jpg

http://www.mkrob.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/10/green.jpg

Both very good but Ahman Green has yet to be acknowledged by the Green Bay Packers with HOF status.

How long should that take?

[Upnorth]

Fritz,

Perfect post.

[Smeefers]

Grant is a couple steps below Green, but when you compare someone to one of the best RB's to ever play on the team, sure there's something to be desired. I mean, sure, Jordy Nelson is good, but he's no Sterling Sharpe or Don Hudson. Just because he's not as good as some of the best players we've had on our team doesn't mean he wasn't a solid contributor. I think grant was good because he was one of the last 3 down backs in the league and he could own it. Then he got hurt and hasn't been the same since.

[Patler]

Green fumbled the ball too much. I mean I still remember the Eagles game where his forearm black sleeves made him fumble in the first half at least twice maybe three times then the second half he had different cloth white ones never fumbled again.

Funny thing is, if you look at "fumbles/touch" he was worse than the best "nonfumblers", but no worse than a lot of backs who don't have reputations as fumblers.

Ahman Green - 28 fumbles in 2056 carries (1 every 73.4 carries)
Jamal Lewis - 35 fumbles in 2542 carries (1 every 72.6 carries)


A. Green - 7 fumbles in 378 receptions (1 every 54 receptions)
J. Lewis - 4 fumbles in 221 receptions (1 every 55 receptions)

I don't remember Lewis being considered a fumbler.

Green tended to get his in bunches, which made it seem worse than it was. The "Homgren traded him because..." thing started it. Always carrying the ball on one side perpetuated it, even though he fumbled no more frequently when the ball was in the "wrong" arm.

[Fritz]

I think you are correct on all points, Patler. One, Holmgren's reason for trading Green followed him to Green Bay. And I think - if I remember correctly - Green's fumbles tended to be at the beginning of the season, so he got "pegged" for the whole year, even once the fumbles slowed or stopped. And the thing about always carrying the ball in the same arm was the third factor. Didn't he try to learn to switch, then fumbled a couple times doing so, then went back to his old ways?

I think Green was even better than Brockington, and Brockington was awfully good for a few years. What really hurt him was the injury - his knee, I think. He was a back of the old-school variety - the horse you rode. Kinda like Earl Campbell, though not quite that good.

[HarveyWallbangers]

Ahman always fumbled a lot in the first few games of the season, everybody would worry, and then he'd go on long streaks without fumbling. They always had a stat that he fumbled less than Jim Taylor. At the end of his career his fumble rate was pretty normal.

Campbell was awesome, but I think Green might have been a better all around RB. Maybe at his absolute best, Campbell was better. Before his punishing style took its toll. Then again, Green was pretty special for a few years also.

I think Green was very underrated--even by some Packer fans. I like my all around backs though. I also think Marshall Faulk is underrated. Most like him, but I think he's one of the five best RBs in NFL history.

[Guiness]

Ahman always fumbled a lot in the first few games of the season, everybody would worry, and then he'd go on long streaks without fumbling. They always had a stat that he fumbled less than Jim Taylor. At the end of his career his fumble rate was pretty normal.

Campbell was awesome, but I think Green might have been a better all around RB. Maybe at his absolute best, Campbell was better. Before his punishing style took its toll. Then again, Green was pretty special for a few years also.

I think Green was very underrated--even by some Packer fans. I like my all around backs though. I also think Marshall Faulk is underrated. Most like him, but I think he's one of the five best RBs in NFL history.

Dunno why we're talking about him, but I agree about Faulk. Never understood why Indi got rid of him, apparently the coach didn't like him? They're lucky they picked up James the next year to step into his footsteps.

[Freak Out]

Green = Badass

Grant = Good.

I remember when Carroll came to town and wanted the "Batman" nickname. LOL.

[MJZiggy]

Instead he got oven mitts.

[Brando19]

Green = Badass

Grant = Good.

I remember when Carroll came to town and wanted the "Batman" nickname. LOL.

Agreed...Green was great...Grant is average to above average. Ahmad Carroll wanted the batman nickname? Psh...more like Flash...because that sums up his career. It was gone in a flash.

[Bretsky]

Perhaps Harvey has me figured out. When I think of the elite backs I truly think of the more all around guys. Elite to me screams of guys like Waltar Payton, Barry Sanders, All Day Peterson, maybe Gayle Sayers (from the highlights I've seen), Marshall Faulk.

I don't put Ahman there

I'd say Ahman was a very very good NFL Running back...and elite Packer RB.

But I don't think I'd categorize him as an elite NFL Back...to me...those are reserved for some of the guys making the Canton Hall of Fame

[Scott Campbell]

Perhaps Harvey has me figured out. When I think of the elite backs I truly think of the more all around guys. Elite to me screams of guys like Waltar Payton, Barry Sanders, All Day Peterson, maybe Gayle Sayers (from the highlights I've seen), Marshall Faulk.

I don't put Ahman there

I'd say Ahman was a very very good NFL Running back...and elite Packer RB.

But I don't think I'd categorize him as an elite NFL Back...to me...those are reserved for some of the guys making the Canton Hall of Fame


Peterson is a likely HOF player, but I don't think of him as a great all around RB. His blitz pickups are weak, and he's a little weak catching passes out of the backfield. Though he obviously more than makes up for it in other areas.

For perspective, I don't think of Curtis Martin (inducted to Canton this year) as being significantly better than Green during both of their peaks. But Martin had a longer shelf life.

[Bretsky]

Peterson is a likely HOF player, but I don't think of him as a great all around RB. His blitz pickups are weak, and he's a little weak catching passes out of the backfield. Though he obviously more than makes up for it in other areas.

For perspective, I don't think of Curtis Martin (inducted to Canton this year) as being significantly better than Green during both of their peaks. But Martin had a longer shelf life.


I'd agree with you.....of course......as I noted a couple months back......I never thought of Curtis Martin as a Hall of Fame Back either

[woodbuck27]

Perhaps Harvey has me figured out. When I think of the elite backs I truly think of the more all around guys. Elite to me screams of guys like Waltar Payton, Barry Sanders, All Day Peterson, maybe Gayle Sayers (from the highlights I've seen), Marshall Faulk.

I don't put Ahman there

I'd say Ahman was a very very good NFL Running back...and elite Packer RB.

But I don't think I'd categorize him as an elite NFL Back...to me...those are reserved for some of the guys making the Canton Hall of Fame

NFL HOF RB's:

Marcus Allen (http://www.profootballhof.com/hof/member.aspx?PlayerId=15) (RB) 1982-1997
Jim Brown (http://www.profootballhof.com/hof/member.aspx?PlayerId=33) (FB) 1957-1965
Earl Campbell (http://www.profootballhof.com/hof/member.aspx?PlayerId=40) (RB) 1978-1985
Larry Csonka (http://www.profootballhof.com/hof/member.aspx?PlayerId=50) (FB) 1968-1979
Eric Dickerson (http://www.profootballhof.com/hof/member.aspx?PlayerId=55) (RB) 1983-1993
Tony Dorsett (http://www.profootballhof.com/hof/member.aspx?PlayerId=59) (RB) 1977-1988
Marshall Faulk (http://www.profootballhof.com/hof/member.aspx?PlayerId=298) (RB) 1994-2005
Frank Gifford (http://www.profootballhof.com/hof/member.aspx?PlayerId=75) (HB-FL) 1952-1960, 1962-1964
Franco Harris (http://www.profootballhof.com/hof/member.aspx?PlayerId=89) (RB) 1972-1984
Paul Hornung (http://www.profootballhof.com/hof/member.aspx?PlayerId=99) (HB) 1957-1962, 1964-1966
John Henry Johnson (http://www.profootballhof.com/hof/member.aspx?PlayerId=106) (FB) 1954-1966
Leroy Kelly (http://www.profootballhof.com/hof/member.aspx?PlayerId=113) (RB) 1964-1973
Floyd Little (http://www.profootballhof.com/hof/member.aspx?PlayerId=292) (RB) 1967-1975
Curtis Martin (http://www.profootballhof.com/hof/member.aspx?PlayerId=299) (RB) 1995-2005
Ollie Matson (http://www.profootballhof.com/hof/member.aspx?PlayerId=143) (HB) 1952, 1954-1966
Hugh McElhenny (http://www.profootballhof.com/hof/member.aspx?PlayerId=148) (HB) 1952-1964
Lenny Moore (http://www.profootballhof.com/hof/member.aspx?PlayerId=155) (HB) 1956-1967
Marion Motley (http://www.profootballhof.com/hof/member.aspx?PlayerId=156) (FB) 1946-1953, 1955
Walter Payton (http://www.profootballhof.com/hof/member.aspx?PlayerId=174) (RB) 1975-1987
Joe Perry (http://www.profootballhof.com/hof/member.aspx?PlayerId=175) (FB) 1948-1963
John Riggins (http://www.profootballhof.com/hof/member.aspx?PlayerId=180) (RB) 1971-1979, 1981-1985
Barry Sanders (http://www.profootballhof.com/hof/member.aspx?PlayerId=187) (RB) 1989-1998
Gale Sayers (http://www.profootballhof.com/hof/member.aspx?PlayerId=188) (HB) 1965-1971
O.J. Simpson (http://www.profootballhof.com/hof/member.aspx?PlayerId=195) (RB) 1969-1979
Emmitt Smith (http://www.profootballhof.com/hof/member.aspx?PlayerId=291) 1990-2004
Jim Taylor (http://www.profootballhof.com/hof/member.aspx?PlayerId=211) (FB) 1958-1967
Thurman Thomas (http://www.profootballhof.com/hof/member.aspx?PlayerId=253) 1988-2000
Charley Trippi (http://www.profootballhof.com/hof/member.aspx?PlayerId=216) (HB) 1947-1955
Doak Walker (http://www.profootballhof.com/hof/member.aspx?PlayerId=223) (HB) 1950-1955

Marcus Allen, the tenth player selected in the 1982 National Football League Draft, played 16 seasons with the Los Angeles Raiders and Kansas City Chiefs. During that time he gained 12,243 yards rushing, 5,411 yards receiving, and scored 145 touchdowns.
Considered one of the game’s best goal line and short-yardage runners, Marcus began his pro career as the NFL Rookie of the Year and ended as the game’s all-time rushing touchdown leader.

Jim Brown was a superb craftsman whose primary job was to run with the football for the Cleveland Browns. For nine seasons, he did it better than any player before him. When he retired at the age of 30 at the peak of his career, he left behind a record book clogged with Jim Brown notations.

Earl Campbell, a 5-11, 232-pound ball-carrying dynamo from the University of Texas, joined the Houston Oilers as the first player taken in the 1978 National Football League Draft. The first player to earn All-Southwest Conference honors four years, Campbell was a consensus All-America and the Heisman Trophy winner in 1977.

Campbell took the NFL by storm right from the very start. In 1978, he was named the NFL's Most Valuable Player, All-Pro, and Rookie of the Year. He won the league rushing championship with 1,450 yards and was named to the AFC Pro Bowl squad. It was more of the same the next two years with NFL rushing titles, MVP honors, and consensus All-Pro acclaim each season.

His finest year came in 1980, however, when he rushed for 1,934 yards, which at the time was second only to 0. J. Simpson’s 2003 yards gained in 1973. That year, he gained over 200 yards in four games. In 1981, he won his fourth straight AFC rushing title. A sensational runner, Campbell was picked for the Pro Bowl five of his first six NFL seasons.

In his eight-season career, Campbell rushed 2,187 times for 9,407 yards, and 74 touchdowns. He also gained 806 yards on 121 receptions to bring his career combined net yards total to 10,213. In spite of the constant pounding he took from opposing defenders, Earl missed only six games out of 115 because of injuries.

Eric Dickerson, Selected in the first round of the 1983 NFL Draft by the Los Angeles Rams. An immediate success, he established rookie records for most rushing attempts (390), most rushing yards gained (1,808) and most touchdowns rushing (18). His efforts earned him All-Pro, Pro Bowl, Player of the Year and Rookie of the Year honors.

In his second season, Dickerson continued his onslaught of the NFL record book. Twelve times during that season he gained more than 100 yards rushing, breaking the record of 100-yard games in a season held by O. J. Simpson. His 2,105 total yards rushing in 1984 shattered Simpson’s 1973 record of 2,003 yards rushing in a single season.

A workhorse runner with the Rams, Dickerson gained more than 1,000 yards each of his first four seasons with the team. In three of those seasons he gained more than 1,800 yards. Although he rushed for 1,234 yards in 1985, he missed the Pro Bowl for the first time in his short NFL career. He did, however, go on to rush for a playoff record 248 yards against the Dallas Cowboys in post-season play.

After playing just three games for the Rams during the strike-shortened 1987 season, Dickerson – in a blockbuster deal – was traded to the Indianapolis Colts. Although he played in just nine games with the Colts that year, he still managed to gain 1,011 yards to finish the season with 1,288.

In 1988, Dickerson, with 1,659 yards rushing, became the first Colt to lead the league in rushing since Alan Ameche in 1955.

The following season he became the first player in NFL history to gain more than 1,000 yards in seven consecutive seasons. He also became the seventh back to gain more than 10,000 yards and the fastest ever to do so, reaching the milestone in just 91 games. During his 11-year career, Dickerson gained 13,259 yards rushing, which was second all-time at the time of his retirement. A six-time Pro Bowl selection, Dickerson was All-Pro in 1983, 1984, 1986, 1987 and 1988.

Tony Dorsett, a 5-11, 192-pound running back from the University of Pittsburgh, already was a celebrity by the time he joined the Dallas Cowboys as their first-round draft pick in 1977. A four-time All-America at Pittsburgh, Dorsett also won the 1976 Heisman Trophy.

Just as he had done at Pitt, he took the National Football League by storm in his rookie 1977 season. Dorsett rushed for 1,007 yards and 12 touchdowns and was a virtually unanimous choice for NFL Offensive Rookie of the Year honors. Dorsett, who was born April 7, 1954, in Rochester, Pennsylvania, rushed for more than 1,000 yards eight of his first nine seasons – the only miss was the strike-shortened 1982 campaign which, ironically, saw him win his only NFC rushing championship.

His top production came in 1981, when he rushed for 1,646 yards and added 325 yards on 32 receptions. Dorsett spent the first 11 seasons of his 12-year, 173-game NFL career with the Cowboys before being traded to the Denver Broncos for a fifth-round draft pick in 1988. He led the Broncos in rushing with 703 yards in 1988 but injuries prevented him from playing after that first campaign in Denver.

For his career, Dorsett rushed for 12,739 yards. He totaled 16,326 yards from scrimmage. He scored 546 points on 91 touchdowns, 77 by rushing, 13 by receiving and one on a fumble return. Dorsett, a three-time All-NFC pick, who was All-Pro in 1981 and a veteran of four Pro Bowls, played in five NFC championship games and Super Bowls XII and XIII. He had impressive post-season statistical totals -- 1,383 rushing yards and 1,786 yards from scrimmage in 17 games. In the 1982 regular season finale during a Monday night game against the Minnesota Vikings, Dorsett set a record that may some day be tied but will never be broken – a 99-yard touchdown run.


To Be Continued next post......

[woodbuck27]

Great HOF RB's Cont'd:

** Marshall Faulk The Indianapolis Colts picked this San Diego State running back as the second player overall in the 1994 NFL Draft. He was an instant star as he rushed for 143 yards and scored three touchdowns in his rookie debut against the Houston Oilers. He then eclipsed the 100-yard mark again the following week against the Tampa Bay Buccaneers. Those were two of four 100-yard rushing days to go with one 100-plus yard receiving game in his rookie season. He finished his first season with 1,282 rushing yards and an AFC-leading 11 TDs. He also caught 52 passes for 522 yards and one touchdown. He was named Rookie of the Year for his performance.

Faulk rushed for 1,000 yards in four of his first five seasons while also amassing 2,804 yards on 297 receptions. He was then traded by the Colts to the St. Louis Rams in 1999 in exchange for a second- and fifth-round draft pick.

He helped guide his new team to a Super Bowl title in his first season in St. Louis. That year he became the second player in NFL history to eclipse the 1,000-yard mark in both rushing and receiving and set the then-record for yards from scrimmage with 2,429 yards. He was named the NFL's Offensive Player of the Year for the first of three straight seasons.

The following year, Faulk earned NFL Most Valuable Player honors after he set the single-season record for touchdowns with 26 that included a career-high and league-leading 18 rushing touchdowns. It marked the first of two straight seasons in which he led the NFL in scoring and touchdowns.

In all, Faulk earned first-team All-Pro acclaim in 1999, 2000, and 2001 and was a second-team All-Pro selection in 1994, 1995, and 1998. He was voted to seven Pro Bowls, named All-AFC twice and All-NFC three times in his career.

Faulk, the first player in NFL history to gain 2,000 yards from scrimmage in four straight seasons (1998-2001), retired as the NFL's ninth-ranked rusher of all-time with 12,279 yards and 100 touchdowns. He also added 767 career receptions, which ranked 16th all-time, for 6,875 yards and 36 touchdowns. His 19,154 yards from scrimmage was sixth all-time. Faulk rushed for 100 or more yards in 38 games and had three games in which he went over the 200-yard mark. He also recorded eight 100-yard receiving games in his 12-year, 176-game career.

** Curtis Martin, who missed most of his final college season at the University of Pittsburgh with an ankle injury, was drafted in the third round by the New England Patriots in 1995. He showed no effects of that injury during his rookie season. He ran 30 yards on his first NFL carry, scored the game-winning touchdown and became the first Patriots player to rush for 100 yards in his pro debut.

It was the first of a rookie-record-tying nine games that he eclipsed the 100-yard mark. Martin finished the year as the AFC's leading rusher with 1,487 yards and scored 14 touchdowns. He was named Rookie of the Year, All-AFC, and voted to the first of his five Pro Bowls.

Martin's steady output continued throughout his 11-season, 168-game career as he joined Hall of Famer Barry Sanders as the only runners ever to start their careers with 10 straight 1,000-yard seasons. Martin led his team in rushing in each of his 11 seasons in the NFL.

Martin, who signed as a restricted free agent with the New York Jets after his third season, had his finest year in his second to last season. He rushed for a career-high 1,697 yards in 2004 to win the lone NFL rushing title of his career. He also tied his career-high of nine games with 100 or more yards rushing. He was named first-team All-Pro for the second time of his career that season.

He suffered a knee injury late in his final year that snapped a streak of 119 consecutive starts and kept him from reaching the 1,000-yard mark for the only time of his career. He finished the final four weeks of the season on the injured reserve list. He later announced his retirement and left the game as the NFL's fourth all-time leading rusher.

Martin gained 14,101 yards on 3,518 carries and scored 90 rushing touchdowns in his career. He rushed for 100 or more yards in a game 57 times. He also caught 484 passes for 3,329 yards and 10 touchdowns and his 17,421 combined net yards placed him 10th all-time at the time of his retirement. The three-time All-AFC pick also threw two touchdown passes on his only career pass attempts.

** Walter Payton, the Chicago Bears' first-round choice and the fourth player selected in the 1975 National Football League Draft, developed into a superstar of unusual dimensions during his 13-season NFL tenure from 1975 to 1987, all of which he spent with the Chicago Bears.The 5-10, 200-pound running back who rushed for 3,563 yards in four seasons at Jackson State went on to dominate the rushing section of the NFL record book during and long after his career ended.

The records he held at the time of his retirement included 16,726 total yards, 10 seasons with 1,000 or more yards rushing, 275 yards rushing in one game against Minnesota (1977), 77 games with more than 100 yards rushing, and 110 rushing touchdowns. Payton had 4,368 combined net attempts and accounted for 21,803 combined net yards. He also scored an impressive 750 points on 125 touchdowns.

Payton won the NFC rushing title five straight years from 1976 to 1980. He also led the NFC with 96 points in 1977 and won the NFL kickoff return championship in his rookie 1975 campaign. He was named both All-Pro and All-NFC seven times and played in nine Pro Bowl games. Payton was selected as the NFL's Most Valuable Player in 1977 and 1985, the NFL Offensive Player of the Year in 1977 and 1985 and the NFC Most Valuable Player in 1977.

An amazing runner, Walter rushed for more than 1,000 yards 10 of his 13 seasons. His best season came in 1977, when he ran for 1,852 yards, third best in history at that time. Payton's 492 career pass receptions for 4,538 yards and 15 touchdowns contributed to his exceptional combined net yard totals.

Extremely durable, Payton missed one game in his rookie campaign and then played in 186 consecutive games.

** Barry Sanders one of the game’s most electrifying runners, rushed for more than 1,000 yards in each of his 10 seasons with the Detroit Lions (1989-1998). He was the first running back ever to do so. The 1988 Heisman Trophy winner was also just the third person to gain more than 2,000 yards in a season, a feat he accomplished in 1997.

Sanders, after forgoing his senior season at Oklahoma State, made his pro debut just three days after signing with the Lions, who had made him their first-round pick and the third overall pick in the 1989 draft. He absolutely dazzled a Pontiac Silverdome crowd when he dashed for an 18-yard gain on his first carry as an NFL running back. But that was just the beginning. His 1,470 yards rushing that season, a-then Lions record, fell just 10 yards short of the league’s best for the year.

In 1990, Sanders, with 1,304 yards rushing, topped all ground gainers, something he would do again in 1994 (1,883 yards) and in 1996 (1,553 yards). His 44 receptions for 283 yards in 1994 gave him a combined 2,166 yards from scrimmage. The most impressive feat of his remarkable career, however, came in 1997, when he rushed for a league-best 2,053 yards and gained another 305 yards on 33 catches for an amazing 2,358 combined yards gained. That year, Sanders, who was named league Most Valuable Player, gained more than 100 yards rushing in an NFL record 14 consecutive regular season games.

Though not big by most standards, Sanders capitalized on his size by running low to the ground making him less of a target for would-be tacklers. His elusiveness and ability to reverse direction seemingly at will, often left defensive players grasping at air. “He makes you miss so bad, you kind of look up in the stands and wonder if anybody’s looking at you,” Atlanta Falcons cornerback D.J. Johnson once remarked. “You’ve got 60,000 people in there and you wonder if anyone saw you miss that tackle.”

A first- or second-team All-Pro ten consecutive seasons, Sanders became the first NFL running back to record five 1,500-yard rushing seasons, in addition to being the only back to do so in four consecutive seasons (1994-1997).

Selected to play in the Pro Bowl each of his 10 NFL seasons, Sanders held nearly every Lions’ rushing record and numerous all-time NFL records, at the time of his retirement.


Cont'd Next Post

[woodbuck27]

Great HOF RB's Cont'd:

** Gale Sayers burst upon the pro football scene in 1965 with the kind of an impact that the sport had not felt in many years.

It is difficult to imagine a more dynamic debut than the one he enjoyed as a rookie. In his first heavy pre-season action, he raced 77 yards on a punt return, 93 yards on a kickoff return, and then startled everyone with a 25-yard scoring pass against the Los Angeles Rams.

In regular season, he scored four touchdowns, including a 96-yard game breaking kickoff return, against the Minnesota Vikings. And, in the next-to-last game, playing on a muddy field that would have stalled most runners, Gale scored a record-tying six touchdowns against the San Francisco 49ers. Included in his sensational spree were an 80-yard pass-run play, a 50-yard rush and a 65-yard punt return. For the entire season, Gale scored 22 touchdowns and 132 points, both then-rookie records.

Quiet, unassuming, and always ready to compliment a teammate for a key block, Sayers continued to sizzle in 1967 and well into the 1968 season. Then, in the ninth game, Sayers suffered a knee injury that required immediate surgery.

After a tortuous rehabilitation program, Gale came back in 1969 in a most spectacular manner, winding up with his second 1,000-yard rushing season and universal Comeback of the Year honors. But injuries continued to take their toll and, just before the 1972 season, Gale finally had to call it quits.

In his relatively short career, he compiled a record that can never be forgotten.

His totals show 9,435 combined net yards, 4,956 yards rushing, and 336 points scored. At the time of his retirement he was the NFL's all-time leader in kickoff returns. He won All-NFL honors five straight years and was named Offensive Player of the Game in three of the four Pro Bowls in which he played.

** O. J. Simpson, a two-time All-America from the University of Southern California and the 1968 Heisman Trophy winner, was one of history's most heralded rookies when the Buffalo Bills selected him as the No. 1 player in the entire 1969 draft.

His career record for 11 seasons, the first nine in Buffalo and the 1978 and 1979 campaigns in San Francisco, confirms the rave notices were well founded. He rushed for 11,236 yards, added 2,142 yards on 203 pass receptions, returned 33 kickoffs 990 yards for a superb 30-yard average, and amassed 14,368 combined net yards. He scored 456 points on 76 touchdowns.

O. J. was not an immediate success and, in fact, did not even win Rookie of the Year acclaim in 1969. Incredibly, he was used sparingly as a running back through his first three campaigns until Lou Saban took over the reins in 1972 and immediately decided to give the 6-1, 212-pound speedster the football as often as possible.

Simpson immediately responded with massive ground-gaining performances. O.J. may be best remembered for his sensational 1973 season when he became the first back in history to rush for over 2,000 yards. With 219 yards in the next-to-last game against New England and a 200-yard output in the finale with the New York Jets, Simpson totaled 2,003 yards, tops for a 14-game season.

Many say the 1975 season was even better - 1,817 yards rushing, 426 yards on receptions and a then-record 23 touchdowns. O.J. led the league in rushing four years in 1972, 1973, 1975 and 1976.

In various selections, he was named NFL Player of the Year in 1972, 1973 and 1975. He was both All-AFC and All-Pro five straight years from 1972 through 1976. He played in six Pro Bowls, winning Player of the Game honors in the 1973 game.

Cont'd next post

[woodbuck27]

Great HOF RB's Cont'd:

** Emmitt Smith The Dallas Cowboys were rebuilding when they selected Florida running back Emmitt Smith in the first round of the 1990 draft. After a holdout during all of training camp and preseason of his rookie season, Smith reported to the Cowboys in time for the start of the regular season. He wasted no time in proving he was going to be a huge part of the team’s future.

Smith rushed for 937 yards and scored 11 touchdowns to earn Offensive Rookie of the Year honors and the first of eight career Pro Bowl nods. He followed that season by rushing for a league-leading 1,563 yards. Smith won four rushing crowns during a five-year span as he added titles in 1992, 1993, and 1995. He also led the NFL in rushing touchdowns three times and contributed 277 pass receptions during that same five-season period.

His best year came in 1995 when he recorded career highs for rushing yards (1,773), rushing touchdowns (25), and receptions (62).

Not surprisingly, Smith’s impact on the team helped nurture the Cowboys back to the top of the NFL. The Cowboys, with their star runner leading the way, won three Super Bowls over four seasons from 1992 to 1995. Smith was named first-team All-Pro in each year during that four-year period. In 1993, he was named the NFL’s MVP and followed that by earning Most Valuable Player honors in the Cowboys’ 30-13 win over the Buffalo Bills in Super Bowl XXVIII.

After narrowly missing the 1,000-yard mark as a rookie, Smith embarked on a record run of 11 straight seasons with 1,000 yards rushing. His streak came to end in Smith’s final season in Dallas in 2002 when he missed the 1,000-yard mark by a mere 25 yards. However, that season was highlighted by one particular game against the Seattle Seahawks on Oct. 27, 2002. In that contest, Smith supplanted Walter Payton as the NFL’s all-time rushing leader.

Smith, who was named to the NFL’s All-Decade Team of the 1990s, finished his 226-game career by playing two final seasons with the Arizona Cardinals. He retired with a career total of 18,355 yards and a NFL record 164 rushing touchdowns. He also added 515 receptions for 3,224 yards and 11 touchdowns.

** Thurman Thomas slipped to the second round of the 1988 National Football League Draft due to concern about a knee injury he had suffered during his senior year at Oklahoma State. The Buffalo Bills, who had no first round pick that year, selected Thomas, an All-America running back, in the second round with the 40th overall pick.

In 1989, after an impressive rookie season that included a division title for the Bills, the multi-dimensional Thomas rushed for 1,000 yards, caught 60 passes, and scored 12 touchdowns in his second season.

His ability to catch the ball as well as run with it was a key ingredient to the Bills' "No Huddle" offensive attack. The team improved to 13-3 in 1990 as Thomas led the NFL in all-purpose yards. He rushed for 1,297 yards and scored 11 touchdowns while catching 49 passes for 532 yards and two touchdowns. With the versatile back leading the way, the Bills marched through the playoffs to the first of their unprecedented four straight Super Bowl berths.

Thomas rushed for 100 yards in each of the playoff games that post-season including Super Bowl XXV when he gained 135 yards on just 15 carries and scored on a 31-yard run early in the fourth quarter. He also had 5 receptions for 55 yards.

In 1991, Thomas amassed more than 2,000 all-purpose yards, just the 11th player ever to do so. His league-leading yardage output included 1,407 yards on the ground and an additional 631 yards on a career-high 62 receptions. He scored 12 touchdowns. He reached the 2,000-yard total again the following season which marked a record fourth straight season of leading the NFL in yards from scrimmage.

Named to the NFL's All-Decade Team of the 1990s, Thomas was selected first- or second-team All-Pro and All-AFC five times, and was voted to the Pro Bowl five straight years. Thomas retired as the NFL's ninth ranked rusher with 12,074 yards and added another 4,458 yards on 472 catches. He scored 65 rushing and 23 receiving touchdowns in his 13-season career.

[Patler]

Perhaps Harvey has me figured out. When I think of the elite backs I truly think of the more all around guys. Elite to me screams of guys like Waltar Payton, Barry Sanders, All Day Peterson, maybe Gayle Sayers (from the highlights I've seen), Marshall Faulk.

I don't put Ahman there

I'd say Ahman was a very very good NFL Running back...and elite Packer RB.

But I don't think I'd categorize him as an elite NFL Back...to me...those are reserved for some of the guys making the Canton Hall of Fame

As Scott said, your criteria doesn't match with your player evaluations.

Ahman Green was an exceptional all-around back. He was very, very good as a receiver. He was a 50-70 receptions per year back until Tony Fisher came. Even then, Green was better, but his asthma required that he be given breaks. Since Fisher was quite good himself in the third down role, it became the best option for giving Green the breaks he needed. He was also a very good blocker.

Peterson is a tremendous runner, but doesn't compare at all to Green as a receiver or blocker.

Unfortunately for Green, his first two seasons were wasted in Seattle, or his career would look a lot different. During his first 5 seasons in GB, if you grouped multiple years (2, 3, 4 or 5), Green was the NFL leader in combined yards rushing and receiving.

Peterson's first 5 years - 73 games, 1406/6752 rushing, 137/1309 receiving.
Greens first 5 years in GB - 77 games, 1467/6848 rushing, 282/2188 receiving.

Combined yards rushing and receiving: Green - 9,036; Peterson - 8,061.

Green was pretty darned good.

[woodbuck27]

As Scott said, your criteria doesn't match with your player evaluations.

Ahman Green was an exceptional all-around back. He was very, very good as a receiver. He was a 50-70 receptions per year back until Tony Fisher came. Even then, Green was better, but his asthma required that he be given breaks. Since Fisher was quite good himself in the third down role, it became the best option for giving Green the breaks he needed. He was also a very good blocker.

Peterson is a tremendous runner, but doesn't compare at all to Green as a receiver or blocker.

Unfortunately for Green, his first two seasons were wasted in Seattle, or his career would look a lot different. During his first 5 seasons in GB, if you grouped multiple years (2, 3, 4 or 5), Green was the NFL leader in combined yards rushing and receiving.

Peterson's first 5 years - 73 games, 1406/6752 rushing, 137/1309 receiving.
Greens first 5 years in GB - 77 games, 1467/6848 rushing, 282/2188 receiving.

Combined yards rushing and receiving: Green - 9,036; Peterson - 8,061.

Green was pretty darned good.

Better than AP...GOOD !

[Guiness]

Unfortunately for Green, his first two seasons were wasted in Seattle, or his career would look a lot different. During his first 5 seasons in GB, if you grouped multiple years (2, 3, 4 or 5), Green was the NFL leader in combined yards rushing and receiving.


Were his two first seasons really wasted? Green was effective until his injury.

Marcus Allen had a long career, and there are differing views on this - one is that the carries Bo Jackson took during his four years cut down the wear and tear on Allen's body, the other opinion is that Allen's career numbers would have been that much better if he'd been given the ball those years. If you subscribe to the first view, then the years Green went unused in Seattle extended his career on the back end.

[LEWCWA]

Eddie Lee Ivory was a great back! We just never saw it, because of damn soldier field.....

[MadtownPacker]

NFL HOF RB's:

Marcus Allen (http://www.profootballhof.com/hof/member.aspx?PlayerId=15) (RB) 1982-1997
Jim Brown (http://www.profootballhof.com/hof/member.aspx?PlayerId=33) (FB) 1957-1965
Earl Campbell (http://www.profootballhof.com/hof/member.aspx?PlayerId=40) (RB) 1978-1985
Larry Csonka (http://www.profootballhof.com/hof/member.aspx?PlayerId=50) (FB) 1968-1979
Eric Dickerson (http://www.profootballhof.com/hof/member.aspx?PlayerId=55) (RB) 1983-1993
Tony Dorsett (http://www.profootballhof.com/hof/member.aspx?PlayerId=59) (RB) 1977-1988
Marshall Faulk (http://www.profootballhof.com/hof/member.aspx?PlayerId=298) (RB) 1994-2005
Frank Gifford (http://www.profootballhof.com/hof/member.aspx?PlayerId=75) (HB-FL) 1952-1960, 1962-1964
Franco Harris (http://www.profootballhof.com/hof/member.aspx?PlayerId=89) (RB) 1972-1984
Paul Hornung (http://www.profootballhof.com/hof/member.aspx?PlayerId=99) (HB) 1957-1962, 1964-1966
John Henry Johnson (http://www.profootballhof.com/hof/member.aspx?PlayerId=106) (FB) 1954-1966
Leroy Kelly (http://www.profootballhof.com/hof/member.aspx?PlayerId=113) (RB) 1964-1973
Floyd Little (http://www.profootballhof.com/hof/member.aspx?PlayerId=292) (RB) 1967-1975
Curtis Martin (http://www.profootballhof.com/hof/member.aspx?PlayerId=299) (RB) 1995-2005
Ollie Matson (http://www.profootballhof.com/hof/member.aspx?PlayerId=143) (HB) 1952, 1954-1966
Hugh McElhenny (http://www.profootballhof.com/hof/member.aspx?PlayerId=148) (HB) 1952-1964
Lenny Moore (http://www.profootballhof.com/hof/member.aspx?PlayerId=155) (HB) 1956-1967
Marion Motley (http://www.profootballhof.com/hof/member.aspx?PlayerId=156) (FB) 1946-1953, 1955
Walter Payton (http://www.profootballhof.com/hof/member.aspx?PlayerId=174) (RB) 1975-1987
Joe Perry (http://www.profootballhof.com/hof/member.aspx?PlayerId=175) (FB) 1948-1963
John Riggins (http://www.profootballhof.com/hof/member.aspx?PlayerId=180) (RB) 1971-1979, 1981-1985
Barry Sanders (http://www.profootballhof.com/hof/member.aspx?PlayerId=187) (RB) 1989-1998
Gale Sayers (http://www.profootballhof.com/hof/member.aspx?PlayerId=188) (HB) 1965-1971
O.J. Simpson (http://www.profootballhof.com/hof/member.aspx?PlayerId=195) (RB) 1969-1979
Emmitt Smith (http://www.profootballhof.com/hof/member.aspx?PlayerId=291) 1990-2004
Jim Taylor (http://www.profootballhof.com/hof/member.aspx?PlayerId=211) (FB) 1958-1967
Thurman Thomas (http://www.profootballhof.com/hof/member.aspx?PlayerId=253) 1988-2000
Charley Trippi (http://www.profootballhof.com/hof/member.aspx?PlayerId=216) (HB) 1947-1955
Doak Walker (http://www.profootballhof.com/hof/member.aspx?PlayerId=223) (HB) 1950-1955
Ok Woody. Im just gonna to say it straight up because thats really the only way.

This and the two post of yours that follow it disrupt this thread. Yes it has relevance to the thread but a link to the list would be a lot cleaner. Instead there is three pages of scrolling down thru some info that really isnt relevant to the conversation posters are having at this point in the thread. I think its cool man but let's start pasting links (like the quote above looks) instead of the bulk text. Thanks.

[woodbuck27]

OK Can you remove the posts if their in error or a problem. When I took the time to do this last night I never imagined it would be a problem...it is a problem.

This is what you want ie Sometimes my natural tendency to be an educator gets the best of me. Sorry about that Mad.

Modern Era: Halfbacks-Fullbacks (29) or Post WWII:

http://www.profootballhof.com/hof/positions.aspx

[woodbuck27]

Eddie Lee Ivery was a great back! We just never saw it, because of damn soldier field.....

Long time since I thought of Eddie Lee Ivery.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eddie_Lee_Ivery#Professional_career

This article certainly allows one some insight into former Green Bay Packer Eddie Lee Ivery;

http://www.theacc.com/sports/m-footbl/spec-rel/090809aah.html

Ivery was one of the greatest Georgia Tech running backs of all time, setting single-game marks for rushing yards in a game (356), all-purpose yards in a game (367), and all-purpose yards in a season (1,879 in 1978) - all records that still stand today.... Ivery was inducted into the Georgia Tech Sports Hall of Fame in 1983. " **

"In the 1979 NFL Draft, the Green Bay Packers drafted Ivery 15th overall. He went on to play for eight seasons with the Packers, finishing his professional career with 2,933 yards and 23 touchdowns." **

"The satisfaction that I get out of life now is when I go out and inspire, motivate and encourage a kid to reach his full potential; not just on the field, but also the off-the-field decisions he's going to have to make in life," Ivery said. ** Article

[gbgary]

i think green was great. to do what he did on a pass 1st, pass 2nd, maybe run 3rd, offense was fantastic. grant's been nearly as good. the lost year, and the rehab year (last year), really was unfortunate. the second year after a knee is always better than the first. hope he bounces back.

[Brandon494]

Green also had a hell of a O-line he ran behind but that doesnt take away from the fact that he was one of the top running backs in the game in the early 2000s. That screen play we use to run with him was a thing of beauty...god I miss that.

[woodbuck27]

Green also had a hell of a O-line he ran behind but that doesnt take away from the fact that he was one of the top running backs in the game in the early 2000s. That screen play we use to run with him was a thing of beauty...god I miss that.

I loved the way he ran. Those light feet.

[Harlan Huckleby]

Ahman Green was an earlier version of AP. Except more dominant in the passing game. My opinion. Green was traded by Seattle for a song and dance. CAn you imagine that happening to a young AP?

I'm not saying this proves much, except AP has a greater pedigree, he is considered hall of fame caliber.

[Harlan Huckleby]

I loved the way he ran. Those light feet. light in the loafers?

[Fritz]

Perhaps Harvey has me figured out. When I think of the elite backs I truly think of the more all around guys. Elite to me screams of guys like Waltar Payton, Barry Sanders, All Day Peterson, maybe Gayle Sayers (from the highlights I've seen), Marshall Faulk.

I don't put Ahman there

I'd say Ahman was a very very good NFL Running back...and elite Packer RB.

But I don't think I'd categorize him as an elite NFL Back...to me...those are reserved for some of the guys making the Canton Hall of Fame

Couple of things....

First, I think you really mis-speak when you use the term "all around guys." I take that - and I think most people have taken that - to mean someone who has a variety of the kinds of skills a RB can have. Obviously, running the ball well is one, but you can divide that into inside and outside ability. Then there's pass blocking, as someone mentioned. Then there's receiving out of the backfield.

By that definition, Barry Sanders was in no way an "all around guy." He was in fact one-dimensional. He had a distinct distaste for both pass blocking and for going out of the backfield to catch the ball. Wayne Fontes, the Lions' coach, wanted to use Sanders' open field ability by getting him out in the flat for some passes, but Sanders did not want to do that and in fact if you look at his career stats he didn't catch too many passes.

He was also not a guy who would go up the middle for one or two yards. Now, he might go up the middle after some dancing, and get you thirty yards. But if a coach needed a yard and a half and wanted a guy to just take the ball and go up the gut, Sanders was not the guy to choose.

Finally, he did not have breakaway speed. He was perhaps the shiftiest, most-difficult-to-tackle running back that ever played, and he could gash teams for big, big gains, but he did not have take-it-to-the-house speed.

I[m not saying he wasn't a great back. He was incredible to watch - I saw him surrounded by three or four tacklers a number of times, and they just couldn't find him to tackle him. He was wonderful. He was elite.

But he wasn't what you'd call an "all around guy."

Secondly, you used the word "great" backs earlier. I do wonder how different people define that. For some, longevity is a key, so a guy like Emmitt Smith, whom I never thought was a truly great, great back, is considered great. He was consistent for a lot of years. For others, longevity is not quite as important as a few great, great years.

For my money, Earl Campbell in his prime was one of the most punishing, gifted backs I've ever had the good fortune to watch. Nobody really enjoyed trying to tackle that guy, and he carried those Houston teams on his back, along with a whole lot of defenders. Having seen only a little footage of Jim Brown, I imagine that Campbell is as close as I've ever come to seeing someone like the great Jim Brown.

[Smidgeon]

Couple of things....

First, I think you really mis-speak when you use the term "all around guys." I take that - and I think most people have taken that - to mean someone who has a variety of the kinds of skills a RB can have. Obviously, running the ball well is one, but you can divide that into inside and outside ability. Then there's pass blocking, as someone mentioned. Then there's receiving out of the backfield.

By that definition, Barry Sanders was in no way an "all around guy." He was in fact one-dimensional. He had a distinct distaste for both pass blocking and for going out of the backfield to catch the ball. Wayne Fontes, the Lions' coach, wanted to use Sanders' open field ability by getting him out in the flat for some passes, but Sanders did not want to do that and in fact if you look at his career stats he didn't catch too many passes.

He was also not a guy who would go up the middle for one or two yards. Now, he might go up the middle after some dancing, and get you thirty yards. But if a coach needed a yard and a half and wanted a guy to just take the ball and go up the gut, Sanders was not the guy to choose.

Finally, he did not have breakaway speed. He was perhaps the shiftiest, most-difficult-to-tackle running back that ever played, and he could gash teams for big, big gains, but he did not have take-it-to-the-house speed.

I[m not saying he wasn't a great back. He was incredible to watch - I saw him surrounded by three or four tacklers a number of times, and they just couldn't find him to tackle him. He was wonderful. He was elite.

But he wasn't what you'd call an "all around guy."

Secondly, you used the word "great" backs earlier. I do wonder how different people define that. For some, longevity is a key, so a guy like Emmitt Smith, whom I never thought was a truly great, great back, is considered great. He was consistent for a lot of years. For others, longevity is not quite as important as a few great, great years.

For my money, Earl Campbell in his prime was one of the most punishing, gifted backs I've ever had the good fortune to watch. Nobody really enjoyed trying to tackle that guy, and he carried those Houston teams on his back, along with a whole lot of defenders. Having seen only a little footage of Jim Brown, I imagine that Campbell is as close as I've ever come to seeing someone like the great Jim Brown.

Who are you and what did you do with Fritz?

P.S. Repping this post.

[Scott Campbell]

By that definition, Barry Sanders was in no way an "all around guy."


I thought he looked like a mere mortal on grass.

[sharpe1027]

I thought he looked like a mere mortal on grass.

Maybe he was no longer god-like on grass, but he was still an incredibly good -- for a mortal.

[mraynrand]

Green also had a hell of a O-line he ran behind but that doesnt take away from the fact that he was one of the top running backs in the game in the early 2000s. That screen play we use to run with him was a thing of beauty...god I miss that.

true that. I'll never forget the win at Minnesota in 2000. The Packers put a knife in the backs of the Vikings and ruined their season. Ahman Green ran the ball and ran out the clock in the waning moments of the game. His victory celebration was awesome. Green knew how to take it to the opposition.

My only regret about Green is that they didn't give him the damn rock on 4th and one.

[Smeefers]

No one here is saying that Green should be in the NFL HOF are they? I may have gotten a little confuzled back there. Sure he put up some good numbers and he was the best RB that GB has ever seen, but there's no way that he's anywhere near Canton material. Simply put, he wasn't the best back in the league when he was in his prime. Off the top of my head, Jerome Bettis and LT were much better.

I have to disagree with you Fritz on the Emmit Smith thing. I thought he was everything that Barry wasn't and that's why I was so happy to be watching them play in my early days. Smith was the prototypical back. He caught out of the backfield, picked up blitz's and could ram it down your throat whether you liked it or not. IMHO, he was a very big reason we didn't have more super bowls in the 90's.

[Cheesehead Craig]

Green also had a hell of a O-line he ran behind but that doesnt take away from the fact that he was one of the top running backs in the game in the early 2000s. That screen play we use to run with him was a thing of beauty...god I miss that.

He ran the hell out of the screen. Knew how to follow his blockers and squeezed every yard he could out of it. He's the reason we were known as such a good screen team. His legacy carried on for years after he left when announcers still called us a good screen team even when we weren't.

[sharpe1027]

he was the best RB that GB has ever seen

Was he better than all the Packer RBs are already in Canton?

[Cleft Crusty]

Was he better than all the Packer RBs are already in Canton?

By far.

[Cleft Crusty]

No one here is saying that Green should be in the NFL HOF are they? I may have gotten a little confuzled back there. Sure he put up some good numbers and he was the best RB that GB has ever seen, but there's no way that he's anywhere near Canton material. Simply put, he wasn't the best back in the league when he was in his prime. Off the top of my head, Jerome Bettis and LT were much better.

I have to disagree with you Fritz on the Emmit Smith thing. I thought he was everything that Barry wasn't and that's why I was so happy to be watching them play in my early days. Smith was the prototypical back. He caught out of the backfield, picked up blitz's and could ram it down your throat whether you liked it or not. IMHO, he was a very big reason we didn't have more super bowls in the 90's.


As our esteemed colleague Patler illustrated, Green was one of the most productive backs of his era. For a 5 year stretch, he was in the top 3 in all-around yardage. If the Packers had won a Superbowl in 2002 or 2003, he would be a HOFer. That's how it works. Green carried the team through it's transition from the depleted post-Superbowl roster of 1999 to four years of playoff competitive football ushered in by Wolf's energized class of 2000. The shadow of Favre also eclipsed Green's great accomplishments, along with the myth of his being a terrible fumbler.

Legacy often hinges on very sharp edges. Giving the ball to Green on fourth and one in Philly could have propelled a 'team of destiny' to a Superbowl victory, and Green into the HOF.

[sharpe1027]

By far.

By far? You can't even say it's close? Jim Taylor might disagree.

[Pugger]

By far? You can't even say it's close? Jim Taylor might disagree.

These gentlemen might disagree too:

Curly Lambeau
Johnny Blood
Clarke Hinkle
Tony Canadeo
Paul Hornung

[Guiness]

Was he better than all the Packer RBs are already in Canton?

I think he qualified that by saying 'he wasn't the best in the league during his prime'.

Back to the original topic - no news of Grant getting a sniff. I guess the GM's around the league didn't like what they say last year, and expect him not to be able to come back from the injury. Popular thinking is that it takes a full year to recover from that injury.

Hard to tell what's going to happen. He's got two things against him - he's at that magic 30yrs old, had a significant injury, and two pluses - an above average to good back and not a lot of mileage (under 1,000 carries). Looks right now like the cons outweigh the pros.

[sharpe1027]

I think he qualified that by saying 'he wasn't the best in the league during his prime'.

Back to the original topic - no news of Grant getting a sniff. I guess the GM's around the league didn't like what they say last year, and expect him not to be able to come back from the injury. Popular thinking is that it takes a full year to recover from that injury.

Hard to tell what's going to happen. He's got two things against him - he's at that magic 30yrs old, had a significant injury, and two pluses - an above average to good back and not a lot of mileage (under 1,000 carries). Looks right now like the cons outweigh the pros.

Qualified statement or not, I still think it is a stretch to say Green was better than Jim Taylor and yet should not even be in the running for Canton.

The thing about Grant is that he only has a very small window where he was successful. He split time as a starter in college, was buried on the depth chart with the Giants, and he had his 2.5 good years with the Packers. He hasn't done much since.

[Cleft Crusty]

By far? You can't even say it's close? Jim Taylor might disagree.


These gentlemen might disagree too:

Curly Lambeau
Johnny Blood
Clarke Hinkle
Tony Canadeo
Paul Hornung

I would expect them all to disagree - except the dead ones. Such is the vanity of most athletes - except Bart Starr. Green is just better. Green had the explosiveness and athleticism of Hornung and the Power of Jimmy Taylor - and better receiving hands than all of them. He just doesn't have the championships and/or the longevity.

[sharpe1027]

I would expect them all to disagree - except the dead ones. Such is the vanity of most athletes - except Bart Starr. Green is just better. Green had the explosiveness and athleticism of Hornung and the Power of Jimmy Taylor - and better receiving hands than all of them. He just doesn't have the championships and/or the longevity.

If you had a time machine and could magically test them side-by-side in their primes, Green would have better measurables. But, if that were the way players were judged, you could make the argument that our current backup offensive lineman are better than any HoF linemen from that era. After all, they are bigger, stronger, faster and more mobile than lineman back then. I don't agree with that type of analysis.

ObalooBF, Jim Taylor was a better RB than A. Green. Perhaps you can argue that point, but to say that Green was "by far" better than Taylor -- no way.

[Smeefers]

I'm sorry, Green was the best RB I've ever seen on the Packers. If you want to go back 50 years, I'm sure there were a lot of great players on our team. I never watched them play, so I couldn't tell you how he stacked up against them. What I do know is that it's almost impossible to compare 50-60's era players with 2000 era players. Hell, it's tough compareing guys from the 90's to now. From what I've seen though, the only player that compares to Green from the modern era who's in the HOF is Curtis Martin. A lot of people don't think he deserves to be in and Green doesn't have anywhere near his numbers. There is no way on God's green earth that Green is going to make it into the HOF. He doesn't deserve to be there. You can cherry pick all the stats you want, but one of the tests he'd have to pass is the eye test and he don't pass that.

I also don't like the "If only" statements. If only Green had personally carried the packers on to 5 super bowls, then he'd be in the HOF for sure. Pshh, That's how things fall though. The problem with If he would have gotten that 4-1 call and he had made it, then the packers would have totally gone on to the super bowl and won it, is a completely baseless argument. What if they went for it on 4-1 and didn't get it. Or what If they got it, but then there was a fumble or intereception or they didn't get the TD or whatever the hell they needed (I have no idea what 4th and 1 call you guys are talking about.) Overall, in his career, was he a Hall of Famer? No. Not even close. He may have sniffed at some of the HOFers shoes for a couple years, but there's no way he was that good.

It's just like comparing Greens numbers to All Day's- A future hall of famer. Green has almost 1000 more in 5 years! Wow, 1000 of that comes from Recieving. Oh, but AP averages 9.6 yards per recieving play and Green averaged 7.8. Huh. That's wierd, maybe it's because Green had 200 more plays than him and Green was in on 3rd downs. People weren't putting 8 in the box to stop Green. Green never carried his team. How many Touchdowns does AP have in 5 years? 64. How many does Green have in his whole career? 14. AP is twice the player on one of his worst days than Green was on his best. There's no comparrison. That's the problem, you might be able to compare him to guys who barely got into the hall, but the second you stand him next to any great player, the argument falls away.

Now will you guys stop all this crazy talk about Amhan Green and the Hall of Fame?

[sharpe1027]

Smeefers, that's partly my point. Green was a great back, but overall, he wasn't better than the Packer's best backs, which did make the HoF. If he was, he would be in the running for the HoF. Green is not going to make a HoF other than the Packers HoF.

[Cleft Crusty]

I'm sorry, Green was the best RB I've ever seen on the Packers. If you want to go back 50 years, I'm sure there were a lot of great players on our team. I never watched them play, so I couldn't tell you how he stacked up against them. What I do know is that it's almost impossible to compare 50-60's era players with 2000 era players. Hell, it's tough compareing guys from the 90's to now. From what I've seen though, the only player that compares to Green from the modern era who's in the HOF is Curtis Martin. A lot of people don't think he deserves to be in and Green doesn't have anywhere near his numbers. There is no way on God's green earth that Green is going to make it into the HOF. He doesn't deserve to be there. You can cherry pick all the stats you want, but one of the tests he'd have to pass is the eye test and he don't pass that.

I also don't like the "If only" statements. If only Green had personally carried the packers on to 5 super bowls, then he'd be in the HOF for sure. Pshh, That's how things fall though. The problem with If he would have gotten that 4-1 call and he had made it, then the packers would have totally gone on to the super bowl and won it, is a completely baseless argument. What if they went for it on 4-1 and didn't get it. Or what If they got it, but then there was a fumble or intereception or they didn't get the TD or whatever the hell they needed (I have no idea what 4th and 1 call you guys are talking about.) Overall, in his career, was he a Hall of Famer? No. Not even close. He may have sniffed at some of the HOFers shoes for a couple years, but there's no way he was that good.

It's just like comparing Greens numbers to All Day's- A future hall of famer. Green has almost 1000 more in 5 years! Wow, 1000 of that comes from Recieving. Oh, but AP averages 9.6 yards per recieving play and Green averaged 7.8. Huh. That's wierd, maybe it's because Green had 200 more plays than him and Green was in on 3rd downs. People weren't putting 8 in the box to stop Green. Green never carried his team. How many Touchdowns does AP have in 5 years? 64. How many does Green have in his whole career? 14. AP is twice the player on one of his worst days than Green was on his best. There's no comparrison. That's the problem, you might be able to compare him to guys who barely got into the hall, but the second you stand him next to any great player, the argument falls away.

Now will you guys stop all this crazy talk about Amhan Green and the Hall of Fame?

This is a very strange contradictory post. It tries to refute Patler's observations, but just confirms them. I'll take one point: Green never carried his team. Hogwash. Green carried the Packers through 2000, 2001, and 2003, at the very least. In an era of scant talent at WR - specifically 2000 and 2001, the entire offense ran through Green, much like AP in 2007 and 2008. The limited nature of the offenses ultimately prevented those teams from going very far. Green was the focus of much of the Packer offense in 2003, and defenses often stacked 8 in the box, but still couldn't stop the Packers run offense. It helped to have a reasonably effective, but damaged Favre under center over say an bumbling boob like Tarvaris Jackson, but that doesn't change the fact of Green's productivity all that much, and the focus of Green Bay's offense.

HOF choices are supposed to be made on talent and productivity, but they are very often based on perception based on championships and longevity. An interesting comparison is Green and Roger Craig. Both had four pro bowl appearances, they had about 11,000 total yards in their 8 years for their major teams, they had about the same number of TDs. Craig was tilted more towards the passing game and Green towards the running game. Craig was a HOF finalist in 2010, if I recall. He may squeak in due to his association with the Superbowl teams, but, much like Green, his association with Montana, Rice, and all the other talent on those rosters, leave most people believing he had less to do with the Niner's success.

Taylor and Hornung were cogs in a running attack in a running league and won a lot of championships. But that doesn't make them better backs than Green. Just very good backs on exceptional teams. It's very hard to compare players in different eras, but that's exactly what we're doing. And individual skills cannot be measured in isolation from each other and in isolation from the teams they played on and the circumstances of seasons and team philosophies. We will soldier on...

Finally, you have to question the credentials of a Packer fan who doesn't understand 4th and 1 in Philly.

[Smidgeon]

This is a very strange contradictory post. It tries to refute Patler's observations, but just confirms them. I'll take one point: Green never carried his team. Hogwash. Green carried the Packers through 2000, 2001, and 2003, at the very least. In an era of scant talent at WR - specifically 2000 and 2001, the entire offense ran through Green, much like AP in 2007 and 2008. The limited nature of the offenses ultimately prevented those teams from going very far. Green was the focus of much of the Packer offense in 2003, and defenses often stacked 8 in the box, but still couldn't stop the Packers run offense. It helped to have a reasonably effective, but damaged Favre under center over say an bumbling boob like Tarvaris Jackson, but that doesn't change the fact of Green's productivity all that much, and the focus of Green Bay's offense.

HOF choices are supposed to be made on talent and productivity, but they are very often based on perception based on championships and longevity. An interesting comparison is Green and Roger Craig. Both had four pro bowl appearances, they had about 11,000 total yards in their 8 years for their major teams, they had about the same number of TDs. Craig was tilted more towards the passing game and Green towards the running game. Craig was a HOF finalist in 2010, if I recall. He may squeak in due to his association with the Superbowl teams, but, much like Green, his association with Montana, Rice, and all the other talent on those rosters, leave most people believing he had less to do with the Niner's success.

Taylor and Hornung were cogs in a running attack in a running league and won a lot of championships. But that doesn't make them better backs than Green. Just very good backs on exceptional teams. It's very hard to compare players in different eras, but that's exactly what we're doing. And individual skills cannot be measured in isolation from each other and in isolation from the teams they played on and the circumstances of seasons and team philosophies. We will soldier on...

Finally, you have to question the credentials of a Packer fan who doesn't understand 4th and 1 in Philly.

I'd rep you, but apparently it says I have to rep others first. :\

[Smidgeon]

I'm sorry, Green was the best RB I've ever seen on the Packers. If you want to go back 50 years, I'm sure there were a lot of great players on our team. I never watched them play, so I couldn't tell you how he stacked up against them. What I do know is that it's almost impossible to compare 50-60's era players with 2000 era players. Hell, it's tough compareing guys from the 90's to now. From what I've seen though, the only player that compares to Green from the modern era who's in the HOF is Curtis Martin. A lot of people don't think he deserves to be in and Green doesn't have anywhere near his numbers. There is no way on God's green earth that Green is going to make it into the HOF. He doesn't deserve to be there. You can cherry pick all the stats you want, but one of the tests he'd have to pass is the eye test and he don't pass that.

I also don't like the "If only" statements. If only Green had personally carried the packers on to 5 super bowls, then he'd be in the HOF for sure. Pshh, That's how things fall though. The problem with If he would have gotten that 4-1 call and he had made it, then the packers would have totally gone on to the super bowl and won it, is a completely baseless argument. What if they went for it on 4-1 and didn't get it. Or what If they got it, but then there was a fumble or intereception or they didn't get the TD or whatever the hell they needed (I have no idea what 4th and 1 call you guys are talking about.) Overall, in his career, was he a Hall of Famer? No. Not even close. He may have sniffed at some of the HOFers shoes for a couple years, but there's no way he was that good.

It's just like comparing Greens numbers to All Day's- A future hall of famer. Green has almost 1000 more in 5 years! Wow, 1000 of that comes from Recieving. Oh, but AP averages 9.6 yards per recieving play and Green averaged 7.8. Huh. That's wierd, maybe it's because Green had 200 more plays than him and Green was in on 3rd downs. People weren't putting 8 in the box to stop Green. Green never carried his team. How many Touchdowns does AP have in 5 years? 64. How many does Green have in his whole career? 14. AP is twice the player on one of his worst days than Green was on his best. There's no comparrison. That's the problem, you might be able to compare him to guys who barely got into the hall, but the second you stand him next to any great player, the argument falls away.

Now will you guys stop all this crazy talk about Amhan Green and the Hall of Fame?

Green or Grant? Green has 60 rushing TDs in his career. His best season was 15 in 2003. He has 74 total with 5 receiving TDs in that same year. AP still hasn't combined for 20 TDs in a single year.

Green also had 1883 yards in 2003. AP's highest? 1760. On 8 more carries. Which means that AP averaged 4.8 yards per carry in his best season and Green averaged 5.3. Funny thing is that Green has the highest seasonal yardage for an RB who didn't win the rushing title (Jamal Lewis had 2066 that year). Which also means that on Green's best day, he was actually better than AP as a runner. :| Whoops.

Adrian's a better runner in that he's had more years that are consistently good, but Green was better all around.

[Tony Oday]

Put down the crack pipe. Any person that watches football would take AP over Green all day long.

[Fritz]

We talk a lot about homerism on Packerrats, but sometimes I think we undervalue some of our own.

The AP vs. Green debate may be in some ways like the Barry Sanders/Emmitt Smith debate. It all depends on which flavor you like best.

In my opinion, AP may be a better "pure" runner, but not by as much as you guys seem to think.

And you can't pretend that AP can catch the ball or block as well as Green.

Both great backs, though. I'm not saying AP's not great. He is.

[woodbuck27]

We talk a lot about homerism on Packerrats, but sometimes I think we undervalue some of our own.

The AP vs. Green debate may be in some ways like the Barry Sanders/Emmitt Smith debate. It all depends on which flavor you like best.

In my opinion, AP may be a better "pure" runner, but not by as much as you guys seem to think.

And you can't pretend that AP can catch the ball or block as well as Green.

Both great backs, though. I'm not saying AP's not great. He is.

Why are we comparing AP with AG?

Isn't the question? Was Ahman Green a great Packer RB or not?

IMO he certainly was.

[Pugger]

Let's get back OT. I heard Grant is visiting NE.

[mraynrand]

Let's get back OT. I heard Grant is visiting NE.

I thought Grant was a RB, not an OT.

[Harlan Huckleby]

Why is no mention made of Green's recent work with the Omaha Nighthawks and Montreal Alouettes?

[pittstang5]

So I'm guessing there has been no interest from the Packers camp on resigning Grant? So right now, Starks, Saine and Green are the only backs on the Roster? Who knows when Green will be available leaving Starks and Saine.

Pretty much tells me TT will be taking a RB somewhere next week....guessing in the 3 to 5 round range. Probably with one of those 4th round Comp Picks is my guess.

[Smidgeon]

Put down the crack pipe. Any person that watches football would take AP over Green all day long.

I would too. I was just pointing out that the disparity between AP and Green wasn't as great as the previous post claimed.

[Tony Oday]

And I am stating that a back like AP would have been even BETTER on the Pack.

[Smidgeon]

And I am stating that a back like AP would have been even BETTER on the Pack.

Perhaps as a runner, but I don't think he would have been the third down receiver on the Packers (except maybe this last year).

[Pugger]

I thought Grant was a RB, not an OT.


Here OT means On Topic.

[Bretsky]

So I'm guessing there has been no interest from the Packers camp on resigning Grant? So right now, Starks, Saine and Green are the only backs on the Roster? Who knows when Green will be available leaving Starks and Saine.

Pretty much tells me TT will be taking a RB somewhere next week....guessing in the 3 to 5 round range. Probably with one of those 4th round Comp Picks is my guess.


With the 28th pick in round one of the NFL Draft, the Green Bay Packers select Doug Martin

That would be a zinger; it would not surprise me

[MJZiggy]

B, as to your sig. Can you send me the latest email you have and I'll see if it matches an email that I have for him. Last time I reached out, he didn't respond.

[Deputy Nutz]

Rastak doesn't like you, he told me in a very detailed email, that he would love to come back, but because of you he will never, ever come back. Pretty horrible stuff.


Anyways, If I was a Packer fan, I would jump on the Brandon Saine train.

[Bretsky]

B, as to your sig. Can you send me the latest email you have and I'll see if it matches an email that I have for him. Last time I reached out, he didn't respond.


I don't have his email anymore......it was on my last pc which is deseased

Just send me his email and I will try. I think the Favre hating bunch sent him away a while back

[woodbuck27]

Couple of things....

First, I think you really mis-speak when you use the term "all around guys." I take that - and I think most people have taken that - to mean someone who has a variety of the kinds of skills a RB can have. Obviously, running the ball well is one, but you can divide that into inside and outside ability. Then there's pass blocking, as someone mentioned. Then there's receiving out of the backfield.

By that definition, Barry Sanders was in no way an "all around guy." He was in fact one-dimensional. He had a distinct distaste for both pass blocking and for going out of the backfield to catch the ball. Wayne Fontes, the Lions' coach, wanted to use Sanders' open field ability by getting him out in the flat for some passes, but Sanders did not want to do that and in fact if you look at his career stats he didn't catch too many passes.

He was also not a guy who would go up the middle for one or two yards. Now, he might go up the middle after some dancing, and get you thirty yards. But if a coach needed a yard and a half and wanted a guy to just take the ball and go up the gut, Sanders was not the guy to choose.

Finally, he did not have breakaway speed. He was perhaps the shiftiest, most-difficult-to-tackle running back that ever played, and he could gash teams for big, big gains, but he did not have take-it-to-the-house speed.

I[m not saying he wasn't a great back. He was incredible to watch - I saw him surrounded by three or four tacklers a number of times, and they just couldn't find him to tackle him. He was wonderful. He was elite.

But he wasn't what you'd call an "all around guy."

Secondly, you used the word "great" backs earlier. I do wonder how different people define that. For some, longevity is a key, so a guy like Emmitt Smith, whom I never thought was a truly great, great back, is considered great. He was consistent for a lot of years. For others, longevity is not quite as important as a few great, great years.

For my money, Earl Campbell in his prime was one of the most punishing, gifted backs I've ever had the good fortune to watch. Nobody really enjoyed trying to tackle that guy, and he carried those Houston teams on his back, along with a whole lot of defenders. Having seen only a little footage of Jim Brown, I imagine that Campbell is as close as I've ever come to seeing someone like the great Jim Brown.

When I come back I want to experience it just like you. To learn that you saw 'the GREAT' Barry Sanders and Earl Campbell play...PRECIOUS. I noted your respect for 'the Greatest (aguably) 'football player' Jim Brown.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jim_Brown

Many older or long time time Packer fans will say it's their guy; Don Hutson.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Don_Hutson

I'd be surprized if it isn't Jim Brown (according to the EXPERTS). Jim Brown's career was rather short before he retired and dabbled in acting and moved to more basic pursuits .

OK ... I just checked that out:

"Football's 100 Greatest Players: #1 Jim Brown" (http://web.archive.org/web/20080916111521/http://archive.sportingnews.com/nfl/100/1.html). The Sporting News. Archived from the original (http://archive.sportingnews.com/nfl/100/1.html) on September 16, 2008. http://web.archive.org/web/20080916111521/http://archive.sportingnews.com/nfl/100/1.html. Retrieved April 1, 2008. " Wikipedia

Fritz ... your a lucky fella to see Barry Sanders and Earl Campbell and likely John Brockington and Ahman Green carry the pigskin.

GO PACKERS !

[Tony Oday]

http://www.boston.com/sports/football/patriots/extra_points/2012/04/pats_host_trio.html

[Deputy Nutz]

I don't have his email anymore......it was on my last pc which is deseased

Just send me his email and I will try. I think the Favre hating bunch sent him away a while back

Or he got a life and just doesn't have time for this place anymore. Packer fans simply aren't nice people and treated him pretty horribly, especially Ziggy.

Favre stuff got pretty out of hand, but it is pretty much over now, except for that menace Scott Campbell.

[Harlan Huckleby]

Rastak doesn't like you, he told me in a very detailed email, that he would love to come back, but because of you he will never, ever come back. Pretty horrible stuff.


Anyways, If I was a Packer fan, I would jump on the Brandon Saine train. You sound eerily like that Cleft Crusty guy.

I think Rastak left because he has standards, he went and found a forum run by an American. Maybe I should do same. Anybody got any suggestions?

[Deputy Nutz]

Barry Sanders had a third down back in Mel Gray. Sanders also was pulled later in his career as a goaline back. Still think he was one of if not the most gifted ball carrier in NFL history.

I think a lot of people don't give Emmit Smith enough credit, sure he had a great offensive line, but he managed to play for so long, and dominate. Field vision and ability to take over a game is second to none.

Brown was a dominant runner, no doubt about that, but he was also a man amongst boys. He was bigger and stronger than most defensive ends at the time, and faster than any defensive back.

Walter Payton, probably had all the gifts, a rich man's Emmit Smith.
For my money give me Herman Truegoode. Hell of an athlete, speed, hands, and vision.

[Cleft Crusty]

Brown was a dominant runner, no doubt about that, but he was also a man amongst boys. He was bigger and stronger than most defensive ends at the time, and faster than any defensive back. .

Few people realize that Jim Brown was only tackled three times in his entire career. Just watch the highlight tapes and you will see.

[Cleft Crusty]

You sound eerily like that Cleft Crusty guy.

You really know how to hurt a guy. If I were 80 years younger I would beat you up.

[woodbuck27]

Or he got a life and just doesn't have time for this place anymore. Packer fans simply aren't nice people and treated him pretty horribly, especially Ziggy.

Favre stuff got pretty out of hand, but it is pretty much over now, except for that menace Scott Campbell.

That post reveals 'the ugliness' that has existed and to a degree exists presently and must forever be extinguished at Packerrats.

That post offers us another version of 'the Naked Truth'. A TRUTH that I have seen for too long.

If you treat a person badly it will always come back to get you.... 'to haunt you'.

Your never safe in your vanity and hauty desire. You can 'only' hide so long. You'll always know who 'you' are. Ever read this story? Read it for understanding ...to learn.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Emperor's_New_Clothes

Scott Campbell is obvious.

He's a mere pawn and actually insignificant in his brash attitudes that are as subtle as 'a kick in the head'. He cannot roam through Packerrats without being naked. Without his drum announcement. Scott Campbell is rather immature and harmless.

Menace? NO! More like 'a Dennis the menace'. He can be duped by a person who thirsts for real power. He's about as scary as a puppy.

It's this person that needs to change:

'You' wear a significantly more unappealing mask. 'YOU' need to get off 'your pony' get on 'a horse'. It's 'YOU' that needs to contact and apologize to RASTAK.

When he was shoved out of Packerats did 'YOU' do this Forum any honor?

'YOU' can get him back. 'YOU' need to step up and do that.

[Deputy Nutz]

Sweet mother of god.

If Ryan Grant were alive today, he would roll over in his grave if he read this thread

[pittstang5]

With the 28th pick in round one of the NFL Draft, the Green Bay Packers select Doug Martin

That would be a zinger; it would not surprise me

Best Buy would love it, because I'd be there early Friday morning buying a new TV to replace the one I would have destroyed if that happens.

[mraynrand]

Scott Campbell is obvious.

QFT

[Cheesehead Craig]

Sweet mother of god.

If Ryan Grant were alive today, he would roll over in his grave if he read this thread

BOMNF!

[woodbuck27]

B, as to your sig. Can you send me the latest email you have and I'll see if it matches an email that I have for him. Last time I reached out, he didn't respond.

If you've tried to do that I commend you.

If you succeed in getting him back I applaud you. It takes 'a real person' to understand what's necessary to make ammends when he/she is wrong.

Good Luck.

[Scott Campbell]

That post reveals 'the ugliness' that has existed and to a degree exists presently and must forever be extinguished at Packerrats.

That post offers us another version of 'the Naked Truth'. A TRUTH that I have seen for too long.

If you treat a person badly it will always come back to get you.... 'to haunt you'.

Your never safe in your vanity and hauty desire. You can 'only' hide so long. You'll always know who 'you' are. Ever read this story? Read it for understanding ...to learn.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Emperor's_New_Clothes

Scott Campbell is obvious.

He's a mere pawn and actually insignificant in his brash attitudes that are as subtle as 'a kick in the head'. He cannot roam through Packerrats without being naked. Without his drum announcement. Scott Campbell is rather immature and harmless.

Menace? NO! More like 'a Dennis the menace'. He can be duped by a person who thirsts for real power. He's about as scary as a puppy.

It's this person that needs to change:

'You' wear a significantly more unappealing mask. 'YOU' need to get off 'your pony' get on 'a horse'. It's 'YOU' that needs to contact and apologize to RASTAK.

When he was shoved out of Packerats did 'YOU' do this Forum any honor?

'YOU' can get him back. 'YOU' need to step up and do that.




That red font really gives his rants that extra "pop".

[mraynrand]

He cannot roam through Packerrats without being naked.

Only in the Garbage Can.

[Scott Campbell]

He (Scott Campbell) can be duped by a person who thirsts for real power. .



That is true.


http://msnbcmedia.msn.com/j/MSNBC/Components/Photo/_new/111219-team-america-world-police-9a.380;380;7;70.jpg


Kim seemed like such a nice young man.

[mraynrand]

It takes 'a real person' to understand what's necessary to make ammends when he/she is wrong.

That's the spirit - keep up the good fight, Woody!
http://motivationalsmartass.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/09/toystory-woody.jpg

[Iron Mike]

That's the spirit - keep up the good fight, Woody!
http://www.jazz.com/assets/2007/12/21/albumcoverWoodyHerman-BlowinUpAStorm.jpg?1198220396

Fixed.