Perry Signed: Five Years

[Smidgeon]

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2017/03/09/report-packers-keep-nick-perry-with-five-year-deal/

https://twitter.com/JasonLaCanfora/status/839825507948593153

[Zool]

I'm going to guess 5 years, $49M. $14M bonus.

[Tony Oday]

Well let's hope the light stays on and he plays well this year too.

[pbmax]

Twitter rumors are between 11 and 12 million per year.

Anyone else having trouble accessing the site?

[QBME]

Anyone else having trouble accessing the site?

iPhone (AT&T) & iPad (Verizon) keep getting a "This site available" screen.

Laptop is getting through.

[pbmax]

iPhone (AT&T) & iPad (Verizon) keep getting a "This site available" screen.

Laptop is getting through.

I am on TDS and getting that message, but only intermittently. For a while yesterday and then this morning.

[pbmax]

JSO Silverstein wrap-up: http://www.jsonline.com/story/sports/nfl/packers/2017/03/09/nick-perry-close-re-signing-packers/98944480/

1. Perry and Packers meeting today to look at deal. Slightly non-committal but everyone seems to agree this meeting doesn't happen today if they don't have general agreement on terms. Spoon says likely north of $10 mil per year, but under Matthews $13.2 mpy. Perry and Sheard were last two pass rushers available. So Perry played this very well.

If its a five year deal, he is going to get north of $20 million of bonus/guarantee.

2. Packers have shown only slight interest in retaining Hyde. Have not committed to matching deals he gets.

3. Says Packers don't seem willing to sign Lang at the price he is going to get.

[HarveyWallbangers]

I wonder what it would cost to get Connor Barwin. Matthews, Perry, and Barwin would be an intriguing trio of OLBs to rotate. Matthews could play inside when they wanted to get all three pass rushers on the field.

[pbmax]

I wonder what it would cost to get Connor Barwin. Matthews, Perry, and Barwin would be an intriguing trio of OLBs to rotate. Matthews could play inside when they wanted to get all three pass rushers on the field.

He really fell off last year, you think it was switch to 4-3 that cost him?

[beveaux1]

JSO Silverstein wrap-up: http://www.jsonline.com/story/sports/nfl/packers/2017/03/09/nick-perry-close-re-signing-packers/98944480/

1. Perry and Packers meeting today to look at deal. Slightly non-committal but everyone seems to agree this meeting doesn't happen today if they don't have general agreement on terms. Spoon says likely north of $10 mil per year, but under Matthews $13.2 mpy. Perry and Sheard were last two pass rushers available. So Perry played this very well.

If its a five year deal, he is going to get north of $20 million of bonus/guarantee.

2. Packers have shown only slight interest in retaining Hyde. Have not committed to matching deals he gets.

3. Says Packers don't seem willing to sign Lang at the price he is going to get.

1. Perry was the must sign of the free agent season for the Packers. Even with his injury history, we could not afford to lose his QB pressures or his run contain.

2. Light interest in Hyde doesn't surprise me. I think the Packers view him as a safety and they have up and comers at that position. Although he made some plays in the regular season and the playoffs as a corner, his lack of speed was evident. He functions as a barely adequate slot corner and rarely was used on the outside, even when we had no CBs available. I think his most valuable role is as a punt returner. He might be the best we have.

3. Again, this does not surprise me. Lang is a free agent during a year in which the draft class is weak in OL and the salary cap jumped precipitously. He will be highly sought after and the Packers will not pay more than $10 million per year for a guard. In their minds, they proved last year that they would not skip a beat on offense, even after releasing a Pro Bowl guard. They would rather have the draft pick as compensation. It wouldn't surprise me if Barclay is the starting RG next year. My guess is Tretter will also be highly valued and will leave in free agency. We had a luxury with 2 starting centers and he will start at C for someone else. They will not move Bulaga who played at a pro bowl level last year and Spriggs is not and will never be a guard.

The big question for me is Jones. I think we need him and will try to re-sign him. With Perry off the board, his value has got to be higher.

[texaspackerbacker]

Good Signing - if Perry plays like he should. The fairly large bonus which keeps the cap number down tells me maybe Ted will sign something more - hopefully.

[pbmax]

Good Signing - if Perry plays like he should. The fairly large bonus which keeps the cap number down tells me maybe Ted will sign something more - hopefully.

Just know the fairly large bonus in my post is completely my speculation. The details of the contract they are supposed to be discussing have not leaked yet.

[Deputy Nutz]

Now Thompson is overpaying for his own players, instead of just paying for his own players. That is too much money for Perry.

[gbgary]

Now Thompson is overpaying for his own players, instead of just paying for his own players. That is too much money for Perry.

is he? the market is what it is. it had to be done regardless. the object is to get better after all. can't take a step back at ANY defensive position.

[Upnorth]

Now Thompson is overpaying for his own players, instead of just paying for his own players. That is too much money for Perry.

with the cap being what it is and the fact that perry is one of the best free agents this year, top 15 anyway, im not suprised, and he is a better deal than cobb imo

[Deputy Nutz]

Over payed per his production in Green Bay. He is often injured, I get what the market states but that has nothing to do with it, any team that was going to sign him to deal of over ten million a year over payed for him. Even with him the Packers defense was a giant turd. As an outside linebacker in this 3-4 defense the minimum amount of sacks an OLB should have is 8. Perry did well this year, and it was an improvement from years past but he is still one dimensional living off one statistic. There cheaper options out there. If he stays healthy and continues the production of 2016 with getting to the QB then it will be worth it, but if he falls back to his 2013-2015 form the Packers screwed up.

[pbmax]

^ That is the entire critique of Free Agency right there. Market prices for whatever detritus is left over.

Perry just happened to be the best left and the devil they knew. If he stays healthy, he is worth every penny. If not, I hope they can dump the deal after two years.

[Deputy Nutz]

He isn't that great of a player even when he is healthy, is he a quality starter? I certainly didn't think so up until last year. The path is clear for him to play 50 to 60 plays a game and with what the Packers are paying hopefully the production is there.

[pbmax]

He isn't that great of a player even when he is healthy, is he a quality starter? I certainly didn't think so up until last year. The path is clear for him to play 50 to 60 plays a game and with what the Packers are paying hopefully the production is there.

Not a game changer but healthy you are looking at 10 sacks/year and in the 20-30 range for pressure. He is also the best OLB run defender by far. He can play three downs effectively.

The downside, beside injury, is that he is not constantly disruptive. His best pass rush move is a bull rush which will collapse a pocket and cause lesser QBs to pause, but won't affect the better ones unless he wins outright.

He needs a partner to flush the QB. Datone Jones should pair well with him (as would Daniels if he wasn't double teamed) but Jones cannot finish a sack to save his life. Jones' best move is catching a fleeing QB.

[gbgary]

again...had to be done. no one better out there or on this squad.

looks like it's 5/60 w/18.5m bonus.

perry-receives-5-year-60m-deal-to-re-up-with-packers (http://www.thescore.com/nfl/news/1250202-report-perry-receives-5-year-60m-deal-to-re-up-with-packers)

[pbmax]

again...had to be done. no one better out there or on this squad.

looks like it's 5/60 w/18.5m bonus.

Yep.

@TomPelissero
Nick Perry's extension with #Packers is a huge one: 5 years, $60 million with an $18.5M signing bonus. He's due $20.8M in first year.

@TomSilverstein 30s30 seconds ago
Nick Perry deal is worth $59 million over five years and includes $1 million Pro Bowl bonuses each year, according to a source.

@TomSilverstein 59s60 seconds ago
At $11.8 million per year, Perry’s deal did not reach Clay Matthew’s average of $13.2 million. But pretty close.

@JasonLaCanfora 1m1 minute ago
Packers are paying Nick Perry big-time: $20.8M cash in 2017 ($18.5M to sign). Makes $39M over 1st 3 years. $60M/5yrs. Wow

[pbmax]

I almost always get this wrong on first go around, but $18.5 signing bonus pro-rates to $3.7 per year. Two years in and this deal could be voided and the signing bonus proration would wash out with cap savings.

If there are other guarantees (actual ones, not Pro Bow ones), then that might extend to three years.

So my guess is 2 years, 30 mil, if 3 years yields 39 Million. So he would make $15 mpy if it goes bad and the deal is terminated after Year 2.

[pbmax]

I almost always get this wrong on first go around, but $18.5 signing bonus pro-rates to $3.7 per year. Two years in and this deal could be voided and the signing bonus proration would wash out with cap savings.

If there are other guarantees (actual ones, not Pro Bow ones), then that might extend to three years.

So my guess is 2 years, 30 mil, if 3 years yields 39 Million. So he would make $15 mpy if it goes bad and the deal is terminated after Year 2.

I was close. Just under franchise value for 2 years.

Jason La Canfora‏ @JasonLaCanfora 3m3 minutes ago
From GB perspective, they'd look at Perry deal as $28M/2yrs; equivalent of franchising him at '17 total 2 yrs in a row, then pay as you go

[Deputy Nutz]

Unreal to pay that guy 28 million over the first 2 years of the contract. thanks but no thanks

[3irty1]

Good for Perry, that young guy is set for life.

Cap hits will look something like:

2017: 1.3M base + 1M roster bonus + 3.7M signing bonus = 6M
2018: 1.9M base + 1M roster bonus + 3.7M signing bonus = 6.6M
2019: 5.2M base + 1M roster bonus + 3.7M signing bonus = 9.9M
2020: 9.6M base + 1M roster bonus + 3.7M signing bonus = 14.3M
2021: 9.4M base + 1M roster bonus + 3.7M signing bonus = 14.1M

This is a reasonable contract for the foreseeable future and with only 18.5 guaranteed it never becomes a hostage situation.

[Rutnstrut]

Unreal to pay that guy 28 million over the first 2 years of the contract. thanks but no thanks

No unreal is what they pay Clay. Perry is just getting market value.

[pbmax]

NFL on ESPN‏Verified account @ESPNNFL 43s44 seconds ago
DT Calais Campbell is going to sign a 4-year, $60 million deal that includes $30M guaranteed with Jacksonville. (via @AdamSchefter)

[Pugger]

Unreal to pay that guy 28 million over the first 2 years of the contract. thanks but no thanks

I post on a handful of Packers message boards and you are the only one I have yet heard who is unhappy with this signing.

[Deputy Nutz]

With the way the salary is structured its not that bad of a deal. The overall contract seems ridiculous for a guy that has a total of 23.5 career stats

[beveaux1]

Had to be the number 1 priority signing. Someone with the potential to get double figure sacks and pressure on the QB had to be re-signed. Outside of Matthews, there is no other potential double figure sack guy. Peppers probably won't be back. Where do those 8 sacks come from? If we don't sign Perry, we have to find 20 sacks from Fackrell, Lowry, and this year's draft class. It was a must sign.

[beveaux1]

Good for Perry, that young guy is set for life.

Cap hits will look something like:

2017: 1.3M base + 1M roster bonus + 3.7M signing bonus = 6M
2018: 1.9M base + 1M roster bonus + 3.7M signing bonus = 6.6M
2019: 5.2M base + 1M roster bonus + 3.7M signing bonus = 9.9M
2020: 9.6M base + 1M roster bonus + 3.7M signing bonus = 14.3M
2021: 9.4M base + 1M roster bonus + 3.7M signing bonus = 14.1M

This is a reasonable contract for the foreseeable future and with only 18.5 guaranteed it never becomes a hostage situation.

I think the first year figure is close to right, but the 2nd and 3rd year should be higher if he gets 39 million over the first 3 years. We're missing 4 to 5 million dollars in those figures if my math is right. It's also missing 5 to 6 million in the last 2 years. Those totals are only around 50 million. Are they counting pro bowl bonuses to get them to 60 million. That would be 2 million per year for that bonus.

[Sparkey]

Perry was tied for 5th most sack from LB's this year plus he is very good at holding the edge. He is being paid what he is worth and as bad as the defense was last year, they would be far worse without him.

[pbmax]

NFL on ESPN‏Verified account @ESPNNFL 43s44 seconds ago
DT Calais Campbell is going to sign a 4-year, $60 million deal that includes $30M guaranteed with Jacksonville. (via @AdamSchefter)

@RapSheet 26s27 seconds ago
The #Saints contract with DT Nick Fairley is 4 years, worth almost $30M, source said.

NO PASS RUSH COSTS $7.5 PER YEAR ON THE INTERIOR.

[Bretsky]

Never been a huge Perry guy but this was a very good signing. Kudos to TT or whoever structured the contract like this.

Now TT should grow some balls and go get Connor Barwin and get him back excelling in the 3-4.

[pittstang5]

Never been a huge Perry guy but this was a very good signing. Kudos to TT or whoever structured the contract like this.

Now TT should grow some balls and go get Connor Barwin and get him back excelling in the 3-4.

I think them signing Perry means no Barwin, not that TT would have signed Barwin anyway.

[pbmax]

Wonder if people still doubt he wants to be an OLB?

[Bretsky]

Wonder if people still doubt he wants to be an OLB?

Wonder if Ted will be bold beyond the Captain Obvious.
Cook is coming back; Lang Maybe. House probably.

Dear Ted, go find us another pass rusher or a real starting CB before the draft.

[pbmax]

I think the first year figure is close to right, but the 2nd and 3rd year should be higher if he gets 39 million over the first 3 years. We're missing 4 to 5 million dollars in those figures if my math is right. It's also missing 5 to 6 million in the last 2 years. Those totals are only around 50 million. Are they counting pro bowl bonuses to get them to 60 million. That would be 2 million per year for that bonus.

Demovsky has the whole thing line by line: http://www.espn.com/blog/green-bay-packers/post/_/id/37824/nick-perrys-contract-with-packers-not-as-monstrous-as-it-seems

What someone reported to Silverstein as Pro Bowl bonuses for $1 million per year seem to actually be $600,000 roster bonuses (awarded weekly in season) and $400,000 workout bonuses each year of the deal.

He does have Pro Bowl bonuses, but smaller:

"Note: Perry also has a $250,000 Pro Bowl bonus each year from 2018-2021. There is no bonus for making the Pro Bowl in 2017."

[Pugger]

Wonder if Ted will be bold beyond the Captain Obvious.
Cook is coming back; Lang Maybe. House probably.

Dear Ted, go find us another pass rusher or a real starting CB before the draft.

Don't hold your breath on any of these scenarios.

[King Friday]

With the way the salary is structured its not that bad of a deal. The overall contract seems ridiculous for a guy that has a total of 23.5 career stats

Look at what some other guys got paid already around the league...many who have less talent than Perry.

Perry is a very good OLB. Unlike Clay, he is stout against the run in addition to being a decent pass rusher. He's not an elite tier player...but when healthy he is certainly in that 2nd tier. Those guys will get paid over $10M per year going forward with the rise in the cap.

[3irty1]

I think the first year figure is close to right, but the 2nd and 3rd year should be higher if he gets 39 million over the first 3 years. We're missing 4 to 5 million dollars in those figures if my math is right. It's also missing 5 to 6 million in the last 2 years. Those totals are only around 50 million. Are they counting pro bowl bonuses to get them to 60 million. That would be 2 million per year for that bonus.

What he gets and what he counts for are two different things. When they report he'll get 39M over the first three years they are counting the guaranteed money from years 4 and 5.

[Fritz]

Wonder if Ted will be bold beyond the Captain Obvious.
Cook is coming back; Lang Maybe. House probably.

Dear Ted, go find us another pass rusher or a real starting CB before the draft.

Bretsky, this draft is so deep at corner that even Matt Millen could close his eyes and get a starter in the fourth round. Why pay a vet bigger money? You could invest that in Cook.

I'm glad Perry is back, but I totally understand Nutz's point of view. You had, last year, a really, really shitty defense. 31st against the pass, I think? Yes, corner was a large part of the problem. Sure. But you couldn't get any pressure on any QB's anyway. So now you've got about 23 million a year wrapped up in two OLB's (Matthews and Perry) who were part of this 31st ranked pass defense. I know, I know, how bad would it have been without them? But this team's defense needs playmakers, disrupters, and while Perry is steady and holds the edge and gets some sacks, well, he's not a disrupter.

Which is why I wave bye-bye to Micah Hyde. Nice guy, solid, available, etc, but always two steps behind the receiver/tight end/running back. He tackled well but he didn't break up many passes. Not a difference maker, and that is what this defense needs.

Ted is just not very good at drafting pas rushers. I wish he'd let someone else make those picks.

And if I read any off-season stories about how Damarious Randall or Rollins feels "misunderstood" or that they thought all the criticism was unfair or that they don't care what anyone says, they played pretty well last year considering their injuries, I'm going to throw up.

[beveaux1]

Demovsky has the whole thing line by line: http://www.espn.com/blog/green-bay-packers/post/_/id/37824/nick-perrys-contract-with-packers-not-as-monstrous-as-it-seems

What someone reported to Silverstein as Pro Bowl bonuses for $1 million per year seem to actually be $600,000 roster bonuses (awarded weekly in season) and $400,000 workout bonuses each year of the deal.

He does have Pro Bowl bonuses, but smaller:

"Note: Perry also has a $250,000 Pro Bowl bonus each year from 2018-2021. There is no bonus for making the Pro Bowl in 2017."

Those numbers are closer to what I had envisioned. Cap hits of 6, 11, and 15 for the first 3 years with the last 2 years at 14 each. Thanks PB.

[Bretsky]

Bretsky, this draft is so deep at corner that even Matt Millen could close his eyes and get a starter in the fourth round. Why pay a vet bigger money? You could invest that in Cook.

I'm glad Perry is back, but I totally understand Nutz's point of view. You had, last year, a really, really shitty defense. 31st against the pass, I think? Yes, corner was a large part of the problem. Sure. But you couldn't get any pressure on any QB's anyway. So now you've got about 23 million a year wrapped up in two OLB's (Matthews and Perry) who were part of this 31st ranked pass defense. I know, I know, how bad would it have been without them? But this team's defense needs playmakers, disrupters, and while Perry is steady and holds the edge and gets some sacks, well, he's not a disrupter.

Which is why I wave bye-bye to Micah Hyde. Nice guy, solid, available, etc, but always two steps behind the receiver/tight end/running back. He tackled well but he didn't break up many passes. Not a difference maker, and that is what this defense needs.

Ted is just not very good at drafting pas rushers. I wish he'd let someone else make those picks.

And if I read any off-season stories about how Damarious Randall or Rollins feels "misunderstood" or that they thought all the criticism was unfair or that they don't care what anyone says, they played pretty well last year considering their injuries, I'm going to throw up.


Plz note I said.....Grow some balls and get a vet starting caliber pass rusher OR cb. ONE or the OTHER.....not just rely fully on draft and develop. Show a bit of urgency. AROD is no getting any younger...Connow Barwin is a captain obvious option to be very excited about. IF we suck at drafting pass rushers go sign another one.

Of course after years is disappointment during FA I expect next to nothing.

I'm fineif they wait and expect to get a CB in round one. There will be some stellar OLB there at 29 too IMO. We should have a great prospects to choose from at 29.

And TT won't fuck up enough to let Cook go. Dude wants to come back. We're securing Cook...not doing that would ba motherload of a fuck up by TT and he knows that....I can go either way on Lang.......we can bring him back; we can use those funds for a pass rusher
An Hde...thx for the service but see ya for that money.

[Deputy Nutz]

So for two years in a row Cook will be the free agent prize for the Green Bay Packers? That is not solidifying the roster to get to the Super Bowl. Ted is going to Ted, and what is getting disturbing about that is that he has complete control over this organization, the same as when the Packers let Mike Sherman sink the ship. The Packers will continue to have an average roster, with a hall of fame quarterback that will get just close enough to a Championship that nothing will change.

[Pugger]

I hate Packers' message boards during FA...

[Deputy Nutz]

I hate Packers' message boards during FA...

I know, 2010 is getting further and further away, making it hard to continually justify the methods of Ted Thompson.

[pbmax]

One thing to remember, the Packers sack numbers and pressure numbers (hits, knock downs, pressure that moved QB but did not tackle him) weren't bad last year. It did not come from the usual suspect (Matthews) but it wasn't a tire fire.

What was a League worst tire fire was the secondary at times.

If I had to improve one area and keep the other the same, I want an improved secondary first.

[HarveyWallbangers]

I know, 2010 is getting further and further away, making it hard to continually justify the methods of Ted Thompson.

Hard to blame TT for the choke jobs in 2007 and 2014. Those were Super Bowl caliber rosters. The 2011 offense was one of the best ever. You aren't going to have the best talent every year, but TT often has a good roster with a healthy cap situation. That gives us a chance every year. That being said, I'd like to see Cook resigned and a veteran CB signed. Another CB and an OLB can be found in this draft. I'd like to see Lacy come back, and I'd like to see they at least kicked the tires on Barwin.

[Deputy Nutz]

2014 team was not better talent wise than the Seahawks. They did choke that game away, but as the game was being pissed away you saw the failure of the roster.

[gbgary]

2014 team was not better talent wise than the Seahawks. They did choke that game away, but as the game was being pissed away you saw the failure of the roster.

i disagree but what ever.

[bobblehead]

2014 team was not better talent wise than the Seahawks. They did choke that game away, but as the game was being pissed away you saw the failure of the roster.

And as we ate their lunch for over 3 quarters you saw the failure of theirs. What I saw as the game was pissed away was the failure of a head coach, special teams coach, and blonde haired pass rusher.

[yetisnowman]

Sucks the market is what it is. Perry has missed games every single season in the nfl, and rendered ineffective by injuries in many more games he didn't miss. And his one impact season came in a contract year, and again even that year he was nullified by a late season injury. But when healthy he's our most productive guy on the front 7 so we couldn't afford to let him walk. Hope he at least earns half his money.

[Rutnstrut]

Sucks the market is what it is. Perry has missed games every single season in the nfl, and rendered ineffective by injuries in many more games he didn't miss. And his one impact season came in a contract year, and again even that year he was nullified by a late season injury. But when healthy he's our most productive guy on the front 7 so we couldn't afford to let him walk. Hope he at least earns half his money.

With Clay being pretty much worthless, they didn't have much choice than to resign Perry.

[red]

thats a lot of money for a one year wonder

and before anyone tells me that they can get out of it in two years, i'll say bullshit. the packers don't do that

if they did get rid of players who have terrible contracts, we would have cut cobb and mathews by now

this is reason #1 why you just can't let guys hit the open market, up until a few days ago he was worth nowhere near the kind of money he got

[red]

Anyone else having trouble accessing the site?

yes, last 2 days on ATT i got that message that the site was available

i figured the brown shirts had found mad and sent him back to the land of the great refried bean

[Teamcheez1]

Matthews is in the last year of his contract in 2018 and due $11.4M.

If he returns to form in 2017, that will be a good price for his services. If he continues to decline, he can be wiped off the books with no cap hit due to dead money. Either way, the Packers are in the drivers seat in regards to Matthews. He is certainly less risk than Perry.

[QBME]

yes, last 2 days on ATT i got that message that the site was available

i figured the brown shirts had found mad and sent him back to the land of the great refried bean

Russian hacking effort, trying to tear down this pillar of American freedom and values. Or it might be Belichick...

[Iron Mike]

Suck it, Haterzzzzz.......

http://gnb.247sports.com/Bolt/Report-Packers-have-contacted-Connor-Barwin--51705652

[Iron Mike]

http://www.scout.com/nfl/packers/story/1761812-barwin-possible-peppers-replacement

[Joemailman]

thats a lot of money for a one year wonder

and before anyone tells me that they can get out of it in two years, i'll say bullshit. the packers don't do that

if they did get rid of players who have terrible contracts, we would have cut cobb and mathews by now

this is reason #1 why you just can't let guys hit the open market, up until a few days ago he was worth nowhere near the kind of money he got

What if guys WANT to hit the open market to test their worth? You can't force them to sign.

[pbmax]

What if guys WANT to hit the open market to test their worth? You can't force them to sign.

Everyone knows that there is one side to negotiations Joe. Ted's side and he either gets it done or screws it up.

Just like buying a car is up entirely to salesman.

[Vincenzo]

I hate Packers' message boards during FA...
Totally with you on this.

[pbmax]

2014 team was not better talent wise than the Seahawks. They did choke that game away, but as the game was being pissed away you saw the failure of the roster.

They beat the shit out of the Seahawks for 52 minutes, then took the ball out of their (injured) best players hands.

They have been better than that team since then, talent wise.

[pbmax]

Perry comparison:

ProFootballTalk‏ account @ProFootballTalk 33m33 minutes ago
Dont'a Hightower gets $43.5 million, $19 million guaranteed

[QBME]

I hate Packers' message boards during FA...

I dunno...

I kind of look at the whole process as a good night out with the wife.

Start off with a couple of cocktails and shooting the breeze - what is, what may be (FA and draft).

Soup, salad, appetizer (OTA's & pre-season games, looking forward to something good).

Main Course - Regular season. (Load up if you're feeling good about the cocktails and apps).

Dessert - playoffs and post season. (Should I or shouldn't I/ Dom's defense ((the garlic in the main course)) is giving me heartburn).

Pay the check, win or lose.

Go home, make the world right.

Repeat.

[esoxx]

They beat the shit out of the Seahawks for 52 minutes, then Stubby took the ball out of their (injured) best players hands.



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