WHY ARE THE PACKERS ALLOWING ELIOT WOLF TO INTERVIEW.........INTERESTING STUFF

[Bretsky]

http://www.packersnews.com/story/sports/nfl/packers/dougherty/2017/01/04/dougherty-questions-swirl-over-wolfs-future/96154940/

[Bretsky]

Just do what is right and Melvaninze the Turtle for Heaven's Sake !

[Bretsky]

Just do what is right and Melvaninze the Turtle for Heaven's Sake !

This week I learned from one NFL source that at least a couple of members of the Packers’ executive committee are concerned about losing Wolf and want him promoted to GM this offseason. In that scenario, Thompson would become an area scout or take an advisory role. Thompson is under contract through the 2018 season

[Fritz]

It would make me laugh if the Niners hired...Brian Gutekunst, and not Eliot Wolf.

Then what would we all think?

[Bretsky]

It would make me laugh if the Niners hired...Brian Gutekunst, and not Eliot Wolf.

Then what would we all think?


Could happen; the Niners are idiots.
Look at their history the past few years.
I'd get nothing in terms of a message out of that hire.
Plus, Wolf might not take that job even if it's offered because that situation if f'cked up.
And if he turns it down we won't know as it will be a PR spin.

[Bretsky]

POLL url
https://polldaddy.com/poll/9627784/?view=results&msg=voted

[texaspackerbacker]

Does anybody really know what Elliot Wolf's ideas are? Can we assume he is similar to Ted or to his dad? I really don't think a GM job is so much about competence as it is about philosophy. Like that poll choice "next man up", a lot of people are competent enough to be a GM in the NFL. I'm not gonna advocate for or against anybody without knowing how he plans to move forward in team building. I'd like to see a whole new direction from Ted; E. Wolf may be that new direction - or he may not. We the Fan Base may not know that stuff until some new guy gets entrenched.

[3irty1]

I'd feel much better about the boy wonder if he were to go cut his teeth somewhere else for a while.

Yes he's like the only human alive whose been groomed from birth to be an NFL GM. But part of being GB royalty is being GB inbred. If he's really ready I hope he gets the offer; he can always make his way back home when Ted goes to pasture.

[texaspackerbacker]

Too bad we can't have an election for our GM - debates, primaries, the whole shibang. Then, knowing what a guy at least says he would do, we vote.

[Harlan Huckleby]

I'd feel much better about the boy wonder if he were to go cut his teeth somewhere else for a while. .

Sure, have your cake and eat it too. Or something. But probably he is gone for good if he succeeds elsewhere.

I think if the Green Bay Politboro thinks Wolfe is the best choice for the future (nothing is guaranteed, but like marriage you gotta choose) pull the trigger. Which is to say execute Ted. Nice like, as Bretsky described.

[Bretsky]

I'd feel much better about the boy wonder if he were to go cut his teeth somewhere else for a while.

Yes he's like the only human alive whose been groomed from birth to be an NFL GM. But part of being GB royalty is being GB inbred. If he's really ready I hope he gets the offer; he can always make his way back home when Ted goes to pasture.

That would be awesome !

It would also be awesome if we could hire John Schneider, John Dorsey, or Reggie McKenzie

But we probably can't

[Freak Out]

Wolfe wants to trade next years #1 for a backup QB somewhere. That's his plan.

[Joemailman]

I'm not much worried about it. The Packers GM job is one of the best jobs in the NFL. Whenever TT retires, I'm sure the Packers will have their choice of a number of talented people. Maybe from inside the organization, maybe from outside.

[Freak Out]

BRETSKY! PUT YOUR AVATAR NAME IN ALL CAPS PLEASE!

[Patler]

Why are they allowing Wolf and Gutekunst to interview? For the same reasons they allowed Schneider, McKenzie and Dorsey to interview.

Why now for Wolf and not last year? They did the same with McKenzie and, I think, Dorsey. I believe it has to do with their belief about the readiness of others to move into the positions of the departed. They lost their three top guys below TT not that long ago. Others (a second level, so to speak) moved up to replace them, and were in turn replaced by the next lower (3rd) level. If they fill Wolf or Gutekunst with an in-house promotion, it would be someone from that third level just a few years ago. They need to be ready to do so.

[Patler]

McGinn hits some of the reasons why Wolf might not be the right choice to succeed TT:

http://www.greenbaypressgazette.com/story/sports/nfl/packers/mcginn/2017/01/05/mcginn-wolf-decision-turns-up-heat-murphy/96198176/

[pbmax]

That would be awesome !

It would also be awesome if we could hire John Schneider, John Dorsey, or Reggie McKenzie

But we probably can't

Pretty sure they could get John Dorsey. He doesn't have final say.

Same with Schneider, but it will probably cost more.

[pbmax]

McGinn hits some of the reasons why Wolf might not be the right choice to succeed TT:

http://www.greenbaypressgazette.com/story/sports/nfl/packers/mcginn/2017/01/05/mcginn-wolf-decision-turns-up-heat-murphy/96198176/

The bar for being a GM in the NFL is lower than I thought:


Like his father, Wolf has keen intelligence and extraordinary memory that gives him an immediate edge on many NFL executives.

:roll:

[Zool]

This week I learned from one NFL source that at least a couple of members of the Packers’ executive committee are concerned about losing Wolf and want him promoted to GM this offseason. In that scenario, Thompson would become an area scout or take an advisory role. Thompson is under contract through the 2018 season

Did you really just quote yourself?

Also you titled this thread like it was factual information. It's all theory and opinion.

[pbmax]

If this McGinn article that Patler linked to is my only evidence, I am rooting for Ball.


Ball ranks as one of the most trusted confidants of Mike McCarthy, Murphy and Thompson. At the same time, he has done everything possible to learn the personnel end of the business. He tries to attend every practice, sits in on almost every draft meeting and constantly watches video with Thompson.

The assumption is that Wolf certainly should be better able to identify a player than Ball. At the same time, Ball would have a vast advantage in areas like building relationships and culture, budgeting, travel and all the myriad duties that slam a first-time GM in the face after the introductory news conference.

“I’ve been an evaluator my whole life,” the former GM said. “When you get a GM job, it’s less and less about evaluating. There’s so many other things. There’s always tension and conflict, and how you lead. The (scouting) does not prepare you for that part.”

In 2011, Ball’s former boss in New Orleans, GM Mickey Loomis, said he should already have been a GM. In August, Thompson said Ball was able to evaluate players as well as a full-time scout and was capable of running an NFL organization both as a GM and as a president.

“Russ has great logic, patience,” said an NFL executive in personnel. “There’s a lot to like about Russ Ball. The million-dollar question is what is Mark Murphy thinking regarding (Ball)?”

[pbmax]

I am completely unenthusiastic about this possible development:


It should be remembered that Murphy has yet to hire his own GM or coach. One source with an understanding of Packers’ affairs believes Murphy ultimately will go outside the organization for Thompson’s successor.

In that event, Murphy almost assuredly would rely on Jed Hughes, who conducts executive searches as vice chairman for an international firm. He was responsible for connecting Murphy with the corporation’s executive committee in 2007, and later spearheaded the hiring of vice presidents Laura Sankey and Tim Connolly, both of whom sources said were let go.

Has he had any hits beside Murphy?

[3irty1]

Pretty sure they could get John Dorsey. He doesn't have final say.

Same with Schneider, but it will probably cost more.

Schneider had the homecoming clause in his first contract too. Powers of deduction indicate that Schneider would be very interested if the timing of our GM needs worked out with his obligations.

[vince]

I'm not much worried about it. The Packers GM job is one of the best jobs in the NFL. Whenever TT retires, I'm sure the Packers will have their choice of a number of talented people. Maybe from inside the organization, maybe from outside.
Great point. Whichever way the Packers go, it will be from a position of strength. Eliot Wolf might be a great GM someday but there are a lot of great prospects out there and nobody is going to force the hand of the Packers if TT's not ready to step aside.

Russ Ball and Alonso Highsmith could make a great tandem at the top down the road if Wolf and Gutekunst were to get away.

[mission]

This isn't official by any means, but one of my salesmen is a big Seahawks fan and he said Schneider's most recent extension does not have the Green Bay-out clause. Not sure how to confirm there... think he read it on SeahawksRats.com.

[3irty1]

How much does MM factor into these moves?

The way I see it no non-Ted GM will have the Packer capitol to get rid of MM. Yet MM is what 55? Its likely our next GM will get MM until MM hangs up his clipboard. Without an opportunity to pick our next coach, our next GM is both hampered and pampered by effectively being a dedicated roster guy. That could be 10 years of training wheels which may be fine for a baby like Eliot but in the meantime the only benefit to the team over Ted is however more effective the next guy is with the roster. If you're Bretsky and believe the optimal NFL offseason looks like it does in Madden, there is vast room for improvement over Ted so bring it on. To those who are less reactionary and see roster building as a set of tradeoffs, improving on Ted would be a pleasant surprise.

Personally I fall in the second camp, I think the worst thing about Ted, other than his having the charisma of an old pedophile, is MM (although I do like MM). And since I believe it'll take Ted or MM to get rid of MM, Ted has a decisive advantage over anyone else until MM is gone. Therefore, a bird in the hand is still worth two in the bush. I'm content to set our beloved Eliot go, if he doesn't come back may his teams forever blow.

[pbmax]

How much does MM factor into these moves?

The way I see it no non-Ted GM will have the Packer capitol to get rid of MM. Yet MM is what 55? Its likely our next GM will get MM until MM hangs up his clipboard. Without an opportunity to pick our next coach ...

And since I believe it'll take Ted or MM to get rid of MM, Ted has a decisive advantage over anyone else until MM is gone. Therefore, a bird in the hand is still worth two in the bush. I'm content to set our beloved Eliot go, if he doesn't come back may his teams forever blow.

Great point. Not sure how much longer M3 wants to coach. I doubt he goes twenty years total, but he could easily get into the 4th or 5th year of a new GM before moving on. Then you are in one of those, shouldn't the GM get a coaching hire before you move on kinda deals.

I think he and Ted are tied at the hip until their contracts are done in 2018. If M3's contract is up, people will convince themselves of many dumb things and I could see McCarthy being allowed to leave after a market value deal is not put on table.

Its impossible to know what Murphy will do, but so far his best move beside tearing down a K-Mart has been to leave Ted alone. Even Ted haters have to acknowledge that the next hire could EASILY be worse, especially if McGinn is right and they use that executive search firm to find candidates.

But the easiest read is what Murphy has done (or not done) so far, which is to ride the Ted/Mike train to a very calm and peaceful decade. Once Ted's contract is up, he will then make a decision on both jobs.

So the corollary to 3irty1's point is that whoever on the Exec Committee is hot about Eliot Wolf might not have the power to move Ted upstairs if Ted doesn't want to. And Murphy will side with Ted.

[Patler]

If this McGinn article that Patler linked to is my only evidence, I am rooting for Ball.

I've been leaning toward Ball since Dorsey left, especially when there were rumors a couple years ago that TT might step down early. The references to him watching film with TT have been around for a while, as well as those about him sitting in on scouting and evaluation meetings. He seems to be preparing himself for a GM spot somewhere. My only reservation about Ball is that he could be a short term replacement. He is only 6 years younger than TT.

[Patler]

This isn't official by any means, but one of my salesmen is a big Seahawks fan and he said Schneider's most recent extension does not have the Green Bay-out clause. Not sure how to confirm there... think he read it on SeahawksRats.com.

When Schneider signed the extension, I posted a link to an article with a quote from Schneider in which he said exactly that.

But, as I understand the league's rules, he doesn't need an out clause. He doesn't have full personnel control in Seattle, so he could leave for a GM job in which he would have it.

[pbmax]

I've been leaning toward Ball since Dorsey left, especially when there were rumors a couple years ago that TT might step down early. The references to him watching film with TT have been around for a while, as well as those about him sitting in on scouting and evaluation meetings. He seems to be preparing himself for a GM spot somewhere. My only reservation about Ball is that he could be a short term replacement. He is only 6 years younger than TT.

Ted looks older than 63.

[Patler]

Pretty sure they could get John Dorsey. He doesn't have final say.

Same with Schneider, but it will probably cost more.

Does Dorsey have full roster control, or does he share that with Reid or Hunt?

I'm not sure Dorsey would even be interested in coming back. When he left he said KC had always been a dream job for him and his wife. She is from there, has lots of family in the area, went to school there, including law school, and worked for a KC law firm even when they lived in Green Bay.

[Maxie the Taxi]

Ted looks older than 63.I've got age spots older than 63.

[vince]

Does Dorsey have full roster control, or does he share that with Reid or Hunt?

I'm not sure Dorsey would even be interested in coming back. When he left he said KC had always been a dream job for him and his wife. She is from there, has lots of family in the area, went to school there, including law school, and worked for a KC law firm even when they lived in Green Bay.
http://www.espn.com/nfl/playoffs/2012/story/_/id/8839153/john-dorsey-named-new-general-manager-kansas-city-chiefs

Dorsey will report directly to Hunt, just as Pioli and other GMs have in the past. But during a massive overhaul of the Chiefs' front office, the chairman said he's altering the organizational structure so Reid also reports directly to him.

In the past, Chiefs coaches always reported to the general manager.

"The general manager has say over personnel. The coach has say over coaching the football team. And I want them to be able to work together," Hunt said. "That's the most important thing."
Interesting. It seems to be working but I would think that heirarchy has some political minefields in it. When they don't win do the coach and GM both run to the owner blaming the other?

[pbmax]

Does Dorsey have full roster control, or does he share that with Reid or Hunt?

I'm not sure Dorsey would even be interested in coming back. When he left he said KC had always been a dream job for him and his wife. She is from there, has lots of family in the area, went to school there, including law school, and worked for a KC law firm even when they lived in Green Bay.

Pretty sure Reid got full roster control when he was hired. Dorsey came on board later.

OK, he came on board after Reid but there is this from ESPN on the hire:


Hunt and Reid both insisted that the coach will not have final say on personnel decisions, and that the general manager will be responsible for building a winning roster.

[hoosier]

I've got age spots older than 63.

And you (your avatar) look older than Ted. Hiring Junior right now would be the impulsive thing to do, and therefore it would almost certainly turn out to be wrong. Even if young Elliot does in fact have the wherewithall to become a good GM, he needs to experience the world a little before he settles down. Hiring him to replace Ted--and, by extension, dear old Dad--would be setting him up to fail. Hire Schneidely and let Wolf go blaze his own trail before bringing him back.

[woodbuck27]

That would be awesome !

It would also be awesome if we could hire John Schneider, John Dorsey, or Reggie McKenzie

But we probably can't

Yea... like Elliot Wolfe is going to sign a contract elsewhere with this clause written in:

`` I will remain this teams GM unless the Green Bay Packers come calling or otherwise. ``

[woodbuck27]

Does Dorsey have full roster control, or does he share that with Reid or Hunt?

I'm not sure Dorsey would even be interested in coming back. When he left he said KC had always been a dream job for him and his wife. She is from there, has lots of family in the area, went to school there, including law school, and worked for a KC law firm even when they lived in Green Bay.

Nailed it....John Dorsey will remain in Kansas City (wife).

[Tony Oday]

To be a good GM, draft a top 5 QB. Done.

[Fritz]

How much does MM factor into these moves?

The way I see it no non-Ted GM will have the Packer capitol to get rid of MM. Yet MM is what 55? Its likely our next GM will get MM until MM hangs up his clipboard. Without an opportunity to pick our next coach, our next GM is both hampered and pampered by effectively being a dedicated roster guy. That could be 10 years of training wheels which may be fine for a baby like Eliot but in the meantime the only benefit to the team over Ted is however more effective the next guy is with the roster. If you're Bretsky and believe the optimal NFL offseason looks like it does in Madden, there is vast room for improvement over Ted so bring it on. To those who are less reactionary and see roster building as a set of tradeoffs, improving on Ted would be a pleasant surprise.

Personally I fall in the second camp, I think the worst thing about Ted, other than his having the charisma of an old pedophile, is MM (although I do like MM). And since I believe it'll take Ted or MM to get rid of MM, Ted has a decisive advantage over anyone else until MM is gone. Therefore, a bird in the hand is still worth two in the bush. I'm content to set our beloved Eliot go, if he doesn't come back may his teams forever blow.

Why would you say old pedophiles have no charisma? That's how they get those kids in the first place. That, and the candy. It sure isn't the rusty white van.

As for your other points, they are excellent.

I do, however, have the solution to all this: when TT retires, give MM the reins as both GM and coach. That'll work for sure!

[vince]

Does Dorsey have full roster control, or does he share that with Reid or Hunt?

I'm not sure Dorsey would even be interested in coming back. When he left he said KC had always been a dream job for him and his wife. She is from there, has lots of family in the area, went to school there, including law school, and worked for a KC law firm even when they lived in Green Bay.
Fresh new intrigue this morning by Ian Rappaport. (http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000771313/article/chiefs-gm-john-dorsey-emerges-as-a-potential-packers-chief?campaign=Twitter_atn)
My guess is this is being floated by Dorsey's agent.

Dorsey, a former Packers player who cut his teeth in Green Bay under Hall of Fame architect Ron Wolf, has not yet signed a contract extension, sources said. He's in the final year of his deal, potentially opening the door to him leaving what he helped build in Kansas City to work at Lambeau Field.

[George Cumby]

Why would you say old pedophiles have no charisma? That's how they get those kids in the first place. That, and the candy. It sure isn't the rusty white van.

As for your other points, they are excellent.

I do, however, have the solution to all this: when TT retires, give MM the reins as both GM and coach. That'll work for sure!

I almost didn't get your sarcasm there and was going to excoriate you for a fool. Assuming that WAS sarcasm...... :-)

[Carolina_Packer]

And you (your avatar) look older than Ted.

The avatar is a picture of Max McGee. I used to love hearing Jim and Max do radio play by play.

[smuggler]

My dad is 60 and he could definitely still work for 10 years, easy. I think the thing is the stress. Ted Thompson looks like he could be my dad's dad.

[Maxie the Taxi]

The avatar is a picture of Max McGee. I used to love hearing Jim and Max do radio play by play.Oops. I forget we have youngsters in the crowd. Max McGee's nickname was "Maxie the Taxi.":oops: