Fire our new offensive coordinator - Clements

[wpony]

Has he called a really good game this year for our offense. unless it was against a very over under powered team that our defense took apart for us ? MM has improved our special teams debatable but they seem a little more constant but he really needs to get back to play calling the offense they have been so vanilla and boring this yr that its easy to figure them out and stop even arod !!!
At least mm made it exciting till he had a big lead and stood on which was stupid but at least we had leads fire Clements now or move him to special teams but get mm back to play calling NOW if not sooner before this season is a loss :bang:

[Pugger]

Is Clements really calling the games that much differently than MM did? IMO most of the problems we are seeing are execution issues more than anything else. :?:

[wpony]

Well that's why i came in here is to get all your opinions I haven't been able to see that many games this yr at least in peace and really able to study them but the parts i have seem seem so vanilla and predictable.
That's something i have never really been able to say before, I even have a Bears fan up here that agrees with me in fact he is another one that asked me a few weeks ago why are the Packers so predictable this yr that coming from a bears fan is so disheartening especially when you realize hes right and maybe that has something to do with arods attitude this yr. I think its Clements play calling but have been wrong before LOL what do you all think.

[sharpe1027]

It is certainly a good question to be asking. There seems to be a correlation, just not sure there is causation. We have seen instances of the offense struggling before, but I do not think it has ever been for this many games.

There are many variables other than just the play calling change. Injuries is a common one, but what the opponents are doing is also a big factor. Have defenses figured them out and caught up? Is Rodgers playing poorly?

[Patler]

Who do you want to be fired, the offensive coordinator, Clements or both?

[mraynrand]

Can I fire him for the first half then rehire for the second half?

[Fritz]

Who do you want to be fired, the offensive coordinator, Clements or both?


Good God in Heaven, last year the mass of this board bitched and bitched about MM's play calling, then after the season blamed him having his head in his offensive play book too much for the Seattle loss.

Now suddenly we want him back? Jaysus.

[Freak Out]

Who is coaching the OL these days? Lets fire them.

[George Cumby]

Fuggit. Fire Ted. Look at the shit 6-2 team that's on the field. At this rate they'll be 12-4 at the end of the year. Bums. How can we tolerate this garbage? Why isn't every game a 52-0 blow out? What kind of crap are they putting out there?

How dare they produce such a shitty team and a shitty product. They obviously don't care. No, no. The Wisconsin media is too soft, that's the problem. Fire those sycophantic hacks as well. No. It's the fans, they walk around like the extras from The Walking Dead, moaning "Everything is fine, Ted is God, all hail the Packers, we don't care if they hire a bunch of morally bankrupt felons as long as we win...." Let's fire the fans, too.

[Rutnstrut]

Fuggit. Fire Ted. Look at the shit 6-2 team that's on the field. At this rate they'll be 12-4 at the end of the year. Bums. How can we tolerate this garbage? Why isn't every game a 52-0 blow out? What kind of crap are they putting out there?

How dare they produce such a shitty team and a shitty product. They obviously don't care. No, no. The Wisconsin media is too soft, that's the problem. Fire those sycophantic hacks as well. No. It's the fans, they walk around like the extras from The Walking Dead, moaning "Everything is fine, Ted is God, all hail the Packers, we don't care if they hire a bunch of morally bankrupt felons as long as we win...." Let's fire the fans, too.

Actually at the level/rate they are playing now, they would end up 6-10. I get your point, however these 2 losses aren't the whole problem. The offense has been listless for 4 games, and the defense has been pretty crappy for 4 years or more.

[sharpe1027]

Firing is too extreme, but asking questions about the effect of the change in play calling roles seems reasonable.

[Harlan Huckleby]

Firing is too extreme

I would remind you that extremism in the defense of liberty is no vice. Clements has shackled the Packer offense. Free Jeff Janis!

[Freak Out]

Fire George Cumby! :)

[Cheesehead Craig]

Let's have Barney Fuckdoggle run the team, call the plays, and coach the players.

[George Cumby]

Fire George Cumby! :)

His play calling is unimaginative at best, he's predictable, he has REALLY bad hair and he has problems with his pad level.

He should have been fired three seasons ago.

[Joemailman]

Pack could try this: http://www.footballsfuture.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=571926&sid=3884a38123e44d085a809510c3680e79

[mraynrand]

Who is coaching the OL these days? Lets fire them.

Campen seemed absolutely confident before the season. Solaris was a little bit creepy and uncertain. I think he may be schizophrenic, maybe even experiencing auditory and visual hallucinations among other psychological issues.

[pbmax]

Campen seemed absolutely confident before the season. Solaris was a little bit creepy and uncertain. I think he may be schizophrenic, maybe even experiencing auditory and visual hallucinations among other psychological issues.

Fear and Loathing in Monona Terrace?

[Bretsky]

I think Patler's thread brought out wonderful points.

On the offensive side we had a wonderful setup....stellar playcaller....great QB coach.....seemingly great WR coach and yes a solid OL coach....ALTHOUGH...When MM brings in assistants he usually fires the head and hires the asst.......

However........we had a f'cked up special teams and probably a f'ck up for his assistant

so while MM's assistance has helped the ST, the changes seemed to have sent everything else to crap

[Freak Out]

Pack could try this: http://www.footballsfuture.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=571926&sid=3884a38123e44d085a809510c3680e79

Ha ha!

[denverYooper]

I think it's funny when pretty straightforward schemes work, they are simple and allow the players to "play fast" "without thinking" and dominate but when they don't, they are "predictable".

Is it an offense vs defense thing? The commentariat loves some simple defense executed well. Case in point, in the Denver v Green Bay tilt the Broncos were lauded for playing a simple defense that allowed them to "play fast" but the Packers were lambasted for playing a simple offensive scheme that was "too predictable".

Perhaps the available personnel make a difference. If Green Bay had their full complement of skill guys and Denver had Chris Harris and Demarcus Ware on the bench, that thing would have looked a little different.

[wpony]

well I said we could get him to coach the special team and bring mm back I never said I didnt like MMs his coaching for most of the game I just said when we had big leads we let up which I think is a mistake but ever since we changed coaches around we dont have to worry about letting up and I am not just talking about the last 2 games ,I love the packers and have all the way back to the early 60s but havent seen the total lack luster game calling like the this year games all the way back to oh lets say maybe devine comes to mind YAWNNN !!!!I just hope we get this turned around and quick

[Rutnstrut]

I think it's funny when pretty straightforward schemes work, they are simple and allow the players to "play fast" "without thinking" and dominate but when they don't, they are "predictable".

Is it an offense vs defense thing? The commentariat loves some simple defense executed well. Case in point, in the Denver v Green Bay tilt the Broncos were lauded for playing a simple defense that allowed them to "play fast" but the Packers were lambasted for playing a simple offensive scheme that was "too predictable".

Perhaps the available personnel make a difference. If Green Bay had their full complement of skill guys and Denver had Chris Harris and Demarcus Ware on the bench, that thing would have looked a little different.

I'm not buying the injury excuse, it's all we ever hear. This is football, do they really not plan for injuries?

[mraynrand]

I'm not buying the injury excuse, it's all we ever hear. This is football, do they really not plan for injuries?

The Packers don't plan to lose, they lose to plan.

[red]

no matter who's in charge, you'd think if m3 really had a problem with whats going on, he would step in a do something about it

the creativity is gone, and it seems like we're doing the things that didn't work in the past even more this year. long developing pass plays that take longer to develop then the line can block for. running slow ass lacy outside, when its never worked. and keeping the stupid bullshit no huddle that doesn't seem to be hurting anyone but us

honestly, i almost seems like we rely totally on the free play. that seems to be the only play we ever score with a big play on. every single play, the first option seems to be to get them offsides for a free play.

why not just play football? we're good enough. i think

[pbmax]

For the love of God, everyone stop with the long developing pass plays thing. Just stop. Its not a thing. Especially with Nelson out, they aren't throwing deep or using many double move routes.

Remember the TD to DickRod versus the 49ers? 3WR, 1TE, no one open on first routes (Slants and flats*), later in route longer slant, flat to wheel route, doesn't see Jones open.

Scrambles to left, finds Rodgers in tight window for TD. Its not long developing routes. Its a QB who doesn't think his WR are open. He trusts Cobb most of all and they are doubling him or putting the best corner on him. Next is Jones, who has never been quickest into a route, same with DickRod.

That is why Adams and Monty probably hold the key. And pass protection. Every phase of the passing game is a quagmire right now. And when they can't run, its lucky that Rodgers is still upright. The Packer Offense team photo (taken in the trainers room) is the one you see in the dictionary under 'dysfunctional'.


*Outside of a WR bubble screen, slants and flat routes are the quickest routes that exist.

[Bretsky]

Captain Obvious can point out that we have a huge void at TE (Vernon Davis Anyone)

Minus Jordy, none of these guys run cut on routes like Greg Jennings when he left (and I'm not saying we should have signed him although I do feel his stats would have been WAY better if he had AROD throwing to him.

But we also really miss Montgomery. I think he was a good route runner and could beat coverage off the press. IMO he's better than the Fresno State guy (Allen Robinson anyone) at getting open.

Against a good secondary, we just don't get open enough. And if we don't get open our plays won't consistently work. Add a pass rush and you lose the times Cobb normally gets open free lance style and you lose scrambling

I'm not on board with the fire all of the coaches although I still would have preferred last year's staff setup PLUS a competent ST coordinator not named Zook

[Bretsky]

Abbrederis was the UW Badgers Jordy Nelson. He ran great routes at UW. Either he must have a ways to go or his skills are just not translating enough at the next level

[Patler]

PB, I think there is an issue with slower developing pass plays, and it has little to do with the depths of the routes. It has a lot to do with the schematic tools they give receivers to get open.

[Rutnstrut]

As far as firing Clements, I don't think it would do a bit of good. I think Stubby is still running the show, Clements is just there to take the heat. No way stubby would have totally turned the reins over.

[pbmax]

PB, I think there is an issue with slower developing pass plays, and it has little to do with the depths of the routes. It has a lot to do with the schematic tools they give receivers to get open.

I haven't seen evidence of this. I have seen the reverse. The shorter routes in a particular play call are bypassed or ignored (variety of reasons) and the QB looks elsewhere.

The cause can be pressure, receiver not open, or QB looking away for reasons that are unclear.

That being said, I think the Packers are doing themselves no favors in the no huddle. If the plan isn't working, they seem UNable to audible to plays that the D is not prepared for. The pattern has been for the first drive to be promising but then after D adjustments, success seems to decrease.

What should be a scheme to force defenses into a bad matchup instead becomes a situation where the Packers cannot take advantage of the situation. In some cases because they can't run versus 6 or 7 in the box. Others, the pass play is well defended early and then pressure gets to the QB.

[Smidgeon]

Two things: The Packers have the slowest receivers and TE in the league, and are in the bottom 7 or 10 for slowest WRs. So they have no speed to work with right now.

Second, an article on Janis from GBPG makes me wonder at the exactness of Adams' routes. I'm assuming Cobb and Jones are consistent route runners having done it for years with success, but you get open with good routes regardless of speed, and right now, the ball isn't getting out. Makes me wonder if Rodgers isn't seeing the route discipline he needs to see to "throw a guy open."

[Rutnstrut]

Two things: The Packers have the slowest receivers and TE in the league, and are in the bottom 7 or 10 for slowest WRs. So they have no speed to work with right now.

Second, an article on Janis from GBPG makes me wonder at the exactness of Adams' routes. I'm assuming Cobb and Jones are consistent route runners having done it for years with success, but you get open with good routes regardless of speed, and right now, the ball isn't getting out. Makes me wonder if Rodgers isn't seeing the route discipline he needs to see to "throw a guy open."

I do think Rodgers is part of the "problem". He has to have a little faith in these guys, whether they have proven themselves to him or not.

[Patler]

I do think Rodgers is part of the "problem". He has to have a little faith in these guys, whether they have proven themselves to him or not.

Agreed. I don't know what actually goes on in practice, and what is said between Rodgers and the coaches, but some of the writers almost make it sound as if Rodgers has to give his approval before a receiver will play much. Even Rodgers' repeated comments about having to gain trust in them are getting tiring. At some point you simply have to play with whoever is on the roster, and make it work,

What would Rodgers do, and how would he play if they have a year like GB had a while back when they seemed to lose another WR every week, and it seemed like a new one was brought in every Monday?

[Pugger]

The only WR Rodgers seems to have little faith in is everybody's favorite Jeff Janis. If Jeff is screwing up on his routes and dropping balls in practice is it any wonder AR looks elsewhere during games? I do agree Rodgers isn't seeing his WRs like he has in the past. I hope this is only a temporary problem...

[Patler]

The only WR Rodgers seems to have little faith in is everybody's favorite Jeff Janis. If Jeff is screwing up on his routes and dropping balls in practice is it any wonder AR looks elsewhere during games? I do agree Rodgers isn't seeing his WRs like he has in the past. I hope this is only a temporary problem...

...and Abbrederis, and Adams last year except for a few games, and...... and ........... and.................

I wonder if you are magnifying Janis deficiencies, as the coaches and writers have said his hands are fine (so no "dropping balls in practice") and have said his understanding of the offense is fine. They even said his routes are fine. From what I have read recently, it makes me wonder just what the problem is? They allude to "consistency", without explaining in what.

Young players make mistakes that older players do not. Randall is playing a lot, makes a mistake and gets burned, but also makes a play to help out now and then.

Is Rodgers so interception paranoid that he can't accept an occasional route location mistake by Janis? How often does it happen? We don't know, is it once every 5 plays, 10 plays, 15 plays or what? No one is perfect, not even Rodgers who could have performed better last week and maybe even eeked out a tie in regulation that they didn't deserve. Maybe Cobb should have come back toward Rodgers scowling and pointing in disgust when he was wide open and Rodgers didn't get him the ball. The typical Rodgers gesture when a pass goes incomplete because a player breaks one way when Rodgers throws another way.

The offense needs revitalization. Going with what they have used has not worked well for a significant portion of the season. It might be time to take the good with the bad and see what players like Janis, Abbrederis and Backman can do in a game.

The roster is what it is, and the coaches and Rodgers have to use it the way it is. The cautious approach to using seems to be becoming more and more unsuccessful, so it might be time to throw caution to the wind every now and then and see what some of the less-than-perfect and inexperienced offensive parts can do.

[pbmax]

They have explained the consistency complaint; Van Pelt said it was consistency of depth on his routes. You may choose to buy that or not.

The West Coast offense has always relied on precision by a WR. It wasn't built on option routes like Infante's offense and Rodgers doesn't just heave passes toward the physically dominant specimens (only with Finley early might you find this). It used to be said it took three years to learn as a WR.

Rodgers accepted Cobb early despite his (still) non-precision routes. He advocated for Nelson when he was #3. He accepted a rookie last year in Adams and Jones before him. He praised Magical Abby in camp last year. I am baffled by complaints about this team not accepting young contributors who make mistakes considering the makeup of their offensive line.

Do the coaches occasionally over value experience (Bishop's case) versus playmaking? Yes, but that is a secondary feature of their depth chart. And fans and Rats have been wrong (Zombo/Jones/Walden/So'oto/Obiozor versus dumping Nick Perry) more often than right (Bishop) when screaming for backups to enter the game.

But look at it from the coaches point of view. The scramble offense clearly suits Janis's talents as is. Do you think Bennett's and Clement's game play says Spider 2Y Banana Rodgers scrambles for life and throws on the run?

I don't think its personnel. Its scheme and play choice. This has all happened before. See the 2009 offense.

[Patler]

I am baffled by complaints about this team not accepting young contributors who make mistakes considering the makeup of their offensive line.


I have said just the opposite, they seem willing to take the good with the bad and play rookies at other positions, except WR & TE. I used Randall as my example. That is why I wonder if they are giving in too much to Rodgers' "comfort level" with receivers.

In two preseasons, Janis has done nothing but make plays when he has the ball. In the regular season, he has done nothing but make plays when he has the ball. I think it is time for the coaches and Rodgers to figure out how to get the ball in his hands a couple times a game, and see what he can do with it. Maybe it will be nothing, but the have little to use trying to find out.

Bringing Janis in motion, then keeping him in to block seems like misuse of his greatest attributes.

[pbmax]

I think they HAVE lived with very young WRs before (Adams, Cobb, Jones and Abby praise then concussion). I don't think something new is happening this year. Janis' demonstrated talents not lend themselves to the currently designed offense.

And while I expect M3 to design some Janis plays eventually, I don't think they only person resisting putting Janis out there is Rodgers. Assuming the depth quote is true, I think the coaches have reservations. I grant that the quote might be baloney.

But a team that promoted Adams ahead of the offseason darling Boykin is not afraid of rookie WR. They seem to be afraid of this rookie. Abby just had no camp.

[Patler]

They have explained the consistency complaint; Van Pelt said it was consistency of depth on his routes. You may choose to buy that or not.

Yes and no. It's not a problem of believing or not, it's filling in all of the blanks. Per the GBPG article both Bennett and Van Pelt said he knows his assignments, can function in the no huddle, and catches the ball, but when pressed mentioned route depth. But, per Van Pelt, “The big thing is just being on the same page as the quarterback. He needs to gain Aaron’s trust more and more every day, and that starts in practice.”

So, is the problem really Janis' or Rodgers? Cobb is a broken play specialist who as of last year (per either JSO or GBPG, don't remember which) had minimal impact on designed plays. I don't see that having changed this year. Finley never did learn to run routes well. But Rodgers has found ways to accept both. Is he expecting perfection from Janis, when maybe imperfections and all Janis could give the offense the spark it needs? Is he expecting Janis to be Nelson-II, instead of just accepting him as Janis-I ?




The West Coast offense has always relied on precision by a WR. It wasn't built on option routes like Infante's offense and Rodgers doesn't just heave passes toward the physically dominant specimens (only with Finley early might you find this). It used to be said it took three years to learn as a WR.

Rodgers accepted Cobb early despite his (still) non-precision routes. He advocated for Nelson when he was #3. He accepted a rookie last year in Adams and Jones before him. He praised Magical Abby in camp last year. I am baffled by complaints about this team not accepting young contributors who make mistakes considering the makeup of their offensive line.

Rodgers was firmly planted on the bench when James Jones came in as a rookie and had 47 receptions for 600+ yards. Apparently, Favre didn't need to be so "comfortable" with his receivers.

Rodgers didn't advocate for Nelson until Nelson had been around a few years. Nelson was more the #4 to Jennings, Driver and Jones until Jones couldn't catch the deep sideline routes that Rodgers loves to throw. That didn't happen until Nelson's third season.

Rodgers has been talking up Adams this year, but really did not go to him much last year except in a couple games. Adams had stretches of minimal impact. 24 of his 38 receptions came in just 4 games. Granted, Nelson+Cobb+Rodgers was on fire last season. Face it, Adams really had no competition last year for #3 after Jones left and Boykin failed miserably. Initially, Rodgers was in Boykin's camp.

[Harlan Huckleby]

And while I expect M3 to design some Janis plays eventually

Be still my beating heart!

I expect to get laid again with a hot young women. Eventually. Not rushing into it, biding my time.

[denverYooper]

Doug Farrar ‏@SI_DougFarrar 11m11 minutes ago
IMO, "simplifying" Green Bay's offense won't solve a broken passing game. Here's what I saw. http://www.si.com/nfl/2015/11/10/all-22-aaron-rodgers-packers-mike-mccarthy …

Chris B. Brown ‏@smartfootball 7m7 minutes ago
@SI_DougFarrar Agree with your diagnosis but not sure with all of your cure. Don't think they need more plays, but they are in no man's land

Chris B. Brown ‏@smartfootball 6m6 minutes ago
@SI_DougFarrar with limited formations and not much tempo and no run game, which hurts PA and packaged play stuff. Either need to speed up

Chris B. Brown ‏@smartfootball 5m5 minutes ago
@SI_DougFarrar or go more Martz era St Louis Rams in sense of lots of shifts and motions, especially to free these pedestrian wideouts

Chris B. Brown ‏@smartfootball 5m5 minutes ago
@SI_DougFarrar but the route concepts look generally fine, they just need to dress them up and get free releases as you mentionDoug Farrar ‏@SI_DougFarrar 11m11 minutes ago
IMO, "simplifying" Green Bay's offense won't solve a broken passing game. Here's what I saw. http://www.si.com/nfl/2015/11/10/all-22-aaron-rodgers-packers-mike-mccarthy …

Chris B. Brown ‏@smartfootball 7m7 minutes ago
@SI_DougFarrar Agree with your diagnosis but not sure with all of your cure. Don't think they need more plays, but they are in no man's land

Chris B. Brown ‏@smartfootball 6m6 minutes ago
@SI_DougFarrar with limited formations and not much tempo and no run game, which hurts PA and packaged play stuff. Either need to speed up

Chris B. Brown ‏@smartfootball 5m5 minutes ago
@SI_DougFarrar or go more Martz era St Louis Rams in sense of lots of shifts and motions, especially to free these pedestrian wideouts

Chris B. Brown ‏@smartfootball 5m5 minutes ago
@SI_DougFarrar but the route concepts look generally fine, they just need to dress them up and get free releases as you mention

[Patler]

I think they HAVE lived with very young WRs before (Adams, Cobb, Jones and Abby praise then concussion). I don't think something new is happening this year. Janis' demonstrated talents not lend themselves to the currently designed offense.

And while I expect M3 to design some Janis plays eventually, I don't think they only person resisting putting Janis out there is Rodgers. Assuming the depth quote is true, I think the coaches have reservations. I grant that the quote might be baloney.

But a team that promoted Adams ahead of the offseason darling Boykin is not afraid of rookie WR. They seem to be afraid of this rookie. Abby just had no camp.

Jones was with Favre as a rookie, and played due to an injury riddled receiving group. And again, that was with Favre..
Cobb didn't do a lot as a rookie WR, did his second year however.
Abbrederis got a positive comment for two days of camp work - doesn't mean much.

Adams wasn't promoted ahead of Boykins as much as Boykins gave it away. Boyknins was awful for three games when he was ahead of Adams, then was hurt and didn't play for three more. He wasn't any better when he got back. Adams had no competition last year for #3. Essentially, he moved ahead of a guy who was cut by Carolina this year and now can't find a job.

Rookie WRs who have figured significantly in the offense have been there due to attrition more than anything else. I look at Janis as being a year behind many of the rookies they brought in other years, just due to his background. I'm not suggesting he will be a saviour, but what they have been doing so far this year hasn't been working all that well. Sometimes in all sports a spark comes not from a better player, but from a player that offers something different than those who have been playing.

Janis might fail miserably; but I think it might be time to find out.

[pbmax]

Be still my beating heart!

I expect to get laid again with a hot young women. Eventually. Not rushing into it, biding my time.

Like Janis' odds better.

[Teamcheez1]

Two things: The Packers have the slowest receivers and TE in the league, and are in the bottom 7 or 10 for slowest WRs. So they have no speed to work with right now.

Second, an article on Janis from GBPG makes me wonder at the exactness of Adams' routes. I'm assuming Cobb and Jones are consistent route runners having done it for years with success, but you get open with good routes regardless of speed, and right now, the ball isn't getting out. Makes me wonder if Rodgers isn't seeing the route discipline he needs to see to "throw a guy open."

Isn't New England the second slowest in the league (with a ragtag offensive line to boot)? Somehow they find a way to make it work.

[Bretsky]

Isn't New England the second slowest in the league (with a ragtag offensive line to boot)? Somehow they find a way to make it work.

Hoody Genius always finds a way; he's in a class by himself

[Patler]

Hoody Genius always finds a way; he's in a class by himself

Agreed. Most other teams try to follow the rules at least a little bit.

[Maxie the Taxi]

Brady might have something to do with it.

[Patler]

Brady might have something to do with it.

Except, of course, for the year Brady was out and Belicheat managed to win 11 games without him.

[Maxie the Taxi]

Except, of course, for the year Brady was out and Belicheat managed to win 11 games without him.

Well, I did say "something.":-)

[pbmax]

Jones was with Favre as a rookie, and played due to an injury riddled receiving group. And again, that was with Favre..
Cobb didn't do a lot as a rookie WR, did his second year however.
Abbrederis got a positive comment for two days of camp work - doesn't mean much.

Adams wasn't promoted ahead of Boykins as much as Boykins gave it away. Boyknins was awful for three games when he was ahead of Adams, then was hurt and didn't play for three more. He wasn't any better when he got back. Adams had no competition last year for #3. Essentially, he moved ahead of a guy who was cut by Carolina this year and now can't find a job.

Rookie WRs who have figured significantly in the offense have been there due to attrition more than anything else. I look at Janis as being a year behind many of the rookies they brought in other years, just due to his background. I'm not suggesting he will be a saviour, but what they have been doing so far this year hasn't been working all that well. Sometimes in all sports a spark comes not from a better player, but from a player that offers something different than those who have been playing.

Janis might fail miserably; but I think it might be time to find out.

Two words: Ty Montgomery

Randall is a first round pick, selected specifically to fill in a role due to losses in FA. HaHa same deal but for talent drain (other) not FA. Janis had no such role. He stepped into a team that had its top three (Nelson, Coob and higher round pick Adams).

Bach started as a rookie because of Bulaga's injury. Does this mean Campen doesn't like rookie starters? Barclay got starts because Bach was otherwise occupied and Newhouse and Sherrod were terrible. Which category does Barclay fall into?

RichRod starts because Quarless is hurt. But he also received significant snaps despite blocking deficiencies as a rookie. Rodgers trusts him.

When there was a spot open, Janis got a start and made two plays, both on QB scrambles. I don't think this is much of a mystery.

But I do agree, even at 6-2, the time to wait before tweaking the offense to Janis is running short. However, I bet we are at least two weeks away as they wait for Monty (a rookie who somehow got snaps without injuries) and Adams to get healthy and back up to speed.

[Patler]

I wouldn't judge Janis based on the offenses he played in, including the play of Rodgers.

...and I again, I'm not arguing Janis is the solution, but something needs to happen and Janis is about all there is to effect change with.

Find a way to get him the ball and see what happens.

[Patler]

They seem to be using Abbrederis today, and that is fine with me.

[red]

tie to make changes after this abortion of a game today

[red]

yes, throw it to dickrod for no gain

edit, wrong thread again, i don't fucking care

[Jimx29]

Fire her....STAT

http://i.imgur.com/e5vq7JE.jpg

[red]

fucking yoko

[wpony]

This will be a interesting week to see what happens just read a article in Rotoworld with Mike saying he has worked with the offense almost all week he still wont be calling the plays but he has focused and worked with them all week this should show plenty I think.

[red]

Oh yay, our Savior as turned his gaze back to the offence

Fucking guys are pry more confused then ever now

[Teamcheez1]

Oh yay, our Savior as turned his gaze back to the offence

Fucking guys are pry more confused then ever now

MM is setting up Clements as the fall guy.

[Fritz]

Fire her....STAT

http://i.imgur.com/e5vq7JE.jpg



This is the best post in this whole thread.