Rayner Making Me Nervous

[Packnut]

Every time I read a training camp update, this guy is missing FG's. Now he misses a 39yd CHIP SHOT. You guys know as well as I do that we're gonna be involved in some close games where a fg is gonna decide the winner and I have no confidence in Rayner.

TT has to bring someone else in like this kid in Dallas. Suisham has nailed 2 kicks and appears to have a very strong leg. He'll get cut soon enough as long as Vanderjagt is'nt hurt to bad. Looked like he just tweaked the hammy a bit.

[BallHawk]

Edinger would be an improvement. Not a huge one, but I agree, we will be in close games and we need someone who can convert in those situations. As of now, Rayner is not it.

[Packnut]

I just went back and checked all the blogs at Packernews.com and Rayner has missed a helluva lot of kicks in the 25-40 yd range. We're screwed if TT is'nt paying attention on this one. :cry:

[Packers4Glory]

nope..stick w/ this kid...even if he struggles give him this yr and most of next yr.

He has a helluva leg and as I posted in a dif thread sometimes you have to give guys like this some time to develope. Look at Neil Rackers first 2 yrs in the lg...he sucked. now he is one of the top 3.

I'm sure he is a bit rusty as he didn't kick FG's last yr so he is still getting his feel for kicking FGs back. He was good at MSU and can be good in the NFL as well.

I'll deal w/ the growing pains and hope he works and continues to develope.

its nice to have a big leg kicking FGs and kickoffs.

give him time..might as well w/ all the young pups on this roster in need of time and patience.

[vince]

I'm iwth you P4G, but if this kid misses one or two chipshots in crucial game situations, it ain't gonna be pretty for him...

[HarveyWallbangers]

He was good at MSU and can be good in the NFL as well.

He may have potential, but the kid wasn't that good at Michigan State. That's what scares me. His FG% was pretty poor--even by college standards.

[Rastak]

nope..stick w/ this kid...even if he struggles give him this yr and most of next yr.



You could lose 2 or 3 games over the course of that time though. I don't think McCarthy is going to want that. That's why young kickers bounce around so much. A coach just can't stomach the losses an inconsistent kicker can deliver, so they get cut and eventually pan out just fine somwhere once they develop that consistency.

[Bretsky]

Very likely that Grammatica is available from New England. New England drafted the kid I really wanted in Gastrowski. Power Leg with good accuracy.
Early reports out of NE were he may be cut and put on practice squad due to experience; but he's been excelling lately and IMO a team like the Packers would pounce on him if he were cut.

So we could grab Automitica Grammatica :mrgreen:

[pittstang5]

Very likely that Grammatica is available from New England. New England drafted the kid I really wanted in Gastrowski. Power Leg with good accuracy.
Early reports out of NE were he may be cut and put on practice squad due to experience; but he's been excelling lately and IMO a team like the Packers would pounce on him if he were cut.

So we could grab Automitica Grammatica :mrgreen:

I wanted Gostowski too, but I think NE took him in the 4th round which, imo, was a tad early. I'd hope TT is all over that if he gets cut, but I too believe Grammatica will get let go before Gost.

[Astonishment]

any untested kicker would make me nervous...in fact Cundiff made me nervous.

[mngolf19]

nope..stick w/ this kid...even if he struggles give him this yr and most of next yr.



You could lose 2 or 3 games over the course of that time though. I don't think McCarthy is going to want that. That's why young kickers bounce around so much. A coach just can't stomach the losses an inconsistent kicker can deliver, so they get cut and eventually pan out just fine somwhere once they develop that consistency.

It is a virtual guarantee that a bad kicker will cost you at least 1 game per year. Can't afford to give any away when your not a "great" team.

[BooHoo]

I am confident TT has one eye on the waiver wire.

[Packnut]

I am confident TT has one eye on the waiver wire.

I sure hope so!

[mmmdk]

I think Rayner has a slightly more than 50% chance to become our kicker. The rest I'd bet on Gramatica, he's way better than Cundiff.

[HarveyWallbangers]

I guess Rayner was a little better than I thought in college. I saw he was 22 of 29 in 2003 and 22 of 31 in 2004, and I wasn't impressed. However, he had a ridiculous amount of 50+ yard kicks. In 2003 he had 8 of them and in 2004 he had 7 of them. His stats when you take that into consideration (and the wide hashes in college) are pretty good.

2003 - 22 of 29
18 of 21 under 50 yard FGs
4 of 8 on 50+ yard FGs

2004 - 22 of 31
20 of 24 under 50 yard FGs
2 of 7 on 50+ yard FGs

Not bad for a young kicker with a big leg.

[FavreChild]

It is a virtual guarantee that a bad kicker will cost you at least 1 game per year. Can't afford to give any away when your not a "great" team.

Oh sure...,easy for YOU to say.

On one hand...at least you can always use the K as the scapegoat. We all need someone to take out frustration on.

On the other hand....ya know, if the game has to come down to one FG kick, it's pretty much "loser talk" to blame it on the kicker if he misses - i.e., Scott Norwood, Vanderdrunk, Ray Finkel, etc.

Don't get me wrong - it is critical to have a good kicker. But the blaming of the kicker for a close loss is a bit childish....although quite fun and theraputic!!

[GBRulz]

Gotta give this new kicker a chance... and seeing the other choices out there are very limited, it makes it a bit easier for me to say that!

[Noodle]

It is a virtual guarantee that a bad kicker will cost you at least 1 game per year. Can't afford to give any away when your not a "great" team.

Oh sure...,easy for YOU to say.

On one hand...at least you can always use the K as the scapegoat. We all need someone to take out frustration on.

On the other hand....ya know, if the game has to come down to one FG kick, it's pretty much "loser talk" to blame it on the kicker if he misses - i.e., Scott Norwood, Vanderdrunk, Ray Finkel, etc.

Don't get me wrong - it is critical to have a good kicker. But the blaming of the kicker for a close loss is a bit childish....although quite fun and theraputic!!

This post nails it. If you're down to a kick, then likely you've blown a whole bunch of plays during the previous 59 minutes.

What I don't get is this love affair with the so-called "big leg." Give me an accurate leg that's money from 35 to 45 any day over the guy who can pop a 54 yarder or hits kick offs to the goal line, but blows the 44 yard shot.

I think a lot of this is driven by frustration with Longwell's "short" kickoffs. As Patler has shown time and again, Longwell's kickoffs were solidly within the average, and he should get a little bump for kicking in Lambeau. But we Packer fans seem to have this absurd obsession with the Monster Leg.

How long was the Vinatieri kick that the Steeler game into OT? 45 yards.
How long was the Vinatieri kick that beat the Steelers in that game? 23 yards.
How long was the Vinatieri kick that won Super Bowl 38? 41 yards.
How long was the Vinatieri kick that won Super Bowl 39? 48 yards (in a dome).

Not one of Vinatieri's epic game winning kicks (there are at least 20 of them) was over 50 yards. Instead he made his money between 35 and 45 yards.

Drive for show, putt for dough.

[PTPaQ]

I do agree with you as far as kicking field goals go...but concerning the kickoffs it was getting a bit annoying seeing return men catch the ball at the 5 - 10 yard line and starting their drive from the 30. Limiting that with touchbacks or longer returns will help our defense.

But yeah, I dont care if you can kick the ball 60 yards if you cant consitantly knock in the 30-40 range ones...

although I did read this from Cliff's report of practice today (Tuesday 8/22):

"Dave Rayner was 8 of 8 in a field goal session. He converted from 34, 39, 42, 46, 48, 25, 49 and 53 yards out. The 53-yard kick sailed well above the crossbar."

We shouldnt jump completley on this guys boat right now, but we shouldnt jump completley off either. If that makes sense?

p'c

[mngolf19]

It is a virtual guarantee that a bad kicker will cost you at least 1 game per year. Can't afford to give any away when your not a "great" team.

Oh sure...,easy for YOU to say.

On one hand...at least you can always use the K as the scapegoat. We all need someone to take out frustration on.

On the other hand....ya know, if the game has to come down to one FG kick, it's pretty much "loser talk" to blame it on the kicker if he misses - i.e., Scott Norwood, Vanderdrunk, Ray Finkel, etc.

Don't get me wrong - it is critical to have a good kicker. But the blaming of the kicker for a close loss is a bit childish....although quite fun and theraputic!!

The Vikes have dealt with some good and bad kickers over the last decade. But one thing you can never overrate is an accurate kicker. Noodle was right that having a big leg is nice but accuracy is so much more important. I put it into terms with having a good closer on your baseball team. Look what Cordero does for the Brewers now as opposed to what Turnbow did the last month or so. It means so much to know that guy is going to make that 35 yarder when it counts, and not just at the end of the game either.

[HarveyWallbangers]

We'll see what Rayner does. I'm actually encouraged by his college numbers now that I look into them more. 15 FG attempts from 50+ yards has to be some kind of record. Over the last two years, there's only been one NFL kicker with more 50+ yard FG attempts (Neil Rackers with 16), and that's in 32 games--not 24 games. Most haven't even attempted 10 of them. That's crazy. Maybe he ends up being more accurate than I initially thought. He does have a big leg. It would be far from unprecedented for a guy like Rayner to succeed this year.

[Joemailman]

Patriots Release K Martin Gramatica
(CBS4) FOXBOROUGH The New England Patriots released veteran kicker Martin Gramatica on Wednesday.

The 30-year-old Gramatica was signed as a veteran free agent back in April as a possible replacement for Adam Vinatieri.

Gramatica played in one game for the Patriots this preseason, converting both of his field goal attempts and his only extra point try against Atlanta .

The kicking duties now belong to rookie Stephen Gostkowski. Gostkowski looked solid in the Patriots last preseason game against Arizona. He was 3 for 3 on field goal attempts, with three extra points.



I'm actually for keeping Rayner, but if he fails in the last two pre-season games, TT might look at Gramatica.

[OKC PackerFan]

Placekicker Rayner has solid practice

Placekicker Dave Rayner turned in one of his most impressive performances of training camp on Tuesday night. Rayner was kicking inside the Don Hutson Center, so he didn’t have to deal with the elements. Nevertheless, he made 8 of 8 field goals from distances of 34, 39, 42, 46, 48, 25, 49 and 53 yards. Rayner had been missing field-goal attempts wide left on a regular basis during training camp, but he drilled every one of his kicks on Tuesday through the center of the uprights.

— Rob Demovsky, reporter, Green Bay Press-Gazette