Manziel autographs

[Guiness]

So the NCAA is chasing him down, intent on punishing him for an autograph signing session.

PFT had it right - he will be thoroughly punished. "And by nailing Manziel, we mean slapping him on the wrist or at worst suspending him for two games so he’ll be back for the Alabama game on September 14."

Would serve the NCAA right if pulled a Pete Carrol, said "fuck it" signed an agent bolted for the NFL. I'm thinking the NFL would have a special supplementary draft for him, or he could just sit out this year and avoid the risk of a catastrophic injury that could knock him out of the first round and cost him $10 million.

[Harlan Huckleby]

Isn't Manziel considered a borderline NFL prospect?

[pbmax]

The NFL has rules about ineligible NCAA players not being immediately available in the next supplemental draft. The player has to be cleared by the League.

[Guiness]

Ya - the NCAA has him between a rock and a hard place, and they're going to squeeze him. And make a pile of money off him for probably 2 more years. He wouldn't be ineligible though...he could sit out his 2 game suspension, party on campus for a month then declare. He redshirted, right? So he'd be eligible next spring.

No, he's not a great NFL prospect, size and arm strength are lacking right now. He's supposed to have good accuracy in short and intermediate throws though.

[red]

the whole situation just fucked up

by the rules, he should lose his eligibility. however, he might be the best thing the NCAA has going for it and they should be stupid to shoot a gift horse in the mouth

however, up until this whole thing surfaced, the NCAA was selling Manziel jerseys and other merchandise and making a mint off of it. however they were telling Manziel himself that he couldn't profit off his own image and name

the whole thing might end johnny footballs career (no i don't think he'll be a decent pro) and could be the end of the stupid NCAA's no pay for play BS

[MadScientist]

the whole situation just fucked up

by the rules, he should lose his eligibility. however, he might be the best thing the NCAA has going for it and they should be stupid to shoot a gift horse in the mouth

however, up until this whole thing surfaced, the NCAA was selling Manziel jerseys and other merchandise and making a mint off of it. however they were telling Manziel himself that he couldn't profit off his own image and name

the whole thing might end johnny footballs career (no i don't think he'll be a decent pro) and could be the end of the stupid NCAA's no pay for play BS

Yea it is BS the way things are done. Something has to change, but they do have to be careful about how things are done to avoid certain schools just buying players.

Still he should be done in college. The NCAA nixed the eligibility of some no name player (la cross player I think) for releasing a crappy rap song under his own name, and this a way more blatant violation of the rule.

[Guiness]

It is interesting that this is what caused the NCAA to stop selling the jerseys. How long had that been going on for?

[Harlan Huckleby]

No, he's not a great NFL prospect, size and arm strength are lacking right now. He's supposed to have good accuracy in short and intermediate throws though.

Graham Harrell material.

[Guiness]

Graham Harrell material.

All the more reason he should be allowed to picket a cool 6 figures for the money he's bringing in right now.

[MadtownPacker]

Honestly fuck the NCAA. I'm will not buy any collegiate gear because I think it is bullshit hypocrisy of the highest level. The high ranks pukes live like kings and want to crush a college kid for making a few bucks. Garbage!!!

[pbmax]

Honestly fuck the NCAA. I'm will not buy any collegiate gear because I think it is bullshit hypocrisy of the highest level. The high ranks pukes live like kings and want to crush a college kid for making a few bucks. Garbage!!!

Its the lack of a viable minor league. Hockey, soccer and baseball do just fine with college eligibility. The NCAA is to blame but its worst offense is being happy to serve the needs of the Pro Leagues because of the visibility it generates.

If players who did not want to go to college OR were good enough to sell jersey's could be employed, this would not be an issue.

[mraynrand]

If players who did not want to go to college OR were good enough to sell jersey's could be employed, this would not be an issue.

Excellent point. And the other key factor is the extreme hypocrisy of the alumni at some of these institutions of "higher learning." These guys know there is a huge population of players who are not college material, yet they insist on 'standards' and wink wink on the side, when the solution is to just go pro-am - give the education to the kids who want it, and let the rest play for pay with your institution's logo on their helmet. Even allow 4 years of all-paid academic eligibility for those players who forgo their education until after their playing days. Maybe when they crap out of the NFL, they can salvage their lives. Hate the alumni, especially at Ala-fucking-bama.

[pbmax]

Excellent point. And the other key factor is the extreme hypocrisy of the alumni at some of these institutions of "higher learning." These guys know there is a huge population of players who are not college material, yet they insist on 'standards' and wink wink on the side, when the solution is to just go pro-am - give the education to the kids who want it, and let the rest play for pay with your institution's logo on their helmet. Even allow 4 years of all-paid academic eligibility for those players who forgo their education until after their playing days. Maybe when they crap out of the NFL, they can salvage their lives. Hate the alumni, especially at Ala-fucking-bama.

It should be a market opportunity because its highly inefficient. But the barrier to entry is high (cost of fielding a league) and the NFL and NCAA will resist. The three years out of school will be tough to get around.

Neither league actually wants a minor league and would fight it tooth and nail.

[Guiness]

If players who did not want to go to college OR were good enough to sell jersey's could be employed, this would not be an issue.

Don't understand that?


It should be a market opportunity because its highly inefficient. But the barrier to entry is high (cost of fielding a league) and the NFL and NCAA will resist. The three years out of school will be tough to get around.

Neither league actually wants a minor league and would fight it tooth and nail.

The conversation about why a second pro or semi-pro league seems unable to survive is a whole other conversation. I'm sure books have been written about it...

[George Cumby]

Honestly fuck the NCAA. I'm will not buy any collegiate gear because I think it is bullshit hypocrisy of the highest level. The high ranks pukes live like kings and want to crush a college kid for making a few bucks. Garbage!!!

I'm with Essay. The college game is so rotten, so corrupt, so bereft of decency and integrity I really can't bring myself to pay much attention. I check to see if the Badgers are in the top 25 but know that they'll choke when playing an inferior opponent or get crushed by an SEC team with looser admission standards than the Big 10. Fuck those greedy, money-grubbing Chancellors and Alumni.

[mraynrand]

The conversation about why a second pro or semi-pro league seems unable to survive is a whole other conversation. I'm sure books have been written about it...

It's pretty simple; it's the same reason a second pro league can't survive: the College game is dominant. But it's a total scam and sham. Pay the players for chrissakes. Stop expecting some of these kids to 'graduate.' End the hypocrisy.

[mraynrand]

Its the lack of a viable minor league. Hockey, soccer and baseball do just fine with college eligibility. The NCAA is to blame but its worst offense is being happy to serve the needs of the Pro Leagues because of the visibility it generates.

If players who did not want to go to college OR were good enough to sell jersey's could be employed, this would not be an issue.

The NFL lifespan is far too short to have a league between college and pro, so the pro league would have to run parallel to and compete with college; and one would dominate and ruin the other. College football is wonderful and exciting and deserves to remain. It just needs to be honest.

[pbmax]

Originally Posted by pbmax

If players who did not want to go to college OR were good enough to sell jersey's could be employed, this would not be an issue.Don't understand that?

The conversation about why a second pro or semi-pro league seems unable to survive is a whole other conversation. I'm sure books have been written about it...


The NFL lifespan is far too short to have a league between college and pro, so the pro league would have to run parallel to and compete with college; and one would dominate and ruin the other. College football is wonderful and exciting and deserves to remain. It just needs to be honest.

Guin, I mean that any person who intends to pursue a professional football career must attend college for all intents and purposes. There is no other pipeline into the League at the moment. So an 18 yo high school graduate who does not want to go to college is forced to go if they wish to play professional football. Regardless of school choice, a player must also wait 3 years after high school to apply for the draft. Semi-pro today is a shell of its former self. You would need money behind it to attract better talent away from college.

NFL Europe had trouble as a business model overseas, but I think something similar could be tried here. Shorter season and less intensive camps and a year out of high school you could tryout for a pro team. Worked for Rivera and Andruzzi. Heck, even the games could be shorter.

And while Donald Trump doesn't want you to believe it, several USFL franchises were doing OK with Spring football. Then ding dong showed up and helped force a signing war and a move to a fall schedule. Ding dong probably wanted to collect on a damages award rather than wait for his property to appreciate, but regardless, as originally constituted, it could have survived. Arena football worked in a lot of areas.

[Fritz]

I still think the best solution is to have colleges sponsor teams. The kids on the team who wanted to go to the school could have that as part of their compensation - scholarships, room, board. The kids who just want to play could get a wage. Wages would be regulated by the league (the NCAA as it were).

So you could still have your Alabama football, your Wisconsin Badgers football - none of that would change. The only thing that would change would be that instead of the King's clothes pretense that these players are really just college students who play football, or even football players who go to college, there would be an acknowledgment that the team was sponsored by the institution but was in fact operating not as a student sport but as a money-making part of the machine.

[pbmax]

So you could still have your Alabama football, your Wisconsin Badgers football - none of that would change. The only thing that would change would be that instead of the King's clothes pretense that these players are really just college students who play football, or even football players who go to college, there would be an acknowledgment that the team was sponsored by the institution but was in fact operating not as a student sport but as a money-making part of the machine.

Its going to take a lot of baby steps to get there. One of the reason's for the creation of the quasi-legal definition of student-athlete was to avoid workman's comp claims.

In the NCAA, its always 1923.

[Guiness]

Its going to take a lot of baby steps to get there. One of the reason's for the creation of the quasi-legal definition of student-athlete was to avoid workman's comp claims.

In the NCAA, its always 1923.

Indeed. No injury settlements for those guys.

[pbmax]

Richard Deitsch ‏@richarddeitsch 31m
I must say I do find irony in media members whose likeness or name appears in video games waxing on Mr. Manziel.

[pbmax]

Johnny Manziel suspended for 30 minutes (http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/08/28/johnny-manziel-suspended-for-30-minutes)


ProFootballTalk ‏@ProFootballTalk 38m
Johnny Manziel suspended for 30 minutes http://wp.me/p14QSB-9fRi

Ian Rapoport ‏@RapSheet 35m
Classic suspension of Johnny Football by @NCAA. A half. Awesome. Guess @RandyMoss isn't the only one happy he deals in straight cash, homey

[red]

and the NCAA takes the last step to make itself a complete joke

[mraynrand]

i just completed my suspension from packer rats

[MadtownPacker]

i just completed my suspension from packer rats
Next time don't spend the night at Harlan's mansion and accept cash for sex and there will be no issue.

[Little Whiskey]

The problem is football supports too many other sports at college. It's what the alumni want to throw money at. Who is going to pay for the entire girls tennis team travel from penn state to Nebraska for a match? Who pays the scholarships for the soccer team? Football does.

[pbmax]

The problem is football supports too many other sports at college. It's what the alumni want to throw money at. Who is going to pay for the entire girls tennis team travel from penn state to Nebraska for a match? Who pays the scholarships for the soccer team? Football does.

True, but you can get back to regional conferences to make travel by bus a much better option. Many sports existed before college football turned into a billion dollar industry.

And I am not sure football would disappear. Many NCAA basketball fans complain about one and done, but somehow something less than the cream of the crop still generate significant revenue in basketball. Hockey generates revenue at certain colleges despite the best talent being in Canadian juniors or NHL minor league.

[mraynrand]

Next time don't spend the night at Harlan's mansion and accept cash for sex and there will be no issue.

it was only a 30 minute suspension - I sold Packerrats t-shirts to Packerrat alumni at inflated prices. Bigguns bought one for 48 cents.

[mraynrand]

True, but you can get back to regional conferences to make travel by bus a much better option. Many sports existed before college football turned into a billion dollar industry.

And I am not sure football would disappear. Many NCAA basketball fans complain about one and done, but somehow something less than the cream of the crop still generate significant revenue in basketball. Hockey generates revenue at certain colleges despite the best talent being in Canadian juniors or NHL minor league.

Sure, division III sports won't change.