How Good is TT at Draft Decisions?

[Patler]

Very good, especially compared to his NFC North rivals. The following article is filled with data, is not very long, and is a good read:

http://www.packersnews.com/article/20130420/PKR01/304200400/For-Thompson-drafting-quality-begins-quantity

Some tidbits:


Since Thompson came on board, the Packers have made 76 selections. That averages out to two more draft picks each year (9.5) than the next-closest division rival, Chicago (7.5).

Among those 76 picks, the Packers have hit on seven players who have combined for an NFC North-leading 15 Pro Bowl selections.

...

Today, Thompson’s selections have combined to play in a total of 2,886 NFL games, including 2,357 for the Packers. The next closest in the division is the Bears’ 60 selections combining for 1,990 NFL games.

However, nearly a quarter of Chicago’s picks since 2005 haven’t played a down in the NFL. Prorated to the amount of picks they’ve had, each Packers draftee has averaged 38 games in the NFL and 31 in Green Bay, trumping the rest of the division in both categories.

...

Locked into the cellar of the division for the better part of the 21st century, the Lions’ 59 selections have played in 1,782 games with only 1,434 of those coming in Detroit (24.3 games per draftee).

Outside of the Packers, the Vikings have had the most success with seven players combining for 12 Pro Bowl selections against 11 draft picks who never played in Minnesota. Their biggest blunder remains drafting Troy Williamson in the first round in 2005, but otherwise they have fared well enough.

[smuggler]

I feel Thompson is better than most in the draft, but he's not perfect. Pat Lee and Justin Harrell. To be fair, I think Harrell would have been an AJ Hawk type pick if not for his injury meltdown. (Meaning, solid, but not really ideal.)

[Joemailman]

TT has been outstanding both in terms of drafting impact players, and drafting players who give you a deep roster. His ability to do the latter made possible a Super Bowl run in a year when the number of injuries would have sunk most teams.

Now if he could just do something about those 5th round picks:

Junius Coston (2005)
Mike Hawkins (2005)
Ingle Martin (2006)
Tony Moll (2006)
David Clowney (2007)
Breno Giacomini (2008)
Quinn Johnson (2009)
Jamon Meredith (2009)
Andrew Quarless (2010)
Marshall Newhouse (2010)
D.J. Williams (2011)
Terrell Manning (2012)

[Patler]

I feel Thompson is better than most in the draft, but he's not perfect. Pat Lee and Justin Harrell. To be fair, I think Harrell would have been an AJ Hawk type pick if not for his injury meltdown. (Meaning, solid, but not really ideal.)

I've never understood the "...but he isn't perfect" type comments.
Do you expect him to be perfect?
Is any GM perfect when it comes to the draft?

Is anyone actually perfect at what they do?

[woodbuck27]

Very good, especially compared to his NFC North rivals. The following article is filled with data, is not very long, and is a good read:

http://www.packersnews.com/article/20130420/PKR01/304200400/For-Thompson-drafting-quality-begins-quantity

Some tidbits:

Awesome Dawson but now TT has to use all that experience and only do one thing :

IMPROVE.

This comparing him to the Vikings, Bears and 'are you kidding me'...Lions ! Is for corner store teen NFL fan talk. It's not for mature Packer fans.

The San Francisco 49ers and Seattle Seahawks are thumping the crap out of us in this off season. TT has to somehow manage even two soild starters from this draft in Rounds 1-3/4.

His track record in later rounds? How's that working for you? Are you really comfortable with his performance there?

Ted Thompson must ACE the top half of this draft. Find two real difference makers. Two starters or solid rotational guys. That's why going with an Eric Reid looks attractive as an option at #26. That's why maybe this draft looking BPA and Grade. Isn't, the way to go.

GO TED GO !

[rbaloha1]

Very good.

Selecting is going to be tougher moving forward with TT's disciples scattered throughout the league.

On the hand, maybe TT has more trading partners.

[Patler]

TT has been outstanding both in terms of drafting impact players, and drafting players who give you a deep roster. His ability to do the latter made possible a Super Bowl run in a year when the number of injuries would have sunk most teams.

Now if he could just do something about those 5th round picks:

Junius Coston (2005)
Mike Hawkins (2005)
Ingle Martin (2006)
Tony Moll (2006)
David Clowney (2007)
Breno Giacomini (2008)
Quinn Johnson (2009)
Jamon Meredith (2009)
Andrew Quarless (2010)
Marshall Newhouse (2010)
D.J. Williams (2011)
Terrell Manning (2012)

Considering its the 5th round, those picks look pretty good to me. I don't have high expectations for 5th round picks, yet in that group you have players that have started a lot of games for the Packers, and players who lasted for decent careers or are still playing.

[woodbuck27]

Very good.

Selecting is going to be tougher moving forward with TT's disciples scattered throughout the league.

On the hand, maybe TT has more trading partners.

Good points.

PACKERS !

[rbaloha1]

Good points.

PACKERS !

Nah -- Rather have Angry White Men acting like Leno making snarky comments.

[Patler]

Awesome Dawson but now TT has to use all that experience and only do one thing :

IMPROVE.

This comparing him to the Vikings, Bears and 'are you kidding me'...Lions ! Is for corner store teen NFL fan talk. It's not for mature Packer fans.

The San Francisco 49ers and Seattle Seahawks are thumping the crap out of us in this off season. TT has to somehow manage even two soild starters from this draft in Rounds 1-3/4.

His track record in later rounds? How's that working for you? Are you really comfortable with his performance there?

Ted Thompson must ACE the top half of this draft. Find two real difference makers. Two starters or solid rotational guys. That's why going with an Eric Reid looks attractive as an option at #26. That's why maybe this draft looking BPA and Grade. Isn't, the way to go.

GO TED GO !

Ya, I don't worry too much about teams that are "thumping the crap out of us in this off season." The off season isn't done, no one has won a game yet in 2013. Every year it seems a different team or two wins the off season hype, and more often than not they fail miserably the next season. That said, I expect the 49ers to be tough, I'm not yet convinced about what is going on in Seattle for the long haul.

Which rounds do you consider to be the later rounds? 6th & 7th? 5th too? What do you expect from the later rounds? I have some theories about TT's approach in the 6th & 7th rounds in view of what he does with URFA signings, but I haven't thought it through completely.

[rbaloha1]

Ya, I don't worry too much about teams that are "thumping the crap out of us in this off season." The off season isn't done, no one has won a game yet in 2013. Every year it seems a different team or two wins the off season hype, and more often than not they fail miserably the next season. That said, I expect the 49ers to be tough, I'm not yet convinced about what is going on in Seattle for the long haul.

Which rounds do you consider to be the later rounds? 6th & 7th? 5th too? What do you expect from the later rounds? I have some theories about TT's approach in the 6th & 7th rounds in view of what he does with URFA signings, but I haven't thought it through completely.

TT is excellent in the late rounds finding gems.

TT has proven to be flexible -- moves up or down depending on the board.

The Packers have a good roster -- imo if certain players are available maybe some of the lower round picks are packaged to move up to take certain player(s).

Seattle has a young roster and dominated the 49ers late in the season.

[Patler]

Very good.

Selecting is going to be tougher moving forward with TT's disciples scattered throughout the league.

On the hand, maybe TT has more trading partners.

It will be interesting to look back on this in 5 years or so. Compare the successes of the disciples and the mentor.
I kind of hoped McKenzie might follow TT as GM, but it seemed like a long shot because TT could be around a while yet. Dorsey didn't seem to have GM aspirations, seemed content doing what he was doing and staying in GB. It appears that only one other team was of interest to him, and unfortunately for the Packers they had an opening.

[Joemailman]

Considering its the 5th round, those picks look pretty good to me. I don't have high expectations for 5th round picks, yet in that group you have players that have started a lot of games for the Packers, and players who lasted for decent careers or are still playing.

I see one player (Newhouse) who has started a lot of games, and some would argue that was be default as much as anything. Tony Moll started some games (badly) when others were hurt. Quinn Johnson was a bad fit. Coston, Hawkins, Martin, Clowney and Giacomini never started a game for the Packers. I will concede the possibility that starting in 2010, the picks have gotten better.

[red]

time to stir some shit

some of those draft picks have gained playing time when maybe they wouldn't have on other teams because of the lack of options TT leaves us by not using free agency

some of those late rounders HAVE TO play, just because there is no other option on the team

guys like will whitiker not only play, but get thrust into starting roles

add to that the fact that we draft special teamers, guys that have no business being on the field for the offense or defense but gets drafted and makes the team because they're a good gunner.........

jarrett bush

and like what was already said. how good will TT and M3 be with all the grunt work guys moved on to other teams?

[Patler]

I'm not dismissing what Seattle did last year. I'm just not convinced they will continue to play at that level. Every year it seems like a team or two gets hot, plays very well and looks to be an up and coming team to be dealt with in the future. The next year, many regress drastically. For some reason, I get that feeling from Seattle. No one factor, just a lot of things that make me skeptical.

[rbaloha1]

It is in place for Seattle to be a high contender for the next 3 years. Last year was not a fluke.

Brilliant reengineering of the roster and drafting.

[Patler]

time to stir some shit

some of those draft picks have gained playing time when maybe they wouldn't have on other teams because of the lack of options TT leaves us by not using free agency

some of those late rounders HAVE TO play, just because there is no other option on the team

guys like will whitiker not only play, but get thrust into starting roles

add to that the fact that we draft special teamers, guys that have no business being on the field for the offense or defense but gets drafted and makes the team because they're a good gunner.........

jarrett bush

and like what was already said. how good will TT and M3 be with all the grunt work guys moved on to other teams?

Interesting that you point to Will Whittaker while simultaneously using the lack of FA activity as a reason for draft picks starting. Whittaker came in and started in a year that TT did try to find guards in FA, and actually paid one quite well. Neither FA guard worked out, and eventually two 7th round picks were the starting guards. Whittaker wasn't a good fit in GB, but went to Washington where they wanted big bruisers and was starting there until he was lost for the year to injury. Never seemed to come back from it.

Giacomini now starts for Seattle. Maybe one of TT's bigger mistakes was trying to keep him on the practice squad, and letting Seattle snatch him away?

[Patler]

I see one player (Newhouse) who has started a lot of games, and some would argue that was be default as much as anything. Tony Moll started some games (badly) when others were hurt. Quinn Johnson was a bad fit. Coston, Hawkins, Martin, Clowney and Giacomini never started a game for the Packers. I will concede the possibility that starting in 2010, the picks have gotten better.

Moll started 18 games for the Packers in 3 years. Maybe he wasn't great, but in those first couple years when TT was turning over the roster he gave them real good value. Lasted another 3 years in the league as a backup, and the Packers had him in last off season for a look.

Giacomini now starts for Seattle. They knew from the start that he would take a few years to settle in to the NFL. They liked him so much that the first year they kept him on the 53 man roster with no intention of playing him. When the numbers didn't work a couple years later, they wanted to keep him on the practice squad, but Seattle signed him.

Some might argue that the Packers should have made Quinn Johnson a better fit. Same with Vonta Leach. If the Packers aren't tough enough as some argue, not physical enough, maybe they should have kept Leach or Johnson. Other teams seem to be able to use them.

What do you expect from 5th round picks, 10 year careers as starters? I don't expect most 5th round picks to sign a second contract with the Packers. If one does, fantastic. I just expect them to fill roles on the team for 3 or 4 years until someone else comes along.

Can't leave this without mentioning Coston. Strange career. Never accomplished a thing, but seemed on the verge a couple times. Maybe you recall that he replaced Colledge at one point, started a couple games when College was playing awful, and articles mentioned what an upgrade Coston seemed to be. Then Coston got hurt, Colledge got the starting job back and Coston disappeared. Certainly Coston never gave the Packers anything, just interesting how pro careers work out. Colledge was replaced or on the verge of being replaced many times, but got his job back due to injuries. The guy might not be great, but I don't think he has missed a single game due to injury.

[Bretsky]

I have to admit......when I saw part of that article I thought the same thing as red
Since Free Agency tends to be the hibernation period for GB it makes sense more draft picks see playing time
Maybe not a fair generalization...but that thought hit me as well

[Joemailman]

I have to admit......when I saw part of that article I thought the same thing as red
Since Free Agency tends to be the hibernation period for GB it makes sense more draft picks see playing time
Maybe not a fair generalization...but that thought hit me as well

It's fair to say that draft picks get more of a chance in Green Bay. But it's also fair to say the Packers wouldn't have won a Super Bowl and been a perennial playoff team if TT wasn't really good on draft day.

[Bretsky]

It's fair to say that draft picks get more of a chance in Green Bay. But it's also fair to say the Packers wouldn't have won a Super Bowl and been a perennial playoff team if TT wasn't really good on draft day.

Also fair to say we probably would not have won a Super Bowl without TT's two big money free agent signings

[rbaloha1]

Also fair to say we probably would not have won a Super Bowl without TT's two big money free agent signings

which is the current trend of the seahawks.

[Bretsky]

Seattle is everybody's darling right now
It's insane...if u belive in Russell Wilson...to think they have a legit starting QB for the next two years at about 300G per year
Thinks of all the excess money they are able to spend before that deal is redone after year three.

It's also interesting that a TT disciple is making all of these bold moves in FA

[pbmax]

TT has been outstanding both in terms of drafting impact players, and drafting players who give you a deep roster. His ability to do the latter made possible a Super Bowl run in a year when the number of injuries would have sunk most teams.

Now if he could just do something about those 5th round picks:

Junius Coston (2005)
Mike Hawkins (2005)
Ingle Martin (2006)
Tony Moll (2006)
David Clowney (2007)
Breno Giacomini (2008)
Quinn Johnson (2009)
Jamon Meredith (2009)
Andrew Quarless (2010)
Marshall Newhouse (2010)
D.J. Williams (2011)
Terrell Manning (2012)

Nearly all of those guys were measurables picks. Giacomini did start for a playoff team last year. And Meredith is still bouncing around. And Johnson was a fine FB if you were Mike Sherman and not Mike McCarthy.

[pbmax]

Young guys starting is a good thing. The are less expensive and are getting better. If the Packers were older with their injury trend then they would have been fielding the Rutgers lineup in two of the last three years.

That youth has a very good record in the NFL. Not all the youth plays right away (Newhouse, Sherrod, Giacomini, Smith, Bishop, House, Heyward, Williams) which means the starting lineup is not a fire sale.

I cannot look at the team's record and say the roster stinks and has lousy veterans and only wins because of Rodgers. That youth plays pretty good.

However, I am coming to the conclusion that the youth does not always play disciplined. And with Collins, Jolly or perhaps Jenkins (ugh!), doesn't get away with it as much as they did early in Capes tenure.

[Patler]

I have to admit......when I saw part of that article I thought the same thing as red
Since Free Agency tends to be the hibernation period for GB it makes sense more draft picks see playing time
Maybe not a fair generalization...but that thought hit me as well

Having now given this some thought, I'm not sure if draft picks really do see significantly more playing time in GB because of the perceived free agency thing or not. A lot of lower level FAs, street FAs and URFA's compete with the draftees for playing time. Guys like Tramon Williams, Shields, Walden, Kuhn, Crabtree, Zombo, EDS, Howard Green (for half a year), Peprah, Bigby, Chiller, Crabtree, all come to mind as free agents of one sort or another who played a lot, took time away from draftees, etc. It's not just the big name guys like Pickett and Woodson who compete with the draft picks for playing time. After all, if not for FAs like Williams and Shields, the likes of Lee and Underwood might have played more, or still been around. Would it have been any different if the Packers signed a couple big name corners instead of Williams and Shields?

I expect there is some impact from it, but perhaps not as much as first appears.

[Patler]

And Meredith is still bouncing around.

Actually, he may have found a home, and as a guard at that. He started 12 games for the Bucs last year after Davin Joseph went out. It will be interesting to see if his career finally takes off, or not. The fluff pieces out of the Bucs PR dept make it sound like they really like him. Of course, Buffalo said the same after he started a few games there in an emergency, too. Could be one of those guys who has a 10 year career playing mostly as a backup for half the teams in the league. He has already drawn checks from the Packers, Bills, Lions, Giants, Steelers and Bucs.

[Patler]

It's fair to say that draft picks get more of a chance in Green Bay. But it's also fair to say the Packers wouldn't have won a Super Bowl and been a perennial playoff team if TT wasn't really good on draft day.


Also fair to say we probably would not have won a Super Bowl without TT's two big money free agent signings

It's also fair to say they probably wouldn't have won the Super Bowl without TT's many small money free agent signings. Not to down play what Woodson and Pickett meant to the team, but wasn't Pickett hurt and playing sporadically at the end of the year? And Woodson missed half the Super Bowl. Luckilly, guys like Peprah, Howard Green, Waldon, Shields, and yes, even Bush stepped up at the right times, and Tramon Williams had a standout season. All small money FA's.

[Bretsky]

It's also fair to say they probably wouldn't have won the Super Bowl without TT's many small money free agent signings. Not to down play what Woodson and Pickett meant to the team, but wasn't Pickett hurt and playing sporadically at the end of the year? And Woodson missed half the Super Bowl. Luckilly, guys like Peprah, Howard Green, Waldon, Shields, and yes, even Bush stepped up at the right times, and Tramon Williams had a standout season. All small money FA's.

Good point as it worked both ways
W/O the big money free agents (which is not always evil) and the lesser priced free agents GB doesn't even see the playoffs. We hardly slipped in there as it was and we needed the help from others that year..........no playoffs........no SB...........

[rbaloha1]

Seattle is everybody's darling right now
It's insane...if u belive in Russell Wilson...to think they have a legit starting QB for the next two years at about 300G per year
Thinks of all the excess money they are able to spend before that deal is redone after year three.

It's also interesting that a TT disciple is making all of these bold moves in FA

There is a reason for the darling treatment.

Keep in mind Carroll has the final say on personnel.

[HarveyWallbangers]

Having now given this some thought, I'm not sure if draft picks really do see significantly more playing time in GB because of the perceived free agency thing or not. A lot of lower level FAs, street FAs and URFA's compete with the draftees for playing time. Guys like Tramon Williams, Shields, Walden, Kuhn, Crabtree, Zombo, EDS, Howard Green (for half a year), Peprah, Bigby, Chiller, Crabtree, all come to mind as free agents of one sort or another who played a lot, took time away from draftees, etc. It's not just the big name guys like Pickett and Woodson who compete with the draft picks for playing time. After all, if not for FAs like Williams and Shields, the likes of Lee and Underwood might have played more, or still been around. Would it have been any different if the Packers signed a couple big name corners instead of Williams and Shields?

I expect there is some impact from it, but perhaps not as much as first appears.

This is a good point. The article analyzed the Packers draft picks, but did it take into account guys like Williams, Shields, etc.? If not, you can say that the Packers draft picks have a better opportunity for PT, but you also have to admit they have to uncommonly compete against good street FAs for that playing time. For example, Davon House may not have to compete against an Asomugha for PT but he does have to compete against Williams and Shields. Those are the guys that have offered much more value than most teams. Let's hope TT can keep it up with a revamped scouting department.

[wist43]

time to stir some shit

some of those draft picks have gained playing time when maybe they wouldn't have on other teams because of the lack of options TT leaves us by not using free agency

some of those late rounders HAVE TO play, just because there is no other option on the team

guys like will whitiker not only play, but get thrust into starting roles

add to that the fact that we draft special teamers, guys that have no business being on the field for the offense or defense but gets drafted and makes the team because they're a good gunner.........

jarrett bush

and like what was already said. how good will TT and M3 be with all the grunt work guys moved on to other teams?

I agree... our young draft picks have to play.

Beyond that, you have to consider players on other teams acquired thru FA. If TT's only avenue of player procurement is the draft, then yes, just about every starting position is going to be filled by a draft pick.

On the other hand, last time I checked, Jared Allen is one hell of a player, and Julius Peppers is a future Hall of Famer. The Bears just signed Jermon Bushrod... problem at LT?? solved. TT will likely be taking swings at our LT spot every draft for the forseeable future, and Rodgers will continue to run and duck for his life.

Those things said, we're kind of stuck with draft only. Rodgers is going to chew up a huge amount of the cap; Matthews just signed an extension... we don't have the money to throw around.

[Patler]

I agree... our young draft picks have to play.

Beyond that, you have to consider players on other teams acquired thru FA. If TT's only avenue of player procurement is the draft, then yes, just about every starting position is going to be filled by a draft pick.

On the other hand, last time I checked, Jared Allen is one hell of a player, and Julius Peppers is a future Hall of Famer. The Bears just signed Jermon Bushrod... problem at LT?? solved. TT will likely be taking swings at our LT spot every draft for the forseeable future, and Rodgers will continue to run and duck for his life.

Those things said, we're kind of stuck with draft only. Rodgers is going to chew up a huge amount of the cap; Matthews just signed an extension... we don't have the money to throw around.

..Yet, for all those FA signings, the Vikings and Bears seem to be left on the outside looking in when all is said and done. It's the same old story year after year with the Bears. Cutler will make the difference. Peppers will make the difference. Marshall will make the difference. Now Bushrod will make the difference. For every hole they patch, another seems to open, probably due to this from the article:


...nearly a quarter of Chicago’s picks since 2005 haven’t played a down in the NFL.

[wist43]

The teams are built differently... in the end, the only thing that matters is Chamionships. We snuck in and stole one - yay for us :)

More than one way to skin a cat... think back to our SB win in '97 - our entire starting DL were signed as FA's. Sean Jones, Gilbert Brown, Santana Dotson, Reggie White.

[rbaloha1]

The teams are built differently... in the end, the only thing that matters is Chamionships. We snuck in and stole one - yay for us :)

More than one way to skin a cat... think back to our SB win in '97 - our entire starting DL were signed as FA's. Sean Jones, Gilbert Brown, Santana Dotson, Reggie White.

You need both since no organization is perfect selecting draft picks. FA can sometimes quickly fix draft screwups.

[smuggler]

The game has changed slightly in FA, as players are consuming larger and larger percentages of the cap when exposed to a full free market.

[red]

The game has changed slightly in FA, as players are consuming larger and larger percentages of the cap when exposed to a full free market.

as opposed to our own resignings that don't hit the market

clay just became the highest paid 3-4 OLB in history, a-rod is about to become the highest paid player ever in the NFL

good players cost money, the key is, not paying the mediocre free agents like elite players

[Bretsky]

To answer the thread question, TT is elite at draft day decsisions. To me, elite is top 5 in the game. There may be a couple GM's I'd rather have....one could argue either way with a few. But IMO TT is elite. Doesn't mean I won't call things into debate, but he's hands down in the upper tier of GM's in the NFL.

[rbaloha1]

To answer the thread question, TT is elite at draft day decsisions. To me, elite is top 5 in the game. There may be a couple GM's I'd rather have....one could argue either way with a few. But IMO TT is elite. Doesn't mean I won't call things into debate, but he's hands down in the upper tier of GM's in the NFL.

Bow wow!

[smuggler]

Bow wow!

Bloo bloo!

[Pugger]

I agree... our young draft picks have to play.

Beyond that, you have to consider players on other teams acquired thru FA. If TT's only avenue of player procurement is the draft, then yes, just about every starting position is going to be filled by a draft pick.

On the other hand, last time I checked, Jared Allen is one hell of a player, and Julius Peppers is a future Hall of Famer. The Bears just signed Jermon Bushrod... problem at LT?? solved. TT will likely be taking swings at our LT spot every draft for the forseeable future, and Rodgers will continue to run and duck for his life.

Those things said, we're kind of stuck with draft only. Rodgers is going to chew up a huge amount of the cap; Matthews just signed an extension... we don't have the money to throw around.

I don't think Allen was a FA. Didn't MN have to make a trade to get him?

[HarveyWallbangers]

I don't think Allen was a FA. Didn't MN have to make a trade to get him?

Yes, they traded a 1st round and two 3rd round picks for him. Two of those picks turned into OG Branden Albert and RB Jamaal Charles. The Chiefs got two really good players for cheap (for 4 years anyways). Allen has been a good pickup for the Vikings. Additional risk was taken on by the Vikings because of Allen's alcohol problems, but Allen has stayed out of trouble and is a good locker room guy (kudos to him). Good trade for both teams.

[woodbuck27]

Ya, I don't worry too much about teams that are "thumping the crap out of us in this off season." The off season isn't done, no one has won a game yet in 2013. Every year it seems a different team or two wins the off season hype, and more often than not they fail miserably the next season. That said, I expect the 49ers to be tough, I'm not yet convinced about what is going on in Seattle for the long haul.

Which rounds do you consider to be the later rounds? 6th & 7th? 5th too? What do you expect from the later rounds? I have some theories about TT's approach in the 6th & 7th rounds in view of what he does with URFA signings, but I haven't thought it through completely.

Good Day Patler.

Later rounds this year are the 5th Picks #159 and Compensatory #167; 6th Rd. #193 and 7th Rd. #232.

Early picks this year are Rd.1 #26; Rd. 2 #55; Rd. 3 #88 and in Rd. 4 #122.

In other years I might have deemed the Pick in Rd. 4 as a later round pick.

PACKERS !