Driver, Woodson and Jennings

[Joemailman]

3 of the recent pinnacles of the Packers franchise have or will depart from the Packers. It is a testament to the job TT has done that nobody seems too nervous about it.

None of the 3 had a crucial role with the 2012 Packers, so replacing them on the field won't be a big deal. However, that's a lot of leadership walking out the door. It will be necessary for some players who haven't had a big leadership role in the past to assume one.

On defense I'm looking at Clay Matthews and Tramon Williams, if Tramon can elevate his game over what we saw this year. You can't jump out of Adrian Peterson's way and be seen as a leader.

On offense someone will need to emerge as a leader of the receiver group. Not sure how that will play out.

[pittstang5]

I'm still not 100% that Jennings will be gone. Maybe it's denial. I honestly can't see him in another uniform.

[smuggler]

He's gone. I think he'll look good in Dolphin white.

[King Friday]

I'm still not 100% that Jennings will be gone. Maybe it's denial. I honestly can't see him in another uniform.

Jennings was gone the minute the Packer offense didn't miss much of a beat without him this season. The emergence of Cobb and Jones makes Jennings very easy to let go when you consider how much he is going to cost.

[pittstang5]

He's gone. I think he'll look good in Dolphin white.

If he has to go somewhere other than GB, I'm fine with Miami or any where in the AFC.

Vikings or Bears could be possible places - both teams need a receiver like Jennings. That would suck.

[Smeefers]

The vikings have 19 mil cap space and the bears have 24 mil in cap space. Either could easily afford him.

[Fritz]

The vikings have 19 mil cap space and the bears have 24 mil in cap space. Either could easily afford him.

On the other hand, the Lions are tight against the cap. Their solution? They're going to restructure (that is, push sal cap money problems into the future and try to live for the moment) contracts. They intend to restructure Stafford's, and have already restructured their mediocre center, Dominic Raiola's, contract.

I love it. Keep restructuring those contracts, Detroit, so you can sign a couple aging vets!

[Pugger]

Jennings was gone the minute the Packer offense didn't miss much of a beat without him this season. The emergence of Cobb and Jones makes Jennings very easy to let go when you consider how much he is going to cost.

You didn't think our offense missed a beat without him this season? He is our best route runner and he makes the other WRs better. Our offense in 2012 not being what in 2011 and his absence for much od the season was not a coincidence to me.

[smuggler]

Pass protection was the difference between 2011 and 2012.

[SkinBasket]

Calling Jennings a "pinnacle" player is like calling the Big Mac a gastronomical delicacy. Yeah, he was good. Sometimes great. Sometimes he wasn't around, and sometimes he just wasn't worth the money. But lets not pretend he was any more than a 60th percentile WR, who's always had HOF quality QBs throwing the ball to him.

[King Friday]

You didn't think our offense missed a beat without him this season? He is our best route runner and he makes the other WRs better. Our offense in 2012 not being what in 2011 and his absence for much od the season was not a coincidence to me.

The offense wasn't as good as last year even when Jennings WAS in the lineup. Our OL was made up of a bunch of late round picks and undrafted players by the end of the year. The number of QB pressures this year was the key difference in the decreased production from 2011.

Bottom line...you could have 4 mediocre receivers out there, and with Rodgers and a very good OL, they will look like world beaters. You simply DO NOT PAY to keep a top receiver when you have a QB like Rodgers. It isn't necessary, and restricts your ability to afford help in other areas of real need.

[Fritz]

Calling Jennings a "pinnacle" player is like calling the Big Mac a gastronomical delicacy. Yeah, he was good. Sometimes great. Sometimes he wasn't around, and sometimes he just wasn't worth the money. But lets not pretend he was any more than a 60th percentile WR, who's always had HOF quality QBs throwing the ball to him.



Wait a minute. Wait just a minute. Big Macs are awesome, Skin. And don't you forget it.

I'd like to see Jennings back - but not if the price will cost the team Raji, who is I think the most likely of the big three to not re-up.

[woodbuck27]

The vikings have 19 mil cap space and the bears have 24 mil in cap space. Either could easily afford him.

The Bears should go all in on him but I'm thinking that Greg Jennings wants to move the family to a warmer climate.

[Ballboy]

I dont claim to know all the ins & outs of the cap....but in my eyes I feel Jennnings is a must keep. I suggested in the past that cutting the like of Finley(I do like him, just not at 8million) and restructuring others we could get Greg at a decent price without having to worry about mortgaging the future. Now with the Packers cuttting Woodson, and the small rumblings to a lesser extent Hawk...why cant/wont we be able to make a run at him? For all the talk about the TE's in MM's system, how many balls and TD's did they actually have this year? Was there ever a game where AR went to Finley time & time again in total domination? Just look at the games Jennings had after he came back.

Furthermore, it could be very possible the likes of Erst(TE from Stanford...SP?) & Eiffert(TE from Irish) could be their for the Packers at the end of round 1. Given our actual game use of Finley, Im sure a rookie TE could give us about the same production...Finley was never that great at blocking anyway!

Getting a rookie WR, whom some thing we may draft early, would be more difficult to get going in the NFL.

[smuggler]

Jennings must not be a must-keep because the Packers and Jennings have not opened any negotiations for a new contract. Meanwhile, his GB home is up for sale and free agency is fast approaching.

[swede]

Jennings must not be a must-keep because the Packers and Jennings have not opened any negotiations for a new contract. Meanwhile, his GB home is up for sale and free agency is fast approaching.

This is correct. Between the few little things that did happen (real estate) and the major things that didn't happen (negotiations) and the damned reality of the salary cap, AR, and CMIII, there will be no more Jennings. It is a business and keeping Jennings could be made to work, at the cost of some other players, but when consulted by a happy medium the icosahedral floatie in the Magic 8 Ball comes up "outlook not so good."

I saw someone propose Indy as a destination for Jennings earlier. I mean, if he has to go somewhere, what a great place for all parties involved if he ended up there.

[RashanGary]

Ryan Pickett - 33
John Kuhn - 30


And then your next oldest players likely to be on the roster next year are Aaron Rodgers and AJ Hawk - 29 years.

Wow. That's a bit of a shocker.

[Iron Mike]

This is correct. Between the few little things that did happen (real estate) and the major things that didn't happen (negotiations) and the damned reality of the salary cap, AR, and CMIII, there will be no more Jennings. It is a business and keeping Jennings could be made to work, at the cost of some other players, but when consulted by a happy medium the icosahedral floatie in the Magic 8 Ball comes up "outlook not so good."

I saw someone propose Indy as a destination for Jennings earlier. I mean, if he has to go somewhere, what a great place for all parties involved if he ended up there.

http://wormholeriders.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/Fringe-S3x12-Outlook-not-so-good.jpg

[Iron Mike]

Ryan Pickett - 33
John Kuhn - 30


And then your next oldest players likely to be on the roster next year are Aaron Rodgers and AJ Hawk - 29 years.

Wow. That's a bit of a shocker.

http://www.samruby.com/Villains/Shocker/ShockerBag.gif

[wootah]

Mike, you disappoint me; I had expected you'd provide us with some of that vintage AJ Hawk "shocker" celebration footage.

[Iron Mike]

Mike, you disappoint me; I had expected you'd provide us with some of that vintage AJ Hawk "shocker" celebration footage.

Every now and then, I like to switch it up a little. :)

[Iron Mike]

BTW, we need to get the Bares fans back on this board, I have an urge to call someone a "fox-eared asshole."


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U2oZwrdIZyU

[Pugger]

Releasing Woodson, Driver and Saturday make sense because they are not the players they once were. I thought Jennings played well when he returned from his surgery. I wonder if TT is waiting to see what the market will really be for Jennings once FA begins. If he is he is being smart. Why offer Greg the moon/or tag him and later find out we over paid him?

[pbmax]

I would love to know what numbers Jennings and the Packers exchanged. I wonder if the Packers simply don't want to risk a contract with him given two years of injuries or find him eminently replaceable with the current roster. If the Packers offered some sizable money or years, I'd believe the former and that Jennings thinks there is more out there. If the latter, I wonder if the Packers handed over an offer at all.

[swede]

I would love to know what numbers Jennings and the Packers exchanged. I wonder if the Packers simply don't want to risk a contract with him given two years of injuries or find him eminently replaceable with the current roster. If the Packers offered some sizable money or years, I'd believe the former and that Jennings thinks there is more out there. If the latter, I wonder if the Packers handed over an offer at all.

Is there a way out of that without hurting feelings? Insult him with "Good luck somewhere else...whatever your number is, it is too much," or insult him with "We're thinking vet min with 'not likely to be earned' incentives for keeping your sister quiet."

[Fritz]

Is there a way out of that without hurting feelings? Insult him with "Good luck somewhere else...whatever your number is, it is too much," or insult him with "We're thinking vet min with 'not likely to be earned' incentives for keeping your sister quiet."


Keeping his sister quiet....priceless.

[Bossman641]

The vikings have 19 mil cap space and the bears have 24 mil in cap space. Either could easily afford him.

Where are you seeing the Bears have 24 million? I've only seen them having ~11M or so, and they are going to have to open the checkbook for Melton. I'm not sure they have the cap room for Jennings.

[King Friday]

I would love to know what numbers Jennings and the Packers exchanged. I wonder if the Packers simply don't want to risk a contract with him given two years of injuries or find him eminently replaceable with the current roster. If the Packers offered some sizable money or years, I'd believe the former and that Jennings thinks there is more out there. If the latter, I wonder if the Packers handed over an offer at all.

Jennings knows what we all know. Thompson isn't dumb enough to throw top 10 WR money at a guy who's going to be on the wrong side of 30 and has seen more than his share of injuries recently. Some other dumb GM will throw good money at Jennings, and with this being his last chance at a big contract he has to take it. I doubt Thompson offered anything to Jennings, because what he would've offered might seem disrespectful. Thompson merely thanked Jennings for his considerable contributions to the team and good luck with his future endeavors.

[Fritz]

Which Gm or owner will throw the money at Jennings? Jerrah Jones?

[Iron Mike]

Which Gm or owner will throw the money at Jennings? Jerrah Jones?

Double J just spent a shit-ton of $ on a new whip to take to the Combine:

http://cdn0.sbnation.com/imported_assets/1449441/NS_15CowboysBus4_29699554_700611_JPG.jpg

[QBME]

Where are you seeing the Bears have 24 million? I've only seen them having ~11M or so, and they are going to have to open the checkbook for Melton. I'm not sure they have the cap room for Jennings.

This mornings Chicago Trib has the Bears at $11 million. Besides, they need a Tight End way more than a WR.

[KYPack]

This mornings Chicago Trib has the Bears at $11 million. Besides, they need a Tight End way more than a WR.

Sportstalk had an interesting point about da Barelys this AM.

- Trestman worked with Tebow prior to the draft to tune up TT's delivery, motion, etc.

- Montreal (Trestman's CFL team) had Tebow's rights while Trestman was there.

- Da Bares have a wieny with a good arm who can't lead at QB. Why not get a great leader with a noodle arm at QB so they will still suck?

[Smeefers]

Where are you seeing the Bears have 24 million? I've only seen them having ~11M or so, and they are going to have to open the checkbook for Melton. I'm not sure they have the cap room for Jennings.

Under the 2012 season. I hate being an idiot!

Vikings 16 mil
Bears 13 mil.

I still think either could easily afford him.

[Patler]

Sportstalk had an interesting point about da Barelys this AM.

- Trestman worked with Tebow prior to the draft to tune up TT's delivery, motion, etc.

- Montreal (Trestman's CFL team) had Tebow's rights while Trestman was there.

- Da Bares have a wieny with a good arm who can't lead at QB. Why not get a great leader with a noodle arm at QB so they will still suck?

I think Trestman also worked with Cutler before his draft.

Just after Trestman was signed, I saw an article that reprinted Trestman's comments about Tebow before his draft. He acknowledged his shortcomings, but emphasized his leadership and said he could be very effective in the NFL, but only in a system that used him correctly. Seemed to acknowledge that he wasn't suitable for everybody.

[pbmax]

Sportstalk had an interesting point about da Barelys this AM.

- Trestman worked with Tebow prior to the draft to tune up TT's delivery, motion, etc.

- Montreal (Trestman's CFL team) had Tebow's rights while Trestman was there.

- Da Bares have a wieny with a good arm who can't lead at QB. Why not get a great leader with a noodle arm at QB so they will still suck?

If Trestman can perform surgery, they can Frankenstein those two and be in good shape.

[Patler]

If Trestman can perform surgery, they can Frankenstein those two and be in good shape.

Cutbow!

[King Friday]

Double J just spent a shit-ton of $ on a new whip to take to the Combine:

http://cdn0.sbnation.com/imported_assets/1449441/NS_15CowboysBus4_29699554_700611_JPG.jpg

Can't blame Jerry. The Cowboys really needed a nice luxury vehicle to relax and watch playoff games in after yet another December swoon.

[smuggler]

Cutbow!

Teutbloer

TEBO- from Tebow

-UTLER from Cutler

Pronounced TOOT BLOWER

or lose the -ut- and just be Tebloer

TEA BLOWER

Whether he's farting or suckling sacks, he's a great candidate for All-Bears team.

[rbaloha1]

Teutbloer

TEBO- from Tebow

-UTLER from Cutler

Pronounced TOOT BLOWER

or lose the -ut- and just be Tebloer

TEA BLOWER

Whether he's farting or suckling sacks, he's a great candidate for All-Bears team.

no relevance.

please go return to wrestling alligators.

[Fritz]

I say it's "Te-tler", pronounced "Teetler."

[Smeefers]

From ESPN as of Yesterday
Cap Space:

Chicago Bears: $8.176 million under the cap
Detroit Lions: $554,000 over the cap*
Green Bay Packers: $17.645 million under the cap
Minnesota Vikings: $12.820 million under the cap

[Fritz]

Wow. So which organization would you rather be a fan of....?

The Packers won the division yet have the most cap space. Impressive.

Although that will change if and when they tie up Matthews and Rodgers this offseason.

[pbmax]

Yeah but with that kinda space and contracts coming up, you can just feel them trading down.

[pbmax]

Packer Report ‏@PackerReport
For what it's worth, I've had some water thrown on Jennings' supposed demand for $14M a year.

I read this as: he is not actually asking for $14 million per, instead of never going to get it, but in the end there isn't much difference.

[Joemailman]

It's just chatter, but there is some talk that the Packers are still considering franchising Jennings. https://twitter.com/RapSheet/status/305764885881569281

[pbmax]

That guy has a pretty good rep, but who did he hear this from? Were the walls of the men's room talking to him in Indy?

[pbmax]

Something called Packerpedia made this good point: With FInley due $8 mil and Jennings number at $10 mil, who do you want for one more year?

Of course, that question presumes you are ready to let both go in a year when the replacement situation will likely be the same with Jennings position stocked and Finley's not.

[gbgary]

if they rework/extend fin, which i think they'll do, that will eliminate him from your one more year question.

[pbmax]

http://www.jsonline.com/sports/packers/packers-prepare-to-rule-on-jennings-finley-hu8td2q-192944071.html

Well Bob is up with a source confirming continuing discussions about Jennings and the tag and he frames it mainly as a Finley versus Jennings debate at Packer HQ. This qualifies as a gaping hole in the normally watertight Packer's ship and I suspect Ari Fleischer will be around to harangue folks about the need to stay message disciplined soon.

Bob puts his source way down in the story, which to me means it either isn't iron clad OR the context is unknown. He also speculates that because Finley's agent Baratz and the Packers spoke that they might be discussing a way to lower Finley's cap number. He also presents a price quote from another NFL source that Jennings might have been seeking $13-14 mil per prior to his injured season, but that number might be closer to $7-9 mil now. His agent is Eugene Parker who is known for holdouts by rookies, but is more even-keeled with veterans.

If that is all true, the Packers might be trying to get a two for one deal. Of course then, Bob speculates the Packers might then tag and trade Jennings.

Last tidbit, Bob hears Philbin is not a fan of Jennings as a player.

[pbmax]

According to Dougherty, the Packers did offer, or at least try to negotiate a long term deal with Jennings at the end of last year (prior to 2012 season).

http://www.packersnews.com/article/20130224/PKR01/302240457/Will-Jennings-tagged-why-

[Patler]

McGinn also quotes a "high ranking personnel man" from an AFC team as saying that Finley would attract offers only in the range of $3-4 million.

[Guiness]

If that is all true, the Packers might be trying to get a two for one deal. Of course then, Bob speculates the Packers might then tag and trade Jennings.

Last tidbit, Bob hears Philbin is not a fan of Jennings as a player.

That surprises me. I wonder what the problem is? He doesn't like him at the franchise price, or doesn't like him at all? Seems strange that the former OC doesn't like his old #1WR that had good production and never seemed to be a media problem!

[pbmax]

The obvious answer would be size, as he is smaller than the other WRs Philbin worked with other than Driver.

But if it isn't silly season for the draft yet, it is for Free Agency. It could be a leak by a rival agent or the Dolphins themselves trying to drive down the price or chase someone else away.

[pbmax]

A new report, by PFT , that Jennings is asking for Vincent Jackson money (actually, >$12 mill per year).

The caution here is that this information is exactly the same as previous, older reports. So despite a new source, it might be just a repeat.

PFT: http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/03/01/jennings-looking-for-as-much-as-12-million-per-year/

GBPG Gives It Their Spin: http://www.packersnews.com/article/20130301/PKR0101/130301040

[woodbuck27]

From ESPN as of Yesterday
Cap Space:

Chicago Bears: $8.176 million under the cap
Detroit Lions: $554,000 over the cap*
Green Bay Packers: $17.645 million under the cap
Minnesota Vikings: $12.820 million under the cap

Here's another number on how much the Packers are under the CAP:

Packers about $21 million under salary cap

Mar. 1, 2013 7:21 AM

http://www.packersnews.com/article/20130301/PKR01/303010344/Packers-about-21-million-under-salary-cap?odyssey=obinsite

GO PACK GO !

[Joemailman]

Packers not putting franchise tag on Jennings. Prepare to see him twice a year in purple.

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap1000000146829/article/greg-jennings-doesnt-get-green-bay-packers-tag

[pbmax]

Dewayne Bowe signed and was not tagged by the Chiefs. That will be a comparable for Jennings.

[Fritz]

So Bowe is off the market?

[pbmax]

So Bowe is off the market?

Bowe knows some cash. http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/03/04/chiefs-tag-branden-albert-sign-dwayne-bowe/

[pbmax]

Bowe possibly helping Jennings out.

Jason Wilde ‏@jasonjwilde
Great question. Per @RapSheet, $15M signing bonus, $36M over first three years. RT @cfurm4: Does @gregjennings get more than Bowe?

[pbmax]

3 years, $36 mil seems the consensus. Greg Rosenthal of NFL.com does not think Jennings is getting this deal. He thinks he will be closer to 9 than 12 per year.

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/03/05/bowe-moves-into-top-three-with-56-million-deal/

Maybe I am just overreacting, but I think the flat cap has moved the needle on guaranteed money. Bowe has $20 mil fully guaranteed in this deal.

[Smeefers]

I would be amazed if Jennings, who turns 30 before the start of the season, gets 12 mil a year. If he does, I'm glad we let go of him. I'm not saying he's not a top receiver in the NFL, but he's not anywhere near a Fitzgerald and he's already reached his peak. He has many more years behind him than he will in front of him. The reason Bowe got the cash is because he's still getting better. Jennings is leveling out and in a couple years, he's only going to get worse. I think he's worth around the 7-9 Mil range and I think the packers would of tried to keep him if they could have gotten him for 5-6 mil.

[pbmax]

Kareem Copeland ‏@kareemcopeland
RT @JosinaAnderson: NFL sources tell me that Seahawks, Dolphins, Jets & Giants are among teams that have called to discuss Charles Woodson.

[Guiness]

Kareem Copeland ‏@kareemcopeland
RT @JosinaAnderson: NFL sources tell me that Seahawks, Dolphins, Jets & Giants are among teams that have called to discuss Charles Woodson.

I wonder if there's any chance in hell he comes back? TT could have told him to ask around, and come back with the numbers he's hearing, instead of making an offer he might find insulting. No buzz about that, so it seems unlikely, and with Hayward and House the Pack probably want to develop the younger players.

[Joemailman]

I wonder if there's any chance in hell he comes back? TT could have told him to ask around, and come back with the numbers he's hearing, instead of making an offer he might find insulting. No buzz about that, so it seems unlikely, and with Hayward and House the Pack probably want to develop the younger players.

I just don't think he has a role here anymore. Hayward got a shot at the slot corner position and ran with it. Woodson no longer has the speed the Packers are looking for at Safety.

[pbmax]

Might just be agent speak to gin up some panic but:

Evan Silva ‏@evansilva
NFL Net's @RapSheet on Greg Jennings: "I hear the #Packers are still trying to negotiate with him." Also mentioned #Vikings #Colts #Browns.

[King Friday]

I could see Jennings back in Green Bay if he doesn't get the huge payday he wants from anyone else...or only from a team that is in the bottom half of the league. The Packers probably would be willing to pay $7M a year...if the best Jennings can get is $8.5M/yr from the Browns or other relative bottom feeder, I could easily see him coming back to Green Bay for a more reasonable amount. I'm guessing Rodgers would take a slight discount on his deal to help get Jennings back to GB.

[woodbuck27]

I could see Jennings back in Green Bay if he doesn't get the huge payday he wants from anyone else...or only from a team that is in the bottom half of the league. The Packers probably would be willing to pay $7M a year...if the best Jennings can get is $8.5M/yr from the Browns or other relative bottom feeder, I could easily see him coming back to Green Bay for a more reasonable amount. I'm guessing Rodgers would take a slight discount on his deal to help get Jennings back to GB.

Comment woodbuck27:

Although it's being reported that Greg Jennings is still negotiating with the Packers. It's also becoming evident that he's a hot commodity. Maybe the best FA on the market?

With news yesterday on Percy Harvin leaving Minny, Victor Cruz getting tagged in New York, Wes Welker best remaining in New England and Danny Amendola being a coveted player by other teams. The 'Greg Jennings stock' seems to be on the rise.

http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nfl/2013/03/12/top-50-free-agents-greg-jennings-mike-wallace-paul-kruger-dashon-goldson/1980881/

http://thefanhub.com/posts/detail/968333/page/2/NFL-Free-Agency-Preview-Wide-Receivers

" Many will argue about the worth and ranking of the top three receivers on the market, but no one can doubt that Jennings is the most well-rounded of the top tier. Though he has struggled to stay healthy over the past two seasons — which could ultimately hurt his payday — Jennings is comfortable lining up both inside and outside, is an excellent route-runner, and has the size, speed, and hands of an elite No. 1.

The drawbacks to Jennings?

... he missed half of the 2012 season and three games the year before, and since he’ll be turning 30 in September, those injuries take on greater significance than they would for a younger player. In addition, while he’s not undersized, nor is he big for a receiver, so he won’t have the overt size that often helps keep guys relevant after their speed has abandoned them.

Nevertheless, Jennings is a smart player with great hands and still plenty of potential, so he’ll get a nice fat contract from someone this spring."








PACKERS !

[Teamcheez1]

Jennings is already sitting on the sidelies during OTA's with a supposed "ankle" injury. Vikings/Jennings say it is nothing serious, but the doubts about his durability during a whole season are not unwarranted.

[Guiness]

Still shocked when I see those 3 names together and realize they are all gone from the Pack the same year.

[Patler]

Still shocked when I see those 3 names together and realize they are all gone from the Pack the same year.

It is an odd situation. Yes, all are missing from the locker room for the first time in years. But all were missing from game action for most of last year anyway. The Packers need to learn to go on without their personalities, but they have already learned how to play the games without contributions from all three at the same time.

[packer4life]

Losing Driver, Jennings, and Woodson will not affect this team.

The ascension of Cobb, Perry, and Hayward is what is getting me excited for the seasion.

[rbaloha1]

Losing Driver, Jennings, and Woodson will not affect this team.

The ascension of Cobb, Perry, and Hayward is what is getting me excited for the seasion.

Leadership is the issue which can never be understated.

IMO A-rod needs to fill the leadership void.

[gbgary]

Losing Driver, Jennings, and Woodson will not affect this team.



i mostly agree. five years ago this would have been a disaster. the key will be injuries...as it always is. i'm anxious to see this year's team.

[BZnDallas]

So with the Jennings and Woodson contracts what are we looking at come draft next year with the compensatory picks? any decent guesses?

[Smeefers]

We released woodson, so we won't get compensation for him. Jennings? Ehh. No clue.