Ding Dong McCarthy is gone

[Tony Oday]

Just heard it on the Red Zone Channel.

[QBME]

Just heard it on the Red Zone Channel.

Heard it from other source.

[Vincenzo]

ya right

[gbgary]

its true.

[pbmax]

Green Bay Packers @packers
The Green Bay Packers have parted ways with Head Coach Mike McCarthy & named Joe Philbin interim head coach: http://pckrs.com/vertg

Trust me, this source is usually pretty good.

[pbmax]

So I think the theory that the Packers were looking to get away from McCarthy gets a boost as this happened before the evening was over after a mid-season loss.

But I wonder when the movement started?

[Rastak]

Holy shitballs, I gotta admit I'm surprised....strange timing - they obviously wanted him out.

[Strange Brew]

Buh Bye Mike!

[QBME]

Green Bay Packers @packers
The Green Bay Packers have parted ways with Head Coach Mike McCarthy & named Joe Philbin interim head coach: http://pckrs.com/vertg

Trust me, this source is usually pretty good.

Yup, and Philbin will not be around next season either.
Let the spectulation begin!!
We have nothing left.

[Rutnstrut]

SWEET!!!!!!! It's on NFL network. Fucking awesome. I am opening a 300.00 dollar bottle of bourbon as I type this.

[pbmax]

He was a very good coach. He has many skills good coaches have.

But he was slow to new ideas, thinks analytics are a chart of numbers and is one of the breed of coaches who thinks if his system isn't working, the problem is that the players are all wrong.

He can motivate, calm the public debate, inspire players and maintain focus. But he could not remake his offense or save his Special Teams.

[pbmax]

It can't be coincidence that Rand was at the game today. Perhaps he had a word with Murphy at the pre-game.

[red]

So I think the theory that the Packers were looking to get away from McCarthy gets a boost as this happened before the evening was over after a mid-season loss.

But I wonder when the movement started?

should have happened last offeseason when we made all the other changes

murphy wasted another year
no talent
don't let the door hit you in your giant fat no talent unoriginal ass

[Packers4Glory]

Xmas came early. Team has turned stagnant & predictable. We’re wasting the Rodgers years

[QBME]

SWEET!!!!!!! It's on NFL network. Fucking awesome. I am opening a 300.00 dollar bottle of bourbon as I type this.

Cheapskate.

[red]

Yup, and Philbin will not be around next season either.
Let the spectulation begin!!
We have nothing left.

buck and troy said defalipo should be up there

[pittstang5]

So he'll be The Browns head coach next year

[red]

Xmas came early.

i was about to say the same damn thing

what a great night

[ZachMN]

Hopefully the malaise that has permeated 1265 will be forever GONE!
Now I'll need a new avatar....

[red]

So he'll be The Browns head coach next year

and drag them right back down into the gutter

they don't have a HOF QB to make him look good

[smuggler]

Should have happened after the NFC championship failure against SEA.

[Rastak]

buck and troy said defalipo should be up there


Fuck that, go find your own guy.

[yetisnowman]

Completely justified. Team has completely fallen apart this season. And with your season on the line you lost at home to one of the worst teams in the league. A warm weather West coast team at that. Bye Mike. Always thought you were overrated anyway.

[bobblehead]

Called it 31 minutes ago in the gameday thread.

[red]

what sucks is, now rodgers might try and we do end up winning out

and still missing the playoffs but getting a much worse pick

[Rastak]

So do the Browns bring him on immediately?

[red]

Fuck that, go find your own guy.

GO FIND YOUR OWN PLAYERS!!!!!!

[red]

So do the Browns bring him on immediately?

would williams immediately quit?

[denverYooper]

So I think the theory that the Packers were looking to get away from McCarthy gets a boost as this happened before the evening was over after a mid-season loss.

But I wonder when the movement started?


Holy shitballs, I gotta admit I'm surprised....strange timing - they obviously wanted him out.

Last year was likely the beginning of the end but their offense has been lukewarm going on 4 years now.

[bobblehead]

He was a very good coach. He has many skills good coaches have.

But he was slow to new ideas, thinks analytics are a chart of numbers and is one of the breed of coaches who thinks if his system isn't working, the problem is that the players are all wrong.

He can motivate, calm the public debate, inspire players and maintain focus. But he could not remake his offense or save his Special Teams.

As with Favre I will follow my pattern. Thank you for the super bowl, but it was time.

[Rutnstrut]

So do the Browns bring him on immediately?

Is it really a given the Browns even want him?

[Rutnstrut]

As with Favre I will follow my pattern. Thank you for the super bowl, but it was time.



Brett was still contributing a lot to the team his last few years. Stubby has been a handicap for the last 4.

[red]

unfortunately, this is still a few years too late

[red]

Is it really a given the Browns even want him?

i'm sure a lot of people thought that mike sherman would get a ton of calls too because of all the games he won

but nfl teams saw through the bullshit and knew he wasn't a great head coach

thats why he coaches high school now

[Cheesehead Craig]

I want Bieniemy, but whomever is hired I hope they keep Pettine . There's no need to have a third defensive coordinator here in 3 years.

[Tony Oday]

I want Bieniemy, but whomever is hired I hope they keep Pettine . There's no need to have a third defensive coordinator here in 3 years.

This for sure. Defense sucks but it's not scheme its lack of playmakers.

[Pugger]

Completely justified. Team has completely fallen apart this season. And with your season on the line you lost at home to one of the worst teams in the league at home. A warm weather West coast team at that. Bye Mike. Always thought you were overrated anyway.

Our season wasn't on the line today. We were eliminated last week. But the way we played today was unacceptable. When your HC loses his team he is done.

[Rastak]

GO FIND YOUR OWN PLAYERS!!!!!!

Ain't no Packers starting for the Vikings Red.....:-P

[red]

Our season wasn't on the line today. We were eliminated last week. But the way we played today was unacceptable. When your HC loses his team he is done.

realistically we were still in the hunt today, but we HAD to win out

and this team barely showed like they wanted to win

[red]

Ain't no Packers starting for the Vikings Red.....:-P

first time for everything

[Rastak]

realistically we were still in the hunt today, but we HAD to win out

and this team barely showed like they wanted to winThis is very true. I thought the chance to make the playoffs was sort of a long shot but doable......see the thread.

[pbmax]

should have happened last offeseason when we made all the other changes

murphy wasted another year
no talent
don't let the door hit you in your giant fat no talent unoriginal ass

I tend to think the one year deal to avoid lame duck status was the first indication (public anyway). But it was still odd as Rodgers was probably on of those in the corner of removing him as head coach. Not much incentive to re-sign.

[pbmax]

McCarthy gave a very kind statement to Glazer on Fox. Thanked the Packers for the chance, was proud of the winning tradition they helped sustain together.

Said it was obvious with one year remaining that anything could happen at the end of the year, but was surprised at the mid season termination.

[QBME]

ya right

argo

[George Cumby]

He was a very good coach. He has many skills good coaches have.

But he was slow to new ideas, thinks analytics are a chart of numbers and is one of the breed of coaches who thinks if his system isn't working, the problem is that the players are all wrong.

He can motivate, calm the public debate, inspire players and maintain focus. But he could not remake his offense or save his Special Teams.

This.

Don't let the last few years take away from the fact that at his peak, M3 was a damn good coach, a great leader, an innovator and won a Super Bowl.

I'm glad he's gone, but he gave us a lot of good seasons.

[pbmax]

Jason Wilde @jasonjwilde
Worth noting that the #Packers made this call without having been mathematically eliminated from playoff contention.

[Rastak]

Jason Wilde @jasonjwilde
Worth noting that the #Packers made this call without having been mathematically eliminated from playoff contention.

I'm pretty damn surprised....do they have someone in mind that they wanted to get a jump on?

[denverYooper]

I actually sort of liked Seifert's take:


Kevin Seifert
‏Verified account @SeifertESPN
11m11 minutes ago

Sparing Mike McCarthy a month’s worth of rumors, plus the indignity of playing out the string, strikes me as a respectful outcome. It’s OK to do things differently from the way they have always been done.

[pbmax]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Dtc2rX2XoAESjIo.jpg:large

[yetisnowman]

Our season wasn't on the line today. We were eliminated last week. But the way we played today was unacceptable. When your HC loses his team he is done.

We most certainly weren't eliminated last week, unless your just saying on an emotional, logical level. Carolina, Chicago, Minnesota, Atlanta, all lost today. 5-6-1 would have still left a reasonable chance.

[pbmax]

^ An immediate search would lean toward, though not be proof, that they were waiting for the moment to strike.


Murphy will hold a press conference at 1:45 p.m. Monday.
~Packer Report: https://247sports.com/nfl/green-bay-packers/Article/Green-Bay-Packers-fire-head-coach-Mike-McCarthy-125780683/

[pbmax]

They did let him give the game ending press conference.

https://twitter.com/packers/status/1069342893243019267

[beveaux1]

I think the handwriting was on the wall. If he really did threaten to quit if Ball was made GM, that’s 2 1/2 strikes right there. I agree that he was a good head coach and a pretty good motivator, but that the offense was not evolving.

I always thought he and TT were attached at the hip, but after Thompson stepped down as GM, I did not see the loyalty out of MM. My feeling is that the acquisition of talent by Thompson was a larger part of our success than MM’s coaching. When Thompson’s job performance started to slip, we’ve seen a similar, but maybe larger slip in MM’s performance.

At any rate, it’s a new age for the Packers.

[George Cumby]

I like it. They are primed to grab the best prospect.

[Rastak]

I like it. They are primed to grab the best prospect.

Who is the "best prospect"?

[George Cumby]

Who is the "best prospect"?

Your OC.

[pbmax]

Tom Silverstein @TomSilverstein
Here's a good question: Who's going to get to a Super Bowl first, Aaron Rodgers or Mike McCarthy? Don't bet all your money on Rodgers. Let's see where McCarthy winds up.

[pbmax]

Your OC.

I want to steal Reich from the Colts instead.

[Rastak]

Your OC.


Not sure he's all that great but you could be right.

[woodbuck27]

i'm sure a lot of people thought that mike sherman would get a ton of calls too because of all the games he won

but nfl teams saw through the bullshit and knew he wasn't a great head coach

thats why he coaches high school now

Mikè Sherman actually coached the Montreal Alouettes this past Season in the CFL.

Finally MM is gone.

[beveaux1]

Tom Silverstein @TomSilverstein
Here's a good question: Who's going to get to a Super Bowl first, Aaron Rodgers or Mike McCarthy? Don't bet all your money on Rodgers. Let's see where McCarthy winds up.

This is something I could agree with. We have a lot of holes on this team and I hope QB is not one of them.

[Pugger]

We most certainly weren't eliminated last week, unless your just saying on an emotional, logical level. Carolina, Chicago, Minnesota, Atlanta, all lost today. 5-6-1 would have still left a reasonable chance.

Before today we were a game behind 3 teams ('Skins, Seattle and MN) in the NFC that already beat us for the last WC spot. We had to run the table and those 3 teams have to implode for us to make the playoffs this year. This team hasn't resembled a playoff caliber team for a while now. Even if made the playoffs this team is nothing like the 2010 squad.

[Strange Brew]

Your OC.

Joe Philbin long term? HA HA Not a chance! Might as well just keep McCarthy.

[QBME]

Mikè Sherman actually coached the Montreal Alouettes this past Season in the CFL.

Finally MM is gone.

Hey....Woody...good to see you!!

[Joemailman]

and drag them right back down into the gutter

they don't have a HOF QB to make him look good

How do you know? Arod didn't exactly look like HOF material when he first got here.

[George Cumby]

I want to steal Reich from the Colts instead.

I'm good with that, too.

[George Cumby]

Joe Philbin long term? HA HA Not a chance! Might as well just keep McCarthy.

You misread the exchange. Philbin is damaged goods.

[yetisnowman]

Before today we were a game behind 3 teams ('Skins, Seattle and MN) in the NFC that already beat us for the last WC spot. We had to run the table and those 3 teams have to implode for us to make the playoffs this year. This team hasn't resembled a playoff caliber team for a while now. Even if made the playoffs this team is nothing like the 2010 squad.

So you were talking on an emotional, logical level. It's certainly possible 9-7 gets a wildcard this year. Washington's playing with a back up the rest of the way. We're behind some teams that are certainly capable of losing 3 of 5 or whatever. But i agree with your assessment otherwise. However today was basically the elimination game.

[QBME]

You misread the exchange. Philbin is damaged goods.

Exactly correct.
Philbin is a place holder.

[beveaux1]

I also don’t care if they keep or release any of the coaches. Pettine has been..meh. The only coaches that I would like for them to retain are the CB coach because of the level of improvement and the OL coach who has been good for quite a while.

[Joemailman]

I also don’t care if they keep or release any of the coaches. Pettine has been..meh. The only coaches that I would like for them to retain are the CB coach because of the level of improvement and the OL coach who has been good for quite a while.

I think Pettine has been good. Defense has given them a shot at every game despite not having a legit starter at Safety. Get him the horses and they'll be fine on defense.

[beveaux1]

In my opinion, unless there were mitigating circumstances, this was a pretty classless move by an organization that doesn’t have the reputation of being classless. You have a coach that coached 13 years with only 2 losing seasons. He took us to 3 NFC Championship games and won a Super Bowl. He was a dead man walking this year, but he should have been afforded the chance to finish the season.

By mitigating circumstance, I mean if he asked the team to let him go the minute they decided he was not going to be their future coach.

[beveaux1]

I think Pettine has been good. Defense has given them a shot at every game despite not having a legit starter at Safety. Get him the horses and they'll be fine on defense.


He’s been OK. They can’t really stop the run, because they sell out to stop the pass. The new coach should be given the opportunity to fill his staff.

[mraynrand]

It can't be coincidence that Rand was at the game today. Perhaps he had a word with Murphy at the pre-game.

I did everything I could to get rid of him.

Actually it was interesting that he was totally isolated the whole game on the sidelines. No one really talked to him much.

My theory that they were scuttling the team to make him look bad and get rid of him seems to be correct. I still think there’s a good chance he resurfaces in Cleveland. If he doesn’t, that tells you how damaged he is.

[texaspackerbacker]

I shut off the TV after the game and went out to dinner. My grandson called me with the news - not really a shock. I'm mildly pleased that he is gone. There was a lot to not like about his coaching even in better years.

This could go one of two ways: We could get a guy who feels the need to rein in Aaron Rodgers, do more early down running, etc. OR we could get somebody who would play the whole game like most 4th quarters - unleash Aaron Rodgers, stop wasting early downs with running plays, etc. Everybody in here should know which one I prefer.

Anybody we get is gonna have some major adjusting to do. Wherever the guy coached, it's safe to say he is used to having an O Line that can actually block somebody as we basically don't. Wherever the guy came from, it's damn sure he didn't coach the (still) greatest QB in the history of the world. It's also fairly likely whatever team the guy was with had better defensive personnel than the Packers have.

I can take or leave Pettine. It wouldn't bother me at all if a new coach brought in somebody else. While it's true the Packer D personnel isn't what it should be, arguably the personnel was as good or better this season and unquestionably, the results were worse. That translates to Pettine's schemes not being worth much.

It will be an interesting off season. Whoever gets the job moves into a fantastic situation - Aaron Rodgers healthy and motivated alone makes this team top tier.

[Rastak]

I shut off the TV after the game and went out to dinner. My grandson called me with the news - not really a shock. I'm mildly pleased that he is gone. There was a lot to not like about his coaching even in better years.

This could go one of two ways: We could get a guy who feels the need to rein in Aaron Rodgers, do more early down running, etc. OR we could get somebody who would play the whole game like most 4th quarters - unleash Aaron Rodgers, stop wasting early downs with running plays, etc. Everybody in here should know which one I prefer.

Anybody we get is gonna have some major adjusting to do. Wherever the guy coached, it's safe to say he is used to having an O Line that can actually block somebody as we basically don't. Wherever the guy came from, it's damn sure he didn't coach the (still) greatest QB in the history of the world. It's also fairly likely whatever team the guy was with had better defensive personnel than the Packers have.

I can take or leave Pettine. It wouldn't bother me at all if a new coach brought in somebody else. While it's true the Packer D personnel isn't what it should be, arguably the personnel was as good or better this season and unquestionably, the results were worse. That translates to Pettine's schemes not being worth much.

It will be an interesting off season. Whoever gets the job moves into a fantastic situation - Aaron Rodgers healthy and motivated alone makes this team top tier.


Alot of what you said makes sense Tex.....except Rodgers sort of looked like shit again.....

[mraynrand]

Alot of what you said makes sense Tex.....except Rodgers sort of looked like shit again.....

It wouldn’t shock me if it was on purpose.

[Fritz]

I think after today's stinker Murphy saw an opportunity to dump MM, giving the Packers a chance to send out all those against-the-rules feelers to whomever they think are the top coaching prospects. Get a jump on things so as soon as the favored candidate's team's season ends they can snag him.

[Pugger]

I think Pettine has been good. Defense has given them a shot at every game despite not having a legit starter at Safety. Get him the horses and they'll be fine on defense.

Yes, the defense looked better than last year until we lost Daniels. Clark is great but he can't do it alone in the middle there.

[Pugger]

In my opinion, unless there were mitigating circumstances, this was a pretty classless move by an organization that doesn’t have the reputation of being classless. You have a coach that coached 13 years with only 2 losing seasons. He took us to 3 NFC Championship games and won a Super Bowl. He was a dead man walking this year, but he should have been afforded the chance to finish the season.

By mitigating circumstance, I mean if he asked the team to let him go the minute they decided he was not going to be their future coach.

From here it appeared he lost that locker room. When that happens the coach is done. I suppose they could have waited until after the Detroit game but I doubt things would have gotten better if they had waited.

[Joemailman]

The Official Proclamation:


The Green Bay Packers have parted ways with Head Coach Mike McCarthy and named Joe Philbin interim head coach, President and Chief Executive Officer Mark Murphy announced Sunday.

“The 2018 season has not lived up to the expectations and standards of the Green Bay Packers. As a result, I made the difficult decision to relieve Mike McCarthy of his role as head coach, effective immediately,” Murphy said. “Mike has been a terrific head coach and leader of the Packers for 13 seasons, during which time we experienced a great deal of success on and off the field. We want to thank Mike, his wife, Jessica, and the rest of the McCarthy family for all that they have done for the Packers and the Green Bay and Wisconsin communities. We will immediately begin the process of selecting the next head coach of the Green Bay Packers.”

President/CEO Mark Murphy will speak with the media Monday, Dec. 3 at 1:45 p.m. Watch live.

[Pugger]

It wouldn’t shock me if it was on purpose.

But Rodgers wasn't the only guy on offense out there today that played like shit. How many guys dropped catchable balls today? Why did Aaron Jones disappear for long stretches again? Having a messed up O line didn't help either.

[texaspackerbacker]

Alot of what you said makes sense Tex.....except Rodgers sort of looked like shit again.....

Rand beat me to saying it. At least, he looked like he didn't much care today.

Aaron Rodgers is still the best in the league - bar none.

[pbmax]

Jimmy Golen @jgolen
Vikings coach Mike Zimmer on Packers firing his counterpart: “I think it’s sad. It’s a sad day. Mike McCarthy’s a good coach. I think it’s a mistake. Just one man’s opinion.”

Steve Czaban @czabe
Tony Dungy is visibly shook by the McCarthy firing. “You just don’t do that to a SB winning coach in the middle of the season.” Oh for f***’s sake people!

IN NO WAY DO I ENDORSE ANYTHING ELSE ABOUT CZABAN, WHO IS NORMALLY A DUMBASS OF COWHERD PROPORTIONS

Michael Cohen @Michael_Cohen13
#Packers president Mark Murphy consulted with GM Brian Gutekunst before firing Mike McCarthy. Gutekunst was on board with Murphy's decision to part ways with McCarthy and begin the coaching search sooner than later.

Greg A. Bedard @GregABedard
McCarthy was very well liked in the Packers building. There will be a lot of long faces this week.
I'm very surprised they didn't let him finish out the season.

WHEN DO YOU SUPPOSE BEDARD WAS LAST IN THE BUILDING?

Drew Magary @drewmagary
Drew Magary Retweeted Greg A. Bedard
“Sure, but... the end was very, very sudden.”
“He was in intensive care for eight weeks!”
“Yeah, but I mean the very end, when he actually died. That was extremely sudden.”

[red]

I'm pretty damn surprised....do they have someone in mind that they wanted to get a jump on?

yeah, fucking up your playoff run by stealing your OC

[call_me_ishmael]

Classless. Terrifying. I have zero confidence in Mark Murphy. That fact plus the new org structure sort of puts us in uncharted territory. I have faith in Googer and I hope he is given full control of all things football at the end of the season, including having Ball report to him and choosing the next coach.

How stupid is this to fire a PHOFer mid-season? What’s the upside? He’ll inevitably have a street after him. He deserved the Coughlin/Reid treatment, not the Hue Jackson Browns treatment. This is fucking embarrassing and extremely concerning.

[mraynrand]

Don’t be so melodramatic. People get the axe all the time. Both GB and Stubby are fee to pursue new directions. Probably better for both.

[mraynrand]

Stubby isn’t going into the HOF based on what he’s down so far. Not by a longshot.

[pbmax]

Stubby isn’t going into the HOF based on what he’s down so far. Not by a longshot.

Partial got you there. He has the Packer Hall of Fame listed.

Pretty sneaky sis.

[KYPack]

I think after today's stinker Murphy saw an opportunity to dump MM, giving the Packers a chance to send out all those against-the-rules feelers to whomever they think are the top coaching prospects. Get a jump on things so as soon as the favored candidate's team's season ends they can snag him.

Yeah, all the way.

This is a huge opportunity.

We should change that stupid "triangle of authority" set-up Murphy instituted at the end of last season (after canning TT)

Goot hires the coach. The coach reports to Goot & Goot reports to Murphy.

Similarly, the coach hires his staff. Pettine should get a shot at the DC job (like all the assistants their shot to interview)

The new broom should also sweep the roster. There were so many guys who were lesser talents with an NFL job. Starting over is a chance to get rid of a lot of dead wood.

I like that we made this move early.

Now we have to pick the brightest light out there to lead us back home.

[mraynrand]

Partial got you there. He has the Packer Hall of Fame listed.

Pretty sneaky sis.
I don’t care. Thought it was ‘potential’ hall of fame.

Arguing based on packer hall of fame is lame.

[Bossman641]

We'll never forget you Mark.

In all honesty I'm not sure what they accomplish by firing him now but whatever.. he gets an extra 4 weeks of vacation.

[Joemailman]

Classless. Terrifying. I have zero confidence in Mark Murphy. That fact plus the new org structure sort of puts us in uncharted territory. I have faith in Googer and I hope he is given full control of all things football at the end of the season, including having Ball report to him and choosing the next coach.

How stupid is this to fire a PHOFer mid-season? What’s the upside? He’ll inevitably have a street after him. He deserved the Coughlin/Reid treatment, not the Hue Jackson Browns treatment. This is fucking embarrassing and extremely concerning.

I wonder if his PC had something to do with the firing now. He seemed to hint that maybe he knew he had lost the team


"I've never been in this spot," McCarthy said after the game, per Brian Jones of 247Sports. "I'm not going to act like I know what the hell I'm gonna do tomorrow when we get in here. But we're going to do what we always do. We're going to represent the Packers the right way."

[pbmax]

https://www.jsonline.com/story/sports/nfl/packers/2018/12/02/twitter-reacts-packers-firing-mike-mccarthy/2187476002/

Kevin Seifert @SeifertESPN
Sparing Mike McCarthy a month’s worth of rumors, plus the indignity of playing out the string, strikes me as a respectful outcome. It’s OK to do things differently from the way they have always been done.

Peter Bukowski @Peter_Bukowski
I just hope #Packers fans realize and appreciate Mike McCarthy was and currently is the best coach in NFC North history. That's not even up for debate. It's objective fact.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Dtc85yRWoAEF2Me.jpg

Hal Habib @gunnerhal
Wow. Packers not wasting any time scrubbing their site following McCarthy era.
6:38 PM - Dec 2, 2018

Justus Cleveland @JustusCleveland
So the question is do Packer fans now turn their anger on Rodgers? Capers, Thompson and McCarthy are all gone. Some patience is going to be needed to rebuild, but the fan base doesn't really have a lot.

A. YOU ARE BEHIND AS ANGER ALREADY EXISTS AT RODGERS. NEW COACH WILL GET A HONEYMOON. WHOEVER YOU ARE, THIS IS BOG STANDARD, COMPLAIN ABOUT THE FANS, DUMB

Gerry Callahan @GerryCallahan
Troy Aikman, cliche machine, says Mike McCarthy deserved better. McCarthy was head coach in Green Bay for 13 years. He won one Super Bowl. How long did he deserve, Troy? Fourteen years? Twenty?

KC Joyner @KCJoynerTFS
I just got through posting that no NFL team would want to hire Mike McCarthy. And then someone pointed out that Cleveland will have an open head coaching job. The Browns would be foolish enough to hire him, so there is that caveat.

The Falcoholic @TheFalcoholic
Mike McCarthy is not going to be the OC of the Atlanta Falcons thank you for asking

THIS GUY IS LIKELY AN IDIOT

Adam Schein @AdamSchein
Mike McCarthy had a great run. Name will go into ring of honor. Inevitable it was over. Bad year. Can’t lose to Cards at home. Feel terrible Ted Thompson never gave him big time talent around Rodgers. Will be desired HC.

WHO WANTS TO TELL ADAM ABOUT THIS?

sportsfreak217 @sportsfreak217
Hey Adam have you ever watched a packer game before

Adam Schein @AdamSchein
The Browns or Jets would be lucky to hire Mike McCarthy.

Ragnarok Lobster @eclecticbrotha
Jay Glazer reporting other coaches around the league are outraged about the way Mike McCarthy was fired. That doesn't bode well for a front office looking for a coach to replace him.

I BET THERE IS SOMETHING TO THIS. GOOD REASON TO AVOID THEM TOO.

[Guiness]

But Rodgers wasn't the only guy on offense out there today that played like shit. How many guys dropped catchable balls today? Why did Aaron Jones disappear for long stretches again? Having a messed up O line didn't help either.

A. Jones mostly disappeared when he was pulled from the game and Williams was rushing. 1 or 2 series in the 3rd quarter and another in the 4th I believe?

Packers passed 50 times, rushed 18. Cardinals are ranked 30th in rush defense. Aaron Jones leads the league in yards/attempt. :whaa:

[Guiness]

J
Steve Czaban @czabe
Tony Dungy is visibly shook by the McCarthy firing. “You just don’t do that to a SB winning coach in the middle of the season.” Oh for f***’s sake people!

IN NO WAY DO I ENDORSE ANYTHING ELSE ABOUT CZABAN, WHO IS NORMALLY A DUMBASS OF COWHERD PROPORTIONS


Dungy up on his high horse, dispensing advice


https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=13&v=jJlNsDuKwnQ

[ThunderDan]

I think Mark Murphy is putting himself in trouble. He needs to stay out of Gute’s way and let him pick his coach.

[Fosco33]

I called for mid season firing on Oct 8th. Waited a season too long and we all knew it... and wasted another year of Arod.

[esoxx]

It wouldn’t shock me if it was on purpose.

If true, Rodgers should be inducted to the Asshole HOF immediately.

[beveaux1]

Packers have not fired a coach during the season since 1953. Not during the late 60s, the 70s, the 80s, or the early 90s. They didn’t fire Rhodes during the season. They didn’t fire Sherman during the season, not even during his 4-12 season with Favre at QB. I don’t even understand the argument that they want to start their coach search early. They can’t hire anyone during the season, and they can’t even interview until the playoffs start.

Nobody could convince me that they haven’t already started a list of people they want to interview or that they couldn’t do it while letting MM run out the string. This is kind of sad...and crappy.

[George Cumby]

Yeah, all the way.

This is a huge opportunity.

We should change that stupid "triangle of authority" set-up Murphy instituted at the end of last season (after canning TT)

Goot hires the coach. The coach reports to Goot & Goot reports to Murphy.

Similarly, the coach hires his staff. Pettine should get a shot at the DC job (like all the assistants their shot to interview)

The new broom should also sweep the roster. There were so many guys who were lesser talents with an NFL job. Starting over is a chance to get rid of a lot of dead wood.

I like that we made this move early.

Now we have to pick the brightest light out there to lead us back home.

Yup.

'Cause if Murphy fucks this up, we are headed back to the future of the '70's and '80's.

[call_me_ishmael]

Ragnarok Lobster @eclecticbrotha
Jay Glazer reporting other coaches around the league are outraged about the way Mike McCarthy was fired. That doesn't bode well for a front office looking for a coach to replace him.

I BET THERE IS SOMETHING TO THIS. GOOD REASON TO AVOID THEM TOO.

Peanut Butter,

My dude, normally you are spot on on most things and I find you very easy to agree with. But this. No no no. This I cannot get behind.

It was a chicken shit thing they did to McCarthy. Ted Thompson NEVER would have done that. Howie Roseman NEVER would have done that. John Mara would NEVER have done that.

The folks in here are too biased and uninformed to recognize the truth: Mike McCarthy, for better or worse, record wise is one of the top 20-30 coaches in NFL history. In this business you are exactly what your record is. Mike McCarthy is a winner.

I 100% believe it was his time to go, but after the season. It should have been handled in a classy way. The Eagles put a video montage and celebrated Reid on the website (https://www.pressofatlanticcity.com/sports/it-hurts-a-lot-firing-of-andy-reid-after-years/article_a696abb8-5309-11e2-bb1a-0019bb2963f4.html). The Packers wasted no time purging him from their site.

We're in uncharted territory here and I am very nervous about it. No Harlan, no wolf, and the only guy with ties to the old guard is a GM who's power has been neutered. I am very concerned, to be frank.

[texaspackerbacker]

Just because the record for his 13 years was probably among the top 20 or 30 for that long a period in NFL history, that doesn't make McCarthy that great a coach any more than it makes Ted a great (or even good) GM. Having the world's greatest QB tended to elevate the reputation of both, but the fact is, neither one maximized things. Getting rid of McCarthy before the end of the season may not have been necessary, but it sends a message that somebody in a position of power recognizes his contribution for what it was.

[call_me_ishmael]

Umm my dude - do you remember the hot garbage ARod looked like pre-MM? Same could be said for Favre. MM gave Favre an additional 5 year window after everyone thought he was done, and MM made ARod into a star. Notice that once the rumors of a poor relationship with the coach began, ARod has looked like shit consistently.

[Sparkey]

Murphy says he will consult with Gutekunst, but it will be his decision as to who they hire as the next head coach of the Green Bay Packers

[pbmax]

Packers have not fired a coach during the season since 1953. Not during the late 60s, the 70s, the 80s, or the early 90s. They didn’t fire Rhodes during the season. They didn’t fire Sherman during the season, not even during his 4-12 season with Favre at QB. I don’t even understand the argument that they want to start their coach search early. They can’t hire anyone during the season, and they can’t even interview until the playoffs start.

Nobody could convince me that they haven’t already started a list of people they want to interview or that they couldn’t do it while letting MM run out the string. This is kind of sad...and crappy.

Murphy and the executive board are not of the era that worked with OR remembers that era. Business as usual.

Probably even looking forward to playing the kids.

[call_me_ishmael]

Coaches who led teams to Super-Bowl titles, only to be fired by them later: Hank Steam, Don McCafferty, Tom Landry, Mike Ditka, George Seifert, Mike Shanahan, Brian Billick, Jon Gruden, Mike Mccarthy. McCafferty and McCarthy are only in-season Super-Bowl winning HCs to he fired.

Because it's classless.

[pbmax]

Peanut Butter,

My dude, normally you are spot on on most things and I find you very easy to agree with. But this. No no no. This I cannot get behind.

Let's focus on the quoted part for now.

I said I believed that coaches around the League were aghast that McCarthy got fired mid-season. I did not say it was a proud moment for the franchise.

What I did say was that if coaches don't want to coach the Packers because of said treatment, they should be avoided like they carry plague. Because coaches are not actually interested in proper HR administration, they are interested in living on forever in their well paid jobs. Which means they defend each other at almost all costs. You are more likely to get the truth from a turnip that you will getting one coach to comment honestly about the other.

So if Tony Dungy is upset, he can stay away from the interview process.

[call_me_ishmael]

https://twitter.com/AdamSchefter/status/1069396450201743361


Firing Mike McCarthy, as Packers did, is almost unprecedented. Former Colts HC Don McCafferty was only HC prior to McCarthy with a SB win to his credit to not finish a season he started. Colts fired McCafferty five games into 1972 season after winning Super Bowl with him in 1970.

Because it's classless.

There _has_ to be more to this story.

[Harlan Huckleby]

It was a chicken shit thing they did to McCarthy. Ted Thompson NEVER would have done that.

Unless McCarthy was being insubordinate or something, ya, it was a crazy calloused way to treat ANY employee who had done their level best for many years.

[pbmax]

John Mara paid a kicker who was beating his wife. Well after they knew about it, they re-signed him to a contract. John Mara hung a coach out to dry when trying to bench Eli Manning and end his career streak on a decidedly non-classy note. I don't think Mara is the kind of guy from whom you take lessons in how to conduct yourself publicly.

Ted Thompson hired and fired players and coaches and refused to meet with the media. Ted did not care about the public spectacle of it. He let his coach take the heat every time.

Howie Roseman wasn't in charge of the Reid firing. That was Lurie. Lurie might have some scruples.

[pbmax]

https://twitter.com/AdamSchefter/status/1069396450201743361

Because it's classless.

There _has_ to be more to this story.

I suspect they wanted Rodgers under contract. They knew they had to do that first to get top flight HC candidates. You couldn't go QB shopping and coach shopping in the same year.

So one year extension for M3 gets Rodgers long term. Fire McCarthy the next year and you have the team in the best possible spot to attract candidates.

On a different topic, if Rodgers were tanking, he would have sat out those four weeks to heal his knee after the Bears opener. His rep would have taken less abuse and M3 might have been gone sooner.

[call_me_ishmael]

Good read on the topic.

http://www.espn.com/blog/green-bay-packers/post/_/id/46392/next-packers-coach-must-make-it-work-with-aaron-rodgers

[pbmax]

Scott Kacsmar @FO_ScottKacsmar
No one seems to get hot late and carry it over to the playoffs anymore.

2012 Ravens (won SB)
2011 Giants (won SB)
2010 Packers (won SB)
2009 Jets (lost AFC-CG)
6 replies 2 retweets 3 likes
Reply 6 Retweet 2 Like 3 Direct message

Joey Hickmann @JoeyHickmann
2016 Packers are the last example I can think of and they lost in the NFCCG

Scott Kacsmar @FO_ScottKacsmar
Yeah that was one, and fittingly, they were the only recent team to take down a 1 seed before the Super Bowl.

2013 - DEN & SEA
2014 - NE & SEA
2015 - DEN & CAR
2016 - NE & ATL
2017 - NE & PHI

Those were all 1 seeds except 2016 ATL (#2).

[MadScientist]

If Rodgers was playing poorly because of MM (either not tanking, or not buying into his strategy/tactics) then there should be an improvement in his play over the final 4 games.

It's clear they made the decision to fire MM and It was just a matter of now vs in 4 weeks. Why now? I can think of a few possibilities:
1) They wanted to send a message to the team. The trades earlier this year should have been enough, but possibly they felt more was necessary.
2) They plan to start searching for a head coach right away. Given tampering rules and lack of availability of NFL candidates, this could mean they want to talk to college coaches.
3) Murphy wanted to show he has all the power and temperament of a crazy, meddling owner. May this not be the case.

[gbgary]

MM was toast the minute they extended Rodgers. this should have been a prove it year for both of them but the scales were tipped with Rodgers signature. now Rodgers gets a pass for a bad year that they're both responsible for. this better be some upcoming off-season, and next couple of years, for it to be worth it. i'll go on record and say a 10-6 season in the next 3 will be pretty much a miracle because Rodgers is in decline and that contract is going to weigh heavy starting in 2020.

[mmmdk]

Finally, Stubby is fired. Many players, including Aaron Rodgers, had quit on McCarthy and it would have been ugly the rest of the season. Now it still may be ugly the rest of the way but management has been sending messages all season long and this message is clear; play with a winning attitude or you're out too.

[oldbutnotdeadyet]

Unless McCarthy was being insubordinate or something, ya, it was a crazy calloused way to treat ANY employee who had done their level best for many years.

Yeah, maybe, but us old guys r of an era where loyalty and shit mattered. Now, times r different, and everything is about NOW. I am actually excited again about the future, and only hope I live long enough to see another super bowl.

[Rastak]

yeah, fucking up your playoff run by stealing your OC

After the game he called yesterday I'm beginning to hope you get him....maybe they could work out a trade.....

[Harlan Huckleby]

2) They plan to start searching for a head coach right away. Given tampering rules and lack of availability of NFL candidates, this could mean they want to talk to college coaches.
Interesting theory. Could be.

I hear Pat Fitzgerald at Northwestern mentioned. He seems like a U-rah-rah college coach who would have to retool for pros. But he does win without benefit of a football factory, so he's smart.

[bobblehead]

I want to steal Reich from the Colts instead.

Last offseason I predicted Reich would be the next good HC. I like him still, but man did he produce a stinker yesterday.

Sidenote. With MM now gone what do I have left to cheer for this year? (KUMEROW)

[mraynrand]

On a different topic, if Rodgers were tanking, he would have sat out those four weeks to heal his knee after the Bears opener. His rep would have taken less abuse and M3 might have been gone sooner.

not necessarily true. With Rodgers out, they have the standard built in excuse - how could Stubbers be expected to win without Rodgers. Or worse, Stubby wins without him and they can't possibly get rid of him. And they spent all that cash on Rodgers who can be replaced. (I don't think this would have happened, but you never know).

I think getting rid of Stubby was the plan all along, and the extreme roster turnover and the itchy trades and IR trigger fingers helped the process along. Stubby had to look bad to fire him and they made sure it happened. So it may be even far more unclassy than even CMI believes.

[bobblehead]

Umm my dude - do you remember the hot garbage ARod looked like pre-MM? Same could be said for Favre. MM gave Favre an additional 5 year window after everyone thought he was done, and MM made ARod into a star. Notice that once the rumors of a poor relationship with the coach began, ARod has looked like shit consistently.

Arod was a potential #1 overall pick and was on the bench for the one season he didn't have MM. Hot Garbage? Look, you are no different than most of us, you overstate things. Truth is MM was a decent coach. Like most coaches the game passed him by. He had the benefit of 2 HOF QBs at his back and he never actually won much outside of GB (was my critique when he got the job). Personally I think TT was a star and the only reason this team was so good for so long. Gutes nailed his first pick, but not liking much else he did so far. Like all things time will tell, but it was time to move on from Fat Mike.

[bobblehead]

Because it's classless.

Was it as classless as scapegoating TT and everyone around him after 2017? Was it classless to scapegoat Montgomery and trade him immediately blaming him for your own inadequacies and inability to use AJones consistently? BTW, Monty is turning in some nice games for Baltimore.

[bobblehead]

https://twitter.com/AdamSchefter/status/1069396450201743361



Because it's classless.

There _has_ to be more to this story.

Like maybe Murph treated MM like he has been treating TT and everyone else? Remember the story about Fat Mike getting some random groundkeeper fired because the guy asked him if they were going to win the superbowl this year?

[bobblehead]

Unless McCarthy was being insubordinate or something, ya, it was a crazy calloused way to treat ANY employee who had done their level best for many years.

Like how MM treated a guy who changed positions to help fatty salvage a season ravaged by injuries to the position?

[bobblehead]

John Mara paid a kicker who was beating his wife. Well after they knew about it, they re-signed him to a contract. John Mara hung a coach out to dry when trying to bench Eli Manning and end his career streak on a decidedly non-classy note. I don't think Mara is the kind of guy from whom you take lessons in how to conduct yourself publicly.

Ted Thompson hired and fired players and coaches and refused to meet with the media. Ted did not care about the public spectacle of it. He let his coach take the heat every time.

Howie Roseman wasn't in charge of the Reid firing. That was Lurie. Lurie might have some scruples.

I have actually met Lurie on more than one occassion. Scruples isn't the word that comes to mind.

[mraynrand]

I'm going to track the success of Ted Thompson's draft picks from 2013 - 2018 around the NFL and ask whether Stubbers had the ammo he needed to win football games. Go though 'em in your mind - think of all the Thompson picks that have become monsters in the NFL for Green Bay or since leaving Green Bay.

Stubby will be successful again somewhere else. The NFL is the extreme socialism/redistribution of wealth league - they punish success, and Stubby/Packers got punished like a Kareem Hunt gf. Ted Thompson's meteoric decline as GM didn't help much. Nothing makes a competent coach so successful as several years of drafting all pro talent.

[mraynrand]

I have actually met Lurie on more than one occassion. Scruples isn't the word that comes to mind.

do you have some Lurid stories?

[bobblehead]

do you have some Lurid stories?

A long time ago I mentioned his wifes great quote. Something like "fans and owners always believe they are just ONE player away from the superbowl." Generally he is a douchebag who talks down to people as if he were royalty.

[Pugger]

Because it's classless.

But we don't really know what was going on in that locker room when the reporters and cameras weren't around. If the atmosphere was getting toxic what good would it do to keep MM around for the last 4 games seeing we are out of playoff contention?

[Patler]

Yeah, maybe, but us old guys r of an era where loyalty and shit mattered. Now, times r different, and everything is about NOW. I am actually excited again about the future, and only hope I live long enough to see another super bowl.

Yup, because NFL "teams" are no longer teams in the nostalgic terms we like to think of them. They are good size businesses with a lot more employees off the field than on, and business activities that go on year-around. They are no longer a team of players and coaches with a handful of supporting employees, and operations that go into hibernation for from January to July. (Heck, I still remember when the draft was during the season!)

When a business determines that it must move on from one of its top executives (or really, any employee, for that matter, but especially a top executive) it should act immediately. Nothing good can happen from waiting for a month, but the situation can deteriorate significantly.

All Packer employees now know the organization is embarking on a new course. They are not left to wonder what is going to happen. All employees, and especially the players can deal with that reality while they are together and engaged in the primary "team" activity. Players can prepare for what will be a major change in their careers while they are together.

In recent years we have seen NFL assistant coaches, coordinators and players dumped unceremoniously during the NFL season. There is no reason head coaches should be any different. It happens in other professional sports all the time. Football is merely catching up to the reality already experienced hy head coaches and managers in professional hockey, baseball, basketball, etc.

McCarthy didn’t lose his job this year, he lost it last year but was given an opportunity to keep it by showing that the dismal performance in 2017 without Rodgers was an aberration. Instead, he proved that his “fix” was ineffective even with Rodgers. In 2017 he showed he was unprepared to play without Rodgers, and showed an inability to adapt on the fly. This year, he showed an inability to adapt even with Rodgers.

In 2010, McCarthy did a masterful job rallying the team to overcome a string of injuries and setbacks to win a Super Bowl. Expectations were justifiably high. He had a young QB, a lot of young players and had shown an ability to come up with good game plans for games they weren’t expected to win. I wrote in 2014 that McCarthy had significantly damaged his reputation with team leaders. He was significantly outcoached at the end of the NFCCG, after three consecutive years of lack-luster playoff performances. He has done nothing since then to reclaim his reputation that was earned in 2010.

McCarthy lost the team. Players were no longer “buying in” to his program. They had doubts. Firing him as soon as the decision was made was the right thing to do for the organization, and will be meaningless to McCarthy’s career or reputation. I commend Murphy for making a decision and acting on it quickly. Delay would cause only deterioration, not improvement.

As someone wrote above, doing it differently (in season firing) doesn’t necessarily mean it is doing it wrong. It has absolutely nothing to do with "classiness." When you make the decision, you act on it. In this case, nothing was to begained by delaying the decision.

[call_me_ishmael]

Arod was a potential #1 overall pick and was on the bench for the one season he didn't have MM. Hot Garbage? Look, you are no different than most of us, you overstate things. Truth is MM was a decent coach. Like most coaches the game passed him by. He had the benefit of 2 HOF QBs at his back and he never actually won much outside of GB (was my critique when he got the job). Personally I think TT was a star and the only reason this team was so good for so long. Gutes nailed his first pick, but not liking much else he did so far. Like all things time will tell, but it was time to move on from Fat Mike.

Aaron was beyond terrible his first pre-season and his first regular season. It took two years of MM before he became the ARod we know.

"Potential #1 pick" - you are who you are. He wasn't Andrew Luck. He was picked #24 because he was not a sure thing, had jacked up mechanics, etc.


Was it as classless as scapegoating TT and everyone around him after 2017? Was it classless to scapegoat Montgomery and trade him immediately blaming him for your own inadequacies and inability to use AJones consistently? BTW, Monty is turning in some nice games for Baltimore.

Do two wrongs make a right? Based on your political posts, it does appear you think it does. That said, I disagree with your assessment on MM here anyway.


But we don't really know what was going on in that locker room when the reporters and cameras weren't around. If the atmosphere was getting toxic what good would it do to keep MM around for the last 4 games seeing we are out of playoff contention?

That is grounds for termination at the end of the year. I am highly sure those same things happened with Reid and Coughlin too. They still got to finish their season and mutually go their separate ways.

[mraynrand]

In 2010, McCarthy did a masterful job rallying the team to overcome a string of injuries and setbacks to win a Super Bowl. Expectations were justifiably high. He had a young QB, a lot of young players and had shown an ability to come up with good game plans for games they weren’t expected to win. I wrote in 2014 that McCarthy had significantly damaged his reputation with team leaders. He was significantly outcoached at the end of the NFCCG, after three consecutive years of lack-luster playoff performances. He has done nothing since then to reclaim his reputation that was earned in 2010.


It's interesting to compare the response by Stubby to that 2014 NFCC game to the response by Pete Carroll to the next game. Pete may actually end up recovering and rebooting from his team's disastrous decision to throw on the goal line in the Super Bowl. Stubby never recovered from the Bostickler. But he had help. Similarly, 'cheat experienced the same failures as Stubby, losing to the same Giants teams in '07 and '11. But that organization found a way to recover. Packers however, just steadily declined. But, I repeat: Stubby had help in the decline. It's not all on him - thus the change to Gute from TT first. This was a 'show us' year for Stubby and a lot of players, and all the moves by the GM/org tell us that they weren't too impressed with what was shown to them.

[pbmax]

Interesting theory. Could be.

I hear Pat Fitzgerald at Northwestern mentioned. He seems like a U-rah-rah college coach who would have to retool for pros. But he does win without benefit of a football factory, so he's smart.

I would not be happy with that hire.

[pbmax]

Like maybe Murph treated MM like he has been treating TT and everyone else? Remember the story about Fat Mike getting some random groundkeeper fired because the guy asked him if they were going to win the superbowl this year?

I forgot about that.

[mraynrand]

Remember the story about Fat Mike getting some random groundkeeper fired because the guy asked him if they were going to win the superbowl this year?

I just fired my housekeeper for asking me this same question today.

[ThunderDan]

Aaron was beyond terrible his first pre-season and his first regular season. It took two years of MM before he became the ARod we know.

"Potential #1 pick" - you are who you are. He wasn't Andrew Luck. He was picked #24 because he was not a sure thing, had jacked up mechanics, etc.

What first year are you talking about? If you are talking 2005 he threw 15 passes in 3 mop up games. In 2006, he threw 15 passes in 2 games and 1 of the games he broke his foot and kept playing because BF had been knocked out of the game.

I am not sure how you can grade those 2 years on 30 passes or his 3rd year either.

His first "real" year he threw for over 4,000 yards.

[Fritz]

But we don't really know what was going on in that locker room when the reporters and cameras weren't around. If the atmosphere was getting toxic what good would it do to keep MM around for the last 4 games seeing we are out of playoff contention?

To me, the Arizona loss may end up being a long-term blessing in disguise. Had Crosby hit that FG, and had the Packers managed to get close enough for Crosby to hit another to win (let's not pretend they would've been able to score a TD), you'd have had to keep MM to see how it played out, especially since the teams ahead of you all lost. You can't ditch a coach when you have the possibility of going on a run, which McCarthy's teams have in the past. In my opinion, a win against Arizona just gives fans some hope, but it's false hope. This team is not good enough, for myriad reasons.

That loss made it feasible to fire McCarthy and get on with the search. And the way the NFL works, the Packers wanted to be in a position to have first pick at the crop of candidates - send out feelers, identify interested parties, come to an "understanding" so that as soon as that coach's team's season's over, he's yours. You're not competing with teams who wait until the end of the season to fire the coach. Sure, that process means you're breaking the NFL's tampering rules, but that happens all the time. It's like the Rooney Rule. People follow the letter but not the spirit.

As for that tweet PB posted about how coaches around the NFL are aghast at how "classless" the Packers' move was, and how that will reduce the number of assistants interested in the GB job, what a load of hooey. There are 32 NFL jobs, and the Green Bay job is one of the better ones. I don't think a single NFL assistant coach (or college coach, if that's what they want) is going to refuse consideration cuz he didn't like the way GB handled the McCarthy firing.

I don't think, like Ishmael does, that this was classless. I don't see anything terribly classy in letting MM twist in the wind with a QB who has disconnected, just so you can fire him one minute after the last game. Green Bay was efffectively eliminated with the Arizona loss; let the man go. He'll get another gig; he may well be more successful in the next few years than the Packers will be. Nonetheless, it was time to move on from McCarthy. He was an excellent coach for many years - my god, that 2016 run was incredible. That team had zero business being in the NFC Championship game, but Rodgers was phenomenal - and MM was part of that. But something happened, and Rodgers has disconnected from his coach. And MM will get an NFL gig again. He'll be fine, maybe even better off than he was in GB the last year or two.

On a side note, I want to disagree with one bit from a Dougherty or Silverstein article that argued the Packers might not be as successful as McCarthy will be with whatever new team hires him. The writer was talking about Green Bay's woes - one of which, he claimed, was that the new coach might want a makeover of the wide receiver position, because he wants a different kind of wide receiver. Yeah, right. No NFL head coach wants three young wide receivers who are tall and fast. "Hey, Gute, get me three or four quick smurfs for that wide receiving corps. Cut those second year guys who are tall and fast - I need the whole position done over."

Looking forward, I think that while firing McCarthy was necessary, and doing it mid-season was smart, I am not sanguine about the future. I am concerned that A-rod is wearing a larger hat size every week, and may not be coachable any more. it reminds me of the worst of the Sherman-Favre relationship, when it was clear Favre just didn't listen to Shermy much at all, and did what he wanted. Sherman knew where his bread was buttered, so what could he do? As a friend of mine said, is Aaron Rodgers turning into Jeff George? None of us know, but he seems to heading that way.

So you have to find a head coach with a big enough ego and personality to get Rodgers to listen and take to the coaching - whatever the new scheme is, as well as convincing him that mechanics do matter and you can't just throw off your back foot all the time. Yet the new coach has to be sure not to try to bulldoze Rodgers, or you'll lose the whole shebang - him and the rest of the team. Nobody wants a bully. Belichek is the only one who has pulled that off. It's not working for Matt Patricia in Detroit, I can tell you that.

The team needs a talent infusion as well. It's not as awful as some here think, but they do need to draft a talented tight end, a couple offensive linemen, a safety, and a couple outside linebackers. And you're not going to get all-pros at all those positions, especially not in one draft.

It's a difficult position for this organization. You have an all-world quarterback who's increasingly injury-prone and seemingly getting more arrogant all the time, some talent though not enough, and an empty head-coaching job in an organization in which the GM does not have the authority to hire or fire the person he's procuring the talent for. I don't know why Murphy doesn't change the structure back, now that MM is gone. I hope he's not keeping it to save face. Like KY, I don't like the structure. Reminds me too much of the old, old days when Harlan was the president but the GM's were parallel to the coaches and the coaches had lots of say over personnel (Bart Starr picking Rich Campbell over Joe Montana despite the pleas of his scouting department).

I fear it's becoming a dysfunctional organization. I hope I am wrong.

[Patler]

If McCarthy really did tell Murphy that he would quit if Ball was hired as GM, the in season firing may have been Murphy showing McCarthy that respect/loyalty is a two-way street.

[call_me_ishmael]

What first year are you talking about? If you are talking 2005 he threw 15 passes in 3 mop up games. In 2006, he threw 15 passes in 2 games and 1 of the games he broke his foot and kept playing because BF had been knocked out of the game.

I am not sure how you can grade those 2 years on 30 passes or his 3rd year either.

His first "real" year he threw for over 4,000 yards.

Exactly, he looked lost in the preseason and regular season until several years of MM tutelage.

[Fritz]

If McCarthy really did tell Murphy that he would quit if Ball was hired as GM, the in season firing may have been Murphy showing McCarthy that respect/loyalty is a two-way street.

I might have been tempted to hire Ball just for that reason, though that alone is not enough of course to justify hiring someone as your new GM.

So I wonder...was Gute actually Murphy's second choice?

[Carolina_Packer]

McCarthy gave a very kind statement to Glazer on Fox. Thanked the Packers for the chance, was proud of the winning tradition they helped sustain together.

Said it was obvious with one year remaining that anything could happen at the end of the year, but was surprised at the mid season termination.

PB, I've heard other people on social media and TV talk about a "mid-season" termination. I would argue that it's not mid-season. We're now into the 4th quarter to quote a popular way to look at splitting up the season.

I personally think it makes no difference when it was done, if they were going to do it anyway. If the team let him coach out the string just to keep up appearances and honor his body of work, that is not a good enough reason. It may seem like a shock now, but in time the way he left won't matter.

I heard one take that said it works for both sides. MM gets a head start finding his next gig, which I think he will, and the Packers can have a look at Philbin, as remotely as it seems he would be retained, what if the team really responds to him? It can't be completely discounted, although, again, it seems unlikely. This is also a bit of a reset on player expectations. I'm every player inherently gets that they are playing for their jobs, but in a situation like this, it's even more true. They can also talk to college coaching candidates and ex-NFL coaches now as part of their search, long before the soon to be "hot commodities" will be available to speak with.

The most interesting thing to me is will Rodgers, with Philbin calling plays now, be able to improve what has been lacking in the offense this season? Can you imagine if he looks like the AR we are used to seeing for the last 4 games? It would make me say, hmm, but I like a good conspiracy. :-)

[Patler]

I might have been tempted to hire Ball just for that reason, though that alone is not enough of course to justify hiring someone as your new GM.

So I wonder...was Gute actually Murphy's second choice?

I doubt that Murphy gave in to McCarthy on the GM choice. If he wanted Ball over Gutekunst, he would have hired Ball.

McCarthy made a power play and it didn't work out for him in the long run. With the way things went this year, Murphy would have fired McCarthy anyway; but I doubt McCarthy's ultimatum, if it in fact was made won any points with Murphy. If McCarthy was not loyal to and respectful of the job Murphy had to do, why should he receive any favors from Murphy? McCarthy overplayed his place on the org chart and overestimated his perceived value to the organization.

[Rutnstrut]

There really isn't much to speculate on here. Stubby has shit the bed the last 4 or more years. The whole org was lulled into accepting the status quo. That shit isn't going to fly anymore. Will a new coach and shake up pay dividends right away? Who knows, but doing the same shit and just hoping something works sure as hell won't.

[Fritz]

I doubt that Murphy gave in to McCarthy on the GM choice. If he wanted Ball over Gutekunst, he would have hired Ball.

McCarthy made a power play and it didn't work out for him in the long run. With the way things went this year, Murphy would have fired McCarthy anyway; but I doubt McCarthy's ultimatum, if it in fact was made won any points with Murphy. If McCarthy was not loyal to and respectful of the job Murphy had to do, why should he receive any favors from Murphy? McCarthy overplayed his place on the org chart and overestimated his perceived value to the organization.


I agree. I was not thrilled with what looked like a power play last offseason, especially with the accompanying remarks about the team needing more talent (via free agency). It appeared, to me at least, that MM was trying to deflect blame.

Again, like KY, I don't like this new power-sharing structure at all. I'm afraid we're heading back to the wildnerness of the 70's and 80's, though of course I do not know that.

[pbmax]

He has had a string of poor strategic organizational decisions with two basic successes since the Super Bowl.

1. He hired the sports science people to help the health of the team. It's a well beaten drum that the Packers are always injured, but they were middle of the pack from the time those guys were hired after a string of terrible seasons in terms of health. I'd give him more credit, but Russ Ball actually oversees this stuff now and I don't know who initiated the change.

2. The no huddle. Introduced it one year, it fizzled and backed off. Came back the next year and it took off. For almost two years it was amazing but it eventually morphed into the extended offense which also petered out. He never regained his offenses' effectiveness after this. though, as Rand notes above, he had help here (Sitton and Lang barely replaced, signing TEs other than Cook).

Poor Decisions

1. Whoever changed the offseason protocol to solve hamstring problems and introduced the year of the shoulder injury. That person should have been fired mid-season.

2. Special Teams. This is a hard nut to crack as there are some very good coaches who always have bad special teams. But this roster was pretty talented in 09 through 2014 and the ST were always on the brink of putrid. Letting Mike Stock convince Ted to give Jon Ryan the boot for Derek Frost was an all time boner. But I tend to think that younger players hurt his cause here.

3. Defense. He pushed Capers to consider more personnel groups to matchup. Which is typical of an HC whose expertise on defense is limited to: "What gives me headaches to prepare for as a play caller?"* This worked in the early stages of all nickel all the time. But it started to backfire in 2011 and never was addressed. The NASCAR defense should have gotten someone fired midseason too.

4. Pushing your luck when you are in a dominant position. Packers were pretty good in 2014 (3rd in DVOA behind Denver and Seattle and ahead of NE) but that was the year of the trick play on special teams. Culminating in allowing a fake field goal TD in the NFCCG because you called a special set for a FG block. It was so obviously vulnerable that the Seahawks prepped a trick play for it. He thought they would need some help versus the Seahawks which we all did, but this idea needed to stay on the shelf in the second half with a lead.

5. Staying conservative when you need first downs. Spent WAY too many years thinking that the old Tony Dorsett rushing stats for the Cowboys (36-4 when Dorsett runs for 100 yards) was a viable approach inside 8 minutes left in a game with a lead. McCarthy was a one dimensional thinker who thought tempo and more cracks with the ball would lead to higher scoring without thinking about the cost to the Defense or the matter of efficiency. He thought that if successful teams ran late, then running MORE Late with a lead would lead to greater success.

6. Blaming personnel when your scheme is failing you. See all of 2017 and 18.

7. Keeping failing assistant coaches.

8. Not adding new ideas to your coaching staff.


* This is also how you get a wildcat offense.

[pbmax]

I just fired my housekeeper for asking me this same question today.

What does the refrigerator tech think about the Packers situation?

(Was it your refrigerator guy that was a source?)

[mraynrand]

Does anyone know if Murphy is overreacting to losing touch of Ted Thompson. Is it possible that he just let Ted pretty much run things only then to discover 'too late' that Ted was losing it? So now he's dedicated to being more involved? Just wondering, because I have no evidence this is the case, but I've seen stuff like this happen in other leadership scenarios. If the new involvement becomes too much, people start looking over their shoulders all the time, expecting to be countermanded. Being more 'in the loop' might hurt the org - (unless of course Gutey likes it and works well with it - that could happen too). Is Lori Nickel still around to get to the bottom of this?

[mraynrand]

What does the refrigerator tech think about the Packers situation?

(Was it your refrigerator guy that was a source?)

The refrigerator delivery guy was DuJuan Harris' high school teammate and personal trainer.

Interestingly, the refrigerator was stocked by Justin Perillo's dietician. I still look back fondly on all that great beer, cheese, and pasta dishes.

[pbmax]

snip

It's a difficult position for this organization. You have an all-world quarterback who's increasingly injury-prone and seemingly getting more arrogant all the time, some talent though not enough, and an empty head-coaching job in an organization in which the GM does not have the authority to hire or fire the person he's procuring the talent for. I don't know why Murphy doesn't change the structure back, now that MM is gone. I hope he's not keeping it to save face. Like KY, I don't like the structure. Reminds me too much of the old, old days when Harlan was the president but the GM's were parallel to the coaches and the coaches had lots of say over personnel (Bart Starr picking Rich Campbell over Joe Montana despite the pleas of his scouting department).

I fear it's becoming a dysfunctional organization. I hope I am wrong.

Great post Fritz.

But to elaborate on the structure, I am not as worried about it now as I was before the firing. Still not my preference, but now Murphy will be responsible for the whole enchilada if he hires a coach AND hired the GM the year before. If it goes bad, out goes Murphy. Given his comments, I am not expecting a change.

Murphy has said that 17 teams, including the Steelers, have a GM and HC reporting to an owner/President. So its not unworkable. I would prefer the GM in charge, but I don't think Murphy is in the same bad spot the Exec Committee was after Lombardi. Just have to hope he isn't Judge Parins I guess.

[pbmax]

The refrigerator delivery guy was DuJuan Harris' high school teammate and personal trainer.

Interestingly, the refrigerator was stocked by Justin Perillo's dietician. I still look back fondly on all that great beer, cheese, and pasta dishes.

He did look like he ate well. :D

[pbmax]

Does anyone know if Murphy is overreacting to losing touch of Ted Thompson. Is it possible that he just let Ted pretty much run things only then to discover 'too late' that Ted was losing it? So now he's dedicated to being more involved? Just wondering, because I have no evidence this is the case, but I've seen stuff like this happen in other leadership scenarios. If the new involvement becomes too much, people start looking over their shoulders all the time, expecting to be countermanded. Being more 'in the loop' might hurt the org - (unless of course Gutey likes it and works well with it - that could happen too). Is Lori Nickel still around to get to the bottom of this?

I'd guess that Ted's reputation and accomplishment held Murphy up for a year, maybe two. But I suspect mainly that Murphy was loathe to move unilaterally (fire the GM after a playoff year) so he wanted Ted's agreement to kick himself sideways to a scouting job.

After that, during interviews, he discovered the communication problems that the HC felt he had.

Depending on his experience with Gutekunst and M3 this year, he could change his mind. But I am expecting this to be the new status quo.

[mraynrand]

He did look like he ate well. :D

Always reminded me of:
https://proxy.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2Fupload.wikimedia.org%2Fwikipedia% 2Fen%2F1%2F14%2FBrewers1970logo.png&f=1

[Dirty Sanchez]

PB, I've heard other people on social media and TV talk about a "mid-season" termination. I would argue that it's not mid-season. We're now into the 4th quarter to quote a popular way to look at splitting up the season.

I personally think it makes no difference when it was done, if they were going to do it anyway. If the team let him coach out the string just to keep up appearances and honor his body of work, that is not a good enough reason. It may seem like a shock now, but in time the way he left won't matter.

I heard one take that said it works for both sides. MM gets a head start finding his next gig, which I think he will, and the Packers can have a look at Philbin, as remotely as it seems he would be retained, what if the team really responds to him? It can't be completely discounted, although, again, it seems unlikely. This is also a bit of a reset on player expectations. I'm every player inherently gets that they are playing for their jobs, but in a situation like this, it's even more true. They can also talk to college coaching candidates and ex-NFL coaches now as part of their search, long before the soon to be "hot commodities" will be available to speak with.

The most interesting thing to me is will Rodgers, with Philbin calling plays now, be able to improve what has been lacking in the offense this season? Can you imagine if he looks like the AR we are used to seeing for the last 4 games? It would make me say, hmm, but I like a good conspiracy. :-)I guess we'll see next week. If we see the same play calling like Rodgers throwing the ball 40 yards downfield on 3rd and 1, then we'll need a new coach that can control him. Otherwise, nothing will change.

[texaspackerbacker]

It makes my blood boil every time I hear idiots and ingrates talk about "controlling Rodgers".

[pbmax]

Murphy and Philbin press conference at 1:45 PM

https://www.packers.com/video/live-video

They have a countdown clock and everything.

[Dirty Sanchez]

It makes my blood boil every time I hear idiots and ingrates talk about "controlling Rodgers".Or maybe you're the idiot. :bs:

[KYPack]

Firstly, Fire Philbin!

And hail Satan everybody.

You guys stop making Tex's blood boil. It really screws up his digestion when you all do that shit.

There really is no "good" way to fire people. Everybody hates it and it's rough to do. But you do it and move ahead, onward and upward & all that shit. When it's a situation like MM was in, it's really the best for both parties. Poor Stubby looked fit to be tied yesterday. He needed somebody to relieve his pain and Murph did the job. Now he can move ahead with his job search.

No, I don't like the org structure as currently configured. I figured that was a temporary thing until they got a new coach. Murph may be in some tall cotton having both guys report to him. It will lead to problems. Murphy has a thing on the GBP site where fans can contact him, bullshit around etc. He mentioned somewhere that he had been getting a lot of static about MM on that site. I wouldn't admit that shit if I was the Murph. Listening to fan boys, espec the rabid Pack fans, can be hazardous to your health.
Well good luck Murph the surf, I hope you've things worked out.

[pbmax]

5. Staying conservative when you need first downs. Spent WAY too many years thinking that the old Tony Dorsett rushing stats for the Cowboys (36-4 when Dorsett runs for 100 yards) was a viable approach inside 8 minutes left in a game with a lead. McCarthy was a one dimensional thinker who thought tempo and more cracks with the ball would lead to higher scoring without thinking about the cost to the Defense or the matter of efficiency. He thought that if successful teams ran late, then running MORE Late with a lead would lead to greater success.



Expanding on #5

Since he never seemed to value efficiency, I don't think he ever thought of analytics as anything other than a chart of good teams box scores. He specifically said something once about knowing what good teams do to be successful, but I never believed he knew WHY it was successful beyond the superficial: keeping the clock ticking is important to shorten the game.

We never found out if Ted kept those analytics guys in the personnel department. But if they are not there or are have limited influence, I worry that the next coach will be similarly self handicapped. Because the media (local and national) heard McCarthy say he was aware of the analytics of his 4th quarter calls but was unable to describe what they told him. He was not questioned in detail about it because they don't understand it. He said the Seattle 4th down call was right by the numbers and no one questioned it. Brian Burke said it was a loss by Win Percentage Added and I haven't seen anyone contradict him.

Later McCarthy basically admitted that he focuses more on his gut and the emotion of the situation (how would my defense feel if I don't show them I trust them by punting?).

[pbmax]

Murphy and Philbin press conference at 1:45 PM

https://www.packers.com/video/live-video

They have a countdown clock and everything.

Murph at 1:45. Philbin the Elder at 2:15

[pbmax]

Gute is with Murphy.

Murphy
Difficult couple of days.

McCarthy very accomplished. Great man, very difficult decision.

Evaluating the season he really felt a change in leadership needed and needed a new voice.

Similar to Reid in Philly

Would have preferred to make change after the season. Key win here or there might have changed things. Perfomance on undaynight indicated the change needed to be made. Mute was involved and agreed that the change needed to be made. Performance last night was unacceptable.

Murphy almost gave it away, saying knowing they were going to make a change made it imperative to act now. Kinda sounded like he knew they were dumping him before this weekend. EDIT: Later with some context, they seem settled on the performance yesterday was bad enough to seal the coach's fate.

Expects Mike to attract offers.

Talked to team about his experience as player getting new coach. Urged them to compete and improve.

Likes Philbin, gives them opportunity to evaluate Philbin (YIKES!)

[pbmax]

Questions

What did you see Sunday:
Gute: certain expectations and standards on field of play have not been met.

Cracks in foundation?
Gute: no, things that needed to be changed weren't getting changed

Who is hiring?
Murphy: I am with Gutekunst and committee will be formed
Will not hire a coach that Gute doesn't want to work with
Gute: trusts the people involved

Refuse to answer who breaks a tie: come to consensus

Did team attempt to repair relationship between player and coach?
Murphy: great run together, but decision not about one player.
Gute: stories about tension are overblown

Extension a good idea last year?
Murphy: no. Rodgers injury meant M3 deserved another shot

[pbmax]

When did discussion begin about evaluating the season?

Murphy: happens each week, all along. We have been behind 8 ball before and come back
But effort on Sunday looked lacking

Is talent good enough?
Gute: team did not meet the expectations we had for out talent?

Rodgers involved?
Murphy: No
Gute: Player doesn't get consulted in search but they always talk about how the team is functioning
Played no role in decision last night.

Who are you considering? Offensive coach?
Murphy; Philbin is candidate, good success :: I missed rest

What is time frame for improvement, how long a leash?
Murphy; Things can turn around quickly. Likes the Gute draft and his picks for next year
Gute: Not about window. wanted to change direction

What about Pettine?
Will not answer

Why not change to GM on top structure yet?
Murphy: We will make decision together, structure less important that relationships
Gute: Job will be attractive regardless of structure

Wilde with direct question: why not use what worked before?
Murphy: don't want to brag, all life been involved in football, hired many many coaches
have a lot to offer as a football person
have great relationship
think it gives Packers best chance to get great coach

Why now?
Murphy: identify candidates, talk to some, head start

Do you have a candidate list?
Gute: yes

How did McCarthy react?
Murphy: professional and first class. knew its part of the profession

Heller with great question: Was decision made but game yesterday dictated timing?
Murphy: no. game was deciding factor.
If they make the FG?
Hypothetical. We did not play well.

[pbmax]

Will Rodgers have ANY contact with coach before hiring?
Murphy: probably not
Gute: putting too much on plate of QB

Rodgers season, do you have theory as to downturn?
Gute: don't agree that he isn't the same player
Team has not performed in all facets
disagree with characterization of Rodgers as down year

Change in player playing time?
Gute: no, do what we need to do to win game

What has last year been like for you Gutekunst? Ted and Mike gone
Gute: this is the way the NFL goes at times. Unpredictable. Want more continuity. We know what we signed up for.

Hiring during season?
Murphy: Think we will definitely wait for end of season.

end

[pbmax]

Philbin is a candidate. I hope that is just to give him some measure of control over the locker room. Because in no way do I want Philbin as HC.

[ThunderDan]

It makes my blood boil every time I hear idiots and ingrates talk about "controlling Rodgers".

Why? Do you like 40 yard bombs down field on 3&2 over and over and over?

No one knows for sure what is going on in Green Bay because we don't know the game plan or the plays called. I think people are frustrated here because on 3rd down we are throwing for touchdowns instead of 1st downs. It was great to see the Packers run a bunch of crossing routes and quick slants yesterday but that has been the exception and not the rule. We actually had an 11 play touchdown drive yesterday so we know it can be done.

I would rather have Arod throwing 8 5-yard completions for first downs in a game than going 1 for 8 on passes over 30 yards down field.

[denverYooper]

Philbin is a candidate. I hope that is just to give him some measure of control over the locker room. Because in no way do I want Philbin as HC.

Yeah, I think that move was just a stopgap.

[Deputy Nutz]

Why? Do you like 40 yard bombs down field on 3&2 over and over and over?

No one knows for sure what is going on in Green Bay because we don't know the game plan or the plays called. I think people are frustrated here because on 3rd down we are throwing for touchdowns instead of 1st downs. It was great to see the Packers run a bunch of crossing routes and quick slants yesterday but that has been the exception and not the rule. We actually had an 11 play touchdown drive yesterday so we know it can be done.

I would rather have Arod throwing 8 5-yard completions for first downs in a game than going 1 for 8 on passes over 30 yards down field.

I think everyone would

[mraynrand]

Yeah just glancing at the PC I’m certain they knew they were dumping Stubby and were just looking for the opportunity. I maintain they were actively working to make it happen with GM moves going back to the draft and FA.

I’m hoping Stubby is actually a Jonah and was actually getting players injured just by his presence in Green Bay.

[KYPack]

The local media drilled Murph pretty hard about the new reporting structure and his hiring the new HC.

He blew it off saying that it was "team thing with him and the Goot, everything is back to normal,"etc.

I dunno, Murph. If you're gonna do all the talkin', you got to be all right.

Maybe it will work, but I think it's a screw-up.

[pbmax]

The local media drilled Murph pretty hard about the new reporting structure and his hiring the new HC.

He blew it off saying that it was "team thing with him and the Goot, everything is back to normal,"etc.

I dunno, Murph. If you're gonna do all the talkin', you got to be all right.

Maybe it will work, but I think it's a screw-up.

I would like to know which successful coaches he has hired previously. Pat Fitzgerald is the only one I know.

[George Cumby]

Yeah just glancing at the PC I’m certain they knew they were dumping Stubby and were just looking for the opportunity. I maintain they were actively working to make it happen with GM moves going back to the draft and FA.

I’m hoping Stubby is actually a Jonah and was actually getting players injured just by his presence in Green Bay.

I think they knew they were gonna' fire him when he got the extension.

[woodbuck27]

Gute is with Murphy.

Murphy
Difficult couple of days.

McCarthy very accomplished. Great man, very difficult decision.

Evaluating the season he really felt a change in leadership needed and needed a new voice.

Similar to Reid in Philly

Would have preferred to make change after the season. Key win here or there might have changed things. Perfomance on undaynight indicated the change needed to be made. Mute was involved and agreed that the change needed to be made. Performance last night was unacceptable.

Murphy almost gave it away, saying knowing they were going to make a change made it imperative to act now. Kinda sounded like he knew they were dumping him before this weekend. EDIT: Later with some context, they seem settled on the performance yesterday was bad enough to seal the coach's fate.

Expects Mike to attract offers.

Talked to team about his experience as player getting new coach. Urged them to compete and improve.

Likes Philbin, gives them opportunity to evaluate Philbin (YIKES!)

Philbin was unimpressive in Miami.

[denverYooper]

I think they knew they were gonna' fire him when he got the extension.

I don't know if they knew then, but the 1 year extension left some thin ice and each loss chipped away the support.

I think they probably made up their minds after the Rams game.

[George Cumby]

I don't know if they knew then, but the 1 year extension left some thin ice and each loss chipped away the support.

I think they probably made up their minds after the Rams game.

You're probably right.

The more accurate verbiage would be: "They strongly suspected they were gonna' fire him when he got the extension....."

[woodbuck27]

All of the blame cannot be laid at MM'S feet.

It's been sick since the playoff defeat in Seattle that shouldn't have happened and showed glaring weakness in MM and handling it. Along with that was MM supported with the talent upgrades necessary? I didn't see it from TT and his decline as the Packer GM was obvious.

[pbmax]

Philbin was unimpressive in Miami.

You got that right woodbuck. Unimpressive is the kindest way to put it.

[pbmax]

The local media drilled Murph pretty hard about the new reporting structure and his hiring the new HC.

He blew it off saying that it was "team thing with him and the Goot, everything is back to normal,"etc.

I dunno, Murph. If you're gonna do all the talkin', you got to be all right.

Maybe it will work, but I think it's a screw-up.

I was pretty impressed for the media group. They asked some tough questions! Way to go guys!

I'll bet even red was impressed.

[pbmax]

I don't know if they knew then, but the 1 year extension left some thin ice and each loss chipped away the support.

I think they probably made up their minds after the Rams game.

Yeah. you don't do a one year extension with the idea that the guy will next get a five year deal.

I think the players knew it too. Ha Ha was just ahead of the curve.

[Bossman641]

The Packers simply don't do enough to create natural rubs and easy releases for their receivers, who have to win one-on-one in coverage. Of Rodgers' 21 touchdown passes this season, just two used a pick to create space, and they were both within two yards of the end zone. Two of the touchdowns included stacked receivers, but one didn't create an open receiver and required Rodgers to improvise and create a throwing lane for a score.

I dunno what happened to MM but he lost his offensive touch. I thought he was ahead of the curve back in 2011 when we ran spread offense and ran teams off the field with the Big 5. Would be interesting to go back and watch some of those games. Were we really just thinking due to superior talent?

[gbgary]

Philbin is a candidate. I hope that is just to give him some measure of control over the locker room. Because in no way do I want Philbin as HC.

exactly.

[Bretsky]

I was pretty impressed for the media group. They asked some tough questions! Way to go guys!

I'll bet even red was impressed.




KUDOS TO THE MEDIA

WHAT WAS BAFFLING....was how Murphy didn't really seem to understand their general concerns and points. Like it was over his head.

Is Mark Murphy playing a Jerry Jones type role in GB

I hate the setup too

[call_me_ishmael]

I have zero faith in Mark Murphy. I just don't buy him as a premier football mind. Maybe that's completely unfair, IDK, there is just something about him that rubs me the wrong way.

I know they're never gone say they'll let ARod have a say in the matter, but does anyone really believe that? I would be shocked if ARod doesn't sit down with the coach before a hiring is made. Let's not forget ARod makes way more money than either Murph or Gooter (presumably, anyway)

[Pugger]

I doubt that Murphy gave in to McCarthy on the GM choice. If he wanted Ball over Gutekunst, he would have hired Ball.

McCarthy made a power play and it didn't work out for him in the long run. With the way things went this year, Murphy would have fired McCarthy anyway; but I doubt McCarthy's ultimatum, if it in fact was made won any points with Murphy. If McCarthy was not loyal to and respectful of the job Murphy had to do, why should he receive any favors from Murphy? McCarthy overplayed his place on the org chart and overestimated his perceived value to the organization.

Murphy hinted in his presser on Monday that there was talk about firing McCarthy in 2016 after they started out with only 4 wins. But then the team went on a tear.

[Pugger]

Great post Fritz.

But to elaborate on the structure, I am not as worried about it now as I was before the firing. Still not my preference, but now Murphy will be responsible for the whole enchilada if he hires a coach AND hired the GM the year before. If it goes bad, out goes Murphy. Given his comments, I am not expecting a change.

Murphy has said that 17 teams, including the Steelers, have a GM and HC reporting to an owner/President. So its not unworkable. I would prefer the GM in charge, but I don't think Murphy is in the same bad spot the Exec Committee was after Lombardi. Just have to hope he isn't Judge Parins I guess.


One thing in Murphy's favor is he is a football guy. He was a player for 8 years, He was the 'Skins' player rep to the NFLPA. He was the DA of Colgate and Northwestern Universities so he's had some experience in hiring coaches.

[Anti-Polar Bear]

I think everyone would

Well then, token interview Norm Chow immediately to exploit the Rooney Rule, then type up J-Mac’s contract. Dink and dunk all day!

As Tex or Mad would say, the paddy (McCarthy) is dead, long live the paddy! (McDaniels) :)

[Joemailman]

KUDOS TO THE MEDIA

WHAT WAS BAFFLING....was how Murphy didn't really seem to understand their general concerns and points. Like it was over his head.

Is Mark Murphy playing a Jerry Jones type role in GB

I hate the setup too

I kind of agree with Murphy. Everybody's too worried about the organizational structure. Different structures can work if you have the right people. People can say that having the GM hire the coach has worked for the Packers in the past, but if Ted Thompson had hired Scott Linehan or Herm Edwards instead of Mike McCarthy, there would have been no 8 straight playoff berths. And certainly no Lombardi Trophy.

[bobblehead]

Aaron was beyond terrible his first pre-season and his first regular season. It took two years of MM before he became the ARod we know.

"Potential #1 pick" - you are who you are. He wasn't Andrew Luck. He was picked #24 because he was not a sure thing, had jacked up mechanics, etc.



At the time there was speculation whether SF would take ARod or Alex Smith #1...so yes, he was a potential #1 pick. It was unknown which way they would go up until the draft. Luck was also not a lock #1, there was plenty of personnel people who thought RG3 was the better pick.

[bobblehead]

Do two wrongs make a right? Based on your political posts, it does appear you think it does. That said, I disagree with your assessment on MM here anyway.



I have never advocated 2 wrongs make a right. I am saying that you get treated like you treat others. And nothing in my FYI posts EVER says 2 wrongs make a right. I am a huge critic of Trump for being a general douchebag, same as I was when anyone on the left acts that way. I also don't say "but the left does it" I simply point out that when the left does it you think its cool, or lack outrage, but when the right does it you think its the end of the fricking world. Very different from me thinking its ok.

[pbmax]

Where does McCarthy end up? https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2809019-unloved-by-fans-mike-mccarthy-is-what-a-lot-of-nfl-teams-want-and-need

Best paragraph of the month:


The Jets

Replace "Baker Mayfield" with "Sam Darnold" and McCarthy to the Jets makes as much sense as McCarthy to the Browns. Even McCarthy's most predictable game plans would be a major step up from the current Jets offense, whose signature play is a punt from midfield while trailing late in the game.

[bobblehead]

Or maybe you're the idiot. :bs:

For a guy with only 8 lifetime posts, this is pretty good.

[bobblehead]

I have zero faith in Mark Murphy. I just don't buy him as a premier football mind. Maybe that's completely unfair, IDK, there is just something about him that rubs me the wrong way.

I know they're never gone say they'll let ARod have a say in the matter, but does anyone really believe that? I would be shocked if ARod doesn't sit down with the coach before a hiring is made. Let's not forget ARod makes way more money than either Murph or Gooter (presumably, anyway)

Arod makes more money than a civil engineer also...should he build the next bridge?

[call_me_ishmael]

Great interview with Jay Glazer. Seems like everybody liked ol' Mac.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kDxMbw1WUHE&feature=youtu.be

[Fritz]

We Packer fans are indeed spoiled. If a Detroit head coach can get to the playoffs and win one playoff game, he'd be the most successful Lions coach in over twenty years.

For you oldsters, Wayne Fontes is the most successful coach this franchise has had since one seaon from Joe Schmidt in 1970.

[mraynrand]

For you oldsters, Wayne Fontes is the most successful coach this franchise has had since one seaon from Joe Schmidt in 1970.

Yabba Dabba Doo!

[pbmax]

We Packer fans are indeed spoiled. If a Detroit head coach can get to the playoffs and win one playoff game, he'd be the most successful Lions coach in over twenty years.

For you oldsters, Wayne Fontes is the most successful coach this franchise has had since one seaon from Joe Schmidt in 1970.

I still fondly remember Mitchell and Perriman carrying me to fantasy glory over a holiday weekend with monster games. Good times.

[bobblehead]

MM was toast the minute they extended Rodgers. this should have been a prove it year for both of them but the scales were tipped with Rodgers signature. now Rodgers gets a pass for a bad year that they're both responsible for. this better be some upcoming off-season, and next couple of years, for it to be worth it. i'll go on record and say a 10-6 season in the next 3 will be pretty much a miracle because Rodgers is in decline and that contract is going to weigh heavy starting in 2020.

As a % of cap is his current contract really different from his last one??

[gbgary]

As a % of cap is his current contract really different from his last one??

don't know exactly but i'm sure it went up. it never goes down. and heck, his last contract weighed heavy.

[Fritz]

Yabba Dabba Doo!



Is it Fred Flintstone, or is it Wayne Fontes?

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[Cheesehead Craig]

Is it Fred Flintstone, or is it Wayne Fontes?

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Judging by the matrix code here, I'm going with Drew Barrymore.

[Joemailman]

As a % of cap is his current contract really different from his last one??

His 2018 cap hit is 11.54% of cap. It will go up to 17.3% in 2020 if the salary cap stays the same, which is unlikely. It will likely be around 16%.

[pbmax]

Judging by the matrix code here, I'm going with Drew Barrymore.

You misread the header. Needs to be base64.

So Drew Barrymore is "RHJldyBCYXJyeW1vcmU="

[denverYooper]

Touchdown to checkdown:

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Dtq06haXgAAOJ-C.jpg:small

[mraynrand]

Just wondering - was anyone at the Golden Corral in Green Bay Sunday night? That would have been a sight to behold.

[mraynrand]

Is it Fred Flintstone, or is it Wayne Fontes?

10100101001010100101010100101010100101010010101010 1010

[pbmax]

McCarthy came back to speak to the Players at some point.

Jason Wilde @jasonjwilde
#Packers president Mark Murphy tells @620wtmj he knew he was going to make a coaching change after the season and expected the final month to be "dreadful" with speculation. Also says Mike McCarthy came in to speak to the team yesterday. FULL interview: https://t.co/O7d6GmfMX8

More
Steve "the Homer" True
Nice for Murphy to decide what's best for McCarthy...Guarantee ..GUARANTEE...McCarthy wanted to coach the rest of the season.

[RashanGary]

McCarthy is my fav all time coach. I’m not a fan of Rodgers stubbornness.

[bobblehead]

His 2018 cap hit is 11.54% of cap. It will go up to 17.3% in 2020 if the salary cap stays the same, which is unlikely. It will likely be around 16%.

I guess I would need to see each year over year from 1-end of each contract as a % of the cap. I think the last deal was similar to this deal, but the cap has gone up immensely.

[Joemailman]

I guess I would need to see each year over year from 1-end of each contract as a % of the cap. I think the last deal was similar to this deal, but the cap has gone up immensely.

His last deal was 5 years for 122M. His latest deal is 4 years for 134M. https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/green-bay-packers/aaron-rodgers-3745/

It's about a 50% increase per year. The cap has been going up, but not enough to keep up with that kind of increase.

[Anti-Polar Bear]

McCarthy came back to speak to the Players at some point.

Jason Wilde @jasonjwilde
#Packers president Mark Murphy tells @620wtmj he knew he was going to make a coaching change after the season and expected the final month to be "dreadful" with speculation. Also says Mike McCarthy came in to speak to the team yesterday. FULL interview: https://t.co/O7d6GmfMX8

More
Steve "the Homer" True
Nice for Murphy to decide what's best for McCarthy...Guarantee ..GUARANTEE...McCarthy wanted to coach the rest of the season.

Talk about hypocrisy.

They never gave Sherman the same opportunity to address his team. Todd had his assistant clear out Sherman’s office during the finale against the Seafags. Sherman was immediately escorted off Lambeau Field after the Packers victory.

[Anti-Polar Bear]

And Philbin thinks Pack is a first class organization? He was a Sherman assistant in 05! They treated Sherman like shit!

[Joemailman]

Talk about hypocrisy.

They never gave Sherman the same opportunity to address his team. Todd had his assistant clear out Sherman’s office during the finale against the Seafags. Sherman was immediately escorted off Lambeau Field after the Packers victory.

Liar. Sherman did address the team and received a standing ovation from the players.

https://madison.com/news/fired---and-fired-up---sherman-out/article_c9a7fe78-94af-5cc3-9928-69389b084c32.html


Sherman's players learned of his firing at the usual end-of-the-season team meeting. The players arrived for the 10 a.m. meeting expecting to see Sherman; instead, Thompson walked into the auditorium and informed them of his decision.

Sherman addressed the players shortly thereafter. Defensive end Kabeer Gbaja-Biamila said Sherman received a standing ovation from the players when he entered the room.

"All I can tell you is it was a very emotional time for the whole team to see a great man like that go," Gbaja-Biamila said. "We don't know what the future holds. All we know is that coach Sherman is no longer the head coach of the Green Bay Packers."

[run pMc]

And Philbin thinks Pack is a first class organization? He was a Sherman assistant in 05! They treated Sherman like shit!

Don't forget, he worked for the Dolphins. "First class" is probably relative.

[Anti-Polar Bear]

Liar. Sherman did address the team and received a standing ovation from the players.

https://madison.com/news/fired---and-fired-up---sherman-out/article_c9a7fe78-94af-5cc3-9928-69389b084c32.html

Thanks for looking up the info. I half-joked. :)

[Fritz]

Judging by the matrix code here, I'm going with Drew Barrymore.


Oops. My apologies. I thought I'd canceled that post. Clearly, I have lost my ability to find and post images of Fred Flintstone snorting coke in my replies on this site.

[Anti-Polar Bear]

Don't forget, he worked for the Dolphins. "First class" is probably relative.

I guess.

It’s worth noting that Philbin fired Sherman as OC, not long before he himself got canned. Sherman was scapegoated for Bullygate, methinks.

[ND72]

I am one of the few that stated alllllllll the way back to McCarthy's 1st year I didn't think he was a capable coach. For many years I felt this team was blessed with talent that never produced. That being said I felt the past 3 season's the team has lacked talent and McCarthy has been ok coaching. The problem, IMO, is McCarthy was routinely out coached. His offense lacked rhyme or reason or creativity. The QB guru developed ONE guy, who to this day holds a grudge he was passed up. Anyone who's been on here long enough knows that I've supported this team, but have never been a McCarthy fan. His house, er should I say, the barn he owns behind his house, is freaking amazing however. And he is surprisingly bigger (taller/broader - not actually fatter) that I expected as I literally ran into him one day in Toys 'R Us a year ago.

[mraynrand]

as I literally ran into him one day in Toys 'R Us a year ago.

So Stubby killed 'Toys R Us' too I see.

[Vincenzo]

I am one of the few that stated alllllllll the way back to McCarthy's 1st year I didn't think he was a capable coach. For many years I felt this team was blessed with talent that never produced. That being said I felt the past 3 season's the team has lacked talent and McCarthy has been ok coaching. The problem, IMO, is McCarthy was routinely out coached. His offense lacked rhyme or reason or creativity. The QB guru developed ONE guy, who to this day holds a grudge he was passed up. Anyone who's been on here long enough knows that I've supported this team, but have never been a McCarthy fan. His house, er should I say, the barn he owns behind his house, is freaking amazing however. And he is surprisingly bigger (taller/broader - not actually fatter) that I expected as I literally ran into him one day in Toys 'R Us a year ago.
Now that's cool. Funny how I will for certain miss him after reading his exit later this week. To take out an add plus address the Packers and the people from Wisconsin the way he did shows how much of a classy person he is. It's so nice to get a local's perspective of MM after running into him.
Yes he gained weight and was as thick as a brick at times, but it's nice to see him leave with dignity.

[Pugger]

I am one of the few that stated alllllllll the way back to McCarthy's 1st year I didn't think he was a capable coach. For many years I felt this team was blessed with talent that never produced. That being said I felt the past 3 season's the team has lacked talent and McCarthy has been ok coaching. The problem, IMO, is McCarthy was routinely out coached. His offense lacked rhyme or reason or creativity. The QB guru developed ONE guy, who to this day holds a grudge he was passed up. Anyone who's been on here long enough knows that I've supported this team, but have never been a McCarthy fan. His house, er should I say, the barn he owns behind his house, is freaking amazing however. And he is surprisingly bigger (taller/broader - not actually fatter) that I expected as I literally ran into him one day in Toys 'R Us a year ago.

McCarthy could win with a loaded team but when the talent on the team dipped so did the performance on the field. A competent coach can win with great players but the better coaches can win with average guys and coach them up.

[Fritz]

Sometimes other teams would come into a game with their second-string QB that nobody'd ever heard of, and that QB would lead his team to victory. The few times McCarthy did not have Rodgers, that did not seem to happen. Hundley barely beat a couple of lousy teams last year, though the Pittsburgh game was probably the highlight of his career.

[TravisWilliams23]

The scratch your head use of time outs, especially near the end of the 1st half drove me nuts. He just didn't have a "feel" for when to stop the clock and when to let it run. That stubborn streak of his to hang onto a coach or player that we all knew should be let go, If his decisions would have resulted it championships then I'd be singing a different tune but that wasn't the case with MM. I just can't understand how he didn't see the offense needed a change in philosophy years ago. I guess it's just Stubby being Stubby.

[pbmax]

Since the NFL seems incapable of leaning to use the clock correctly, I look forward to new ways to engage is poor game management.

Seriously, when Tony Romo and Al Michaels know clock management better than the coaches they broadcast, it should be a hint you aren't up to snuff.

[Fritz]

Trying to go no huddle, then everybody muddling around, then Rodgers lining everyone up, then trying to change something...then having to call a timeout because you didn't have your shit together.

I hated that. If you can't figure it out, then just huddle up, for crissakes. Didn't they notice how many fewer times this year Rodgers caught the opposing defense in a bad grouping, or how many fewer times he caught them with 12 on the field?

[denverYooper]

Trying to go no huddle, then everybody muddling around, then Rodgers lining everyone up, then trying to change something...then having to call a timeout because you didn't have your shit together.

I hated that. If you can't figure it out, then just huddle up, for crissakes. Didn't they notice how many fewer times this year Rodgers caught the opposing defense in a bad grouping, or how many fewer times he caught them with 12 on the field?

I haven't been keeping track, but he might have caused his own team to jump more than the opponent this year with the famous hard count.

[pbmax]

I haven't been keeping track, but he might have caused his own team to jump more than the opponent this year with the famous hard count.

SPRIGGS™!

[Joemailman]

Perhaps having 2 rookies at WR much of the year impacted ability to get up to line quickly and snap the ball? Everybody has to be lined up properly and set or you end up with a penalty on the offense.

[pbmax]

Perhaps having 2 rookies at WR much of the year impacted ability to get up to line quickly and snap the ball? Everybody has to be lined up properly and set or you end up with a penalty on the offense.

Pretty sure that the opposition works on this as much as the 3rd down package. Both snap count and substitutions.

Youth doesn't help, but I think they line up and then run the wrong route just in time.

[Pugger]

https://www.si.com/nfl/2018/12/11/mike-mccarthy-green-bay-packers-hired-fired-andrew-brandt

[beveaux1]

https://www.si.com/nfl/2018/12/11/mike-mccarthy-green-bay-packers-hired-fired-andrew-brandt

Really good article. Thanks.

[red]

so, fat fuck is down to just one team that wants him

he was suppose to be a shoe in for another job because he's "such a great coach". the browns were suppose to be his next spot, because everyone running the team is former packers. but turns out they don't want him

so its just down to the jets. they are the only team left willing to take him, and they supposedly really like him, BUT, they've also interviewed 20 other guys so far. so who knows

[red]

and that one team that still wanted him just convinced a guy to quit his college gig so he could interview for the job

might be down to kingsbury and mccarthy for the jets job

do they have buffets in new york/new jersey? or do you have to pay a lot for everything you eat out there?

[Rutnstrut]

Stubby "announced" today that he will be taking 2019 off. More like nobody wanted his worthless ass.

[call_me_ishmael]

Meh, if I were him I'd take two years off and wait for kids to graduate HS. Every body wants a young, inexperienced McVay. It's going to blow up in at least some of their faces. You can have all the talent and football smarts in the world, but leadership is a totally different skillset that comes with age and experience.

[Cheesehead Craig]

Stubby "announced" today that he will be taking 2019 off. More like nobody wanted his worthless ass.

I too, was not offered a HC gig, so I will take a year off of coaching as well.

[call_me_ishmael]

I mean he was rumored to be offered the Cleveland job if he would keep Freddie Kitchens on staff but he refused. He was offered Arizona allegedly but turned that down too. Unless Pittsburgh opens up next year, I doubt he coaches in 2020 either. He'll be back at some point, though, he's a top 20 all-time coach.

[texaspackerbacker]

I wonder how much we'll see of him on the various TV networks next year as a pregame or in game commentator.

[Pugger]

I wonder how much we'll see of him on the various TV networks next year as a pregame or in game commentator.

I just don't see him as a football analyst on TV... lol

[mraynrand]

I just don't see him as a football analyst on TV... lol

I could see him as the spokesperson when Golden Corral goes national, but I'd rather see him on Nutrisystem commercials with Dan Marino.

[Bossman641]

Lol...I get being upset with MM about the last few years but some of you need to let it go.

[texaspackerbacker]

I bet he's on one of the pregame shows - like Ditka used to or Jimmy Johnson.

[bobblehead]

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/jets-pursuit-of-former-packers-coach-mike-mccarthy-collapsed-over-staffing-issues/

Some of this sounds like what convinced Murph to fire him. I can just see him thinking he is the inside choice and start making stupid demands "well...I am not going to answer to the GM...who better fucking not be russ ball!"

[George Cumby]

Lol...I get being upset with MM about the last few years but some of you need to let it go.

IKR.

Fucking A'. Develop some perspective.

[esoxx]

IKR.

Fucking A'. Develop some perspective.

The same could be said regarding the many Favre haters.

[Rutnstrut]

The same could be said regarding the many Favre haters.




Spot on.

[George Cumby]

The same could be said regarding the many Favre haters.

Who?

[esoxx]

Who?

Yeah, none of those types around. Lol

[pbmax]

I don't have time for Favre hate.

I am rooting for Rodgers not to head down the same path.

[Bossman641]

Favre? Lol where is that coming from.