Studs And Duds - Packers vs. Bears

[Joemailman]

Studs

Aaron Rodgers - He had a pretty good 2nd half.

Randall Cobb - 9 catches, 142 yards, 1 TD

Davante Adams - 5 catches, 88 yards, 1 TD

Geronimo Allison - 5 catches, 69 yards, 1 TD

Nick Perry - Saved Clay's Ass

Reggie Gilbert - Great coverage on Cohen

Muhammad Wilkerson - Really came to play in 2nd half.

Duds

Clay Matthews - Only made 1 play that anyone will remember.

Deshon Kizer - Produced -7 points while in there.

Justin McCray - Looked overmatched at times.

Brian Bulaga - Tough matchup, but his overall prognosis is questionable at this point.

[pbmax]

Justin is right, Kenny Clark really closed off the middle in the second half against some ferocious double teams.

[RashanGary]

Man, Kenny Clark was blocked by 2 all game long. That’s respect. That opened everything else up. I thought king was sticky good too.

[pbmax]

Dix missed a hit on Trubisky that cost them a first down, but Dix, Whitehead and Brice played safety well and came up and made some nice tackles otherwise.

Hard to say about coverage, Bears didn't test them deep much.

[Tony Oday]

Dud:
Play calling first half

Stud:
Playcalling second half

[Bossman641]

Bulaga had an awful first half but was much better in the second. Hopefully just needed some time to knock some rust off.

[Bossman641]

Brice seemed around the ball, but I can't tell whether it's because he was flying to the ball or because his coverage wasn't very good.

[ThunderDan]

King played well. I like that we can play man and did a lot.

[Harlan Huckleby]

Bulaga gets a pass due to all circumstances. He wasn't terrible.

[RashanGary]

I’m giving a couple week wait and see on the whole OL. Matthews is done though.

[Carolina_Packer]

I joked with my son on the play where Trubisky went out of bounds and ran into Matthews on the sideline, "That's the first time he's hit Trubisky tonight."

[bobblehead]

Dud : MM Not playing Rodgers and other starters all preseason had them not game ready and it really showed in the first half...almost cost us Rodgers for the season.

[LEWCWA]

Amazing what the O looks like when you have to scrap the touchdown to checkdown on every damn play!

[Willard]

The rookie punter was pretty good, as far as punters go. In first half I thought our punter was the only stud. Fortunately he was not needed in 2nd half.

[pbmax]

Antonio Morrison looks like he can fit in for Ryan just fine.

[Rutnstrut]

Dud- I'm going a different direction with mine and saying Gutekunst. Just for not having a better plan at the #2 QB spot. We got a brief glimpse into what will happen if AR gets hurt. I don't think Kizer is the answer. He may be worse than Hundley. Hell even the Bucs have a better backup QB than GB.

[Zool]

Dud, MM for the vertical route tree.

[pbmax]

Dud- I'm going a different direction with mine and saying Gutekunst. Just for not having a better plan at the #2 QB spot. We got a brief glimpse into what will happen if AR gets hurt. I don't think Kizer is the answer. He may be worse than Hundley. Hell even the Bucs have a better backup QB than GB.

If Rodgers has to have a cartilage repair and is out say four weeks, it looks like another bad year not to have it settled. No doubt on that.

That said, some of the backups on rosters are even worse. You almost need to luck into a Flynn. Otherwise you are starting a McCown and you might as well raise a white flag.

Should have signed Kaepernick.

[Tony Oday]

If Rodgers has to have a cartilage repair and is out say four weeks, it looks like another bad year not to have it settled. No doubt on that.

That said, some of the backups on rosters are even worse. You almost need to luck into a Flynn. Otherwise you are starting a McCown and you might as well raise a white flag.

Should have signed Kaepernick.

Yes a noodle arm shit stain that hasn't played in two years.

[smuggler]

Kizer really only had one bad play. The strip by Mack was rough but it's not likely that any other QB would've prevented it.

[call_me_ishmael]

If Rodgers has to have a cartilage repair and is out say four weeks, it looks like another bad year not to have it settled. No doubt on that.

That said, some of the backups on rosters are even worse. You almost need to luck into a Flynn. Otherwise you are starting a McCown and you might as well raise a white flag.

Should have signed Kaepernick.

From my perspective, they certainly invested in the position and the player there looks like he has a strong future. I actually thought Kizer looked alright tonight. He had no time in my opinion.

You cannot pay ARod 33M and then pay another guy 5M to back him up.

[Harlan Huckleby]

Kizer really only had one bad play. The strip by Mack was rough but it's not likely that any other QB would've prevented it.

Yep

[pbmax]

Kizer really only had one bad play. The strip by Mack was rough but it's not likely that any other QB would've prevented it.

Strip sack and a pick six. He looked more comfortable in the pocket than Hundley, but that netted one nice completion.

[mraynrand]

Strip sack and a pick six. He looked more comfortable in the pocket than Hundley, but that netted one nice completion.

Kizer's MO from last year is that he made bad decisions in the clutch. Late in close games, red-zone. There's no way to really correct that in practice. You either play your way out of it, or it's with you forever (see: Bert). Still, it would have been nice to see Kizer behind an O-line that was blocking for him like they did for Rodgers in the second half. Hope he doesn't have to play much, especially against the better defenses (i.e., next week).

[denverYooper]

Jamaal Williams looks good in pass pro.

[pbmax]

Jamaal Williams looks good in pass pro.

He did, he created a nice muddle when Trevathan brought the wood. Jamaal took the brunt of the hit, but it stopped Danny cold.

I love when he and the other running backs check with Rodgers in the gun about protection and which side to be on. You can see the "don't screw this up" thought on their face.

[bobblehead]

If Rodgers has to have a cartilage repair and is out say four weeks, it looks like another bad year not to have it settled. No doubt on that.

That said, some of the backups on rosters are even worse. You almost need to luck into a Flynn. Otherwise you are starting a McCown and you might as well raise a white flag.

Should have signed Kaepernick.

There are 2 reasons why Kapernick isn't in the NFL and one of them is that he isn't a very good QB. Like Tebow he would make a decent backup, but the headache that comes with it isn't worth it.

[Harlan Huckleby]

Packers have two starting RBs in Williams & Jones. As one or the other is down with inevitable injury the offense will be fine.

[Harlan Huckleby]

There are 2 reasons why Kapernick isn't in the NFL and one of them is that he isn't a very good QB. Like Tebow he would make a decent backup, but the headache that comes with it isn't worth it.

He was much more successful than Tebow. But he did regress his last season as starter. I think Kap's ceiling wasn't clear.

[mraynrand]

There are 2 reasons why Kapernick isn't in the NFL and one of them is that he isn't a very good QB. Like Tebow he would make a decent backup, but the headache that comes with it isn't worth it.

He would have been a better backup than Hundley in Seattle. But he wanted to start, and wanted starter money. If Kap is serious about playing in the NFL again, he should put his cards on the table in Canada and light it up there. Warren Moon did when he was ignored by the NFL, and created a bidding war for his talent. Or Kap could just go his current route and maybe also sue the NFL, as many have suggested. The second won't increase his popularity with NFL/team execs though.

[call_me_ishmael]

Kaep is making plenty of money right now without risking injury. Why on earth would he ever want to play in the league again at the this point? He has his health, and his money. What more could you want?

[mraynrand]

Kaep is making plenty of money right now without risking injury. Why on earth would he ever want to play in the league again at the this point? He has his health, and his money. What more could you want?

Championships, success.

[call_me_ishmael]

Championships, success.

Championships I'll give you, but he has success. He has plenty of money and his health. That's what NFL success looks like.

[pbmax]

There are 2 reasons why Kapernick isn't in the NFL and one of them is that he isn't a very good QB. Like Tebow he would make a decent backup, but the headache that comes with it isn't worth it.

Tebow couldn't sniff a Super Bowl. CK is at least as good as Trent Dilfer and Nick Foles and likely better. Here is a list of some of the backups in the NFL:

Ian Rapoport @RapSheet
As the preseason wound down, sounds like some backup QBs solidified their standing as No. 2: #Panthers QB Taylor Heinicke, #Chargers QB Geno Smith, #Broncos QB Chad Kelly, #Jaguars QB Cody Kessler.

Here are some starters:

Nathan Peterman, Eli Manning, Sam Bradford, Tyrod Taylor, Blake Bortles, Case Keenum and Alex Smith.

[pbmax]

Kaep is making plenty of money right now without risking injury. Why on earth would he ever want to play in the league again at the this point? He has his health, and his money. What more could you want?

You have his endorsement contract with Nike?

[Fritz]

From my perspective, they certainly invested in the position and the player there looks like he has a strong future. I actually thought Kizer looked alright tonight. He had no time in my opinion.

You cannot pay ARod 33M and then pay another guy 5M to back him up.

I agree, for the most part, but I am troubled that he seems to be continuing his habit of committing turnovers. Maybe he can learn to stop that. I sure hope so.

I would also include Jamal Williams on a "meh" list. I imagine there were thousands of fans screaming "Dammit there's a big hole right there!" only to see Jamal run right up his center's back. Guy has no vision at all.

[pbmax]

I agree, for the most part, but I am troubled that he seems to be continuing his habit of committing turnovers. Maybe he can learn to stop that. I sure hope so.

I would also include Jamal Williams on a "meh" list. I imagine there were thousands of fans screaming "Dammit there's a big hole right there!" only to see Jamal run right up his center's back. Guy has no vision at all.

if Jamaal had cut back like Howard was, he'd have doubled his yardage total.

[Cheesehead Craig]

I'm going studs (small s) with the rookie corners Alexander and Jackson along with the sophomore King. They didn't make splash plays, but they didn't look lost out there, and we didn't hear about them screwing anything up and given the dumpster fire the secondary has been, this is a very encouraging start for those three.

[call_me_ishmael]

You have his endorsement contract with Nike?

The rumors are that he is paid as a tier one football star for Nike, so that should be good money. Not basketball star money, but good money none the less. Most sites peg his net worth at around 20M. Not bad at 30 with your health. I can easily see why he turned down the Broncos though. He's not a young buck anymore. It's not worth playing and risking injury knowing you aren't getting a phat contract without taking a small contract first. This is all just my opinion on money management and risk aversion of course.

[call_me_ishmael]

I'm going studs (small s) with the rookie corners Alexander and Jackson along with the sophomore King. They didn't make splash plays, but they didn't look lost out there, and we didn't hear about them screwing anything up and given the dumpster fire the secondary has been, this is a very encouraging start for those three.

100% agreed. Josh Jackson got some snaps in crunch time as well. I am far more excited about that pair then Randall and Rollins.

[mraynrand]

Tebow couldn't sniff a Super Bowl. CK is at least as good as Trent Dilfer and Nick Foles and likely better. Here is a list of some of the backups in the NFL:

Ian Rapoport @RapSheet
As the preseason wound down, sounds like some backup QBs solidified their standing as No. 2: #Panthers QB Taylor Heinicke, #Chargers QB Geno Smith, #Broncos QB Chad Kelly, #Jaguars QB Cody Kessler.

Here are some starters:

Nathan Peterman, Eli Manning, Sam Bradford, Tyrod Taylor, Blake Bortles, Case Keenum and Alex Smith.

I disagree with you on Foles, just based on accuracy - though maybe Foles was just hot last year, and Kap is better long-term. There are probably about 3-5 teams who would start Kap next Sunday if they didn't have to worry about controversy.

[mraynrand]

He has plenty of money and his health. That's what NFL success looks like.

I'll quibble with you here: that's personal success, but not NFL success.

[mraynrand]

100% agreed. Josh Jackson got some snaps in crunch time as well. I am far more excited about that pair then Randall and Rollins.

So far, King, Jackson, and Alexander all look promising. Add Josh Jones and you have a very young secondary with a lot of potentially rising talent.

[Carolina_Packer]

if Jamaal had cut back like Howard was, he'd have doubled his yardage total.

The Bears backside contain was better than the Packers, so I don't know if that's true or not. Fangio had that defense ready to play.

[smuggler]

Why didn't Dean Lowry get a sack for the last when he fell on Trubs with the high snap?

[pbmax]

Why didn't Dean Lowry get a sack for the last when he fell on Trubs with the high snap?

Is that a muffed snap?

[Anti-Polar Bear]

Stud: Jimmy Graham. Spent many a blue moons chipping and neutralizing Mack in the 2nd half. And people say Jimmy G doesn't block. Stats are for losers, but I have reasons to believe Jimmy G's stats will still end up being similar to what it was in his youthful, albino days down there yonder in dat Orleans.

[Anti-Polar Bear]

So far, King, Jackson, and Alexander all look promising. Add Josh Jones and you have a very young secondary with a lot of potentially rising talent.

King, Jackson and Alexander? Aren't they the founding fathers of the Rainbow Coalition?

Everything tastes good after a win. The aforementioned 3-headed monstas were actually kinda rotten in the 1st half. Caption Kirk is up next. We'll find out soon enough if King, Jackson and Alexander are bona fide NFL corners, or they're better off fighting the good fight.

[Fritz]

Why didn't Dean Lowry get a sack for the last when he fell on Trubs with the high snap?

Speaking of falling on QB's and penalty-calling, in the first quarter the Bears were driving deep in Packer territory, and after a completion that got them somewhere around the twelve, I think, a penalty was called on Nick Perry for roughing the passer, I think. On the replay, you see Trumansky throw the ball and Perry immediately slowed up but still hit him, then let up more so he didn't even knock Trubersky to the ground. I think he even held the guy up so Truzipski wouldn't fall down.

So how do you attempt to sack the quarterback at all without getting a penalty for roughing?

[Pugger]

Speaking of falling on QB's and penalty-calling, in the first quarter the Bears were driving deep in Packer territory, and after a completion that got them somewhere around the twelve, I think, a penalty was called on Nick Perry for roughing the passer, I think. On the replay, you see Trumansky throw the ball and Perry immediately slowed up but still hit him, then let up more so he didn't even knock Trubersky to the ground. I think he even held the guy up so Truzipski wouldn't fall down.

So how do you attempt to sack the quarterback at all without getting a penalty for roughing?

You have to sack him before he throws the ball? ;-)

Going back to Clay's penalty late in the game had he not hit Trubisky in the head with his forearm I doubt that would have been a penalty. You could tell Clay was trying not to hit him after the ball was gone but his momentum didn't let him. Defenders can't go near the head I guess...

[QBME]

Ultimate Team Game.

Studs - Packers

Duds - Bears

Team Game.

[Fritz]

You have to sack him before he throws the ball? ;-)

Going back to Clay's penalty late in the game had he not hit Trubisky in the head with his forearm I doubt that would have been a penalty. You could tell Clay was trying not to hit him after the ball was gone but his momentum didn't let him. Defenders can't go near the head I guess...


You funny.

But does that mean if you're running full speed and the QB just barely gets rid of it, you'd better figure out how to defy physics so as to avoid any impact at all?

[channtheman]

You funny.

But does that mean if you're running full speed and the QB just barely gets rid of it, you'd better figure out how to defy physics so as to avoid any impact at all?

I went back and rewatched all three roughing penalties. The first two the Packer hit the QB within a second of the slow motion replay. So, even less than that at normal speed. I have no idea how or what they are supposed to do. What if the QB doesn't actually throw the ball? Does a defensive player get awarded a sack if he runs by a QB who decides last second to not throw the ball?

Clay's was legit cause he hit the head of the QB.

[Guiness]

Man, Kenny Clark was blocked by 2 all game long. That’s respect. That opened everything else up. I thought king was sticky good too.

It did, but the rushers did not take very good advantage of it, not getting a single sack. Trubisky did get out of a few, and usually managed to pick up good yards on the ground when he did.

[pbmax]

We finally found the shut down corner:

Kevin King @King_kevvoo
That 4th quarter on sunday was the loudest ive heard Lambeau since ive been here. Aha shit was live as fuck.

Actually sounds like APB/Tank :D

[Pugger]

Bulaga gets a pass due to all circumstances. He wasn't terrible.

He got better as the game went along.

[Pugger]

Dud- I'm going a different direction with mine and saying Gutekunst. Just for not having a better plan at the #2 QB spot. We got a brief glimpse into what will happen if AR gets hurt. I don't think Kizer is the answer. He may be worse than Hundley. Hell even the Bucs have a better backup QB than GB.

He isn't worse than Hundley. I see a lot more to like with Kizer. I doubt Fitzpatrick would have fared any better with Hicks and Mack terrorizing the offensive line.

[Harlan Huckleby]

He isn't worse than Hundley. I see a lot more to like with Kizer. I doubt Fitzpatrick would have fared any better with Hicks and Mack terrorizing the offensive line.

I'm gonna concede that Kizer is a little worse than Hundley right now. But after a few games, I expect he'll be better.

Most of the passes Kizer throws can't be made by Hundley, more zip.

[Guiness]

A small dud to whatever was going on with the defense during the Bear's drive that started at the 9 minute mark of the 4th quarter. A clock eating 6 minute 22 second 14 play drive that included three 3rd down conversions. Oh, and the Pack had to use all their timeouts during it as well. We can't have been the only people screaming at the tv!

[Guiness]

I disagree with you on Foles, just based on accuracy - though maybe Foles was just hot last year, and Kap is better long-term. There are probably about 3-5 teams who would start Kap next Sunday if they didn't have to worry about controversy.

Big Dick Nick Foles has a pretty strange career arc. Pro-bowler his second season in the league, then breaks his collarbone halfway through a mediocre season. Traded to by acknowledged wacko Chip Kelly to the Rams where he looked like a zombie playing under Fischer. Asks for his release and signs a 1.75M deal with the Chiefs...wins both games he starts, but then is released at the end of the season! (his contract did balloon to $5M)

Then this past year - SB MVP. I'd say he's a damn good QB when given a chance.

[HowardRoark]

I'll quibble with you here: that's personal success, but not NFL success.

I’ll continue the quibble and say that personal success is subjective.

The point being.....Partial is wrong on all the quibbles.

[texaspackerbacker]

Say what you want about Hundley - and I'm sure the detractors will continue doing that, but he usually showed caution and good sense kinda like Aaron Rodgers. Kizer was and is a dud because he does not. Even at least one of his completions was kinda up for grabs and coulda been intercepted.

The O Line was pretty horrible too - lowered expectations maybe made them seem half decent, but compared to just about any other O Line in the league, they stunk.

Clay Matthews didn't seem as bad to me as a lot of people claim. He is now like a baseball hitter with "warning track power" - almost never getting all the way to the QB. He did, however, cut off some paths and with that one glaring exception, play with good sense. I still wish they would play him at ILB.

Jimmy Graham also was not a dud. The Bears apparently thought covering him was such a priority that our WRs got a little less attention. Also, he was called on to block or at least chip on his way out, making him less effective as a receiver. I'm still hopeful he is all we hoped he would be.

On the stud side, obviously Rodgers and all the WRs (I take back the bad I have said about Randall Cobb). It seemed like the D Line did its job most of the time in a studly way. The ILBs were the ones who allowed those cutbacks and missed a bunch of tackles. Most of the time our young Corners did ok. Brice was all over the field making tackles, but I'm not so sure he wasn't also out of position a lot.

[woodbuck27]

The results of Bears @ Packers on this past Sunday evening was beyond description ourageously amazing.

Well this .....Aaron Rodgers !

[pbmax]

OK, we need to clip the chip narrative in the bud. They chipped Mack maybe 5 times.

They did line some people up on his side of the formation and the reaction of the D was to send him wider and harder to chip.

[Teamcheez1]

OK, we need to clip the chip narrative in the bud. They chipped Mack maybe 5 times.

They did line some people up on his side of the formation and the reaction of the D was to send him wider and harder to chip.

Graham was used to chip Mack twice in the game. Bulaga held his own in the second half after a terrible start. People are selling this O line short.

[Joemailman]

Check out McCarren's talk on this. https://www.packers.com/video/rock-report-problem-solving They slid blocking coverage to the right, leaving Bakhtiari totally on an island.

Bakhtiari is probably the 2nd best player on this team.

[pbmax]

Check out McCarren's talk on this. https://www.packers.com/video/rock-report-problem-solving They slid blocking coverage to the right, leaving Bakhtiari totally on an island.

Bakhtiari is probably the 2nd best player on this team.

I don't think that is the whole story. They may have slid right on some sequences, maybe because of overload blitz looks, but McCarthy said, and I believe him, that they only adjustment they made was in the middle.

In his example, Larry thinks they are sliding right to Mack, but he is wrong. They are sliding right because there are four potential pas rushers to the right of center. If they don't slide, it'll be 3 on 3 and one of those 3 blockers is a TE. Not a good matchup. So they leave the ILB to Monty and slide right.

If they don't slide, the only help (Monty) is on the wrong side of the overload.

The question to ask is what was expected of Graham in this scenario? Was he expected to block, chip or just force someone wide? In this case he blocked.

And the Bears might have expected this call because they looped Mack around to the Packer left with had two blockers looking at two rushers and they almost slid him by.

[smuggler]

Check out McCarren's talk on this. https://www.packers.com/video/rock-report-problem-solving They slid blocking coverage to the right, leaving Bakhtiari totally on an island.

Bakhtiari is probably the 2nd best player on this team.

Right now it's either Bakhtiari or Clark. Adams is good, but not top-3 at his position. You can make the case for Clark as a top-3 pure NT.

[pbmax]

In that pass rush McCarren is breaking down, the Bears get the better of the calls. Mack stunts AFTER Linsley helps out on the DT and Bulaga has no one to block. Leaves Mack open up the middle.

Its almost as if they expected that adjustment.

[mraynrand]

Its almost as if they expected that adjustment.

They probably knew every play before the Packers even ran 'em.

[mraynrand]

In his example, Larry thinks they are sliding right to Mack, but he is wrong. They are sliding right because there are four potential pas rushers to the right of center. If they don't slide, it'll be 3 on 3 and one of those 3 blockers is a TE. Not a good matchup. So they leave the ILB to Monty and slide right.

This reminds me: For all the talk of Marcedes Lewis being a key blocker in pass pro, I really don't recall much of him being in there at all. Saw ton of Graham, but he seemed to be running routes. Have to look at the TE more closely when I look at the game again...

[Joemailman]

This reminds me: For all the talk of Marcedes Lewis being a key blockt of the niger in pass pro, I really don't recall much of him being in there at all. Saw ton of Graham, but he seemed to be running routes. Have to look at the TE more closely when I look at the game again...

Lewis was on the field for only 7 snaps. Packers went with 3 WR's plus Graham most of the night.

[Tony Oday]

AR seemed to get the ball out faster in the second half, instead of dancing around looking for a homerun ball.

[Fritz]

Lewis was on the field for only 7 snaps. Packers went with 3 WR's plus Graham most of the night.

I wonder if they'll take the Mercedes for a spin on Sunday in order to keep that Minnesota pass rush at bay.

[Anti-Polar Bear]

Say what you want about Hundley - and I'm sure the detractors will continue doing that, but he usually showed caution and good sense kinda like Aaron Rodgers. Kizer was and is a dud because he does not. Even at least one of his completions was kinda up for grabs and coulda been intercepted.

The O Line was pretty horrible too - lowered expectations maybe made them seem half decent, but compared to just about any other O Line in the league, they stunk.

Clay Matthews didn't seem as bad to me as a lot of people claim. He is now like a baseball hitter with "warning track power" - almost never getting all the way to the QB. He did, however, cut off some paths and with that one glaring exception, play with good sense. I still wish they would play him at ILB.

Jimmy Graham also was not a dud. The Bears apparently thought covering him was such a priority that our WRs got a little less attention. Also, he was called on to block or at least chip on his way out, making him less effective as a receiver. I'm still hopeful he is all we hoped he would be.

On the stud side, obviously Rodgers and all the WRs (I take back the bad I have said about Randall Cobb). It seemed like the D Line did its job most of the time in a studly way. The ILBs were the ones who allowed those cutbacks and missed a bunch of tackles. Most of the time our young Corners did ok. Brice was all over the field making tackles, but I'm not so sure he wasn't also out of position a lot.

Other than the part 'bout the Hun, excellent post.

[mraynrand]

Saw a couple all 22's where T-Will was just running all over the place, including smartly coming off his guy to get Mitsubishi - While Clay stood there with his thumb up his ---

T-Will played every snap and looked fast, but also assignment sure, with good instincts. Gotta wonder if he'll hold up all season, but he looked great Sunday.

[Pugger]

Check out McCarren's talk on this. https://www.packers.com/video/rock-report-problem-solving They slid blocking coverage to the right, leaving Bakhtiari totally on an island.

Bakhtiari is probably the 2nd best player on this team.

Yes, Mack stayed away from his side of the line Sunday night.