A Strength and Conditioning Program That Works: Six Seattle Players Busted for PEDs Since 2011

[pbmax]

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/05/19/six-seahawks-have-tested-positive-for-peds-since-2011/

1. Richard Sherman
2. Bruce Irvin
3. Brandon Browner
4. Winston Guy
5. John Moffitt
6. Allen Barbre

Now this will cure both small and slow.

[denverYooper]

Barbre. Huh.

[denverYooper]

I don't think I ever mentioned it on PR, but I'd had a thought about the Packers injury problems vs other teams: that they aren't taking whatever newfangled regenerative therapies that are going around. They're like Rocky carrying logs through the snow while teams like the Vikings (Williams Wall) and Seattle are shooting up and pounding kilometers on the treadmill.

But I've never mentioned it because it gets out into a pretty heavy homer narrative -- that Green Bay is more wholesome than other teams wrt PEDs -- that I feel I'd be naive to buy.

[rbaloha1]

The league is filled with players using Human Growth Hormone which is currently not tested for.

Getting a legal prescription for Attention Deficit Disorder is also very easy.

[Joemailman]

How extensive is the testing program? Just wondering to what extent, if any, the 6 who were caught are just the tip of the iceberg?

[rbaloha1]

How extensive is the testing program? Just wondering to what extent, if any, the 6 who were caught are just the tip of the iceberg?

It is not at the Olympics level due to the player's union.

[denverYooper]

The league is filled with players using Human Growth Hormone which is currently not tested for.

Getting a legal prescription for Attention Deficit Disorder is also very easy.

Tell that to fake tough guy.

[rbaloha1]

Tell that to fake tough guy.

His problem was a failure to disclose to the league.

[Old School]

I'm no expert, but I've often wondered if the high number of injuries might be connected to roids, HGH, or the flavor of the day. I remember Mark Prior of the Cubs having unbelievably huge calves he used to generate power for his fastball. After a succession of injuries, he mysteriously had skinny, by comparison, legs.

[pbmax]

I'm no expert, but I've often wondered if the high number of injuries might be connected to roids, HGH, or the flavor of the day. I remember Mark Prior of the Cubs having unbelievably huge calves he used to generate power for his fastball. After a succession of injuries, he mysteriously had skinny, by comparison, legs.

Its possible, though visual evidence can obviously be misleading. Most of the new stuff, though, is designed, used in combination and/or scheduled to either protect or strengthen other soft tissue as well to prevent those kinds of blowouts. Its one of the reasons HGH is so popular.


Or so I have heard. :D

[pbmax]

How extensive is the testing program? Just wondering to what extent, if any, the 6 who were caught are just the tip of the iceberg?

Random tests can come at any time and there is a minimum of once per year. I believe, though don't have the link handy, that many are tested again in-season. Prior to the 2012 CBA the conventional wisdom among football players was that you had to avoid drug use in season AND prior to your offseason random test. Between that test and camp, it was full go.

The tests they use, minus HGH, are the same tests with the same labs as WADA and USADA. The list of banned substances is similar, including many innocuous substances due to possible masking effects.

Prior to the HGH kerfuffle, the biggest difference between Olympic and NFL programs were penalties. Olympic athletes lose years. NFL players lose games. There is obviously room for disagreement about the length of suspensions because careers are shorter and NFL games are more frequent than many Olympic sporting events.

That being said, WADA is one of the most odious, self-righteous entities on the planet.

[Old School]

"ODIOUS" - the word of the day. Good one!!!

[George Cumby]

This comes as a surprise to me.

Pete Carroll has always been such a stickler for rules.

Weird.

[rbaloha1]

This comes as a surprise to me.

Pete Carroll has always been such a stickler for rules.

Weird.

You are joking?

Rules -- what happened at USC during Carroll's reign.

[Carolina_Packer]

You are joking?

Rules -- what happened at USC during Carroll's reign.

Pretty sure, ol' George was being funny, seeing as how Pete left USC before the hammer fell, and he got his fat NFL contract.

[Iron Mike]

Love the comments.....PED Carroll and the Seadderal Cheathawks. :)

[Iron Mike]

http://distprod.com/gfx/teamadd.jpg

[Iron Mike]

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i24/jimrat201/73f2d783-974c-415d-9caf-5ec86277d53e_zpsc3345a74.png

[George Cumby]

You are joking?

Rules -- what happened at USC during Carroll's reign.

Irony. It's not just for breakfast anymore.

[red]

at what point does the nfl step in and start stripping the team of draft picks and past accomplishments?

its clear there is a massive problem up there in seattle. when sherman said half the nfl was taking adderall he was probably basing it on the his knowledge of half the seahawks taking it

[Joemailman]

at what point does the nfl step in and start stripping the team of draft picks and past accomplishments?

its clear there is a massive problem up there in seattle. when sherman said half the nfl was taking adderall he was probably basing it on the his knowledge of half the seahawks taking it

I was thinking the same thing. Does the NFL have a policy on penalizing a team? I guess based on the bounty fiasco, the policy is Goodell can do whatever he wants.

[3irty1]

Adderall is a PED now?

[denverYooper]

Adderall is a PED now?

College students always think it is during finals.

[pbmax]

I think it is PLUS I believe it can mask some other stuff.

[rbaloha1]

Adderall is a PED now?

Always was.

[Guiness]

How does the NFL classify weed? It's banned, under the 'substance abuse not the PED category, right?

[pbmax]

How does the NFL classify weed? It's banned, under the 'substance abuse not the PED category, right?

Yep, not PED but covered under the Drug and Alcohol policy.

[Joemailman]

Adderall is a PED now?

It can be used as a masking agent for steroids.

[mission]

This might sound ridiculous, but if this is your profession and there are MILLIONS of dollars on the line: why WOULDN'T you take HGH? Seems kind of like the cost of doing business.

I mean, guys do a lot of shit for a lot less than $10mil a year. I'd take it for a few years to set my kids up and their kids up for life especially if it was the difference between 5mil a year and selling insurance.

Save me the integrity stuff please. This is a gladiator sport and the NFLPA's reluctance to institute HGH testing makes it obvious that it's a big part of the Bigger / Stronger / Faster mentality of the league and its players.

[RashanGary]

This might sound ridiculous, but if this is your profession and there are MILLIONS of dollars on the line: why WOULDN'T you take HGH? Seems kind of like the cost of doing business.

I mean, guys do a lot of shit for a lot less than $10mil a year. I'd take it for a few years to set my kids up and their kids up for life especially if it was the difference between 5mil a year and selling insurance.

Save me the integrity stuff please. This is a gladiator sport and the NFLPA's reluctance to institute HGH testing makes it obvious that it's a big part of the Bigger / Stronger / Faster mentality of the league and its players.


Yep. The difference between integrity and lacking integrity is Brady Poppinga and Clay Matthews. If you're in the NFL, if you want to dominate, you do what it takes. HGH is very safe and very helpful in recovery. The great ones use it. I'll bet anything AP and Clay are both HGH users.

[pbmax]

Well, integrity is an issue for people who have short memories. No one gets verklempt over greenies.

[red]

i agree

if there's no testing in place, then why the hell not take HGH?

[Cleft Crusty]

i agree

if there's no testing in place, then why the hell not take HGH?


there's absolutely no downside to taking various growth hormones. Only positives! What could possibly go wrong??

http://media.oregonlive.com/today/photo/hgh-growing-use-21254939jpg-45096ec89df60ef5.jpg

[mission]

Well, integrity is an issue for people who have short memories. No one gets verklempt over greenies.

Is Greenies all the 70s Steelers were taking? I always thought they were the pioneers of juicing the NFL.. hasn't seemed to tarnish anything they've done.

[rbaloha1]

It can be used as a masking agent for steroids.

masking agents are myth.

[rbaloha1]

there's absolutely no downside to taking various growth hormones. Only positives! What could possibly go wrong??

http://media.oregonlive.com/today/photo/hgh-growing-use-21254939jpg-45096ec89df60ef5.jpg

Cancer

[NewsBruin]

masking agents are myth.

Interesting. Please elaborate.

(As I understood it, masking agents take the graphs of a urine test and turn it into porn scramblevision. Does anyone remember back when the only way to get porn was to watch the blocked channels?)

[RashanGary]

Does anyone remember back when the only way to get porn was to watch the blocked channels?

I remember adjusting the fuzz out of HBO and skinimax at midnight in highschool to watch the soft-core porn. That, MTV's spring break and the underwear section in the JC Penny catalog were this 15 year olds best friends.

[rbaloha1]

This might sound ridiculous, but if this is your profession and there are MILLIONS of dollars on the line: why WOULDN'T you take HGH? Seems kind of like the cost of doing business.

I mean, guys do a lot of shit for a lot less than $10mil a year. I'd take it for a few years to set my kids up and their kids up for life especially if it was the difference between 5mil a year and selling insurance.

Save me the integrity stuff please. This is a gladiator sport and the NFLPA's reluctance to institute HGH testing makes it obvious that it's a big part of the Bigger / Stronger / Faster mentality of the league and its players.

HGH helps with the healing process since it helps cartilidge repair faster and repairs muscles quicker.

[Pugger]

Will all 6 of these players be suspended early in the 2013 season?

[George Cumby]

If I could legitimately get my hands on some HGH, I would use it (note: not abuse it).

[Pugger]

They were talking about Seattle and this issue on the NFLN tonight and there is a chance the league could fine the seachickens over this.

[NewsBruin]

I remember adjusting the fuzz out of HBO and skinimax at midnight in highschool to watch the soft-core porn. That, MTV's spring break and the underwear section in the JC Penny catalog were this 15 year olds best friends.

See, kids don't appreciate how tough we had it.

[NewsBruin]

But back to PEDs, I belive there are some meds that serve as masking agents by blocking or diluting definitive proof of steroids or weed. Adderol, a stimulant, would serve to make someone feel more alert and wired (it's the opposite of what stimulants do to a person diagnosed with ADHD, funny enough). I don't believe it has any drug-masking properties.

Some folks on the board speculated that the diuretics in StarCaps served as masking agents for marijuana. I can see how turning on the waterworks would reduce clear readings for specific substances. Still, the league does not ever say what the substance is, so the playes are able to get the first volley in the court of public opinion.

Charles Rogers of the Lions (http://sports.espn.go.com/nfldraft/story?id=1538495) received a suspension, ostensibly for masking agents, before playing in his first game.

RBAloha says masking agents are only a myth, which relieves me greatly.

[3irty1]

Personally I've always assumed that over 90% of the league is on PED's. I'd actually be upset if they weren't. The NFL is supposed to be the highest level of football competition in the world. But if we're being honest with ourselves we know they are. They're extreme competitors beyond what most of us can even understand. We don't need more testing we need more lip-service for testing so that kids have good role models and can watch in blissful ignorance. Really though who are we to demand entertainment then question the manor in which professional athletes accomplish it?

[Guiness]

But back to PEDs, I belive there are some meds that serve as masking agents by blocking or diluting definitive proof of steroids or weed. Adderol, a stimulant, would serve to make someone feel more alert and wired (it's the opposite of what stimulants do to a person diagnosed with ADHD, funny enough). I don't believe it has any drug-masking properties.

Some folks on the board speculated that the diuretics in StarCaps served as masking agents for marijuana. I can see how turning on the waterworks would reduce clear readings for specific substances. Still, the league does not ever say what the substance is, so the playes are able to get the first volley in the court of public opinion.

Charles Rogers of the Lions (http://sports.espn.go.com/nfldraft/story?id=1538495) received a suspension, ostensibly for masking agents, before playing in his first game.

RBAloha says masking agents are only a myth, which relieves me greatly.

Remember Ben Johnson? He of the 9.72 100m in Seoul? Not a bright boy, his idea of a masking agent was apparently to drink 10 beers as quick as he could right after the fateful race in an effort to dilute his urine! Diuretics work that way, lowering the levels of banned substances to the point that they are undetectable, or at least at allowable levels. I'm not sure about ones that 'scramble' the chemical signal, do you have any examples NB? I'd like to read about them.

[pbmax]

Is Greenies all the 70s Steelers were taking? I always thought they were the pioneers of juicing the NFL.. hasn't seemed to tarnish anything they've done.

All? Probably not. They could have been taking them, and it would not have been uncommon though greenies were just amphetamines. Baseball clubhouses used to keep a jar, like they were M&Ms, in the clubhouse.

Steve Courson is the only player I know of on the 70s Steelers to cop to steroids except Bradshaw. Courson himself was a late stage Steeler dynasty player. Jim Haslett said he took them when he played and was influenced by the Steeler's Super Bowl teams. Dan Rooney then gave what might be the textbook definition of a statement in denial:


Rooney rejected Haslett's claims, noting the Steelers were known for smaller, quicker linemen who ran trap plays that required they be agile, not bulky.

"This is totally false when he says it started with the Steelers in the '70s," Rooney told the Post-Gazette. "(Then-coach) Chuck Noll was totally against it. He looked into it, examined it, talked to people. Haslett, maybe it affected his mind.

"Chuck Noll told the players, 'Hey, this stuff doesn't do you any good. If you just do the work, lift, things like that, you'll be all right,"' Rooney said.
http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/story/8322840

Yes, Chuck Noll, the guy benefitting second most over possible steroid use conducted an investigation and found everyone to be clean. Slam. Dunk.

Given the day and age, the suspicion is that the Steelers would have used anabolic steroids common to Olympic athletes a decade earlier. Bradshaw at one point admitted taking them, then backtracked and said what he took wasn't what we think of as steroids today (?) and Courson said Ham and Lambert were adamantly opposed to taking them.

But the most damning info is simple inference.


[During recent spate of former player's deaths s]even died of heart failure: Jim Clack, 58; Ray Oldham, 54; Dave Brown, 52; Mike Webster, 50; Steve Furness, 49; Joe Gilliam, 49; and Tyrone McGriff, 41. (In 1996, four years before the steady succession of Steelers deaths, longtime center Ray Mansfield died of a heart attack at 55.)

There is speculation that steroid abuse could have played a role in some of the deaths, but no hard evidence. It’s just as plausible that weight issues were a factor.

via http://fifthdown.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/07/04/steve-courson-from-the-heart-and-from-the-grave/ originally from the Pittsburgh Press Gazette.

Clack, Mansfield, Webster, Furness and McGriff all played on the LOS.

[smuggler]

Rooney really is a special kind of idiot to even speak about it, let alone expect people to buy his bullshit sandwiches. This is definitely a case of the cover-up being worse (or more disgraceful) than the actual crime. At least in my book.

[RashanGary]

The NFL is a gladiator sport. I think all concern over being fair and just goes out the window when you play a game that causes head injury, death, paralysis, back injury, and many other forms of bodily harm. Football is dangerous. You do what it takes to win and do what it takes to make your body stronger than their bodies.

Honor is a virtue, but it does not come before self-preservation. I'm sure you can find graveyards filled with people who died with honor and car lots loaded with football players who couldn't make it in the NFL, but sell cars with honor.

I certainly respect people who conduct themselves with honor, but it can cross the line from honor to stupidity.

[Cleft Crusty]

Really though who are we to demand entertainment then question the manor in which professional athletes accomplish it?


I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the blanket of the very freedom that I provide, and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather you just said thank you, and went on your way, Otherwise, I suggest you pick up a weapon, and stand a post. Either way, I don't give a damn what you think you are entitled to.

http://online.wsj.com/media/jessup0422_E_20100423143143.jpg

[bobblehead]

This might sound ridiculous, but if this is your profession and there are MILLIONS of dollars on the line: why WOULDN'T you take HGH? Seems kind of like the cost of doing business.

I mean, guys do a lot of shit for a lot less than $10mil a year. I'd take it for a few years to set my kids up and their kids up for life especially if it was the difference between 5mil a year and selling insurance.

Save me the integrity stuff please. This is a gladiator sport and the NFLPA's reluctance to institute HGH testing makes it obvious that it's a big part of the Bigger / Stronger / Faster mentality of the league and its players.

HgH has virtually no negative effects. It helps immensely with recovery. In larger doses (which have mild side effects) it increases muscle mass. I can't think of a single reason an NFL player would NOT take it (unless they are REALLY honorable).

[bobblehead]

there's absolutely no downside to taking various growth hormones. Only positives! What could possibly go wrong??

http://media.oregonlive.com/today/photo/hgh-growing-use-21254939jpg-45096ec89df60ef5.jpg

And he looks better than he did at 69. Doc Life works out at my gym (although I only see him about once every 3 months....works out at 5am). He takes Testosterone and HgH...and measures every ounce of food he eats.

[bobblehead]

Cancer

NO basis for this statement (like most of your posts). Although some detractors have THEORIZED that HgH causes cancer that hard statistical data says it actually REDUCES chances of getting cancer. As a growth agent though, if you do get cancer it can prolifierate the spread.

[bobblehead]

If I could legitimately get my hands on some HGH, I would use it (note: not abuse it).

Our wonderful representatives in congress decided that you can not have this. We need you to die early, not milk the system into your 90's.

[bobblehead]

The NFL is a gladiator sport. I think all concern over being fair and just goes out the window when you play a game that causes head injury, death, paralysis, back injury, and many other forms of bodily harm. Football is dangerous. You do what it takes to win and do what it takes to make your body stronger than their bodies.

Honor is a virtue, but it does not come before self-preservation. I'm sure you can find graveyards filled with people who died with honor and car lots loaded with football players who couldn't make it in the NFL, but sell cars with honor.

I certainly respect people who conduct themselves with honor, but it can cross the line from honor to stupidity.

Game of thrones: Catelyns sister "you do not fight with honor" Bronn: (nodding to dead body falling into pit) "He did"

[denverYooper]

Game of thrones: Catelyns sister "you do not fight with honor" Bronn: (nodding to dead body falling into pit) "He did"

Great scene.

[Cleft Crusty]

And he looks better than he did at 69. Doc Life works out at my gym (although I only see him about once every 3 months....works out at 5am). He takes Testosterone and HgH...and measures every ounce of food he eats.


Clefty was concerned about increase in nipple size morso than cancer. Also that he lost fifteen years of his life.

[Cleft Crusty]

NO basis for this statement (like most of your posts). Although some detractors have THEORIZED that HgH causes cancer that hard statistical data says it actually REDUCES chances of getting cancer. As a growth agent though, if you do get cancer it can prolifierate the spread.

Actually, the aspect related to cancer that is known, is that some cancers have increased GH production, so that GH might exacerbate an already cancerous situation. But the point is the direction: some cancerous cells generates GH. Very little is known about the oncogenic potential of GH, although it's role in the treatment of various stature defects is pretty well known and beneficial.

[hoosier]

HgH has virtually no negative effects.

Are you talking about Rx HGH or illegally obtained? If legal then known negative effects, in addition to the speeding of previously existing cancers, include contributing to hypertension, diabetes, as well as lesser ills like edema and neuropathy. If it's illegal HGH, who really knows what you're putting in your body.

[RashanGary]

Game of thrones: Catelyns sister "you do not fight with honor" Bronn: (nodding to dead body falling into pit) "He did"

My fav show EVER! Game of Thrones, that is. Not any particular episode. They all sort of build on and off each other.

[RashanGary]

Are you talking about Rx HGH or illegally obtained? If legal then known negative effects, in addition to the speeding of previously existing cancers, include contributing to hypertension, diabetes, as well as lesser ills like edema and neuropathy. If it's illegal HGH, who really knows what you're putting in your body.

This is the list of possible side effects with Advil. You realize, if the FDA was able to list possible side effects of gummy worms, it would include black, rotting teeth, digestion problems, and who knows what the hell else. Shit, Romaine lettuce might have a more disturbing list of side effects than HGH.



chest pain, weakness, shortness of breath, slurred speech, problems with vision or balance;
black, bloody, or tarry stools, coughing up blood or vomit that looks like coffee grounds;
swelling or rapid weight gain;
urinating less than usual or not at all;
nausea, upper stomach pain, itching, loss of appetite, dark urine, clay-colored stools, jaundice (yellowing of the skin or eyes);
fever, sore throat, and headache with a severe blistering, peeling, and red skin rash;
bruising, severe tingling, numbness, pain, muscle weakness; or
severe headache, neck stiffness, chills, increased sensitivity to light, and/or seizure (convulsions).
Less serious Advil side effects may include:

upset stomach, mild heartburn, diarrhea, constipation;
bloating, gas;
dizziness, headache, nervousness;
skin itching or rash;
blurred vision; or
ringing in your ears.

[Cleft Crusty]

chest pain, weakness, shortness of breath, slurred speech, problems with vision or balance;
black, bloody, or tarry stools, coughing up blood or vomit that looks like coffee grounds;
swelling or rapid weight gain;
urinating less than usual or not at all;
nausea, upper stomach pain, itching, loss of appetite, dark urine, clay-colored stools, jaundice (yellowing of the skin or eyes);
fever, sore throat, and headache with a severe blistering, peeling, and red skin rash;
bruising, severe tingling, numbness, pain, muscle weakness; or
severe headache, neck stiffness, chills, increased sensitivity to light, and/or seizure (convulsions).
Less serious Advil side effects may include:

upset stomach, mild heartburn, diarrhea, constipation;
bloating, gas;
dizziness, headache, nervousness;
skin itching or rash;
blurred vision; or
ringing in your ears.

You've just described a typical Wednesday morning for Cleft Crusty

[Freak Out]

Blast from the past...well maybe not.

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/i-team/red-flag-lindsey-vonn-red-bull-east-german-drug-doctor-article-1.1349830

[bobblehead]

Actually, the aspect related to cancer that is known, is that some cancers have increased GH production, so that GH might exacerbate an already cancerous situation. But the point is the direction: some cancerous cells generates GH. Very little is known about the oncogenic potential of GH, although it's role in the treatment of various stature defects is pretty well known and beneficial.

Cliffy. Exacerbate is pretty much a syllable for proliferate.

[bobblehead]

Are you talking about Rx HGH or illegally obtained? If legal then known negative effects, in addition to the speeding of previously existing cancers, include contributing to hypertension, diabetes, as well as lesser ills like edema and neuropathy. If it's illegal HGH, who really knows what you're putting in your body.

Who says I am taking anything? The science on the hypertension is questionable. Dr. Life has documented MANY users whose BP drops with HGH. I haven't seen any studies showing it causes hypertension. The diabetes is also THEORY. HGH increases insulin resistance (so it was theorized that it caused daibetes) but in every study lasting over 6 months it showed that the condition actually improves.

[Cleft Crusty]

Cliffy. Exacerbate is pretty much a syllable for proliferate.

The only guy who could get away with a malapropism like that was Yogi Berra or:
http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lz38o5UWOG1r9hrxoo1_500.jpg

[Fritz]

Dammit, let's get JC Tretter on HGH or whatever it is that helps players recover more quickly from injury.

And while we're at it, how about giving Sherrod, House, and Bishop doses too. Hell, a triple dose for Sherrod.

[pbmax]

Who says I am taking anything? The science on the hypertension is questionable. Dr. Life has documented MANY users whose BP drops with HGH. I haven't seen any studies showing it causes hypertension. The diabetes is also THEORY. HGH increases insulin resistance (so it was theorized that it caused daibetes) but in every study lasting over 6 months it showed that the condition actually improves.

Time to bump up the screen font Bobble, hoosier said "taLking" not taking.

[swede]

The only guy who could get away with a malapropism like that was Yogi Berra or:
http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lz38o5UWOG1r9hrxoo1_500.jpg

I don't remember his interviews well-enough to recall mispokenisms. He went to UW-Oshkosh, so he had that going for him.

Kent Tekulve and Jim Ganter are two guys that made little, geeky kids with asthma believe they had a shot at the bigs.

[hoosier]

Kent Tekulve and Jim Ganter are two guys that made little, geeky kids with asthma believe they had a shot at the bigs.

Mario Mendoza was the true Rudy Stein (Bad News Bears) of MLB.


http://www.vintageseattle.org/wp-content/uploads/2008/02/mario_mendoza_1981_topps.thumbnail.jpg

[Fritz]

Is this the guy for whom the "Mendoza Line" is named?

[hoosier]

Yeah, that's the guy. He rivals Bob Uecker's inverse correlation between batting average and fame.

[swede]

Yeah, that's the guy. He rivals Bob Uecker's inverse correlation between batting average and fame.

Mendoza is AV Club material to be sure, but that Kent Tekulve...

http://24.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lnnyq5nIOy1qz5nxco1_400.jpg

[hoosier]

You have a point, not much meat on that carcass. But then there is nothing that aging will not change:




http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/f/f1/Kent_Tekulve_2007.jpg

[Freak Out]

Is this the Brewers forum? LOL!

[hoosier]

Now are you happy?


http://media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/192x/15/3b/48/153b48f14fea18f9cefe9fbe6fbf58d6.jpg

[Freak Out]

Who's the power bottom in the NL Central today?

[RashanGary]

Who's the power bottom in the NL Central today?

I don't know what that means exactly, but it sounds really gay.