More Banjo: Week 9 vs Colts [Archive]

pbmax

11-06-2016, 06:39 PM

Lotta plays to mention, but on 3rd and long, good blitz call, you get safety hit on QB and he slides right off. All he needs to do is stand and hold him arm to keep a throw from going out or make it inaccurate. Instead, easy pass for first down.

Have to make opportunities count.

On offense, long pass to Adams to setup TD was example of what this offense DOESN'T do this year. Make a drive easier by getting deep or YAC. He might have been doing it versus some kinda prevent. But still, made for short field and setup nicely for TD.

Otherwise, lots of trips into Colts territory but nothing to show for it in first half.

pbmax

11-06-2016, 06:41 PM

Jason Wilde ‏@jasonjwilde 4h4 hours ago
"Clay Matthews is always hurt."
Games played:
2009: 16/16
2010: 15/16
2011: 15/16
2012: 12/16
2013: 11/16
2014: 16/16
2015: 16/16
2016: 5/8

pbmax

11-06-2016, 06:44 PM

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CwnqCK9WQAAtqF_.jpg:large

pbmax

11-06-2016, 06:45 PM

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CwnqJXcXgAUKU6C.jpg:large

Rutnstrut

11-06-2016, 06:45 PM

Jason Wilde ‏@jasonjwilde 4h4 hours ago
"Clay Matthews is always hurt."
Games played:
2009: 16/16
2010: 15/16
2011: 15/16
2012: 12/16
2013: 11/16
2014: 16/16
2015: 16/16
2016: 5/8

That doesn't factor in the ones where he came out to deal with menstrual cramping.

Anti-Polar Bear

11-06-2016, 06:51 PM

That doesn't factor in the ones where he came out to deal with menstrual cramping.

Claymaker's vag's still a-hurting, we know.

That's a good one, I'll give you that. :)

pbmax

11-06-2016, 07:05 PM

Green Bay Packers ‏@packers 2m2 minutes ago
McCarthy: Difficult, disappointing home loss. Colts jumped on us the first play & frankly we never got it back. #INDvsGB

Jersey Al - GBP ‏@JerseyAlGBP 8m8 minutes ago
MM say's he's irritated.

Jersey Al - GBP ‏@JerseyAlGBP 4m4 minutes ago
MM: "We're 4-4, played a lot of good football... Our style of play in six of eight games has been excellent."

Jersey Al - GBP ‏@JerseyAlGBP 7m7 minutes ago
Mike, what got the offense going in the fourth quarter? We got first downs...

Green Bay Packers ‏@packers 8m8 minutes ago
McCarthy on Randall Cobb: Impressive that he was active. Personally was not expecting him to play. He gave us everything he's got.

Green Bay Packers ‏@packers 16s16 seconds ago
Rodgers on his foot: Not too bad. Just got stepped on.

Jersey Al - GBP ‏@JerseyAlGBP 7m7 minutes ago
Rodgers takes mild swipe at MM: - "I didn't quite understand what Cobb's status was...

I DUNNO ABOUT THAT, MAYBE HE IS. BUT I AM NOT AND I DON'T KNOW WHAT COBB'S STATUS IS AND ITS AFTER THE GAME

Green Bay Packers ‏@packers 48s48 seconds ago
Rodgers: We've got to be tougher. That's the mark of a team. How you deal with adversity. We have to respond better. #INDvsGB

Green Bay Packers ‏@packers 4m4 minutes ago
Rodgers: We didn't have the same enthusiasm & courage that we had the last few weeks. We've got to be mentally tougher than that. #INDvsGB

denverYooper

11-06-2016, 07:15 PM

Too many missed opportunities.
Too inconsistent.
Too little too late.

Clayish

11-06-2016, 07:21 PM

The Packers are simply not a good football team right now.

pbmax

11-06-2016, 07:22 PM

Football Perspective ‏@fbgchase 59m59 minutes ago
I am shocked to see the Packers score a TD there, given how demoralized they were after missing that 2-point conversion earlier.

pbmax

11-06-2016, 07:27 PM

pbmax

11-06-2016, 07:30 PM

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Cwn1n_7WIAA5xIL.jpg:large

Maxie the Taxi

11-06-2016, 07:31 PM

So not only are we bad, but we seem to be in the throes of dissension. Great.

mission

11-06-2016, 07:34 PM

Tyler Dunne ‏@TyDunne 15m15 minutes ago
Also, this from Aaron Rodgers: "We have to find a way to get a rushing touchdown by somebody besides myself."

He really said that??? :whaa:

pbmax

11-06-2016, 07:37 PM

He really said that??? :whaa:

Unless I missed that Dunne was joking. But I did not watch the PC.

pbmax

11-06-2016, 07:39 PM

So not only are we bad, but we seem to be in the throes of dissension. Great.

That might not be a bad thing. I got the sense late that Rodgers was calling the offense. Might force change in offense.

pbmax

11-06-2016, 07:42 PM

Michael Cohen ‏@Michael_Cohen13 1m1 minute ago
Joe Thomas on kick coverage woes: "Like coach said, man, the first half they just outplayed us. I think that’s pretty much what happened."

Michael Cohen ‏@Michael_Cohen13 33s34 seconds ago
Kentrell Brice on kick return TD: "They ran to the weak side. We were pushing everybody to the front side. They countered back to our side."

Exactly what I saw for both long returns. Wasn't anything magical about it. Just against the grain of the coverage.

hoosier

11-06-2016, 07:45 PM

yetisnowman

11-06-2016, 07:48 PM

Tyler Dunne ‏@TyDunne 15m15 minutes ago
Also, this from Aaron Rodgers: "We have to find a way to get a rushing touchdown by somebody besides myself."

Tyler Dunne ‏@TyDunne 17m17 minutes ago
Aaron Rodgers says the Packers have to "look in the mirror." Calls the slow starts "unacceptable."

I hope this is not an accurate quote. Hard to imagine Aaron would say that, but if he did I've lost all respect for him. Our top two rbs are out, and if he could throw accurate passes and read a simple defense he would be giving a presser after a win.

Joemailman

11-06-2016, 09:00 PM

https://cdn0.vox-cdn.com/thumbor/mUtMHPw9PmY3w6K-tuarEYAhlmM=/800x0/filters:no_upscale()/cdn0.vox-cdn.com/uploads/chorus_asset/file/7419669/SQ2.0.gif

Pugger

11-06-2016, 09:13 PM

Colts are an awful team but they like Pagano and they generally play hard for him when the chips are down. Not surprising they would play their best game today. Very surprising that the Packers would not be able to answer. I am more convinced than ever that things have grown stale and it's time for a new direction.

It may indeed be time for a change. There is no excuse for this team to come out flat like that especially after learning MN lost today. It would be nice if our guys would play like the Colts did for Pagano.

Joemailman

11-06-2016, 09:47 PM

I hope this is not an accurate quote. Hard to imagine Aaron would say that, but if he did I've lost all respect for him. Our top two rbs are out, and if he could throw accurate passes and read a simple defense he would be giving a presser after a win.

He did say it. But he said it right after saying he needs to play better too. Not like he was blaming others while refusing to take any blame himself. I think just a comment made out of frustration.

denverYooper

11-06-2016, 10:01 PM

It may indeed be time for a change. There is no excuse for this team to come out flat like that especially after learning MN lost today. It would be nice if our guys would play like the Colts did for MM.

Lots of frustration over M3 today and I don't disagree with a lot of it. But Green Bay could lose every game for the rest of the year (won't happen) and there's still a good chance he'd get 1 more year.

call_me_ishmael

11-06-2016, 10:10 PM

I think this will be MMs last year here. He'll go somewhere else and be successful. He's a great coach - it just is time for a change. Elliot isn't gonna wanna start with a long-term tenured coach.

Freak Out

11-06-2016, 10:17 PM

It's hard to win with a healthy team...no starting RB left..the CBs are a joke. Everybody else has to be about perfect and it didn't happen.

Anti-Polar Bear

11-07-2016, 03:31 AM

https://cdn0.vox-cdn.com/thumbor/mUtMHPw9PmY3w6K-tuarEYAhlmM=/800x0/filters:no_upscale()/cdn0.vox-cdn.com/uploads/chorus_asset/file/7419669/SQ2.0.gif

This may sound racist but that's the same squirrel that was at the pack-queens game last season in Minneapolis.

I said it back then and I'll say it again: Thompson needs to sign that fuckin rodent to play RB. He's a tad short but dude's fast and super quick, ala DuJuan Harris.

Obviously the squirrel is a pack fan. Saved Bulaga from a false start foul late in the game.

Carolina_Packer

11-07-2016, 05:46 AM

So much doom and gloom after a loss. This team does have some things wrong, for sure, but they are 4-4 now and are not hopelessly out of it. Take away the special teams gaffes and convert one of those GB picks to a TD and you've got a different result. Of course the D needs to play better, but their inexperience is showing with the injuries. We get some nice runs by Monty, but then MM makes that disappear with his play calling choices. Receivers need to beat man coverage more consistently. We can't change the players right now (duh!), so they have to adjust scheme to beat man coverage, like they did in the Bears game. They were playing fast, the ball was coming out fast and they got positive yards on many more plays. In many respects, they read the D and took what they were giving. Now the O seems back to long developing, must push the ball down the field, decent pass pro, A-Rod scrambles as nobody can get open down the field regularly, so he has to do the scramble drill. I realize that's how they want to play on O, but if they can win with another approach as they did in the Bears game, then do whatever it takes to win. Good teams find a way to adjust to the opponent and win however possible.

oldbutnotdeadyet

11-07-2016, 07:10 AM

'Good teams find a way to adjust to the opponent and win however possible.'

I agree, but me thinks other than a handful of players, this team is not good.

Patler

11-07-2016, 07:35 AM

Lots of frustration over M3 today and I don't disagree with a lot of it. But Green Bay could lose every game for the rest of the year (won't happen) and there's still a good chance he'd get 1 more year.

I'm not sure that will be the case. I suspect there was much frustration with MM and his staff for their failure to close out the Seattle playoff game and get a trip to the SB. That was followed by a 2015 season that was excused because of an injury to a WR in preseason. That was window dressing at best, and I suspect the frustration with MM grew as he did little to change what wasn't working on offense. So far, 2016 is very much a continuation of 2015. Nothing much is working offensively, and he keeps reverting to what hasn't worked for a while now.

MM's success has always been based on having a juggernaut offense because that is his area of expertise, and generally having his team ready to play when their backs have been against the wall. But he seems to have lost his touch in both areas, and it has been gone for quite a while.

2016 might actually be his "one more season." His tenure might very well be determined by the next 8 games.

pbmax

11-07-2016, 08:03 AM

'Good teams find a way to adjust to the opponent and win however possible.'

I agree, but me thinks other than a handful of players, this team is not good.

That actually hasn't been McCarthy's model when winning, at least not in the second half. They tend to have the lead early and keep it.

pbmax

11-07-2016, 08:08 AM

I tend to think McGinn gives Ted too much credit for changes to staff over the years. His articles about changes to assistant coaches include a lot of declarative statements about red lines and standards but zero quotes from inside. Even the anonymous stuff is from outside.

Given that McGinn is the only Packer guy who even attempts to report from inside the building (exceptions include Wilde getting player quotes and RapSheet knowing McCarthy's agent), I have NO idea what Ted's frustration level is. How much does he value Lacy and Starks as key parts of the offense?

But McCarthy can fix the passing game. Its not hard. But the offense needs to change. There are some signs he has made adjustments, but he has not gone over to them wholesale. They keep showing bits and pieces for a half. He needs to junk the offseason plan on fundamentals and chalkboard new routes and formations now.

They lost to the Colts for Pete's sake.

pbmax

11-07-2016, 08:10 AM

There is no Fuckdoggle in a loss, but that Squirrel deserves some kinda award.

Rutnstrut

11-07-2016, 08:24 AM

That actually hasn't been McCarthy's model when winning, at least not in the second half. They tend to have the lead early and keep it.

Agree, he does well when it's easy and most any coach could do it. When there is adversity and work, he crumbles. Soft coach, soft GM, soft team.

pbmax

11-07-2016, 08:26 AM

Agree, he does well when it's easy and most any coach could do it. When there is adversity and work, he crumbles. Soft coach, soft GM, soft team.

Not at all. They have jumped all over very good teams many times. If it was just versus bad teams, his record would be 500, not second to New England.

yetisnowman

11-07-2016, 08:30 AM

He did say it. But he said it right after saying he needs to play better too. Not like he was blaming others while refusing to take any blame himself. I think just a comment made out of frustration.

I don't care what he said before and after that's completely inappropriate for a qb to criticize his own running game after a loss.

pbmax

11-07-2016, 08:31 AM

yetisnowman

11-07-2016, 09:13 AM

There are a LOT of mediocre teams that have a lot of 4th Quarter comebacks. A lot of bad teams spend the year known as the Cardiac Kids.

I trust the lead and the record more than 4th Quarter comebacks, but I suspect it does tell us something about their limitations.

But are there any other good teams that have hardly any 4th quarter comebacks? Aaron has 10 in 9 years. And the 4th comeback stat simply accounts for a game in which you were losing at the beginning of the 4th, but went on to win. When looking at the game by game 4th quarter comebacks were not last possession wins save for a couple. They were games in which the pack regained the lead early to midway through the 4th and never gave it up. The packers are generally very bad, when the game is in its final minutes and they are trailing by less than one score.

denverYooper

11-07-2016, 09:35 AM

I'm not sure that will be the case. I suspect there was much frustration with MM and his staff for their failure to close out the Seattle playoff game and get a trip to the SB. That was followed by a 2015 season that was excused because of an injury to a WR in preseason. That was window dressing at best, and I suspect the frustration with MM grew as he did little to change what wasn't working on offense. So far, 2016 is very much a continuation of 2015. Nothing much is working offensively, and he keeps reverting to what hasn't worked for a while now.

MM's success has always been based on having a juggernaut offense because that is his area of expertise, and generally having his team ready to play when their backs have been against the wall. But he seems to have lost his touch in both areas, and it has been gone for quite a while.

2016 might actually be his "one more season." His tenure might very well be determined by the next 8 games.

I felt a little more strongly about it before I read some of the comments this morning from last night's press conferences. Those are the only evidence, really, of the frustration. If the divide between McCarthy's belief in a good week of preparation and Rodger's postgame comments on not knowing the status of key players widens, that might be a stronger signal.

As a fan, I'm frustrated. The players seem frustrated. But the only frustration level that really matters in the decision is Thompson and Murphy and they've shown to be quite patient with personnel moves.

oldbutnotdeadyet

11-07-2016, 10:20 AM

I felt a little more strongly about it before I read some of the comments this morning from last night's press conferences. Those are the only evidence, really, of the frustration. If the divide between McCarthy's belief in a good week of preparation and Rodger's postgame comments on not knowing the status of key players widens, that might be a stronger signal.

As a fan, I'm frustrated. The players seem frustrated. But the only frustration level that really matters in the decision is Thompson and Murphy and they've shown to be quite patient with personnel moves.

Yup, frustration is evident with the players, and god knows us fans are frustrated. Part of it is probably our growing belief that the odds of us finding another good quarterback after two hall of fame quarterbacks is not in our favor. Denveryooper, ever do 'the incline' in colorado springs?

pbmax

11-07-2016, 10:35 AM

But are there any other good teams that have hardly any 4th quarter comebacks? Aaron has 10 in 9 years. And the 4th comeback stat simply accounts for a game in which you were losing at the beginning of the 4th, but went on to win. When looking at the game by game 4th quarter comebacks were not last possession wins save for a couple. They were games in which the pack regained the lead early to midway through the 4th and never gave it up. The packers are generally very bad, when the game is in its final minutes and they are trailing by less than one score.

They are pretty unique in that regard.

Its become clear that if McCarthy doesn't practice it, it does not become part of the game until well past desperation time (think about the 2 point play versus Arizona last year that didn't happen).

But what is new is that this problem has infected the start of the game and halftime. Its entirely dependent on what the defense puts out on the field. The Packers no longer dictate anything.

The Packer offense is middle of the road by the numbers. But its still struggling compared to past iterations. But you won't beat good teams with mediocre offense and defense. And if one side is worse on a given day, you lose to the Colts.

pbmax

11-07-2016, 10:37 AM

Zach Kruse ‏@zachkruse2 38m38 minutes ago
Jeff Janis played 44 snaps on Sunday. More than Ty Montgomery (31), Randall Cobb (23), Trevor Davis (5). That's offensive malpractice.

Cobb was hurt, but otherwise, yes it seems to be.

pbmax

11-07-2016, 10:41 AM

Just like my other complaints about coaching philosophy in the offseason (end of game strategy), McCarthy has started to tweak the passing game.

Jordy's first catch of the half was on a bunch and combo route where someone ran off Jordy's coverage and he crossed wide open. They ran another similar look with Davis doing a Welker in and out route, where he was WIDE open, but the QB decided to throw into the end zone.

But I still believe McCarthy has broken the QB with the be patient for the long ball approach.

He needs to commit to fixing the pass game short to make it effective versus man coverage (with routes that BEG to be covered by zone D, which the Packers still beat). Then he needs to reteach his QB how to read it short to long.

Rutnstrut

11-07-2016, 10:55 AM

pb, that's way too much teaching for stubby in half a season. Hell he can't even form intelligible words during sideline interviews.

pbmax

11-07-2016, 12:20 PM

Packer Report ‏@PackerReport 9m9 minutes ago Green Bay, WI
Rodgers and Bulaga spoke of lack of energy. MM: "Watching it, reviewing it wtih the coaching staff, I thought there was good energy."

Tom Silverstein ‏@TomSilverstein 8m8 minutes ago
McCarthy on no energy: Big focus was about energy after game. Today watching, I thought there was good energy, just moments not detailed.

Tom Silverstein ‏@TomSilverstein 9m9 minutes ago
McCarthy on team at 4-4: Just focused on details. Important each and every week. Disappointed in loss. The made more plays than us.

Green Bay Packers ‏@packers 8m8 minutes ago
McCarthy: After watching the video, I thought our guys played with good energy. We need to be cleaner, sharpen things up. That's the focus.

Packer Report ‏@PackerReport 10m10 minutes ago Green Bay, WI
Cobb got out of the game OK, McCarthy said. He was a late add to the actives list. Which perhaps explains some of the confusion from 12/18.

Packer Report ‏@PackerReport 11m11 minutes ago Green Bay, WI
Matthews had a setback on Friday, which is why he didn't play. Not sure of his status for this week since it's only Monday.

Green Bay Packers ‏@packers 4m4 minutes ago
McCarthy on C Corey Linsley: He played OK. Mental part was sharp. Some things he'll want to improve. Thought is was a solid performance.

Tom Silverstein ‏@TomSilverstein 6m6 minutes ago
McCarthy on KOR TD: Ball placement poor and lane integrity was poor. He wasn’t touched.

CROSBY WITH BAD DAY TOO

Tom Silverstein ‏@TomSilverstein 7m7 minutes ago
McCarthy on energy: I’m looking for speed, I’m looking for urgency, that’s not what I was looking for. That’s the reality. We were not clean

Tom Silverstein ‏@TomSilverstein 10m10 minutes ago
McCarthy on defense: Have to get off the field on third down. That was a pretty good swing for the Colts.

Tom Silverstein ‏@TomSilverstein 14m14 minutes ago
McCarthy on Cobb’s role: Decisions based on information we had. He was a late add, right before inactive. Figured he’d be limited.

Michael Cohen ‏@Michael_Cohen13 15m15 minutes ago
#Packers coach Mike McCarthy said Randall Cobb didn't injure the hamstring further last night. Believes he is moving forward in recovery.

Tom Silverstein ‏@TomSilverstein 6m6 minutes ago
McCarthy on passing game: Man to man game, the middle of the field, triangle reads is principal we adhere to. TE usually benefits from that.

Tom Silverstein ‏@TomSilverstein 13m13 minutes ago
McCarthy on team at 4-4: Just focused on details. Important each and every week. Disappointed in loss. The made more plays than us.

denverYooper

11-07-2016, 12:42 PM

Yup, frustration is evident with the players, and god knows us fans are frustrated. Part of it is probably our growing belief that the odds of us finding another good quarterback after two hall of fame quarterbacks is not in our favor. Denveryooper, ever do 'the incline' in colorado springs?

I haven't done it in about 10 years. Maybe I'll head down South and climb it in lieu of watching the game next week ;).

woodbuck27

11-07-2016, 12:48 PM

pbmax

11-07-2016, 12:53 PM

Michael Cohen ‏@Michael_Cohen13 7m7 minutes ago
McCarthy said Ty Montgomery was on a rep count yesterday. The coaches liked the way he played. #Packers

Tom Silverstein ‏@TomSilverstein 7m7 minutes ago
McCarthy on run game: Ty was on a rep count. Would have liked to give Don more. Wanted to play more base than we did. Like to be 20 runs.

Tom Silverstein ‏@TomSilverstein 6m6 minutes ago
McCarthy on Starks: Had a good week. Hit the target. Hopefully push that forward and see what happens this week.

Packer Report ‏@PackerReport 5m5 minutes ago Green Bay, WI
MM on passing game: It's a man-to-man game. Didn't do enough to win those matchups yesterday.

Patler

11-07-2016, 01:23 PM

But the only frustration level that really matters in the decision is Thompson and Murphy and they've shown to be quite patient with personnel moves.

I'm not sure if TT is patient as opposed to secretive. He extended Sherman, then fired him after one year. There was no hint to the public about wanting Favre out, but no retreat in TT either after the opportunity was there. More recently, who saw the Sitton release coming? TT could be planning to fire MM tomorrow, and it is unlikely the press would see it coming.

Murphy, too, has made front office changes that surprised a lot of those who watch the team, changes no one expected.

I'm not sure either would let on what they are thinking.

denverYooper

11-07-2016, 02:39 PM

I'm not sure if TT is patient as opposed to secretive. He extended Sherman, then fired him after one year. There was no hint to the public about wanting Favre out, but no retreat in TT either after the opportunity was there. More recently, who saw the Sitton release coming? TT could be planning to fire MM tomorrow, and it is unlikely the press would see it coming.

Murphy, too, has made front office changes that surprised a lot of those who watch the team, changes no one expected.

I'm not sure either would let on what they are thinking.

They wouldn't let on what they are thinking but there often seem to be reasons outside of a dip in performance for them to move on. Favre was clearly becoming a distraction at the tail end of his career and was becoming increasingly critical of his management. Sitton was supposedly let go due to an internal incident that they've kept a lid on and he too is on the downside of his career and was rumored to be increasingly disgruntled.

Sherman was never really TT's pick and was supplanted at GM by TT. Those kinds of relationships do not generally work well in a professional environment. I have seen it play out in management before and it has always resulted in a poor relationship.

I suspect it would take more than a single subpar year for them to release a coach who has made the playoffs 7 years running and is 2nd to Belichick in winning pct among active coaches.

Sparkey

11-07-2016, 03:39 PM

pbmax

11-07-2016, 04:08 PM

pbmax

11-07-2016, 04:15 PM

Tom Silverstein ‏@TomSilverstein 8m8 minutes ago
Dom Capers at the podium: We started fast. We had some hits on Luck. He ended up with a 74 rating. Felt decent about that.

Packer Report ‏@PackerReport 8m8 minutes ago Green Bay, WI
Capers felt "decent" about performance vs. Luck. 77 rating. Played well after the second long kickoff return. Won most of first downs.

Michael Cohen ‏@Michael_Cohen13 14m14 minutes ago
Dom Capers said the #Packers defense was 60 percent efficient on first down. Best mark in the last few weeks.

Tom Silverstein ‏@TomSilverstein 15m15 minutes ago
Capers: Had our best game on first down. 60% efficiency. Long run was 11 yards.

Tom Silverstein ‏@TomSilverstein 14m14 minutes ago
Capers: Came down to two critical situations: 2-minute drill end of half. Luck completed a key third down in a zone coverage.

Packer Report ‏@PackerReport 14m14 minutes ago Green Bay, WI
Two critical situations. First, third-and-9 at end of half from Indy 5. Second was the third-and-10 with 3:19 left. Blitzed but missed sack

Tom Silverstein ‏@TomSilverstein 14m14 minutes ago
Capers: Got them into a third and 10 late in the game. We blitzed, we took a shot and didn’t make the play. They made the play.

Tom Silverstein ‏@TomSilverstein
Capers: I see things we can build on. We just have to make critical plays when we need them.

pbmax

11-07-2016, 04:19 PM

Packer Report ‏@PackerReport 8m8 minutes ago Green Bay, WI
Capers thinks his players will respond well. Back-to-back losses, now three straight on road. Defining time.

Packer Report ‏@PackerReport 16m16 minutes ago Green Bay, WI
Last third down was an all-out blitz on third-and-2. Blitzed more than they had been blitzing past couple weeks.

Michael Cohen ‏@Michael_Cohen13 17m17 minutes ago
Dom Capers on the missed sack by Clinton-Dix: "We had exactly what we wanted there." Just didn't make the play on key third down. #Packers

denverYooper

11-07-2016, 05:07 PM

They've solved the problem: http://www.espn.com/espn/now?nowId=21-0587412898226118034-4

They dropped the guy who screwed up the KO return and added a second FB.

Patler

11-07-2016, 06:16 PM

I think mailing Brett his locker was a pretty public message :lol:

Well, a direct message. That Brett made public.

Patient and secretive are really not substitutes though. If Ted was secretive and not patient, a lot of coaches and first round picks would have been moved earlier.

It was a done deal before the locker was sent. At the time Favre announced his retirement, I bet most would have guessed he would be welcomed back if he asked.

The draft picks he has shown greatest patience with are mostly higher round picks who have been injured. He has scrapped quickly a lot more of his draft picks than some are willing to admit.

TT hires one coach and one coach only, the head coach. I fully expect he offers opinions about others if asked by MM, but leaves the decision to MM, just as he did with the transfer of play calling to Clements

Bossman641

11-07-2016, 06:18 PM

I'm curious to see what happens if this team ever hits on a deep ball route. They are certainly getting closer to connecting on one. Will it be like a baseball team where the floodgates open?

Patler

11-07-2016, 06:21 PM

They wouldn't let on what they are thinking but there often seem to be reasons outside of a dip in performance for them to move on. Favre was clearly becoming a distraction at the tail end of his career and was becoming increasingly critical of his management. Sitton was supposedly let go due to an internal incident that they've kept a lid on and he too is on the downside of his career and was rumored to be increasingly disgruntled.

Sherman was never really TT's pick and was supplanted at GM by TT. Those kinds of relationships do not generally work well in a professional environment. I have seen it play out in management before and it has always resulted in a poor relationship.

I suspect it would take more than a single subpar year for them to release a coach who has made the playoffs 7 years running and is 2nd to Belichick in winning pct among active coaches.

This is the second year of poor performance. Making the playoffs last year was more of a fluke than deserved. MM performed poor as HC in the playoff loss to Seattle, and mostly ever since.

Patler

11-07-2016, 06:24 PM

YEAR , O/C , Off-Rank
---------------------------------------------
2016 Edgar Bennett 14
2015 Edgar Bennett 15
2014 Tom Clements 1
2013 Tom Clements 8
2012 Tom Clements 5
2011 Joe Philbin 1
2010 Joe Philbin 10

Maybe EB is neither OC nor HC material?
I think he was a great position coach. His position groups always performed well

hoosier

11-07-2016, 07:34 PM

I haven't done it in about 10 years. Maybe I'll head down South and climb it in lieu of watching the game next week ;).

If you can run the entire thing in under 8 min miles I will guarantee the Packers run the table this season.

hoosier

11-07-2016, 07:40 PM

beveaux1

11-07-2016, 07:48 PM

This is the second year of poor performance. Making the playoffs last year was more of a fluke than deserved. MM performed poor as HC in the playoff loss to Seattle, and mostly ever since.

I'm disappointed that he hasn't adjusted his offense to try to beat what every defense does against us. Tight man with safety's over the top can be beaten at least two ways. One is to establish the running game and move one or both safeties up to try and stop the run. That's the approach he took during the off-season. It still means your receivers have to beat man coverage, but they would not have as much safety help, allowing Rodgers to find the man without safety help.

It doesn't appear that he worked very hard on Plan B. This would be needed if the run game couldn't bring the defense out of its 2 deep shell. Like maybe when one or both of your RBs get hurt and you have to play journeymen at RB, or if you can't run on the team you're playing. Plan B might involve playing stacked receivers on one side and running pick plays to get them open, or spreading 5 fast WRs and making the defense counter by removing their LBs and either putting safeties or back-up CBs on the receivers, or by having a TE that can work the middle between the 2 safeties. Our lack of decent TE talent makes the third option moot, but we very sporadically use either of the first two options. We are usually content with banging our head against 2 deep with 3 WRs, a TE, and a RB, running ISO routes getting smothered by the safeties and praying that someone breaks loose after 6 seconds of holding the ball.

We won't improve our running attack with our RB situation, so that means we need a complete change in our offensive philosophy that I don't think our coach is willing to make because it means the end of the 2014 quick strike attack. My feeling is that AR doesn't really want to change either. We've seen spurts of the dink and dunk, but it's never lasted much more than a half, and they usually revert right back to their preferred offense. In my opinion, this is why we struggle so much to have a complete offensive game. If our coach doesn't recognize what most of the team's fans see, it will be tough for him to go on the win streak he needs to keep from putting his job in jeopardy.

pbmax

11-07-2016, 07:54 PM

I'm curious to see what happens if this team ever hits on a deep ball route. They are certainly getting closer to connecting on one. Will it be like a baseball team where the floodgates open?

They did versus Atlanta and it heralded their best half in a long while. But the zone coverage had a lot to do with overall success as well.

denverYooper

11-07-2016, 08:21 PM

This is the second year of poor performance. Making the playoffs last year was more of a fluke than deserved. MM performed poor as HC in the playoff loss to Seattle, and mostly ever since.

It is rather hard to argue that a 10-6 record, a win in the WC round, and an OT game in the divisional on the road is 1 year of poor performance. Nor was it a fluke. They won 10 games and earned the wildcard spot by virtue of their record.

And this year is not over yet. So while the current malaise has covered a span lasting the latter half of last year and most of the 1st half of this year, there are 8 games left to play. We've seen M3-coached teams sag at times before. If they improve to 10-6 with a good finish this year and make the playoffs again, will it be a fluke or just an effect of sampling? At a lifetime win pct of 0.646, M3's yearly win expectation is 10 games.

beveaux1

11-07-2016, 08:37 PM

It is rather hard to argue that a 10-6 record, a win in the WC round, and an OT game in the divisional on the road is 1 year of poor performance. Nor was it a fluke. They won 10 games and earned the wildcard spot by virtue of their record.

And this year is not over yet. So while the current malaise has covered a span lasting the latter half of last year and most of the 1st half of this year, there are 8 games left to play. We've seen M3-coached teams sag at times before. If they improve to 10-6 with a good finish this year and make the playoffs again, will it be a fluke or just an effect of sampling? At a lifetime win pct of 0.646, M3's yearly win expectation is 10 games.

I truly hope you're right. I just get a different vibe about this team. They really can't stop the pass on defense because of injury with little reason to believe this will change. On offense, they've banged their head against man 2 deep for more than a year and don't seem to understand why they can't beat it. At this point, they're pretty average on offense and maybe a little less so on defense. A weak schedule helps but it's hard to get excited about their chances.

pbmax

11-07-2016, 09:22 PM

Its telling that we are discussing the Packers of the last two seasons as less than mediocre, when their record hasn't fallen below 500.

Pugger

11-07-2016, 09:25 PM

I'm disappointed that he hasn't adjusted his offense to try to beat what every defense does against us. Tight man with safety's over the top can be beaten at least two ways. One is to establish the running game and move one or both safeties up to try and stop the run. That's the approach he took during the off-season. It still means your receivers have to beat man coverage, but they would not have as much safety help, allowing Rodgers to find the man without safety help.

It doesn't appear that he worked very hard on Plan B. This would be needed if the run game couldn't bring the defense out of its 2 deep shell. Like maybe when one or both of your RBs get hurt and you have to play journeymen at RB, or if you can't run on the team you're playing. Plan B might involve playing stacked receivers on one side and running pick plays to get them open, or spreading 5 fast WRs and making the defense counter by removing their LBs and either putting safeties or back-up CBs on the receivers, or by having a TE that can work the middle between the 2 safeties. Our lack of decent TE talent makes the third option moot, but we very sporadically use either of the first two options. We are usually content with banging our head against 2 deep with 3 WRs, a TE, and a RB, running ISO routes getting smothered by the safeties and praying that someone breaks loose after 6 seconds of holding the ball.

We won't improve our running attack with our RB situation, so that means we need a complete change in our offensive philosophy that I don't think our coach is willing to make because it means the end of the 2014 quick strike attack. My feeling is that AR doesn't really want to change either. We've seen spurts of the dink and dunk, but it's never lasted much more than a half, and they usually revert right back to their preferred offense. In my opinion, this is why we struggle so much to have a complete offensive game. If our coach doesn't recognize what most of the team's fans see, it will be tough for him to go on the win streak he needs to keep from putting his job in jeopardy.

This is a great post and illustrates exactly what is wrong with this offense. I find it incredible that Mac is so hell bent on utilizing his preferred offense even when everyone outside of the team can see it isn't working with the personnel presently on this team. His stubbornness might be his undoing in GB.

Patler

11-08-2016, 03:02 AM

Its telling that we are discussing the Packers of the last two seasons as less than mediocre, when their record hasn't fallen below 500.

It's quite obvious when things changed last year, and they are 8-10 since then.

Patler

11-08-2016, 03:25 AM

It is rather hard to argue that a 10-6 record, a win in the WC round, and an OT game in the divisional on the road is 1 year of poor performance. Nor was it a fluke. They won 10 games and earned the wildcard spot by virtue of their record.

And this year is not over yet. So while the current malaise has covered a span lasting the latter half of last year and most of the 1st half of this year, there are 8 games left to play. We've seen M3-coached teams sag at times before. If they improve to 10-6 with a good finish this year and make the playoffs again, will it be a fluke or just an effect of sampling? At a lifetime win pct of 0.646, M3's yearly win expectation is 10 games.

On the other hand, going 4-6 in their last 10 games of the season, including getting beat at home by every team in the division, going 0-2 in your final two games of the season with the division title on the line, and losing at home to the Vikings when given one last chance to tie for the division doesn't look like they really earned much either. It looks more like a team that backed into the playoffs without being one of the better teams after their bye.

texaspackerbacker

11-08-2016, 08:31 AM

They did versus Atlanta and it heralded their best half in a long while. But the zone coverage had a lot to do with overall success as well.

You nailed it there. Aaron Rodgers still hits open receivers better than any other QB in the game, and there are open receivers in a zone. Sometime last season, though, and continuing into this season, D Coordinators figured out that the Packer receivers didn't have the ability to beat man coverage - even against not too great corners. It took Atlanta several series to figure that out and to get away from their bread and butter zone D. When they did, things got tougher even with their lame ass corners.

I think I may have been the first one in this thread anyway to use the word "mediocre". I did NOT describe the Packers team in general as mediocre. What I said was THE SUPPORTING CAST that God damned Ted Thompson has put together for Aaron Rodgers is mediocre at best. Aaron Rodgers + the rest of the team being mediocre still = damn good. Because of injuries mainly, that mediocre rest of the team has slipped to an even lower level at just about every position you can name. Just the same, as somebody mentioned, getting back Matthews, getting Nelson up to speed (hopefully that happens), maybe getting Randall back (although I don't recall him being all that great before being injured), maybe getting some use out of Cook, etc. should bring the rest of the team back to a high enough level of mediocrity that Aaron Rodgers can win out the regular season and go far in the playoffs.

I say again, it's disgusting to read all the negativism posted in here. NONE of the remaining teams on the schedule, not even Seattle, should be a favorite to beat the Packers.

Rutnstrut

11-08-2016, 08:36 AM

How many other teams with a mvp caliber QB would continually try and do the same things that DON'T work???? Most coaches would make adjustments to use that talented QB and whatever talent you have. Not stubby, if he keeps throwing the same shit at the wall, it WILL stick.

Maxie the Taxi

11-08-2016, 09:21 AM

I say again, it's disgusting to read all the negativism posted in here. NONE of the remaining teams on the schedule, not even Seattle, should be a favorite to beat the Packers.GB probably won't even get by the Titans next week. The two teams are almost identical in stats. Titans run game is their only real advantage. That plus home field. We'll see who wants it most.

Sparkey

11-08-2016, 10:09 AM

Pugger

11-08-2016, 10:15 AM

You nailed it there. Aaron Rodgers still hits open receivers better than any other QB in the game, and there are open receivers in a zone. Sometime last season, though, and continuing into this season, D Coordinators figured out that the Packer receivers didn't have the ability to beat man coverage - even against not too great corners. It took Atlanta several series to figure that out and to get away from their bread and butter zone D. When they did, things got tougher even with their lame ass corners.

I think I may have been the first one in this thread anyway to use the word "mediocre". I did NOT describe the Packers team in general as mediocre. What I said was THE SUPPORTING CAST that God damned Ted Thompson has put together for Aaron Rodgers is mediocre at best. Aaron Rodgers + the rest of the team being mediocre still = damn good. Because of injuries mainly, that mediocre rest of the team has slipped to an even lower level at just about every position you can name. Just the same, as somebody mentioned, getting back Matthews, getting Nelson up to speed (hopefully that happens), maybe getting Randall back (although I don't recall him being all that great before being injured), maybe getting some use out of Cook, etc. should bring the rest of the team back to a high enough level of mediocrity that Aaron Rodgers can win out the regular season and go far in the playoffs.

I say again, it's disgusting to read all the negativism posted in here. NONE of the remaining teams on the schedule, not even Seattle, should be a favorite to beat the Packers.

If this team keeps playing like they did against Indy they will have a hell of time beating any of the remaining teams on the schedule. And as long as McCarthy and AR are hell bent on chucking the short passing game in favor of the long ball this offense is going to continue to underperform. :sad:

Pugger

11-08-2016, 10:19 AM

This is the week we see what the Packers have become. I expect an ass kicking.

On another note ? Do we draft terrible receivers or is the coaching staff that poor ?

It seems guys three years removed from college still can't run a clean route or get off a jam.

Seattle showed the league a couple of years ago our guys can't beat tight man coverage and our staff doesn't seem to know how to instruct our WRs on how to over come this. One would think after all this time somebody over at 1265 would have fixed this issue. Until someone does our offense is gonna look anemic at best even against lousy defenses. :???:

Carolina_Packer

11-08-2016, 11:07 AM

On offense, they've banged their head against man 2 deep for more than a year and don't seem to understand why they can't beat it.

The answer is either make them respect a running game to move one of the two deeps towards the LOS, or get faster/quicker receivers if you are not truly committed to the run game. With their lack of depth, thus low margin for error at RB, they now have a reason (some may say excuse) for not being able to employ one of those options to beat two deep. What I really haven't been able to wrap my head around is whether we have a scheme/WR routes issue or a lack of speed and separation at WR, or possibly both. If the latter, what are they trying to do to help create separation with the receivers we have? Unless the Packers send the receivers out with banana peels for their defender, they have to find ways to get separation for the receivers.

beveaux1

11-08-2016, 12:25 PM

On another note ? Do we draft terrible receivers or is the coaching staff that poor ?

It seems guys three years removed from college still can't run a clean route or get off a jam.

There's always a reason a draft pick falls to the 4th through 7th rounds. Most of them have some deficiency to make up for. Davis is slight of build and not very strong. Janis came from a very small school and really did not know anything about route running, blocking, or how to change his route based on DB positioning. Allison is not very fast with some of the same deficiencies as Janis. It usually takes three years in this system for the lights to click on if you had few deficiencies (usually a 1 through 3 draft pick). Driver took 4 to 5 years. Nelson was a contributor his 2nd year. J Jones took 3 or 4 years (still made mistakes his 3rd year). Cobb plays slot (a little different learning curve there). He was up and running by his 2nd year, although his third was great.

It appears that Adams is playing better in this his third year. The others are not ready for prime time. This is the problem with drafting late every first round. In essence, we have one fewer first round pick and one more guy that we draft last that would have been a free agent. It also shows what 5 drafts in a row focusing on the defense will do to your offense.