Bush

[red]

i have told you guys for years not to let the pile of shit on the field because it will cost us

now he cost us a playoff game, and it wasn't his first

you assholes need to listen

[Brandon494]

I mean we had to, losing Shields for the game really hurt us.

[red]

I mean we had to, losing Shields for the game really hurt us.

thats why i always wanted to get rid of him, no matter how good he looked on ST

he always weasels his way into the defensive lineup and he almost always does something boneheaded to cost us

[Bossman641]

Bush was least of the problems and unless you wanted to pull people off the street I dunno who else would have played db

[mraynrand]

Bush made a great play on the pass rush. He forced Kap off his play and made him run. The error (AGAIN!) was Mulumba not scraping and keeping contain. The question is whether he was told to keep outside contain, or whether he just ignored instructions/forgot/didn't know his assignment. If the coaches told him to crash inside - and sent Bush, they should be shot. But it was a solid pass rush by Bush.

[HarveyWallbangers]

I think Bush probably played a pretty good game. I saw him on Vernon Davis quite a bit, and Davis didn't go off. Davis is always a tough matchup. But, yeah, I think he blew contain on that last play. Of course, he'll always have the pick in the Super Bowl to hang his hat on.

[Zool]

I didn't realize I had any sort of personnel powers. Can I just get rid of anyone?

[Joemailman]

I didn't realize I had any sort of personnel powers. Can I just get rid of anyone?

Are you in the right thread?

[Zool]

Are you in the right thread?

Red said he's been telling us to get rid of Bush for years. Didn't realize I had that sort of pull.

[sharpe1027]

Thought that he had a good game. Aikman claimed Bush was responsible for contain, but Mulumba looked like he might have had that job. Mulumba looked injured while trying to chase down Kap. I'm any event, that play was far from the worst defensive lapse.

If you want to blame someone, Hyde dropped the potential game winner.

[woodbuck27]

Thought that he had a good game. Aikman claimed Bush was responsible for contain, but Mulumba looked like he might have had that job. Mulumba looked injured while trying to chase down Kap. I'm any event, that play was far from the worst defensive lapse.

If you want to blame someone, Hyde dropped the potential game winner.

Yup when you look at it all.

It was just that play 'away', close.

WOW ! That pick six and in all likelihood we're off to play the Panthers and more suffering.

The Packers are a severely hurting team.

GO PACK GO !

[wist43]

Bush made a great play on the pass rush. He forced Kap off his play and made him run. The error (AGAIN!) was Mulumba not scraping and keeping contain. The question is whether he was told to keep outside contain, or whether he just ignored instructions/forgot/didn't know his assignment. If the coaches told him to crash inside - and sent Bush, they should be shot. But it was a solid pass rush by Bush.

No he didn't - what he did on that play was idiotic!!!

When you're rushing from the outside like that, you have to take the outside shoulder of the blocker and if you realize you're not going to get home you have to come under control and contain the QB - especially a guy like Kapernick.

That's football IQ, pure and simple. You have to know which angle to take, what shoulder to block/attack. That rush was nothing short of stupid, and you saw the result. Before Kapernick had even take a few steps I was already walking away from the TV in disgust. It was stupid.

[Carolina_Packer]

No he didn't - what he did on that play was idiotic!!!

When you're rushing from the outside like that, you have to take the outside shoulder of the blocker and if you realize you're not going to get home you have to come under control and contain the QB - especially a guy like Kapernick.

That's football IQ, pure and simple. You have to know which angle to take, what shoulder to block/attack. That rush was nothing short of stupid, and you saw the result. Before Kapernick had even take a few steps I was already walking away from the TV in disgust. It was stupid.

I'm never glad when the Packers lose. The one thing it does do, perhaps, is expose more the lack of discipline and football smarts and overall instincts of some of the guys on our defense. I know they were gritting it out and kept the score close and for that I was happy that they found a way to keep it so close. Big picture, this defense needs some major tweaking and a change in leadership. That change may not make the guys we have tackle better, think or communicate better, but maybe it will and that's why it's worth doing because we have a pretty consistent offense when Rodgers is in and now that we have a running game we have balance. Now we need to once and for all fix the leaky defense. Too many blown coverages, lack of edge contain and lack of ability to impose its will when needed like a dominant defense can. Get it fixed and this team can go places.

[SkinBasket]

Fuck, Bush played better defense than ST this season, which isn't saying much since he is, in reality, a pretty fucking shitty ST player, but I thought for the most part his defense was improved when he saw the field this year. I still wouldn't mind if a shark ate his leg and he could never play football again. Of course, then we might have to suffer some fool just as bad as him, like McMillon, or whoever that Bigby wannabe was. But like Bigby, Bush seems to enjoy a certain following that buy into this magical "reputation" he has for almost making ST plays and the two or three things he's done right in the last 5 years.

[PaCkFan_n_MD]

Would not be sad if he was cut. But lets remember that he was our 6th CB yesterday. It took Injuries to Hayward, Shields, and House to get him on the field. In the playoffs I would rather have a guy who has been on the team for 7 years and knows the defense come in then some guy they had to pull off the street. With that said I go back to my first comment. The guy has very low football IQ I would not be sad if he left if they can find someone better.

[Zool]

Anyone trying to defend that play, just go back and watch it. He takes an inward move when Gore comes to pick him up. Then Bush decides to jump right when he gets to Gore and Gore was then literally able to pick him up and move him farther inward giving Shitburger McQB about a 50 yard cushion. I would LB has contain unless there's a guy playing wider than him which there was on the play in question.

Bush is terrible on D. Just flat out terrible. Anyone disputing that point is just arguing for the sake of it.

[Smeefers]

Wow, you guys know an awful lot about the play that was called. Everyone here is positive Bush's responsibilities were contain, not sacking the QB.

I know this is crazy, I mean, Bush is utter shit right? But, well, let's just - for the sake of conversation - say that Bush actually was assignment sure there. Let's just say that his sole job was to rush the QB and get a tackle and that someone else was responsible for contain. I mean, I've seen plenty of players take an inside rush when it suited them. Who's to say in the split second he had, that Bush thought that was the best course of action? What would you guys be saying if Bush went wide and Gore pushed him out further and Kap ran into the hole that created? Or what would you say if Bush didn't rush and just sort of played spy out there and Kap had all day to pick apart the D backs?

[pbmax]

I thought Mulumba dropped to spy or pick up Gore out of the backfield. I think he got caught out of position when Kap ran.

Bush has blitzed less than a dozen times this year and he flushed Kapernick. That makes Bush the Packers second most effective pressure artist after Daniels and its best blitzer.

He is fine. The rest of the D needs to improve around him. Perry was active and stout against the run, but even from his favored right side he got jack for pressure. Kap is terrible is a close pocket and the Packers could only get one guy close.

[Zool]

Wow, you guys know an awful lot about the play that was called. Everyone here is positive Bush's responsibilities were contain, not sacking the QB.

I know this is crazy, I mean, Bush is utter shit right? But, well, let's just - for the sake of conversation - say that Bush actually was assignment sure there. Let's just say that his sole job was to rush the QB and get a tackle and that someone else was responsible for contain. I mean, I've seen plenty of players take an inside rush when it suited them. Who's to say in the split second he had, that Bush thought that was the best course of action? What would you guys be saying if Bush went wide and Gore pushed him out further and Kap ran into the hole that created? Or what would you say if Bush didn't rush and just sort of played spy out there and Kap had all day to pick apart the D backs?

Or better yet, he plays smart and solid instead of trying to be the hero? He takes on the block, holds his position, and forces Kap to step up instead of running wide?

Maybe his job was to run in as fast as possible and then jump, but I doubt it. I'm guessing he was trying to win the game on 1 play. He's a try hard guy who was never very smart.

[mraynrand]

My initial reaction was that he forced Kap to pull the ball down and scramble. I didn't see a whole lot of other pass rushers doing that. I'd like to see if anyone associated with the Packers team (meaning defensive coaches) comes out and says whether or not he had contain responsibilities. I may be wrong but when teams send d-backs I don't recall them generally having that responsibility.

[red]

that play reminded me of walden last year, crashing inside time after time and letting Kap run wild

i thought we fixed that problem. guess not

i still would like to know who datone jones was talking about when he said some players got selfish and it hurt the team

[denverYooper]

that play reminded me of walden last year, crashing inside time after time and letting Kap run wild

i thought we fixed that problem. guess not

i still would like to know who datone jones was talking about when he said some players got selfish and it hurt the team

Interesting. Did he say that in postgame interviews?

[red]

Interesting. Did he say that in postgame interviews?

datone said that when he was in the radio booth after the game

[mraynrand]

that play reminded me of walden last year, crashing inside time after time and letting Kap run wild

i thought we fixed that problem. guess not

i still would like to know who datone jones was talking about when he said some players got selfish and it hurt the team

Except Walden is an OLB, with different responsibilities, and it's been discussed to death that on plays like those, someone else had the responsibility
to scrape or keep outside contain. So the question remains whether Bush abandoned his contain responsibilities or not.

[mraynrand]

From McGinn's column: Bush "My job is the back" McGinn: "Bush's job is two-fold: harass if not sack Kaepernick, and not permit him to scramble around his end."

So it's Bush's responsibility. I don't like the design, but mostly just because it didn't work. UNSOUND!!

[run pMc]

Yeah, didn't like that he drifted inside, but he was trying to get to CK or bat down the throw. I'll give Bush credit for admittting his mistake -- he bit on the pumpfake and there was no contain. That's a risky blitz scheme.
That play was important but not as big as Hyde dropping the INT.

I honestly don't have high expectations for Bush as a CB, and he's more or less met them. Overall I don't think he played poorly at CB this year, but I'm assuming he was in there and not purely a ST ace because of injuries.

[SkinBasket]

Ace!

[mraynrand]

Ace!


42,000,000 people saw Bush lose contain

[gbgary]

42,000,000 people saw Bush lose contain

bush didn't have 'contain'. he was blitzing. if told to contain he would have. aikman was wrong in his assessment.

[mraynrand]

bush didn't have 'contain'. he was blitzing. if told to contain he would have. aikman was wrong in his assessment.

See McGinn article. Bush admitted he had contain responsibility; McGinn reported the same.

[woodbuck27]

Except Walden is an OLB, with different responsibilities, and it's been discussed to death that on plays like those, someone else had the responsibility
to scrape or keep outside contain. So the question remains whether Bush abandoned his contain responsibilities or not.

Who could ever us the words " Packers defense " and " keep outside contain ", in the same sentence !?

Do so positively and with any sense of reality and the team we see marched out onto the field over this past three seasons?

Packers 'D' and sealing the edge...Ha ha ha ... Haa !

[wist43]

I don't know why some of you guys are having a hard time wrapping your brains around this...

Just b/c Bush's assignment on the play was to blitz doesn't mean that is his only responsibility. They were in man coverage - he knows that, which means he also knows that there is nothing behind him. If he gives up the outside - pure and simple, the QB is gone - which is what happened.

It's not that complicated. When he came on the blitz, he needed to take on Gore's left shoulder and try to power him back into Kapnerfucker. By doing that, he ensures that the QB stays in the pocket and doesn't escape to the outside.

The 2 things he CANNOT do on that play are 1) He cannot overrun the QB to the top side, and 2) he cannot come underneath any blocker.

If he does either one of those things - the QB has a mile of unoccupied real estate in front of him for the taking. Which is exactly what ended up happening when Bush committed sin #2.

It's simple football IQ.

[mraynrand]

I don't know why some of you guys are having a hard time wrapping your brains around this...

Just b/c Bush's assignment on the play was to blitz doesn't mean that is his only responsibility. They were in man coverage - he knows that, which means he also knows that there is nothing behind him. If he gives up the outside - pure and simple, the QB is gone - which is what happened.

It's not that complicated. When he came on the blitz, he needed to take on Gore's left shoulder and try to power him back into Kapnerfucker. By doing that, he ensures that the QB stays in the pocket and doesn't escape to the outside.

The 2 things he CANNOT do on that play are 1) He cannot overrun the QB to the top side, and 2) he cannot come underneath any blocker.

If he does either one of those things - the QB has a mile of unoccupied real estate in front of him for the taking. Which is exactly what ended up happening when Bush committed sin #2.

It's simple football IQ.

Blitzers and pass rushers don't always have more than one goal; in this case Bush did. It looked like a blown play, but I wasn't sure whether it was Bush or someone else. Now I know. It's not always obvious to me from the film exactly what they're running and who has what responsibility. Credit Aikman for knowing immediately. But I wasn't listening to him, I was screaming for someone to tackle Kap because I knew that was the game and the season right there. You should announce games too if you knew right away what was being run and who had what assignment. I congratulate you as well for your insight.

[sharpe1027]

Whenever Bush makes a mistake there's someone telling everyone I told you "so", nevermind all the mistakes made by other players. Your right, of course, our last string DB is not that good. I wager he's better than average for being that far down on the depth chart, not to mention the flexibility to fill in at multiple positions in a pinch. In any event, thanks you guys for telling as all "so."

[mraynrand]

I also question the logic of bringing Bush on a blitz and then asking him to also be on an island against Kap to stop any run. After all the talk of contain and scraping and giving help, it seems insane to combine man coverage with a blitz and then have that blitzer also have sole edge contain responsibility. Who would do such a thing against the 49ers? Doesn't seem like simple football IQ to me.

[wist43]

2nd Quarter, 11:58 on the clock.

1:27:30 of the video

LeRoy Butler blitzes Drew Bledsoe and takes on RB Dave Meggett's block.

He takes Meggett's left shoulder and keeps outside leverage. This was back in the days when you could horse collar, and Bledsoe was never a threat to bolt the pocket, so Butler didn't have to worry as much about overrunning the QB to the top side here, but this is essentially how Bush needed to take on Gore's block.





http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KygbatvXpds

[woodbuck27]

Blitzers and pass rushers don't always have more than one goal; in this case Bush did. It looked like a blown play, but I wasn't sure whether it was Bush or someone else. Now I know. It's not always obvious to me from the film exactly what they're running and who has what responsibility. Credit Aikman for knowing immediately. But I wasn't listening to him, I was screaming for someone to tackle Kap because I knew that was the game and the season right there. You should announce games too if you knew right away what was being run and who had what assignment. I congratulate you as well for your insight.

If you have to visit the washroom to take care of business and your going right now but the door bell rings.

What do you do?

You identify any real problem and take care of that which is most necessary.

It was certainly more necessary on that play to contain the mans legs that burned you a lot before.

The Packers lost this game over and over so many times it's ridiculous and at the end of the day this was simply just one of those reasons.

The San Fran 49ers were too ripe for the picking and our team simply across the board blew it...blew that golden chance out of the fricken water.

I'm so damn disappointed in the Packers and that loss I cannot even allow myself to go there for I could explode with anger.

I have to somehow find the comical side to deal with that atrocious loss.

The Green Bay Packers as a team shit their pants. That result let down players like Eddie Lacy, Jordy Nelson, Randall Cobb, Tramon Williams's (overall game) and Mike Daniels and not many more.

Aaron Rodgers was right back to his too perfectionist ways. James Jones found his dropsies again. Micah Hyde forgot that the football in the NFL is similar to the one used in the NFL.

There is over the top too much to critique right now.

I hope that will go away. That I'll feel some healing as a Green Bay packer fan. I know this.

I'll never forget this ugly loss that just simply didn't have to be.

[wist43]

Guys, this is simple stuff... Bush just needs to make sure he takes Gore's left shoulder to maintain outside leverage. This is basic stuff.

[oldbutnotdeadyet]

If you have to visit the washroom to take care of business and your going right now but the door bell rings.

What do you do?

You identify any real problem and take care of that which is most necessary.

It was certainly more necessary on that play to contain the mans legs that burned you a lot before.

The Packers lost this game over and over so many times it's ridiculous and at the end of the day this was simply just one of those reasons.

The San Fran 49ers were too ripe for the picking and our team simply across the board blew it...blew that golden chance out of the fricken water.

I'm so damn disappointed in the Packers and that loss I cannot even allow myself to go there for I could explode with anger.

I have to somehow find the comical side to deal with that atrocious loss.


Whiskey helps.....a little.

[woodbuck27]

Whiskey helps.....a little.

Right now I'll try some sausage. :whist:

[red]

Whenever Bush makes a mistake there's someone telling everyone I told you "so", nevermind all the mistakes made by other players. Your right, of course, our last string DB is not that good. I wager he's better than average for being that far down on the depth chart, not to mention the flexibility to fill in at multiple positions in a pinch. In any event, thanks you guys for telling as all "so."

yes, because this is the first time i've ever said bush sucked

and this thread was made tongue in cheek for those that were expecting me to go off on bush

[bobblehead]

Guys, this is simple stuff... Bush just needs to make sure he takes Gore's left shoulder to maintain outside leverage. This is basic stuff.

You are right. After we lost to them last year I said that against mobile QB's you have to collapse the pocket on them. That is how you disrupt them. If ever we see a truly athletic QB that also is a great pocket passer look out, because the big time threat to run means you get at least a full second extra in the pocket at nearly all times.

Last year we ran upfield over and over, then we bit on the read option even more times. We only blew contain twice in this game...I feel blessed.

[mraynrand]

2nd Quarter, 11:58 on the clock.

1:27:30 of the video

LeRoy Butler blitzes Drew Bledsoe and takes on RB Dave Meggett's block.

He takes Meggett's left shoulder and keeps outside leverage. This was back in the days when you could horse collar, and Bledsoe was never a threat to bolt the pocket, so Butler didn't have to worry as much about overrunning the QB to the top side here, but this is essentially how Bush needed to take on Gore's block.



Seriously, this is what you come up with? Bledsoe was never any threat to run.

[mraynrand]

You are right. After we lost to them last year I said that against mobile QB's you have to collapse the pocket on them. That is how you disrupt them. If ever we see a truly athletic QB that also is a great pocket passer look out, because the big time threat to run means you get at least a full second extra in the pocket at nearly all times.

Last year we ran upfield over and over, then we bit on the read option even more times. We only blew contain twice in this game...I feel blessed.

Except that he escaped upfield for close to 100 when collapsing the pocket. So on the play in question, does Capers leave Mulumba inside and trust Bush to get both pressure and keep contain - and have zero help if he fails?

[bobblehead]

Seriously, this is what you come up with? Bledsoe was never any threat to run.

You were both right. Aikman had the benefit of being able to see the entire field, we could not. It was only a guess whether Bush had contain or if he was all out, and Mulumba was spy with contain duties. Turns out it was on Bush. No way Wist knew that for certain before we heard it from the coaching staff. Aikman may have been able to see the whole field and being a former NFL QB knew for sure that it was on Bush.

[Patler]

that play reminded me of walden last year, crashing inside time after time and letting Kap run wild


..and yet Matthews did the same exact things several times as well last year against SF. People railed on Walden for the long TD run, yet earlier in the game Matthews did the exact same thing as Walden, but Kaepernick only went for 15-20 yards, so no one remembers it. The plays were almost mirror images of each other the way Walden and Matthews played them.

People act as if Bush is the only blitzer who has ever lost/been forced out of his lane. The only reason people are making a big deal out of it is because Aikman decided to single it out.

As far as an impact play failure, Hyde's dropped interception was probably more significant.

People were pretty happy to have Bush against Atlanta when he had a big pass knockdown and then an interception to preserve a 1 point win.

The really sad part is that the starting DBs for the Packers seem to screw up plays almost as frequently as the guy who was the #6 CB at one point this year (Shields, Williams, Hayward, House and Hyde were all ahead of him.) The really funny part is that at the end of the year when it comes to playoffs and even the SB, its Bush who is still on the field while these other "great" DBs ahead of him are standing on the sidelines in street clothes or relaxing in the locker room nursing their latest injury. At least Bush is still on the field trying to win the game.

[mraynrand]

I just don't understand the logic of sending Bush to pressure Kap and keep contain, with an entire side of the field open with man coverage.

[woodbuck27]

..

The really sad part is that the starting DBs for the Packers seem to screw up plays almost as frequently as the guy who was the #6 CB at one point this year (Shields, Williams, Hayward, House and Hyde were all ahead of him.) The really funny part is that at the end of the year when it comes to playoffs and even the SB, its Bush who is still on the field while these other "great" DBs ahead of him are standing on the sidelines in street clothes or relaxing in the locker room nursing their latest injury. At least Bush is still on the field trying to win the game.

So there. :-D

Put that in your pipe and ...

[woodbuck27]

You are right. After we lost to them last year I said that against mobile QB's you have to collapse the pocket on them. That is how you disrupt them. If ever we see a truly athletic QB that also is a great pocket passer look out, because the big time threat to run means you get at least a full second extra in the pocket at nearly all times.

Last year we ran upfield over and over, then we bit on the read option even more times. We only blew contain twice in this game...I feel blessed.

Baby steps.

[pbmax]

You are right. After we lost to them last year I said that against mobile QB's you have to collapse the pocket on them. That is how you disrupt them. If ever we see a truly athletic QB that also is a great pocket passer look out, because the big time threat to run means you get at least a full second extra in the pocket at nearly all times.

Last year we ran upfield over and over, then we bit on the read option even more times. We only blew contain twice in this game...I feel blessed.

See, Colts game, last year.

[woodbuck27]

I just don't understand the logic of sending Bush to pressure Kap and keep contain, with an entire side of the field open with man coverage.

You can't drop back in pass protect and recover in time to seal the edge to.

You have to pick your poison. The fact is that Kaepernick isn't known for his passing. It's his legs that will burn you.

The Packers too often scare 'the bejays out of you' when it comes to any fast opponent trying to reach and reaching the edge. That's usually a nice plus Vs the Green Bay Packers.

[pbmax]

Oh, by the way, this is not Bush admitting McGinn or wist is right. Bush is talking about blitzing when the back is not going into the pattern. He might have had contain, but you still have no confirmation. Mulumba was behind all this, coverage or spy I am not sure.



Bush's job is two-fold: harass if not sack Kaepernick, and not permit him to scramble around his end.

Kaepernick pump-faked to Crabtree and, as Bush was leaping high to bat the pass, pulled the ball down and sprinted for 11 yards.

"My job is the back," said Bush. "I saw him getting ready to throw it and so I got my hands up.

"It was a short drop, and he pulled it down and made a play. At the end of the day, that's what it's all about."



Read more from Journal Sentinel: http://www.jsonline.com/tablet/topstories/frozen-out-colin-kaepernick-orchestrates-another-knockout-blow-to-packers-b99177625z1-238816231.html#ixzz2pfLQDWS4
Follow us: @JournalSentinel on Twitter

[HarveyWallbangers]

All of a sudden, Wist is back.

[pbmax]

All right, we might be able to get some more inside info if anyone can watch Larry McCarren's Monday TV show from this week. It was on TV here but I found it just after he stopped talking about Bush's blitz and as he moved to Mulumba chasing Kap but obviously limited by his earlier injury.

Called Packers Live with Larry McCarren and Quarless was his guest.

[pbmax]

I just don't understand the logic of sending Bush to pressure Kap and keep contain, with an entire side of the field open with man coverage.

I think Mulumba was the spy, but that is just a guest. The question is whether Green/Trgovac knew he was that slowed by his knee injury. Jones might have been faster at that point.

[KYPack]

All of a sudden, Wist is back.

That's it!

Wist, change your screen name to "Oliver Sudden".

[bobblehead]

Except that he escaped upfield for close to 100 when collapsing the pocket. So on the play in question, does Capers leave Mulumba inside and trust Bush to get both pressure and keep contain - and have zero help if he fails?

NO, we didn't collapse the pocket, that is the point. Bush lost outside leverage. When I say collapse the pocket I mean push it back into him and force him to move, but the edge rushers have to maintain contain. The edge guys push the tackles into the guards while the fatties in the middle push guards and center back. Thus it collapses on the QB. When he tries to scramble the outside guys release and pursue. Bush went inside the tackle and got pinned.

[bobblehead]

..and yet Matthews did the same exact things several times as well last year against SF. People railed on Walden for the long TD run, yet earlier in the game Matthews did the exact same thing as Walden, but Kaepernick only went for 15-20 yards, so no one remembers it. The plays were almost mirror images of each other the way Walden and Matthews played them.

People act as if Bush is the only blitzer who has ever lost/been forced out of his lane. The only reason people are making a big deal out of it is because Aikman decided to single it out.

As far as an impact play failure, Hyde's dropped interception was probably more significant.

People were pretty happy to have Bush against Atlanta when he had a big pass knockdown and then an interception to preserve a 1 point win.

The really sad part is that the starting DBs for the Packers seem to screw up plays almost as frequently as the guy who was the #6 CB at one point this year (Shields, Williams, Hayward, House and Hyde were all ahead of him.) The really funny part is that at the end of the year when it comes to playoffs and even the SB, its Bush who is still on the field while these other "great" DBs ahead of him are standing on the sidelines in street clothes or relaxing in the locker room nursing their latest injury. At least Bush is still on the field trying to win the game.

Incidentally, I railed on mathews last year for that play, but I hammered walden worse because he did it like 6 times.

[wist43]

All of a sudden, Wist is back.

Came off IR couple weeks ago :)

[wist43]

Seriously, this is what you come up with? Bledsoe was never any threat to run.

Did you not see my comment where I said Bledsoe was never a threat to run?? I simply used Butler's blitz as an example of how Bush needed to maintain outside leverage. I remembered that play, so I used it as an example... I'm sure there are better examples, but not easy to find on youtube.

As I said in my original comment, I knew immediately that when Bush came under the block that we were screwed - you have to keep Kaepernick in the pocket, and Bush committed the sin of letting him out. Bush should have known full well that there was no one behind him - again, simple football IQ.

[Smidgeon]

.

[woodbuck27]

That's it!

Wist, change your screen name to "Oliver Sudden".

If Darth Vader was described as usually right:

I'd recommend wist43's new screen name be:

Darth Vader 'Light'.

[woodbuck27]

Did you not see my comment where I said Bledsoe was never a threat to run?? I simply used Butler's blitz as an example of how Bush needed to maintain outside leverage. I remembered that play, so I used it as an example... I'm sure there are better examples, but not easy to find on youtube.

As I said in my original comment, I knew immediately that when Bush came under the block that we were screwed - you have to keep Kaepernick in the pocket, and Bush committed the sin of letting him out. Bush should have known full well that there was no one behind him - again, simple football IQ.

Stroke the Lion... don't kick the LION in the ass.

[mraynrand]

Oh, by the way, this is not Bush admitting McGinn or wist is right. Bush is talking about blitzing when the back is not going into the pattern. He might have had contain, but you still have no confirmation. Mulumba was behind all this, coverage or spy I am not sure.


"My job is the back"

I assumed Bush meant Backside of the defense. He meant running back. So we're back to square one. Who had contain responsibility?

[mraynrand]

Did you not see my comment where I said Bledsoe was never a threat to run?? I simply used Butler's blitz as an example of how Bush needed to maintain outside leverage. I remembered that play, so I used it as an example... I'm sure there are better examples, but not easy to find on youtube.

As I said in my original comment, I knew immediately that when Bush came under the block that we were screwed - you have to keep Kaepernick in the pocket, and Bush committed the sin of letting him out. Bush should have known full well that there was no one behind him - again, simple football IQ.

Like I said, When they kept Kap in the pocket he was able to scramble upfield, not run outside. The goal seemed to be to disrupt the pass, which worked, but they were unsound in contain, whoever was at fault.

And Butler was ass rushing aginst Dave Maggot, who was a tiny back. Outside, inside, he ran right through him to Bedsore. Totally different circumstances. That's my favorite play of SBXXXI, but I never considered Butler was playing outside technique or anything else on Maggot.

[mraynrand]

NO, we didn't collapse the pocket, that is the point. Bush lost outside leverage. When I say collapse the pocket I mean push it back into him and force him to move, but the edge rushers have to maintain contain. The edge guys push the tackles into the guards while the fatties in the middle push guards and center back. Thus it collapses on the QB. When he tries to scramble the outside guys release and pursue. Bush went inside the tackle and got pinned.

Again, Bush isn't an "Edge guy" It's totally different bringing a safety versus a rushing OLB. But I find it entirely plausible that the Packers had Bush rush Kap with the understanding that he was not to give up the edge, especially since it looked like Mulumba crashed inside. I'll assume Bush is at fault, until I see otherwise.

[red]

I'll assume Bush is at fault, until I see otherwise.

in my experience, thats usually a pretty safe assumption

[wist43]

Like I said, When they kept Kap in the pocket he was able to scramble upfield, not run outside. The goal seemed to be to disrupt the pass, which worked, but they were unsound in contain, whoever was at fault.

And Butler was ass rushing aginst Dave Maggot, who was a tiny back. Outside, inside, he ran right through him to Bedsore. Totally different circumstances. That's my favorite play of SBXXXI, but I never considered Butler was playing outside technique or anything else on Maggot.

Good grief ayn, lol...

1) Bush was at fault - get over it. What he did was stupid. Pure and simple - stupid.

2) Butler didn't have to maintain outside leverage on his blitz, that is simply the route he took, and that is what Bush needed to do.

[Pugger]

I thought Mulumba dropped to spy or pick up Gore out of the backfield. I think he got caught out of position when Kap ran.

Bush has blitzed less than a dozen times this year and he flushed Kapernick. That makes Bush the Packers second most effective pressure artist after Daniels and its best blitzer.

He is fine. The rest of the D needs to improve around him. Perry was active and stout against the run, but even from his favored right side he got jack for pressure. Kap is terrible is a close pocket and the Packers could only get one guy close.

And poor Mulumba was playing on one leg in the end. Didn't he tweak his knee in that game? Good lord, I was half expecting MM and Capers to go ask anyone under 30 in the stands to suit up by the 4th quarter.

[red]

And poor Mulumba was playing on one leg in the end. Didn't he tweak his knee in that game? Good lord, I was half expecting MM and Capers to go ask anyone under 30 in the stands to suit up by the 4th quarter.

yeah it was his knee, i was pretty surprised to see him back in there. but they honestly had no one else that could fill in for him

maybe they saw him come back in and knew he was hurting so they decided to run at him?

[wist43]

It would seem I'm not the only one that saw it :bang:


McGinn -

"When Capers rushed seven for the first time since Game 7, the blitzing Bush (10) committed the cardinal sin of giving up the outside on Kaepernick's 11-yard burst on third and 8. It was a horrible mental error."

Read more from Journal Sentinel: http://www.jsonline.com/mainheadlines/sports/rating-the-packers-vs-49ers-b99178387z1-238999221.html#ixzz2pkkHGhiH
Follow us: @JournalSentinel on Twitter

He said, "... horrible mental error". I said "stupid", close enough, lol... :taunt:

[mraynrand]

Good grief ayn, lol...

1) Bush was at fault - get over it. What he did was stupid. Pure and simple - stupid.

I already did. And I cited McGinn from his article as IDing Bush as the guilty party. Still, your example of Butler rushing Bedsore was pretty much useless to the discussion, which was about containing Kap. If Bush is tasked with pass rush and containing the outside, and has responsibility for the RB, then he can't pass rush aggressively, regardless of shoulder, because a guy like Kap can get around either one, especially with a decent RB in there blocking.

[gbgary]

See McGinn article. Bush admitted he had contain responsibility; McGinn reported the same.

well hell. I was going by what another beat writer said. so bush admitted it...wow...never mind.