The Passing of a Legend

[Carolina_Packer]

RIP, David Deacon Jones who passed yesterday at age 74. Part of the LA Rams "Fearsome Foursome" leaving Rosey Grier as the only living member of that front four.

From Wikipedia...

Jones was considered by many to revolutionize the position of defensive end. Jones was credited with coining the phrase "sacking the quarterback".[7] What separated Jones from every other defensive end was his blinding speed and his ability to make tackles from sideline to sideline, which was unheard of in his time. He also was the first pass rusher to utilize the head slap, a move that he said was "...to give myself an initial headstart on the pass rush, in other words a extra step. Because anytime you go upside a man's head ... or a woman; they may have a tendency to blink they eyes or close they eyes. And that's all I needed. [sic]"[8]

Pro Football Weekly reported he accumulated 194½ sacks over his career, which would be third on the all-time sack list. (Jones would have ranked first all-time at the time of his retirement, and since has been surpassed by two fellow Hall of Famer's Bruce Smith and Reggie White.) [9]

In 1967, Jones had 26 sacks in only 14 games, which (if official) would be the single season record. (The term "sack" had not yet been coined at the time, and official sack statistics were not recorded by the NFL until 1982.) Then in 1968 Jones had 24 sacks in 14 games, also more than the current NFL record.[10] The sum total of these two seasons would give him 50 sacks in 2 seasons, far more than anyone else has achieved.

Unofficial Annual Sack Totals
Year Sacks Team
1961 8 Los Angeles Rams
1962 12 Los Angeles Rams
1963 20 Los Angeles Rams
1964 22 Los Angeles Rams
1965 19 Los Angeles Rams
1966 18 Los Angeles Rams
1967 26 Los Angeles Rams
1968 24 Los Angeles Rams
1969 15 Los Angeles Rams
1970 12 Los Angeles Rams
1971 4½ Los Angeles Rams
1972 6 San Diego Chargers
1973 5 San Diego Chargers
1974 3 Washington Redskins

I am not old enough to remember watching him on TV. If any forum member here has recollections of watching him during his career, was he as dominant as he looked on some of the highlight films?

[mraynrand]

"How about THAT, Oscar?"

http://www.dvdizzy.com/images/l-o/oc3-08.jpg

"You want a minister to do a shaving cream commercial?"

[RashanGary]

189 to Deacon Jones. Nice. That follows Reggie and Bruce Smith. Bruce Smith has 2 more, but Reggie was out of football for two years before he came back for his last year. He surely would have had more. Plus, Reggie was a 300lb plus guy. Bruce Smith was that standard 265 pass rusher.

And I don't even mean to diminish Smith. He's one of the greatest of all time. I just think Reggie was a one of a kind player. . . Jim Thorpeish.

[RashanGary]

This should really be about Deacon, but I was looking up current pass rushers after reading about Deacon. Jared Allen, IMO, is one of todays most underrated players. He's 2 years younger than Peppers and has something like 10 more career sacks. I think he's a tougher run block too.

[pbmax]

Didn't see Deacon play. Loved his attitude and the blue and white Rams unis.

[Patler]

189 to Deacon Jones. Nice. That follows Reggie and Bruce Smith. Bruce Smith has 2 more, but Reggie was out of football for two years before he came back for his last year. He surely would have had more. Plus, Reggie was a 300lb plus guy. Bruce Smith was that standard 265 pass rusher.

And I don't even mean to diminish Smith. He's one of the greatest of all time. I just think Reggie was a one of a kind player. . . Jim Thorpeish.

Remember, too, that Deacon Jones played only 14 games each season. Over his 14 year career, 28 more games could have added another 20-35 sacks.

[RashanGary]

Didn't think about the 14 game season. I think I'd give him the production nod over Reggie and Smith, just cuz. Sure he could have been injured had he played more games, but I'd give him an edge still.

Never got to see Deacon Jones either. Saw a few clips. They all seemed slower off the snap than they do now. Just off the few clips, if I had to compare his game to someone, I'd say Julius Peppers. His burst didn't impress me in the clips I saw (maybe they were clips later in his career, I don't know.) He seemed like a ruthless competitor though. Just the couple plays I saw, his edge showed up. One play, he tripped a guy. I'm pretty sure it's illegal now (might have been then) but I like that he didn't want that fucker to get away. Sometimes guys are so focused on technique, they forget to make a play. I call it savvy, natural, whatever. . . He just sort of found a way, and I like to see that. Woodson did a lot of that type of thing here. Matthews, Bishop and Collins too. I like defenders who just sort of find a way. Tackling isn't always an exact science. If it doesn't line-up right, you have to trip the guy up or punch him in the throat or something. Get him down.

[Smidgeon]

189 to Deacon Jones. Nice. That follows Reggie and Bruce Smith. Bruce Smith has 2 more, but Reggie was out of football for two years before he came back for his last year. He surely would have had more. Plus, Reggie was a 300lb plus guy. Bruce Smith was that standard 265 pass rusher.

And I don't even mean to diminish Smith. He's one of the greatest of all time. I just think Reggie was a one of a kind player. . . Jim Thorpeish.

Bruce Smith played five years longer than White in the NFL (if I remember correctly). But the big nod in Reggie's favor is that his first two years were in the USFL and his stats didn't credit towards the NFL.

[pbmax]

Remember, too, that Deacon Jones played only 14 games each season. Over his 14 year career, 28 more games could have added another 20-35 sacks.

Think there is any chance that factor is overblown and the player actually just peters out faster? Or is it just youth?

[smuggler]

Deacon Jones was a monster, but you have to also consider that his head-slap move gave him an advantage over more modern players.

[Patler]

Think there is any chance that factor is overblown and the player actually just peters out faster? Or is it just youth?

Do you mean current players retire after few seasons? Each has only so many games in them, not seasons? Kind of like RBs and carries?

Maybe. Don't know, but back in those days the roster sizes were much smaller. His first few years it was 36, thereafter 40. There weren't rotations in the D-line. Starters basically played the entire game. so, who knows?

Lot few pass plays back then, generally fewer than 20/game; so a lot fewer sack opportunities.
But, O-line had to keep their hands clenched and against their chests, so maybe easier to get a sack on any specific play.

[pbmax]

Do you mean current players retire after few seasons? Each has only so many games in them, not seasons? Kind of like RBs and carries?

Maybe. Don't know, but back in those days the roster sizes were much smaller. His first few years it was 36, thereafter 40. There weren't rotations in the D-line. Starters basically played the entire game. so, who knows?

Lot few pass plays back then, generally fewer than 20/game; so a lot fewer sack opportunities.
But, O-line had to keep their hands clenched and against their chests, so maybe easier to get a sack on any specific play.

Yes, forgot about pass blocking rules. I was thinking the longer season would produce larger stats in a players early years, but perhaps wear and tear of age (and injuries) would appear sooner. He would not have access to better medical care. Its probably a partial cause, being very dependent on specific cases.

[red]

how many sacks would he have in todays NFL when he couldn't use the head slap to stun his blockers?

honestly, the guy is probably responsible for a good chunk of the old players who are currently suing the NFL because they can't remember their names

[RashanGary]

how many sacks would he have in todays NFL when he couldn't use the head slap to stun his blockers?

honestly, the guy is probably responsible for a good chunk of the old players who are currently suing the NFL because they can't remember their names

Yeah. He didn't seem as athletic as todays players. And I don't say that about everyone. I watched a LB, named Robertson from the 70's play, and he impressed me a lot. Reminded me of todays best, a young Urlacher maybe.

[Guiness]

Yeah. He didn't seem as athletic as todays players. And I don't say that about everyone. I watched a LB, named Robertson from the 70's play, and he impressed me a lot. Reminded me of todays best, a young Urlacher maybe.

He dominated an era. You can have this conversation ad nauseum about any player. As Pbmax and Palter pointed out, rules have changed, size of players, medical care, etc. His accomplishments stand out among his peers, which is the only way you can consider him.

[Guiness]

how many sacks would he have in todays NFL when he couldn't use the head slap to stun his blockers?

honestly, the guy is probably responsible for a good chunk of the old players who are currently suing the NFL because they can't remember their names

Between the legal head slap and OL not being able to extend their arms, it's a wonder the QB didn't end up on his ass every play. That accounts for the 20 pass plays/game and '3 yards and a cloud of dust', because if the DL correctly guessed you were passing, you were done. On third and long I bet the QB got rid of the ball in a hurry!

[Patler]

Between the legal head slap and OL not being able to extend their arms, it's a wonder the QB didn't end up on his ass every play. That accounts for the 20 pass plays/game and '3 yards and a cloud of dust', because if the DL correctly guessed you were passing, you were done. On third and long I bet the QB got rid of the ball in a hurry!

Don't forget, too, that QBs were fair game to be blasted long after they got rid of the ball, as the rushers were allowed to "finish" their effort. Sometimes it was laughably long after the throw. If a DL couldn't get there, a slap to the QB's headgear was common. QBs got hit a lot back then.

[Cheesehead Craig]

Deacon Jones was a monster, but you have to also consider that his head-slap move gave him an advantage over more modern players.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lm2l0pxYw-4

[Guiness]

Don't forget, too, that QBs were fair game to be blasted long after they got rid of the ball, as the rushers were allowed to "finish" their effort. Sometimes it was laughably long after the throw. If a DL couldn't get there, a slap to the QB's headgear was common. QBs got hit a lot back then.

You mean the way Martin 'finished the play' (and the career) on/of Jim McMahon?

[Patler]

You mean the way Martin 'finished the play' (and the career) on/of Jim McMahon?

Sort of. That was a "block" on an interception, wasn't it?

QBs could be hit, knocked down or dragged down so long as it was a continuous extension of the pass rush toward the passer. To avoid it, QBs would often move immediately after throwing, making the rusher alter his path so it wasn't a continuous extension of the pass rush. If the pocket was tight on them, the QB often got buried under a pile of humanity long after the pass was thrown.

[Carolina_Packer]

Sort of. That was a "block" on an interception, wasn't it?

QBs could be hit, knocked down or dragged down so long as it was a continuous extension of the pass rush toward the passer. To avoid it, QBs would often move immediately after throwing, making the rusher alter his path so it wasn't a continuous extension of the pass rush. If the pocket was tight on them, the QB often got buried under a pile of humanity long after the pass was thrown.

No, it was a throw by McMahon that was intercepted by Mark Lee and long after the throw was picked, Charles Martin bear hugs McMahon from behind and body slams him on that old nasty turf at Soldier Field. Check this (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lTLlaMY_9PM) out. That was a pretty bush league play by Martin. Those were dark days, Packer fans.

[Patler]

No, it was a throw by McMahon that was intercepted by Mark Lee and long after the throw was picked, Charles Martin bear hugs McMahon from behind and body slams him on that old nasty turf at Soldier Field. Check this (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lTLlaMY_9PM) out. That was a pretty bush league play by Martin. Those were dark days, Packer fans.

Ah, ya.....that's why I said it was a "block" (notice the quotes) on an interception. McMahon threw the interception and the only reason for Martin to hit him at that point was to block him. I was being facetious.

[Carolina_Packer]

Ah, ya.....that's why I said it was a "block" (notice the quotes) on an interception. McMahon threw the interception and the only reason for Martin to hit him at that point was to block him. I was being facetious.

My facetious meter was off, sorry. I am very literal today, I guess. :confused: A similarly good block was Warren Sapp's on Chad Clifton.

[Guiness]

My facetious meter was off, sorry. I am very literal today, I guess. :confused: A similarly good block was Warren Sapp's on Chad Clifton.

Sapp's hit was bush league, but still not in the same stratosphere as what Martin did. Watching that replay of Martin's bodyslam makes me shiver.

[woodbuck27]

Didn't see Deacon play. Loved his attitude and the blue and white Rams unis.

Then your younger than I imagined pbmax.

I was shocked to see that Deacon Jones has left us. I will post this LINK on this matter that may lend some information on that death. You have to consider the source regarding this ** as you read it.

" (Lem) Barney is one of more than 4,000 former players who have taken legal action alleging the NFL didn’t provide enough information concussions and the long-term effects. " Fr. LINK below

http://www.torontosun.com/2013/06/05/lem-barney-suspects-head-injuries-led-to-deacon-jones-death


Lem Barney suspects head injuries led to Deacon Jones’ death

The Sports Xchange

First posted: Wednesday, June 05, 2013 03:29 PM EDT | Updated: Wednesday, June 05, 2013 03:51 PM EDT

http://cdn.fansided.com/wp-content/blogs.dir/229/files/2013/06/deacon-jones.jpg

R.I.P. Mr. Deacon Jones.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deacon_Jones

[woodbuck27]

My facetious meter was off, sorry. I am very literal today, I guess. :confused: A similarly good block was Warren Sapp's on Chad Clifton.

In the over half century I've watched football. Nothing even marginally pissed me off more than Warren 'dough head' Sapp's, bush league block on Chad Clifton. That was totally unnecessary. SICK !

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xBpEIRaGq2U

GO PACK GO !

[Patler]

Sapp's hit was bush league, but still not in the same stratosphere as what Martin did. Watching that replay of Martin's bodyslam makes me shiver.

I've always wondered just what was going through his mind at the time.

[Carolina_Packer]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Dltz7SPGWw Here is a nice highlight reel of Deacon Jones game action, complete with the Rocky Theme. My favorite is when he sacks the Cardinals QB while being blocked; just drags the guy to the ground with one hand. Amazing.

Deacon Jones...Datone Jones...both with ties to LA...just sayin! ;-) If he can cause that kind of havoc, he's a steal at #26.

[Guiness]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Dltz7SPGWw Here is a nice highlight reel of Deacon Jones game action, complete with the Rocky Theme. My favorite is when he sacks the Cardinals QB while being blocked; just drags the guy to the ground with one hand. Amazing.

Deacon Jones...Datone Jones...both with ties to LA...just sayin! ;-) If he can cause that kind of havoc, he's a steal at #26.

Great vid of the Deacon. He was a big guy!

Check out the sack at 1:05...full blown body slam on the QB's shoulder, very similar to what Martin did! QB looks to be Cleveland #13, which would make him Frank Ryan.

For some good looks at the head slap, look starting at 1:25, three good examples in a row, the second one he's swinging with both arms.

[KYPack]

Yeah. He didn't seem as athletic as todays players. And I don't say that about everyone. I watched a LB, named Robertson from the 70's play, and he impressed me a lot. Reminded me of todays best, a young Urlacher maybe.

Always tough to compare eras. Some of the old timers would not make it in the modern game. There are DE's now that are as quick as but I've yet to see any that have Deac's foot speed. David Jones was a top flight DE who was as fast as many RB's and WR's. A high motor guy, he had a long career, he was still a pretty effective player after he came down from his physical peak.

One of the great NFL games I've ever seen is the Dec '67 play-off game in Milwaukee, Rams Packers. I finagled a ticket and saw Travis Williams run wild for the play-off victory for the Pack. The real highlight was watching Forrest Gregg and Deacon Jones go at it. They looked like a couple dinosaur's in one of the old monster movies. Deac tried every trick in the book, but Forrest had studied the film and had every punch countered. They went from start to finish and it was a brutal match-up. Advantage Gregg, but what a game.

I know a lot of you youngbloods think the NFL being played now is the ultimate, but over a span of time you get to see all the truly one of a kind players.

You want defensive ends, give me Deac, Willie Davis, and Dough Atkins and I will stop your read options or whatever else you got right in it's tracks.

[Pugger]

I've always wondered just what was going through his mind at the time.

I don't think there was much going on in that mind of his.

[woodbuck27]

Always tough to compare eras. Some of the old timers would not make it in the modern game. There are DE's now that are as quick as but I've yet to see any that have Deac's foot speed. David Jones was a top flight DE who was as fast as many RB's and WR's. A high motor guy, he had a long career, he was still a pretty effective player after he came down from his physical peak.

One of the great NFL games I've ever seen is the Dec '67 play-off game in Milwaukee, Rams Packers. I finagled a ticket and saw Travis Williams run wild for the play-off victory for the Pack. The real highlight was watching Forrest Gregg and Deacon Jones go at it. They looked like a couple dinosaur's in one of the old monster movies. Deac tried every trick in the book, but Forrest had studied the film and had every punch countered. They went from start to finish and it was a brutal match-up. Advantage Gregg, but what a game.

I know a lot of you youngbloods think the NFL being played now is the ultimate, but over a span of time you get to see all the truly one of a kind players.

You want defensive ends, give me Deac, Willie Davis, and Dough Atkins and I will stop your read options or whatever else you got right in it's tracks.

I believe in ... 'TRUST' your post KY. That's the TRUTH.

As an aside:

If players coming out of college between the greatest era of the Green Bay Packers, or the 1960's. Were getting better and better. Explain to me why between 1970 and the arrival of Brett Favre in Green Bay? Explain to me why? for a period exceeding 2 decades? The Green Bay Packers only managed what?... one (1) playoff win.

I'm guessing that most Packerrats go back to the 1980's Packers to date. If I'm correct most of you will be able to accurately assess this in terms of TRUTH.

Please examine this question:

How many sure cat NFL HOFers did Brett Favre play alongside in Green Bay?

Besides Reggie White, who was already going to the NFL HOF (as an Eagle) before his arrival in Green Bay. Name those HOFers that played beside Brett Favre.

Now think about the comparisons between Bart Starr and Brett Favre.

That the Green Bay Packers got too so many playoff rounds with Brett Favre; won as many playoff games as they did. That ... considering the talent he was surrounded with... amazes me.

I was spoiled as a teen and early adult by the 1960's Green Bay Packers. Spoiled by a level of play the younger Packerrat posters (maybe?) cannot even imagine comprehending. In the 1960's the Green Bay Packers were the New York Yankees of football. I was a Milwaukee Brave fan and transitioned that to the Green Bay Packers and American football. What an incredible ride to be on as a Green Bay Packer fan. A ride that no future Green Bay Packer fan will likely and sadly never enjoy.

When I see Packerrat posters rank Bret Favre behind Bart Starr. I wonder if they overlook or neglect to weigh the obvious. Favre didn't have the advantages of the quality of teammates (or future HOFers) as Bart Starr did. Bart Starr played with NFL HOFers:

Len Ford (1950's);

Jim Taylor; Forrest Gregg; Ray Nitschke; Herb Adderley; Willie Davis; Jim Ringo; Paul Hornung and most recently Dave Robinson (1960's). Count them and you arrive at nine HOFers.

Bart Starr played with incredibly talented teammates. The Green Bay Packers of the 1960's, were the best prepared and most talented teams to play the game of football to that point in NFL history. Vince Lombardi refused to accept losing. His players had the exceptional talent and felt and responded to his passion.

Don Hutson might have been the greatest Green Bay Packer player all time. Bart Starr might have been a greater Green Bay Packer player/quarterback. After those two Green Bay Packer GREATS. Most of us here at Packerrats saw the next greatest Green Bay Packer player play his heart out for us... 'the Packer fans'. I certainly appreciated that fact.

I certainly appreciate Aaron Rodgers today. It's just awesome to have been and to be... a Green Bay Packer fan.

I've got some baked beans and Irish crème cornbread to get ready for supper. Have a great day Packerrats ! (-;

PACKERS FOREVER !

[woodbuck27]

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap1000000214112/article/deacon-jones-award-will-honor-future-nfl-sack-leaders

Deacon Jones Award will honor future NFL sack leaders

By Chris Wesseling ... Around the League Writer

Published: June 22, 2013 at 04:19 PM ... Updated: June 22, 2013 at 06:47 PM


" NFL Commissioner Roger Goodell recently called the late Deacon Jones an "icon among icons" as a charismatic keeper of the NFL flame.

Now Goodell has come up with a permanent way to honor Jones, who is credited with coining the term quarterback "sack."

A person informed of the league's plans tells NFL.com's Ian Rapoport that the NFL's leader in sacks will receive the Deacon Jones Award beginning in 2013. The award will be among those featured in the nationally televised "NFL Honors" award show the night before the Super Bowl. " Fr. LINK above and please click on that LINK for the entire story and video.