Packer Rats Winners and Losers of GB VS CHI

[Deputy Nutz]

Painful

This was not the way Ted Thompson and his lacky Mike McCarthy wanted to start the season, but with poor or at least questionable off season moves, or failure to make moves that would seem sensible for team that was 36 million under the cap at one point, this loss should have been expected. Ted Thompson has looked out classed and over his head as the Packers General Manager in the last two seasons. His 2005 draft has already been considered a failure. His lack of concern over the offensive line is mind boggling, especially when you have a QB like Brett Favre that needs protection. His hire of Mike McCarthy now has to come into question. After the first game of the 2006 season, and 4 preseason games, it seems that McCarthy might not be ready to be a head coach in the NFL. He was outclassed by Lovie Smith, and his game plan was basic and uninspiring. His hire of Bob Sanders can also be considered a reach. The special teams is down right unwatchable and fails to ignite this team in anyway. The bottom line is that Thompson has taken this franchise in the wrong direction over the last year and a half.

Winners

1. Ahman Green, In his first game back from a thigh injury suffered in 2005, Green was able to rush for 110 yards on 20 carries. He didn't score a touchdown, but then again no one on the Packers were able to score a single point. The most important thing, was that Green was able to run with his old athority, and give the hit instead of taking one. He had the explosive running style that we last saw in 2004. Green was also able to catch 3 balls for 22 yards. It is going to be a long season for Ahman running behind this offensive line, but if he was able to gain 110 yards against the Bears. this could be a big year for Ahman Green. He was the only bright spot on this offense.

2. Donald Driver, he like Green didn't score, but he did manage to be the only impact player on offense. Driver was able to catch 7 balls for 96 yards. Unfortunately for Driver, if Jennings, or Ferguson don't step up in the next couple of games, Drive will have to get used to again beating double teams on a consistent basis.

3. AJ Hawk, Hawk demonstrated today why he was the 5th overall pick, and why he is the most capable defender the Packers have at this point. He simply knows the game of football, and knows how to get to the ball. The Bears ran mostly to the strongside of the field, meaning that Hawk had to go across the field keeping the correct angle to take away the cut back. When the Bears did run to the weakside Hawk was there to either meet the ball carrier, or take on the lead blocker with athority and turn the ball back to the inside. Hawk also didn't get beat once in coverage, and was able to pick the right hole on a blitz where he forced Grossman to throw early. According to JSO, Hawk only had 5 total tackles, and next to Poppinga's 8 it proves that the Bears decided to run at Poppinga instead of going to the weakside of the field against Hawk.

4. Aaron Kampman, Aaron played really well along the defensive line. He was able to stand pat agains the run, and recorded 7 total tackles with one sack. Infact he was the only defensive line man that had any pressure on Rex Grossman. I will give Thompson credit, so far Kampman looks to be earining his big pay day.

5. Ryan Pickett, he had 5 total tackles along with 4 solo tackles. He failed to get any significant pressure on Grossman, but he is paid to take on the run. Pickett along with the other defensive tackles were able to absorb most of the Bears running attempts up the middle. Pickett was also a good move on the behalf of Ted Thompson.

Losers

1. The offensive Line, the sad part is that the interior of the offensive line didn't play that poorly, they didn't play great by any stretch of the imagination, but I thought they played much better than the combination of Chad Clifton and and Mark Tauscher. The Bears defensive ends took Tausch and Clifton to school all day. Tauscher who has a reputation for playing cleanly and penalty free, was called for two holding penalties, both deserved. Clifton played with an illness, and it showed. Clifton who has fought threw knee problems this off-season is not fitting the zone blocking scheme at all. He has never been known as a run blocker, but the zone scheme demonstrates his slow feet in the run game. Spitz was to blame for tripping Favre, and there were times were defensive linemen were running free on missed blocks or missed assignments. This offensive line only has one way to go and that is up, but it has a long way to go to being considered an average offensive line in the NFL.

2. Greg Jennings, to be the number 2 reciever you have to do more than drop 2 balls and only catch one ball and that was done in mop up time. Jennings has a room to grow and that is to be expected, but with Favre under pressure all day and with limited options of open receivers it would have been a big addition for Jennings to be able to contribute on this offense today.

3. Brett Favre, Brett played within the system for 3 quarters, although they were 3 unproductive quarters, Favre made plays when there were plays to be made. Once again, Favre decided to play by his own rules and made two throws that were inexcusable. those throws were not going to win the ball game, they were useless attempts by Favre. Favre can't roll to his right and then look back and try to throw across his body 30 yards to a covered receiver, it just doesn't work that way anymore, infact it usually never did. His first interception was totally on him. With an unusual amount of time in the pocket Favre overthrew Greg Jennings and the ball ended up into the open arms of the defender. It was the capper to several throws by Favre that were all high.

4. Marquand Manuel, lets face it, he is slow in coverage. His inablity to run with a receiver down the middle of the field set the tone for this game. He was beaten by at least 5 yards. Other than that play, Manuel was able to play decently in the box, and make tackle in against the running game, and hopefully that is where they decide to use him.

5. Charles Woodson, it seems that Charles just doesn't want to man up against the big boys. Woodson still has the ability but for some reason along the way he has lost the motivation to play physical football. He doesn't get a jam on receivers and is content to run step for step with them and hope the QB doesn't test him. When the ball is in the air he simply gives up on it and doesn't fight the receiver for the ball. Muhammad abused both him and Harris for most of the day.

6. KGB, he barely held up against the run today, but the fact that he had 1 pressure on Grossman all day should tell you that he needs to be given not only plays off, but whole series off. He was invisible in the second half of the ball game today.

7. Brady Poppinga, he was outclassed all day today, and Ben Taylor may have some hope in starting against the Saints. Poppinga was average against the run, but the tight end busted him up all day. Desmond Clark had 77 yards receiving and seemed to be open all day. On Devin Hester's Punt returner for a touchdown, Poppinga simply ran by Hester not even getting a hand on him. He was playing out of control. Poppinga better hurry up and get on the same page as the rest of the defense or his starting job will be in jeopardy.

8. Special Teams, this was the worst special teams performance that I have seen in 15 years, and thats just because I don't remember much past 15 years ago. Noah Herron has no business returning kicks, let alone being on this team. Samkon Gado looked scared running back kicks and totally indecisive with the ball in his hands. Both Gado and Herron are going to have trouble adding anythign positive to this team offensively, or on special teams. Devin Hester should have been stopped after a 5 yard gain on his TD return, but Poppinga ran right past him, and nobody else was in position to make a play. Herron's fumble was costly and the challege after was absurd.

Well as always be free to add your own and comment on my selections. The Packers have some positives to build on like their run defense, but they need to put together a complete game on defense, and find some consistency on offensive. Ted Thompson has a lot to be responsible for and very little of it is positive at this point in his tenure.

[son of a vic]

How many f'n points do you have to be behind by, with 8 minutes left in the game, before you go no huddle, Mike?

Shut-out at home. Alright all you stat whores, when's the last time that happened?

[retailguy]

How many f'n points do you have to be behind by, with 8 minutes left in the game, before you go no huddle, Mike?

Shut-out at home. Alright all you stat whores, when's the last time that happened?

233 games.

[GrnBay007]

SAD!! :sad:

[Brohm]

Was thinking it had been awhile. Damn way back to Lindy :shock:

Home opener against the Bears to break the streak :mad:

[VegasPackFan]

Losers:

THE FANS

Because to not score any points in a game at home against your arch- enemies is disgusting. Packer fans deserve better than this crap.

I am pissed about this. M3 better find a way to turn this crap around, because I do not want to watch our team turn into the 49'ers of last year.

Funny how the 49'ers scored quite a few points this week after being so pathetic on O last year.

I WONDER WHAT CHANGED!?

[son of a vic]

Well mates, I don't know if it's time to jump off the ship, but you might want to keep the life vest within arm's reach.

[GBRulz]

it's the kicker's fault :twisted:

[son of a vic]

What's the over under for a "Bates would have been better" thread, before midnight?

[son of a vic]

"GBRulz"-------it's the kicker's fault.

By the way, nice prediction on the game. Lay off the sauce for a while, would ya!

[GBRulz]

"GBRulz"-------it's the kicker's fault.

By the way, nice prediction on the game. Lay off the sauce for a while, would ya!

Yeah, maybe next time I won't even bother, because it's just a waste of time to predict! :wink:

[Bossman641]

Pretty much everyone played terribly except for Green, Kampman, and Driver. I wasn't watching him that closely, but it also looked like Barnett had a pretty good day.

We have to have the least explosive kick returners in the world. Fergy is indecisive back there. Gado takes about 3 seconds to get up to top speed. Herron takes about 5 seconds to get up to top speed, top speed being ridiculously slow.

[BallHawk]

C'mon, if the referee called the blatantly obvious Pass Interference on Ferg we would of scored.

[VegasPackFan]

They should just cut Herron.

[son of a vic]

For the record, I predicted 5-7 wins. In hindsight, a thimble full of kool-aid must have clouded my thought process. Clean and sober, 3-4 wins seems about right.

[red]

Pretty much everyone played terribly except for Green, Kampman, and Driver. I wasn't watching him that closely, but it also looked like Barnett had a pretty good day.

We have to have the least explosive kick returners in the world. Fergy is indecisive back there. Gado takes about 3 seconds to get up to top speed. Herron takes about 5 seconds to get up to top speed, top speed being ridiculously slow.

i would add pickett and the other dt's to the winners list, along with what you have. they plugged the middle well, and got some pressure. jenkins even had a knockdown.

our ST are horrible. i think we have the only returners that slow down when they start to gt close to traffic. the good ones seem to speed up and keep accelerating the whole time

[GBRulz]

C'mon, if the referee called the blatantly obvious Pass Interference on Ferg we would of scored.

Granted, a few calls didn't go our way, but that wouldn't have made a remote difference in the outcome.

A couple areas in which I didn't think we'd have to worry about, well...we do. Our secondary (minus Collins) was horrible.

Secondly, if you put our O-line together in a lineup with blank jerseys on, I don't think we would have been able to tell who the 2 rookies were. Clif and Taush....not so good today.

[son of a vic]

"BallHawk"-------C'mon, if the referee called the blatantly obvious Pass Interference on Ferg we would of scored.

Incidental contact is not a penalty. Watch the replay, the defender was playing the ball, and his feet got tangled up with princess Fergie. It really is sad, that we have to bitch about a penalty, that is the only way we could have scored today. Embarrassing.

[GBRulz]

For the record, I predicted 5-7 wins. In hindsight, a thimble full of kool-aid must have clouded my thought process. Clean and sober, 3-4 wins seems about right.

holy schitt, SOV.... 5-7 wins.... you? I'm impressed!!

If we can't beat the Saints next week.... I'll assume you had more than a thimble full !

[GBRulz]

Surely Nutz is still working on the "losers" concept of his article.... after all, the "winners" list is about as long as Gado's runs today...

[Joemailman]

Winners:

Cullen Jenkins
Aaron Kampman
Nick Barnett
Donald Driver
Ahman Green


Losers:

Entire defensive backfield
Brady Poppinga (Not down on him, but a tough day).
Chad Clifton
Mark Tauscher
Noah Herron

[KYPack]

That must be what it feels like after electroshock therapy.

We need to all get together and patch up each others wounds.

This is much worse than I thought. We just don't have any troops.

Deputy, take yer time. Grading this mess is a painful task.

I'll skip the Kool-Aid. Gimme a shot of Jack and a shot of Schnaaps.

To go.

[BEARMAN]

Is it ok if I post " I TOLD YA SO !" ? Man O Man did yous guys look bad, Man O Man did we look good ! Must be :oops: to have lost to the lowly BEARS 26 to 0 ? But hey, there is always next game.. in CHICAGO ! LOL


GO BEARS !

[BallHawk]

Looking at the Colts passing defense makes me cringe. It is so fluid. Their receivers run 7-8 yard routes and make the catches. A solid run follows, and then another short pass. That's what we need to do. Of course, our O-Line is pathetic, but we can try.

[MJZiggy]

There's a series of "little ifs" forming in my mind. If Herron doesn't drop that punt, take 3 off for Chi., if the 3rd and 4th and inches are spotted correctly, the Pack keep possession (I think M3 should have challenged the spot.), if the hold on Caroll is called, take 7 off for Chicago, We still sucked, but the D did fairly well at holding them off in the red zone. Just a thought--the score really could have been closer...

[BallHawk]

Is it ok if I post " I TOLD YA SO !" ? Man O Man did yous guys look bad, Man O Man did we look good ! Must be :oops: to have lost to the lowly BEARS 26 to 0 ? But hey, there is always next game.. in CHICAGO ! LOL


GO BEARS !

Ya, how 'bout that Red Zone offense?

In all honesty, you're defense played a great game.

[retailguy]

"BallHawk"-------C'mon, if the referee called the blatantly obvious Pass Interference on Ferg we would of scored.

Incidental contact is not a penalty. Watch the replay, the defender was playing the ball, and his feet got tangled up with princess Fergie. It really is sad, that we have to bitch about a penalty, that is the only way we could have scored today. Embarrassing.


Hey, Mr. Black Koolaid, fergie got pushed in the back. It wouldn't have affected the outcome, but it WAS a penalty. Princess Fergie? That's a GOOD one. better than the Fraud.... way better...

[FavreChild]

I thought we were supposed to wait for Nutz to post the official winners and losers....

But, yes...I agree that we must respect Driver, Green and Kamp for their performances. Possibly you could give a nod to Barnett and/or Pop. And you can hardly blame Brett. Don't have to put him in winners, I guess, but he did his damn job.

Losers. TT, M3, Noah, Woodson are the top four names that spring to mind. Dave Rayner - well, no one was actually delusional enough to believe he was going to make a 53-yarder.

And not that the officiating would have made any difference whatsoever (and it's just plain loser talk to whine about officiating), but it adds insult to injury when there are blatant mistakes. 'Nuff said. Ed Hochuli, pray for us.

[BallHawk]

Am I the only one who thinks we should give Fergie a shot at starting next week?

[retailguy]

There's a series of "little ifs" forming in my mind. If Herron doesn't drop that punt, take 3 off for Chi., if the 3rd and 4th and inches are spotted correctly, the Pack keep possession (I think M3 should have challenged the spot.), if the hold on Caroll is called, take 7 off for Chicago, We still sucked, but the D did fairly well at holding them off in the red zone. Just a thought--the score really could have been closer...

if chicago's red zone offense didn't suck - 35-0....

we can't do the 'if' game

[MJZiggy]

Dave Rayner - well, no one was actually delusional enough to believe he was going to make a 53-yarder.

Maybe not make it, but keeping it in the same hemisphere would have been nice.

[wpony]

Hawk was all over the field I think he had a great game today also woodson had to be the biggest loser today I tried to focus on him all day today the only thing he did decent today was his returns and I dont think TT want to pay him thay much for his returning abilities .

[son of a vic]

I didn't see a push Retail, I saw a defender making a play on the ball(what a concept), and their feet got together. It wasn't a blatant push, he was more focused on the ball, than the receiver.

Just because I didn't think it was a penalty, doesn't make me a negative sov, does it?

[BallHawk]

I had a bet with my Dad he wouldn't come even close.

Let's say I'm $1 richer because of that.

[VegasPackFan]

Am I the only one who thinks we should give Fergie a shot at starting next week?

He has been "Given a shot" enough times in the past. Let it go. We might as well keep playing with Driver and Jennings as the starters. Jennings has a lot of upside potential. Fergie has done all he's ever gonna do.

[retailguy]

Just because I didn't think it was a penalty, doesn't make me a negative sov, does it?


nope, you did that last year. I called you black koolaid then too. i should do an avatar for you with a black kool aid guy... it would be great for you... :wink:

[billy_oliver880]

WTF happened to the team today? I went for a long ride on my bike and I came back and what the hell? I am glad I didn't stay home to watch it. :evil:

[FritzDontBlitz]

Am I the only one who thinks we should give Fergie a shot at starting next week?

i have said all along that fergy should be the 2 and jennings should handle all return duties. the return game was jennings' thing in college, expecting him to be the 2 against their most formidable division opponent was obviously asking too much of him in week one. jennings was invisible for most of the game until he showed up for two drops and as an innocent bystander on favre's two picks. i think jennings was overwhelmed today.

and while i'm discussing wr's, how STUPID does tt look now for only having 4 wideouts on the roster? is it too late to get rod gardner back? what about koren robinson? is don beebe still playing?

[retailguy]

Am I the only one who thinks we should give Fergie a shot at starting next week?


yes, yes you are.

[FavreChild]

I had a bet with my Dad he wouldn't come even close.

Let's say I'm $1 richer because of that.

Who, Rayner?

I said outloud to my Bronco-fan companions that there was a better chance of the Bears blocking and returning the kick for a TD than Rayner making the kick. And I'm an optimist.

[VegasPackFan]

The problem is not the WR's on this team.

It is that we have a crappy offensive scheme that cant score any points. I refer you the the 49'ers offense of last year, which M3 was responsible for.

[FavreChild]

Yet *someone* was responsible for hiring McCarthy.

AHEM.

[Deputy Nutz]

Winners:

Cullen Jenkins
Aaron Kampman
Nick Barnett
Donald Driver
Ahman Green


Losers:

Entire defensive backfield
Brady Poppinga (Not down on him, but a tough day).
Chad Clifton
Mark Tauscher
Noah Herron

I agree with Cullen Jenkins, other than Kampman he was the only one that got after Grossman. I wasn't al that impressed with Barnett after the INT. I thought he he got stoned on a couple of blocks. That one they showed the replay of, where Desmond Clark led up the hole and pancaked Barnett. That looked like it hurt, Barnett didn't even see him coming.

[retailguy]

Yet *someone* was responsible for hiring McCarthy.

AHEM.

We were trying NOT to point this out, but YES, YOU were responsible! :mrgreen:

[motife]

Just listened to the McCarthy interview.

He sounded very rational. Says it's a great learning experience.

Mccarthy's definitely not a whiner.

If this team stays scrappy, I like it. I like the commitment to the running game. Favre needs protection, but let's face it, he's a borderline liability to this team and to some extent is holding back its future progress. I love Favre, but he's becoming another Vinny Testaverde.

Bob Sanders and his whole staff must be fired and a real Defensive co-ordinator hired before we know what kind of talent we have. This is a Bob Slowik type defensive staff.


But for the reason for the post is, at the end of the interview something McCarthy said he thinks his biggest problem is his team not getting a big head from their successes.

[FavreChild]

Oh, well, I'm glad at least M3 got a good LEARNING EXPERIENCE out of this debacle.... :roll:

Sorry for the negativity. And thanks for posting, motife. But just about anything M3 possibly could say is empty and meaningless right now. I mean, this is the guy who talked about what a great thing FOR HIM his hiring was. Ugh.

But we're stuck with the guy, so....there it is.

[Partial]

Just listened to the McCarthy interview.

He sounded very rational. Says it's a great learning experience.

Mccarthy's definitely not a whiner.

If this team stays scrappy, I like it. I like the commitment to the running game. Favre needs protection, but let's face it, he's a borderline liability to this team and to some extent is holding back its future progress. I love Favre, but he's becoming another Vinny Testaverde.

Bob Sanders and his whole staff must be fired and a real Defensive co-ordinator hired before we know what kind of talent we have. This is a Bob Slowik type defensive staff.


But for the reason for the post is, at the end of the interview something he said he thinks his biggest problem is his team not getting a big head from their successes.

Where was the interview? I agree, I really want us to bring in an agressive coordinator. I would love for us to go after someone from San Diegos or Pittsburgs staffs.

[motife]

Where was the interview? I agree, I really want us to bring in an agressive coordinator. I would love for us to go after someone from San Diegos or Pittsburgs staffs.

http://www.packers.com/multimedia/audio/2006_game_audio/

[MJZiggy]

Partial, I just don't see that happening once the season's begun. I think we're stuck with the coaches we've got for the duration of the season.

[RashanGary]

Hey...On the bright side, we should get another high pick next year. If we're lucky, a stud RB will fall to us at pick #8 or whereever we pick.

The Bears are a great team. I knew they would compete for the SB this year. The Packers are at least one more year away from even smelling a playoff birth. I got a kick out of everyone here talking about us beating the Bears.

I'm not jumping off any bridges anytime soon. The Packers are a young, up and coming team. They will improve. They won't be dominate for a while but each year the team will get stronger and stronger.

[BananaMan]

KGB, he barely held up against the run today, but the fact that he had 1 pressure on Grossman all day should tell you that he needs to be given not only plays off, but whole series off. He was invisible in the second half of the ball game today.

Nutz, I highly disagree with you here. In the first half KGB was VERY solid against the run. I was amazed. And while he didn't get a ton of pressure, he still took up double teams and allowed Kampman and others to do well.

[mraynrand]

The defense gave up one TD on a mental mistake, then allowed 4 FGs, including one following a TO on a kickoff, right? That's 16 points on the defense. Given the piss poor offense - the same offense that couldn't get past the 50 without a fake punt, how can anyone pin this loss on the defense? And for the record, Favre was 5-5 in the first half. When is the last time Favre threw five passes in one half. If, as a coach, you've quit on Favre, what the hell are you starting him for? I think TT doesn't really want him there, but was too chicken to try to trade him. What a miserable development. ASk yourself this -which Packer offensive roster looked worse on paper - the roster on Dec 25, 2005, or today's? Which team performed better? Why?

[BallHawk]

They haven't given up on Favre, we just didn't have time to pass the ball. On one play we had Spitz step on his foot, on other we had 1st and 30. Favre was passing well, but the O-line just didn't give them the oppurtunity to go to it, as needed.

[retailguy]

The defense gave up one TD on a mental mistake, then allowed 4 FGs, including one following a TO on a kickoff, right? That's 16 points on the defense. Given the piss poor offense - the same offense that couldn't get past the 50 without a fake punt, how can anyone pin this loss on the defense? And for the record, Favre was 5-5 in the first half. When is the last time Favre threw five passes in one half. If, as a coach, you've quit on Favre, what the hell are you starting him for? I think TT doesn't really want him there, but was too chicken to try to trade him. What a miserable development. ASk yourself this -which Packer offensive roster looked worse on paper - the roster on Dec 25, 2005, or today's? Which team performed better? Why?

I know where you're going here, and I agree with most of what you say, but you're never going to win this here. Sherman is the scapegoat. Always will be, and that's very sad.

[woodbuck27]

For the record, I predicted 5-7 wins. In hindsight, a thimble full of kool-aid must have clouded my thought process. Clean and sober, 3-4 wins seems about right.

a prediction of 3-4 wins after what we witnessed today = optimistic.

Will someone put some oil in the engine,PLEASE.

Oh. . lots of oil . . I see . then...

"no gas... got any gas"?

What's that?...... Oh ! Water in the gas. OK.

[woodbuck27]

There's a series of "little ifs" forming in my mind. If Herron doesn't drop that punt, take 3 off for Chi., if the 3rd and 4th and inches are spotted correctly, the Pack keep possession (I think M3 should have challenged the spot.), if the hold on Caroll is called, take 7 off for Chicago, We still sucked, but the D did fairly well at holding them off in the red zone. Just a thought--the score really could have been closer...

Is 16 to ZERO better than 26 to ZERO, MJ?

ZERO = ZERO ! :mrgreen:

[woodbuck27]

Partial, I just don't see that happening once the season's begun. I think we're stuck with the coaches we've got for the duration of the season.

Yup! That sets up a scapegoat scenario MJ.

[Joemailman]

The defense gave up one TD on a mental mistake, then allowed 4 FGs, including one following a TO on a kickoff, right? That's 16 points on the defense. Given the piss poor offense - the same offense that couldn't get past the 50 without a fake punt, how can anyone pin this loss on the defense? And for the record, Favre was 5-5 in the first half. When is the last time Favre threw five passes in one half. If, as a coach, you've quit on Favre, what the hell are you starting him for? I think TT doesn't really want him there, but was too chicken to try to trade him. What a miserable development. ASk yourself this -which Packer offensive roster looked worse on paper - the roster on Dec 25, 2005, or today's? Which team performed better? Why?


It is true that the defense only gave up 16 points. However, to give up that score on the first drive of the game was huge. In recent years, the Packers defense has all too often allowed opposing teams to come into Lambeau and score right off the bat. This has to stop if the Packers are ever going to re-establish a home-field advantage.

I was also struck by the lack of use of the passing game in the first half. To be down 16-0 at half, with Favre being 5-5 was just bizarre. I know McCarthy doesn't want Favre to have to carry the offense on his back alone, but Favre is not an old geezer in a wheelchair.

I realize success will not be overnight. I predicted this team would have a losing record in the 1st half of the season, and turn things around in the 2nd half. I just hope McCarthy realizes that Favre is still the guy with the best chance to be a difference maker on offense.

[mraynrand]

It is true that the defense only gave up 16 points. However, to give up that score on the first drive of the game was huge. .


I'll give you this one. And it's an even bigger error when the Packers were burned on an IDENTICAL play (play fake and bomb to Berrian) in that Dec. 25 2005 game. Bob Sanders was there, and he must have watched the tape more than once. How do you F this up?

[Bossman641]

KGB, he barely held up against the run today, but the fact that he had 1 pressure on Grossman all day should tell you that he needs to be given not only plays off, but whole series off. He was invisible in the second half of the ball game today.

Nutz, I highly disagree with you here. In the first half KGB was VERY solid against the run. I was amazed. And while he didn't get a ton of pressure, he still took up double teams and allowed Kampman and others to do well.

I agree with the Bananaman here. I thought KGB played the run pretty well. There was one run where he pinched inside and Jones was able to cut it back behind him but other than that he was decent.

I have to admit that I don't watch him much on passing downs so I have no idea if he was getting doubled or chipped. I do remember him beating his man one play though and then getting obviously held and basically tackled by the LT. A flag came out and I figured for sure it was offensive holding, but instead it was a holding call on Woodson. :evil:

[the_idle_threat]

Am I the only one who thinks we should give Fergie a shot at starting next week?

Yeah, pretty much. :D

[OS PA]

Winners

Brett Favre - With all of the things going wrong for him today, he seemed to maintain a certain swagger and keep his head out of trouble. Before his interceptions he was making good decisions and seemed to be "obeying" the play calling.

Ahman Green - 110 yards against the #1 Rushing defense in the league with no offensive line, while playing from behind. Enough said.

Donald Driver - Driver comes up big in every game.

Aaron Kampman - He was the heart of the defense today, if we could only teach him how to run a 4.5 =(

Charles Woodson (The Punt Returner) - Woodson did his best impression of Devin Hester after we were down and out, racking up 28 yard punt return and a 14.7 yard average.


Losers

The Coaching Staff - C'mon guys, get your heads out of your asses. Be creative with your play calling, switch it up. It seemed that no matter what was happening on the field McCarthy tried to stick with the same gameplan, lose. We need to pick up another reciever and show some confusing sets. Not the ultimate pass blocking set of 3 tight and a fullback, which we saw alot of tonight.

Brady Poppinga - Brady should not play Linebacker in this league. Put him at his natural position of Defensive End and hope that he makes up for his year and a half lost playing LB'er. He can't read an offense. Limit his job to hitting the quarterback and he'll be a fine player.

Bob Sanders and his in-the-box safeties - Part of the reason we were so successful in pass coverage last year was our safeties helping our CB's double up. In this years scheme we seem to be putting our safeties out of position too much. The long touchdown to Berrian was given up because Marquand Manuel was playing too far up, and it seemed Nick Collins job was to watch the running back to the basics.

Chad Clifton - Sure Chad is a rock, but this isn't a good thing. He was letting people by at an alarming rate today. The only pass protection we got out of him was when we put two tight ends and fullback next to him.


I was disappointed with our heralded Zone-Blocking scheme today, our boys don't do finesse well. I say throw it out during our bye-week and teach them how to hit like men.[/b]

[Fritz]

For all the talk about TT making this team too young, I think that some of the blame for this loss has to go to some of the vets. I'm thinking primarily of Clifton and Tauscher, both of whom had bad games. Especially Clifton, who was responsible for two sacks at times the Packers were in decent down and distance positions.

What is needed, more than anything, is a stud defensive lineman, end or tackle, who can blow up the pocket. Grossman had time to pick his nose back there.

[Iron Mike]

I do remember him beating his man one play though and then getting obviously held and basically tackled by the LT. A flag came out and I figured for sure it was offensive holding, but instead it was a holding call on Woodson. :evil:

IMO, there were a lot of "non-calls" in this game.... :neutral:

[Harlan Huckleby]

I just hope McCarthy realizes that Favre is still the guy with the best chance to be a difference maker on offense.

But does a difference maker make a difference on a team this bad? This is a rebuilding year, I don't see how you can progress without giving the QB you are building around (Aaron Rodgers) some playing experience.

It is certainly more entertaining to watch Favre play than to suffer through Aaron Rodger's growing pains. But if the games are painful anyway, might as well be pain with gain.

[Zool]

Just think, this is far and away the best defense we will see until week 17.

[MJZiggy]

I just hope McCarthy realizes that Favre is still the guy with the best chance to be a difference maker on offense.

But does a difference maker make a difference on a team this bad? This is a rebuilding year, I don't see how you can progress without giving the QB you are building around (Aaron Rodgers) some playing experience.

It is certainly more entertaining to watch Favre play than to suffer through Aaron Rodger's growing pains. But if the games are painful anyway, might was well be pain with gain.

I think you have to take what you can get right now. Favre gives them their best shot at winning, that's true. He also brings the experience and can spot problems in the way guys are lining up instantly. He is also on fire in the huddle and teaching them how to battle until the last play. Perhaps Aaron can do these things as well, but certainly not as well as Favre.

[Harlan Huckleby]

ziggy, maybe they can give Rodgers a quarter of play in a game like yesterday.

[MJZiggy]

I would not have had a problem with that, though what good would it really have done to have him out there getting his ass handed to him as well?

[Harlan Huckleby]

I would not have had a problem with that, though what good would it really have done to have him out there getting his ass handed to him as well?

college of hard knocks.

[Noodle]

I would not have had a problem with that, though what good would it really have done to have him out there getting his ass handed to him as well?

college of hard knocks.

And maybe, just maybe, he doesn't get his ass handed to him.

I'm a huge believer in the notion that nothing teaches the speed of the game like playing the game. Give A-Rod a taste everyweek so that his mind begins operating at that speed all the time.

Once Favre started his fuck-it, let's chuck-it phase near the end of the third, ARod should have gotten the call. Nutz said it at the time on the game thread, and he was exactly right.

[Cheesehead Craig]

I agree with the Bananaman here. I thought KGB played the run pretty well. There was one run where he pinched inside and Jones was able to cut it back behind him but other than that he was decent.

I have to admit that I don't watch him much on passing downs so I have no idea if he was getting doubled or chipped. I do remember him beating his man one play though and then getting obviously held and basically tackled by the LT. A flag came out and I figured for sure it was offensive holding, but instead it was a holding call on Woodson. :evil:
I'll agree here as well. KGB did a nice job in the game. Overall, I thought the run defense did well considering that last year this defense likely would have given up 160-170 yds rushing in a game like this. But then, if you throw the ball to wide open receivers, why run?

[LaFours]

I know Poopenport is an injury liability but after watching this team self-destruct on 3rd/4th and short I couldn't help but think that it would have been nice to have the "pile-mover" around. But thats just thining out loud.

[HarveyWallbangers]

What's sad about this game was they ran the ball pretty well, stopped the run pretty well, and by the time Favre threw his first incompletion we were down 16-0 in the 3rd quarter. Just crazy stuff. No pass rush. No pass defense. Favre was 6 for 6 for 84 yards into the 3rd quarter.

His first 6 passes:
B.Favre pass deep right to D.Driver to GB 37 for 17 yards (1st quarter)
B.Favre pass deep middle to D.Lee to GB 47 for 25 yards (2nd quarter)
B.Favre pass short middle to A.Green to GB 45 for 13 yards (2nd quarter)
B.Favre pass short right to A.Green to CHI 45 for 5 yards (2nd quarter)
B.Favre pass short left to R.Ferguson to CHI 35 for 10 yards (2nd quarter)
B.Favre pass deep right to D.Driver to GB 45 for 24 yards (3rd quarter)

Some times I wish he'd eat the ball late in game when there is no hope, but that wouldn't be Favre. People will now say he played terrible because he threw 2 picks in the 4th quarter when the team was down 26-0. I hardly think he was to blame because the Packers couldn't convert a 3rd and 1 on the first drive, Wells stepped on his foot on a 3rd and 3 on the second drive, Rayner missed a FG, the defense couldn't stop the Bears and give the ball back to the offense, the offense allowed 3 sacks where the defender was on him in a hurry, and Herron fumbled a KO return. Sure, he can take some blame for the sneak, but he's not exactly going to be great in those situations if Wells can't stand up the NT. He was far from the major problem in this game.

[MJZiggy]

Hey, he made it on that sneak, it was a bad spot.

[HarveyWallbangers]

I thought it was a bad spot also. There's no way he lost yardage. However, you have to get well past the marker in those situations, or you have nobody to blame but yourself.

[Patler]

Some times I wish he'd eat the ball late in game when there is no hope, but that wouldn't be Favre. People will now say he played terrible because he threw 2 picks in the 4th quarter when the team was down 26-0.

My biggest beef with Favre is that he throws interception in situations he doesn't have to. He forces things that aren't there, when he doesn't have to.

First interception:
Packers pick up two first downs driving from their 34 to Chicago's 44. On 1st and 10, Favre throws an interception.

Second interception:
Packers get a good punt return from Woodson (28 yards) and pick up another 1st down to have 1st and 10 at the Chicago 37. On first down again Favre throws an interception.

In both situations it was 1st down, and the team had moved the ball some. In both situations, but especially the one back to the middle of the field, he took an unneccessary chance on 1st down in Bear territory. Wait for third down, or at least 2nd down for the risky throw. Be safer on 1st down, have a chance for second down.

Sometimes, and I've felt this his entire career, he loses a sense of the situation. Let the play go, stay alive for another chance, THEN take the riskier option.

Interceptions on bad decisions on 1st down really aggravate me! :mad:

[MJZiggy]

Wonder if his coach gave him hell for it?

[HarveyWallbangers]

The first one was just a bad overthrow. It wasn't a bad decision. The receiver was open. If I remember correctly, he had some pressure which might have been partly to blame for the bad throw. Still a bad throw. I was in the bathroom for the second interception, so I can't comment on that one. It was still 26-0, so did the interceptions mean anything? Not really. Up until the game got out of reach, he was probably one of the five best players for the Packers--although that's not saying much.

[Patler]

The first one was just a bad overthrow. It wasn't a bad decision. The receiver was open. If I remember correctly, he had some pressure which might have been partly to blame for the bad throw. Still a bad throw. I was in the bathroom for the second interception, so I can't comment on that one. It was still 26-0, so did the interceptions mean anything? Not really. Up until the game got out of reach, he was probably one of the five best players for the Packers--although that's not saying much.

I'm willing to overlook the overthrow. Jennings was the target, and may not even have been exactly where Favre expected him. it kind of looked that way, a bit.

Now the other one didn't mean much as far as the outcome, the Packers weren't going to win. However, especially with a young team you want something positive. A conservative, scoring drive would have been a positive. It would show they CAN score against one of the best defenses in the league. It would have been a positive to build on. Now they have nothing.

BTW - the other was a classic, foolish throw back into the middle of the field late in the play. Those are picked off routinely for all QBs. Reportedly, had it gotten through it could have gone for a long play. It's not a good risk on 1st down, maybe on 3rd.

This team needs patient leadership from Favre, not an impatient gunslinger. He doesn't have the offensive tools for it, and I'm not sure he has the personal skills for it anymore, game after game. The team needs to learn to walk before it runs, to use a cliche. At times Favre will need to walk with them.

[Deputy Nutz]

BTW - the other was a classic, foolish throw back into the middle of the field late in the play. Those are picked off routinely for all QBs. Reportedly, had it gotten through it could have gone for a long play. It's not a good risk on 1st down, maybe on 3rd.


This is exactly why he ended up as a loser this past week. Those INTs didn't play a factor on Sunday but they are going to add to his total of 30 at the end of the year. I guess if Favre doesn't care about making foolish rookie mistakes why should I?

Also he believes he can still make that throw. The bottom line is he can't. He can still rifle a ball when he is in the pocket and he can use the rest of his body, but when he is rolling one direction and tries to throw it back the other way, the only thing he proves is that his arm is now that of human category.

[Fritz]

"No pass rush."
- Harvey

Of all that's been written as to why the Pack was so awful, this is the one aspect I think has been most overlooked. I mean, we all know the offensive line didn't play well, and you can't win if you don't score, but that's pretty obvious. Fewer people have commented on the fact that, like last year, and the year before, and maybe before that, too, the Packers allow opposing QB's to sit back in the pocket and survey the field. Sometimes for hours on end. With some pressure on the pocket I don't think that the GB linebackers and secondary would have looked quite so ordinary.

TT better be scouring colleges for the guy that can get into the offensive backfield, fast. Doesn't matter whether it's a DT or DE.

[red]

"No pass rush."
- Harvey

Of all that's been written as to why the Pack was so awful, this is the one aspect I think has been most overlooked. I mean, we all know the offensive line didn't play well, and you can't win if you don't score, but that's pretty obvious. Fewer people have commented on the fact that, like last year, and the year before, and maybe before that, too, the Packers allow opposing QB's to sit back in the pocket and survey the field. Sometimes for hours on end. With some pressure on the pocket I don't think that the GB linebackers and secondary would have looked quite so ordinary.

TT better be scouring colleges for the guy that can get into the offensive backfield, fast. Doesn't matter whether it's a DT or DE.

dwight freeney

give up a 1st round pick for him if we have too, even if its the #1 overall

[Fritz]

Is he on the trading block?

How old is he?

[rdanomly]

"No pass rush."
- Harvey

Of all that's been written as to why the Pack was so awful, this is the one aspect I think has been most overlooked. I mean, we all know the offensive line didn't play well, and you can't win if you don't score, but that's pretty obvious. Fewer people have commented on the fact that, like last year, and the year before, and maybe before that, too, the Packers allow opposing QB's to sit back in the pocket and survey the field. Sometimes for hours on end. With some pressure on the pocket I don't think that the GB linebackers and secondary would have looked quite so ordinary.

TT better be scouring colleges for the guy that can get into the offensive backfield, fast. Doesn't matter whether it's a DT or DE.

dwight freeney

give up a 1st round pick for him if we have too, even if its the #1 overall

He didn't seem to have much of an impact last night for what its worth..

[Patler]

"No pass rush."
- Harvey

Of all that's been written as to why the Pack was so awful, this is the one aspect I think has been most overlooked. I mean, we all know the offensive line didn't play well, and you can't win if you don't score, but that's pretty obvious. Fewer people have commented on the fact that, like last year, and the year before, and maybe before that, too, the Packers allow opposing QB's to sit back in the pocket and survey the field. Sometimes for hours on end. With some pressure on the pocket I don't think that the GB linebackers and secondary would have looked quite so ordinary.

TT better be scouring colleges for the guy that can get into the offensive backfield, fast. Doesn't matter whether it's a DT or DE.

I think the problem was more that they couldn't put coverage and pressure together on the same play. If the pressure was there, someone was wide open. When coverage was better, there was no pressure.

Kampman had a sack and four hits on Grossman.
Jenkins got good pressure a couple times.
Barnett knocked Grossman down once on a blitz.
Didn't Hawk get there once too?

That's not bad pressure, but except for Barnett's interception there wasn't much coverage with it.

[red]

yeah, hawk had a knockdown

he blitzed right up the middle and was untouched, grosman had to unload right before hawk hit him. i think it was an imcomplete. or was that the play where grossman threw the ball at the back of his lineman and got a flag?

[CyclonePackFan]

Winners

Ahman Green - Came back from a major injury to put up triple digit yardage on one of if not the best defenses in the league, in his contract year. If he stays healthy, he's won himself a new contract.

Vonta Leach's run blocking - No way Green racks up 100 yards without it. Leach pancaked both Urlacher and Hillenmeyer at points in the game. Now if only he could learn to pass block, run with the ball, and catch, we'd have a great replacement for Henderson.

Aaron Kampman - Ted Thompson showed him the money. He earned it.

A. J. Hawk - His stats don't show it, but he was around the ball all day. Made great plays taking on blockers, great team effort.

Donald Driver - Or should I just call him, "the passing game"

Me, and every other die-hard on the season ticket waiting list - Thump..Thump..Thump.. Hear that? That's the sound of the remaining bandwagoners jumping off. Maybe I won't have to wait 44 more years after all. I wish I could speed it up without us sucking, but hey, I'm looking for positives here. :roll:

Losers

Brett Favre - Somehow I have a feeling this conversation occurred in the 2nd half:

Brett: Come on, coach, let me sling it around
MM: We can't have turnovers against this team. We're already down, we need to drive the field, not just hand it back to them.
Brett: Fuck you. I'm Brett Favre. I'll do what I want.
MM: ...OK Brett. Go for it. You do what you want.
<2 interceptions later>
MM: So....ready to listen to me?
Brett: STFU.

Mark Tauscher and Chad Clifton - How did the two veterans perform worse than two rookie guards?

David Martin - You fail, please try again...but with another team when your contract runs out at the end of the year ^_^

KGB - Overpaid, Underperformed

Brady Poppinga - So....isn't BYU great preparation for the NFL?

Samkon Gado - 2 attempts, -7 yards. Hope you enjoy being a doctor.

Dave Raynor - PREDICTION, MARK IT DOWN:

With their first selection in the third round, the Green Bay Packers select Mason Crosby, Kicker, Colorado

[MJZiggy]

Mike McCarthy did many things in the second half. Smirking was not among the things he did.

[CyclonePackFan]

Mike McCarthy did many things in the second half. Smirking was not among the things he did.

I really was at a loss to better describe the situation. I can't picture him saying "I told you so" to Brett, so I went with the smirk. You know there had to be some "Why doesn't he listen" or "Dammit I hate being right"...I'm going to edit that

Also, did anybody else notice that Brett was the first player off the field? I don't even think he stayed around for handshakes.

[Cobra Kai]

Mike McCarthy did many things in the second half. Smirking was not among the things he did.

I really was at a loss to better describe the situation. I can't picture him saying "I told you so" to Brett, so I went with the smirk. You know there had to be some "Why doesn't he listen" or "Dammit I hate being right"...I'm going to edit that

Also, did anybody else notice that Brett was the first player off the field? I don't even think he stayed around for handshakes.

He was running up the tunnel before the clock hit zero...

It was also interesting seeing Favre's face late in the 4th when they called several draw plays back to back. He was pissed... I think McCarthy did that on purpose to let Favre know he wasn't going to let him chuck the seed around with reckless abandon any more...