Backup QB

[Harlan Huckleby]

I really disliked Flynn last year with his ramen noodle arm. Sounds like he was not recovered from injury. Time to jump on bandwagon.

http://www.jsonline.com/blogs/sports/270334021.html

I think they ought to keep Tolzien too. Emergency QB doesn't count on game day 46. There's a 50-50 chance Arod will miss some games.

[Carolina_Packer]

I really disliked Flynn last year with his ramen noodle arm. Sounds like he was not recovered from injury. Time to jump on bandwagon.

http://www.jsonline.com/blogs/sports/270334021.html

I think they ought to keep Tolzien too. Emergency QB doesn't count on game day 46. There's a 50-50 chance Arod will miss some games.

Totally agree on keeping Tolzien. God forbid they go through another stretch without Rodgers like they did last year, but they have to be ready and not short-change the importance of the backups at that position like they did when they had Graham Harrell there.

[vince]

I'm in the camp of keeping Flynn or Tolzien as back-up and developing Rettig on the practice squad. You get past the back-up you're in dire straits no matter how you look at it and there's too much talent and need at other spots to use a 53-man spot on a 3rd QB. Last year was great to eek into the playoffs but without Arod the hope of going deep is practically nil.

[Harlan Huckleby]

without Arod the hope of going deep is practically nil.

I thought we dispelled this argument last year. The quality of the backups means a lot, you need to win games when Arod is out.
Last year the team had 4 different starting QBs. I can see the argument for keeping 2, but 3 is not excessive.

[vince]

I thought we dispelled this argument last year. The quality of the backups means a lot, you need to win games when Arod is out.
Last year the team had 4 different starting QBs. I can see the argument for keeping 2, but 3 is not excessive.
They kept 2 last year and eeked into the playoffs. Tolzien was promoted from the PS when Rodgers went down.

They eventually kept three with Rodgers promising to return - and then hung onto Tolzien the last couple games to push for back-up this year. He does have a better arm but if he isn't clearly better than Flynn he's not worth hanging onto. If he is then Flynn's not. Either one would probably be available as a street pick-up if needed.

I'm saying that keeping three would have had virtually no impact. They still eek into the playoffs sans Rodgers and then it all depends on how sharp he is when he gets back in terms of how far they go postseason. Without him they got no shot with 2, 3 or 10 backups.

[Bretsky]

They kept 2 last year and eeked into the playoffs. Tolzien was promoted from the PS when Rodgers went down.

They eventually kept three with Rodgers promising to return - and then hung onto Tolzien the last couple games to push for back-up this year. He does have a better arm but if he isn't clearly better than Flynn he's not worth hanging onto. If he is then Flynn's not. Either one would probably be available as a street pick-up if needed.

I'm saying that keeping three would have had virtually no impact. They still eek into the playoffs sans Rodgers and then it all depends on how sharp he is when he gets back in terms of how far they go postseason. Without him they got no shot with 2, 3 or 10 backups.



Tolzien...low upside

I am fine keeping Flynn

[Brandon494]

Never understood why everyone is so high on Tolzien, dude is garbage.

Flynn is this generation's Doug Pederson.

[Bretsky]

Never understood why everyone is so high on Tolzien, dude is garbage.

Flynn is this generation's Doug Pederson.


Completely agree

I bleed Badger and even with my jaded eyes I don't see much in Tolzien

If I need somebody to go a four game stretch and play well I'm rolling with Flynn

And if we keep a 3rd QB IMO there will be guys with much greater upside than Tolzien available

[Harlan Huckleby]

And if we keep a 3rd QB IMO there will be guys with much greater upside than Tolzien available

The QBs they danced with last year include Seneca Wallace, Vince Young, BJ Coleman, and Graham Harrell. Tolzien looked a bit better than those guys.

Now in 2014 you think there is going to be a gem in the scrap heap with much greater upside than Tolzien?

I think you are going to be one of those guys who spends his retirement searching for hidden treasures.
http://media.kval.com/images/130715metal-detector405.jpg

[Patler]

I think they ought to keep Tolzien too. Emergency QB doesn't count on game day 46.

The emergency QB rule was abolished 3 years ago. Before then, a designated third QB did not count against the then game day limit of 45 active players. They abolished that and went to a 46 player active roster, and everyone counts. If you chose to have three QBs available, the third one counts against the 46 player limit.

[MadScientist]

The emergency QB rule was abolished 3 years ago. Before then, a designated third QB did not count against the then game day limit of 45 active players. They abolished that and went to a 46 player active roster, and everyone counts. If you chose to have three QBs available, the third one counts against the 46 player limit.

The real issue is that a 3rd QB will count against the 53. What position do you go thin to keep both backups?

Let's see what they can do in the preseason. If Flynn looks better and stronger, keep him. If Tolzien has improved his accuracy and decision making to the point that he's the best option, keep him.

[Patler]

The real issue is that a 3rd QB will count against the 53. What position do you go thin to keep both backups?

Let's see what they can do in the preseason. If Flynn looks better and stronger, keep him. If Tolzien has improved his accuracy and decision making to the point that he's the best option, keep him.

The Packers have often allotted one or two spots on the 53 man roster to development guys who are not ready to play. Giacomini for a couple years, then McDonald. They have carried 5 TEs, 3 FBs. If they have a QB suitable for development, they have room on the roster for him, unless ("until" for GB) a rash of injuries makes it hard to find 46 healthy bodies to suit up on game days.

[Guiness]

I thought we dispelled this argument last year. The quality of the backups means a lot, you need to win games when Arod is out.
Last year the team had 4 different starting QBs. I can see the argument for keeping 2, but 3 is not excessive.

Yup. Packers made it into the playoffs despite him being out for significant time. Granted, they snuck in, not in control of their own destiny, but they got in. To use the cliche, at that point it's a new season and anything can happen. There were reasons the Packer didn't deep into the playoffs last year, but Rodgers injury was not one of them.

[3irty1]

Flynn is a proven backup who can get you out of a game but IMO his real value has been as the leader of the scout team offense. When our defenses were at their best it was Flynn preparing them.

Tolzien has been with us a year, and spent two more in SF playing in a system that made Alex Smith look like he was worth two second rounders. At this point I doubt he'll ever learn to take care of the ball as well as Flynn which is pretty much the only thing I want in a backup. If we needed a backup backup he'd be at the top of my list of guys to call but I wouldn't bet an inactive roster spot that he won't be around.

[Harlan Huckleby]

Packers seem to have really lucked out with Flynn. I've always heard that one should buy low and sell high. They got Flynn when he was struggling with elbow problems, nobody wanted him. They have him under contract until he is 30. Age and a couple bed-shitting incidents might keep him affordable.
He contributed well enough last year. Now he is throwing ball better. As Borat would say, "Great Success!"

[Harlan Huckleby]

Both packer papers said Tolzien helped himself in the QB derby. Guess I'll have to watch more of the game. This could be a chance to rub Bretsky's nose in it.

http://www.jsonline.com/blogs/sports/270631841.html

http://www.packersnews.com/story/sports/nfl/packers/2014/08/09/green-bay-packers-tennessee-titans-preseason/13851855/

Not sure you can judge much in the heavy rain.

[Freak Out]

Was the third QB last night just horrible or what? Maybe I was drunk and it looked worse than it was?

[Striker]

Tolzien showed his athleticism vs. Flynn's. Itll certainly be more of a battle than some are expecting.

[Brandon494]

Three things about Flynn and Tolzien last night...

-Flynn played in worse conditions last night.

-Tolzien played against 2nd and 3rd stringers.

-Tolzien's arm is better suited under those conditions but how many rainy games do we play a year?

With all that said Tolzien definitely played better then Flynn though but I think have Flynn was the #2 guy.

[denverYooper]

Three things about Flynn and Tolzien last night...

-Flynn played in worse conditions last night.

-Tolzien played against 2nd and 3rd stringers.

-Tolzien's arm is better suited under those conditions but how many rainy games do we play a year?

With all that said Tolzien definitely played better then Flynn though but I think have Flynn was the #2 guy.

Good points. I feel like Flynn has a pretty solid roster spot atm because he earned it last year and is, by sports journo accounts, looking pretty good in camp. Tolzien is probably competing against the 4th TE or 5th RB, trying to prove they should carry him on the roster for another year.

[Harlan Huckleby]

I think Flynn and Tolzien are both competing for jobs, and not with just each other. The Packers discovered last year just how difficult it is to find NFL-ready QBs. No way do they want to go shopping in that reject market again. If Flynn & Tolzien both prove that they are serviceable backups, they will both be kept. I heard that Flynn costs the team just $100K if they cut him. Flynn looks like near-sure keeper, but he is not 100% safe.

[Patler]

I think the real question is this; Will your 3rd QB give you any better chance to win a game than a QB you are able to keep on the practice squad, or an experienced veteran you can sign if needed. The third QB will never be active if #1 & #2 are healthy, so doesn't factor into the game that the starter is injured. The following week you can sign your guy off the practice squad or a veteran who is sitting at home to back up your second QB.

So, assuming that Flynn holds on to the back-up spot, does Tolzien give you that much more of a chance to win a game than someone you can have on the practice squad or one of the veterans who is sitting at home? He did not show that last year, because while he showed an ability to rack up passing yards, it was more than offset by his too frequent mistakes. Chances are if you release him, he will ne available to be resigned later anyway. I doubt he would be a hot commodity on the waiver list, and he isn't practice squad eligible.

Flynn has proven himself to be a very capable backup in GB's offense multiple times in multiple seasons. He has proven that he responds well under pressure. That puts him ahead of Tolzien by quite a bit. Flynn makes the team so long as he doesn't have an injury.

Tolzien makes the team only if he demonstrates that he has indeed gotten over his tendency for mistakes, and only if the Packers come out of TC extremely healthy, without a bunch of guys who won't be able to play week 1.

[Harlan Huckleby]

I think the real question is this; Will your 3rd QB give you any better chance to win a game than a QB you are able to keep on the practice squad, or an experienced veteran you can sign if needed.

I think Flynn and Tolzien are probably both keepers, although either could be cut. Despite Tolzien's shortcomings, I'm confident that any "player to be named later" will stink more.

[Just Jeff]

Has Seneca Wallace been cleared to play?

[Patler]

I think Flynn and Tolzien are probably both keepers, although either could be cut. Despite Tolzien's shortcomings, I'm confident that any "player to be named later" will stink more.

But how much more? It seems like a lot of Badger followers don't think it gets much worse than Tolzien in the NFL. And, really, what are the chances that either of the odoriferous QBs will actually have to play? Yes, I know, it happened last year; but that is quite unusually. One year they went through something like 10 WRs. That doesn't mean you need to keep 10 the next year.

As I said before, I have no problem keeping a third QB so long as the roster is healthy, but when injuries hit and 4 or 5 guys are medically out, as long as neither of the first two QBs is one of the injured, the third QB needs to go.

Besides, if they need him I think Tolzien will be available for signing during the season even if they release him at the final cutdown.

[Patler]

Has Seneca Wallace been cleared to play?

Don't know and don't care at this point; but if the need arose, I think I would prefer him to Tolzien.

[sharpe1027]

But how much more? It seems like a lot of Badger followers don't think it gets much worse than Tolzien in the NFL. And, really, what are the chances that either of the odoriferous QBs will actually have to play? Yes, I know, it happened last year; but that is quite unusually. One year they went through something like 10 WRs. That doesn't mean you need to keep 10 the next year.

As I said before, I have no problem keeping a third QB so long as the roster is healthy, but when injuries hit and 4 or 5 guys are medically out, as long as neither of the first two QBs is one of the injured, the third QB needs to go.

Besides, if they need him I think Tolzien will be available for signing during the season even if they release him at the final cutdown.

I agree to a large extent, but I hope there would be a pretty big difference between Tolzien with almost no practice time to get familiar with the system and after an off season of work. Also, he might still be available if released, but he would no longer have the benefit of training with the team during the season. Might be better to cut Flynn and resign if needed. He would benefit less from additional practice time and could probably get up to speed quicker.

It will be interesting to see what they decide to do.