Suh a Packer?

[red]

Lavar Arrington thinks so, thinks we would be a perfect fit for suh, and he might be the missing piece for us

granted, i think suh is a grade-A piece of monkey shit, but he's a hell of a player, and we do have the cap

hmmmm

http://www.freep.com/story/sports/nfl/lions/2015/02/12/detroit-lions-ndamukong-suh-packers/23287525/

[woodbuck27]

I can read it now here:

" He's not Packer people."

If Suh lands in Seattle where he hopes he'll fit best for next season and beyond.

That might be all that's needed to keep the Green Bay Packers out of the Super Bowl next season.

Thanks red- a separate thread on the number one player available in 2015 Free Agency ...the Ndamukong Suh watch.

[mraynrand]

I'd love him in G&Gold. There are so many Bears and Vikings that need stepping on.

[woodbuck27]

I'd love him in G&Gold. There are so many Bears and Vikings that need stepping on.

Suh in Seattle has a very solid chance of happening.

[mraynrand]

Suh in Seattle has a very solid chance of happening.

If they do that, they have to avoid being Lynched.

[red]

I'd love him in G&Gold. There are so many Bears and Vikings that need stepping on.

yeah, i think if we would sign him, i would end up loving his antics

[woodbuck27]

yeah, i think if we would sign him, i would end up loving his antics

That 'and I'm fantasizing' would sure dump any chance of BJ Raji back in town.

[Carolina_Packer]

Suh in Seattle has a very solid chance of happening.

If the Packers don't end up signing him, I hope Seattle gives him a ton of money, and they can be as cap constrained as Detroit was with his contract. I don't think Suh is giving discounts, I think he's looking for top dollar, so if you sign him, be prepared for him to have a big cap number. Not sure how that works out with the guys they signed last off-season, plus Wilson and Lynch to come, should he keep the Skittle parade going.

[Guiness]

If the Packers don't end up signing him, I hope Seattle gives him a ton of money, and they can be as cap constrained as Detroit was with his contract. I don't think Suh is giving discounts, I think he's looking for top dollar, so if you sign him, be prepared for him to have a big cap number. Not sure how that works out with the guys they signed last off-season, plus Wilson and Lynch to come, should he keep the Skittle parade going.

If he won't give discounts, I wonder what the top of the market for a DT is? The money Detroit had to pay him because of the hole they dug was a caricature of the city's problems. Like Bradford, he'll be working for a percentage of that next year, although for a different reason - DT franchise tag number was under $10M, less than half of what he made.

A deal that ends up paying him more than $15M/year would surprise me. I'd also guess the 'announced' contract will be ~ 5yr/$100M though.

[smuggler]

I don't think so. Neither for the Pack or Seachickies.

[red]

If he won't give discounts, I wonder what the top of the market for a DT is? The money Detroit had to pay him because of the hole they dug was a caricature of the city's problems. Like Bradford, he'll be working for a percentage of that next year, although for a different reason - DT franchise tag number was under $10M, less than half of what he made.

A deal that ends up paying him more than $15M/year would surprise me. I'd also guess the 'announced' contract will be ~ 5yr/$100M though.

only 3 dts had a cap number averaging over 10 million last year. gerald mccoy, who got a new 7 year= 95 million dollar deal. suh, and geno atkins at 5 years, 53 million

no other dts make over 7.25 a year

so, i'm guessing he gets just over what mccoy got, probably 14 mil a year

[Striker]

Well, it depends on how the base salary is structured.

If Spotrac.com is correct, McCoy's base salary this year was 17 million, and with other bonuses and such his cap hit was 21 million.

Next season, 14 million, and then in a ballpark 12-14 million for the duration.

If Suh won't give them a discount, I hope they spend and lure Suh out there. The Packers have shown they can contain Suh (and the Seahawks line in general).

What I wouldn't want to see is, say, Randall Cobb go out there or Dez Bryant or someone. Though if Lynch leaves, then it all may be moot anyway.

[vince]

Not interested at 14 mil. The talent's there, but that's too much collateral risk at such a premium price...

Teddy was a serious player in the Randy Moss sweepstakes back in the day so he's not above taking on character risks. That was when Moss was seriously undervalued through trying to escape from Alcatraz/The Black Hole/Oakland.

[woodbuck27]

My analysis says the $15 M$ /season would satisfy Ndamukong Suh .

Even if TT wanted him that cost would 'only' be fantasy at best. TT has to put his marbles into retaining his own FA's.

How attractive is this problem child-adult?

He's lived up to his billing out of College. He's a reliable (overall) dominant force for a DL that has other pieces. Suh has to be accounted for by opposing teams. In five seasons since he was chosen second overall by Detroit in 2010:

He's had 241 TT's, 36 SACKS 15 PD's, 2 FF's and 1 Pick in 78 games. He's a dominant/aggressive man upfront and center. The Lions run 'D' is going to suffer the impending loss of Ndamukong Suh.

It seems pretty clear that his marketing strategy is based on moving his life closer to home. Seattle has a lot of factors to consider as priorities before entertaining anyone in Free Agency. It's obvious that that organization isn't afraid to swing for the fence. Seattle will bite the dead cap bullet in the future for being enamoured over Percy Harvin. It appears to me that if they can get it done the same lost gamble won't occur signing Ndamukong Suh.

Seattle should have won the Super Bowl past. Why not double down with SUH in 2016? Two straight Super Bowls was maybe? a changed offensive call away. Two Super Bowls in three seasons would be redemption.

[Pugger]

I'd love him in G&Gold. There are so many Bears and Vikings that need stepping on.

:lol: There are few loins that need stepping on too. :-)

But I'm sure Ted will concentrate on keeping our own (Cobb and Bulaga) rather than screw up our cap going forward. Sue is gonna want top dollar for sure.

[woodbuck27]

I heard on the NFL Network that Ndamukong Suh may not be going anywhere as the Lions want to somehow retain him.

[Pugger]

I heard on the NFL Network that Ndamukong Suh may not be going anywhere as the Lions want to somehow retain him.

Good. They can keep the goon.

[Guiness]

I heard on the NFL Network that Ndamukong Suh may not be going anywhere as the Lions want to somehow retain him.

I'm sure they'd love to, but can they? I also wonder how attractive Detroit is to FAs right now. I don't know much about the city other than what I see in the news, but it sure is portrayed awfully. Would anyone really want to go there?

[woodbuck27]

I'm sure they'd love to, but can they? I also wonder how attractive Detroit is to FAs right now. I don't know much about the city other than what I see in the news, but it sure is portrayed awfully. Would anyone really want to go there?

Are you also hinting that Suh likely can't get away from Detroit soon enough?

[Cheesehead Craig]

Detroit would have a shit ton of $ tied up in Stafford, Megatron and Suh. They already have about $38M committed for Stafford and Megatron in cap next year and $46M in 2016 for those 2. I don't know if they could afford a $15 - 18M contract for Suh over multiple years. Add in that Deandre Levy is an UFA after next year and they wouldn't be able to keep him if they re-sign Suh. Detroit would be best to let Suh go. I wouldn't want him as a Packer, especially not for what it would cost to get him.

[Joemailman]

Detroit would have a shit ton of $ tied up in Stafford, Megatron and Suh. They already have about $38M committed for Stafford and Megatron in cap next year and $46M in 2016 for those 2. I don't know if they could afford a $15 - 18M contract for Suh over multiple years. Add in that Deandre Levy is an UFA after next year and they wouldn't be able to keep him if they re-sign Suh. Detroit would be best to let Suh go. I wouldn't want him as a Packer, especially not for what it would cost to get him.

They're definitely in a tough situation. Actually, Suh probably deserves 15-18 million more than Stafford and CJ deserve the money they're getting. Stafford was #21 in passer rating, and CJ was 16th in receiving yards due in part to injuries. He's starting to get banged up. The Lions are paying CJ almost twice what the Packers are paying Jordy Nelson. That's an example of why some teams have salary cap problems and some don't.

[Smidgeon]

They're definitely in a tough situation. Actually, Suh probably deserves 15-18 million more than Stafford and CJ deserve the money they're getting. Stafford was #21 in passer rating, and CJ was 16th in receiving yards due in part to injuries. He's starting to get banged up. The Lions are paying CJ almost twice what the Packers are paying Jordy Nelson. That's an example of why some teams have salary cap problems and some don't.

But that's also a product of draft position and early career success. If Jordy was drafted by the Packers at number 5 overall and started his season like CJ, the Packers would either be paying him a lot or already have let him go.

[Guiness]

Detroit would have a shit ton of $ tied up in Stafford, Megatron and Suh. They already have about $38M committed for Stafford and Megatron in cap next year and $46M in 2016 for those 2. I don't know if they could afford a $15 - 18M contract for Suh over multiple years. Add in that Deandre Levy is an UFA after next year and they wouldn't be able to keep him if they re-sign Suh. Detroit would be best to let Suh go. I wouldn't want him as a Packer, especially not for what it would cost to get him.

They did it with bubblegum and bundle twine this past year. Those 3 players accounted for North of $52M in cap space this past year, no one else on the team had a cap number over $5M. Yes, they had a good run and made the playoffs, but that is nowhere near sustainable.

[Guiness]

Are you also hinting that Suh likely can't get away from Detroit soon enough?

It's possible, I really don't know. All I know of Detroit is what I get from the news. Abandoned houses, people's water being cut off, etc, however you wouldn't expect a pro football player to have to put up with that sort of thing. I assume there are some nice suburbs where they live and are isolated from those problems? Beats me.

[Cheesehead Craig]

They did it with bubblegum and bundle twine this past year. Those 3 players accounted for North of $52M in cap space this past year, no one else on the team had a cap number over $5M. Yes, they had a good run and made the playoffs, but that is nowhere near sustainable.

They seem to treat their football team like a baseball team. Baseball teams would spend a ton of money, win a title, then disbanded the team as they would hemorrage money. Problem is, the cap is a lot more unforgiving in the NFL than baseball. Plus the Lions didn't do squat with the team they had which is a double whammy. Football owners and GMs need to be smarter with their money than their MLB counterparts and I think some NFL guys get too wrapped up with how the baseball guys do things at times with big contracts.

Another reason to love Ted.

[Joemailman]

But that's also a product of draft position and early career success. If Jordy was drafted by the Packers at number 5 overall and started his season like CJ, the Packers would either be paying him a lot or already have let him go.

Maybe that's why TT doesn't use 1st round picks on WR's. Why put yourself into a position of having to pay huge money to a WR when you have a great QB who can make good WR's great? And average WR's good?

[mraynrand]

Maybe that's why TT doesn't use 1st round picks on WR's. Why put yourself into a position of having to pay huge money to a WR when you have a great QB who can make good WR's great? And average WR's good?

Sure, and where they typically draft, you're not going to get a shot at that physical specimen, 'sure-fire' dominant WR. Even when Raji was drafted #9; Packers could have had Crabtree, Macklin, Harvin (Nicks and Britt were available after Clay was drafted)

[smuggler]

If Calvin Johnson had played his entire career with Favre/Rodgers, he'd be on pace to destroy Rice's records. It's not always about just the one player, but the supporting cast. Calvin Johnson got that boatload payday because had great production AND was the most physically talented receiver, if not player, in the league when he inked the deal.

[wist43]

How would signing Suh overcome dunderdummy's - "rush 3 (no one really), and cover no one defense" like he ran against Seattle on 3rd and forever??

Signing another stud player isn't going to stop Capers from being Capers - is it??

He's had the tools to succeed the last 2 years, and he's shit the bed time and time again... you guys can make some excuses for the embarrassing crap he's handed us years previous, at least to some defensible degree, but the bottom line is - dunderdummy cannot be trusted - EVER!!

I said that when they hired him, and it'll be true until the day the league declares him an embarrassment to the game and bans him for life!!!

I'd love to have Suh as a player - just as I love Peppers as a player, and I like a lot of the other players we have on defense... but undercutting it all is dunderdummy.

There's simply no accounting for the time when he decides to stick 2 carrots up his nose and go complete idiot on us... it can happen at any moment, and unfortunately it tends to happen at big moments in big games.

I would hope you guys would eventually get this figured out, lol... but alas, all these years later - you guys still love the guy. Complete headscratcher to me :cnf:

[Joemailman]

I would hope you guys would eventually get this figured out, lol... but alas, all these years later - you guys still love the guy. Complete headscratcher to me :cnf:

Would you care to point out the recent threads where anybody on this forum has been praising Capers? I haven't seen it.

[texaspackerbacker]

Would you care to point out the recent threads where anybody on this forum has been praising Capers? I haven't seen it.

I read this and felt compelled to comment. I may not have praised Capers in this forum, but I certainly have in others. The main reason the Packers D did as good as it did/didn't do worse than it did (take your pick) is the scheming and trickery of Capers. Personnel-wise, we are deficient. Think back to the blandness of Packer D before Capers. What we have now is distinctly better.

[wist43]

Would you care to point out the recent threads where anybody on this forum has been praising Capers? I haven't seen it.

Com'on Joe... you love the guy, admit it!!!

[Joemailman]

Com'on Joe... you love the guy, admit it!!!

I'm pretty meh about him. I think it's possible to win with him (they have before). But I sure wouldn't mind a change. With the exception of ILB, I think the talent is pretty good. The defense has had a frustrating inability to close out games after playing well for most of the game.

[pbmax]

Well the Cover 0 rush didn't get the QB when Russell threw the game winning TD, so it seems as though you can get burned with either approach if the players don't do what they are supposed to do.

Or the offense doesn't get a first down until its behind.

[Joemailman]

Well the Cover 0 rush didn't get the QB when Russell threw the game winning TD, so it seems as though you can get burned with either approach if the players don't do what they are supposed to do.

Or the offense doesn't get a first down until its behind.

The last 3 times Seattle possessed the ball they scored touchdowns. It's hard to come to Capers' defense (no pun intended) when that happens.

[woodbuck27]

The last 3 times Seattle possessed the ball they scored touchdowns. It's hard to come to Capers' defense (no pun intended) when that happens.

The defensive alignment Vs Seattle with 1st and 10 at our 35 that went for the game winning pass and catch for the Seahawks win was simply stupid 'D'.

For CB Tramon Williams to give the inside route to Seattle WR Jermaine Kearse and with no over the top backup ie from Sean Richardson was simply hard to believe.

It was a gift wrapped route for Wilson > Kearse.

Dom Capers should have been FIRED just for that.

[mraynrand]

The last 3 times Seattle possessed the ball they scored touchdowns. It's hard to come to Capers' defense (no pun intended) when that happens.

never trust Capers. NEVER

[Joemailman]

never trust Capers. NEVER

You remind me of someone...

[Carolina_Packer]

You remind me of someone...

Very Wisterious!

[pbmax]

The last 3 times Seattle possessed the ball they scored touchdowns. It's hard to come to Capers' defense (no pun intended) when that happens.

But what was it about his gameplan that was foolish or ill-considered? It worked for 55 minutes. It was never likely they would hold the Seattle O scoreless.

Does anyone actually believe Capers has a D that is called play better NOW! Or one called rush 3 and cover no one?

Players have to execute the call. They did for 55 minutes and then stopped. Wilson hits a few long balls he missed in the first half and the pass rush slows down.

The two areas that need to be addressed by the coach are one, why cannot they play a deep zone pass defense and keep everyone in front of them, and second, though I didn't think it came into play versus Seattle, why call off the dogs late in a half?

[pbmax]

The defensive alignment Vs Seattle with 1st and 10 at our 35 that went for the game winning pass and catch for the Seahawks win was simply stupid 'D'.

For CB Tramon Williams to give the inside route to Seattle WR Jermaine Kearse and with no over the top backup ie from Sean Richardson was simply hard to believe.

It was a gift wrapped route for Wilson > Kearse.

Dom Capers should have been FIRED just for that.

That Cover 0 blitz had been hugely effective in the second half of the season. It helped win the Cowboys game. Players need to execute.

[woodbuck27]

That Cover 0 blitz had been hugely effective in the second half of the season. It helped win the Cowboys game. Players need to execute.

Giving the down and the importance of the situation (the Super Bowl was at stake). I feel that more prudence in terms of protecting the middle against the pass was needed.

Yes ...... in all plays execution is important.

Yes ...... CB Tramon Williams screwed up allowing Seattle WR Jermaine Kearse the inside route. The sideline was TWill's friend.

He had to align himself 4-5 feet to his right. Force the route outside. As it turned out he was simply beaten by an easier throw for Russell Wilson than if Wilson had to toss it down along the sideline.

Some help over the top was also needed. The Packers gift wrapped that win for Seattle right there. Dom Capers should have been FIRED! He's too old to get it right.

Forever we put up with weakness and ST's.

Forever we witnessed MM's flaws in overall game management.

Forever we have to witness Dom Capers screw up !!!!!!

Mike McCarthy acts too slowly !

His boss is slower.

[pbmax]

Everyone makes mistakes, and we don't even know what the mistake is in this case. Is Tramon playing the wrong technique? Is Richardson or one of the other short coverage guys supposed to be deep? Was it definitely a Cover 0 blitz? We don't know the call.

But if you fire someone because of the timing of an error, you are just looking for a scapegoat. Either Capers can still coach or he can't. One play shouldn't change that assessment.

His units have outperformed the offense at the end of the season two years in a row. I think McCarthy can coach. I think Capers still can as well.

Replacing him without knowing who the new guy will be is just wishful thinking.

[Patler]

I think McCarthy can coach. I think Capers still can as well.


...and on the other hand, there was little indication that Slocum can coach. All aspects of ST have been agonizingly inconsistent for years, and prone to late season gaffes, not just this year.

[pbmax]

...and on the other hand, there was little indication that Slocum can coach. All aspects of ST have been agonizingly inconsistent for years, and prone to late season gaffes, not just this year.

Agreed. Other that a brief glimpse of ingenuity and an uptick with Cobb in 2011, there was not much positive. His best players, Crosby and Masthay, both had big slumps that the coach seemed powerless to help as well.

Kickoff coverage was about the only team to improve and stay that way. And I think it improved all the way to average.

[red]

Agreed. Other that a brief glimpse of ingenuity an an uptick with Cobb in 2011, there was not much positive. His best players, Crosby and Masthay, both had big slumps that the coach seemed powerless to help as well.

Kickoff coverage was about the only team to improve and stay that way. And I think it improved all the way to average.

don't forget that with the crosby slump, he wasn't allowed to get help from outside the team

i remember the story of him wanting to work with an outside consultant to fix what was broken, but was told he wasn't allowed

that was a clear indication of the idiocy and arrogance on this coaching staff, imo