House in a harness

[Harlan Huckleby]

http://www.jsonline.com/sports/packers/shoulder-injury-to-limit-house-all-season-jj6khf4-167508505.html

Tramon Williams sucked when he had to protect a bad shoulder. I wish they would IR House.

[Lurker64]

Tramon's the kind of DB who really needs to get his hands on you to excel, so playing with the harness really hurt his game.

House, on the other hand, can run with darn near anybody in the game (he just needs to avoid losing steps in transition). The harness will hold him back some, but not as much as it held back Tramon, once House gets used to it.

[Harlan Huckleby]

House is no stud, and tackling WAS one of his strengths. I'd rather throw the rookie out there.

I don't know these players very well, just shooting from the recliner

[Lurker64]

House is no stud, and tackling WAS one of his strengths. I'd rather throw the rookie out there.

I don't know these players very well, just shooting from the recliner

Tramon needs to get his hands on you to keep you from getting past him. House just needs to not lose steps in transition to keep you from getting past him.

One of these stat lines is Davon House, the other is Morris Claiborne, picked #6 overall by the Dallas Cowboys.
5111, 188, 4.43/2.58/1.56 (40/20/10), 34.5" vert, 118" broad, 4.12 shuttle, 7.01 cone
6004, 200, 4.37/2.55/1.56 (40/20/10), 33.5" vert, 109" broad, 4.12 shuttle, 6.65 cone

It's not like House is slow, the reason he fell was because he was inconsistent in college, low-level of competition, and the "losing steps in transition" thing is hard to fix (Al Harris never fixed it.)

It shouldn't be a Tramonesque dropoff. Even with the harness, he could be better outside than Bush, Hayward, or Shields.

[RashanGary]

Both Tramon and Woodson healed over the course of an off season. House has had three weeks now. We have Hayward, Tramon, Shields and Bush to play. If they can give him 2 or three more weeks off, it will be nothing like the Tramon/Woodson situations. Those two guys played the next week. House is younger (younger guys heal better.) House gets several weeks off before having to get tossed in the fire (5,6, 7 times the rest of the other two depending on how much longer he sits.)

I don't think keeping House on the roster is such a bad thing, especially if they give him a week or two into the season before they bring him back.

[pbmax]

I dunno Lurk. House himself said Tramon was in a better spot to adjust to the harness and limited shoulder strength and flexibility and Twill struggled mightily with it last year. Woodson has also worn one. Now House is young, so he might be in a better position to cope than he thinks (as you make the case) and he might be over-estimating the skills Williams has that he does not. But he thinks is going to be tough to change his game up.

So his first hurdle might be his own head.

http://www.jsonline.com/blogs/sports/167488405.html

[pbmax]

Tramon needs to get his hands on you to keep you from getting past him. House just needs to not lose steps in transition to keep you from getting past him.

One of these stat lines is Davon House, the other is Morris Claiborne, picked #6 overall by the Dallas Cowboys.
5111, 188, 4.43/2.58/1.56 (40/20/10), 34.5" vert, 118" broad, 4.12 shuttle, 7.01 cone
6004, 200, 4.37/2.55/1.56 (40/20/10), 33.5" vert, 109" broad, 4.12 shuttle, 6.65 cone

It's not like House is slow, the reason he fell was because he was inconsistent in college, low-level of competition, and the "losing steps in transition" thing is hard to fix (Al Harris never fixed it.)

It shouldn't be a Tramonesque dropoff. Even with the harness, he could be better outside than Bush, Hayward, or Shields.

Oh and which is which? I think House is 5' 11", right?

And was the losing steps in transition knock due to the cone drill, tape or both?

[RashanGary]

And was the losing steps in transition knock due to the cone drill, tape or both?


House is the guy who's taller and ran the blazing fast 3-cone. He's extremely athletic.


This is not as bad as the Woodson/Williams situations. House gets time to heal. It's very, very different. I think they should keep him down a week or two more. Let that shoulder really heal.

[Harlan Huckleby]

This is not as bad as the Woodson/Williams situations. House gets time to heal. It's very, very different. I think they should keep him down a week or two more. Let that shoulder really heal.

It's not a two week or two month deal. He is expected to need that harness for the whole season. The doctors are afraid the shoulder is vulnerable to another seperation, or subluxation - you could look it up. It will heal, but over long period.

I don't trust any stats or measurements that suggests a player will be OK at cornerback with a friggin harness limiting range of motion. That's an acrobatic position.

On the other hand, I really don't know. Lurker may be onto something, other than the usual meth pipe.

[Tony Oday]

House doesn't have nerve damage...different injury than Tramon.

[pbmax]

House doesn't have nerve damage...different injury than Tramon.

Are you certain of that? Was that question asked or has it simply not been mentioned?

Did Tramon even play in a harness or was it just damage and no separation for him?

[Patler]

NFL players have been using harnesses like this for 50 years. Some players adapt well to it. Some don't. We have no idea yet whether this will bother House a great deal, or just a little. If he sucks while wearing it, he simply won't play much. Sort of like those who have broken hands, and have a "club" during games. Some players seem bothered a lot with it, for others you hardly notice it affecting them at all.

[rbaloha1]

Tramon needs to get his hands on you to keep you from getting past him. House just needs to not lose steps in transition to keep you from getting past him.

One of these stat lines is Davon House, the other is Morris Claiborne, picked #6 overall by the Dallas Cowboys.
5111, 188, 4.43/2.58/1.56 (40/20/10), 34.5" vert, 118" broad, 4.12 shuttle, 7.01 cone
6004, 200, 4.37/2.55/1.56 (40/20/10), 33.5" vert, 109" broad, 4.12 shuttle, 6.65 cone

It's not like House is slow, the reason he fell was because he was inconsistent in college, low-level of competition, and the "losing steps in transition" thing is hard to fix (Al Harris never fixed it.)

It shouldn't be a Tramonesque dropoff. Even with the harness, he could be better outside than Bush, Hayward, or Shields.

Again -- meaningless numbers.

Its impossible to determine how much the injury affects House until actual game action.

It is time for someone to step-up -- appears to be Bush. IMO we should be alright.

[mmmdk]

NFL players have been using harnesses like this for 50 years. Some players adapt well to it. Some don't. We have no idea yet whether this will bother House a great deal, or just a little. If he sucks while wearing it, he simply won't play much. Sort of like those who have broken hands, and have a "club" during games. Some players seem bothered a lot with it, for others you hardly notice it affecting them at all.

Who knows? Snoopy knows!

Btw, if I had a pair of clubs I think I could make it in the NFL. :wink:

[PaCkFan_n_MD]

If you listen to his interview on packers.com he doesn’t sound too confident about it. He says there are many movements he can’t make with his arm and that he probably will have to change the way he plays receivers on the line. Definitely sounds like he will have to change his style of play. I seriously doubt he will able to play at his best, although we don’t really even know what his best is yet.

[BobDobbs]

I don't think that they can IR House right away. He looked good and we get to see if his shoulder can heal. Of course the Packers aren't going to tell us what's actually wrong. Tramon lost strength, House says he's going to lose reach. It was disturbing to read that he feels he can't play in people's face. I mean you have to be able to do that.

Is he playing on Thursday? Seems like if he's ready that would be a good game to get him some snaps and see how he looks.

[mraynrand]

LeRoy Butler played in a harness for several games in 1997. Even though the Pack gave up a ton of points to MN, Butler had one of his better games as a pro in a win at Lambeau. But that's a seasoned vet, not a raw - second year guy just getting on the field.* Seems like putting Bishop on IR gives them some flexibility (ahem) with House. Let him heal and see what he ca do.



*What do you call House, a red-shirt rookie?

[Smidgeon]

Tramon needs to get his hands on you to keep you from getting past him. House just needs to not lose steps in transition to keep you from getting past him.

One of these stat lines is Davon House, the other is Morris Claiborne, picked #6 overall by the Dallas Cowboys.
5111, 188, 4.43/2.58/1.56 (40/20/10), 34.5" vert, 118" broad, 4.12 shuttle, 7.01 cone
6004, 200, 4.37/2.55/1.56 (40/20/10), 33.5" vert, 109" broad, 4.12 shuttle, 6.65 cone

It's not like House is slow, the reason he fell was because he was inconsistent in college, low-level of competition, and the "losing steps in transition" thing is hard to fix (Al Harris never fixed it.)

It shouldn't be a Tramonesque dropoff. Even with the harness, he could be better outside than Bush, Hayward, or Shields.

So if House didn't lose steps in transition, would his cone or shuttle look better? I know those numbers don't mean much if they don't translate to the field (see Hawk, A.J.), but I'm simply curious if any of the combine drills would account for that.

[Freak Out]

He'll basically have one arm tied behind his back out there....seems like the guy to pick on so we'll see how well he'll be able to play pretty fast once he's on the field.

[PaCkFan_n_MD]

I think Sam is the safest start this year. He has experience and we know he is at least decent. Let House get healthy.

[Lurker64]

Oh and which is which? I think House is 5' 11", right?

And was the losing steps in transition knock due to the cone drill, tape or both?


House is the second player. But the stat lines are interchangeable enough to make the point that House is not a slouch on his feet.

Losing steps in transition doesn't have anything to do with either drill. He loses steps when he has to adjust to where he has to go on the fly. If he knows (or thinks he knows) where he needs to go on a route, he'll be fine. He was actually better adapting to adjusting to routes on the fly prior to his injury in the SD game than he ever was at NMSU, so it's conceivable he's on his way to correcting the problem (which would be fantastic.)

He does need to work on his hands, since he's not the technician that Williams is or Harris is, but it's entirely conceivable that overcoming the mental hurdle of playing with the harness will actually improve his footwork.

[rbaloha1]

I think Sam is the safest start this year. He has experience and we know he is at least decent. Let House get healthy.

IMO based on recent performance its Bush (I know its hard to believe.)

Heyward was drafted specifically for the zone coverage and imo is the number 2 option.

SS is better in bump and run. Unfortunately Capers is more of zone guy.

[pbmax]

He'll basically have one arm tied behind his back out there....seems like the guy to pick on so we'll see how well he'll be able to play pretty fast once he's on the field.

They should just harness, support and plaster cast his bad arm in the extended upward position like a statue. Just think of the pass deflections that might cause. And if your guys catches it anyway, just clobber him with it like a mace.

[RashanGary]

They should just harness, support and plaster cast his bad arm in the extended upward position like a statue. Just think of the pass deflections that might cause. And if your guys catches it anyway, just clobber him with it like a mace.

From February 1st (end of playoff run) to May 21st (OTA's), you have 13 weeks of an off season.


If House starts practicing next week Thursday, he'll have 4 weeks rest/recovery.

If they start practicing him without letting him do the aggressive bump coverage or laying into guys with his shoulder, they could practice him for another 4 weeks while still letting him recover. That's 8 weeks keeping strain off the shoulder while still allowing him to get practice.

Woodson's injury was similar. I believe his was separated. Woodson was what? 35 years old. House is 23. The doctors have been impressed with how far he's come.

I highly doubt this shoulder injury is a problem. Wood and Twill tell him the challenges, but I don't think anyone is taking into consideration how much more time this guy has had to rehab/rest than they did. I'd like to see him back for week 4 or 5. The way he played in that first preseson game, I think he's well worth the 3 or 4 week wait, and a guy his age, as fast as the doctors are saying his shoulder has progressed. . . . I think he'd be at or near 100.
*
If they bring him back sooner, that just shows how confident they are that he can play with it because they can give him 12 weeks off the thing and still have him for the 2nd half of the season and playoffs.


Again, this is very, very different than those other two guys. Healing, rehab, rest, strength, are very much related to time. Everyone, everywhere has compared these injuries. Nobody has taken time into consideration.