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View Full Version : Bakhtiari - Something is clearly wrong.



Patler
11-25-2019, 10:06 AM
I have a lot to say, so this is going to be a long recap and comment about Bakhtiari. I apologize for the length in advance.

There have been lots of comments in many threads about Bakhtiari's apparent decline this year, including:

- he was never really that good to begin with, we expect too much
- he is being exposed by miscommunications from playing next to a rookie
- he has always relied on cleverly disguised holding, which is being more closely called this year
- he is past his prime, and isn't physically talented enough to continue dominating
- he is playing hurt

I always watch the games long after they are done, already knowing the result before I start watching. I normally listen to or follow the game live while doing other things, so I already know key plays, game trends etc. before I watch my recording of the game. This allows me to watch the game differently, I focus on different things.

I've watched Bakhtiari in pass pro quite closely, not just when he gets beat or commits a penalty. He is really struggling this year, play after play. Unlike previous years, he rarely looks like he is in control, he is constantly playing "catch-up" to a pass rusher on the verge of beating him cleanly. Things I have seen:

- His "claim to fame" in the past was his quickness off the snap. At times he was called for false starts both rightly and wrongly. Either quickness or anticipation allowed him to move with the ball, usually a flash before any other OL (making it look like a false start even when it wasn't) and well before his opponent. This gave him control of the confrontation from the start. I don't see that with any consistency now, and his opponent often beats him at the snap.

- He has struggled with power rushers in the past, but this year seems to be overpowered at times by just about anyone. I have seen him completely run over, put on his back on the ground at least three times in recent weeks.

- He had a good feel in the past for directing wide speed rushers well past the pocket where Rodgers should be, at least initially. This year, often he can't keep up with speed rushers and they get to their target. He struggles to keep contact with the rusher at times.

- He looks stiff.


Loss of quickness, power, speed and flexibility. Based on my life experiences, he looks to me like a guy struggling through a back issue that is really bothering him.

ThunderDan
11-25-2019, 10:10 AM
My thoughts exactly.

I bowed out of competitive golf 20+ years ago because of a back injury/bad back. I can't imagine how it would effect your performance in a sport were someone is hitting you on every play.

MadScientist
11-25-2019, 11:20 AM
He did have a reported back injury earlier this year. I also wonder if some of his knee problems from last year are still bothering him. Whatever the reason, his play is way off. The rest of the line does him no favors either.

KYPack
11-26-2019, 09:16 PM
Great post P. You Patlerized a situation I've been looking at myself.

Bahk has always had a strong base, great footwork, quick hands and super anticipation.

He's developed a kind of unique set of mechanics to take advantage of his talents

He tends to set up to the inside to keep the inside rush (the gate) protected. He uses that quick slide step to get wide if it's an outside rush.

His injuries (or whatever) don't allow him to cheat in either direction anymore.

The big indicator of problems was the Charger game.

Bosa made a flash rush to the inside and whipped Bahk to sack Arod.

After that, Bosa would feint to the inside, then blow post the committed LT with an edge rush.

Our LT was now a mortal and David had a real rough time of it that game.

He's still strong but some of his movement has been lost.

I hope the guy mends, but if it is leg and back miseries, it'll take an off-season to get right.

red
11-26-2019, 09:28 PM
i haven't paid attention in awhile to him, but a couple years ago, he would always just escort his guy in a large arch around the pocket, without really touching the guy

this would always cause problems when rodgers would take one of his 12 step drops and run right into the arms of a guy that was escorted well away from the action

so to me, i never saw him being all the physical or aggressive, so if he lost any speed, or dancing ability, then he would be kind of worthless

the back injury thing sounds pretty plausible though, those fucking things just suck. i've had plenty and they render you almost completely useless

bobblehead
11-27-2019, 05:52 AM
He hasn't declined, he is too young for that. He very likely is still suffering from his back injury, but that is only part of the equation. The other 2 parts are that he was never the top pass blocking tackle in the league many thought he was and he WAS always the best holder in the league and this year they are calling it. He is also playing next to someone who ISN'T getting beat so fast that you didn't notice Bak when he gets beat.

The other 2 factors aren't new, I've said it for years. Bak is a good LT, he isn't top 3. If he gets healthy in the off season we won't be noticing him as much next year.

Fritz
11-27-2019, 10:14 AM
Better draft a tackle in the next draft.

red
11-27-2019, 11:46 AM
Better draft a tackle in the next draft.

Needed to do that the last couple years to replace the always injured bulaga

texaspackerbacker
11-27-2019, 12:50 PM
We could use at least two or three decent O Linemen - draft or otherwise. And what we need is "road graders" - hopefully Jenkins is the first of many of that type that we pick up.

JohnMexico
11-27-2019, 06:37 PM
We could use at least two or three decent O Linemen - draft or otherwise. And what we need is "road graders" - hopefully Jenkins is the first of many of that type that we pick up.

We do need to reload at OL but dont be fooled there are no road graders anymore. We simply need our QB, Aaron Rodgers and beyond, to stay upright.

The first draft really was a fuck up. Hock was gone and boy we needed the fuck out of him. Bush was gone and we went with the potential guy that is a 3rfld or 4th string fella. Maybe Cole Madison will be ready next year, and perhaps we can find a top flight TE prospect and play the copy cat game that utilizes two TEs at all times. Graham and Bulaga will be literally eating dicks somewhere else.

Which leaves us with picking our poison... get a WR or get interior D help. I'm for MLB or DE.

run pMc
12-02-2019, 09:40 AM
I think the MLF offense wants athletic zone blockers, not road graders. They do need to draft someone who can play OT well. Bulaga has been a warrior but he's 30 going on 40 with his injury history, and Bahk has looked mortal.

texaspackerbacker
12-02-2019, 02:30 PM
That's the kind of O Linemen the Packers have drafted in the recent past, and it's why we have the lame assed O Line we currently have. Inside zone runs - which the Packers have been fairly successful on this season - are better with people like Jenkins and Linsley, both of whom are closer to the road grader end of things. Correct me if I'm wrong, but outside zone does not use pulling linemen, making size and strength preferable to mobility there too.

I never liked Bakhtiari nearly as much as a lot of others do, and Bulaga has been better this year, but he only seems good IMO due to the mediocrity and low expectations in general for our O Line.

pbmax
12-02-2019, 02:35 PM
That's the kind of O Linemen the Packers have drafted in the recent past, and it's why we have the lame assed O Line we currently have. Inside zone runs - which the Packers have been fairly successful on this season - are better with people like Jenkins and Linsley, both of whom are closer to the road grader end of things. Correct me if I'm wrong, but outside zone does not use pulling linemen, making size and strength preferable to mobility there too.

I never liked Bakhtiari nearly as much as a lot of others do, and Bulaga has been better this year, but he only seems good IMO due to the mediocrity and low expectations in general for our O Line.

Mobility first for outside zone. Think Alex Gibbs.

Fosco33
12-02-2019, 04:40 PM
Looked like he is slower off the snap in particular

bobblehead
12-03-2019, 05:27 PM
Mobility first for outside zone. Think Alex Gibbs.

Mobile enough to catch a LB and athletic enough to lock into/onto him in the open field.