Will Jeff Janis be a *thing* next year?

[smuggler]

Show your thoughts on this guy's future.

[mraynrand]

depends on whether he becomes dependable

[Patler]

He will be on the team due to ST play. They will probably try to find a few more ways to use his speed at WR, but he will be a typical 4-5 WR.

[hoosier]

I chose option 3 but only because I had forgotten about his ST role. He stays but his role doesn't change. On the first (failed) red zone excursion you could see why Janis is still very far from being a reliable receiver.

[Harlan Huckleby]

Aaron Rodgers was not a reliable QB. For Janis to succeed, Rodgers needs to earn Janis's trust.

[red]

i picked the second option, but i could easily see him not even being on the team next year

[Joemailman]

He will be on the team due to ST play. They will probably try to find a few more ways to use his speed at WR, but he will be a typical 4-5 WR.

Good enough. I'm fine with:

1. Jordy
2. Cobb
3. Monty/Adams/Draft pick

Janis' performance yesterday will force teams to respect his speed. (He can actually catch the ball!) He may never become a well rounded receiver, but he might be able to give the Packers what Corey Bradford gave the Packers some time ago. They need to have some rather simple plays designed to get the ball into his hands because he's such an explosive athlete. Throw that screen with 2 WR's blocking to him rather than Dickrod.

[mraynrand]

Aaron Rodgers was not a reliable QB. For Janis to succeed, Rodgers needs to earn Janis's trust.

:)

[oldbutnotdeadyet]

Good enough. I'm fine with:

1. Jordy
2. Cobb
3. Monty/Adams/Draft pick

Janis' performance yesterday will force teams to respect his speed. (He can actually catch the ball!) He may never become a well rounded receiver, but he might be able to give the Packers what Corey Bradford gave the Packers some time ago. They need to have some rather simple plays designed to get the ball into his hands because he's such an explosive athlete. Throw that screen with 2 WR's blocking to him rather than Dickrod.

I have a feeling Cobb won't be on this team next year.

[mraynrand]

I have a feeling Cobb won't be on this team next year.

you think he will die?

[texaspackerbacker]

Maybe the wording should have been "should he" instead of "will he". I've been campaigning in forums for a long time for the Packers to make a lot better use of Jeff Janis. He simply is better/can do a lot more things better than Adams or Montgomery or even Cobb, but McCarthy with his damn seniority system or whatever the hell it is, stubbornly refused to play Janis until sadly, the injury to Cobb forced him to. Undoubtedly Aaron Rodgers deserves blame too for keeping Janis down on the depth chart. Absolutely, the Packers SHOULD have Janis starting with Jordy Nelson - assuming Nelson is back to 100%. Let Cobb be the third receiver/jack-of-all-trades; Let Montgomery be the fourth; And let Adams ride the bench or be inactive. Whether it WILL be that way, though, is anybody's guess, given the damn way McCarthy handles personnel.

[oldbutnotdeadyet]

you think he will die?

Yes....i do.

[mraynrand]

Janis still was running some wrong routes last night.

[Joemailman]

Janis still was running some wrong routes last night.

He was. Although Rodgers in his PC said when Cobb went out, both Abby and Janis had to run routes that they had barely run in practice. Routes that were designed for Cobb. I'll drink the Kool-aid and say maybe another offseason/training camp will improve his precision on route running.

[hoosier]

Janus should be deployed at least twice a game on Haily Mary plays next year. Even if Rodgers has a bad year next year and only completes 50% that will still provide a huge boost to the offensive production.

[texaspackerbacker]

He was. Although Rodgers in his PC said when Cobb went out, both Abby and Janis had to run routes that they had barely run in practice. Routes that were designed for Cobb. I'll drink the Kool-aid and say maybe another offseason/training camp will improve his precision on route running.

That's on the coaching staff. Hell, the slow development of Janis in general is on the coaching staff.

[mraynrand]

That's on the coaching staff. Hell, the slow development of Janis in general is on the coaching staff.

Whew. Thank god Janis is off the hook. Tex, maybe you should be in charge of sending him the "best attitude" trophy.

[3irty1]

Janis will certainly be on the team for his special teams value alone. Even without his considerable upside at WR he's an ace gunner and decent kick returner which is enough to make him a tough cut.

That said you've got to feel good about both him and Abbrederis as WRs going into next season. Janis seems to be polished enough that he can at least get on the field now. Furthermore I think it bodes well that he's already mastered an NFL position even if its just a special teams one. Similarly Abby looks to have build himself and NFL body which was his biggest red flag as a prospect. I think there is a good chance both of these guys take a jump this offseason and become more of a thing.

[call_me_ishmael]

He will be on the team due to ST play. They will probably try to find a few more ways to use his speed at WR, but he will be a typical 4-5 WR.

This is exactly right. Janis showed enough to me in the game yesterday that he is physically capable of playing more on offense than he did this year. They have 6 guys that will likely be on the roster next year at wideout. I no longer think they will draft a WR high. They will give the WR another year to shake out. Yes, the group was pretty bad this year, but all 6 will be on an NFL roster next year.

My prediction is they bring in a receivers coach. No more of this dual receivers/quarterback coach business.

[call_me_ishmael]

Abby needs to get bigger next year. He is too slight of build to take NFL punishment. He needs to add some thickness. If he really is 6'2", which seems unlikely to me, 190-195 is not very heavy.

[mraynrand]

I don't know about James Jones. I don't see him on the roster next year.

[Pugger]

That's on the coaching staff. Hell, the slow development of Janis in general is on the coaching staff.

Of all of the WRs who needed an position coach it was Janis. I hope to God Mike corrects this mistake this offseason and has a separate QB and WR coach.

[call_me_ishmael]

I don't know about James Jones. I don't see him on the roster next year.

Don't think so either.

Nelson, Cobb, Adams, Montgomery, Abbrederis, and Janis are all pretty much locks to make the roster next year pending injury. I just don't see how Abby or Janis wouldn't make the roster after what they showed. Abby needs to get bigger.

[mraynrand]

Don't think so either.

Nelson, Cobb, Adams, Montgomery, Abbrederis, and Janis are all pretty much locks to make the roster next year pending injury. I just don't see how Abby or Janis wouldn't make the roster after what they showed. Abby needs to get bigger.

I keep forgetting about poor Monty. Ya, with those six, they oughtta be able to tear up the league.

[Striker]

Don't think so either.

Nelson, Cobb, Adams, Montgomery, Abbrederis, and Janis are all pretty much locks to make the roster next year pending injury. I just don't see how Abby or Janis wouldn't make the roster after what they showed. Abby needs to get bigger.

I agree. I think there's about a 1 percent chance of James Jones returning. He brings some nostalgia, but physically he doesn't really have it anymore. His limited speed is even further down.

[Pugger]

Yes, we need speed at WR and TE next season. Without Jordy defenses didn't fear our deep ball at all.

[Striker]

As for Janis, even if he becomes solely a burner/deep threat that's fine with me. Just need someone to draw the safeties deep/open the middle up again.

[run pMc]

Yes, Janis unless he stinks it up in TC next year, gets hurt, or arrested, he stays for just his ST value.

Agree a WR coach is needed, especially one that can help develop the younguns and teach the group how to beat press coverage. Might also help if McCarthy designed some plays to help beat that coverage as well...it should't be hard to do (use motion, bunch formations, etc.). I can't imagine GB is the only team with receivers that struggle at it. They also need more speed...swapping Janis for Jones could help there, assuming Janis makes a leap.

[red]

I agree. I think there's about a 1 percent chance of James Jones returning. He brings some nostalgia, but physically he doesn't really have it anymore. His limited speed is even further down.

but even with his limited speed he was better then cobb and adams

why get rid of the best player of the group if you can't keep them all?

jones with his slow ass could still get open and catch a ball every now and then, cobb with all his quickness couldn't get away from anyone all season. probably because the wallet in his back pocket if just too heavy for him

[red]

and since we're kind of turning this into the future at WR thread

what happens if jordy loses a step because of the injury?

we either need to really put our faith in janis, which i would have a hard time seeing m3 and a-rod doing that after not wanting him on the field all year, or we need to draft a big speedster

[Pugger]

and since we're kind of turning this into the future at WR thread

what happens if jordy loses a step because of the injury?

we either need to really put our faith in janis, which i would have a hard time seeing m3 and a-rod doing that after not wanting him on the field all year, or we need to draft a big speedster

If Jordy loses a step because of that injury we might have to draft a speedy WR.

[red]

If Jordy loses a step because of that injury we might have to draft a speedy WR.

the draft and any decent free agents will be long gone by the time we figure out if jordy is back to 100% or not

[King Friday]

but even with his limited speed he was better then cobb and adams

why get rid of the best player of the group if you can't keep them all?

Jones was not really better than Cobb. Cobb was bracketed by 2 defensive players on a vast majority of the plays this year, while Jones almost exclusively had single coverage because NOBODY feared he would beat them deep. If Jones got the attention that Cobb got from opposing defenses, he wouldn't have caught shit this year. With all the injuries, opposing defenses had the luxury of being able to take away Cobb and force another WR on the team to beat them. We all see how that worked out.

So, no, Jones is not the best WR on the team.

[red]

Jones was not really better than Cobb. Cobb was bracketed by 2 defensive players on a vast majority of the plays this year, while Jones almost exclusively had single coverage because NOBODY feared he would beat them deep. If Jones got the attention that Cobb got from opposing defenses, he wouldn't have caught shit this year. With all the injuries, opposing defenses had the luxury of being able to take away Cobb and force another WR on the team to beat them. We all see how that worked out.

So, no, Jones is not the best WR on the team.

:roll:

[denverYooper]

Janis will have a shot for an expanded role next year, though it's hard to see him higher than #4 until at least 2017.

They'll work up a package of plays for him and if he really works on his detail this offseason, he'll be like George and Weezy.

[King Friday]

If Jordy loses a step because of that injury we might have to draft a speedy WR.

I think we need to draft several speedy TEs instead. It is far more important that we have a target that can attack the middle of the field and be more of a threat in short yardage/goal line situations. DickRod simply looks like he's wearing concrete shoes and has limited value in those situations because it takes him too damn long to get where he needs to be.

[Guiness]

but even with his limited speed he was better then cobb and adams

why get rid of the best player of the group if you can't keep them all?

jones with his slow ass could still get open and catch a ball every now and then, cobb with all his quickness couldn't get away from anyone all season. probably because the wallet in his back pocket if just too heavy for him

Jones was able to be a useful weapon and he got open, although mostly by getting away with pushing off at the top of the route. I'm surprised he didn't get called for it more.

Still, I don't expect him to be back next year.

[Maxie the Taxi]

Jones was able to be a useful weapon and he got open, although mostly by getting away with pushing off at the top of the route. I'm surprised he didn't get called for it more.

Still, I don't expect him to be back next year.You would have thought that Jones would have gotten more chances yesterday, since the refs weren't calling PI.

[Guiness]

Things looks to be crowded at WR next year. Even the simple math

Nelson
Cobb
Adams
Montgomery
Janis
Abbrederis

That's 6. Add a draft pick (TT's draft picks almost always make the team) and something has to give. I like Abbrederis more as a WR than I do Janis, so I think he stays and Janis goes. His ST contributions are important, but so were Tracy White's and look where that got him.

The unknown factor of course is that the top 4 guys in that list are all currently injured. How many will be ready to go for TC? :roll:

[pbmax]

I agree. I think there's about a 1 percent chance of James Jones returning. He brings some nostalgia, but physically he doesn't really have it anymore. His limited speed is even further down.

Player-Coach.

[call_me_ishmael]

and since we're kind of turning this into the future at WR thread

what happens if jordy loses a step because of the injury?

we either need to really put our faith in janis, which i would have a hard time seeing m3 and a-rod doing that after not wanting him on the field all year, or we need to draft a big speedster

And who do they cut? Cobb? Adams? Montgomery? Abby? Janis? Nelson? They aren't drafting a WR - they are going to hope that some better health and good fortune happens this year. They will likely draft a TE.

[Patler]

I like Abbrederis more as a WR than I do Janis, so I think he stays and Janis goes. His ST contributions are important, but so were Tracy White's and look where that got him.


Big difference between Janis and White is that Janis is not just a coverage guy, which WHite was primarily. Janis is a legitimate threat as a KO return man, good enough that they won't have to risk Montgomery there if they don't want to. Abbrederis has been their second choice punt returner to Hyde, but Janis did well with a few preseason punt return opportunities as well, and plays on punt return teams even when not the return man. He is a key member on all four teams.

[Patler]

And who do they cut? Cobb? Adams? Montgomery? Abby? Janis? Nelson? They aren't drafting a WR - they are going to hope that some better health and good fortune happens this year. They will likely draft a TE.

When it comes down to it, if healthy, Cobb and Montgomery are relatively the same, with Montgomery being perhaps better from the backfield, and Cobb perhaps better in the open field. Abbrederis is the same WR as Cobb and Montgomery, not useful from the backfield, but perhaps the best route runner of the three. Cobb, Montgomery and Abbrederis is where the glut is among WRs. Barring injuries, you need two of the three.

[call_me_ishmael]

When it comes down to it, if healthy, Cobb and Montgomery are relatively the same, with Montgomery being perhaps better from the backfield, and Cobb perhaps better in the open field. Abbrederis is the same WR as Cobb and Montgomery, not useful from the backfield, but perhaps the best route runner of the three. Cobb, Montgomery and Abbrederis is where the glut is among WRs. Barring injuries, you need two of the three.

Don't disagree - but why not keep them all if they're all good NFL caliber players. I just don't see them adding another receiver next year. I think they give it another go and assume Nelson will be a solid player and Adams will get out of his funk.

[Patler]

Don't disagree - but why not keep them all if they're all good NFL caliber players. I just don't see them adding another receiver next year. I think they give it another go and assume Nelson will be a solid player and Adams will get out of his funk.

I think they will keep all three. The question was asked who you would get rid of if you wanted to bring in someone new. I think Abbrederis would likely be the guy, not as valuable on ST as Janis, still suspect physically, and being best at what Cobb and Montgomery do too, but not as versatile as they are.

[texaspackerbacker]

After what Janis has shown pretty much every time he got a chance at WR, how can anybody see him as anything less than second only to a healthy Nelson? Of the seven total, Jones and/or Adams should be the first to go. Does Montgomery have anywhere near the speed or athleticism of Janis, not to even mention durability? I doubt it.

Speaking of TEs with speed, another apparently talented but barely used Packer is Backman. Add him to the list with Janis, Elliot, and Gunter.

[red]

When it comes down to it, if healthy, Cobb and Montgomery are relatively the same, with Montgomery being perhaps better from the backfield, and Cobb perhaps better in the open field. Abbrederis is the same WR as Cobb and Montgomery, not useful from the backfield, but perhaps the best route runner of the three. Cobb, Montgomery and Abbrederis is where the glut is among WRs. Barring injuries, you need two of the three.

and one of those guys will count 9.15 million against the cap while the other two are on cheap rookie deals

to me, adams is also a candidate to take a hike

and of course, like i said earlier, janis could be the odd man out and off the team next year

[Guiness]

I think they will keep all three. The question was asked who you would get rid of if you wanted to bring in someone new. I think Abbrederis would likely be the guy, not as valuable on ST as Janis, still suspect physically, and being best at what Cobb and Montgomery do too, but not as versatile as they are.

You think this is the year they keep 6 WRs than? Seems like it gets brought up every year but it never happens. The Packers carried 11 DBs this year, if he's that valuable on ST then maybe the swap a DB for a WR.

[Guiness]

and one of those guys will count 9.15 million against the cap while the other two are on cheap rookie deals

to me, adams is also a candidate to take a hike

and of course, like i said earlier, janis could be the odd man out and off the team next year

Adams is hard to judge for sure. If he doesn't have a good TC next fall he could find himself on the bubble.

[Patler]

After what Janis has shown pretty much every time he got a chance at WR, how can anybody see him as anything less than second only to a healthy Nelson? Of the seven total, Jones and/or Adams should be the first to go. Does Montgomery have anywhere near the speed or athleticism of Janis, not to even mention durability? I doubt it.


Janis showed last night that he still has a long way to go before he will be a starter. His next step is to play an appreciable number of meaningful snaps each game, like a third or fourth receiver.

[Patler]

Adams is hard to judge for sure. If he doesn't have a good TC next fall he could find himself on the bubble.

Yup, he will be at a crossroad next year, is he the player of the potential shown as a rookie, or the disappointing player of 2015.

[Patler]

You think this is the year they keep 6 WRs than? Seems like it gets brought up every year but it never happens. The Packers carried 11 DBs this year, if he's that valuable on ST then maybe the swap a DB for a WR.

They had 6 for most of this year, from when Abbrederis was signed to when Montgomery was put on IR, something like 12 weeks.

[Guiness]

They had 6 for most of this year, from when Abbrederis was signed to when Montgomery was put on IR, something like 12 weeks.

But not 6 coming out of camp. Abbrederis was called up when Montgomery went down, right?

[Patler]

Abbrederis was signed for week 4, after Adams got hurt in the third game. Jones had a hamstring problem at the same time, and Cobb was still hurting from his preseason injury. Montgomery got hurt three weeks after Abbrederis was signed. The point is, from week 4 when Abbrederis was signed through week 15 after which Montgomery was put on IR, for 12 weeks they carried 6 WRs on the 53 man roster. No reason they can't from week 1.

[woodbuck27]

He was. Although Rodgers in his PC said when Cobb went out, both Abby and Janis had to run routes that they had barely run in practice. Routes that were designed for Cobb. I'll drink the Kool-aid and say maybe another offseason/training camp will improve his precision on route running.

That speaks mountains of how things go with the Green Bay Packers and a MM run practise. What is it? Some Private School run 'You' should know your place ANAL Hyped System where you can't even offer any advice or input until MM decides 'You may speak'.

Mike McCarthy in a typical practise for Aaron Rodgers and the pecking order of wide receivers:

"OK you guys...HaHaHaa ... MY GUY's... My Good Men ....You get to learn the real game stuff. Over here Jordy, Randall and Davata (what's your name!?) Ohh Ohh right I have to try harder to remember that...I'll just call you '3' OK ....Yaa Know your my Number Three Wideout. Over here...this will be fun."... Who else let me see....is here..Ohh Thanks for showing up Who are you guys anyway? Jan what? Arba Abra...ahh shit..I hate that.....Frick why did Ted draft you? Yer name is impossible to pronounce....all the same.....how was your day yesterday New Guys...Well no time now for that...might talk to you later HaHaHaa..........What Aaron? There you go again...yer not trying to take over are yaa?....... What? Ahh shit Aaron 'shut your pie hole' and 'for Christ Sakes I told you'. . . . . . I run things around here and they'll learn the real stuff when that time comes. Whaaaaaat Aaron..... Ohh shit...I havn't the time today. I'm still looking for Ted...been three fricken days since he showed his scruffy face around here.

That piss's me off......... get's ... right... down... on my Irish."

"Anyway Guy's forgive my nerves ..... (as he pops a few more TUMs) that's something else again."m You don't need to know."

Right now it's near game day and we're doing route running 101. Let's stay focused....can we.

You young guys. We've got some pretty cool T's in just yesterday. Go see the equipment guy. Aaron.....What's his name? I can't remember names...too much fricken' stress round this monkey Hole." Let's practise...something good might come of it."

[mraynrand]

and of course, like i said earlier, janis could be the odd man out and off the team next year

Not a chance. At the very least, he will be the Jarrett Bush, the Travis Jervey, the Marcus Wilson....

[pbmax]

Not a chance. At the very least, he will be the Jarrett Bush, the Travis Jervey, the Marcus Wilson....

He is better than any of them. Even if you judge Bush a better DB than Janis a WR, Bush was of no field position value like Janis is on KO return.

[mraynrand]

He is better than any of them. Even if you judge Bush a better DB than Janis a WR, Bush was of no field position value like Janis is on KO return.

that's why I said at the very least. Janis isn't going anywhere. The question is whether he has it between the ears to play WR. Rodgers had to throw away a potential TD pass last night because Janis didn't flatten his route. He probably made other errors we're not aware of. Now if he were just a seasoned veteran, assignment sure, like julius Peppers, well then we could trust him.....

SLIDE, SLIDE!!!

[call_me_ishmael]

One thing that I don't get is the obsession with speed. Speed does not equal athleticism. It is certainly a component of it, sure. For example, it is no secret that Ted likes guys who run the first 10 yards very fast. That does not mean they have great top end speed, it means they can accelerate explosively. Give me someone who is explosive and quick and runs great routes over a speedster any day. Greg Jennings was not an elite burner but he was deadly as a route runner in his prime.

[pbmax]

One thing that I don't get is the obsession with speed. Speed does not equal athleticism. It is certainly a component of it, sure. For example, it is no secret that Ted likes guys who run the first 10 yards very fast. That does not mean they have great top end speed, it means they can accelerate explosively. Give me someone who is explosive and quick and runs great routes over a speedster any day. Greg Jennings was not an elite burner but he was deadly as a route runner in his prime.

Well, speed and quickness get used interchangeably sometimes. Ted does like 10 yard quickness at several positions, but his WR corp if full of guys who do not have it.

Janis might but is undisciplined in his routes. Cobb SHOULD be able to be open immediately but it doesn't happen. Nelson, Jones and Adams all take a long time to get moving. Abby and only are the two that stand out in this area. So they could use another one, or even better, Adams and Janis to get much better at getting into and out of routes.

But they also could use speed deep. One reason teams liked man versus the Pack was that a single high safety wan't going to be put in an impossible position very often with the Packers deep speed limited to non speedsters Jones/Adams and the somewhat unreliable (and infrequently repped) Janis. A field stretching TE would help too.

[Guiness]

Abbrederis was signed for week 4, after Adams got hurt in the third game. Jones had a hamstring problem at the same time, and Cobb was still hurting from his preseason injury. Montgomery got hurt three weeks after Abbrederis was signed. The point is, from week 4 when Abbrederis was signed through week 15 after which Montgomery was put on IR, for 12 weeks they carried 6 WRs on the 53 man roster. No reason they can't from week 1.

There doesn't seem to be any reason they can't...but they don't. At least not so far, maybe Janis will be the reason they do.

[Patler]

There doesn't seem to be any reason they can't...but they don't. At least not so far, maybe Janis will be the reason they do.

I don't get the hangup with #s on week 1? The numbers kept at different positions is very fluid. They've carried anywhere from 1 to 3 fullbacks in week 1; any where from 8 to 10 offensive linemen; from a few to a lot of LBs, DBs or DLs. Carrying 5 WRs has been "standard" for a while, carrying another one in week 1 isn't much of a step, especially after carrying 6 for most of 2015.

[Guiness]

I don't get the hangup with #s on week 1? The numbers kept at different positions is very fluid. They've carried anywhere from 1 to 3 fullbacks in week 1; any where from 8 to 10 offensive linemen; from a few to a lot of LBs, DBs or DLs. Carrying 5 WRs has been "standard" for a while, carrying another one in week 1 isn't much of a step, especially after carrying 6 for most of 2015.

No hangup, just seems like every year it looks like they've got some good WRs they can't possibly let go, but they always get it down to five. I was wondering when the last time they carried more into the season though, and didn't have far to look - in 2012 there are 7 WRs listed on the final roster(!) and 7 OL (!!). In 2011 there were 6 WRs. Maybe we will see it again this year.

[Joemailman]

When you consider that Janis is your #1 ST player, Abby is your #2 punt returner, and Cobb and Monty both help out in the backfield, I don't think 6 is unlikely at all. Pack used to keep an extra DB because Bush was a premier ST player.

[King Friday]

When you consider that Janis is your #1 ST player, Abby is your #2 punt returner, and Cobb and Monty both help out in the backfield, I don't think 6 is unlikely at all. Pack used to keep an extra DB because Bush was a premier ST player.

Toss in that we will only be a few months removed from having just 3 healthy WRs to utilize during a playoff game, and keeping 6 WRs next year is a no-brainer. Janis is almost a lock to make the team due to his special teams acumen alone.

I would really love to see us have some packages where Janis and Jordy are out wide, Cobb/Abby in the slot, and with a capable young TE to attack between the hashes. That would put an end to defenses rolling up on us real quick.

[Smidgeon]

the draft and any decent free agents will be long gone by the time we figure out if jordy is back to 100% or not

Not sure that's true. If Jordy's already running (considering he injured his knee in the preseason), by April, they might have an idea of his speed, though probably not his cutting and burst.

Maybe not by free agency though.

[Smidgeon]

Janis will have a shot for an expanded role next year, though it's hard to see him higher than #4 until at least 2017.

They'll work up a package of plays for him and if he really works on his detail this offseason, he'll be like George and Weezy.

Yep. Not next year, but the year after.

[Smidgeon]

Well, speed and quickness get used interchangeably sometimes. Ted does like 10 yard quickness at several positions, but his WR corp if full of guys who do not have it.

Janis might but is undisciplined in his routes. Cobb SHOULD be able to be open immediately but it doesn't happen. Nelson, Jones and Adams all take a long time to get moving. Abby and only are the two that stand out in this area. So they could use another one, or even better, Adams and Janis to get much better at getting into and out of routes.

But they also could use speed deep. One reason teams liked man versus the Pack was that a single high safety wan't going to be put in an impossible position very often with the Packers deep speed limited to non speedsters Jones/Adams and the somewhat unreliable (and infrequently repped) Janis. A field stretching TE would help too.

Didn't Janis have an insane 3 cone? He should have great change of direction.

[Smidgeon]

When you consider that Janis is your #1 ST player, Abby is your #2 punt returner, and Cobb and Monty both help out in the backfield, I don't think 6 is unlikely at all. Pack used to keep an extra DB because Bush was a premier ST player.

Abby is #4 PR, I thought, after Hyde, Cobb, Montgomery.

[Joemailman]

Abby is #4 PR, I thought, after Hyde, Cobb, Montgomery.

Not really sure. Hyde is #1. Cobb returned 4 although those might have been when Abby was hurt. Monty was returning K.O.'s before he got hurt. He didn't return any punts. I wouldn't be surprised to see Abby be #2. Cobb has more value to the offense, and hasn't done anything special returning punts since his rookie year.

[woodbuck27]

Aaron Rodgers was not a reliable QB. For Janis to succeed, Rodgers needs to earn Janis's trust.

Do you know on an individual one to one basis and getting to know and respect another your post isn't inaccurate Harlan.

People or an individual judges another's value 'to the group' or oneself ....based on 2 criteria upon first meeting.

It's just like an interview for any job. You have to make that first acceptable right impression. It's got to all about time and that to the point of being simply STUPID.

That first encounter...be cautious...pucker up your asshole.

Screw that up and the relationship may go off the tracks forever. Why is that generally the case? I believe that's so because too many need to fit into 'the GROUP' and feel accepted as one of that group or some people are simply too damn selfish and all caught up in their pathetic unremitting ego drives.

This is no place for amateur psycology hour. Yet all the same I wrote it and I DO CARE...I've always been....the Teacher and Leader. :whaa:

Focusing on WER Jeff Janis or substitute another ie Ty Montgomery and Jared Abbrederis in the same file:

WR Jared Abbrederis or affectionately here called Abby by well....the Group. He's Mr. Jared Abbrederis to this poster and as a member of Packer Nation I expect that he has and will gives his all BECAUSE he's treated properly so we see the absolute BEST from him and Green Bay Packers.....and winning the Super Bowl.

I'll submit this to support your post Harlan and it's what I've learned is the case over my lifetime:

People assess us all very quickly. It might go down inside of 10 seconds. They might at first hand reject you based on any number of initial observations: ie .....your face...ethnicity.... name.....skin color and all that detail cast aside because yur real Waspish.... People ask themselves two questions regarding any other....Powerful or not. •Can I trust this person?


A) Can I TRUST this person; and that is certainly of primary importance before getting down to the real nitty gritty and:

B) Can I RESPECT this person?

If your the type that needs others and must feel accepted you'll most liokely also be a clickish ass kissing ...follower and therefore miss out on any real potential genius you nay otherwise culyivate b y thinking for yourself for the bettern >>> BEST way. I realize the meritsn in 'GROUP THINK'. Yet I also know this :

In any group theren is the ultimate mind and personality that leads to then BEST results.

I never was able to dig...stale 'stuck in the mud and going no where ...too slow' (as getting there too fast reveals too much that may be cause for a proper intervention and up setting of the OLD and replaced by the better idea for a hopeful future ...THE NEW....or that then status quo is the way.

If you get that which I've written here...... you'll get who I am here.

If I was in Aaron Rodgers place. Dealing with Mike McCarthy and Ted Thompson would certainly offer me the most outstanding challenge. Aaron Rodgers had to wait to find his special (whatever that really is relationship with .;..going back to his beginning as a Packer...and Brett Favre...and he absolutely admired Favre as the QB in the NFL he identified as having such outstanding qualities. I've always felt you\'d have to be frozen in your own time not to see the greatness in Favre.

Therein lies the rub. Aaron isn't Brett. Aaron isn't Mike Mccarthy and unless those two Packers are totally on the same page and correctly so in terms of offering the BEST hope for Packer Nation and Super Bowl.

The whole thing is used wash water. . . . days and more days old and stinking up the joint in it's negative and mostly useless reality. That meaning NOT a ghost of a chance and this present set of Management and HC and his staff and the Packer roster actually being truly strong enough to defeat all the other NFL teams and what they have in place to in TRUTH and REALITY ... BE...a contender for the Super Bowl.

I'm never going to be pleased with anything less than seeing the real potential to win a Super Bowl.

Anything less than that measns I want change. MM and TT have been in place since what 2006. Are we seeing MM grow?

Does MM have anything to do with new blood and the XERY BEST way to bring that lifeblood to the team productively and Super Bowl? Specifically and this thread:

Did MM treat Jeff Janis ( Ty Montgomery; Jared Abbrederis ) with the very BEST and TRUST AND RESPECT or did MM Pigeon Hole or in any manner HOLD Janis ...any new Packer back by just the way he designs his off season program and all of his practise sessions pre and in season?

[deake]

The question is which one will be injured, or how many will be on IR rather than will they carry six?

[mraynrand]

That first encounter...be cautious...pucker up your asshole.

You were responding to Harlan, but this is always good advice.

[pbmax]

Didn't Janis have an insane 3 cone? He should have great change of direction.

He probably does, but it can't help you on the field when you round your cuts in a route.

But Patler's point about his effect on the game is well worth remembering. Even with all the tiny things he does wrong, he still makes plays. They have to find room for him. He is just that kind of rare athletic freak.

[mraynrand]

He probably does, but it can't help you on the field when you round your cuts in a route.

But Patler's point about his effect on the game is well worth remembering. Even with all the tiny things he does wrong, he still makes plays. They have to find room for him. He is just that kind of rare athletic freak.

To you they seem tiny, but to Rodgers, that's at least 11.1376 QBR points over the span of a season!

[pbmax]

To you they seem tiny, but to Rodgers, that's at least 11.1376 QBR points over the span of a season!

Exactly. Though if he keeps running the slant like he did versus the Cards, that distrust will evaporate in a hurry. It was a beautiful thing. Fought all the way through the route, won position and fought for the ball. Nearly brought me to tears.

[Striker]

but even with his limited speed he was better then cobb and adams

why get rid of the best player of the group if you can't keep them all?

jones with his slow ass could still get open and catch a ball every now and then, cobb with all his quickness couldn't get away from anyone all season. probably because the wallet in his back pocket if just too heavy for him

As others said, he was mostly left alone vs. the other players on the roster who were more of a threat. With zero upside and on the wrong side of 30 I don't see any world where they re-sign Jones in favor of Adams/Cobb/Abby/Janis.

[woodbuck27]

Exactly. Though if he keeps running the slant like he did versus the Cards, that distrust will evaporate in a hurry. It was a beautiful thing. Fought all the way through the route, won position and fought for the ball. Nearly brought me to tears.

Any 10 year old football enthusiast in North America...knew...he ...had...to...go...there.

PACKERS !

[Striker]

One thing that I don't get is the obsession with speed. Speed does not equal athleticism. It is certainly a component of it, sure. For example, it is no secret that Ted likes guys who run the first 10 yards very fast. That does not mean they have great top end speed, it means they can accelerate explosively. Give me someone who is explosive and quick and runs great routes over a speedster any day. Greg Jennings was not an elite burner but he was deadly as a route runner in his prime.

It could be the "Madden effect" as well. Looking at the raw statistic in a video game and thinking "well that's all there is to it".

[Striker]

As others have said, Janis seems to also be that super valuable ST guy who plays 3 different roles for the team between offense and ST. So he'd have to really eff up or someone else would need to join the team who is just as intriguing for Janis to go.

Thinking about his poor route running more, there was lots of problems with crisp routes and "improv" after routes break down this season. So maybe with better/dedicated coaching the entire corps will take a step up next year?

[Maxie the Taxi]

One thing that I don't get is the obsession with speed. Speed does not equal athleticism. It is certainly a component of it, sure. For example, it is no secret that Ted likes guys who run the first 10 yards very fast. That does not mean they have great top end speed, it means they can accelerate explosively. Give me someone who is explosive and quick and runs great routes over a speedster any day. Greg Jennings was not an elite burner but he was deadly as a route runner in his prime. TT's obsession is height. He doesn't draft WR's under 6' tall unless they're named Cobb. The problem is many of the best NFL receivers nowadays (and the fastest) are 5'10" or so...and their last name is usually Brown.

It's possible to draft route runners who have speed as well. There are several in this upcoming draft class.

[woodbuck27]

TT's obsession is height. He doesn't draft WR's under 6' tall unless they're named Cobb. The problem is many of the best NFL receivers nowadays (and the fastest) are 5'10" or so...and their last name is usually Brown.

It's possible to draft route runners who have speed as well. There are several in this upcoming draft class.

Is there any like Antonio Brown possibly available after Rounds 3-4?

I've neglected this part of my overall interest and knowledge as the fan.

I need shortcuts. . . . and the next week or two. After that I'm going to be less ignorant I expect. :-)

[Maxie the Taxi]

Is there any like Antonio Brown possibly available after Rounds 3-4?

I've neglected this part of my overall interest and knowledge as the fan.

I need shortcuts. . . . and the next week or two. After that I'm going to be less ignorant I expect. :-)

Sterling Shepard, Round 3?


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OXCw9SqzcZA

[Joemailman]

Shepard is an inch shorter and the same weight as Greg Jennings. I could see TT having a Round 2-3 grade on him.

[Maxie the Taxi]

Shepard is an inch shorter and the same weight as Greg Jennings. I could see TT having a Round 2-3 grade on him.Yup. 5'10" 193 lbs. He reminds me a lot of Jennings. He's just what the doctor ordered for our WR corps. But TT likes the taller, bigger guys like Monty. Then again, look at what Seattle got when they drafted Lockett or Arizona when they drafted JJ Nelson. It's a new NFL, where small guys with speed can not only survive, but flourish. They same is also true about RB. See Tyler Ervin in this year's draft.

[smuggler]

Jennings ran 4.40 electronic. That's pretty fast. He was a good route runner, sure, and had nice wiggle. He still had wheels.

As has been said, Jennings was 5'11"

[Fritz]

I am all but certain Jones will be gone, though I think he'd be a good WR coach.

I believe TT will draft a wide receiver, but probably not in the first couple rounds.

We're all complaining about the wide receiver position, but remember that the Packers played most of the AZ game having lost their #1 (Nelson), #2 (Cobb), #3 (Adams), and #4 (Montgomery) receivers...

And only one of the guys on the field at the end was an old, slow vet. Two were young guys with quicks or wheels.

That's crazy.

[Guiness]

I am all but certain Jones will be gone, though I think he'd be a good WR coach.

I believe TT will draft a wide receiver, but probably not in the first couple rounds.

We're all complaining about the wide receiver position, but remember that the Packers played most of the AZ game having lost their #1 (Nelson), #2 (Cobb), #3 (Adams), and #4 (Montgomery) receivers...

And only one of the guys on the field at the end was an old, slow vet. Two were young guys with quicks or wheels.

That's crazy.

Has there ever been a guy who two teams in receiving yards, two years in a row, only to find himself without a job after both years?

[Patler]

Has there ever been a guy who two teams in receiving yards, two years in a row, only to find himself without a job after both years?

I asked myself; "Who might have worn out his welcome after good years?" (Not that Jones did, but I needed someone good enough to get a lot of yards but be released.)
I immediately answered myself; "T.O."

Sure enough, in 2008 he lead Dallas in receiving yards but was released. He signed a one year contract with Buffalo and lead them in receiving yards. He was not resigned, but went to the Bengals.

[Bossman641]

I just can't see Jones coming back. He served his purpose this year but 6 games with one catch or less, 3 games with no catches at all. Next year he won't be good enough to be 1-3 and doesn't have enough upside to stash as 4-6.

Thanks JJ. We will always have 2015 and the Hoodie

https://i.ytimg.com/vi/2SwRd3u_QkQ/maxresdefault.jpg

[MadScientist]

Janis is similar to Jarrett Bush. A special teams demon who makes too many mistakes from the line of scrimmage. Unlike Bush, Janis has top notch physical tools, so if he puts things together, he could be really good. Does he have the mental ability and the discipline to fix his short comings? Time will tell. Because he's so good on ST, he'll stick with the team and likely get a chance to show he can play on offense.

[yetisnowman]

Janis is similar to Jarrett Bush. A special teams demon who makes too many mistakes from the line of scrimmage. Unlike Bush, Janis has top notch physical tools, so if he puts things together, he could be really good. Does he have the mental ability and the discipline to fix his short comings? Time will tell. Because he's so good on ST, he'll stick with the team and likely get a chance to show he can play on offense.

The dude must really suck in practice. He has shown he can play. When he gets snaps and targets, positive things have happened. Not sure his opportunities were as limited as they were.

[mraynrand]

I am all but certain Jones will be gone, though I think he'd be a good WR coach.

Based on.....? The improvement of Janis? :)


That's crazy.

[Harlan Huckleby]

I just can't see Jones coming back. He served his purpose this year but 6 games with one catch or less, 3 games with no catches at all.

I agree his career is over. But your stats underestimate his contribution. Other teams had to devote a good DB to take him out - AZ used their best. Plus without him, Packers would have lost two more games and missed the playoffs.

[MadScientist]

The dude must really suck in practice. He has shown he can play. When he gets snaps and targets, positive things have happened. Not sure his opportunities were as limited as they were.

Suck, no. Inconsistent, yes. He made some great plays against AZ, but ran his route wrong one one near the goal line that we saw. What we don't see is how many times is is off or sloppy in his routes when he doesn't get targeted. When Bush screwed up, the opposing QB could target him. When Janis screws up, the ball most likely goes somewhere else. Don't take this as hating on Janis. He has the size and speed the Packers could really use, and has shown decent hands, a willingness to go up and fight for the ball, and stepped up in a big game. I just think there are solid reasons that he hasn't been involved in the offense more.

I damn sure want to see him on the field in desperation / hail Mary times. Size and speed matter more than precision in those situations.

[MadScientist]

So does Janis now have the record for most receiving yards on a single drive (101)? If not, who does and how many yards?

Before that last drive, Janis had 5 catches for 44 yards and 1 TD. Nice for the last receiver on the bench, but nothing to get to excited about.

[mraynrand]

So does Janis now have the record for most receiving yards on a single drive (101)? If not, who does and how many yards?

Before that last drive, Janis had 5 catches for 44 yards and 1 TD. Nice for the last receiver on the bench, but nothing to get to excited about.

If that's your #6 receiver, you have to feel totally pumped.

Just to say it, in case it isn't totally obvious, Janis has some skills, but his 101 on the final drive mostly goes to Rodgers. On the fourth and 20, that throw was 60 yards on as much of a rope as you'll ever see. Your average NFL QB can make that accurate and rapid of a delivery on say a 20-30 yard pass. Along with the final end zone shot I bet it's Rodgers and no one else right now who can make those throws. Arm, but not the accuracy: Cam, Big Ben, maybe Eli and Cutler.

[Smidgeon]

So does Janis now have the record for most receiving yards on a single drive (101)? If not, who does and how many yards?

Before that last drive, Janis had 5 catches for 44 yards and 1 TD. Nice for the last receiver on the bench, but nothing to get to excited about.

I forget who it was, but someone else had either 103 or 104 yards on a drive previously, but not in the playoffs.

[mraynrand]

That Janis Drive has to be 100 yards, not 101, because there was no intervening play that gained or lost yardage, unless they are admitting the refs screwed them out of a yard by misplacing the ball at some point before the final play.

[ThunderDan]

That Janis Drive has to be 100 yards, not 101, because there was no intervening play that gained or lost yardage, unless they are admitting the refs screwed them out of a yard by misplacing the ball at some point before the final play.

They had the illegal shift on DickRod between plays.

[mraynrand]

They had the illegal shift on DickRod between plays.

right. And now I realize how I screwed it up to begin with...the 4th and 20 was from the 4.

[Patler]

Before that last drive, Janis had 5 catches for 44 yards and 1 TD. Nice for the last receiver on the bench, but nothing to get to excited about.

Except you need to look more closely at those five. Two were for 1st downs besides the one for the TD. One was over the middle and he took a big hit and held on, the type of pass sorely lacking this season. Another was a strongly contested throw along the sidelines, where he used his size and strength to get the ball and stay inbounds.

On those five completions, Janis looked like the receiver we hoped Adams would be. On the other two and several of the incomplete passes, he showed his speed in addition to size, strength and jumping ability.

[Scott Campbell]

Things looks to be crowded at WR next year. Even the simple math

Nelson
Cobb
Adams
Montgomery
Janis
Abbrederis

That's 6. Add a draft pick (TT's draft picks almost always make the team) and something has to give. I like Abbrederis more as a WR than I do Janis, so I think he stays and Janis goes. His ST contributions are important, but so were Tracy White's and look where that got him.

The unknown factor of course is that the top 4 guys in that list are all currently injured. How many will be ready to go for TC? :roll:

I don't think Adams is a lock to make the team. Janis > Abby, but only because he's a special teams stud. Abby is the better receiver.

[Scott Campbell]

I suspect Monty moves up to #3 next year, unless we draft somebody better. I expect Cobb's production to rebound if Jordy returns to form. Cobb is not a #1.

[Harlan Huckleby]

I suspect Monty moves up to #3 next year, unless we draft somebody better. I expect Cobb's production to rebound if Jordy returns to form. Cobb is not a #1.

Well said. Nice to hear from you, good buddy.