O Line

[Packnut]

http://www.packersnews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060818/PKR07/608180455/1989


Look's like I'm not the only one who believes TT should be held accountable for our O line situation. The man makes a good amount of cash with a job many of us would give anything to have. IF Atlanta does to us what SD did, then TT had better step up and trade one of his precious picks for some help at guard.

I know several of you are gonna say it was Sherman's fault and TT should get time to develope the rookies, but that is not acceptable. This is the kind of situation that separates the Good GM's from the weak ones. IF we get killed on the O line for ANOTHER season and he sits back and does nothing, then he needs to be held accountable.

[]{ilr]3]

Hoping for the best, but its hard to imagine there will be improvement sooner rather than later.

Hard to get your offense rolling with out good plays by the offensive line. Its also hard to see them being able to bring in anyone that can be an improvement over what we currently have. I dont think Denver or Atlanta are going to be sending anyone our way.

This is frustrating about TT and his decisions on the line, but over all I have been pretty pleased with what he has done so far.

[PaCkFan_n_MD]

You say make a trade, but for who? Who are we going to trade for. Say we trade a 2nd or a 3rd, who are we going to get for that. Best bet, which you already mentioned, is to stay with our rookes and watch them develop rather than waste a pick.

[prsnfoto]

http://www.packersnews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060818/PKR07/608180455/1989


Look's like I'm not the only one who believes TT should be held accountable for our O line situation. The man makes a good amount of cash with a job many of us would give anything to have. IF Atlanta does to us what SD did, then TT had better step up and trade one of his precious picks for some help at guard.

I know several of you are gonna say it was Sherman's fault and TT should get time to develope the rookies, but that is not acceptable. This is the kind of situation that separates the Good GM's from the weak ones. IF we get killed on the O line for ANOTHER season and he sits back and does nothing, then he needs to be held accountable.

Good post and ultimately his future will depend on this choice he made, if the pack is not a playoff team by 2008 TT will be unemployed as he should be. I think he sees the writing on the wall and will make some kind of move before the season starts this Oline has serious depth problems so any vet or two would be a smart move at this point.

[Packnut]

{ilr]3]Hoping for the best, but its hard to imagine there will be improvement sooner rather than later.

Hard to get your offense rolling with out good plays by the offensive line. Its also hard to see them being able to bring in anyone that can be an improvement over what we currently have. I dont think Denver or Atlanta are going to be sending anyone our way.

This is frustrating about TT and his decisions on the line, but over all I have been pretty pleased with what he has done so far.

I agree that he has made a few good moves and his draft look's promising. However, those moves mean nothing if your QB's get killed! For those of you who doubt me, throw in the tape from the Bears game last season. They beat the hell out of Brett and then spent the following week boasting about it.

As it stands right now, I'm real worried about what the Bears D is gonna do against the O line we have now.

[Packnut]

You say make a trade, but for who? Who are we going to trade for. Say we trade a 2nd or a 3rd, who are we going to get for that. Best bet, which you already mentioned, is to stay with our rookes and watch them develop rather than waste a pick.

So while our rookies are learning, what happens to our QB's? As far as who's out there, that's his job to find SOMEONE. Look I love draft picks as much as the next guy but this situation is desperate right now. I can't say who is and is'nt available and who he should try and get because we are not privy to that kind of info.

I'm also not advocating some big time trade. All I'm saying is trade a 3 or 4 for another team's back-up with experience who can at least come in and protect our QB. There are a few teams out there with solid O lines that might be willing to trade a back-up.

[MJZiggy]

He just did that. Mookie. He will be watching the waiver wire looking for cuts to bring in, but remember whoever he brings in will have to know ZBS, because as we saw last week, cooperation and timing are everything in that system.

[Packnut]

He just did that. Mookie. He will be watching the waiver wire looking for cuts to bring in, but remember whoever he brings in will have to know ZBS, because as we saw last week, cooperation and timing are everything in that system.

I hope he gets some playing time tomorrow night so we can evaluate him. He could go a long way into relieving my nightmares about Brett getting killed in week 1.

[PaCkFan_n_MD]

You say make a trade, but for who? Who are we going to trade for. Say we trade a 2nd or a 3rd, who are we going to get for that. Best bet, which you already mentioned, is to stay with our rookes and watch them develop rather than waste a pick.

So while our rookies are learning, what happens to our QB's? As far as who's out there, that's his job to find SOMEONE. Look I love draft picks as much as the next guy but this situation is desperate right now. I can't say who is and is'nt available and who he should try and get because we are not privy to that kind of info.

I'm also not advocating some big time trade. All I'm saying is trade a 3 or 4 for another team's back-up with experience who can at least come in and protect our QB. There are a few teams out there with solid O lines that might be willing to trade a back-up.

I understand your piont. Believe me I hate to see Brett getting his ass kicked, it's just I think we may be better off keeping our rookies and watching them grow, rather than use a 3rd or 4th on some teams back up who is probabaly not going to be much better.

[Mazzin]

I understand they got Mookie, but why have we heard NOTHING about him yet, didn't he USED to be a starter?

[Packnut]

You say make a trade, but for who? Who are we going to trade for. Say we trade a 2nd or a 3rd, who are we going to get for that. Best bet, which you already mentioned, is to stay with our rookes and watch them develop rather than waste a pick.

So while our rookies are learning, what happens to our QB's? As far as who's out there, that's his job to find SOMEONE. Look I love draft picks as much as the next guy but this situation is desperate right now. I can't say who is and is'nt available and who he should try and get because we are not privy to that kind of info.

I'm also not advocating some big time trade. All I'm saying is trade a 3 or 4 for another team's back-up with experience who can at least come in and protect our QB. There are a few teams out there with solid O lines that might be willing to trade a back-up.

I understand your piont. Believe me I hate to see Brett getting his ass kicked, it's just I think we may be better off keeping our rookies and watching them grow, rather than use a 3rd or 4th on some teams back up who is probabaly not going to be much better.

Well, on the bright side, if Green can get our run game going, the opponents pash rush won't be as strong.

[Packnut]

I understand they got Mookie, but why have we heard NOTHING about him yet, didn't he USED to be a starter?


He's still listed at #3 on the depth chart behind Whitaker.

[Mazzin]

I could have SWORN they moved whittaker to tackle.? anyone?

[Packnut]

I could have SWORN they moved whittaker to tackle.? anyone?

The way they are moving everyone around, who knows. It is strange that they hav'nt talked about Mookie at all. May-be he's injured?

[BooHoo]

It's still too early to tell how the O Line will do. It might work out just fine.

[Brohm]

Whitacker tweaked a hamstring or whatnot and has been sidelined for awhile.

[KYPack]

I could have SWORN they moved whittaker to tackle.? anyone?

Whit's out with the hammy.
He is the back-up RT at this time.

Everything is so shuffled around, it's impossible to look at a depth chart.

Fer instance, JSO lists Cundiff as the 1st team FGK. He's, ah, GONE, JSO!

[4and12to12and4]

I don't understand why there are so many topics started and posts followed that express concern for our guard positions. It amazes me how our RB's, tackles, and tight ends are getting free rides from all of us, when they performed WORSE than the guards from my perspective. This o-line WILL look way more impressive Saturday because Atlantas d-line and blocking scheme is lightyears worse than SD's. SD was about the toughest possible team to go against for the first time these guys played together against real opposition. Their scheme was complicated and dominant. That's why Tauscher, Henderson, and Bubba all looked horrible also. Believe me, after Saturday's game, everyone here will be going on and on about how much improvement there has been in just one more week, and it will not be for improvement's sake, it will be for competition's sake.
Also, I watched Denver's o-line, because I wanted to see this scheme ran "properly" against a good d-line. Denver didn't seem to create many more holes than we did, but their running back was squeezing into very small holes, and was through them quickly. Also, they had ALOT of runs that only netted a couple of yards, but they stuck with it anyways. Another thing I noticed is that Bell and Williams created just as much pressure and problems in the middle as SD did. It's the nature of the scheme. Denver's line, like ours, is dependent on lighter, and more athlitic guys with good feet, but when matched up against the likes of HUGE guys like SD and Detroit have in the middle, who have speed to go along with thier gigantic bodies, it does create a mismatch. This scheme somewhat relies on the defenses larger bodies being slower, so when a GREAT athlete that is also huge comes up against it, they will succeed more times than not. But, then again, they also succeed against traditional man to man schemes also. That's why they end up in the Probowl. They are really good.

[esoxx]

In fairness to our O-line, which I've been very critical of, you make a good point in that it's a new scheme for everyone and will take some time. My understanding is Davenport missed some opportunities that were available against the Chargers. He needs to improve in this zone scheme too or will be waived. They all need to improve and have some type of cohesion.

It's just that my tolerance level for the O-line is low based on last year's debacle.

[Lare]

I agree that it takes a while to get a new blocking scheme down. They've only been practicing this one since April, what do you expect in four months. It's not like it's a simple thing to learn to block the guy in front of you.

[4and12to12and4]

As is everyone's. Yes, Davenport completely whiffed twice that I remember, Bubba whiffed on a LB on an outside move, Henderson got knocked straight backwards almost into Favre, Tauscher got schooled a few times, so this is why I am saying, lets back off the guards if we aren't going to hold all these other guys responsible also. It was just an all around bad game for ALL our blockers. Clifton and Spitz held their own better than anyone else, but that's not saying much. My bet is that they will all look much better against the Falcons. No where near the quality rush of SD. And, they will be going in expecting to HAVE TO play great just to be decent. So, I expect a solid performance from the line this week.

[BooHoo]

In fairness to our O-line, which I've been very critical of, you make a good point in that it's a new scheme for everyone and will take some time. My understanding is Davenport missed some opportunities that were available against the Chargers. He needs to improve in this zone scheme too or will be waived. They all need to improve and have some type of cohesion.

It's just that my tolerance level for the O-line is low based on last year's debacle.

My tolerance level is low for the O-Line also but we have only had one practice game so far. So there is still time to get our stuff together. I will save my negative comments about TT and the O-Line until later in the season.

[esoxx]

I agree that it takes a while to get a new blocking scheme down. They've only been practicing this one since April, what do you expect in four months. It's not like it's a simple thing to learn to block the guy in front of you.

I know it's sarcasm but you're understating things. Of course the zone scheme says block the guy in front of you at it's core level. However, the confusion comes when you have a team that zone blitzes and overloads a side with, say, three rushers. That's where the confusion comes in and SD, those bastards, ran these gimmicks in the first preseason game. I'm glad they didn't "play nice" like many teams do in preseason, running vanilla stuff. This exposed an obvious weakness and it's a good teaching tool on video. It should end up being a good learning experience. Still, I'm a bottom line guy and need to see some results of progress soon. "Throw me a frickin' bone here!"

[4and12to12and4]

I can't wait for the line to do better Sunday, so we can all start sleeping a little better, and renew our hope for a decent season.

[Packnut]

I can't wait for the line to do better Sunday, so we can all start sleeping a little better, and renew our hope for a decent season.


That makes two of us!

[BooHoo]

I can't wait for the line to do better Sunday, so we can all start sleeping a little better, and renew our hope for a decent season.


That makes two of us!

Three of us!!!!!!!!!!

[vince]

I fully expect the o-line to struggle again this early against another stout pass rushing d-line. I also fully expect this week to offer another good learning experience for the youngsters and even the veterans implementing the new scheme. IT'S THE SECOND GAME OF THE PRESEASON WITH AN ENTIRELY NEW SCHEME! Right now, they're thinking about what they have to do, and that makes them slow. Soon they'll react, and their abilities will come out.

Wait until the regular season to get uptight. Stay off the emotional roller coaster. They're young, they're inexperienced, and they're learning. They will get it, but it will take some time. Give it to them - and give it to yourself.