Finley getting 57th opinion on his neck today

[Just Jeff]

Sooner of later he'll find someone who will clear him.

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2014/04/27/jermichael-finley-having-an-x-ray-of-neck-on-monday/?ocid=Yahoo&partner=ya5nbcs

[denverYooper]

Maybe his insurance policy stipulates 57 confirmations of the injury.

[MadScientist]

Sooner of later he'll find someone who will clear him.

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2014/04/27/jermichael-finley-having-an-x-ray-of-neck-on-monday/?ocid=Yahoo&partner=ya5nbcs

Nick never found someone to clear him.

Time to take the $10M insurance and get on with with the rest of your life JF.

[mraynrand]

Maybe his insurance policy stipulates 57 confirmations of the injury.

One for each state.

[bobblehead]

One for each state.

TAKE IT TO FYI !!!

But I do have to R-S-P-E-C-T the opinion of the doctors that Finley can keep if he wants to keep them.

[pittstang5]

Regardless of medical clearance, I don't think Finley will be a Packer or play in the NFL for that matter.

He had the same problem as Nick Collins and the Packers let Collins go, even though he was "Medically Cleared." No other team signed Collins - a player at the height of his career before the injury.

Finley is done, imo.

[woodbuck27]

http://www.rotoworld.com/recent/nfl/4717/jermichael-finley

" The Seahawks and Dolphins have flirted with Finley, while the Jets, Chiefs, Giants, and Steelers have all been rumored to have interest.

The Milwaukee Journal-Sentinel reported in late March that Finley was "at least two months" and "maybe several months more" from signing a contract. Apr 27 - 2:13 PM " Fr. LINK above

[Joemailman]

MM not closing the door on Finley:


"In my mind, he's a Green Bay Packer, hopefully," coach Mike McCarthy said on SiriusXM NFL Radio on Wednesday. "He's going through a tough medical situation that we all recognize is a serious injury. My understanding is he's doing everything and beyond to get himself ready, and we'll continue to watch that."

Maybe MM is just choosing not to talk negatively about a guy in a tough situation, but he has always liked Finley, despite the headaches he sometimes causes.

[woodbuck27]

MM not closing the door on Finley:



Maybe MM is just choosing not to talk negatively about a guy in a tough situation, but he has always liked Finley, despite the headaches he sometimes causes.

It seems to me that.... MM's suffering a delusion of certain proportions.

JerMichael Finley has shown far too much interest in other NFL teams for MM to express this man love for him. Where's MM's pride?

If I was MM's advisor I wouldn't recommend commentary on JerMichael Finley and his status as a possible NFL TE.

[Cheesehead Craig]

It seems to me that.... MM's suffering a delusion of certain proportions.

JerMichael Finley has shown far too much interest in other NFL teams for MM to express this man love for him. Where's MM's pride?

If I was MM's advisor I wouldn't recommend commentary on JerMichael Finley and his status as a possible NFL TE.

Disagree.

Just because Finley is looking for another team does not negate that the Packers should not keep an eye on his progress. The Packers drafted him and gave him every chance to succeed, why should they throw all that time, effort and money out the window and treat him as some pariah? MM showed no "man love" for him, just commented that he would like to keep him assuming his neck heals. Why shut the door on a talented player? Yes, he's hurt, but what would it say about MM if he just said "hit the bricks"? How would other players around the league take it where the head coach seemingly doesn't care about his players?

I thought he handled it just fine.

[mraynrand]

Disagree.

Just because Finley is looking for another team does not negate that the Packers should not keep an eye on his progress. The Packers drafted him and gave him every chance to succeed, why should they throw all that time, effort and money out the window and treat him as some pariah? MM showed no "man love" for him, just commented that he would like to keep him assuming his neck heals. Why shut the door on a talented player? Yes, he's hurt, but what would it say about MM if he just said "hit the bricks"? How would other players around the league take it where the head coach seemingly doesn't care about his players?

I thought he handled it just fine.

Hear, hear! Repped.

[woodbuck27]

Hear, hear! Repped.


http://images.latinpost.com/data/images/full/5013/dumb-and-dumber-to.png?w=600

Riiiiiight Onnn !

************************************************** *******


The way some of you ram it in together can be counted on.

Sorry Lads but common sense rules the day:

Get out the chains or see this situation for what it is; see TE JerMichael Finley for what /who he is and "his double speak".

Visits to other NFL teams for a new contract and extending his NFL playing career and ** wanting to retire a Green Bay Packer** . Which is it JerMichael?

Why not simply use some common sense after sound analysis.

** The latter (or retirement as a Green Bay Packer) is obtainable as long as he simply faces the facts of his injury and retires now. I believe that after all the blah blah blah that it's going to most reasonably end right there.

Let's exmine it closer. Being silly isn't ever an incurable thing. :idea:

A) Jermichael Finley has shown more interest in the Seattle Seahawk and New York GIANTS organizations than a return to Green Bay where he has said a return means he want the same money he got pre-injury. See Ted Thompson and his needs to re-sign at least one of WR's Jordy Nelson and/or Randall Cobb....2015 UFA"s and star Green Bay Packer offensive weapons that offer superior returns than any injury afflicted JerMichael Finley.

B) JerMichael Finleys injury is similar to former star Safety Nick Collins and what was the Green Bay Packers response to that? Is a man like TT (the Green Bay Packers) going to make a decision about one star player (Nick Collins) and where the same decision is prudent RE: JerMichael Finley. Do an about turn? NO ! That's not logical nor likely.

Not that Ted Thompson can ever be accused of certain consistency. Take his latest draft and the claim he always drafts BPA. That went has gone out the door like used bath water after the 2014 draft. That TT is such a kidder. :-|

C) Mike McCarthy is a football coach. MM is being over emotional and not using managerial skills required of an NFL GM. Ted Thompson won't be bringing JerMichael Finley back because Mike McCarthy can't use common sense and let go of this damaged TE.

D) Focusing on the personal and the man himself. JerMichael Finley isn't the brightest bulb on the tree. To allow JerMichael Finley to come back (again ... see Nick Collins) and with that decision. Put him at high risk that one hit could risk much more than his football life. Isn't going to happen.

It's a certain bye bye to TE JerMichael Finley and TE play in Green Bay.

Take that to the bank.

[pbmax]

Jermichael Finley has shown more interest in the Seattle Seahawk and New York GIANTS organizations than a return to Green Bay where he has said a return means he want the same money he got pre-injury.

Source on this?

Similar injury is not the same injury. Few players have returned from Collins injury. Many more have returned from Finley's injury. However, its not a lock every team Doc will clear him.

So his interest in other teams COULD be an indication that he wants to leave, or it might be an indication he MAY HAVE TO leave, in order to continue playing. Plus, either way it never hurts to have more than one suitor.

[woodbuck27]

Source on this?

Similar injury is not the same injury. Few players have returned from Collins injury. Many more have returned from Finley's injury. However, its not a lock every team Doc will clear him.

So his interest in other teams COULD be an indication that he wants to leave, or it might be an indication he MAY HAVE TO leave, in order to continue playing. Plus, either way it never hurts to have more than one suitor.

Your as up on this UFA as I am pbmax. There's not much that you miss as a Packer fan and my observations here. To top that off your competent as a fan in regards to being even in your common sense and personality.

You know as well as me that he has been in contact with the Seattle Seahawks and the New York giants don't you?

OK:

Jermichael Finley and the New York Giants:

http://www.sportsmedia101.com/newyorkgiants/2014/05/13/jermichael-finley-says-hed-play-for-new-york-giants-if-ben-mcadoo-came-calling-loves-playing-for-him/

Jermichael Finley Says He’d Play for Giants If Ben McAdoo Came Calling; Loves Playing for Him

May 13th, 2014 at 9:00 AM

By: Doug Rush

" Since the beginning of the offseason, there has been one very popular name that has been linked to the New York Giants from the very beginning, talk that all started when he was being recruited to play for the team by Antrel Rolle during Super Bowl XLVIII; Jermichael Finley of the Green Bay Packers."

Jermichael Finley and the NY GIANTS and ...the Seattle Seahawks:

http://www.bigblueview.com/2014/5/15/5717688/nfl-free-agency-2014-ny-giants-rumors-news-jermichael-finley

NFL Free Agency 2014: Tight end market is Jermichael Finley and who else?

By: Ed Valentine  @bigblueview on May 15 2014, 12:00p

" If and when that clearance ever comes, the Giants will have some competition if they want the services of the 27-year-old Finley. The Super Bowl champion Seattle Seahawks have reportedly shown some interest, and ..... a return to the Packers is also apparently not out of the question."

This talk and these NFL teams and this former Green Bay Packer TE and his desires to continue his NFL career. Has been in the news for weeks now.

[mraynrand]

Both articles mention nothing about money. Finley's interest in the Giants is due to McAdoo (a father figure), based on one quote. The Seattle rumor cites unsubstantiated rumors. No evidence supporting anything having to do with how much money Finley wants. Try again.

P.S. Madtown's rules are pretty simple - not posting of personal information.

[woodbuck27]

Both articles mention nothing about money. Finley's interest in the Giants is due to McAdoo (a father figure), based on one quote. The Seattle rumor cites unsubstantiated rumors. No evidence supporting anything having to do with how much money Finley wants. Try again.

P.S. Madtown's rules are pretty simple - not posting of personal information - leave the pic of you and your brother off the site.

When did money become the specific of this argument? Get real please. Ohh forget that suggestion. Your "way past" out to lunch.

I never imagined a bigger ASSHOLE could exist such as you. That's obviously your life's greatest endeavour to remain supreme in that category.

What a joke you are. Your so delisciously idiotic to me.

Do you in your narcissistic manner actually imagine that I answer to you here?

Your seriously deluded if you do.

Your like a fly.........that's right.

[mraynrand]

Do you in your narcissistic manner actually imagine that I answer to you here?

Your seriously deluded if you do.

Your like a fly.........that's right.


I'm sorry, I missed the link to the article about Finley's contract demands in this post. Or are you just tossing insults again?

[Cheesehead Craig]

Get out the chains or see this situation for what it is; see TE JerMichael Finley for what /who he is and "his double speak".

Visits to other NFL teams for a new contract and extending his NFL playing career and ** wanting to retire a Green Bay Packer** . Which is it JerMichael?

Why not simply use some common sense after sound analysis.

** The latter (or retirement as a Green Bay Packer) is obtainable as long as he simply faces the facts of his injury and retires now. I believe that after all the blah blah blah that it's going to most reasonably end right there.

Let's exmine it closer. Being silly isn't ever an incurable thing. :idea:

A) Jermichael Finley has shown more interest in the Seattle Seahawk and New York GIANTS organizations than a return to Green Bay where he has said a return means he want the same money he got pre-injury. See Ted Thompson and his needs to re-sign at least one of WR's Jordy Nelson and/or Randall Cobb....2015 UFA"s and star Green Bay Packer offensive weapons that offer superior returns than any injury afflicted JerMichael Finley.

B) JerMichael Finleys injury is similar to former star Safety Nick Collins and what was the Green Bay Packers response to that? Is a man like TT (the Green Bay Packers) going to make a decision about one star player (Nick Collins) and where the same decision is prudent RE: JerMichael Finley. Do an about turn? NO ! That's not logical nor likely.

Not that Ted Thompson can ever be accused of certain consistency. Take his latest draft and the claim he always drafts BPA. That went has gone out the door like used bath water after the 2014 draft. That TT is such a kidder. :-|

C) Mike McCarthy is a football coach. MM is being over emotional and not using managerial skills required of an NFL GM. Ted Thompson won't be bringing JerMichael Finley back because Mike McCarthy can't use common sense and let go of this damaged TE.

D) Focusing on the personal and the man himself. JerMichael Finley isn't the brightest bulb on the tree. To allow JerMichael Finley to come back (again ... see Nick Collins) and with that decision. Put him at high risk that one hit could risk much more than his football life. Isn't going to happen.

It's a certain bye bye to TE JerMichael Finley and TE play in Green Bay.

Take that to the bank.

Yes, JF has stated he is willing to look at other teams, but his preference is retiring as a Packer. It's a business and he knows it is. The Packers can cut bait with him at any time and he knows it so he is keeping his options open as he wants to play again.

PFT article supporting this: http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2014/01/31/finley-wants-to-stay-with-packers-but-eyeballing-seattle/

This is extremely common when a player hits FA, they always say they want to stay with their former team in order to get more offers on the table and thus get the best contract. To be shocked that a player does this is being obtuse to the realities of the NFL.

You haven't shown any evidence that MM is being "overly emotional" about Finley. His statement that was referenced above shows nothing remotely over the top.

I personally don't think Finley is coming back given the injury. I would be surprised if he does end up getting cleared given what has been reported.

[mraynrand]

When did money become the specific of this argument? Get real please. Ohh forget that suggestion. Your "way past" out to lunch.

I never imagined a bigger ASSHOLE could exist such as you. That's obviously your life's greatest endeavour to remain supreme in that category.

What a joke you are. Your so delisciously idiotic to me.

Do you in your narcissistic manner actually imagine that I answer to you here?

Your seriously deluded if you do.

Your like a fly.........that's right.

nice edit. Stay classy, San Diego.

[woodbuck27]

Both articles mention nothing about money. Finley's interest in the Giants is due to McAdoo (a father figure), based on one quote. The Seattle rumor cites unsubstantiated rumors. No evidence supporting anything having to do with how much money Finley wants. Try again.

P.S. Madtown's rules are pretty simple - not posting of personal information.

Be specific "Troubled Child".

What exact personal information did I post here on this thread?

You cannot go there because your obsessions slime you.

Your always "the LOSER". So ....best to simply waddle away mraynrand.

[woodbuck27]

Yes, JF has stated he is willing to look at other teams, but his preference is retiring as a Packer. It's a business and he knows it is. The Packers can cut bait with him at any time and he knows it so he is keeping his options open as he wants to play again.

PFT article supporting this: http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2014/01/31/finley-wants-to-stay-with-packers-but-eyeballing-seattle/

This is extremely common when a player hits FA, they always say they want to stay with their former team in order to get more offers on the table and thus get the best contract. To be shocked that a player does this is being obtuse to the realities of the NFL.

You haven't shown any evidence that MM is being "overly emotional" about Finley. His statement that was referenced above shows nothing remotely over the top.

I personally don't think Finley is coming back given the injury. I would be surprised if he does end up getting cleared given what has been reported.

Then you and I are on the same page.

mraynrand as usual wants to be contentious with his bullshit style of raisin HELL here.

[mraynrand]

Yes, JF has stated he is willing to look at other teams, but his preference is retiring as a Packer. It's a business and he knows it is. The Packers can cut bait with him at any time and he knows it so he is keeping his options open as he wants to play again.

PFT article supporting this: http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2014/01/31/finley-wants-to-stay-with-packers-but-eyeballing-seattle/

This is extremely common when a player hits FA, they always say they want to stay with their former team in order to get more offers on the table and thus get the best contract. To be shocked that a player does this is being obtuse to the realities of the NFL.


“I mean there’s a couple of teams I would love and would be on the first flight out to play with but like I said the Packers are going to come at me with something and I’m going to go to them first and see what they’ve got and if it’s not [**] I would love to be on the first flight out to good old Seattle,”


**no numbers, but assuming he means "enough"

Finley wants to be well paid. No shocker there. I hope he passes his physical eventually and the Packers can get him for a reasonable contract. If not, I really hope he goes to the AFC.

[mraynrand]

Be specific "Troubled Child".

What exact personal information did I post here on this thread?

You cannot go there because your obsessions slime you.

Your always "the LOSER". So ....best to simply waddle away mraynrand.

I'm sorry, is there a football topic in here anywhere? Seems like a personal attack. I think you are up to at least five today.

Personal info: Stop posting pictures of me and my posse.

http://www.movieactors.com/freezeframes33/dumb53.jpeg

[woodbuck27]

nice edit. Stay classy, San Diego.

No ASSHOLE you made the edit. Your really weak mraynrand.... not worthy. Very difficult to take seriously. You've been informed of that plenty of times by others.

I stick to the TRUTH...and you. Your over the top too obvious. Sadly.

It's time for you to take a wee rest "t" iger.

bye bye...your boring me.

Don't act insane...Your on IGNORE.

Read that...GOOD !

[mraynrand]

No ASSHOLE you made the edit. Your really weak mraynrand.... not worthy. Very difficult to take seriously. You've been informed of that plenty of times by others.

I stick to the TRUTH...and you. Your over the top too obvious. Sadly.

It's time for you to take a wee rest "t" iger.

bye bye...your boring me.

Don't act insane...Your on IGNORE.

Read that...GOOD !

I just quote your posts. Are you saying I'm in control of your posts? Hardly. Still, you are up to six insults in one day. Didn't your mother teach you to play nice? Stay Classy, San Diego!

P.S. Still waiting for some contract demand proof about Finley.

[woodbuck27]

I'm sorry, is there a football topic in here anywhere? Seems like a personal attack. I think you are up to at least five today.

Personal info: Stop posting pictures of me and my posse.

http://www.movieactors.com/freezeframes33/dumb53.jpeg

Ohh this and just what a sicko hypocrite you are.

As if you never insult...personally attack here.

How's it feel "dumpling".

Your pathetic. Get to your therapist...fast. Your batteries have run low.

[woodbuck27]

I just quote your posts. Are you saying I'm in control of your posts? Hardly. Still, you are up to six insults in one day. Didn't your mother teach you to play nice? Stay Classy, San Diego!

P.S. Still waiting for some contract demand proof about Finley.

S....ure.

I know how to help you.

Your on IGNORE mraynrand.

To post me now is idiotic.

[mraynrand]

Ohh this and just what a sicko hypocrite you are.

As if you never insult...personally attack here.

How's it feel "dumpling".

Your pathetic. Get to your therapist...fast. Your batteries have run low.

I thought I was on 'ignore'

FYI - there was no link to Finley contract demands in that post.

[mraynrand]

Fuck off

Jesus loves you.

[woodbuck27]

Source on this?

Similar injury is not the same injury. Few players have returned from Collins injury. Many more have returned from Finley's injury. However, its not a lock every team Doc will clear him.

So his interest in other teams COULD be an indication that he wants to leave, or it might be an indication he MAY HAVE TO leave, in order to continue playing. Plus, either way it never hurts to have more than one suitor.

Yes.

A lot must change as it is now for him to ever play TE as a Packer again.

It's my view with many in Packer Nation that his career as a Packer TE is over.

That's my stance on this as I view it today.

Before he's medically cleared to speculate anything but the likelihood of that (a medical Doctor's clearance to return to the NFL as a player) is to think too far ahead as I see that.

[Cheesehead Craig]

Then you and I are on the same page.

mraynrand as usual wants to be contentious with his bullshit style of raisin HELL here.

The only agreement we have is that we don't believe that Finley will be here next season. I still disagree about your other comments on MM and Finley.

[woodbuck27]

The only agreement we have is that we don't believe that Finley will be here next season. I still disagree about your other comments on MM and Finley.

Disagreeing is OK Cheesehead Craig. I expect that from you. It's been my clear perception that we're not on the same page in terms of Packer focus and direction. The basis of my complaints:

I expect a lot from the Packer leadership.

Your disagreement isn't insulting or gone to where "the Problem Child" is so challenged to avoid. You don't post to trash as this other member does with such enjoyment. Your not sadistic to other members.

That BS never works with me. All that gets is double time from me or total disregard and disrespect. I make it a promise to myself tt wade right in or best ...ignore trouble and fix that fast.

On point....

I 've never understood "all the positive rage" and JerMichael Finley. How well has he produced?

JerMichael Finley has been overpaid as I've seen it for "only 20 TD's" in six (6) seasons.

He's been available for 70 games and started 48. He's had 223 receptions for 2785 yards and 12.5 Yards/Catch. He's been a continuing concern and a project to act sensible. His maturity issues have been obvious.

Now add the latest injury and prognosis for worse. Add his impetuous nature and given the non medical clearance to play again. Add contradictory reports of remaining a Green Bay Packer.

I rest my case on why are we coveting his future service.

[mraynrand]

Your disagreement isn't insulting or gone to where "the Problem Child" is so challenged to avoid. You don't post to trash as this other member does with such enjoyment. Your not sadistic to other members.

That BS never works with me. All that gets is double time from me or total disregard and disrespect. I make it a promise to myself tt wade right in or best ...ignore trouble and fix that fast.



http://d1mxyp5ceukbya.cloudfront.net/images/richard-ramirez-dies-dead-night-stalker-serial-killer.jpg

[MadtownPacker]

Damn, do I have two bullets left in the chamber? :lol:

[mraynrand]

Damn, do I have two bullets left in the chamber? :lol:

If you have any left over, you know what to do.

http://i.cdn.turner.com/si/multimedia/photo_gallery/1101/nba.greatest.rookie.seasons/images/unseld.jpg

[bobblehead]

Damn, do I have two bullets left in the chamber? :lol:

If not, call Aaron Hernandez...I hear he is willing to do contract work now that the Patriots have waived him.

[Rastak]

If you have any left over, you know what to do.

http://i.cdn.turner.com/si/multimedia/photo_gallery/1101/nba.greatest.rookie.seasons/images/unseld.jpg


Damn, is that Wes slammin it down?

That takes me back.

[Scott Campbell]

I never imagined a bigger ASSHOLE could exist such as you. (mraynrand)


How soon they forget.

[mraynrand]

How soon they forget.

:)

[red]

Source on this?

Similar injury is not the same injury. Few players have returned from Collins injury. Many more have returned from Finley's injury. However, its not a lock every team Doc will clear him.

So his interest in other teams COULD be an indication that he wants to leave, or it might be an indication he MAY HAVE TO leave, in order to continue playing. Plus, either way it never hurts to have more than one suitor.

i thought we settled this?

they ARE the exact same injury. the procedures to fix the injury is different. collins got the old tried and true method while finely got some new age voodoo where they pretty much threw some spices and herbs at it and danced around in a circle and declared him healed

http://nomoda.org/images/newage_george.png

[pbmax]

Dammit! I can never keep it straight!

http://packerrats.com/showthread.php?26532-Jermichael-Finley-What-might-the-Green-Bay-Packers-do&p=775312&viewfull=1#post775312


Partial redemption for Cub Reporter Hot Tub Chmura, Rob Demovsky confirms the same vertebrae involved with Collins AND Finley. McCarthy much more optimistic about Finley, obviously.



http://espn.go.com/blog/nflnation/post/_/id/118582/jolly-on-track-to-return-from-neck-surgery

Bonus news, Jolly likely to be cleared to play this year.

[pbmax]

Dammit! I can never keep it straight!

http://packerrats.com/showthread.php?26532-Jermichael-Finley-What-might-the-Green-Bay-Packers-do&p=775312&viewfull=1#post775312

However, though it involves the same vertebrae, it may not be the same injury. Finley is still getting sniffs from teams, so there must be some hope the whatever sidelined Collins is not happening with Finley.

Yet.

3irty1 remembers it was stenosis that was the key factor for Collins being unable to return.

[red]

However, though it involves the same vertebrae, it may not be the same injury. Finley is still getting sniffs from teams, so there must be some hope the whatever sidelined Collins is not happening with Finley.

Yet.

3irty1 remembers it was stenosis that was the key factor for Collins being unable to return.

we've been over that too. everything that collins his agent and his doctor said was that he did not have stenosis

as for teams still sniffing around him. you'll noticed that teams that have brought him in for a look haven't continued to sniff him

i think m3 saying over and over again that he wants finley back is just a clever way to get minnesota to sign his broken ass to a long term deal

[pbmax]

we've been over that too. everything that collins his agent and his doctor said was that he did not have stenosis

as for teams still sniffing around him. you'll noticed that teams that have brought him in for a look haven't continued to sniff him

i think m3 saying over and over again that he wants finley back is just a clever way to get minnesota to sign his broken ass to a long term deal

No, I think the initial report of no stenosis was from his agent. It turned out later that his outcome after surgery involved some complications, including stenosis which meant that even teams who had cleared others with the same fusion would not let him come back.

Given my track record here, I would not take my word for this, but I am, let's say optimistic, that this was the case.

I do know stenosis can develop after the surgery and after the injury even if the canal was normal prior.

[red]

No, I think the initial report of no stenosis was from his agent. It turned out later that his outcome after surgery involved some complications, including stenosis which meant that even teams who had cleared others with the same fusion would not let him come back.

Given my track record here, I would not take my word for this, but I am, let's say optimistic, that this was the case.

I do know stenosis can develop after the surgery and after the injury even if the canal was normal prior.

i do know that when we discussed this a month or two ago i looked it up and nowhere on the net could i find where nick had stenosis

[red]

now even if the team does somehow clear him. finley has said that he will only be signing for the same kind of money that he was getting before the injury

BUT HE WAS FUCKING WORTH THE MONEY HE WAS GETTING BEFORE THE INJURY. not even close

before the injury, he was worth about half of what he was making, and i wouldn't pay a 100% healthy finley much more then that

[mraynrand]

BUT HE WAS FUCKING WORTH THE MONEY HE WAS GETTING BEFORE THE INJURY. not even close

We could had 4 Scott Wellses for the price of that worthless fucker!

[pbmax]

now even if the team does somehow clear him. finley has said that he will only be signing for the same kind of money that he was getting before the injury

This I do not remember. Was he talking about his insurance plan or something?

[red]

This I do not remember. Was he talking about his insurance plan or something?

damnit, i read this or heard it in just the last couple of days, but i can't find it again for the life of me

i'm about 75% sure though that i actually read/heard it, and that its not just something that my brain made up out of the blue and has tried to convince me is real

[pbmax]

If only we had someplace centralized where we could write this stuff down, and save it, so we don't forget it ...

[red]

i think i might have found where i read it, it was right under my nose

from this thread. you actually quoted the post in the post that i called you out on. go figure


A) Jermichael Finley has shown more interest in the Seattle Seahawk and New York GIANTS organizations than a return to Green Bay where he has said a return means he want the same money he got pre-injury.

so maybe it wasn't the most reputable source. it still counts as me remembering reading it somewhere

reds memory-1
reds imagination-378

[woodbuck27]

http://espn.go.com/blog/green-bay-packers/post/_/id/9769/jermichael-finleys-locker-still-intact

Jermichael Finley's locker still intact

May 17 ...8:00 AM ET

By Rob Demovsky | ESPN.com

Comment woodbuck27:

Johnny Jolly's and Ryan Pickett's...NOT ! That and the DL concerns me.

JerMichael Finley and back and too much money (to make that A REALITY) and his performance and our status at the TE position Vs the DL.

If I could as a Packer fan have Johnny Jolly back Vs JerMichael Finley back . That would be an easy decision as to which former Packers I'd most prefer.

[smuggler]

The locker thing could be as simple as... Jolly and Pickett cleaned out their lockers at the end of the year, and Fin didn't.

[Just Jeff]

The locker thing could be as simple as... Jolly and Pickett cleaned out their lockers at the end of the year, and Fin didn't.

Or it could mean that TT knows that it is in the best interest of Jolly and Pickett to retire, as Packers, and he has prepared their lockers to be shipped to them as an honor from the team. We'll know more if TT travel to their homes and has dinner there without saying a word.

[pbmax]

"Honey, I have terrible news"

"What! What happened?!"

"You know how we have been taking about what to do when I was done playing football?"

"Yes"

"My locker just arrived at the front door."

[Cheesehead Craig]

Or it could mean that TT knows that it is in the best interest of Jolly and Pickett to retire, as Packers, and he has prepared their lockers to be shipped to them as an honor from the team. We'll know more if TT travel to their homes and has dinner there without saying a word.

Wonder how much that costs? I'm sure there's a difference in 2 day vs standard, but still that's a solid chunk of change.

[Just Jeff]

Wonder how much that costs? I'm sure there's a difference in 2 day vs standard, but still that's a solid chunk of change.
They might get a volume discount by sending Jolly's , Pickett's and Favre"s at the same time.

[woodbuck27]

"Honey, I have terrible news"

"What! What happened?!"

"You know how we have been taking about what to do when I was done playing football?"

"Yes"

"My locker just arrived at the front door."

Ohh Yeaaaa !

PACKERS !

[woodbuck27]

They might get a volume discount by sending Jolly's , Pickett's and Favre"s at the same time.

" I don't want no damn locker. I want the ball." Brett Favre

[mraynrand]

Wonder how much that costs? I'm sure there's a difference in 2 day vs standard, but still that's a solid chunk of change.

Second day Locker Delivery is free with Amazon Prime.

[Fritz]

It'd be pretty funny if they left the stanky unwashed jocks and cleats in the locker when they delivered it.

[woodbuck27]

http://www.chatsports.com/minnesota-vikings/a/Jermichael-Finley-Tweet-Sets-Off-Vikings-Speculation-2-9879274

Jermichael Finley Tweet Sets Off Vikings Speculation

By: Dan Zinski 1d ago

Comment woodbuck27:

We've entered "the Dog Days" in the NFL Season.


" ... What is Jermichael Finley doing these days? Apparently he was hanging out in the Minneapolis area on Sunday if this tweet is any indication. ... " Fr. LINK

Tweet:

" ... What’s Going On In The #TwinCities 2day?

— Jermichael Finley (@JermichaelF88) May 25, 2014 ... " Fr. Link

Please click on the LINK if you want to reads the rest of this story.

[Fritz]

Why does he keep on hanging out in Minneapolis? Isn't he from Texas?

I think he's career is over. I know MM wants to think differently, but I'm getting that ol' Nick Collins feeling about all this.

[Joemailman]

There is a place in Minneapolis that Finley has worked out at in the offseason before, including 2011 when he was coming back from his knee injury. This is nothing new.

[pbmax]

http://espn.go.com/blog/green-bay-packers/post/_/id/9929/mailbag-whats-up-with-jermichael-finley


Demovsky: You're referring to the tweet that Jermichael Finley posted in which he proclaimed that he had "Awesome News!" A few hours later, however, he tweeted something about a "minor setback" for a "major #comeback." I can tell you that after talking to several people about the matter after those tweets, that there has been no change in either his medical clearance or his contractual status with the Packers. Until the former changes, meaning the Packers' doctors give him the OK to return to the field, nothing will happen with the latter. And let's be clear about this: Even if Finley's doctor says it's safe for him to resume his career, that does not mean individual doctors for NFL teams will have the same opinion.

Shorter version: Nothing has changed.

[woodbuck27]

Why does he keep on hanging out in Minneapolis? Isn't he from Texas?

I think he's career is over. I know MM wants to think differently, but I'm getting that ol' Nick Collins feeling about all this.

Here's a guess:

It's the food:

i.e. The deliscious turkey drumsticks and jerk-style chicken wings; deep-fried pumpkin pie and mini-doughnut-batter ice cream....Chocolate covered cheese?

Yum Yum !

[woodbuck27]

http://bleacherreport.com/green-bay-packers


Tom Silverstein ✔ @TomSilverstein

New from JS: Jermichael Finley will undergo testing with Packers Wednesday http://bit.ly/1hwEARy #packers


11:42 PM - 27 May 2014

12 Retweets

[Patler]

For a guy with only 223 receptions and 20 TDs in 6 seasons, he certainly gets a lot of press.

[Brandon494]

For a guy with only 223 receptions and 20 TDs in 6 seasons, he certainly gets a lot of press.

:roll:

[Patler]

:roll:

What's the eye roll for? It wasn't a criticism of him, just a comment on the way his career has evolved, influenced more by injuries than anything.

At some point, and I would suggest with six seasons in the bank the point has come, it should be realized that is career trajectory is set. Can he possible still have a big year? Sure. But something will likely always get in the way of a truly fantastic season. First it was immaturity, then leg injuries, followed by a knee injury and surgery. Then, a concussion followed by the neck injury and another surgery. Drops have made him unreliable for long stretches, even when he was otherwise healthy.

He's never had an 800 yard season. He has had 3 games of 100 yards or more, the last in 2010. He has had four games of 80-100 yards, the last in 2011.

He seems to get press based on potential, because injuries and some of his own failings (drops) have suppressed his actual performance. But press based on potential for a skill position player entering his 7th season seems misplaced, in my opinion.

That said, I would like to see him back in GB, but not if it takes a big contract to get him there. I think that would be wasted money.

[woodbuck27]

For a guy with only 223 receptions and 20 TDs in 6 seasons, he certainly gets a lot of press.

Really. :-)

[HarveyWallbangers]

Finley is much better than the likes of Quarless. Richard Rodgers looks he'll be a JAG in the Quarless mold to me. Finley changes how defenses cover us. None of our other guys do. (Lyerla does have the talent to be that kind of guy.)

[Pugger]

For a guy with only 223 receptions and 20 TDs in 6 seasons, he certainly gets a lot of press.

Of course him tweeting so much gets him a lot of air time and press attention.

[mraynrand]

All I asked was that Finley live up to his contract somewhere near the level of Scott Wells. Then the neck injury. Oh. the HUMANITY!

http://thetrivialtroll.files.wordpress.com/2012/10/imagesca09o8w2.jpg?w=440

[woodbuck27]

Finley is much better than the likes of Quarless. Richard Rodgers looks he'll be a JAG in the Quarless mold to me. Finley changes how defenses cover us. None of our other guys do. (Lyerla does have the talent to be that kind of guy.)

Colt Ly err laa.... Aaron Rodgers may be thinking great thoughts and this Rookie. Plans !!

Another TE prospect that uses Twitter.

If he gets it right, Colt Lyerla may be a Green Bay Packer fan favourite. He has such potential !


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xgqbrR8FOYI&feature=kp


https://twitter.com/LongLiveLyerla/media

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/10955664/green-bay-packers-sign-troubled-tight-end-colt-lyerla

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BY5L4pkCUAEbgJp.jpg

Colt Lyeria college fans.


A Colt Lyeria Twitter Page:

https://twitter.com/LongLiveLyerla

[pbmax]

Finley is much better than the likes of Quarless. Richard Rodgers looks he'll be a JAG in the Quarless mold to me. Finley changes how defenses cover us. None of our other guys do. (Lyerla does have the talent to be that kind of guy.)

I'm not buying that. He draws little linebacker coverage, but even when its the 3/4 CB or a safety, its single coverage. No one rolls coverage to him. Captain crossing route hasn't made that kind of dent in a while. Not since the knee injury.

[pbmax]

TLS 1.2, AES with 128 bit encryption (High); ECDH_P256 with 256 bit exchange



Your encryption and encoding is showing.

[woodbuck27]

Your encryption and encoding is showing.

Your Johnny on the spot... :-) I corrected for that already.


Thanks pbmax... and have a great day.

[Patler]

Finley is much better than the likes of Quarless. Richard Rodgers looks he'll be a JAG in the Quarless mold to me. Finley changes how defenses cover us. None of our other guys do. (Lyerla does have the talent to be that kind of guy.)

Finley CAN do those things, but too often does not. He does not do them standing on the sidelines with yet another injury. It seemed to me that defenses were becoming less and less concerned about him as his problems with drops continued from one season to the next. He is an inconsistent blocker on top of the injury and drop issues. He is a veteran player going into his 7th season. Basically, he is a player that can not be relied on because of injuries, drops and inconsistent effort and technique in blocking. I don't expect any of that to change, but he still will do things to get people excited from time to time.

He is the Jeff George of tight ends. A guy who has ability to be much better than his actual performances for many reason, including injuries. Every time Jeff George was available, the press and fans went crazy, and every where he went, his actual performance failed to live up to their hopes and expectations.

Finley will continue to suffer from injuries. He will continue having issues with drops. He will continue to be an inconsistent blocker. The trick is determining what value he has apart from those things.

Keeping him in GB would, however, be quite interesting if he can be paired with a healthy and experienced Quarless, a focused Lyerla and an up and coming reliable Rodgers. It would allow Finley to focus on what he does best, while still presenting reasonable options in the passing game with the other TEs. In view of Finley's history, I juts don't want to see them risk a lot of cap dollars with Finley

[pbmax]

Nothing Has Changed


Rob Demovsky ‏@RobDemovsky 1m
Source on Finley added: "It's a formality, no testing. Nothing more, nothing less." #Packers
Details coming on http://ESPN.com soon

Rob Demovsky ‏@RobDemovsky 2m
Source said Finley had plans to travel to GB w/his family. While in town will check in w/ #Packers docs b/c he has not seen them recently.

[woodbuck27]

Finley CAN do those things, but too often does not. He does not do them standing on the sidelines with yet another injury. It seemed to me that defenses were becoming less and less concerned about him as his problems with drops continued from one season to the next. He is an inconsistent blocker on top of the injury and drop issues. He is a veteran player going into his 7th season. Basically, he is a player that can not be relied on because of injuries, drops and inconsistent effort and technique in blocking. I don't expect any of that to change, but he still will do things to get people excited from time to time.

He is the Jeff George of tight ends. A guy who has ability to be much better than his actual performances for many reason, including injuries. Every time Jeff George was available, the press and fans went crazy, and every where he went, his actual performance failed to live up to their hopes and expectations.

Finley will continue to suffer from injuries. He will continue having issues with drops. He will continue to be an inconsistent blocker. The trick is determining what value he has apart from those things.

Keeping him in GB would, however, be quite interesting if he can be paired with a healthy and experienced Quarless, a focused Lyerla and an up and coming reliable Rodgers. It would allow Finley to focus on what he does best, while still presenting reasonable options in the passing game with the other TEs. In view of Finley's history, I juts don't want to see them risk a lot of cap dollars with Finley


http://www.wpclipart.com/money/money_bags.png

Jermichael Finley wants to be "somewhere" AND "$$$$ in there $$$$".

[mraynrand]

Finley CAN do those things, but too often does not. He does not do them standing on the sidelines with yet another injury.

Injury Prone!

[Patler]

Injury Prone!

Finley is prone to many things, injuries being just one of them.

[pbmax]

Sometimes, he is just flat out prone.

http://fikklefame.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/04/Jermichael-Finley.jpg

[pbmax]

Nothing Has Changed

Blake Baratz ‏@blakebaratz 16m
Easier 2 answer every1 at once: @JermichaelF88 is making tremendous strides, is in the best shape of his life, & this is a process.#Patience

[HarveyWallbangers]

I'm not buying that. He draws little linebacker coverage, but even when its the 3/4 CB or a safety, its single coverage. No one rolls coverage to him. Captain crossing route hasn't made that kind of dent in a while. Not since the knee injury.

Changing how defenses cover us doesn't just mean he was getting double covered. Defenses having to put a safety on him changes how defenses cover us. It opens things up for other guys. Come on now. People act like the guy is average. I trust Ted Thompson thinks this guy makes more of a difference than some on here think or he wouldn't have given him all that money. The guy is a good player, and he'll be missed. Can we overcome the loss of him? Of course, outside of Rodgers, we can overcome the loss of any one player.


McCarthy reiterated his admiration for the matchup problems Finley poses for opponents. "When you look at Jermichael," McCarthy said, "and you go on the other side of the ball or you talk to any of the defensive guys that played against him, he's a matchup challenge for defenses. I think his best routes are when we're attacking the middle of the field with him. I think he's unique that way. Big target, excellent in the red zone."

http://www.footballoutsiders.com/extra-points/2013/what-jermichael-finley-means-packers


The formation flexibility that Finley brought had the double reward of making the Packers unpredictable and the defense extra predictable. Often the way a defense responded to Finley’s alignment before the snap revealed whether the coverage was man or zone. And those coverages tended to be more basic because defensive coordinators were worried about whichever one of their linebackers, safeties or backup corners was caught on the wrong end of a mismatch.

[Brandon494]

What's the eye roll for? It wasn't a criticism of him, just a comment on the way his career has evolved, influenced more by injuries than anything.

At some point, and I would suggest with six seasons in the bank the point has come, it should be realized that is career trajectory is set. Can he possible still have a big year? Sure. But something will likely always get in the way of a truly fantastic season. First it was immaturity, then leg injuries, followed by a knee injury and surgery. Then, a concussion followed by the neck injury and another surgery. Drops have made him unreliable for long stretches, even when he was otherwise healthy.

He's never had an 800 yard season. He has had 3 games of 100 yards or more, the last in 2010. He has had four games of 80-100 yards, the last in 2011.

He seems to get press based on potential, because injuries and some of his own failings (drops) have suppressed his actual performance. But press based on potential for a skill position player entering his 7th season seems misplaced, in my opinion.

That said, I would like to see him back in GB, but not if it takes a big contract to get him there. I think that would be wasted money.

You were trying to downgrade him with that comment knowing he hasn't played a full 6 seasons and knowing how Rodgers likes to spread the ball around. Finley is still a top 8 TE in the league when healthy and the defense still has to account for him on the field. Now I've gone on the record and stated we should move on from Finley but to complain about him getting too much press about 2-3 short articles deserves an :roll:

[Brandon494]

Changing how defenses cover us doesn't just mean he was getting double covered. Defenses having to put a safety on him changes how defenses cover us. It opens things up for other guys. Come on now. People act like the guy is average. I trust Ted Thompson thinks this guy makes more of a difference than some on here think or he wouldn't have given him all that money. The guy is a good player, and he'll be missed. Can we overcome the loss of him? Of course, outside of Rodgers, we can overcome the loss of any one player.

OFT

[pbmax]

Changing how defenses cover us doesn't just mean he was getting double covered. Defenses having to put a safety on him changes how defenses cover us. It opens things up for other guys. Come on now. People act like the guy is average. I trust Ted Thompson thinks this guy makes more of a difference than some on here think or he wouldn't have given him all that money. The guy is a good player, and he'll be missed. Can we overcome the loss of him? Of course, outside of Rodgers, we can overcome the loss of any one player.



http://www.footballoutsiders.com/extra-points/2013/what-jermichael-finley-means-packers

Think about what you are suggesting. He is such a threat that a Defense responds to him like he is a 3rd or 4th WR. Disinclined to cover him with a LB. But no rolled over safety or double team. That is praise of his athletic gifts and height, but its not an alteration of coverage. It means he faces nickel and dime more often. Which makes him more of a benefit to the run game than the pass in matchup terms.

He is athletic enough to present a matchup problem to whoever has him singled in coverage, which is what I take McCarthy's statement to mean. But he is not enough of a threat to alter the scheme. If the Packers are satisfied to see more nickel and dime (which helps the run game) that is fine. But its faint praise of a TE. Tyrone Davis used to draw that coverage.

On the negative side of the ledger, he doesn't block well enough to be of much use in line, which would be a primary way he could take advantage of the D's answer to his matchup problem. He doesn't beat zone coverage enough to alleviate the team problem with Cover 2 man because he is ineffective in the deep middle.

He is only a threat if he can catch something short and break a long run.

My issue with him is that he is a shell of his former self. He might still be more of a threat than any other TE on the roster, which is more a condemnation of the roster than a commendation of Finley.

[Brandon494]

He is only a threat if he can catch something short and break a long run.

My issue with him is that he is a shell of his former self. He might still be more of a threat than any other TE on the roster, which is more a condemnation of the roster than a commendation of Finley.

http://cdn.bleacherreport.net/images_root/article/media_slots/photos/001/063/647/2013-09-1512_08_151_original.gif

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-x16uUOX-wug/Uizz57aFJdI/AAAAAAAAAYs/B7RQD_Ntkf4/s1600/jermicheal1.gif

http://s3.amazonaws.com/br-cdn/temp_images/2013/10/20/FinleyTD.gif

[pbmax]

Well, you have succeeded in showing 2 of his three touchdowns and 3 of his 25 catches.

But where are the coverage changes? Each of those throws was within 5 yards of the LOS. If he was playing for Chip Kelly, they might design an offense for him on these routes. Or if he played for Kyle Shanahan, that would be the offense.

The Browns TD has a LB on him (in zone I think). The CB is with Boykin and a fake of a slant by Boykin keeps the safety deep. So in that video, Finley is an outlet receiver who benefits from D coordinators fear of Boykin. Now that is a game changer.

But he isn't helping altering the coverage as an outlet receiver. In fact, contrary to McCarthy's assertion, I bet each of the D coordinators would be happy to give up a reception to Rodgers and Co at that distance multiple times a game.

I think the whole Finley/Rodgers thing was over these routes. He didn't want to head deep into the teeth of cover 2 and wanted something short he could break. Its works for him here. I am not sure it works for the offense as a whole.

[mraynrand]

Sometimes, he is just flat out prone.

http://fikklefame.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/04/Jermichael-Finley.jpg

Jordy or James would have caught they ball! They NEVER dropped a pass.

Actually, Scott Wells never dropped a pass. BRING BLACK WELLS!!!

[HarveyWallbangers]

Think about what you are suggesting.

People more important than me (e.g. Mike McCarthy) are suggesting what I wrote. Like McCarthy said last year, nobody on the roster can replace what Finley gives them. There aren't that many guys around the league that can. Maybe 10 or so. It's why Thompson paid him $8M/year, and it's why Finley would have a lot of suitors if he was cleared to play.

You can cover average TEs with LBs. Guys like Finley exploit that. That alters coverage. Teams now have to move a safety over that player or tilt coverage towards that TE. That leaves better matchups for the likes of Nelson and Cobb (and Jennings, Driver, and Jones before that).

[Patler]

You were trying to downgrade him with that comment knowing he hasn't played a full 6 seasons and knowing how Rodgers likes to spread the ball around. Finley is still a top 8 TE in the league when healthy and the defense still has to account for him on the field. Now I've gone on the record and stated we should move on from Finley but to complain about him getting too much press about 2-3 short articles deserves an :roll:

Finley has played 6 seasons. Finley has played 70 games. No matter how you want to cut it, the result is the same. In six seasons he has achieved certain things.

I have reiterated over and over that his career has been altered by injuries. But no matter how you look at it, he is now entering his seventh season, the downside of a typical career. His career production is what it is, injuries or not. Part of an athletes impact for his team is his availability. A player has no impact standing on the sidelines. In judging any player's career, we can lament the fact that injuries were an overriding factor, but that does not change what his real impact was.

As pbmax pointed out, the Finley of 2011 - 2013 was nothing like the Finley we saw at the end of 2009 and the start of 2010. I think 2013 was a pivotal year for him. Defenses seemed to realize he was not the threat he looked like he might become. Sure, he had an impressive play from time to time; but he had as many excruciating drops. He was not reliable, and it was clear at times that Rodgers did not always have faith in him in crucial situations. In short, I don't think he impacted what defenses would do all that much anymore.

Yet, in March everything was a "twitter" for a few days about him signing with the Seahawks. In April, it was the Dolphins. Just a week ago it was the Vikings. Now the Packers. In each location fans become active, and sportswriters wrote as if it was important. If the past teaches us anything, it is that his impact will be muted, albeit with splashes of excitement.

[pbmax]

People more important than me (e.g. Mike McCarthy) are suggesting what I wrote. Like McCarthy said last year, nobody on the roster can replace what Finley gives them. There aren't that many guys around the league that can. Maybe 10 or so. It's why Thompson paid him $8M/year, and it's why Finley would have a lot of suitors if he was cleared to play.

You can cover average TEs with LBs. Guys like Finley exploit that. That alters coverage. Teams now have to move a safety over that player or tilt coverage towards that TE. That leaves better matchups for the likes of Nelson and Cobb (and Jennings, Driver, and Jones before that).

McCarthy has also said he doesn't pay attention to carries but YPC, also that sometimes just getting carries makes a difference more than YPC indicates, and that Allen Barbre looked great at tackle so your mileage may vary.

But in this specific case, I do not think he said what you said. McCarthy said he was a matchup problem. You said he changes how teams cover us. I say that he dictates less LB coverage and more DB coverage, which means more nickel and dime but no coverage changes. I have yet to see anyone roll coverage to or over him. And that the routes he is running don't help the other receivers like a deep middle threat would.

Finley is not pulling a safety from the middle of the field and leaving teams in Cover 1. Finley has played many games during the great Cover 2 Man crisis and hasn't yet broken teams of playing it. He does not make that difference anymore.

Like everything else with him, he should be doing it, but he isn't. And I was a true believer. Thought he would mature (and I think he has). Thought the drops would sort themselves out (he was better with it at the end of 2012 and most of 2013). Injury is tough because no one can tough out an ACL quickly.

But after that injury and even the year after the year of rehab, he no longer plays the same game.

[pbmax]

Serious question:

Brandon claimed Finley is a Top 8 TE when healthy. Harv thinks average TEs can be covered by a LB.

Where does Finley rank overall? Here are the Top 40 for the last two years according to Pro Football References' Approximate Value. This says nothing about their speed or athleticism, but focuses on their numbers compared to others in the League. Are there eight better than Jermichael? Are there 14 who don't see much linebacker coverage?

EDIT: I changed the filter to last 2 years and still active at TE. The first list, for 5 years, had a lot of old players on it and most of the good young TEs were at the bottom, at or below 40.

Here is the link if you think a different sample would be better: http://www.pro-football-reference.com/play-index/psl_finder.cgi?request=1&match=combined&year_min=2012&year_max=2014&season_start=1&season_end=-1&age_min=0&age_max=99&league_id=&team_id=&is_active=Y&is_hof=&pos_is_te=Y&c1stat=&c1comp=gt&c1val=&c2stat=&c2comp=gt&c2val=&c3stat=&c3comp=gt&c3val=&c4stat=&c4comp=gt&c4val=&order_by=av&draft=0&draft_year_min=1936&draft_year_max=2014&type=&draft_round_min=0&draft_round_max=99&draft_slot_min=1&draft_slot_max=500&draft_pick_in_round=0&draft_league_id=&draft_team_id=&college_id=all&conference=any&draft_pos_is_qb=Y&draft_pos_is_rb=Y&draft_pos_is_wr=Y&draft_pos_is_te=Y&draft_pos_is_rec=Y&draft_pos_is_t=Y&draft_pos_is_g=Y&draft_pos_is_c=Y&draft_pos_is_ol=Y&draft_pos_is_dt=Y&draft_pos_is_de=Y&draft_pos_is_dl=Y&draft_pos_is_ilb=Y&draft_pos_is_olb=Y&draft_pos_is_lb=Y&draft_pos_is_cb=Y&draft_pos_is_s=Y&draft_pos_is_db=Y&draft_pos_is_k=Y&draft_pos_is_p=Y#stats::none



Game Game Misc Misc Misc Misc
Rk Player From To Draft Tm Lg G GS Yrs PB AP1 AV
1 Alfred Morris 2012 2013 6-173 WAS NFL 32 32 2 1 0 20
2 Jimmy Graham 2012 2013 3-95 NOR NFL 31 20 2 1 1 19
3 Tony Gonzalez 2012 2013 1-13 ATL NFL 32 32 2 2 1 17
4 Jason Witten 2012 2013 3-69 DAL NFL 32 32 2 2 0 16
5 William Beatty 2012 2013 2-60 NYG NFL 32 31 2 0 0 15
6 Greg Olsen 2012 2013 1-31 CAR NFL 32 32 2 0 0 15
7 Martellus Bennett 2012 2013 2-61 TOT NFL 32 31 2 0 0 14
8 Vernon Davis 2012 2013 1-6 SFO NFL 31 31 2 1 0 14
9 Riley Reiff 2012 2013 1-23 DET NFL 32 24 2 0 0 14
10 Rob Gronkowski 2012 2013 2-42 NWE NFL 18 17 2 1 0 13
11 Donnie Avery 2012 2013 2-33 TOT NFL 32 29 2 0 0 12
12 Charles Brown 2012 2013 2-64 NOR NFL 26 17 2 0 0 12
13 Antonio Gates 2012 2013 SDG NFL 31 30 2 0 0 12
14 Heath Miller 2012 2013 1-30 PIT NFL 29 29 2 1 0 12
15 Jermaine Gresham 2012 2013 1-21 CIN NFL 30 29 2 1 0 11
16 Scott Chandler 2012 2013 4-129 BUF NFL 31 20 2 0 0 10
17 Jared Cook 2012 2013 3-89 TOT NFL 29 18 2 0 0 10
18 Kelvin Beachum 2012 2013 7-248 PIT NFL 22 17 2 0 0 9
19 Brent Celek 2012 2013 5-162 PHI NFL 31 29 2 0 0 9
20 Jermichael Finley 2012 2013 3-91 GNB NFL 22 19 2 0 0 9
Games Games Misc Misc Misc Misc
Rk Player From To Draft Tm Lg G GS Yrs PB AP1 AV
21 Zach Miller 2012 2013 2-38 SEA NFL 30 27 2 0 0 9
22 Brandon Myers 2012 2013 6-202 TOT NFL 32 30 2 0 0 9
23 Mike Adams 2012 2013 2-56 PIT NFL 25 16 2 0 0 8
24 Jason Avant 2012 2013 4-109 PHI NFL 30 20 2 0 0 8
25 Jordan Cameron 2012 2013 4-102 CLE NFL 29 20 2 1 0 8
26 Gabe Carimi 2012 2013 1-29 TOT NFL 30 17 2 0 0 8
27 Charles Clay 2012 2013 6-174 MIA NFL 30 24 2 0 0 8
28 Coby Fleener 2012 2013 2-34 CLT NFL 28 22 2 0 0 8
29 Kyle Rudolph 2012 2013 2-43 MIN NFL 24 24 2 1 0 8
30 Julius Thomas 2012 2013 4-129 DEN NFL 18 14 2 1 0 8
31 Delanie Walker 2012 2013 6-175 TOT NFL 31 15 2 0 0 8
32 Owen Daniels 2012 2013 4-98 HTX NFL 20 19 2 1 0 7
33 Jeff Linkenbach 2012 2013 CLT NFL 28 13 2 0 0 7
34 Brandon Pettigrew 2012 2013 1-20 DET NFL 28 25 2 0 0 7
35 Dennis Pitta 2012 2013 4-114 RAV NFL 20 6 2 0 0 7
36 Donald Stephenson 2012 2013 3-74 KAN NFL 32 14 2 0 0 7
37 Jacob Tamme 2012 2013 4-127 DEN NFL 32 9 2 0 0 7
38 Terrance Williams 2013 2013 3-74 DAL NFL 16 8 1 0 0 7
39 Dallas Clark 2012 2013 1-24 TOT NFL 28 7 2 0 0 6
40 Rob Housler 2012 2013 CRD NFL 28 19 2 0 0 6

[mraynrand]

I think 2013 was a pivotal year for him. Defenses seemed to realize he was not the threat he looked like he might become. Sure, he had an impressive play from time to time; but he had as many excruciating drops.

He had only one impressive play?

http://www.sportingcharts.com/nfl/stats/drops/2013/

[Brandon494]

Well, you have succeeded in showing 2 of his three touchdowns and 3 of his 25 catches.

But where are the coverage changes? Each of those throws was within 5 yards of the LOS. If he was playing for Chip Kelly, they might design an offense for him on these routes. Or if he played for Kyle Shanahan, that would be the offense.

The Browns TD has a LB on him (in zone I think). The CB is with Boykin and a fake of a slant by Boykin keeps the safety deep. So in that video, Finley is an outlet receiver who benefits from D coordinators fear of Boykin. Now that is a game changer.

But he isn't helping altering the coverage as an outlet receiver. In fact, contrary to McCarthy's assertion, I bet each of the D coordinators would be happy to give up a reception to Rodgers and Co at that distance multiple times a game.

I think the whole Finley/Rodgers thing was over these routes. He didn't want to head deep into the teeth of cover 2 and wanted something short he could break. Its works for him here. I am not sure it works for the offense as a whole.

Did you not see what I highlighted in bold? You said he was a shell of himself which is not true.

[mraynrand]

PBmax: that ranking seems to be right on the money. I'd probably take Fin over Celek and Olsen, but maybe not Miller. Miller too suffered from unavailability.

[mraynrand]

Did you not see what I highlighted in bold? You said he was a shell of himself which is not true.

He might be NOW, but he sure as hell wasn't against Cleveland, right up to the injury.

[pbmax]

He had only one impressive play?

http://www.sportingcharts.com/nfl/stats/drops/2013/

Holy crap, good find. Is this new or do my Google skills need to be refined?

[Brandon494]

As pbmax pointed out, the Finley of 2011 - 2013 was nothing like the Finley we saw at the end of 2009 and the start of 2010. I think 2013 was a pivotal year for him. Defenses seemed to realize he was not the threat he looked like he might become. Sure, he had an impressive play from time to time; but he had as many excruciating drops. He was not reliable, and it was clear at times that Rodgers did not always have faith in him in crucial situations. In short, I don't think he impacted what defenses would do all that much anymore.

He dropped one pass last season...

[mraynrand]

Holy crap, good find. Is this new or do my Google skills need to be refined?

I checked the previous years and it seemed to be right.

[mraynrand]

Tom Crabtree dropped 14% of his passes

[pbmax]

Did you not see what I highlighted in bold? You said he was a shell of himself which is not true.

That is not the Finley I remember. It is impressive, none-the-less, but not what this offense needs in my opinion.

I remember a TE who could sky above coverage to snag a contested ball. His catch radius was huge. And he went deep with aplomb and fearlessness. He was never quite the seam breaker that Chmura (Chmura would get blasted on those routes sometimes aided by a Favre cannon shot right into a defender) or Keith Jackson were. But he regularly threatened the deep middle of the field, enough that you didn't let him simply run past a LB while you simultaneously left the safety deep.

Now, teams simply put a coverage DB on him and leave the safeties deep to defense Nelson and Jones. No idea what happens this year without Jones.

Oddly, if there was a season he needs to be here, this year might be it. But that is due to attrition elsewhere.

[Brandon494]

Serious question:

Brandon claimed Finley is a Top 8 TE when healthy. Harv thinks average TEs can be covered by a LB.

Where does Finley rank overall? Here are the Top 40 for the last two years according to Pro Football References' Approximate Value. This says nothing about their speed or athleticism, but focuses on their numbers compared to others in the League. Are there eight better than Jermichael? Are there 14 who don't see much linebacker coverage?


Jimmy Graham
Gronk
V. Davis
Witten
J. Thomas
J Cameron
Finley
Gates

[Brandon494]

That is not the Finley I remember. It is impressive, none-the-less, but not what this offense needs in my opinion.

I remember a TE who could sky above coverage to snag a contested ball. His catch radius was huge. And he went deep with aplomb and fearlessness. He was never quite the seam breaker that Chmura (Chmura would get blasted on those routes sometimes aided by a Favre cannon shot right into a defender) or Keith Jackson were. But he regularly threatened the deep middle of the field, enough that you didn't let him simply run past a LB while you simultaneously left the safety deep.

Now, teams simply put a coverage DB on him and leave the safeties deep to defense Nelson and Jones. No idea what happens this year without Jones.

Oddly, if there was a season he needs to be here, this year might be it. But that is due to attrition elsewhere.

http://cdn2.sbnation.com/imported_assets/1533913/ikwejQvIGSFGB.gif

[pbmax]

What year is that with Jennings (and Harris) in the picture? I assume 2012. Also, how often do they call this anymore?

The one I remember from last year left him with a concussion.

[Brandon494]

I have reiterated over and over that his career has been altered by injuries. But no matter how you look at it, he is now entering his seventh season, the downside of a typical career.

He just turned 27...hes in his prime, that statement might be true if he was a RB.

[Fritz]

Funny, but it looks like it was "only" a linebacker that Finley beat, and the safety had no deep coverage so he could come up and make the tackle.

I'm of the opinion that Finley's presence in GB is no longer the threat it was, and so I am okay with letting him move on, to retirement or Seattle or wherever.

[pbmax]

Funny, but it looks like it was "only" a linebacker that Finley beat, and the safety had no deep coverage so he could come up and make the tackle.

I'm of the opinion that Finley's presence in GB is no longer the threat it was, and so I am okay with letting him move on, to retirement or Seattle or wherever.

If Finley and Rodgers were routinely making that play, I would break the bank for him (given a healthy neck). But that play is precisely what has been missing from the Packers passing game. That seam route and check downs in front of LBs not on 3rd down.

[Brandon494]

I believe we should move on without him as well but just find it funny how some of you don't see how talented this guy is.

[Brandon494]

If Finley and Rodgers were routinely making that play, I would break the bank for him (given a healthy neck). But that play is precisely what has been missing from the Packers passing game. That seam route and check downs in front of LBs not on 3rd down.

When was the last time this offense has been fully healthy? Like Harvey said the guys who really know football (TT and MM) know how valuable having a TE of Finley's skill set is to this team.

[pbmax]

I believe we should move on without him as well but just find it funny how some of you don't see how talented this guy is.

We see it. But its on its own agenda now. Kinda like a former QB.

Speaking of which, Rodgers shouldn't get off scot free. Mr. Go Deep Early and Often frequently misses opportunities to extend drives waiting for something big to break. Its not just Finley.

[Brandon494]

What year is that with Jennings (and Harris) in the picture? I assume 2012. Also, how often do they call this anymore?

The one I remember from last year left him with a concussion.

2012.

[mraynrand]

Funny, but it looks like it was "only" a linebacker that Finley beat, and the safety had no deep coverage so he could come up and make the tackle.

I'm of the opinion that Finley's presence in GB is no longer the threat it was, and so I am okay with letting him move on, to retirement or Seattle or wherever.


Of course any discussion depends on physical recovery and all that, but the worry about Fin is not just how good he is - which I think is a top ten TE - but what remains behind him. The kid from Oregon has potential to be, but the others really aren't in Fin's class. Some can block better of course, but so could Tom Crabtree, and he drops 1 of every 7 passes he sees - and he only gets 7 passes/year and is gone. The Packers stable of TEs without Fin thrill me about as much as Ed West did.

[pbmax]

When was the last time this offense has been fully healthy? Like Harvey said the guys who really know football (TT and MM) know how valuable having a TE of Finley's skill set is to this team.

They are never fully healthy, but Finley was around for most of 2012. And much of this was still going on. In fact, I think end of 2011 or early 2012 was when Rodgers and Finley finally decided where to meet the night before the game in the team hotel (Rodgers went and invited him if I recall the story).

Its was then that those shallow crosses and flares started to become his dominant route. I don't remember where I read that he was interested in those more than seam routes, but that info came out after QB and TE got on the same page.

If the Packers want to solve the Cover 2 conundrum, this kinda stuff has to end. You can't always run your favorite non-life-threatening routes versus good Ds.

[Patler]

He had only one impressive play?

http://www.sportingcharts.com/nfl/stats/drops/2013/

McGinn has him with three drops and the worst drop rate on the team last year, admittedly with a very small sample:


Jermichael Finley: It's 50-50 at best that he resumes his career in Green Bay, if anywhere. After suffering a concussion Sept. 22, he underwent a cervical fusion Nov. 14 for a spinal-cord contusion. It's a serious injury, not unlike other cases in which the Packers wouldn't run the risk of allowing players to play football again. By signing Finley to a short-term contract (two years) in February 2012, the Packers now are off the hook financially. Finley is hell-bent on resuming his career. However, he would collect $10 million tax-free from an insurance policy if he can't play. In 252 snaps, Finley dropped three of 34 balls, the worst drop rate on the team.

[Brandon494]

Lmao you really quoted McGinn to prove your point? You lose by default.

[Patler]

Lmao you really quoted McGinn to prove your point? You lose by default.

Aren't you the one who has argued McGinn as an NFL god, of sorts? Or am I think of another of our fellow ""Rats"?

I think McGinn does two thing very well:
- Accumulate and report the evaluations made by others regarding draftable players. (He asks questions and takes good notes.)
- Report stats at the end of the season (He can count and add.).

I don't put much stock in his opinion pieces, and his Packer insight is not very insightful.

[Brandon494]

I can't stand that ass clown.

[Patler]

He just turned 27...hes in his prime, that statement might be true if he was a RB.

I didn't say his career was over, I said he was entering the downside of a typical career. How many are still playing effectively at 33-34? Even if he is at the peak of his career, the end will come up soon enough. For the typical athlete, the second half of his career means even more injuries, and for Finley that could hasten the end of his career even earlier than for many, assuming it isn't already done.

[Patler]

I can't stand that ass clown.

Sorry, I must have been mistaking you for someone else I argued with a year or two ago about McGinn. I feel pretty much the same about him, except for the two things I mentioned above.

[Brandon494]

If we resigned him it will be a one year deal, two at the most so your point is mute. Also its not like hes had the same recurring injuries, they have just been bad luck. His first injury came in 2010 when Donald Lee fumbled and he hurt his knee trying to make a tackle. Then the neck injury last season when the Browns safety leading with the helmet hit.

[pbmax]

McGinn's numbers show how tough it is to get a good reading on drops. Rand's site has him with the second best rate on the team (Cobb is first) and only one drop.

Football Outsiders has him with a catch rate of 74% of targets, Nelson at 67%, Boykin at 59%, Jones at 63%, Cobb at 66 and White at 75%.

Its one area that eyeballs are better than stats, at least in the short term.

[Patler]

If we resigned him it will be a one year deal, two at the most so your point is mute. Also its not like hes had the same recurring injuries, they have just been bad luck. His first injury came in 2010 when Donald Lee fumbled and he hurt his knee trying to make a tackle. Then the neck injury last season when the Browns safety leading with the helmet hit.

No, its not mute; in fact, it isn't even moot! (Sorry, I shouldn't do that, but the "mute" vs. "moot" one always gets me for some reason! :lol: Now I have really opened myself up, haven't I???)

The last two year deal turned out being not so good for the team, in my opinion, and I don't want to see them waste a lot of cap space on him again. I know, I know, he had the 61 receptions in 2012, but the yardage wasn't there (sort of Bubba Franks-like) and there were the other issues mentioned previously.

One injury after another is just as bad as the same one over and over; but we can always hope that it will end, just as we do with Matthews and his hammies.

[Brandon494]

Whites stats are pointless since he only had 12 targets, Quarless was at 60.4% though.

[Brandon494]

No, its not mute; in fact, it isn't even moot! (Sorry, I shouldn't do that, but the "mute" vs. "moot" one always gets me for some reason! :lol: Now I have really opened myself up, haven't I???)

The last two year deal turned out being not so good for the team, in my opinion, and I don't want to see them waste a lot of cap space on him again. I know, I know, he had the 61 receptions in 2012, but the yardage wasn't there (sort of Bubba Franks-like) and there were the other issues mentioned previously.

One injury after another is just as bad as the same one over and over; but we can always hope that it will end, just as we do with Matthews and his hammies.

One injury after another? He didn't miss a game in 2011 and 2012. Also don't know how his last deal didn't turn out good for us by wasting a lot of cap? Who did we miss out on by signing Finley? Last I checked we are among the top in cap space in the NFL every year. Also if we didn't resign him who would have started at TE with Quarless injured in 2011 and 2012?

[pbmax]

Whites stats are pointless since he only had 12 targets, Quarless was at 60.4% though.

Both White and Cobb are under the qualifying line for season totals as FO calculates it.

[Patler]

One injury after another? He didn't miss a game in 2011 and 2012. Also don't know how his last deal didn't turn out good for us by wasting a lot of cap? Who did we miss out on by signing Finley? Last I checked we are among the top in cap space in the NFL every year. Also if we didn't resign him who would have started at TE with Quarless injured in 2011 and 2012?

I was referring to your statement about Finley suffering a number of different injuries rather than a recurring one. I didn't mean injuries following in rapid succession. (see my earlier posts about his injuries).

Regarding cap space, money wasted is money wasted; and since it now rolls forward it can always benefit you in the future, maybe even years later, just like a personal rainy day fund. Any player who underperforms what he is paid hurts the salary cap situation to some extent.

Had they not paid Finley, or not paid him so much, maybe they would have felt more comfortable paying Wells that same year (we can wonder if that would have been any better). The even more space now might have made them comfortable retaining EDS this year, and/or Jones; or extending both Nelson and Cobb (we don't know how those will turn out). Could they have done at least some those anyway? Sure, but the current group seems unlikely to push cap limits if they can help it.

[mraynrand]

Had they not paid Finley, or not paid him so much, maybe they would have felt more comfortable paying Wells that same year (we can wonder if that would have been any better).

It's just too tempting not to mention Wells! 0% drop rate! 0/5 on shoe untying in 2013 though. Needs improvement, but he only started 12 games. Injury Prone!

[woodbuck27]

In the 2011 season Jermichael Finley had by far his best season as a Green Bay Packer TE.

He dressed for 16 games and started 13.

He had 55 receptions for 767 yards a 13.9 Y/C Avg. and 8 TD's.

He had a long of 41 yards; 3.4 receptions/game and 47.9 yards/game.



In the remainder of his career he started "only" 35 games....or an average of seven (7) starts/season.

He had 168 Receptions for 2018 yards and "only" 12 TD's....or 2.4 TD's /season for five (5) seasons.

He averaged 3.36 receptions/game and 41.84 Y/G.

His stat's and injury record aren't impressive and he cannot be counted on as a blocker; yet he still manages to make the top ten of the NFL TE rankings as analysts see active TE's.

Active TE's !?

Isn't this one of the real issues and JerMichael Finley and seriously doesn't he make too much money for what he contributes?

Does he really expect that Ted Thompson will reward him with what he was being paid for a little better than 2 TD's of offense /season take away the 2011 season?

That to me is why? I consider JF back as a Green Bay Packer NO. 1 TE a long shot proposition.

[Bretsky]

I agree Finley does not deserve big money this year; he's been hurt too much and has produced too little.

With that being said, he's still one of the most talented TE's in the NFL and I'll take him back for a year.

But if we do take him back.....can we do a round 3 repick ? :)

This of our glut. Ryan Taylor is a perfect last TE because he's an ok blocker who excels at special teams. Quarless is a fine backup who IMO can play. Bostik I think has some talent and then we've got out 3rd round draft pick Rodgers who IMO TT really reached for. Seems to be a high character guy who lacks speed and upside. We already have those. I really think TT was going with the ND Tight End in round two but he got nabbed right in front of us.
If he falls to us than we probably end up with Moncrief in round 3 and Wist would be in heaven :)

[woodbuck27]

I agree Finley does not deserve big money this year; he's been hurt too much and has produced too little.

With that being said, he's still one of the most talented TE's in the NFL and I'll take him back for a year.

But if we do take him back.....can we do a round 3 repick ? :)

This of our glut. Ryan Taylor is a perfect last TE because he's an ok blocker who excels at special teams. Quarless is a fine backup who IMO can play. Bostik I think has some talent and then we've got out 3rd round draft pick Rodgers who IMO TT really reached for. Seems to be a high character guy who lacks speed and upside. We already have those. I really think TT was going with the ND Tight End in round two but he got nabbed right in front of us.
If he falls to us than we probably end up with Moncrief in round 3 and Wist would be in heaven :)

Good analysis B.

[Patler]

I agree Finley does not deserve big money this year; he's been hurt too much and has produced too little.

With that being said, he's still one of the most talented TE's in the NFL and I'll take him back for a year.

But if we do take him back.....can we do a round 3 repick ? :)

This of our glut. Ryan Taylor is a perfect last TE because he's an ok blocker who excels at special teams. Quarless is a fine backup who IMO can play. Bostik I think has some talent and then we've got out 3rd round draft pick Rodgers who IMO TT really reached for. Seems to be a high character guy who lacks speed and upside. We already have those. I really think TT was going with the ND Tight End in round two but he got nabbed right in front of us.
If he falls to us than we probably end up with Moncrief in round 3 and Wist would be in heaven :)

Don't forget the wild card in the TE game....Colt Lyerla.

Some more insight into his background from people who know him:

http://www.jsonline.com/sports/packers/packers-ready-to-roll-dice-on-colt-lyerla-b99279647z1-261042541.html

[Pugger]

He had only one impressive play?

http://www.sportingcharts.com/nfl/stats/drops/2013/

Did you guys see how many Jordy dropped?

[pbmax]

Don't forget the wild card in the TE game....Colt Lyerla.

Some more insight into his background from people who know him:

http://www.jsonline.com/sports/packers/packers-ready-to-roll-dice-on-colt-lyerla-b99279647z1-261042541.html

That article reads like nothing is resolved. Nothing at all. I am rooting for the kid, but I am not optimistic. Sports haven't saved him yet. Sports plus money might be worse.

[Patler]

That article reads like nothing is resolved. Nothing at all. I am rooting for the kid, but I am not optimistic. Sports haven't saved him yet. Sports plus money might be worse.

Seems sort of lost, doesn't he?

Who knows, GB is a rather unique environment for a professional athlete. Some think it will be good for him, yet he is portrayed as a very private person. I'm not sure the fishbowl of GB will be good. Doesn't seem to be any questions in the minds of those who know him that he has the talent to be a special player.

[run pMc]

Finley's a talented guy. There aren't a lot of TE's with his blend of size and athleticism. With the way GB spreads the ball around I don't think you're going to have a lot of eye-popping stats out of your TE. He was off to a good start last season (IIRC on pace for about 60rec & 800 yds) before the injury, and he would've been a boost to the offense once Rodgers went down.


If he clears the medical I think he's worth offering a short-term incentive laden contract, but I'm skeptical Finley takes that. There is a market for guys like him, but the injury history will scare teams. Still, it sounds like he wants to get paid big money, but just I don't see how any sane GM would do that. Once they sign all the draft picks they'll be about $11M under the cap. Knowing you have Jordy and Cobb extensions to do, what would you consider a reasonable contract offer for Finley?


I think if they sign Finley then Ryan Taylor, Bostick, Stoneburner, and Lyerla are likely fighting for one spot. Quarless will stick unless he bombs, and R.Rodgers will stick because he's an R3 pick. (Unless he sucks worse than Cory Rodgers.)
Maybe they can stow Lyerla on the PS.

[Fritz]

Finley's a talented guy. There aren't a lot of TE's with his blend of size and athleticism. With the way GB spreads the ball around I don't think you're going to have a lot of eye-popping stats out of your TE. He was off to a good start last season (IIRC on pace for about 60rec & 800 yds) before the injury, and he would've been a boost to the offense once Rodgers went down.


If he clears the medical I think he's worth offering a short-term incentive laden contract, but I'm skeptical Finley takes that. There is a market for guys like him, but the injury history will scare teams. Still, it sounds like he wants to get paid big money, but just I don't see how any sane GM would do that. Once they sign all the draft picks they'll be about $11M under the cap. Knowing you have Jordy and Cobb extensions to do, what would you consider a reasonable contract offer for Finley?


I think if they sign Finley then Ryan Taylor, Bostick, Stoneburner, and Lyerla are likely fighting for one spot. Quarless will stick unless he bombs, and R.Rodgers will stick because he's an R3 pick. (Unless he sucks worse than Cory Rodgers.)
Maybe they can stow Lyerla on the PS.


I am not sure I would be okay with even a short-term, incentive-laden contract. I think a one-year deal gives Finley a chance to show not only that he is and can stay healthy, but that he isn't gun-shy about going over the middle. But I am afraid he is afraid of going over the middle, and I'm afraid, too, that he won't be healthy enough to start the season. Thus, you'd be giving a guy a deal that would rob you of a younger guy on your roster, and would give you an effective and healthy Finley (if he is) for only a part of the season, and would essentially pay him to showcase himself for other teams. And I'm not sure Lyerla would last on PS. Once he's in Green Bay and shows stability and ability, someone would snatch him off the PS.

But I still like the post. It's thoughtful.

[Brandon494]

That article reads like nothing is resolved. Nothing at all. I am rooting for the kid, but I am not optimistic. Sports haven't saved him yet. Sports plus money might be worse.

Just because someone stumbles and loses their way, it doesn't mean they're lost forever.

http://rfmp.files.wordpress.com/2010/05/professorx.jpg

[Just Jeff]

Not sure if someone should start a thread about Finley's 58th medical opinion, but it looks like he got what he didn't get the prior 57 times.

[Brandon494]

Regarding cap space, money wasted is money wasted; and since it now rolls forward it can always benefit you in the future, maybe even years later, just like a personal rainy day fund. Any player who underperforms what he is paid hurts the salary cap situation to some extent.

Had they not paid Finley, or not paid him so much, maybe they would have felt more comfortable paying Wells that same year (we can wonder if that would have been any better). The even more space now might have made them comfortable retaining EDS this year, and/or Jones; or extending both Nelson and Cobb (we don't know how those will turn out). Could they have done at least some those anyway? Sure, but the current group seems unlikely to push cap limits if they can help it.

So by resigning Finley we missed out on two average centers who got overpaid. Sorry bro but TT was not spending that much money on those guys even if we didn't sign Finley. TT is one of the best in the league at handling cap space and we have more than enough room to resign Nelson and Cobb. Finley's contract did not set this team back in anyway.

[Just Jeff]

So by resigning Finley we missed out on two average centers who got overpaid. Sorry bro but TT was not spending that much money on those guys even if we didn't sign Finley. TT is one of the best in the league at handling cap space and we have more than enough room to resign Nelson and Cobb. Finley's contract did not set this team back in anyway.

I agree that cap management is a complete non issue as it has never, in the history of the NFL, ever caused the league to impose sanctions for exceeding it but...

Wells > Saturday
Wells > EDS
Wells > all other centers that have never taken a snap in the NFL.
Wells > Average

[Brandon494]

I agree that cap management is a complete non issue as it has never, in the history of the NFL, ever caused the league to impose sanctions for exceeding it but...

Wells > Saturday
Wells > EDS
Wells > all other centers that have never taken a snap in the NFL.
Wells > Average

Wells was a good center but I'm not paying him to be one of the highest centers in the NFL like the Rams did. Hes 33 now and has been injured each season since leaving the Packers.

[Just Jeff]

Wells was a good center but I'm not paying him to be one of the highest centers in the NFL like the Rams did. Hes 33 now and has been injured each season since leaving the Packers.

Who is talking about signing him now? When he was on the Packers he was good. Since he left the team, the position has been not good. Since he left, we have the #1 QB in terms of time on his ass. I'd have kept Wells.

Good > not good.

[Brandon494]

Our centers have struggled in the run game not in pass protection, smart GMs don't pay centers past their prime nearly 6M a year. There is a reason the #1 rated center didn't go until the 3rd round in this years draft.

[Guiness]

Wells was a good center but I'm not paying him to be one of the highest centers in the NFL like the Rams did. Hes 33 now and has been injured each season since leaving the Packers.

That has to be making the Rams crazy, I'm surprised they haven't accused the Packers of spiking the dude's drink on his way out the door! Wells missed more time due to injury in 2 seasons in St-Louis than he did all the time he was in Green Bay.

[red]

so finley's quack doctor who sprinkeled some moon dust on him and made him walk counter clockwise for a full day, instead of doing the normal procedure, has now deemed him cured

i'm shocked

still doesn't mean a team will come anywhere near touching him. i think collins has been deemed "fixed" by his doctor too

and like PFT brought up, and most of us know already, he has 10 million reasons to not ever play again. no team is gonna give his broken drop happy ass a huge contract right now, at best he'll get a few million dollar one year "prove you can do it" deal

if its me, i take the 10 million and go plop down on a beach somewhere next to a bar. or buy a bar on a beach

[Brandon494]

if its me, i take the 10 million and go plop down on a beach somewhere next to a bar. or buy a bar on a beach

You mean you wouldn't want to leave in Green Bay? :-)

[red]

You mean you wouldn't want to leave in Green Bay? :-)

fuck off, i hate snow

[woodbuck27]

Who is talking about signing him now? When he was on the Packers he was good. Since he left the team, the position has been not good. Since he left, we have the #1 QB in terms of time on his ass. I'd have kept Wells.

Good > not good.

You nailed it.

[woodbuck27]

Not sure if someone should start a thread about Finley's 58th medical opinion, but it looks like he got what he didn't get the prior 57 times.

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2014/05/29/agent-jermichael-finley-has-received-clearance-from-his-doctor/

Agent: Jermichael Finley has received clearance from his doctor

Posted by Mike Florio on May 29, 2014, 12:55 PM EDT

" Packers tight end Jermichael Finley finally has gotten some good news. But it doesn’t mean he’ll soon be joining a new team. Or rejoining his former team, the Packers."

PACKERS !

[Patler]

So by resigning Finley we missed out on two average centers who got overpaid. Sorry bro but TT was not spending that much money on those guys even if we didn't sign Finley. TT is one of the best in the league at handling cap space and we have more than enough room to resign Nelson and Cobb. Finley's contract did not set this team back in anyway.

Those were just examples of what maybe could have been done. Perhaps more importantly, with a bunch more cap space, Tt might have felt comfortable signing a F A. Sure, he COULD have anyway, but I really believe TT has a comfort level of space which he is willing to spend up to, but not over except when absolutely necessary. With Finley's dollars he might have signed that years version of Peppers or Woodson.

Wasted cap dollars is always wasted, and matters long term.

[pbmax]

I agree that cap management is a complete non issue as it has never, in the history of the NFL, ever caused the league to impose sanctions for exceeding it but...

Wells > Saturday
Wells > EDS
Wells > all other centers that have never taken a snap in the NFL.
Wells > Average

13 missed games makes it a dicey signing. EDS as backup isn't as good as EDS with starting experience.

[pbmax]

Just because someone stumbles and loses their way, it doesn't mean they're lost forever.

http://rfmp.files.wordpress.com/2010/05/professorx.jpg

I agree. But the idea in the article that a change of location will solve issues seems very naive. Football hasn't fixed him yet. He needs something else.

[Joemailman]

I agree. But the idea in the article that a change of location will solve issues seems very naive. Football hasn't fixed him yet. He needs something else.

I agree. I think he's probably okay for now because he's involved with football. The real test will be next Jan/Feb when everybody goes their separate ways for 2-3 months.

[mraynrand]

Good > not good.

I won't argue this one with you.

[vince]

I agree Finley does not deserve big money this year; he's been hurt too much and has produced too little.

With that being said, he's still one of the most talented TE's in the NFL and I'll take him back for a year.

But if we do take him back.....can we do a round 3 repick ? :)

This of our glut. Ryan Taylor is a perfect last TE because he's an ok blocker who excels at special teams. Quarless is a fine backup who IMO can play. Bostik I think has some talent and then we've got out 3rd round draft pick Rodgers who IMO TT really reached for. Seems to be a high character guy who lacks speed and upside. We already have those. I really think TT was going with the ND Tight End in round two but he got nabbed right in front of us.
If he falls to us than we probably end up with Moncrief in round 3 and Wist would be in heaven :)At this point we don't know whether Lyerla or Finley will be available and we knew even less on draft day in terms of whether Lyerla would be offered a UDFA contract by another team. What we did know at that point was that the top 5 TE's went quickly and Rodgers was likely TT's last value TE - the next one wasn't drafted until the 7th round so there was very likely a big drop on TT's board right at that spot. You say he's a reach but it's pretty clear the guy who makes all the money projecting football talent and has all the first-hand info likes the coach's son who has great hands and big YAC production.

So with all that we knew and didn't know, combined with what we still don't know, the selection of the TE at that point would appear to have been a prudent move. Now we'll have to see if Rodgers can play as TT projects or if the high-risk and reward gambles pay off (or are even signable yet) which then might make the Rodgers selection a prudent move for the team that ends up being mitigated by even greater talent coming to the fore. No matter how it turns out TT has made significant attempts to strengthen the TE position. We'll know a little bit more about if he's succeeded in a few months.

If he's successful, what does it matter if it's Finley, Leyerla, Rodgers or some combination. I sure am glad he didn't put all his eggs in either the Finley or Lyerla basket at this point. What a duo they could make but I'd applaud a draft-day buffer to help mitigate those pretty significant availability risks all day long even if the best case scenario were to come to fruition.

[Brandon494]

Wasted cap dollars is always wasted, and matters long term.

You keep saying that so I guess every player in the NFL who gets injured is wasted cap dollars. Guess Rodgers missing 7 games last season was wasted cap space too, we could have used that money to resign Crabtree.

[woodbuck27]

Those were just examples of what maybe could have been done. Perhaps more importantly, with a bunch more cap space, Tt might have felt comfortable signing a F A. Sure, he COULD have anyway, but I really believe TT has a comfort level of space which he is willing to spend up to, but not over except when absolutely necessary. With Finley's dollars he might have signed that years version of Peppers or Woodson.

Wasted cap dollars is always wasted, and matters long term.

If Jermichael Finley is ever declared ready to return as a Green Bay Packers by the teams doctor. As I view it as a fan:

It's wisdom for TT to offer him much less than the money he was paid in his last contract. Looking at his availability and production after the 2011 season (Jermichael Finley's career season). Should Ted Thompson return JerMichael Finley to the roster at a price tag in the order of $8 Million$ / season for whatever duration?

I say no way that should happen.

I hope that TT moves on past JerMichael Finley; that Mike McCarthy let's go in his mind of this TE.

Can I predict that this will be the case in the end? Do I see a flip side?

Mike McCarthy. MM seems to be "in love" with JerMichael Finley. If that's the case then that might influence Ted Thompson to extend JF and even overpay him in so doing.

This is an interesting watch. maybe one of the more interesting watch's of so many in this remaining exciting off season as we witness the 2014 Green Bay Packer roster evolve.

GO PACK GO !

[denverYooper]

You keep saying that so I guess every player in the NFL who gets injured is wasted cap dollars. Guess Rodgers missing 7 games last season was wasted cap space too, we could have used that money to resign Crabtree.

Rodgers has a history of production that merits the money spent on his services -- MVP, Superbowl MVP + ring, NFL record QBR.

Finley has ne'er but dwell'd in the formless mist knownst to his well-wishers as "potential"

[Patler]

You keep saying that so I guess every player in the NFL who gets injured is wasted cap dollars. Guess Rodgers missing 7 games last season was wasted cap space too, we could have used that money to resign Crabtree.

It will always happen with one player or another in a given year. The issue is not with respect to a specific year, as with Rodgers last year. The problem comes up with players who are frequently out or otherwise underperform over the term of a contract. For some it is because of injuries, others just don't perform up to the level of their pay. I think Finley falls into both categories. Injuries are a concern and inconsistency is, too. The Packers did not get adequate value from him for both reasons over the term of his last short contract.

Wasted dollars are wasted dollars, but sometimes it can't really be avoided. Nick Collins last contracted had a lot of wasted dollars, but signing the contract was still the right thing to do. I expect Rodgers will still give meaningful value for his contract, but if he were to sustain a career ending injury the contract was still the right thing to do, in spite of the cap waste that would result

I think there were warning signs about Finley, as as there were about Jennings and Matthews. Then there's Bulaga............

[Tony Oday]

Just release him.

[MadScientist]

Just release him.

They don't have to, his contract was completed and he is a FA. Hopefully if he actually does sign it will be elsewhere.

[Tony Oday]

whoops thought he had a year left...well then who cares? He is one of the most overrated Packers in recent memory.

[mraynrand]

whoops thought he had a year left...well then who cares? He is one of the most overrated Packers in recent memory.

doesn't seem like it from this thread

[denverYooper]

doesn't seem like it from this thread

He's no Scott Wells, that's for sure.

[Pugger]

But the thought of having him and Colt on opposite ends of the LOS is intriguing...

[gbgary]

i think i might sign him for a year at a low price and see what happens. our TE situation is soooo dicey. could be great...could be horrible.

[woodbuck27]

i think i might sign him for a year at a low price and see what happens. our TE situation is soooo dicey. could be great...could be horrible.

It's that signing him at a low price thingy that isn't realistic.

[Bretsky]

I've always been a fan of bringing Jermichael Finley back because he has elite talent; physically he's a man among boys
But I also feel he has a bit of Brett Favre in him in that he's an ego maniac who clearly wants to feel love, and needed
That also leads to him always going for the highest dollar he can get; that was in Green Bay.

But production wise, lets call a spade a spade. Green Bay got screwed on the last deal
But I get the vibe TT is going to give him tough love this round and it's not going to end well
If he takes a huge wage cut I get the feeling its with a team like Seattle.

[MadtownPacker]

But the thought of having him and Colt on opposite ends of the LOS is intriguing...
How about the thought of them in opposites sides of the locker room? Don't see Finley as the type to take sharing the spotlight very well. He has already shown how he can be. We really want the his influence on a guy who has his own issues?

[Brandon494]

How about the thought of them in opposites sides of the locker room? Don't see Finley as the type to take sharing the spotlight very well. He has already shown how he can be. We really want the his influence on a guy who has his own issues?

Obviously his teammates and coaches don't have any problems with him since they all want him back. Exactly what bad influence could Finley have on a guy like Colt? I'm dying to know. You guys need to stop judging Finley for not being a perfect choir boy. Dude has never been arrested and he works his ass off. Yea hes not the smartest guy, hes pretty much your typical jock ,but that doesn't make him a bad guy.

This guy is such a cancer to the locker room...
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BkT9gl1CIAAIVV-.jpg:large

[Brandon494]

But production wise, lets call a spade a spade. Green Bay got screwed on the last deal

So we got screwed on the Rodgers and Matthews deals also? I mean both those guys missed half the season too.

[gbgary]

So we got screwed on the Rodgers and Matthews deals also? I mean both those guys missed half the season too.

touche. :)

fin's got to prove he's really back. i don't think anyone (in their right mind) is going to throw even medium-money at him right out of the gate. a one year 'show us' deal isn't out of the question. don't think he'll be "screwing" anyone this season. :)

[Patler]

So we got screwed on the Rodgers and Matthews deals also? I mean both those guys missed half the season too.

Uh....No, not yet. How many years does each have left under their contracts to return adequate value?
How many years does Finley have left? Oh, wait...NONE.


But, I repeat myself.......................:


It will always happen with one player or another in a given year. The issue is not with respect to a specific year, as with Rodgers last year. The problem comes up with players who are frequently out or otherwise underperform over the term of a contract. For some it is because of injuries, others just don't perform up to the level of their pay. I think Finley falls into both categories. Injuries are a concern and inconsistency is, too. The Packers did not get adequate value from him for both reasons over the term of his last short contract.

Wasted dollars are wasted dollars, but sometimes it can't really be avoided. Nick Collins last contracted had a lot of wasted dollars, but signing the contract was still the right thing to do. I expect Rodgers will still give meaningful value for his contract, but if he were to sustain a career ending injury the contract was still the right thing to do, in spite of the cap waste that would result

I think there were warning signs about Finley, as as there were about Jennings and Matthews. Then there's Bulaga............

[pbmax]

Finley, Kuhn, Perry and who is the other dude?

[Brandon494]

Uh....No, not yet. How many years does each have left under their contracts to return adequate value?
How many years does Finley have left? Oh, wait...NONE.

No shit, none of the deals screwed us, that was the point.

[Brandon494]

Finley, Kuhn, Perry and who is the other dude?

No clue

[Patler]

No shit, none of the deals screwed us, that was the point.

Finley's deal was a big waste to the Packers. Two years, over and done with, and $14 Million (or whatever) wasted. They got little of nothing on year two, and his inconsistency in year 1 made him average in performance, yet he was paid like an elite TE over a two year period.

Matthews and Rodgers may not have provided expected value last year, but it doesn't make their contracts wastes, because they have years to make it up.

The $14 M paid to Finley was a big waste of cap space.

[Brandon494]

Finley's deal was a big waste to the Packers. Two years, over and done with, and $14 Million (or whatever) wasted. They got little of nothing on year two, and his inconsistency in year 1 made him average in performance, yet he was paid like an elite TE over a two year period.

Matthews and Rodgers may not have provided expected value last year, but it doesn't make their contracts wastes, because they have years to make it up.

The $14 M paid to Finley was a big waste of cap space.

Once again it was not a waste of money, I'm done arguing with you on such a stupid issue as wasted cap space.

[Patler]

Once again it was not a waste of money, I'm done arguing with you on such a stupid issue as wasted cap space.

Ya, wasted cap space is meaningless. Mike Sherman as GM proved that, didn't he???

[Brandon494]

Ya, wasted cap space is meaningless. Mike Sherman as GM proved that, didn't he???

You are acting like Finley is Joe Johnson. BTW who did we have to cut to sign Finley? What impact player did we fail to get because we signed Finley? Who would have started at TE if we did not sign Finley? Did you forget who our GM is? He almost never signs big name FAs, he uses the money to keep our own talent which is what he did with Finley. He was average his first year of his contract in which he only made 5M. Last season he looked like he was on his way to a Pro Bowl season before the injury. We might have paid a few million extra on him just like we did with Rodgers, Clay, and Shields but to say his whole contact was a waste of money is foolish.

[Patler]

They would have been better off not spending the $ on Finley.

[Brandon494]

They would have been better off not spending the $ on Finley.

You are wrong, answer my questions then. You are just being a hard headed at this point because of your dislike for the player.

[Patler]

BTW who did we have to cut to sign Finley? What impact player did we fail to get because we signed Finley? Who would have started at TE if we did not sign Finley? Did you forget who our GM is? He almost never signs big name FAs, he uses the money to keep our own talent which is what he did with Finley.

Who did he not sign? How the heck am I supposed to know that? ..... Mario Williams. The extra cap would have convinced TT to go after Mario Williams.

[Brandon494]

Who did he not sign? How the heck am I supposed to know that? ..... Mario Williams. The extra cap would have convinced TT to go after Mario Williams.

:roll:

Oh you mean his 100 million dollar deal? Give it a rest man.

[Patler]

You are wrong, answer my questions then. You are just being a hard headed at this point because of your dislike for the player.

I don't dislike the player. I just think he was well over-paid under his last contract.

[Patler]

:roll:

Oh you mean his 100 million dollar deal? Give it a rest man.

Yup, he was just 14 million short of signing Williams.
Damn, could had Williams......

[Brandon494]

Yup, he was just 14 million short of signing Williams.
Damn, could had Williams......

Yea then we couldn't have resigned Rodgers or Clay....

[Brandon494]

I don't dislike the player. I just think he was well over-paid under his last contract.

YOU might think so but one of the best GMs in the league doesn't. Finley made 5M in the first year of his deal in which you are complaining about him having an average year even though he was top 8 in receptions for TEs. Last season he made 8M and looked like he was on his way to a Pro Bowl season. FYI you complaining about Finley being overpaid while Rodgers and Clay both made over 20M last season.

[HarveyWallbangers]

Finley is a good player. He was overpaid. Not the only guy on the team that's been overpaid (see Tramon, Hawk, Raji, Clay and Rodgers last year because of injuries, Burnett, etc.).

[Brandon494]

Finley is a good player. He was overpaid. Not the only guy on the team that's been overpaid (see Tramon, Hawk, Raji, Clay and Rodgers last year because of injuries, Burnett, etc.).

All that wasted cap space.

[Patler]

YOU might think so but one of the best GMs in the league doesn't. Finley made 5M in the first year of his deal in which you are complaining about him having an average year even though he was top 8 in receptions for TEs. Last season he made 8M and looked like he was on his way to a Pro Bowl season. FYI you complaining about Finley being overpaid while Rodgers and Clay both made over 20M last season.

I think it makes more sense to look at value over the life of a contract. In any one year an injured player is overpaid if he is injured early, but over the life of the contract he can still return reasonable value to the team.

Finley was not worth $14 million over the course of last contract.

[woodbuck27]

Finley's deal was a big waste to the Packers. Two years, over and done with, and $14 Million (or whatever) wasted. They got little of nothing on year two, and his inconsistency in year 1 made him average in performance, yet he was paid like an elite TE over a two year period.

Matthews and Rodgers may not have provided expected value last year, but it doesn't make their contracts wastes, because they have years to make it up.

The $14 M paid to Finley was a big waste of cap space.

Yes ...I agree but Jermichael Finley wasn't the only one to be treated so richly.

The same goes for AJ Hawk throughout his career in Green Bay.

Ted Thompson was headed in the same direction with BJ Raji IMO and he didn't exactly get that one right in the end.

I feel that BJ Raji was overpaid for this last "one year contract" given his lousy play and effort on the field last season, and especially that as the season wore on.

[pbmax]

You could make a case for Raji except that was all on his rookie deal and no one was complaining about him in 09-10.

You can make a case for Matthews if injuries keep him on the bench for an average of 4 games a season. He is on his second deal.

I don't think there is much case for Rodgers after one injured year.

I think those stand apart from Finley And I don't think Finley's case is egregious. It was $14 mil but only covered two years. Every contract carries risk, but in football, the risk is mainly how long you wish to wait for the player to deliver. He was fine but not spectacular in Year 1. Year 2 was wiped out by that injury.

So wasted? Maybe, but it was worth the risk. Unlike the last go around, I am no longer sure he is worth the risk, depending on the size of the deal. I think he is going to get a one year prove-it deal to show he has returned to health. But even then I am not sure he is going to be an elite threat.

[woodbuck27]

You could make a case for Raji except that was all on his rookie deal and no one was complaining about him in 09-10.

You can make a case for Matthews if injuries keep him on the bench for an average of 4 games a season. He is on his second deal.

I don't think there is much case for Rodgers after on injured year.

I think those stand apart from Finley And I don't think Finley's case is egregious. It was $14 mil but only covered two years. Every contract carries risk, but in football, the risk is mainly how long you wish to wait for the player to deliver. He was fine but not spectacular in Year 1. Year 2 was wiped out by that injury.

So wasted? Maybe, but it was worth the risk. Unlike the last go around, I am no longer sure he is worth the risk, depending on the size of the deal. I think he is going to get a one year prove-it deal to show he has returned to health. But even then I am not sure he is going to be an elite threat.

I hope that Jermichael Finley decides on a deal elsewhere.

[run pMc]

I wouldn't say it was wasted money. I would say he underperformed his contract, but that was due to injuries, not his play on the field.

I don't think it was a bad signing.

I don't think he will get a contract with the same (or better) money in GB or elsewhere, though.

[woodbuck27]

I wouldn't say it was wasted money. I would say he underperformed his contract, but that was due to injuries, not his play on the field.

I don't think it was a bad signing.

I don't think he will get a contract with the same (or better) money in GB or elsewhere, though.

I believe your correct.

Jermichael Finley needs to grow up fast.

[pbmax]

I wouldn't say it was wasted money. I would say he underperformed his contract, but that was due to injuries, not his play on the field.

I don't think it was a bad signing.

I don't think he will get a contract with the same (or better) money in GB or elsewhere, though.

You know, that raises an interesting question, one that Advanced NFL Stats looked at a bit in relation to the salary cap.

Considering all players, what does $7 mil per year get you from the TE?

[pbmax]

Seahawks out of chase for Finley (http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2014/06/01/seahawks-out-of-chase-for-finley/)

Seahawks out. Packers, Giants and maybe the Patriots are in.

Possibly.

[Brandon494]

Seahawks out of chase for Finley (http://packerrats.com/showthread.php?26778-Finley-getting-57th-opinion-on-his-neck-today&p=788005#post788005)

Seahawks out. Packers, Giants and maybe the Patriots are in.

Possibly.

Haha need to fix your link.

[red]

Haha need to fix your link.

could have been worse. he could have linked the gay porn site he had just visited

[Bretsky]

So we got screwed on the Rodgers and Matthews deals also? I mean both those guys missed half the season too.

I'm looking at the full contract. Not just last year. Jermichael made out well when considering his production versus what we paid over the deal......and that is from a guy who has been on the side of singing him if possible and from a guy who was originally happy that we paid him what hhas turned out to be too much.

I'm just looking at the bigger picture and looking at actual numbers. It was a bad deal IMO for Green Bay.

With all of that being said, since I still have some infinite blind faith that the talent may turn into production, I would have no problem if Green Bay brings him back again.

In the end Finley will go to the team that pays him the most IMO

[Brandon494]

I'm looking at the full contract. Not just last year. Jermichael made out well when considering his production versus what we paid over the three year deal. Robbery...and that is from a guy who has been on the side of singing him if possible and from a guy who was originally happy that we paid him what hhas turned out to be too much.

I wasn't being serious with the comment. BTW Jermichael only signed a 2 year deal and that was the reason for paying him a little extra. The deal was good for both sides at the time but obviously Finley made out better in the deal. Still was far from a waste of money since they two years he started on offense we were top 5 in offense.

[pbmax]

Haha need to fix your link.

Thanks for the heads up.

[red]

In the end Finley will go to the team that pays him the most IMO

and that team will end up disappointed in the end IMO

[Tony Oday]

He should take his insurance payout of $10 mil and quit.

[mraynrand]

could have been worse. he could have linked the gay porn site he had just visited

no, that would be The Skinbasket

[Bretsky]

OK....let's have some fun with this. Write down how much you'd pay on a one year deal for Finley. If the answer is zero......just say PASS... I'm not in the pass group but I'm not sure where my figure is. I'm guessing around 3 MIL range .......

[mraynrand]

Haha need to fix your sausage link.


doesn't this belong in the Clinton-Dix thread?

[mraynrand]

OK....let's have some fun with this. Write down how much you'd pay on a one year deal for Finley. If the answer is zero......just say PASS... I'm not in the pass group but I'm not sure where my figure is. I'm guessing around 3 MIL range .......

If some doctor other than the Kansas City Quack says it's OK, I'd pay him 5 mil, straight up one year contract.

[pbmax]

$4 million, one year. $1 million tied to game day roster bonuses.

[woodbuck27]

I'm looking at the full contract. Not just last year. Jermichael made out well when considering his production versus what we paid over the deal......and that is from a guy who has been on the side of singing him if possible and from a guy who was originally happy that we paid him what hhas turned out to be too much.

I'm just looking at the bigger picture and looking at actual numbers. It was a bad deal IMO for Green Bay.

With all of that being said, since I still have some infinite blind faith that the talent may turn into production, I would have no problem if Green Bay brings him back again.

In the end Finley will go to the team that pays him the most IMO

For sure that's the way it will go down.

So which contending teams have the CAP space to even possibly and realistically be able to sign Jermichael Finley?

[mraynrand]

With a healthy Collins and Finley, Packers would have won back-to-back superbowls.

[woodbuck27]

With a healthy Collins and Finley, Packers would have won back-to-back superbowls.

Woulda...Coulda...Shoulda.

[Patler]

With a healthy Collins and Finley, Packers would have won back-to-back superbowls.

Well, maybe Collins. He was a big part of the one they did win. Finley, on the other hand was not much of a factor in the SB winning season, but was around for all of the following season, wasn't he?

[pbmax]

Well, maybe Collins. He was a big part of the one they did win. Finley, on the other hand was not much of a factor in the SB winning season, but was around for all of the following season, wasn't he?

Pro Football Reference has him down for 16 games, 13 starts. Might be formation more than injuries.

[Brandon494]

$4 million, one year. $1 million tied to game day roster bonuses.

Sounds about right.

[woodbuck27]

http://www.rotoworld.com/articles/nfl/47272/69/post-draft-dynasty-ranks---te?pg=2

Post-Draft Dynasty Ranks - TE

Tuesday, May 27, 2014


Ranked 26th Gavin Escobar DAL Age 23.5 Drafted 2013-2


Ranked 27th Colt Lyerla GB Age 21.8 .... 2014-UFA


Ranked 28th Jermichael Finley FA age = 27.4 Drafted 2008-3

[HarveyWallbangers]

Well, maybe Collins. He was a big part of the one they did win. Finley, on the other hand was not much of a factor in the SB winning season, but was around for all of the following season, wasn't he?

Yes, Finley was around for the 15-1 season, and the Packers offense was much better.

2009 - Offense = 28.8 points/game; Defense = 18.6 points/game (gave up 51 points in playoff loss)
2010 - Offense = 24.3 points/game; Defense = 15.0 points/game (gave up 19 points/game in playoffs; never more than 25 points)
2011 - Offense = 35.0 points/game; Defense = 22.4 points/game (gave up 37 points in playoff loss)
2012 - Offense = 27.1 points/game; Defense = 21.0 points/game (gave up 45 points in playoff loss)

Seems to me like the Packers offense was much better off when Finley was healthy.

[mraynrand]

Well, maybe Collins. He was a big part of the one they did win. Finley, on the other hand was not much of a factor in the SB winning season, but was around for all of the following season, wasn't he?


'back-to-back' - get it fellas?

[Patler]

Yes, Finley was around for the 15-1 season, and the Packers offense was much better.

2009 - Offense = 28.8 points/game; Defense = 18.6 points/game (gave up 51 points in playoff loss)
2010 - Offense = 24.3 points/game; Defense = 15.0 points/game (gave up 19 points/game in playoffs; never more than 25 points)
2011 - Offense = 35.0 points/game; Defense = 22.4 points/game (gave up 37 points in playoff loss)
2012 - Offense = 27.1 points/game; Defense = 21.0 points/game (gave up 45 points in playoff loss)

Seems to me like the Packers offense was much better off when Finley was healthy.

I don't think you can compare a year with Finley to one without him, and conclude that he was responsible for the differences. The offense changes, the team is different. I think a better comparison can be made looking at the years in which he was injured. You can compare how they performed before and after he was injured. In 2010, his departure didn't seem to impact scoring, in 2013 scoring without him dropped by about 3 points/game, but Rodgers was also out most of those same games, and I don't think it is extreme to think the loss of Rodgers had more to do with it than the loss of Finley.

In my opinion, Finley should be making much more of an impact on the offense than he has.

[Patler]

$4 million, one year. $1 million tied to game day roster bonuses.
Sounds about right.

I would sign that deal with Finley.

[Tony Oday]

Let him walk. Go forward with a number one that can catch and doesn't spout off in the media.

[Rutnstrut]

Let him walk. Go forward with a number one that can catch and doesn't spout off in the media.

Absolutely, Fin wasn't that great before the injury. Even if they could get him on the cheap, he's never going to be the player he was before the injury, both physically and mentally.

[run pMc]

Not sure what I'd offer Finley. Maybe in the 1 year for 3-4M range. Something that wouldn't prevent me from making good offers to Jordy and Cobb.

That said, I think Finley's gone. GB leans more conservatively with neck injuries, plus they have Quarless, Bostick, Taylor, Rodgers, Lyerla and Perillo. They can find 4 TEs from that group; the question is whether they can find one that is a pass catching threat who can stay healthy. Lyerla is probably the only one who has the athleticism to scare a Cover 2 defense.

[pbmax]

I am seriously conflicted about whether this makes me think Finley is a better option or that its clear he is done.

ProFootballTalk ‏@ProFootballTalk 20s
Even though transaction report suggests Jermichael Finley visited Patriots on Monday, it happened on Friday.

[pbmax]

Jason Wilde ‏@jasonjwilde 20m
RT @Edwerderespn: Hearing Jermichael Finley visit to Patriots was exclusively for medical evaluation of his spinal fusion surgery.

[Fritz]

That would be opinion #58, then.

[pbmax]

That would be opinion #58, then.

I think #59. Fins doc cleared him last week.

[Patler]

I think #59. Fins doc cleared him last week.

So is he 1 and 58 in opinions?

[woodbuck27]

http://espn.go.com/boston/?topId=11026208

The Backup Plan?

New England needs tight-end depth, and veteran talent is available. So what's the holdup?

This video is really about Jermichael Finley; but there's more Packers as well.

[gbgary]

I would sign that deal with Finley.

yup...there's your cheap, one-year, "show us", contract.

[pbmax]

http://espn.go.com/boston/?topId=11026208

The Backup Plan?

New England needs tight-end depth, and veteran talent is available. So what's the holdup?

This video is really about Jermichael Finley; but there's more Packers as well.

See above: http://packerrats.com/showthread.php?26778-Finley-getting-57th-opinion-on-his-neck-today&p=788208&viewfull=1#post788208

[pbmax]

Doctor Shopping

Ian Rapoport ‏@RapSheet 51m
Technically visited Steelers team doc. RT @AaronNagler: Jermichael Finley has interest from the Raiders and visited Steelers, per @RapSheet.

Jason Wilde ‏@jasonjwilde 48m
Important distinction. How many of these visits are purely medical for now? RT @RapSheet: Finley technically visited Steelers team doc.

[red]

so finley has visited the seahawks to get checked out, and they passed

the pats brought him in to check him out, didn't offer him a deal

steelers doc checked him out, no offer

anyone noticing a pattern?

everyone that has looked at his neck has decided it doesn't look good

CAREER---------OVER

[Cleft Crusty]

CAREER---------OVER

nek

[pbmax]

Took 10.5 months for Richardson to be brought back. No reason to hurry. No one has reported Packers or Giants have lost interest.

[woodbuck27]

See above: http://packerrats.com/showthread.php?26778-Finley-getting-57th-opinion-on-his-neck-today&p=788208&viewfull=1#post788208

Read it....THANKS. :-)

[woodbuck27]

Yes, Finley was around for the 15-1 season, and the Packers offense was much better.

2009 - Offense = 28.8 points/game; Defense = 18.6 points/game (gave up 51 points in playoff loss)
2010 - Offense = 24.3 points/game; Defense = 15.0 points/game (gave up 19 points/game in playoffs; never more than 25 points)
2011 - Offense = 35.0 points/game; Defense = 22.4 points/game (gave up 37 points in playoff loss)
2012 - Offense = 27.1 points/game; Defense = 21.0 points/game (gave up 45 points in playoff loss)

Seems to me like the Packers offense was much better off when Finley was healthy.

Key words from above post:

" when Finley was healthy "

[RashanGary]

He's not a great player. He's a player who makes some great plays, drops a lot of balls, struggles to stay healthy, struggles to be on the same page with our QB and is involved in a lot of drama. I think if a person takes and objective look, he's not a very good piece for this team. A super reliable, trust worthy TE who can block is a better fit for this offense than Finley. His downs outnumber his ups IMO.

[red]

He's not a great player. He's a player who makes some great plays, drops a lot of balls, struggles to stay healthy, struggles to be on the same page with our QB and is involved in a lot of drama. I think if a person takes and objective look, he's not a very good piece for this team. A super reliable, trust worthy TE who can block is a better fit for this offense than Finley. His downs outnumber his ups IMO.

i think that just about sums it up perfect as far as i'm concerned

[red]

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2014/06/05/finley-eventually-will-have-a-tough-decision-to-make/


And that’s the point at which Finley will have a tough decision to make. With a $10 million disability policy available to Finley if he’s never able to play again, Finley will have to decide whether to call it quits for $10 million tax free, or whether to return to the NFL for far less than what it would take to earn $10 million after taxes.

interesting question. if fins dr. clears him to play, but no team dr's clear him to play. can he still get the injury money? or does the one dr. clearing him to play wipe out the insurance money?

[mraynrand]

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2014/06/05/finley-eventually-will-have-a-tough-decision-to-make/



interesting question. if fins dr. clears him to play, but no team dr's clear him to play. can he still get the injury money? or does the one dr. clearing him to play wipe out the insurance money?

He'd probably have to play in the Mexican league then

[Cheesehead Craig]

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2014/06/05/finley-eventually-will-have-a-tough-decision-to-make/



interesting question. if fins dr. clears him to play, but no team dr's clear him to play. can he still get the injury money? or does the one dr. clearing him to play wipe out the insurance money?

I think he has to get a contract offer. If he cannot get cleared by any team's doctors then he can retire and take the $. It's a really grey area but that was my understanding.

[woodbuck27]

i think that just about sums it up perfect as far as i'm concerned

ditto.

[Zool]

I think he has to get a contract offer. If he cannot get cleared by any team's doctors then he can retire and take the $. It's a really grey area but that was my understanding.

Maybe this odd farewell, team doctor tour is satisfying some sort of insurance requirement?

[Guiness]

Maybe this odd farewell, team doctor tour is satisfying some sort of insurance requirement?

I was starting to wonder that as well - maybe he has to do due diligence that he tried to find work. I'm sure the insurance company is not at all amused that they might have to pay this out.