Offense

[esoxx]

Sick of the offense being offensive. What is the problem?

Is it Rodgers? WR's pedistrian? Play book stale? What????

[red]

well, this time last year, we blamed it on the new guy calling the plays

so fat fuck took play calling back

and we might have gotten worse since then

[pbmax]

Its everything. The new $51 million dollar man looked bad at times.

[Harlan Huckleby]

I blame Sitton. The cancer spread before it could be excised.

[RashanGary]

I don't think we ran enough. Being on the road played a part. Aaron didn't play great. It was a really good defense.


Now, that said, there was some good things too.....

Jordy had a couple nice grabs. Looked better
Lacy is a damn good runner again
Adams is still very young.
Not sure about how I feel about Cook, but Dick Rod looks better these last two games than he ever looked last year
Cobb looks healthy and aggressive
I thought the OL, Taylor included, played pretty well against a great front on the road
We have a strong front 7. Thomas, Martinez and Ryan all showed up. The pass rush was really good.

Randall had his worst game as a pro. Bradford was throwing well, but still a bad night
MM seemed to ignore the run too much
Cook doesn't seem to have chemistry with AR
AR was tentative off balance for most of the night

[esoxx]

Your last comment sums it up; AR was tentative off balance most of the night.

Same as he has been since about week 9 last season.

Why?

Whatever was ailing the offense hasn't been fixed. At all.

[pbmax]

DickRod looks like an entirely different person. that was obviously bad weight he was carrying around.

[RashanGary]

The way Lacy is running, the improvement of Dick Rod and the addition of Cook..... It might be time for more of a rushing offense.

[Pugger]

Its everything. The new $51 million dollar man looked bad at times.

MN's D line will make a lot of O lines look bad at times.

[Pugger]

I don't think we ran enough. Being on the road played a part. Aaron didn't play great. It was a really good defense.


Now, that said, there was some good things too.....

Jordy had a couple nice grabs. Looked better
Lacy is a damn good runner again
Adams is still very young.
Not sure about how I feel about Cook, but Dick Rod looks better these last two games than he ever looked last year
Cobb looks healthy and aggressive
I thought the OL, Taylor included, played pretty well against a great front on the road
We have a strong front 7. Thomas, Martinez and Ryan all showed up. The pass rush was really good.

Randall had his worst game as a pro. Bradford was throwing well, but still a bad night
MM seemed to ignore the run too much
Cook doesn't seem to have chemistry with AR
AR was tentative off balance for most of the night

Cook did have a couple of nice catches and saved the day a couple of times after AR got stripped of the ball. RRod still isn't good at blocking.

[texaspackerbacker]

Why do we get so much mileage out of Cook and R. Rodgers, and Abbrederis and Montgomery don't even hit the field on offense (not to even mention Janis if/when he is healthy)?

Because the damn O Line can't keep the pass rush out long enough to run wide receiver patterns ....... and because McCarthy is so obsessed with run-first - even though our O Line hardly ever opens decent holes even with two tight ends - and of course, you need to keep that TE in like a fullback for pass protection. and there still isn't time to throw. The side effect of that is other teams D can jump the short routes, barely having to worry about anything long.

If the Packers had an O Line that was dominant in comparison to the competition - like Wisconsin for example, I'd be campaigning for run-first too. But that simply ain't the way it is.

And still we win and win and win, and should continue to win the great majority of games coming up - why? Mainly because Aaron Rodgers is so damn good that we can win even with all the other shit I mentioned ........ but wouldn't it be nice to surround Rodgers with something like what Brady gets surrounded with? And maybe have better play calling too?

[Cheesehead Craig]

There's just too much of a home run swing to this offense. I remember they used to say Touchdown - checkdown, but that isn't working any longer. The Packers moved the ball when they attacked the intermediary routes.

There was time to throw, but if it's not the HR ball, Rodgers bailed too quickly.

Put me in the camp that there needs to be someone brought in to bring some new ideas to the offense as defenses seem to have figured us out. It's frustrating to watch Packer WRs not open on a consistent basis while other teams seemingly have players running free on a good number of their pass plays.

[Harlan Huckleby]

Adams is still very young.

Third season. He is what he is. Makes some big plays, drops too many.

[Maxie the Taxi]

The better team won. Their QB was was better. Their receivers were better. Their coach was better.

You want to know the story of the game, look at the Ball Possession and Drive Chart. (http://prod.static.packers.clubs.nfl.com/assets/docs/gamebooks/2016/160918-gamebook-vikings.pdf) GB lost the field position battle. You can't expect an offense to excel if most of the game you're starting from your own 10 yd. line.

And the easiest way to work your way out of a field position deficit is to take what the defense gives you, not the MM/Arod Touchdown/Checkdown strategy.

Minnesota also had the best defense. You can't get greedy against it and consistently succeed. How many short completion opportunities did Arod pass up to take a shot downfield? Do we even have any pass plays in the playbook designed to target a RB curling out of the backfield in front of retreating LB's?

I think what the offense needs is more patience. If that runs against the grain of our offensive philosophy, well then the philosophy has to change or we can expect more disappointment.

[Harlan Huckleby]

That sane stranger has taken over your account again.

[superfan]

You can't expect an offense to excel if most of the game you're starting from your own 10 yd. line.

This was a fairly minor issue compared to everything else that went wrong but the lack of any punt returns was frustrating. The Vikings punted 7 times and GB managed 1 punt "return" for 2 yards - and that return was Randall picking up the blocked punt and advancing it 2 yards before going OB.

Granted 5 of those punts were inside the 20, and maybe the Viking punter was getting fantastic hang time, but to not have a single opportunity for extra yardage on a punt return didn't do the offense any favors. It seemed like the punt return blockers let the gunners run free and never gave the returner a chance.

[Upnorth]

My biggest concern is not our loss. 14-17 is okay loss for an away game, and we all know Mcarthy's record in games wit 4 points or less (stirring the pot). Im more concerned that the Jacksonville defense shut us down and then let SD put up 40 on them. That concerns me a lot...

[Pugger]

Why do we get so much mileage out of Cook and R. Rodgers, and Abbrederis and Montgomery don't even hit the field on offense (not to even mention Janis if/when he is healthy)?

Because the damn O Line can't keep the pass rush out long enough to run wide receiver patterns ....... and because McCarthy is so obsessed with run-first - even though our O Line hardly ever opens decent holes even with two tight ends - and of course, you need to keep that TE in like a fullback for pass protection. and there still isn't time to throw. The side effect of that is other teams D can jump the short routes, barely having to worry about anything long.

If the Packers had an O Line that was dominant in comparison to the competition - like Wisconsin for example, I'd be campaigning for run-first too. But that simply ain't the way it is.

And still we win and win and win, and should continue to win the great majority of games coming up - why? Mainly because Aaron Rodgers is so damn good that we can win even with all the other shit I mentioned ........ but wouldn't it be nice to surround Rodgers with something like what Brady gets surrounded with? And maybe have better play calling too?

If you listen to folks here and on other forums Rodgers best days are behind him.

[Patler]

My biggest concern is not our loss. 14-17 is okay loss for an away game, and we all know Mcarthy's record in games wit 4 points or less (stirring the pot). Im more concerned that the Jacksonville defense shut us down and then let SD put up 40 on them. That concerns me a lot...

What defense hasn't shut the Packers down in the last 16 games?
This is the new normal. Hopefully it is short term.

[Pugger]

The better team won. Their QB was was better. Their receivers were better. Their coach was better.

You want to know the story of the game, look at the Ball Possession and Drive Chart. (http://prod.static.packers.clubs.nfl.com/assets/docs/gamebooks/2016/160918-gamebook-vikings.pdf) GB lost the field position battle. You can't expect an offense to excel if most of the game you're starting from your own 10 yd. line.

And the easiest way to work your way out of a field position deficit is to take what the defense gives you, not the MM/Arod Touchdown/Checkdown strategy.

Minnesota also had the best defense. You can't get greedy against it and consistently succeed. How many short completion opportunities did Arod pass up to take a shot downfield? Do we even have any pass plays in the playbook designed to target a RB curling out of the backfield in front of retreating LB's?

I think what the offense needs is more patience. If that runs against the grain of our offensive philosophy, well then the philosophy has to change or we can expect more disappointment.

If you just look at raw numbers the reason we lost was turnovers. That is gonna kill ya, especially on the road. If we don't turn it over we win the game IMO even tho our QB is having his struggles.

[Patler]

If you just look at raw numbers the reason we lost was turnovers. That is gonna kill ya, especially on the road. If we don't turn it over we win the game IMO even tho our QB is having his struggles.

Statistically true, perhaps. But, considering that they very easily could have turned the ball over twice as much as they did, I think their problems went deeper than just turnovers.

[Rutnstrut]

What defense hasn't shut the Packers down in the last 16 games?
This is the new normal. Hopefully it is short term.

It's already long past short term.

[red]

theres also the issue, that we seem to be less of a real offense, and more of one that tries to depend on the other team getting penalties

we're way to worried about getting the other team to jump offsides so we have a free play (that we always throw deep), or worrying about snapping the ball early when they have guys trying to get off the field

in the good old days, we just ran a normal offense, that huddled, and worried about executing

[Patler]

It's already long past short term.

True. I should have said, "Hopefully its not permanent."

[pbmax]

Because the damn O Line can't keep the pass rush out long enough to run wide receiver patterns ....... and because McCarthy is so obsessed with run-first - even though our O Line hardly ever opens decent holes even with two tight ends - and of course, you need to keep that TE in like a fullback for pass protection. and there still isn't time to throw. The side effect of that is other teams D can jump the short routes, barely having to worry about anything long.


They are looking to increase the number of runs.

Tom Silverstein ‏@TomSilverstein 4m4 minutes ago
Bennett on run game: We need to get them more involved. We have a plan in place. Sometimes flow of the game has an effect.

[Patler]

theres also the issue, that we seem to be less of a real offense, and more of one that tries to depend on the other team getting penalties

we're way to worried about getting the other team to jump offsides so we have a free play (that we always throw deep), or worrying about snapping the ball early when they have guys trying to get off the field


It does seem to be a bit overly important to AR, doesn't it?

[red]

They are looking to increase the number of runs.

Tom Silverstein ‏@TomSilverstein 4m4 minutes ago
Bennett on run game: We need to get them more involved. We have a plan in place. Sometimes flow of the game has an effect.

we've heard this song and dance before, and yet we're still at this place

last night was not a high scoring shootout, eddie was running, ok. it was the perfect time to push the run game. yet the final tally was almost 2-1 passing to running

its all lip service when the staff and players say " we'll get that fixed". if they could fix the damn problem, it would have happened long ago

its time to start realizing that the staff is just clueless what to do and how to fix the issues

[red]

It does seem to be a bit overly important to AR, doesn't it?

its almost like its the first option, or first goal of any play

[Joemailman]

If you listen to folks here and on other forums Rodgers best days are behind him.

Favre went through a similar stretch in 1999-2000 where he was pretty mediocre. He was able to rebound to elite status. Stay tuned.

[red]

and then they fired ray rhodes

[pittstang5]

The bombs on 3rd and 2, 3rd and 3, 3rd and 4, 3rd and 1. THEY NEED TO STOP! Get the 1st down and move the chains.

Is this a fix all, No, but I'm sick of it. It doesn't help the field position battle and it doesn't help the defense, because they either have had no rest or are playing on a short field.

[Maxie the Taxi]

The bombs on 3rd and 2, 3rd and 3, 3rd and 4, 3rd and 1. THEY NEED TO STOP! Get the 1st down and move the chains.

Is this a fix all, No, but I'm sick of it. It doesn't help the field position battle and it doesn't help the defense, because they either have had no rest or are playing on a short field.Second this.

[King Friday]

The bombs on 3rd and 2, 3rd and 3, 3rd and 4, 3rd and 1. THEY NEED TO STOP! Get the 1st down and move the chains.

Is this a fix all, No, but I'm sick of it. It doesn't help the field position battle and it doesn't help the defense, because they either have had no rest or are playing on a short field.

THIS!

McCarthy's offensive approach has been figured out. Teams with good defenses know how to stop Green Bay now...and McCarthy is too much of a mental midget to find answers.

McCarthy better start putting in some film of old west coast offenses and applying some of those principles...quick slants...screens...short crossing patterns...or the Packers will waste what's left of Rodgers' career.

[beveaux1]

The bombs on 3rd and 2, 3rd and 3, 3rd and 4, 3rd and 1. THEY NEED TO STOP! Get the 1st down and move the chains.

Is this a fix all, No, but I'm sick of it. It doesn't help the field position battle and it doesn't help the defense, because they either have had no rest or are playing on a short field.

If you're having trouble sustaining an offense, the low completion Madden Football plays need to be reduced. AR is not usually even close on these throws. Not saying we should never try it, but when it becomes a tendency, opposing defenses cover it.

[red]

The bombs on 3rd and 2, 3rd and 3, 3rd and 4, 3rd and 1. THEY NEED TO STOP! Get the 1st down and move the chains.

Is this a fix all, No, but I'm sick of it. It doesn't help the field position battle and it doesn't help the defense, because they either have had no rest or are playing on a short field.

this has been going on for years

its what fat mike is, a hippo can't change his stretched out stripes

[pbmax]

and then they fired ray rhodes

It was all Sherm Lewis' fault. Letting Brett throw deep.

So I say we fire Alex Van Pelt.

[pbmax]

THIS!

McCarthy's offensive approach has been figured out. Teams with good defenses know how to stop Green Bay now...and McCarthy is too much of a mental midget to find answers.

McCarthy better start putting in some film of old west coast offenses and applying some of those principles...quick slants...screens...short crossing patterns...or the Packers will waste what's left of Rodgers' career.

Figured out is not really the problem. They are still getting single covered. But they aren't completing any of them. They used to complete them AND get penalties. Now its just the penalties.

[Pugger]

:oops:.

[texaspackerbacker]

They are looking to increase the number of runs.

Tom Silverstein ‏@TomSilverstein 4m4 minutes ago
Bennett on run game: We need to get them more involved. We have a plan in place. Sometimes flow of the game has an effect.

DAMN! If that happens, it will only make things worse.

[texaspackerbacker]

THIS!

McCarthy's offensive approach has been figured out. Teams with good defenses know how to stop Green Bay now...and McCarthy is too much of a mental midget to find answers.

McCarthy better start putting in some film of old west coast offenses and applying some of those principles...quick slants...screens...short crossing patterns...or the Packers will waste what's left of Rodgers' career.

Amen to that.

[Anti-Polar Bear]

DAMN! If that happens, it will only make things worse.

Agree.

Just throw the damn ball. The more reps the Great Arm of Butte gets, the better the odds he finds his mojo again.

Pass to set up the run - that's a tenet of West Coast Offense.

[Zool]

Agree.

Just throw the damn ball. The more reps the Great Arm of Butte gets, the better the odds he finds his mojo again.

Pass to set up the run - that's a tenet of West Coast Offense.

Haven't run a WCO in like, 11 years.