OFFICIAL PACKERS VS SAINTS GAME DAY THREAD

[Rutnstrut]

19 rushes in game. Stuff a sock in it.

So you are denying that the run is working? The run is what made this drive.

[red]

that shovel pass to cobb is gonna drive d's nuts this year if we use it once or twice a game

[mmmdk]

that shovel pass to cobb is gonna drive d's nuts this year if we use it once or twice a game

...but when will the fucking preseason end?

[pbmax]

So you are denying that the run is working?

I am denying the coach "forgot" about it.

[gbgary]

very nice! now...how about some D here dom!?

[pbmax]

that shovel pass to cobb is gonna drive d's nuts this year if we use it once or twice a game

Yep. Going to be open with safeties back.

[mmmdk]

RUSH BREES OR LOSE, CAPERS!

[Guiness]

So you are denying that the run is working? The run is what made this drive,

jesus h, you are thick, or a a really bad troll. And you suck at it. In case it's the former, he was pointing out that we've run it often enough to have balance.

btw an answer to me is pointless right now. Welcome to my ignore list.

[Rutnstrut]

Nelson is some kind of pissed off after that play. Replay shows the guy had him in a headlock and twisted him around. Lucky someone pulled him away, he was about to get himself an unsportsmanlike.

Sometimes I wish football was like hockey and they could duke it out;)

[pbmax]

Anyone but Triplette!

[gbgary]

We'll get screwed here.

[Guiness]

That ball is OUT.

[red]

fucking refs still suck

the nfl is trying to fuck us hard this year

[Packers4Glory]

boned again.

this has to be some sort of record of screw jobs to one team.

[mmmdk]

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOO

[pbmax]

Terrible blown call.

[Teamcheez1]

I want the replacement refs back. They didn't miss this many calls.

[KalamazooPackerFan]

Are we sure these are the "real" refs?

[Iron Mike]

And "Green Bay Ass Rape 2012" continues......

[Packers4Glory]

you know they are gonna go down and score and we lose. bank on it folks. it's that kind of yr where nothing goes right.

[pbmax]

Be smart Chuck

[red]

nice bull shit chants in the stadium

[mmmdk]

Be smart Chuck

He wasn't there!

[Fosco33]

I can't fucking believe how bad we r getting absolutely fucked. This is amazing. You'd think the football gods have it out for us. I'm in disbelief.

[pbmax]

YES!

[gbgary]

time for an int

[Fosco33]

Wonder what the NFL will tell us - that the refs got the call right?

[pbmax]

CJ Wilson with a nice hump move

[mmmdk]

I can't fucking believe how bad we r getting absolutely fucked. This is amazing. You'd think the football gods have it out for us. I'm in disbelief.

Goodell said to refs: DON'T HAND PACKERS ANY FAVORS - HERE'S YOUR GOLD.

[Packers4Glory]

wide open..every time

[pbmax]

DJ playing better.

[red]

how do you stay motivated to play when you continue to do things to win a game yet continue to get screwed in very obvious ways by the refs?

i was barely able to turn the game on. didn't watch any of the early games today. after the way the nfl fucked us last week i have lost all respect for them and tgheir product.

the fact that its the packers is the only reason i turned in. and i watch my team get fucked again

[Guiness]

Trying to draw them offside?

[pbmax]

DOG? Must Punt!

[pbmax]

Jiminy XMas

[red]

WHAT THE FUCK IS THAT BULL SHIT?

there was no time out

[Fosco33]

These refs need a few weeks to warm up.... this is just bad.

[pbmax]

Dammit

[red]

Goodell said to refs: DON'T HAND PACKERS ANY FAVORS - HERE'S YOUR GOLD.

they'll say. you guys were the ones that wanted these assholes. you got them

[mmmdk]

I hate NFL refs.

[pbmax]

TO legitimate

[Guiness]

What happened there? The Saints called a time out?

Ok, replay shows they did.

[pbmax]

McMillan jumped wrong route. Another four or five man rush getting nowhere.

[Packers4Glory]

gonna waste time and kick a FG to win it. GB won't have much time to counter

[Guiness]

Still shoulda denied it as payback. It's CB's that are supposed to have no memory.

[pbmax]

Why dive at peoples feet on the outside! Hold them and wait for help!

[mmmdk]

TACKLE CHUCK

[pbmax]

Picket in game with harness.

[pbmax]

That time Matthews got close enough to hurry Brees.

[pbmax]

10 yards! 53 yd FG now

[pbmax]

Oh my God

[Packers4Glory]

stupid fuckers

[mmmdk]

10 yards! 53 yd FG now

No away kicker miss at Lambeau.

[pbmax]

4th quarter comeback still alive for Rodgers due to missed FG. That's some stat they have going there.

[Packers4Glory]

heavy does of benson and underneath shit

[mmmdk]

No away kicker miss at Lambeau.

BUT THIS ONE DOES!

[red]

did the football gods (goodell) just crack a small smile?

[Rutnstrut]

Now they better RUN THE DAMN BALL!!!!

[pbmax]

4 yards OK.

[mmmdk]

heavy does of benson and underneath shit

You're cruel :lol:

[Packers4Glory]

just hope Benson doesn't fumble

[pbmax]

heavy does of benson and underneath shit

Just need one first down. They had only one TO before CBen run.

[mmmdk]

just hope Benson doesn't fumble

:shock:

[red]

why stretch it out?

run up the middle

[Packers4Glory]

need a 1st to ice it....so you know they won't.

[mmmdk]

3rd down and a Brees coming....?

[Gunakor]

why stretch it out?

run up the middle

Takes more time off the clock.

[pbmax]

Two minute warning will expire. Can throw and leave 1:45 after punt.

Can run and leave 1:05 after punt.

[red]

Takes more time off the clock.

only like 2 or 3 seconds though

[Packers4Glory]

I say go 4 wide and run a draw up the middle...

but you know we'll play action, which nobody will bite on, and throw a homerun ball.

[pbmax]

I think you have to run it.

[Rutnstrut]

I would like to see a QB keeper play here, but yes no matter what run it.

[Gunakor]

only like 2 or 3 seconds though

Right, and that play ended with 3 seconds to spare before having to run a play before the 2 minute warning.

[pbmax]

only like 2 or 3 seconds though

Important 2-3 seconds on both runs. It took them past 2 minute warning before 3rd down,

[Packers4Glory]

i'll take that shovel pass to cobb again

[mmmdk]

I say go 4 wide and run a draw up the middle...

but you know we'll play action, which nobody will bite on, and throw a homerun ball.

This!

[pbmax]

Naked boot.

How the HELL did he catch that?

[mmmdk]

CATCH

[red]

got a 1st but man, do i hate the call

empty backfield at that point? wtf?

[mmmdk]

Naked boot.

How the HELL did he catch that?

That was Jordy, right? :lol:

[mmmdk]

got a 1st but man, do i hate the call

empty backfield at that point? wtf?

Liked it, AR can run.

[Brandon494]

You knew damn well they were going to throw it.

[KalamazooPackerFan]

James Jones is showing his value today

[Guiness]

got a 1st but man, do i hate the call

empty backfield at that point? wtf?

Maybe, but how's that crow tasting?

Dagger? A little premature?

[gbgary]

dodged a bullet. can't believe he threw that...and jones caught it blind.

[mmmdk]

Packers win, no thanks to a lot of things!

[pbmax]

Security had to point out the Saints head coach!

[pbmax]

You knew damn well they were going to throw it.

And I disagree with that call. But happy for win either way.

[red]

Maybe, but how's that crow tasting?

Dagger? A little premature?

fuck you guiness

asshole

[Brandon494]

I trust ARod picking up a first down over our defense holding their offense. I liked the call, didn't play scared and went for the win.

[channtheman]

Had to throw there. If the Saints get the ball with 1:20 or 1:50, they would have won.

[channtheman]

Also, wtf is up with the shittiest refs reffing the Packers games two weeks in a row?

[red]

James Jones is showing his value today

dude finally looked like the players we all thought he was gonna turn in to about 3 or 4 years ago

huge game

[mmmdk]

Had to throw there. If the Saints get the ball with 1:20 or 1:50, they would have won.

I agree 100%.

[Brohm]

Always hated watching Triplette reffed games. Bad draw to get his crew after the monday debacle

[Joemailman]

I hope the 2 trolls on here aren't taking the win too hard.

[Guiness]

fuck you guiness

asshole

What's wrong? Truth hurts?


DAGGER

season over

[Fosco33]

Gotta think - that may be a turning point game. After all the bs in the 2nd half - got a W. Maybe that'll be the spark needed for the road trip.

[Brandon494]

dude finally looked like the players we all thought he was gonna turn in to about 3 or 4 years ago

huge game

James Jones played pretty good last season also.

[Joemailman]

Gotta think - that may be a turning point game. After all the bs in the 2nd half - got a W. Maybe that'll be the spark needed for the road trip.

This team doesn't need a spark. They need a fucking break. I hope they're not emotionally drained after 4 games.

[Harlan Huckleby]

MM almost lost game by wasting a challenge early.

[mmmdk]

This team doesn't need a spark. They need a fucking break. I hope they're not emotionally drained after 4 games.

If they're emotionally drained - fire those who are and spank the rest! :lol:

[LEWCWA]

awsome game today....Brees is a tough sob. D did just enough, play calling was better (enough run calls to keep the D honest) and Ced was close a couple times. Sans Rodgers missing a play and the refs trying to screw them again, this team lined up and beat a good team today.

[pbmax]

MM almost lost game by wasting a challenge early.

Perhaps, but can you challenge a down by contact ruling? That used to be untouchable.

[mmmdk]

MM almost lost game by wasting a challenge early.

Magic Stubby!

[KalamazooPackerFan]

MM almost lost game by wasting a challenge early.

Agreed. he has comeout and said that he will use a challenge when he needs a time out anyway. Hopefully this will teach him but we got hosed on is second challenge so we should have had one left.

[Lurker64]

I would have been okay with another week of the scabrefs if it got Jeff Triplette kicked out of the NFL forever.

I don't think the fumble on the kickoff would have been reviewable even if MM did have a challenge. It was just a bad call on the field.

[pbmax]

Agreed. he has comeout and said that he will use a challenge when he needs a time out anyway. Hopefully this will teach him but we got hosed on is second challenge so we should have had one left.

I don't remember that. But a win on the second challenge would not have earned a 3rd challenge. Need to win both of the originals.

[mmmdk]

At Colts, at Texans & at Rams. Texans destroys Packers; other 2 road games winnable but nothing is given with this Packer team.

[Harlan Huckleby]

Perhaps, but can you challenge a down by contact ruling? That used to be untouchable.

now you got me confused. If they blow the whistle after down by contact, then play is dead, obviously. I think the whistle is issue there.

the announcer was saying that the refs didn't know who recovered the fumble (which I think is dumb speculation) and therefore the fumble was irrelevant.

I think that play would have been reviewable and would have gone packers way.

[digitaldean]

When I thought it couldn't get any worse on the officiating dept, we draw Jeff Tripplett. Colton's PI shove in first qtr., the trap catch by Graham in 2nd qtr and the down by contact crap on the Sproles fumble. Sheesh!
I still don't get why we didn't at least try and jam the WRs at the line.
Kudos for James Jones. He had a great game. That grab to get final 1st down was all effort on his part (even if there was PI called)
MM showed guts on the fake punt run to Kuhn.

[Harlan Huckleby]

said that he will use a challenge when he needs a time out anyway.

ya, this is what Troy Aikman speculated, but I'm not sure that MM confirmed this. As you pointed out, timeouts are only half the issue.

[pbmax]

ya, this is what Troy Aikman speculated, but I'm not sure that MM confirmed this. As you pointed out, timeouts are only half the issue.

Was he out of TOs in the first half? I have never heard of using a challenge as a timeout when you still have timeouts left. It makes no sense.

A timeout to stop the offense talk to the officials then challenge we have seen before.

[Lurker64]

Was he out of TOs in the first half? I have never heard of using a challenge as a timeout when you still have timeouts left. It makes no sense.

A timeout to stop the offense talk to the officials then challenge we have seen before.

I think his perspective is that if there's something challengeable and he was going to take a time out anyway in order to regroup or reconnoiter or somehow change the flow of the game, he will challenge it even if he doesn't expect to win. It's like the challenge of the Brett Swain drop in the Superb Owl. That wasn't a good challenge in terms of "percentage chance of winning it" (since the refs did make the right call) but it was a valid tactic since a review takes longer to run its course than a normal time out, so it gives you more chance to talk to your guys, get things under control, etc.

[pbmax]

If McCarthy has this correct, wouldn't be reviewable:

Mike Vandermause ‏@MikeVandermause
MM: Very frustrating play on Sproles fumble, clearly illustrated on Jumbotron. Refs had blown whistle.

[pbmax]

I think his perspective is that if there's something challengeable and he was going to take a time out anyway in order to regroup or reconnoiter or somehow change the flow of the game, he will challenge it even if he doesn't expect to win. It's like the challenge of the Brett Swain drop in the Superb Owl. That wasn't a good challenge in terms of "percentage chance of winning it" (since the refs did make the right call) but it was a valid tactic since a review takes longer to run its course than a normal time out, so it gives you more chance to talk to your guys, get things under control, etc.

Got it, thanks. Forgot that play and comment. Unsure if that's a good idea in the first half.

[pbmax]

No doubt with M3 about what to call on 3rd down last drive:

Mike Vandermause ‏@MikeVandermause
MM: When we got ball on final drive, I was running on 1st and 2nd down, play to win on third down.

[Harlan Huckleby]

I have never heard of using a challenge as a timeout when you still have timeouts left.

you can only challenge when you have timeouts. If you are going to call a timeout anyway, a challenge is slightly less costly because you aren't risking a timeout, it is otherwise lost anyway.

[pbmax]

you can only challenge when you have timeouts. If you are going to call a timeout anyway, a challenge is slightly less costly because you aren't risking a timeout, it is otherwise lost anyway.

But you have 6 TOs. only 2 challenges. If you commit to challenge even when evidence is not in your favor, you are virtually guaranteeing yourself only 1 more challenge in game. Today was a good example of that backfiring.

In the second half, when there are only 3 remaining TOs and only 30 minutes, its less costly.

[mmmdk]

you can only challenge when you have timeouts. If you are going to call a timeout anyway, a challenge is slightly less costly because you aren't risking a timeout, it is otherwise lost anyway.

I thought so.

[pittstang5]

Missed the game, just now catching up on some of the things that happened. I have questions I hope someone / people can answer.

Defense - were they as bad as the stats suggest (Giving up 446 through the air)?

How did the offense do moving the ball? Good/Bad/ stalls, penalties?

Injuries? - Thought I saw Jennings had to leave with a groin issue? Anything else?

Harrell fumbles on 1st and goal? Really - i saw Rogers had to leave because of an eye poke and Harrell fucks up a handoff? Please tell me that was made up.

Thanks all

[Joemailman]

Missed the game, just now catching up on some of the things that happened. I have questions I hope someone / people can answer.

Defense - were they as bad as the stats suggest (Giving up 446 through the air)?

How did the offense do moving the ball? Good/Bad/ stalls, penalties?

Injuries? - Thought I saw Jennings had to leave with a groin issue? Anything else?

Harrell fumbles on 1st and goal? Really - i saw Rogers had to leave because of an eye poke and Harrell fucks up a handoff? Please tell me that was made up.

Thanks all

Defense was bad. Gave up lots of 1st downs on 3rd and long. Couldn't cover Colston.

Overall, offense played pretty well. Jones and Cobb were excellent. So was Benson.

Pickett hurt shoulder. Not sure if he came back.

Harrell's foot got stepped on by a lineman causing him to stumble as he went to hand off. Probably should have aborted the handoff.

[wist43]

Agreed. he has comeout and said that he will use a challenge when he needs a time out anyway. Hopefully this will teach him but we got hosed on is second challenge so we should have had one left.


I would have been okay with another week of the scabrefs if it got Jeff Triplette kicked out of the NFL forever.

I don't think the fumble on the kickoff would have been reviewable even if MM did have a challenge. It was just a bad call on the field.


I don't remember that. But a win on the second challenge would not have earned a 3rd challenge. Need to win both of the originals.

The Sproles fumble would have been reviewable b/c we came out of the pile with the ball.

Max is right having to win both challenges though... still there was no excuse for the 1st challenge - that was clearly an incomplete pass; he just wasted a challenge, and it could have meant the difference in the game.

We came away with the win - so it will all get glossed over.

[wist43]

Defense was bad. Gave up lots of 1st downs on 3rd and long. Couldn't cover Colston.

Overall, offense played pretty well. Jones and Cobb were excellent. So was Benson.

Pickett hurt shoulder. Not sure if he came back.

Harrell's foot got stepped on by a lineman causing him to stumble as he went to hand off. Probably should have aborted the handoff.

Colston's catch on 3rd and 17 illustrates my point exactly when rushing - in this case only 2 guys. 2 stinking guys on the pass rush!!! Bet NO never saw that coming, lol...

Matthews stayed near the LOS and would have taken Graham (I think it was Graham) had he released; but still, Brees could have read War and Peace back there and never been bothered.

[pittstang5]

Defense was bad. Gave up lots of 1st downs on 3rd and long. Couldn't cover Colston.

Overall, offense played pretty well. Jones and Cobb were excellent. So was Benson.

Pickett hurt shoulder. Not sure if he came back.

Harrell's foot got stepped on by a lineman causing him to stumble as he went to hand off. Probably should have aborted the handoff.

Thanks Joe

[Guiness]

Harrell's foot got stepped on by a lineman causing him to stumble as he went to hand off. Probably should have aborted the handoff.

Harrell's offensive play was a cluster f*. Obviously everyone was a little jumpy with him back there. PB said he had happy feet while stepping back, he did stumble on a Saturday's leg.

[channtheman]

You guys are all (incorrectly) assuming the refs would have gotten the fumble review correct.

[Fred's Slacks]

The Sproles fumble would have been reviewable b/c we came out of the pile with the ball.

Pretty sure it wouldn't have mattered because when down by contact is ruled, replay has to show a clear recovery by the defense in order to overturn. That said, I agree the first challenge was dumb.

[pbmax]

The Sproles fumble would have been reviewable b/c we came out of the pile with the ball.

Max is right having to win both challenges though... still there was no excuse for the 1st challenge - that was clearly an incomplete pass; he just wasted a challenge, and it could have meant the difference in the game.

We came away with the win - so it will all get glossed over.

Not sure about whether the recovery helps or not. If its down by contact on a whistle, recovery or no, I am not sure it can be challenged by the team. And with no turnover ruled on field, its not automatically called for review by the booth.

[Bossman641]

I think the fumble would have been unchallengeable because they blew it dead, basically wiping out everything that happened after that point.

[wist43]

Not sure about whether the recovery helps or not. If its down by contact on a whistle, recovery or no, I am not sure it can be challenged by the team. And with no turnover ruled on field, its not automatically called for review by the booth.

I guess that's where we get into "clear recovery"... it used to be automatic - no review on "down by contact". McCarthy screwed up by wasting a challenge - but how in pooh perfect hell can the refs miss that fumble by Sproles?? He was still fairly upright when the ball came out - what the hell are they looking at??

[Joemailman]

I guess that's where we get into "clear recovery"... it used to be automatic - no review on "down by contact". McCarthy screwed up by wasting a challenge - but how in pooh perfect hell can the refs miss that fumble by Sproles?? He was still fairly upright when the ball came out - what the hell are they looking at??

That's what I was wondering. Hard to imagine nobody seeing that ball come out. Been that kind of a season so far I guess.

[digitaldean]

If it was blown dead by refs then we were screwed anyway. We need to play better vs the conference. With losses to SF and SEA it maks it harder if we are competing for wild card. Hopefully the NFC West will beat the crap out of each other. We need to carry our own nd of the bargain or we will be on the outside looking in.

[digitaldean]

Though I hate Aikman as an announcer, he was SLIGHTLY less anti- Packer today.

[pbmax]

I guess that's where we get into "clear recovery"... it used to be automatic - no review on "down by contact". McCarthy screwed up by wasting a challenge - but how in pooh perfect hell can the refs miss that fumble by Sproles?? He was still fairly upright when the ball came out - what the hell are they looking at??

Yeah, that's the hard to understand part. What I thought would cost us was Triplette getting completely sidetracked by arguing with a Packer player (Matthews?). I thought he never would have a handle on the recovery and make his best guess at covering his butt. So I was unsurprised by down by contact call.

But how someone else didn't see the fumble and get Tripplette to call it is a mystery. The whistle McCarthy was talking about is another mystery.

[pbmax]

Though I hate Aikman as an announcer, he was SLIGHTLY less anti- Packer today.

He did miss a Saints hand to the face today even with one on one replay. So he was trying. :)

[swede]

He did miss a Saints hand to the face today even with one on one replay. So he was trying. :)

First of all, Joe Buck and Troy Aikman seem to do every game when FOX is broadcasting it. Man...

Aikman is all right in terms of his general football knowledge and color patter about general things. But he drives me crazy with his constant play by play blather talking over the replays in which 90% of the time he is saying something which is shown to be untrue by the video.

[mraynrand]

He did miss a Saints hand to the face today even with one on one replay. So he was trying. :)

I thought that penalty call was technically correct, but was extremely weak. I would prefer they let that stuff go uncalled.

[mraynrand]

Not sure about whether the recovery helps or not. If its down by contact on a whistle, recovery or no, I am not sure it can be challenged by the team. And with no turnover ruled on field, its not automatically called for review by the booth.


That sounds like a conspiracy theory. I hate this sequence: Well, we blew the call, but we can't correct it because the manner in which we blew it protects us from being shown to be wrong!

[ThunderDan]

That sounds like a conspiracy theory. I hate this sequence: Well, we blew the call, but we can't correct it because the manner in which we blew it protects us from being shown to be wrong!

No, they can now overturn down by contact if the other team clearly has possesion. The problem is the scrum at the end of the play negates the clear possesion part of the overturn.

On a similar note, how the hell did we lose the second challenge on the Grahm drop?

[HarveyWallbangers]

Yes, a blown whistle no longer nullifies any potential replay. The defense has to have a clear recovery. I don't know if they told McCarthy that there was no clear recovery or that it didn't matter because he had no more challenges. It looked pretty clear to me that the Packers recovered though. Either way, blown call. I'm just glad it didn't cost us another game.

[mraynrand]

No, they can now overturn down by contact if the other team clearly has possesion. The problem is the scrum at the end of the play negates the clear possesion part of the overturn.

That's what I was talking about. Why no clear possession? But let me make sure I understand: If the Packers had 'clear possession' then they would have been forced to review the play, because it is a turnover play, which must be review. So by not giving clear possession to GB, they don't have to review the play, and they don't have to admit they got the initial call wrong.

[ThunderDan]

That's what I was talking about. Why no clear possession? But let me make sure I understand: If the Packers had 'clear possession' then they would have been forced to review the play, because it is a turnover play, which must be review. So by not giving clear possession to GB, they don't have to review the play, and they don't have to admit they got the initial call wrong.

I think the sequence of events is:
1. Refs rule down by contact, so play is dead no turnover no automatic review

The End

Unless..... you have a challenge left.

Then
1a. Check if ball is fumbled before down
2a. See if a defensive player clearly has possesion of the ball

[pbmax]

That sounds like a conspiracy theory. I hate this sequence: Well, we blew the call, but we can't correct it because the manner in which we blew it protects us from being shown to be wrong!

I prefer to call it a Hoculi.

[mraynrand]

I think the sequence of events is:
1. Refs rule down by contact, so play is dead no turnover no automatic review

The End

Unless..... you have a challenge left.

No, they can now overturn down by contact if the other team clearly has possesion.

So they can only overturn with a challenge, but the challenge is only allowed if there was a clear call of changed possession. I'd like to restate my conspiracy theory charge, officer.

[mraynrand]

I prefer to call it a Hoculi.

bless you

[ThunderDan]

No, they can now overturn down by contact if the other team clearly has possesion.

So they can only overturn with a challenge, but the challenge is only allowed if there was a clear call of changed possession. I'd like to restate my conspiracy theory charge, officer.

You can challenge any time you want in a game. The challenge, if it shows a fumble, then had to be able to determine clear possession. If there is no clear possession than the ball goes back to the team that fumbled.

[pbmax]

No, they can now overturn down by contact if the other team clearly has possesion. The problem is the scrum at the end of the play negates the clear possesion part of the overturn.

On a similar note, how the hell did we lose the second challenge on the Grahm drop?


Yes, a blown whistle no longer nullifies any potential replay. The defense has to have a clear recovery. I don't know if they told McCarthy that there was no clear recovery or that it didn't matter because he had no more challenges. It looked pretty clear to me that the Packers recovered though. Either way, blown call. I'm just glad it didn't cost us another game.


No, they can now overturn down by contact if the other team clearly has possesion.

But does down by contact with clear recovery qualify for automatic review or must the team have spend a challenge.

[ThunderDan]

But does down by contact with clear recovery qualify for automatic review or must the team have spend a challenge.

After today I think the answer is clearly the later, which I think is technically correct because if the play is down before the fumble there was no turnover to review.

[mraynrand]

You can challenge any time you want in a game. The challenge, if it shows a fumble, then had to be able to determine clear possession. If there is no clear possession than the ball goes back to the team that fumbled.

I didn't mean to say 'allowed' only that in this instance - or anything like it - the lack of clear possession call - even if correct - essentially covers for the blown fumble call. In other words, the call of no clear possession essentially gets the refs off the hook, because it puts the burden on the team to challenge, and if the refs can't make a clear possession call, it's unlikely replay will show anything different. I've had enough.

[ThunderDan]

I didn't mean to say 'allowed' only that in this instance - or anything like it - the lack of clear possession call - even if correct - essentially covers for the blown fumble call. In other words, the call of no clear possession essentially gets the refs off the hook, because it puts the burden on the team to challenge, and if the refs can't make a clear possession call, it's unlikely replay will show anything different. I've had enough.

Yes, I completely agree!

[Pugger]

Had MM not foolishly challenged that play early in game when it was obvious to me we were gonna lose it we would have been able to challenge that last fumble by the Saints. Who is the goofball up there advising MM anyway??