Never too early 2020 NFL Draft Thread

[wthigoot]

Never made a thread before so just experimenting. Lots of 2019 football left (with I think at least 1 playoff win) but never too early for draft talk. Thought I saw someone saying there was already a 2020 draft thread, but didn't see one. Cancel this one if there is.

No responses = too early!!!

Way too early mock draft:
1 - Davis, Wyatt - OG - Ohio State
2 - Murray, Kenneth - ILB - Oklahoma
3 - Rogers, Kendrick - WR - Texas A&M
4 - Pinckney, Nyles - DT - Clemson
5 - Samuels, Stanford - CB - Florida State
6 - Hopkins, Brycen - TE - Purdue
6 - Vaughn, Ke'Shawn - RB - Vanderbilt
7 - Zuniga, Jabari - DE - Florida
7 - Paulo, Darrin - OT - Utah
7 - Duvernay, Devin - WR - Texas

Just estimating positions vs. rounds of the draft. Packers probably won't select any of these guys.

Absurd (Davis) Draft:

1 - Davis, Wyatt - OG - Ohio State
2 - Davis, Raekwon - DT - Alabama
2 - Davis, Quartney - WR - Texas A&M
3 - Davis, Gabriel - WR - Central Florida
5 - Davis, Ashtyn - S - California
6 - Davis, Carlos - DT - Nebraska
7 - Davis, Jordan - TE - Louisville

FA - Davis, Kahlil - DT - Nebraska
FA - Davis, Javaris - CB - Auburn
FA - Davis, Alvin - CB - Akron

[MadtownPacker]

Why no Cali guys on the mock draft?

[Cheesehead Craig]

No worries about the thread. So long as there's a Kinda Early Draft thread, Somewhat Early Draft thread, and Sorta Early one too.

[run pMc]

I thought Brycen Hopkins was considered among, if not the, top TE in the draft... if true, no way he lasts until R6. I know nothing about any of these other younguns, so... nice job.
How many months to the draft?

[Joemailman]

I thought Brycen Hopkins was considered among, if not the, top TE in the draft... if true, no way he lasts until R6. I know nothing about any of these other younguns, so... nice job.
How many months to the draft?

This guy has Hopkins as #1 TE and #52 overall. https://thedraftnetwork.com/articles/joe-marino-s-2020-nfl-draft-big-boardpositional-rankings

[pbmax]

Aaron Nagler @AaronNagler
The QB the Broncos traded up in front of the Packers to take because they suspected (correctly) that Green Bay planned on taking him.

He is speaking of Drew Lock. Nagler later names himself as the source, so I think this is informed speculation if not a joke, but has anyone else heard this?

Got LEEEEEEEROY Jenkins instead.

[Smidgeon]

Aaron Nagler @AaronNagler
The QB the Broncos traded up in front of the Packers to take because they suspected (correctly) that Green Bay planned on taking him.

He is speaking of Drew Lock. Nagler later names himself as the source, so I think this is informed speculation if not a joke, but has anyone else heard this?

Got LEEEEEEEROY Jenkins instead.

I heard similar rumors on draft day...and it's certainly possible. After the incapabilities of the backup QBs the last few years, Gute was possibly seeing value in a QB in that position. Hopefully that means he values the future QB position as well.

[pbmax]

I heard similar rumors on draft day...and it's certainly possible. After the incapabilities of the backup QBs the last few years, Gute was possibly seeing value in a QB in that position. Hopefully that means he values the future QB position as well.

Someone in that thread said Gute had publicly said something positive about him. Given the secrecy that normally surrounds this stuff, I guess maybe?

[wthigoot]

I thought Brycen Hopkins was considered among, if not the, top TE in the draft... if true, no way he lasts until R6. I know nothing about any of these other younguns, so... nice job.
How many months to the draft?

Wow, my mistake, thought I got that ranking from Great Blue North but they have him 3rd round or so. Probably wouldn't spend a 1 or 2 on a TE, but would be OK with it if that's what they decided.

[wthigoot]

Why no Cali guys on the mock draft?

Hmmm.... Well is it time to draft another Cali QB to develop, since our current Cali QB has begun to say the "R" word?

How about a guy from Bakersfield?

2 - Love, Jordan - QB - Utah State - 6-4, 220

[MadtownPacker]

Sounds good! Plus his current state is preparing him for bagging multiple honeys. Solid choice.

[texaspackerbacker]

Breaking News: I've changed my mind - something that hardly ever happens. I've always been against drafting a WR early. I still don't want one drafted in the first round, but second would be a good idea. I'm with the Allison detractors. I'm thinking positive about Lazard and even Kumerow and St. Brown next season, and even though MVS has been a bit of a disappointment, he still could develop. But basically, we could use a book end with Davante Adams - somebody on that level. It supposedly is a good year for WRs also.

I still want a Kenny Clark clone of a DT in the first round and a top quality TE in the third round. And maybe 4th round on, O Linemen across the board, hopefully getting lucky on a couple of them.

Free Agency, of course, is also a possibility for any or all of those positions.

[Sparkey]

Aaron Nagler @AaronNagler
The QB the Broncos traded up in front of the Packers to take because they suspected (correctly) that Green Bay planned on taking him.

He is speaking of Drew Lock. Nagler later names himself as the source, so I think this is informed speculation if not a joke, but has anyone else heard this?

Got LEEEEEEEROY Jenkins instead.

https://247sports.com/nfl/green-bay-packers/Article/Drew-Lock-Green-Bay-Packers-draft--131604123/

[pbmax]

Well taking Lock would solve one problem (QB backup) and then offered an immediate proof of concept when Lane Taylor got Rodgers knocked out for another season.

[run pMc]

Well taking Lock would solve one problem (QB backup) and then offered an immediate proof of concept when Lane Taylor got Rodgers knocked out for another season.

C'mon...everyone knows they shoulda taken M.K. Decaf. :P
I'm fine with Gute taking Leeeeroy over Drew "John" Locke -- ol Leeeroy has the makings of a 10 year starter and that's worth something. Rodgers will need a better backup and they should start looking at finding his successor, but keeping him upright and healthy in the meantime is a good idea.

Stud ILB who can cover
WR with speed/separation
OT to replace or backup Bulaga
DL to help Kenny
CB because you can't have enough
QB to develop?
random fast fat guys to play ST

[texaspackerbacker]

I really like this Texas wideout in the Alamo Bowl, Devin Duvernay if we could get him maybe second or third round.

[Joemailman]

I really like this Texas wideout in the Alamo Bowl, Devin Duvernay if we could get him maybe second or third round.

Rated probably 3rd round pick right now.

Strengths: Speed, yards after catch.

Weakness: Route running.

[pbmax]

What do you do with player tracking? Figure out where teams attack defenses.

https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/how-do-you-find-good-nfl-defenders-by-measuring-whats-not-there/

[Joemailman]

This is the kind of receiver the Packers need. Possible late 1st round pick.

Jalen Reagor - TCU

https://thedraftnetwork.com/player/jalen-reagor/BdQaY3TtVR


Route Tree - Appreciate the nuance he brings to route releases to force false steps or create space before accelerating. He's shifty both at the LOS and when closing down on the toes of off defenders, showing great snap, footwork and pace. Movement skills to run any route in the tree.

Hands - There are lapses with concentration here, seemingly from looking to get his eyes up the field too quickly and look for run after catch opportunities. When he's focused, he gets it clean and has little issue catching balls that test his catch radius or elevating above the rim.

Contested Catch Ability - He's best when he has to go high for the football. If you're asking him to jostle for positioning and box out, that's not where he's going to win. But put a ball up high and outside in the red zone and he'll sky for it and typically gets his frame back around to greet the ball, too.

RAC Ability - Play him in the quick game and he's going to give you chunk gains from time to time, good field vision, excellent explosiveness, strong creativity to force a missed tackle or false step. Sells cuts with head snap, capable of stringing cuts together.

Football IQ - Natural instinct here to win on different levels, shows good understanding of when he's got leverage and how to sell defenders on something other than his true intent. Much more polished and pro-ready than offense gave him the chance to showcase.

Vertical Receiving Skills - Devastating vertical receiver with easy speed to blow past defenders who bite on double moves or fail to sink quick enough. His ball tracking skills are best in vertical situations, shows good body control to high point, adjust to the ball and pounce to attack the football.

Change of Direction Ability - Twitch is littered all throughout his game and whether that comes in speed outs, stop routes, lateral releases vs. press or cutting back against defensive pursuit, he'll make undisciplined defenders look silly with his redirect ability.

Speed - Blazing fast runner who has track speed. One of the fasts game speed players in the class, regardless of position. Playing him off will create a lot of easy separation and catches underneath unless you bracket him. Minimal lag from snap to top speed, quick accelerator, too.

Competitive Toughness - Play strength is suitable to play on the outside but this isn't a player who thrives on winning vs. contact, he's better when you give him more space to work with. Like his effort with the ball in his hands to maximize yardage.

Blocking Ability - Wouldn't plant him on the front side of plays and expect a lot of success escorting defenders out of the way. You'll get just enough disruption to allow a back to slip up inside the boundary defender but length, hand strength and urgency aren't notable here.

---

Best Trait - Vertical Receiving

Worst Trait - Drops

Best Film - WVU (2018)

[Bretsky]

Is Quinten Ceephus more talented than any WR on our roster except for Devante Adams ?

I am also going to really miss the Badger LB's.

[Joemailman]

Is Quinten Ceephus more talented than any WR on our roster except for Devante Adams ?



Certainly. Question is how much the sexual assault charges, even though he was acquitted, will scare teams off.

[texaspackerbacker]

I doubt that will scare anybody. Even Badger fan that I am, I'm not that sold on Cephus being what we need. Oh, he's good all right, but we need a speed burner, more of a deep threat, which I don't think is Cephus's strong suit.

[texaspackerbacker]

Question for various rats, so many of whom have such disdain for our GOAT QB:

If the #12 ranked prospect in the draft happened to fall to us with the 32d pick - oh ok, 31st, 30th, 29, 28, whatever, should we grab him?

That #12 ranked prospect, of course, is Tua Tagovailoa.

[smuggler]

Tua may not enter the draft. Or, he may never be the same.

[Joemailman]

Tua may not enter the draft. Or, he may never be the same.

He will announce Monday whether he is entering the draft.

[run pMc]

Good question re: Tua. I don't watch a ton of CFB so I don't know him that well. I will say that he is on the smaller side for a pro QB and has an injury history, which would be a concern.

[Deputy Nutz]

Tua is about 6'1" 215, I wouldn't call him small, but the hip injury is a concern along with chronic ankle injuries. Most of the time that stuff seems to work itself out when a guy turns pro. If this guy drops to the Packers because of the concerns of his hip, the Packers have to take a long hard look at him at the end of round 1. Rodgers will be 37 next year, his play dropped off this year, but I can't pin point it specifically to his age. The Packers wouldn't be drafting a QB not replace Rodgers right away or push Rodgers out, simply when Rodgers retires there is a cat behind him with a pedigree ready to take the reigns of the franchise.

[Cheesehead Craig]

I'd pass on Tua. He's injury prone and he's gonna miss games in the NFL on a fairly regular basis. I'm still on the don't need to draft Rodgers replacement in the early rounds train still. This team needs more talent at other positions. When we get a new QB, I'd rather the cupboard not be bare.

[Deputy Nutz]

Packers draft needs
Production from the wide receiver position has been down in 2019. I think their is an overall lack of talent and skill at the position. It is nice to see Lazard step up. Lazard was a highly ranked recruit coming out of high school. He was a high 4 star recruit for Iowa St, so he has some talent and it is materializing for the Packers. Its nice to see a guy like Lazard take advantage of the situation in the receivers room. The top end of this draft for receivers is deep. The Alabama guys are intriguing, possibly 3 of them will go in the first round. I could see 6 receivers going in the first round.

https://thedraftnetwork.com/articles/joe-marino-s-2020-nfl-draft-wide-receiver-rankings

I don't put much stock in big boards prior to the combine but it gives you an idea of the talent out there.

Inside linebacker is another need on the defense. The Packers have played with only one inside linebacker all year and Martinez is a crafty player but at the end of the day he just isn't athletic enough to be the one inside linebacker. I don't know if there is going to be one in the first round that will stand out.

https://thedraftnetwork.com/articles/joe-marino-s-2020-nfl-draft-linebacker-rankings

The other area of need is offensive tackle, namely right tackle. Lots of tackles projected as first round picks and it seems like the Packers like to snag offensive linemen at the end of the first round.

https://thedraftnetwork.com/articles/joe-marino-s-2020-nfl-draft-offensive-tackle-rankings

[Deputy Nutz]

I'd pass on Tua. He's injury prone and he's gonna miss games in the NFL on a fairly regular basis. I'm still on the don't need to draft Rodgers replacement in the early rounds train still. This team needs more talent at other positions. When we get a new QB, I'd rather the cupboard not be bare.

The exact opposite thinking has led the Packers to have 28 years of the some of the best QB play in the history of the NFL.

[pbmax]

If he passes physical muster, I'd very much consider taking him.

Packers have front line pass rush and CBs. Can get other parts and developmental people in 2nd round and later.

[Anti-Polar Bear]

Question for various rats, so many of whom have such disdain for our GOAT QB:

If the #12 ranked prospect in the draft happened to fall to us with the 32d pick - oh ok, 31st, 30th, 29, 28, whatever, should we grab him?

That #12 ranked prospect, of course, is Tua Tagovailoa.

I dunno 'bout Nutz, but I like my food spicy, my beer cold, my women hot, my corners dark and my QBs pale.

Give me that Brooks Bollinger clone, you know, the Wisconsin QB (Michael Cohen?), over T-Tago on any given Sunday!

Actually, as someone who supports NFL - and NBA - oddities, I am rooting Tago. And Luka Doncic.

[texaspackerbacker]

Seriously, APB, Coan? I like my QBs to be able to throw the ball farther than I can.

I'm truly uncertain on the Tua thing - that's why I asked the question. I really think there's a strong chance Rodgers plays well into his 40s. On the other hand, this is shaping up to be a very similar scenario to when we drafted him while Favre was still good.

Regarding the injury thing, the Packers have the luxury of waiting on him to be completely healed - as a lot of teams do not. I don't think the hip is gonna be a chronic concern. Isn't that about what Chad Clifton had, and he came back and was effective at a position where there is a lot more hits.

Nutz, I disagree a little bit about Packer needs. The primary one I see is a Kenny Clark level D Lineman. I don't think we need another ILB drafted all that high because we just don't use two on the field all that much. O Line, yes, but not too early in the draft. Wide Receiver yes, but probably second round, not first because there are so many speed burners in this draft. Unless we switch Lazard to TE, we also could use a top level TE fairly early in the draft.

[pbmax]

Seriously, APB, Coan?


https://www.wikihow.com/images/thumb/a/ad/Cast-a-Baitcasting-Reel-Step-11-Version-2.jpg/aid1103305-v4-728px-Cast-a-Baitcasting-Reel-Step-11-Version-2.jpg

[run pMc]

Seriously, APB, Coan? I like my QBs to be able to throw the ball farther than I can.

I'm truly uncertain on the Tua thing - that's why I asked the question. I really think there's a strong chance Rodgers plays well into his 40s. On the other hand, this is shaping up to be a very similar scenario to when we drafted him while Favre was still good.

Regarding the injury thing, the Packers have the luxury of waiting on him to be completely healed - as a lot of teams do not. I don't think the hip is gonna be a chronic concern. Isn't that about what Chad Clifton had, and he came back and was effective at a position where there is a lot more hits.

Nutz, I disagree a little bit about Packer needs. The primary one I see is a Kenny Clark level D Lineman. I don't think we need another ILB drafted all that high because we just don't use two on the field all that much. O Line, yes, but not too early in the draft. Wide Receiver yes, but probably second round, not first because there are so many speed burners in this draft. Unless we switch Lazard to TE, we also could use a top level TE fairly early in the draft.

I think Coan has a LONG way to go to be a game active QB, nevermind a NFL starter.
6'1" is short for an NFL QB, and some short QBs (Brees, Wilson) have succeeded, but it's not easy. OL go about 6'5" on average these days, and they have to be able to see/throw over that (and the DL). So, the size and injury concerns with Tua exist. He could pan out, and maybe worth a shot if he's there at end of R1. Honestly, I could see a Mariota/MLF reunion in GB, with Marcus as the backup until they find the true heir apparent. Who knows.

I agree GB needs another DL to help out Kenny Clark. He's the only dynamic player on the DL they have, and he can't play 80% of the snaps and be healthy/effective. The Capers DL of Pickett, Raji and Jenkins was pretty darn good, and they aren't close to that. Maybe Keke develops and takes M.Adams' snaps; I think M.Adams is what he is at this point: depth.

I think they definitely need someone who can cover TEs and defend the middle of the field. That is a weakness and has been for years. Ibraheim Campbell is nice but I don't think he's the best answer, if there's an ILB available who can run and cover you draft them. Also, Blake's contract is up and I'm ambivalent on paying him big money. He's decent, but hardly worth top 5 ILB money. If he walks you have Burks and Summers, which is to say not much.

WR is a big need, and I just don't see much out of Graham that makes him worth the money either. Lazard is not moving to TE -- he's their #2 WR at this point.

They also need a RT if they don't keep the Bulaga/Veldheer combo.

[Deputy Nutz]

Packers definitely need defensive tackle help, although they only need a rotation of three true defensive tackle/nose type players. They do a lot with their hybrid type players like the Smiths and hopefully Gary down the road, but neither of those three are true 3 tech or 0 tech players. They are edge rushers. Currently they have one true difference maker at the position, so this should be an area of address in the draft or free agency.
https://thedraftnetwork.com/articles/joe-marino-s-2020-nfl-draft-defensive-tackle-rankings

[Cheesehead Craig]

The exact opposite thinking has led the Packers to have 28 years of the some of the best QB play in the history of the NFL.

Back then, 1st round QBs could sit for years. Rodgers was the last 1st round QB to not start in his rookie season. Teams have the best SB window when their QBs are on rookie deals and can play. That way you don't have to blow 10-15% of your cap on QB. College QBs are coming into the league better prepared to play right away as compared to the last time the Pack went looking for a QB.

Your statement is a bit misleading in that they had no real QB established when they traded for Favre and Rodgers fell into their laps when Favre was in his "should I retire" phase. It's not like they've drafted 3-4 QBs during that time.

[Bretsky]

I dunno 'bout Nutz, but I like my food spicy, my beer cold, my women hot, my corners dark and my QBs pale.

Give me that Brooks Bollinger clone, you know, the Wisconsin QB (Michael Cohen?), over T-Tago on any given Sunday!

Actually, as someone who supports NFL - and NBA - oddities, I am rooting Tago. And Luka Doncic.



Some times you post some over the top ridiculous shit

You get an award for this one.

[Deputy Nutz]

Back then, 1st round QBs could sit for years. Rodgers was the last 1st round QB to not start in his rookie season. Teams have the best SB window when their QBs are on rookie deals and can play. That way you don't have to blow 10-15% of your cap on QB. College QBs are coming into the league better prepared to play right away as compared to the last time the Pack went looking for a QB.

Your statement is a bit misleading in that they had no real QB established when they traded for Favre and Rodgers fell into their laps when Favre was in his "should I retire" phase. It's not like they've drafted 3-4 QBs during that time.

I was referring to the drafting of Rodgers, not the drafting of Favre. Rodgers deal was a bargain because he dropped to the 24th pick in 2005. Josh Jacobs was the 24th pick in the 2019 draft and makes about twice that of Rodgers in 2005. Compare the salary cap of 2005 of 85 million to the 2019 salary cap of 2019 of 185 million it doesn't cost a team any more in 2020 to sit a QB, in fact it probably cost less because of the salary structure of the draft slots for rookies. Also Rodgers was not drafted to replace Favre in 2005, Favre was 35 and not getting along with the new front office and was trying to find any angle to bargain for better players around him. He casually mentioned retirement and the Wisconsin media went bananas with it. Ted Thompson took the best player available to them in 2005.

Tua without injury is the #1 QB in this draft. He is a much better NFL prospect than Rodgers in 2005.

[Anti-Polar Bear]

I was referring to the drafting of Rodgers, not the drafting of Favre. Rodgers deal was a bargain because he dropped to the 24th pick in 2005. Josh Jacobs was the 24th pick in the 2019 draft and makes about twice that of Rodgers in 2005. Compare the salary cap of 2005 of 85 million to the 2019 salary cap of 2019 of 185 million it doesn't cost a team any more in 2020 to sit a QB, in fact it probably cost less because of the salary structure of the draft slots for rookies. Also Rodgers was not drafted to replace Favre in 2005, Favre was 35 and not getting along with the new front office and was trying to find any angle to bargain for better players around him. He casually mentioned retirement and the Wisconsin media went bananas with it. Ted Thompson took the best player available to them in 2005.

Tua without injury is the #1 QB in this draft. He is a much better NFL prospect than Rodgers in 2005.

I concede, you sometimes know your QBs. I recall your fondness for Josh Allen and Lamar Jackson. Allen has gotten the Bills into the big dance. Jackson hasn't been moved to WR, so he's probably doing something right.

I, too, am rooting for T-Toga. I support NFL oddities, after all. But what about Mighty Joe Burrow?

Lots of folks believe Burrow is gonna rock the NFL and, thanks to his humble Hiesman speech, annihilate poverty, which is a good fight worth fighting.

[Anti-Polar Bear]

Some times you post some over the top ridiculous shit

You get an award for this one.

I was jotting sarcasticm or, maybe, joking. Not gonna lie, I've only seen Coan play once this year, against Michigan. Looked like Bollinger. I hated Bollinger.

[Joemailman]

It's official. Jonathan Taylor will enter the draft.

Taylor is 30th on this big board. https://thedraftnetwork.com/articles/joe-marino-s-2020-nfl-draft-big-boardpositional-rankings

Aaron Jones and Jamaal Williams are entering the final years of their contracts. If Taylor were available when the Packers pick in he 1st round, should Gutey take him?

[Teamcheez1]

We don’t need to draft a WR after signing Reggie Begelton from the CFL to a futures contract.

[hoosier]

Badger running backs have a very checkered history in the NFL. And no thanks to drafting any RB in the first round.

[call_me_ishmael]

Tua without injury is the #1 QB in this draft. He is a much better NFL prospect than Rodgers in 2005.

You think he's a better prospect than Burrow? Burrow has looked great. I haven't seen enough Tua to have an opinion either way but a statement like this does make me raise my uninformed brow and listen more.

[call_me_ishmael]

Badger running backs have a very checkered history in the NFL. And no thanks to drafting any RB in the first round.

I really thought Melvin Gordon would be a better NFL player. He's so fast, or at least he was in the Big 10, that I figured he'd be special from his speed alone.

[Bretsky]

I was jotting sarcasticm or, maybe, joking. Not gonna lie, I've only seen Coan play once this year, against Michigan. Looked like Bollinger. I hated Bollinger.


Bollinger was way better than Coan

[Bretsky]

It's official. Jonathan Taylor will enter the draft.

Taylor is 30th on this big board. https://thedraftnetwork.com/articles/joe-marino-s-2020-nfl-draft-big-boardpositional-rankings

Aaron Jones and Jamaal Williams are entering the final years of their contracts. If Taylor were available when the Packers pick in he 1st round, should Gutey take him?


A youthful Edge Rusher who can produce is a bigger need than a RB :)))))


In all seriousness, as much as I love JT Green Bay has too many needs to use a 1st on him.

[Bretsky]

Badger running backs have a very checkered history in the NFL. And no thanks to drafting any RB in the first round.


I still kinda think Melvin Gordon was the best Badger RB I have ever seen. I hope JT tears it up in the pros thought and I'm definitely getting him in the NY Auction Fantasy Football League I'm in

[Bretsky]

You think he's a better prospect than Burrow? Burrow has looked great. I haven't seen enough Tua to have an opinion either way but a statement like this does make me raise my uninformed brow and listen more.

I truly interesting question is whether GB would consider Tua if he fell to us in the draft. I think he'll be taken before we pick in round one though

[Bretsky]

I really thought Melvin Gordon would be a better NFL player. He's so fast, or at least he was in the Big 10, that I figured he'd be special from his speed alone.



I think Melvin is a special RB in the NFL. He's a step back from elite but he's really dam good. Stupid call to sit out this year though and it's going to cost him

[pbmax]

It's official. Jonathan Taylor will enter the draft.

Taylor is 30th on this big board. https://thedraftnetwork.com/articles/joe-marino-s-2020-nfl-draft-big-boardpositional-rankings

Aaron Jones and Jamaal Williams are entering the final years of their contracts. If Taylor were available when the Packers pick in he 1st round, should Gutey take him?

No.

[run pMc]

It's official. Jonathan Taylor will enter the draft.

Taylor is 30th on this big board. https://thedraftnetwork.com/articles/joe-marino-s-2020-nfl-draft-big-boardpositional-rankings

Aaron Jones and Jamaal Williams are entering the final years of their contracts. If Taylor were available when the Packers pick in he 1st round, should Gutey take him?

Taylor's a good player, but RBs taken in R1 are unusual these days, and while JT has been durable he's got a lot of carries already and WI RBs have a spotty pro record. I think he lasts until middle of R2.
Jamaal can be resigned to a modest contract, he's just as likely to be replaced by a younger hammerback. I think they were hoping Dexter Williams would be farther along; I wouldn't be surprised if they brought in another late round RB to push him. RBs get hurt so often in the pros it's good to have a few.
Aaron Jones is going to be expensive to resign, although his injury history will affect his asking price a little bit. I'm not sure what they do with him... RBs can be replaced more easily than an above average LT, but GB has so few playmakers and he's becoming the centerpiece of the offense.

[Joemailman]

I agree you don't want to draft a RB 1st round. Just gauging he response from diehard Badger fans. :)

https://thedraftnetwork.com/articles/crabbs--2020-nfl-mock-draft-4.0

This mock draft has the Packers taking a guy I Really like - Jalen Reagor - WR - TCU.

Few other interesting guys:

Vikings taking IDL Javon Kinlaw at #24

Seahawks taking OT Alex Leatherwood at #26

Saints taking QB Jordan Love at #28. Rodgers is about the same age Favre was when they drafted Rodgers. Just sayin...

[Joemailman]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8wem2YdoBdI

Interesting thing about Reagor is that he's only 5-11, but he can go up and catch contested balls.

[Zool]

Taylor's a good player, but RBs taken in R1 are unusual these days, and while JT has been durable he's got a lot of carries already and WI RBs have a spotty pro record. I think he lasts until middle of R2.
Jamaal can be resigned to a modest contract, he's just as likely to be replaced by a younger hammerback. I think they were hoping Dexter Williams would be farther along; I wouldn't be surprised if they brought in another late round RB to push him. RBs get hurt so often in the pros it's good to have a few.
Aaron Jones is going to be expensive to resign, although his injury history will affect his asking price a little bit. I'm not sure what they do with him... RBs can be replaced more easily than an above average LT, but GB has so few playmakers and he's becoming the centerpiece of the offense.

I like this whole assessment but 12 months from now. I think they stand pat this summer at RB.

[Joemailman]

Dexter Williams will get every chance to show he can be the guy of they decide not to resign Jones. He has the talent but his head isn't always where it shoild be.

[esoxx]

Dexter Williams will get every chance to show he can be the guy of they decide not to resign Jones. He has the talent but his head isn't always where it shoild be.

No chance they don't resign Jones.

[RashanGary]

No chance they don't resign Jones.

Yeah. It's a point in Rodgers career and a window for the team too. Jones knows the offense, he's slippery and has balance, vision and speed. He catches, blocks, is a great guy.

[esoxx]

Yeah. It's a point in Rodgers career and a window for the team too. Jones knows the offense, he's slippery and has balance, vision and speed. He catches, blocks, is a great guy.

He scored 19 freakin' touchdowns this season. Think about that and how truly rare that is for a RB nowadays.

Still blows my mind he has received no Pro Bowl or All Pro recognition. At least that will drive his cost down just a little come contract talk time.

[Bretsky]

He scored 19 freakin' touchdowns this season. Think about that and how truly rare that is for a RB nowadays.

Still blows my mind he has received no Pro Bowl or All Pro recognition. At least that will drive his cost down just a little come contract talk time.


I don't get the lack of respect either

Teams don't game plan for Aaron Rodgers anymore

They Game Plan for Aaron Jones

Jamal Williams....sign him...let him go...whatever..........

AARON JONES IS A MUST SIGN

[pbmax]

No chance they don't resign Jones.

I’m with you. Haven’t seen and offense like it would be without Jones.

[texaspackerbacker]

As good as Aaron Jones is, it's generally a mistake to sign a RB long term for a ton of money - and that's probably what it is gonna take to sign him.

We have another year to see if he sustains is good play and if he is all that irreplaceable.

I think it's about 40/60 we sign him to a max contract.

[call_me_ishmael]

I truly interesting question is whether GB would consider Tua if he fell to us in the draft. I think he'll be taken before we pick in round one though

Oh I think they would unquestionably draft him if he's available and scouts think as highly of him as many have suggested. My uninformed opinion is the scouts see what we all see. That ARod never really came back the same guy that ran the table in 2016 from the broken collarbone in 2017.

[call_me_ishmael]

As good as Aaron Jones is, it's generally a mistake to sign a RB long term for a ton of money - and that's probably what it is gonna take to sign him.

We have another year to see if he sustains is good play and if he is all that irreplaceable.

I think it's about 40/60 we sign him to a max contract.

What's a max contract? I think he'll be fairly affordable. He is a playmaker but he is closer to James White than Zeke as far as his role that he excels in. I think he'll get a fair deal this off-season.

[call_me_ishmael]

My hope for the Packers draft is that they can find a Bryan Bulaga 2.0 and a Greg Jennings 2.0 in the second round. If they do that, they'll be in extremely good shape. They need a Greg Jennings so badly in my opinion.

[texaspackerbacker]

Good grief, CMI. Jennings wasn't bad, in fact he was damn good. But he was not a top level WR. I want somebody like DeAndre Hopkins, who looks a lot like Davante Adams except faster and smoother, and I want him in the second round - is that too much to ask hahahaha? Not if we get lucky. Michael Thomas was drafted in the second round, and this is supposedly a better year for WRs. Barring that, I want somebody like Will Fuller who has outstanding speed, but somebody who can stay healthy a lot better - drafted maybe round 4 or 5.

As for getting somebody like Bulaga, yeah if it is maybe 4th or 5th round. I'd rather have somebody like Elgton Jenkins. Bulaga, in addition to the numerous injuries, has the good reputation he has mainly because of Aaron Rodgers' mobility. This year, we can run inside, and it's mostly because Jenkins and Linsley has done so good blocking there. Occasionally, we can go left on an outside zone run, as Bakhtiari blocks well - occasionally. We hardly ever can run outside right. Bulaga this year has improved in pass blocking, but only from crap or mediocre to moderately good.

What's a max contract for a RB? It's a helluva lot and it's way too much. I would say, give Aaron Jones a big contract, but without extreme guaranteed money - maybe $100 million for a nice round figure, for about 6 or 7 years, but with a relatively small signing bonus - maybe $10 million or so. That actually might not be enough to sign him, but any more guaranteed than that, and the team is out on too much of a limb in case of injury or decline in performance - which certainly tends to happen with RBs. Also, I wouldn't be in too big a hurry - like during the season next year or even after - to see if he is as good next year as this year, and to see how D Williams or any other possible drafted replacement plays. Comparing him to James White is an insult to Jones. Quality-wise this season, he has actually been better than White, even though he is a different kind of runner. I'd compare him to a healthy Dalvin Cook, but there has hardly ever been a healthy Dalvin Cook hahahaha.

[pbmax]

I'd be all for another Jennings. Hopkins would be great too.

[RashanGary]

I'd be all for another Jennings. Hopkins would be great too.

Tons of good second round wrs.

Jordy, Jennings, Adams, Thomas, Hopkins and so many more! One or two really tood ones every year it seems.

Deep WR draft... End of round 1 should definitely have a star sitting there, maybe even end of round 2.

[Bretsky]

What's a max contract? I think he'll be fairly affordable. He is a playmaker but he is closer to James White than Zeke as far as his role that he excels in. I think he'll get a fair deal this off-season.



There is a salary cap but I don't think there is a max contract.

James White is a ridiculous comparison; but he's undoubltedly not Zeke either.

He won't be that expensive though. Thinking 6-8 Mil per year. Somebodhy tell me if those numbers are on or insane.

[Joemailman]

There is a salary cap but I don't think there is a max contract.

James White is a ridiculous comparison; but he's undoubltedly not Zeke either.

He won't be that expensive though. Thinking 6-8 Mil per year. Somebodhy tell me if those numbers are on or insane.

#4 RB contract is 13 mil per year. But then it drops down to 8.25 Mil for the #5 RB contract. https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/rankings/average/running-back/ Not sure where Aaron Jones fits in. He was #12 in rushing yards, but #1 in TD's. He may be less expensive than I originally thought.

[Bretsky]

I don't think he's going to try to break the bank. And Green Bay needs him way more than anybody else.

[pbmax]

#4 RB contract is 13 mil per year. But then it drops down to 8.25 Mil for the #5 RB contract. https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/rankings/average/running-back/ Not sure where Aaron Jones fits in. He was #12 in rushing yards, but #1 in TD's. He may be less expensive than I originally thought.

I was gonna guess between $8 and $10 per year. Not top money, but next tier.

[Bretsky]

I was gonna guess between $8 and $10 per year. Not top money, but next tier.


Don't we have some dead money this year still ? Can we just lock his ass up at 8ish ?

[Joemailman]

Don't we have some dead money this year still ? Can we just lock his ass up at 8ish ?

Packers will have the money. They currently are set to head into free agency 37M under the cap. 45M if they cut Graham. 50M if they cut Lane Taylor.

They have about 10M cap space right now.

[Bretsky]

Packers will have the money. They currently are set to head into free agency 37M under the cap. 45M if they cut Graham. 50M if they cut Lane Taylor.

They have about 10M cap space right now.


Can they still use up this year's cap or are they just going to bank the money for expenses ?

Anybody..or you...know if there is a deadline ?

[Joemailman]

Don't we have some dead money this year still ? Can we just lock his ass up at 8ish ?

Whatever cap space they have can be rolled over to next year. If those numbers I had were right, that 10M is part of the 37M they would have when free agency starts.

[pbmax]

Can they still use up this year's cap or are they just going to bank the money for expenses ?

Anybody..or you...know if there is a deadline ?

Deadline has passed to use this years cap. They signed Lucas Patrick and guaranteed Rodgers next year bonuses to push future cap allocations to this year.

[Joemailman]

Tua will enter NFL draft.

[gbgary]

i saw a mock saying ilb or dt should be our pick. i agree. the middle has been an issue all year.
thescore.com/2020-nfl-mock-draft (https://www.thescore.com/ncaaf/news/1918405/2020-nfl-mock-draft-cfp-stars-off-the-board-early-and-often)

[jklowan]

i saw a mock saying ilb or dt should be our pick. i agree. the middle has been an issue all year.
thescore.com/2020-nfl-mock-draft (https://www.thescore.com/ncaaf/news/1918405/2020-nfl-mock-draft-cfp-stars-off-the-board-early-and-often)

I would agree with this

A Defensive Tackle and Dominate middle Linebacker then receiver and O lineman.

Maybe use free agency on a serviceable vet TE

[Joemailman]

Cephus entering the draft.



Quintez Cephus
@QoDeep_87
Thank You Badger Nation ! It’s been a great ride and I’m ready for the next chapter. Thanks for all the support 8️⃣7️⃣

[Fosco33]

Cephus entering the draft.

And JT - no surprise. Cephus seems like a legit good kid. The fact that he’s innocent may cloud his above average skills. I’d take a flyer on him as 4th/5th round with 3rd round talent.

[Joemailman]

For Cephus,the interviews he conducts at The Combine will be more important than the drills he runs.

[pbmax]

And JT - no surprise. Cephus seems like a legit good kid. The fact that he’s innocent may cloud his above average skills. I’d take a flyer on him as 4th/5th round with 3rd round talent.

Innocent is a strong word. He still uploaded that video.

Would suggest not guilty of charged crimes.

[George Cumby]

Innocent is a strong word. He still uploaded that video.

Would suggest not guilty of charged crimes.

I'm OOtL. What did he do?

[Joemailman]

I'm OOtL. What did he do?

Had sex with 2 women. He claimed it was consensual. I believe they claimed they were too intoxicated to give consent. https://madison.com/wsj/news/local/crime-and-courts/ex-badgers-receiver-testifies-at-his-sex-assault-trial-says/article_c5aa0b57-246f-56ea-abe9-b61bc8dbb22e.html

[George Cumby]

And uploaded a video to the internet?

[pbmax]

And uploaded a video to the internet?

My bad. It was a photo he asked Danny Davis to take.

https://fox6now.com/2019/08/02/former-wisconsin-football-player-quintez-cephus-found-not-guilty-of-rape/

[Bretsky]

Innocent is a strong word. He still uploaded that video.

Would suggest not guilty of charged crimes.



He didn't upload any videos

You a Wolverine fan or something ? :))

[Bretsky]

Had sex with 2 women. He claimed it was consensual. I believe they claimed they were too intoxicated to give consent. https://madison.com/wsj/news/local/crime-and-courts/ex-badgers-receiver-testifies-at-his-sex-assault-trial-says/article_c5aa0b57-246f-56ea-abe9-b61bc8dbb22e.html


People that know me would tell you I always assume the guy is guilty; but not this one. Guilty of bad decisions. But we all are.

[Bretsky]

And JT - no surprise. Cephus seems like a legit good kid. The fact that he’s innocent may cloud his above average skills. I’d take a flyer on him as 4th/5th round with 3rd round talent.


be pretty surprised if he's there for us round 4
I'd take him in 3 if he was there; he'd be our 2nd most talented WR

[Joemailman]

be pretty surprised if he's there for us round 4
I'd take him in 3 if he was there; he'd be our 2nd most talented WR

Given all the publicity his case got in Wisconsin, I'd be surprised if the Packers drafted him. The guy could probably use a change of scenery.

[Bretsky]

Given all the publicity his case got in Wisconsin, I'd be surprised if the Packers drafted him. The guy could probably use a change of scenery.


If our brass did their due diligence they would know that he was a leader within the locker room of that team. Then again, that's what I said a few years ago when we got stuck with the King Biegel

[texaspackerbacker]

He was an excellent college receiver, and I wish he had stuck around, but I really don't think he would help the Packers. We have a glut of receivers like him now - big but not overly fast. We need somebody faster who also can catch - is that too much to ask for?

[run pMc]

I think they pass on Cephus because of the local press coverage. The kid from Minnesota might get a long look though. Either one would likely be the 2nd most talented WR on the roster. They have Adams and a bunch of Day3/UDFAs, which isn't going to cut it.
Even Favre struggled when they had to play Taco Wallace.

As for A.Jones, I wonder if 4y/30M is ballpark? He's 26 and has an injury history.

[call_me_ishmael]

Let's say Tua is sitting there at 5, and you think he is going to be really good.

1. The team at 5 calls and says "we'll give you Tua for a #2 and Aaron". Do you do it?
2. The team at 5 calls and says "we'll give you Tua for #1, #2, #3 and next year's #2". Do you do it?

If Tua really is the guy with the golden arm and a future star, I think you have to do it. I'd try to do the #1 scenario, personally.

[MadScientist]

Let's say Tua is sitting there at 5, and you think he is going to be really good.

1. The team at 5 calls and says "we'll give you Tua for a #2 and Aaron". Do you do it?
2. The team at 5 calls and says "we'll give you Tua for #1, #2, #3 and next year's #2". Do you do it?

If Tua really is the guy with the golden arm and a future star, I think you have to do it. I'd try to do the #1 scenario, personally.

The #1 option would trigger a 40M cap hit. I don't think that would be possible to absorb.
The #2 option would be a brutal hit to affordable production for the next 3-5 years, especially for a guy who will sit for 1-2 years. If he somehow slid to 32 and there was no other first round talent, then sure.

[pbmax]

No. No sure thing with a rookie QB even high in first round. Yo Gabbert Gabbert, Trubinski, Mayfield. You draft one you can develop without selling your soul.

Wolf didn't trade a #1 pick AND Majik.

[RashanGary]

End of round 1 is loaded with good safeties, receivers, corners, interior OL, and high upside DL like Clark who need development.

Its a good year for corners and receivers. I could see one of those.

If it's a corner, you move Alexander to Tramons spot and the secondary is still young but at least it's ridiculously fast and talented l

[RashanGary]

Lazard should be better next year. As should Tonyan and Sternberger. But still, a receiver is a need. Preferably a very fast one to take MVS role.

[texaspackerbacker]

Lazard is damn good already, and yes, he should get better - especially if we get a speed receiver to spread things out more. Tonyan is ok, but I'm not sure he has a very high ceiling - Kittle or Kelce he likely ain't (although Lazard at TE just might me). Sternberger has absolutely stunk, so he couldn't possibly not get better - how much is the question. I wouldn't count on him being a real stand out either, but who knows. Valdez-Scantling IMO has the highest ceiling because of his speed and size. How likely he is to fulfill that potential is anybody's guess, though.

For next season, as I've said a lot of times, Lazard should be switched to TE. So that leaves spots at WR for Adams, MVS, and Kumerow. St. Brown is coming back and probably should get a spot. A lot of people including me would like to see Allison gone. Grant is basically worthless. So adding St. Brown and subtracting Allison and Grant, that is just 4 WRs. Draft a speed burner about the second round, and that still leaves one spot this Begelton guy or maybe Shepherd or maybe another lower round draft pick. If Lazard switches to TE, we would also likely keep Tonyan and Sternberger. I'm assuming Graham is gone and maybe Lewis also, although it's not out of the question to keep 4 TEs.

[RashanGary]

Lazard is damn good already, and yes, he should get better - especially if we get a speed receiver to spread things out more. Tonyan is ok, but I'm not sure he has a very high ceiling - Kittle or Kelce he likely ain't (although Lazard at TE just might me). Sternberger has absolutely stunk, so he couldn't possibly not get better - how much is the question. I wouldn't count on him being a real stand out either, but who knows. Valdez-Scantling IMO has the highest ceiling because of his speed and size. How likely he is to fulfill that potential is anybody's guess, though.

For next season, as I've said a lot of times, Lazard should be switched to TE. So that leaves spots at WR for Adams, MVS, and Kumerow. St. Brown is coming back and probably should get a spot. A lot of people including me would like to see Allison gone. Grant is basically worthless. So adding St. Brown and subtracting Allison and Grant, that is just 4 WRs. Draft a speed burner about the second round, and that still leaves one spot this Begelton guy or maybe Shepherd or maybe another lower round draft pick. If Lazard switches to TE, we would also likely keep Tonyan and Sternberger. I'm assuming Graham is gone and maybe Lewis also, although it's not out of the question to keep 4 TEs.

I wouldn't complain about this Tex. Lazard is lean for a TE and does seem to have just enough get up and go to play WR.

I think Lazard stays put, but I see the possibility too.

[Cleft Crusty]

If Lazard switches to TE, we would also likely keep Tonyan and Sternberger. I'm assuming Graham is gone and maybe Lewis also, although it's not out of the question to keep 4 TEs.

I don't think there is any reason to believe they will switch Lazard to TE. Certainly in camp they could see how he stands up in pass pro to speed rushers or to run blocking OLB and DEs, which is what makes TEs actually TEs, and not glorified WRs. But he's really not that large, and he doesn't have the anchor of an in line blocker, even though his blocking technique is pretty good. So I don't see it, but I do see Sternberger being much stronger next year, and also see him improving on his 100% drop rate. Tonyan can block and is a reliable pass catcher, if not elusive as a route runner. He can be an Ed West type. Marcedes may be at the end, but he's in such good physical condition that I could see them bringing him back - his blocking is totally reliable.

[RashanGary]

That's reasonable cleft. Tonyan probably becomes our new Mercedes. Sternberger our new Graham. Would be nice if one fell to us. We just don't have a good TE under the age of 33 on the roster next year.

But those two young guys had ideal training environment with two of the best tight ends of the last decade in front of them paving the way. They should be serviceable in years 2 and 3.

[RashanGary]

To me, because our cap is so tight, we need to move on from Tramon, Graham, Mercedes and maybe even Bulaga. Light looks dependable. I can't picture paying 10M for 31 year old Bulaga when you have a guy who's almost free and is servicable.

Clark, Martinez, Aaron Jones, King and others should get the money, not the old guys

[texaspackerbacker]

I'd say also that it's a long shot that Lazard is actually designated as a TE. I expect, though, that he get's used more like a TE. What I stated above presumed 6 WRs and 3-4 TEs. If Lazard takes up what is designated as a WR spot, likely we would keep 7 WRs and only 2-3 TEs. Arguably, Lewis has been the best of a lame group of TEs on the roster this season, so maybe he does stay.

[Joemailman]

Why are people dismissing Sternberger? He's a talented guy whose rookie season was sidetracked by injuries. I'll be surprised if he's not a pretty big part of the offense next year.

[texaspackerbacker]

I wouldn't dismiss him, but he's been just plain awful this season. It's gonna take pretty extreme improvement for him just to get to average. He was a 3rd round pick, I think, though, so who knows, maybe he is better than he seems.

[RashanGary]

Why are people dismissing Sternberger? He's a talented guy whose rookie season was sidetracked by injuries. I'll be surprised if he's not a pretty big part of the offense next year.

TEs take a little time. I'm holding out judgement on him until next year at soonest and really year 3 is when I'd give up if he doesn't start to look like a player.

[Sparkey]

CFL all-star Reggie Begelton will hopefully add something next year.

[Cleft Crusty]

Don't forget the Looney TE experiment, no pun intended, and Evan Baylis is still lurking around as well.

[call_me_ishmael]

The #1 option would trigger a 40M cap hit. I don't think that would be possible to absorb.
The #2 option would be a brutal hit to affordable production for the next 3-5 years, especially for a guy who will sit for 1-2 years. If he somehow slid to 32 and there was no other first round talent, then sure.

If you want a star QB, you gotta pony up or suck. Tua ain't droppin' that far.

[Zool]

To me, because our cap is so tight, we need to move on from Tramon, Graham, Mercedes and maybe even Bulaga. Light looks dependable. I can't picture paying 10M for 31 year old Bulaga when you have a guy who's almost free and is servicable.

Clark, Martinez, Aaron Jones, King and others should get the money, not the old guys

I agree with all but Lewis. He's making 2.1 this year and made 2.1 last year. Having a 6th lineman who can catch is pretty useful at times and he's cheap.

[pbmax]

To me, because our cap is so tight, we need to move on from Tramon, Graham, Mercedes and maybe even Bulaga. Light looks dependable. I can't picture paying 10M for 31 year old Bulaga when you have a guy who's almost free and is servicable.


The presence of Veldheer argues against reading this confidence about Light. Unless he is hurt and I have forgotten it.

Veldheer and Patrick were active for Week 17. Light and Leglue were inactive.

[RashanGary]

The presence of Veldheer argues against reading this confidence about Light. Unless he is hurt and I have forgotten it.

Vehldeer is 32 and a really good player. I suspect he took a steroid hiatus and got himself in tip top shape. Gutey being a thorough dude couldn't resist. But it's possible it was due to lack of confidence. I haven't ruled it completely out

[run pMc]

I will be surprised if they keep Graham -- he's ok, but I don't see production worth the contract. His speed is gone, and he isn't special in the RZ anymore. He's a fighter and his blocking has improved but is still not good, and it looks like his legs are gone.
I think they can get the same production elsewhere, and draft another TE or even a replacement for Vitale who can play the Kyle Juszczyk FB role (blocking, receiving). I had high hopes for Vitale but they barely use him (injuries, etc.). John Kuhn he apparently ain't.

Lewis is cheap and reliable, and he can block. I actually don't think Sternberger has been that bad -- he's at least as good at blocking as Tonyan, but the injuries really set him back in understanding the offense and where Rodgers wants/expects him to be on pass routes. He needs to get stronger, immerse himself in the playbook and stay healthy. Tonyan I feel like is more or less maxed out to who he is at this point, a #3 or #2 TE at best. He'll have a great block one play and then a whiff or run a sh_tty route the next.

Lazard will stay at WR. Crusty is right about not having the anchor even if he has grit. He's better off as a #3 WR paired with Adams and some other shifty WR not currently on the roster who can separate and run good routes. St. Brown and MVS round out the 5 WRs, and they keep a 6th. Don't think MLF keeps 7 WRs - they have 6 on the 53 now (counting Grant) and I think the MLF likes TEs. Allison, Kumerow, Begelton, et al. fight for that last spot if they are around. I'm not sure I'd bring G-Mo back. He does some things that don't show up on the stat sheet, but he's had a pretty dreadful year and is replaceable. Same with Kumerow -- if he's so great and Rodgers likes him, why doesn't he get more snaps or targets?

[run pMc]

The presence of Veldheer argues against reading this confidence about Light. Unless he is hurt and I have forgotten it.

Veldheer and Patrick were active for Week 17. Light and Leglue were inactive.

I'd take Veldheer over Light, especially when jockeying for playoff spot in the last quarter of the regular season. Light has some potential but he's no Bulaga. He had some struggles. The live reps will help him and they can keep developing him as a backup but I wouldn't want him starting for 16+ games.

Actually I wouldn't want either Light or Veldheer starting for a full season, but I'd feel a lot better about playing Veldheer for 4 game stretch.

Figuring out their starting RT for 2020 season will be very important. Bulaga is 30 years old, but is seems like he's 36.

[pbmax]

I will be surprised if they keep Graham -- he's ok, but I don't see production worth the contract. His speed is gone, and he isn't special in the RZ anymore. He's a fighter and his blocking has improved but is still not good, and it looks like his legs are gone.
I think they can get the same production elsewhere, and draft another TE or even a replacement for Vitale who can play the Kyle Juszczyk FB role (blocking, receiving). I had high hopes for Vitale but they barely use him (injuries, etc.). John Kuhn he apparently ain't.



I can't believe I am saying this because he needs to go, but if they don't choose to go UFA on offense, I can see Graham staying for year 3 of that deal.

[Cleft Crusty]

I actually don't think Sternberger has been that bad -- he's at least as good at blocking as Tonyan, but the injuries really set him back in understanding the offense and where Rodgers wants/expects him to be on pass routes. He needs to get stronger, immerse himself in the playbook and stay healthy.

It's really a shame he got hurt, because Flower is working him into the offense (about 10-20 plays/game) and you can see that he's a willing, athletic, and mostly technically gifted blocker. From the preseason, you could see that he's a decent route runner and bendy for a TE. I was joking about his drop rate - it is 100%, but he's only had on pass thrown to him and it was low an behind him in the end zone. Something has to be done about Rodgers throwing low and behind to large, tall, TEs. (I have a theory that it is an intentional, lower INT risk strategy that Rodgers has adopted. Sure, lower passes to TEs over the middle are less likely to be intercepted, but they are also less likely to be caught and sprung for big plays). If Sternberger had remained healthy though, I suspect he would be a much bigger part of the offense right now. Too bad.

[Cleft Crusty]

I can't believe I am saying this because he needs to go, but if they don't choose to go UFA on offense, I can see Graham staying for year 3 of that deal.

no

[Deputy Nutz]

You think he's a better prospect than Burrow? Burrow has looked great. I haven't seen enough Tua to have an opinion either way but a statement like this does make me raise my uninformed brow and listen more.


Really good question. I think Tua had some amazing wide receivers around him, mightbe the most talented group of receivers any college has ever had. I think I would obviously take Burrow now, but without injury, Tua and Burrows would be 1a, and 1b. Burrows looks like he can run an NFL offense from day one, and Tua might be a better overall athlete before the injury. Tua reminds me of a slightly bigger version of Russell Wilson.

[Deputy Nutz]

Lazard is damn good already, and yes, he should get better - especially if we get a speed receiver to spread things out more. Tonyan is ok, but I'm not sure he has a very high ceiling - Kittle or Kelce he likely ain't (although Lazard at TE just might me). Sternberger has absolutely stunk, so he couldn't possibly not get better - how much is the question. I wouldn't count on him being a real stand out either, but who knows. Valdez-Scantling IMO has the highest ceiling because of his speed and size. How likely he is to fulfill that potential is anybody's guess, though.

For next season, as I've said a lot of times, Lazard should be switched to TE. So that leaves spots at WR for Adams, MVS, and Kumerow. St. Brown is coming back and probably should get a spot. A lot of people including me would like to see Allison gone. Grant is basically worthless. So adding St. Brown and subtracting Allison and Grant, that is just 4 WRs. Draft a speed burner about the second round, and that still leaves one spot this Begelton guy or maybe Shepherd or maybe another lower round draft pick. If Lazard switches to TE, we would also likely keep Tonyan and Sternberger. I'm assuming Graham is gone and maybe Lewis also, although it's not out of the question to keep 4 TEs.

You can't move a guy who has played unattached his whole life to tight end and ask him to block DEs and linebackers in a zone blocking scheme. He would get mauled in pass pro and demolished in the run game. I like how LaFluer uses his receivers with motion and then like an interior crack block, its sorta groovy.

[Deputy Nutz]

Let's say Tua is sitting there at 5, and you think he is going to be really good.

1. The team at 5 calls and says "we'll give you Tua for a #2 and Aaron". Do you do it?
2. The team at 5 calls and says "we'll give you Tua for #1, #2, #3 and next year's #2". Do you do it?

If Tua really is the guy with the golden arm and a future star, I think you have to do it. I'd try to do the #1 scenario, personally.

You don't trade your golden goose for potential. Adding a player like Tua would be a making sure the cupboard is stocked for the future.

[texaspackerbacker]

You can't move a guy who has played unattached his whole life to tight end and ask him to block DEs and linebackers in a zone blocking scheme. He would get mauled in pass pro and demolished in the run game. I like how LaFluer uses his receivers with motion and then like an interior crack block, its sorta groovy.

That makes sense about pass protection, although chipping outside pass rusher shouldn't be that much of a stretch for a hybrid TE/WR. He already does a good job blocking linemen and LBs in the run game. I also agree with you about that legal version of a crackback.

The implication of calling him a TE or not is roster spots. I'd like to see 6 WRs on the roster other than Lazard. Using him more like a TE mostly in the middle of the field, and less like a WR trying to outrun cover Corners seems to make sense.

Getting a speed burner wideout would make things better regardless of how Lazard is used.

[pbmax]

That makes sense about pass protection, although chipping outside pass rusher shouldn't be that much of a stretch for a hybrid TE/WR. He already does a good job blocking linemen and LBs in the run game. I also agree with you about that legal version of a crackback.

The implication of calling him a TE or not is roster spots. I'd like to see 6 WRs on the roster other than Lazard. Using him more like a TE mostly in the middle of the field, and less like a WR trying to outrun cover Corners seems to make sense.

Getting a speed burner wideout would make things better regardless of how Lazard is used.

Calling him a TE for roster purposes just leaves you short an in-line blocker in favor of another WR body.

[texaspackerbacker]

There's plenty of roster room for either 7 WRs and 3 TEs or 6 WRs and 4 TEs. Besides, I say again, the few plays he would be kept in for pass protection, it's not that much to expect him to successfully chip or cut an outside rusher. That's less of an accomplishment than a RB blocking an inside or outside pass rusher who gets past the O Line.

[run pMc]

I thought MVS was our speed burner.

[texaspackerbacker]

He is, but he hasn't proven to be good enough - it helps to be able to catch the ball. It wouldn't hurt to have more than one too.

[pbmax]

I thought MVS was our speed burner.

Its the old conundrum, if you could put Lazard's tenacity into MVS physical skill set, you'd really have something.

But this kind of work is mostly illegal these days.

[Zool]

Its the old conundrum, if you could put Lazard's tenacity into MVS physical skill set, you'd really have something.

But this kind of work is mostly illegal these days.

Did MVS trade arms with Lowry?

[pbmax]

Did MVS trade arms with Lowry?

Possibly.

Though my working theory was that Lowry was just spending his off time hanging from a chin-up bar.


https://bradybunchreviewed.files.wordpress.com/2017/10/featured.jpg

[smuggler]

He's a bit inexperienced, but the LSU inside backer Patrick Queen looks like the kind of rangy player we could use in Green and Gold.

Dude is listed as a 6th round prospect, but looks like the kind of player that could be a day-two type. Might need to play '20 in college.

[Joemailman]

He's a bit inexperienced, but the LSU inside backer Patrick Queen looks like the kind of rangy player we could use in Green and Gold.

Dude is listed as a 6th round prospect, but looks like the kind of player that could be a day-two type. Might need to play '20 in college.

Lot of people talking about him after Monday Night. Underclassmen have to declare for draft by Jan 17. He would likely be higher than a 6th round pick if he declares.

[wthigoot]

Narcissistic bump - my first thread is dying. :-)
How about a new never too early mock?

1 - Davis, Raekwon - DT - 6-7 - 312 - Alabama
2 - Pittman, Michael - WR - 6-4 - 225 - Southern California
3 - Phillips, Jacob - ILB - 6-4 - 229 - Utah State
4 - Cleveland, Ezra - OT - 6-6 - 310 - Boise State
5 - Wilcox, Mitchell - TE - 6-5 - 245 - South Florida
6 - Stenberg, Logan - OG - 6-6 - 322 - Kentucky
6 - Davis, Javaris - CB - 5-10 - 180 - Auburn
7 - Dorn,Myles - S - 6-2 - 205 - North Carolina
7 - Knipp, Jacob - QB - 6-4 - 218 - Northern Colorado
7 - Vaughn, Ke'Shawn - RB - 5-10 - 218 - Vanderbilt

Bad timing, no reason to care about this now. Packers stay close on Sunday and win it late. KC vs GB, repeat of Super Bowl #1 - with same result.

[texaspackerbacker]

In case anybody is interested, the East West Shrine game is 2pm tomorrow and the NFLPA Collegiate Bowl 6pm tomorrow, both on the NFL Network. The Senior Bowl is next Saturday Jan. 25 at 1:30 pm also on the NFL Network.

[Anti-Polar Bear]

Really good question. I think Tua had some amazing wide receivers around him, mightbe the most talented group of receivers any college has ever had. I think I would obviously take Burrow now, but without injury, Tua and Burrows would be 1a, and 1b. Burrows looks like he can run an NFL offense from day one, and Tua might be a better overall athlete before the injury. Tua reminds me of a slightly bigger version of Russell Wilson.

The more films I watch - and by films, I meant YouTube clips - of Burrow, the more Matt Flynn I see in him.

Burrow has a noodle arm, according to YouTube. At best, he’s Flynn. At worst, he’s Brian Brohm.

[Cheesehead Craig]

The more films I watch - and by films, I meant YouTube clips - of Burrow, the more Matt Flynn I see in him.

Burrow has a noodle arm, according to YouTube. At best, he’s Flynn. At worst, he’s Brian Brohm.

He throws one of the prettiest deep balls you'll see. Noodle arm lol.

[run pMc]

Burrow's arm is strong enough. It'll get stronger with pro S&C. He'll go #1 or 2, depending on what happens with Chase Young.

Curious about Isaiah Simmons -- I hear he could go top 10, but he'd be an amazing piece instead of Ibraheim Campbell IMO.

[Guiness]

Back then, 1st round QBs could sit for years. Rodgers was the last 1st round QB to not start in his rookie season. Teams have the best SB window when their QBs are on rookie deals and can play. That way you don't have to blow 10-15% of your cap on QB. College QBs are coming into the league better prepared to play right away as compared to the last time the Pack went looking for a QB.

Your statement is a bit misleading in that they had no real QB established when they traded for Favre and Rodgers fell into their laps when Favre was in his "should I retire" phase. It's not like they've drafted 3-4 QBs during that time.

No reason a first round QB could not sit today. The Chiefs let Mahomes sit pretty much his entire rookie season, only getting a start the final week of the season in a meaningless game.

Truth is teams spending a 1st rounder on a QB probably don't have a qb beyond a washed up journeyman, so when the loosing starts, pressure to play him builds. I don't know if Daniel Jones will turn out to be any good, but I'm pretty sure he'd be better off if they'd kept trotting Eli out every week this year.

[Guiness]

I agree with all but Lewis. He's making 2.1 this year and made 2.1 last year. Having a 6th lineman who can catch is pretty useful at times and he's cheap.

+1

He's been healthy, a reliable blocker and has chipped in some key catches. Luxury automobile is more than welcome back at that price.

[Guiness]

The presence of Veldheer argues against reading this confidence about Light. Unless he is hurt and I have forgotten it.

Veldheer and Patrick were active for Week 17. Light and Leglue were inactive.

I'm pretty sure I read Light was a healthy scratch against Seattle, meaning Veldheer got the nod.

Veldheer wasn't quite a Barney Fuckdoggle (too many starts under his belt), but dammit I'm happy a guy that was not on the radar a month ago was out there last Sunday

[Joemailman]

Curious about Isaiah Simmons -- I hear he could go top 10, but he'd be an amazing piece instead of Ibraheim Campbell IMO.

Simmons officially declared foe the draft. But yes, he's likely top 10. Best ILB in the draft.


He's a bit inexperienced, but the LSU inside backer Patrick Queen looks like the kind of rangy player we could use in Green and Gold.

Dude is listed as a 6th round prospect, but looks like the kind of player that could be a day-two type. Might need to play '20 in college.
This board now has Patrick Queen as a late 1st/early 2nd round pick. https://thedraftnetwork.com/articles/2020-nfl-draft-big-board-rankings-december-solak

[Joemailman]

Packers will pick 30th.

Past 30th picks:

2015: Damarious Randall
1997: Ross Verba

[red]

we need, in no order

wr
o-line
pass catching TE
ILB that can cover
more CBs, tramon can't play forever, and we need to get rid of king
more fat guys for the d-line never hurts
a-rods replacement

so i'm looking at those positions for #30

[pbmax]

The offense needs attention but so does the defense. Cannot have a heavy draft only on one side unless they go for two bigger names in FA.

[call_me_ishmael]

If I'm the Packers, this is what my off-season looks like:

1. First three draft picks have to be an OT, DL and WR. The goal of the rest is finding a bigger center and bigger guard.
2. Resign Bulaga for three years but be structure deal so it's cap neutral for year 3.
3. Make a decision with Baconator. Either gotta slim down and play OLB at -10-15 lbs, or bulk up and be a DE.
4. Find a serviceable receiver in free agency
5. Figure out what to do at MLB.

[Deputy Nutz]

Simmons officially declared foe the draft. But yes, he's likely top 10. Best ILB in the draft.


This board now has Patrick Queen as a late 1st/early 2nd round pick. https://thedraftnetwork.com/articles/2020-nfl-draft-big-board-rankings-december-solak

Simmons is weird combination of strong safety and inside linebacker. Great development at Clemson, went from a 2 star to a top ten draft pick.

Obviously the NFL is still a passing league, but as more teams watch the 49ers and Titans run wild in the Playoffs, the copycats will come in droves. Teams like the Packers have built defenses into clamping down on the pass and simply don't have the personnel to attack heavy run schemes.

The key to the NFL is a getting the most dynamic balanced team possible in a 3-5 year window to win a Super Bowl.

[mraynrand]

The key to the NFL is a getting the most dynamic balanced team possible in a 3-5 year window to win a Super Bowl.

or cheat

[mraynrand]

The offense needs attention but so does the defense. Cannot have a heavy draft only on one side unless they go for two bigger names in FA.

I firmly believe Summers and Burks will be all pro ILBs next year.
-Tex

[texaspackerbacker]

Don't misquote me you half assed sonofabitch.

[mraynrand]

Don't misquote me you half assed sonofabitch.

-Tex

I'm offended. only half?

[Anti-Polar Bear]

He throws one of the prettiest deep balls you'll see. Noodle arm lol.

Pretty? Burrow throws lots of wobbling bombs. In the NFL, wobblers cause picks.

True, when he was sexually assaulting college chicks and conspiring to blame black athletes for said misdeeds while at Tennessee, P-Mann threw wobblers too. Got rid of the disorder after his rookie season via a mechanic overhaul. Perhaps Burrow could, too.

Still, Burrow looks more like Flynn than Manning. Then again, after a nice workout, I look hot in one mirror and fat in another. Looks are illusions. Guess time will tell the tale of a forgotten tail named Burrow.

[Deputy Nutz]

My first few glances at the 2020 draft tells me that this class is weak on offensive tackles, which is an issue because the free agent class of tackles is pretty poor as well. If one of the top 2 or 3 tackles drop to the Packers regardless who is on the Board at WR, LB, and DL the Packers will need to pull the trigger on the offensive tackle.

I know APB, you don't draft linemen at the front end of the draft. I here you, but keeping Rodgers up right is becoming more and more of an issue as he doesn't do as good of a job doing it on his own anymore.

If I was the GM the Tackle I would target would be Jack Conklin from Tennessee. He knows Lafluer's system. It might cost a few bucks, but I think it would be worth it in the long run.

[Anti-Polar Bear]

My first few glances at the 2020 draft tells me that this class is weak on offensive tackles, which is an issue because the free agent class of tackles is pretty poor as well. If one of the top 2 or 3 tackles drop to the Packers regardless who is on the Board at WR, LB, and DL the Packers will need to pull the trigger on the offensive tackle.

I know APB, you don't draft linemen at the front end of the draft. I here you, but keeping Rodgers up right is becoming more and more of an issue as he doesn't do as good of a job doing it on his own anymore.

If I was the GM the Tackle I would target would be Jack Conklin from Tennessee. He knows Lafluer's system. It might cost a few bucks, but I think it would be worth it in the long run.

Agree with you in that Rodgers is no longer the drop back, scramble around for 7 seconds, launch TD QB he was in his youth. If he wanna be starting into his 40, he's gonna have to morph into a productive pocket passer.

However, Packers' history of drafting Yokozuna OTs with late 1st rounders has been ugly. Sherrod, Micheles, Verba, Bulaga (injury-prone), etc., were ugly. What's the saying? Ignore history and you're bound to fuck up again. On a side note, pimps like Clifton, Taush, Bak, etc., weren't 1st rounders.

Go WR, WR, WR with the first 3 picks. Pocket Passer Rodgers needs Wu-Tang WRs more than he needs a RT. Plus, the Packers have wasted enough premium draft resources on defensive busts.

[texaspackerbacker]

You stumbled onto an acorn of truth, APB. Drafting O Tackles in the first round generally is a crap shoot, especially for the Packers, but for most teams. I had been thinking we needed several O Linemen between about the 3rd and 6th round. Having Veldheer look fairly decent and having Lucas Patrick seem worthy of signing makes the need for back ups less obvious. I'd still like to get one good Elgton Jenkins quality guy around the 4th, 3rd, or maybe 2nd round. A lot of times, quality in college or lack of it doesn't translate to quality in the NFL or lack of it with O Linemen.

We also don't need more than hitting on one quality speed burner WR - a Tyreek Hill clone is what I want. Duvernay in the second or third round might be that.

As for the first round pick, I still want a Kenny Clark level D Lineman. If not that, I'll give a longshot position pick: if there is a really sure thing shutdown Corner, we could certainly use him.

Any of the above we do not get in the draft, hopefully Gutekunst will address in free agency. One of the primary reasons the Packers had the season they had this year was his departure from the anti-free agency stance of Ted Thompson. Hopefully, he keeps that up.

[Deputy Nutz]

When you are drafting at the end of the draft there are no sure fire shut down corners, receivers, edge rushers, or QBS. I would say there aren't too many sure fire picks in the draft anyways but at the end of the first round you are either reaching, or taking a guy that would've gone sooner if not for some type of concern. The value at the end of the round is usually with offensive linemen (interior), Linebackers, Safeties, running backs, and tight ends

[Smidgeon]

When you are drafting at the end of the draft there are no sure fire shut down corners, receivers, edge rushers, or QBS. I would say there aren't too many sure fire picks in the draft anyways but at the end of the first round you are either reaching, or taking a guy that would've gone sooner if not for some type of concern. The value at the end of the round is usually with offensive linemen (interior), Linebackers, Safeties, running backs, and tight ends

In theory, for some of those positions, GB could be in a decent place already: RB (Jones and however you feel about the Williamses), S (Savage), and TE (Sternberger) all have someone who could turn into someone or who did.

[pbmax]

Arash Markazi @ArashMarkazi
The stage for the 2020 NFL Draft in Las Vegas will be on the water at the Fountains of Bellagio. The players will be transported to the stage by boat.


https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EO0yJWkUEAY0U86?format=jpg&name=small


GOOD, I CAN DO SOMETHING ELSE WITH MY NIGHT SINCE I WON'T BE WATCHING THIS

[pbmax]

Recognize someone in this picture?


https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EO5bibtU0AA4eT9?format=jpg&name=4096x4096

[Zool]

Alexander in that sweet red suit

[George Cumby]

As a casual fan with limited football smarts and no time to watch college football and certainly less time to do any other research, it is my well thought out opinion that the Packers should draft as many big, fast, athletic, savvy Gud football players at as many positions of need as they can.

But I admittedly know fuck all.

[RashanGary]

ILB and DL was exposed by SF. Between FA and Draft, we need that covered.

[mraynrand]

Arash Markazi @ArashMarkazi
The stage for the 2020 NFL Draft in Las Vegas will be on the water at the Fountains of Bellagio. The players will be transported to the stage by boat.


https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EO0yJWkUEAY0U86?format=jpg&name=small


GOOD, I CAN DO SOMETHING ELSE WITH MY NIGHT SINCE I WON'T BE WATCHING THIS

If Evel Knievel jumped over that stage, It would be the best draft night ever.

[run pMc]

If Evel Knievel jumped over that stage, It would be the best draft night ever.

QFT

Also -- transported by boat? Isn't that going to take like 20 minutes to go round trip and get these guys on/off the boat? Will Goodell be the captain?
What NFL methhead owes some Vegas mobsters money to think this is a good idea? Do they not know Vegas is in the desert?

If nobody jumps the stage, I kind of hope a throng of Philly fans show up and throw garbage at Goodell and the boat.
Or a streaker jumps in and swims around. Imagine the fat security guys trying to fish him out with a net.

[George Cumby]

The boat thing is really weird.

Really Weird.

REALLY. WEIRD.

My hope is the Vikings picks will also have coke and strippers on the boat with them.

[RashanGary]

Conspiracy red flag. No good reason for this strange boat setup . Mind fuckery

[Deputy Nutz]

Too Early mock draft, Computer Generated, except for the Packers pick which was User Picked
https://thedraftnetwork.com/mockdraft

30th Pick, Round 1
Kenneth Murray Jr LB Oklahoma
I have actually watched a little bit of film on him and he flies around the field. He has speed and instinct.

62nd Pick Round 2
Justin Jefferson WR LSU
Fluid route runner that understands where to attack zone coverage. He wasn't high recruit and had to figure out how to be better than some really talented corners in the SEC.

94th Pick Round 3
Jalen Hurts QB Oklahoma
Good to great arm strength, top 3 athlete at the position, may be a little to hasty with his reads and will rely on his athleticism to make premature decisions. I think it is great value for the upside in 3 to 4 years.

126th pick Round 4
Ezra Cleveland OT Boise St
Athletic build and movement, needs to develop more.

157th Pick Round 5
Davon Hamilton DT Ohio State
Big athletic body that can move, but lacks overall production.

Didn't bother with the 6th and 7th round

[beveaux1]

Too Early mock draft, Computer Generated, except for the Packers pick which was User Picked
https://thedraftnetwork.com/mockdraft

30th Pick, Round 1
Kenneth Murray Jr LB Oklahoma
I have actually watched a little bit of film on him and he flies around the field. He has speed and instinct.

62nd Pick Round 2
Justin Jefferson WR LSU
Fluid route runner that understands where to attack zone coverage. He wasn't high recruit and had to figure out how to be better than some really talented corners in the SEC.

94th Pick Round 3
Jalen Hurts QB Oklahoma
Good to great arm strength, top 3 athlete at the position, may be a little to hasty with his reads and will rely on his athleticism to make premature decisions. I think it is great value for the upside in 3 to 4 years.

126th pick Round 4
Ezra Cleveland OT Boise St
Athletic build and movement, needs to develop more.

157th Pick Round 5
Davon Hamilton DT Ohio State
Big athletic body that can move, but lacks overall production.

Didn't bother with the 6th and 7th round

Love your top two picks. Hope we can get them.

[Cheesehead Craig]

Murray is a favorite amongst the mock sites for the Pack.

[yetisnowman]

Henry Ruggs III. 6'0 190. Great hands, quick twitch, breakaway speed. Lined up in all different kinds of formations. He'll probably be gone by 30 but I would love a trade up to get him. I know everyone will call that crazy. But we are so bad at drafting defensive players, it makes a lot of sense to me. We have to throw some goddamn ammo at top level offensive talent. Take a shot during Aaron's twilight. He's here for a couple more years, I don't see the risk.

[run pMc]

Ruggs will probably run a 4.3 at Indy and is projected by many to go before GB picks at #30... but I'd be on board with that.
Nutz's mock draft ain't bad - I like the first two picks (Murray can run, Jefferson was productive and can separate) and Hamilton in R5. He's a big nimble space eater that would help the run D and be an upgrade over Lancaster/Adams.

[esoxx]

It's very comforting knowing we have 4 of the top 126 picks in the draft :x

[GB-Brandon]

It’s early but unless something completely changes against them I don’t see Murray being there at pick 30 or Jefferson being there at pick 62.

[pbmax]

It's very comforting knowing we have 4 of the top 126 picks in the draft :x

Is this a Bears joke or a Kahlil Mack complaint?

[esoxx]

Is this a Bears joke or a Kahlil Mack complaint?

It's just bemoaning draft positioning and the scourge of picking at the end of each round.

[pbmax]

It's just bemoaning draft positioning and the scourge of picking at the end of each round.

Ah, I was over-reading it. Was looking for the cut back lane to NFC North sarcasm.

[Zool]

Too Early mock draft, Computer Generated, except for the Packers pick which was User Picked
https://thedraftnetwork.com/mockdraft

30th Pick, Round 1
Kenneth Murray Jr LB Oklahoma
I have actually watched a little bit of film on him and he flies around the field. He has speed and instinct.

62nd Pick Round 2
Justin Jefferson WR LSU
Fluid route runner that understands where to attack zone coverage. He wasn't high recruit and had to figure out how to be better than some really talented corners in the SEC.

94th Pick Round 3
Jalen Hurts QB Oklahoma
Good to great arm strength, top 3 athlete at the position, may be a little to hasty with his reads and will rely on his athleticism to make premature decisions. I think it is great value for the upside in 3 to 4 years.

126th pick Round 4
Ezra Cleveland OT Boise St
Athletic build and movement, needs to develop more.

157th Pick Round 5
Davon Hamilton DT Ohio State
Big athletic body that can move, but lacks overall production.

Didn't bother with the 6th and 7th round

Hurts wasn’t super accurate in college. I don’t like QBs (Tebow) who weren’t good passers in college but lived off athleticism. They don’t get more accurate with less time in the pocket and more complex Ds

Edit: well wtf do I know. Apparently he’s gotten better every year. I must just watch the games where he bounces 2 passes to receivers.

https://www.pff.com/news/college-football-jalen-hurts-on-pace-for-a-career-year-in-oklahomas-offense-has-improved-in-all-facets-since-his-time-at-alabama

[Deputy Nutz]

It’s early but unless something completely changes against them I don’t see Murray being there at pick 30 or Jefferson being there at pick 62.

I think Jefferson could slip in this draft, especially in comparison with some other athletic receivers in this draft. It will all depend on the combine for a lot of the receivers. Jefferson wasn't even the best receiver on his college team. Not sure if he drops all the way to the 62nd pick, but not shocked if he drops out of the first round, DK Metcalf dropped to the end of the 2nd round.

If the Packers go linebacker in the first round the top 3 guys are Isaiah Simmons, Patrick Queen, and Kenneth Murrray Jr.

Simmons is looking like a top 10 pick mainly due to his flexibility and coverage ability. He played the depth of a rocked down strong safety at Clemson.

Queen is flying up the draft boards and also looks like a round 1 possibility due to his athleticism and middle of the field coverage set.

Murray can run all over the field, and has played against all the crazy pass heavy schemes in the Big 12.

[jklowan]

I think Jefferson could slip in this draft, especially in comparison with some other athletic receivers in this draft. It will all depend on the combine for a lot of the receivers. Jefferson wasn't even the best receiver on his college team. Not sure if he drops all the way to the 62nd pick, but not shocked if he drops out of the first round, DK Metcalf dropped to the end of the 2nd round.

If the Packers go linebacker in the first round the top 3 guys are Isaiah Simmons, Patrick Queen, and Kenneth Murrray Jr.

Simmons is looking like a top 10 pick mainly due to his flexibility and coverage ability. He played the depth of a rocked down strong safety at Clemson.

Queen is flying up the draft boards and also looks like a round 1 possibility due to his athleticism and middle of the field coverage set.

Murray can run all over the field, and has played against all the crazy pass heavy schemes in the Big 12.

I ALSO THINK MURRAY WILL BE GONE, I have seen Troy Dye going to us in the second, Love the mock but not the QB in the 3rd, prefer OL or DL in that spot

[ThunderDan]

My first shot at fanspeak:
30: EDGE JULIAN OKWARA NOTRE DAME
62: LB PATRICK QUEEN LSU
94: WR TYLER JOHNSON MINNESOTA
133: TE JARED PINKNEY VANDERBILT

[GB-Brandon]

I think Jefferson could slip in this draft, especially in comparison with some other athletic receivers in this draft. It will all depend on the combine for a lot of the receivers. Jefferson wasn't even the best receiver on his college team. Not sure if he drops all the way to the 62nd pick, but not shocked if he drops out of the first round, DK Metcalf dropped to the end of the 2nd round.

If the Packers go linebacker in the first round the top 3 guys are Isaiah Simmons, Patrick Queen, and Kenneth Murrray Jr.

Simmons is looking like a top 10 pick mainly due to his flexibility and coverage ability. He played the depth of a rocked down strong safety at Clemson.

Queen is flying up the draft boards and also looks like a round 1 possibility due to his athleticism and middle of the field coverage set.

Murray can run all over the field, and has played against all the crazy pass heavy schemes in the Big 12.


Well yeah, but that receiver(Chase) won the Biletnikoff award. Maybe if we trade up in 2nd but I just don’t see Jefferson making it to pick #62 though I could be wrong. Many are saying we could see 5-6 receivers coming off the board in the 1st round alone and there will certainly be a run on them at some point. I’d like to get Cephus later and hope Jaylen Reagor is someone to be targeted in 1st. As has been posted Reagor brings a speed and short area quickness element this offense severely lacks. Some also like KJ Hamler(Penn State) but I prefer Reagor as the bigger prospect(5’11 195lb) that can also win some 50/50 balls downfield. Reagor really appears to be a more athletic and explosive version of Randall Cobb IMO.

Murray would be great but just don’t know how he makes it to 30 unless something bad comes out. Queen looks the part but the guy I am hot on early is Jordyn Brooks(Texas Tech). Brooks appears to have all the ability along with a certain swagger that has been dearly missed in the middle of the defense. There might be a shot to get Brooks in 2nd which might make it a more realistic option.

Simmons would be a dream come true but he is gonna go top 10 and maybe even top 5.

[Deputy Nutz]

I ALSO THINK MURRAY WILL BE GONE, I have seen Troy Dye going to us in the second, Love the mock but not the QB in the 3rd, prefer OL or DL in that spot

Sure, if there was an OL or DL player you didn't have to reach for. It's kind of hard to look at just the picks with the whole picture of the draft board. I simply don't get about fans of the NFL is the expectation that every draft pick is for the upcoming season. Sure a third round pick could step in and take meaningful reps as a rookie, but it's pretty unlikely. Hurts could very well be the QB of the future, and gives the Packers a legitimate backup. In reality it's a value pick that could have big potential in the future. Fans should stop being so short sighted and not by into all the hype the NFL floods into the draft.

[GB-Brandon]

Sure, if there was an OL or DL player you didn't have to reach for. It's kind of hard to look at just the picks with the whole picture of the draft board. I simply don't get about fans of the NFL is the expectation that every draft pick is for the upcoming season. Sure a third round pick could step in and take meaningful reps as a rookie, but it's pretty unlikely. Hurts could very well be the QB of the future, and gives the Packers a legitimate backup. In reality it's a value pick that could have big potential in the future. Fans should stop being so short sighted and not by into all the hype the NFL floods into the draft.

I’m just not certain we’re in a position to be making “value picks” at this stage in the game. The “Value Pick” of Rashan Gary was enough for me actually. If the wheels fall off this upcoming year then that could change the vision.

[Deputy Nutz]

Well yeah, but that receiver(Chase) won the Biletnikoff award. Maybe if we trade up in 2nd but I just don’t see Jefferson making it to pick #62 though I could be wrong. Many are saying we could see 5-6 receivers coming off the board in the 1st round alone and there will certainly be a run on them at some point. I’d like to get Cephus later and hope Jaylen Reagor is someone to be targeted in 1st. As has been posted Reagor brings a speed and short area quickness element this offense severely lacks. Some also like KJ Hamler(Penn State) but I prefer Reagor as the bigger prospect(5’11 195lb) that can also win some 50/50 balls downfield. Reagor really appears to be a more athletic and explosive version of Randall Cobb IMO.

Murray would be great but just don’t know how he makes it to 30 unless something bad comes out. Queen looks the part but the guy I am hot on early is Jordyn Brooks(Texas Tech). Brooks appears to have all the ability along with a certain swagger that has been dearly missed in the middle of the defense. There might be a shot to get Brooks in 2nd which might make it a more realistic option.

Simmons would be a dream come true but he is gonna go top 10 and maybe even top 5.

Other than last year where two inside backers went in the top 10 picks of the draft, Middle linebackers tend to be over looks until the end of the first round. I don't think Murray or Queen are the same type of players that Bush and White were coming out of college, I might clearly be wrong as I have watched 5 minutes of film on both of them.

The draft is a different animal, I thought for sure that up to 5 offensive tackles could be draft in last year's 1st round, instead the first 3 linemen drafted were interior guys, and Dillard didn't come off until the 22nd pick. 3 tackles came off the board in the first, and I certainly didn't think Titus Howard or McGary were going to be 1st round picks. I think you might have a better shot at picking the NCCA March Maddness Tournament perfectly than the NFL draft.

I will guarantee that Borrows will go #1, and Young will go #2.

[Deputy Nutz]

I’m just not certain we’re in a position to be making “value picks” at this stage in the game. The “Value Pick” of Rashan Gary was enough for me actually. If the wheels fall off this upcoming year then that could change the vision.

That doesn't make any sense. I am not an NFL Scout so I don't make a BIG BOARD, but I wouldn't reach just because I have a need, why? Obviously I have a player lower on my draft board because I don't have the confidence in his tape and measurable that they are going to contribute with accordance to the round they are drafted in. The Draft is about filling needs, but is it a need that is urgent? Usually you will look to fill it in the first two rounds, if it is a need but maybe two or three seasons away then you might take a flyer on potential or value in a certain round because the player is too good to pass up. Jalen Hurts was the potential and the value to not pass up at the end of the 3rd round.

[run pMc]

I think Jefferson could slip in this draft, especially in comparison with some other athletic receivers in this draft. It will all depend on the combine for a lot of the receivers. Jefferson wasn't even the best receiver on his college team. Not sure if he drops all the way to the 62nd pick, but not shocked if he drops out of the first round, DK Metcalf dropped to the end of the 2nd round.

If the Packers go linebacker in the first round the top 3 guys are Isaiah Simmons, Patrick Queen, and Kenneth Murrray Jr.

Simmons is looking like a top 10 pick mainly due to his flexibility and coverage ability. He played the depth of a rocked down strong safety at Clemson.

Queen is flying up the draft boards and also looks like a round 1 possibility due to his athleticism and middle of the field coverage set.

Murray can run all over the field, and has played against all the crazy pass heavy schemes in the Big 12.

I'd be happy with Jefferson at 62. I think there will be at least two runs on WRs in the first 2 rounds, and Jefferson will be in there. Not sure he lasts until 62 but I do think GB will have opportunities to get a good WR that can contribute early (but not start right away).

As for 3 ILBs taken before 30, that would be a little unusual. That's not a position where you see many taken in R1 -- usually it's QBs (Burrow, Tua, Herbert, etc.), DL, OL, CBs, what they call EDGE and WRs. Maybe a TE and RB sneaks in there too, and at S Delpit will go R1.

Basically R1 is usually big guys and skill positions.
Re: LBs, Simmons is for sure gone, and likely one of Murray or Queen gone after 20 but I'm skeptical both will be gone with the other talent on the board.

It's so early; combine is about 5 weeks out... things will shake up a few times before that's over. GB definitely needs speed and coverage at ILB...I think either Queen or Murray will be there at 30.

[GB-Brandon]

That doesn't make any sense. I am not an NFL Scout so I don't make a BIG BOARD, but I wouldn't reach just because I have a need, why? Obviously I have a player lower on my draft board because I don't have the confidence in his tape and measurable that they are going to contribute with accordance to the round they are drafted in. The Draft is about filling needs, but is it a need that is urgent? Usually you will look to fill it in the first two rounds, if it is a need but maybe two or three seasons away then you might take a flyer on potential or value in a certain round because the player is too good to pass up. Jalen Hurts was the potential and the value to not pass up at the end of the 3rd round.

I agree with some of this but only in a certain context. If we were the Miami Dolphins and in the middle of a rebuild then sure take the best player available on your board all the way through. However, we are a team that was one game away from the Super Bowl with a 36yo franchise QB. We have to utilize every resource to get us over the hump within our Championship window so “Need” gets slated above “Value”. I would also argue that you can still find immediate needs in the 3rd round.

Now as far as ILB you are correct that the position was undervalued but that isn’t the case anymore. Every team in the league is looking for guys with speed that can cover as well as hold up against the run game. It severely decreases the talent pool of guys that can potentially project well to the NFL in modern schemes.

Yes, every draft is different and as I said I could be wrong but i’m certainly not holding my breath that Murray will be there at 30 or Jefferson at 62.

[jklowan]

and I'm not sure Queen is 1st round talent, I doubt he makes it to 62 so hence my question on Troy Dye in maybe the 3rd

[call_me_ishmael]

Wow, lots of candor from Gooter in the presser today. Sounds like WR and ILB are his targets and there is little chance the current ILB is back.

https://packerswire.usatoday.com/2020/01/24/highlights-from-brian-gutekunsts-season-ending-press-conference/

[GB-Brandon]

and I'm not sure Queen is 1st round talent, I doubt he makes it to 62 so hence my question on Troy Dye in maybe the 3rd

Jordyn Brooks in 2nd or Dye in 3rd at this juncture appears to be our best case options. I like both of them.


Wow, lots of candor from Gooter in the presser today. Sounds like WR and ILB are his targets and there is little chance the current ILB is back.

https://packerswire.usatoday.com/2020/01/24/highlights-from-brian-gutekunsts-season-ending-press-conference/

I put the nail in the coffin on Martinez when he got beat to the edge near the goal line in Niners game. That kinda signified in one play what is lacking.

I would also add Brandon Aiyuk to the conversation at receiver. There is literally so much talent at receiver in this draft that I don’t know how we could screw it up.

[GB-Brandon]

and I'm not sure Queen is 1st round talent, I doubt he makes it to 62 so hence my question on Troy Dye in maybe the 3rd

After further review I’m not sure about Dye after watching his tape vs Auburn and being able to come in and replace Martinez right out of the gate. He was okay in coverage(had a few mistakes) but got swallowed up quite a bit in run game. He has some toughness to him but not sure if he is strong enough at this point to hold up in the power run game. Definitely gonna need some development.

The more and more I look at this we’re gonna have to spend $ to have the best chance to fortify the position of trade up in draft.

[call_me_ishmael]

How do the Patriots stop the run and cover so affectively with slow ass Donta Hightower and old ass Jamie Collins? Let's just do what they do.

[run pMc]

How do the Patriots stop the run and cover so affectively with slow ass Donta Hightower and old ass Jamie Collins? Let's just do what they do.

They play in the AFC East. Also, they have Belichick, who is a defensive smart guy. Finally, Hightower and Collins were once pretty good athletes for their size, they've replaced that speed with smarts. I wouldn't trust either one to consistently provide pass coverage. They have ok safeties, plus Gilmore had a very good year.

[Cheesehead Craig]

How do the Patriots stop the run and cover so affectively with slow ass Donta Hightower and old ass Jamie Collins? Let's just do what they do.

We would have to hire Hoody Genius and then allow him to continue cheating.

[George Cumby]

How do the Patriots stop the run and cover so affectively with slow ass Donta Hightower and old ass Jamie Collins? Let's just do what they do.

Film the other team?

[GB-Brandon]

How do the Patriots stop the run and cover so affectively with slow ass Donta Hightower and old ass Jamie Collins? Let's just do what they do.

That is why I’m off the Mike Pettine train as even with what we had(which was a 100 percent healthy roster for the most part) he failed to be able to stop or even slow down there run game. So now that we know he is coming back the Packers are pretty much forced to get him significant upgrades at DE and ILB.

With his schemes he puts an awful lot on the plate of his one ILB and 2 DL he plays most of the time. What makes the performance even more maddening against Niners was we couldn’t even stop them when he went to 3-4 Base.

It was a total fail all the way around. I have a hard time believing a Bill Belichick coached team would lay such an egg regardless of personnel.

[mraynrand]

Film the other team?

There's film of everything. Packers got outcoached, outschemed, outphysicalled, outdesired, or more likely all of the above. Maybe ask 'Snubby' what was foremost on his mind - getting big splash sacks to show them idiots who selected pro bowlers, or playing within the scheme and winning a game.

[mraynrand]

I have a hard time believing a Bill Belichick coached team would lay such an egg regardless of personnel.

You (and everyone else) can make all the comparisons to 'Cheat that you want, and you will mostly always be right. But just know that it's too easy and too pat. Like saying "boy Red Auerbach and the 57-66 Celtics would never let that happen to them." Yep, right again, but does that really help analyze what's going on with the Packers rn? Maybe not so much.

Oh, BTW, you may have seen what happened to Bill this year with marginal O personnel.

[texaspackerbacker]

I would ask the people bad mouthing Martinez, would you rather replace him with a rookie - even a fairly highly drafted one? I'd say the only way we should lose Martinez is if we can sign somebody from another team who is clearly better.

Switching to a 4-3 would solve a lot of problems including Martinez needing to basically do the job of two players. 4-3 would also make the Smiths DEs, which they pretty much play like now. You'd then have OLBs behind them actually covering outside runs and short zones in the passing game.

[pbmax]

Wow, lots of candor from Gooter in the presser today. Sounds like WR and ILB are his targets and there is little chance the current ILB is back.

https://packerswire.usatoday.com/2020/01/24/highlights-from-brian-gutekunsts-season-ending-press-conference/

Holy Crap.


– On defensive line: “I really do like our defensive line group.” Likes Dean Lowry and Tyler Lancaster. Excited for Montravius Adams and Kinglsey Keke in 2020. Said he wouldn’t pass on adding a talented player along the line.

[pbmax]

– Gutekunst said he wanted to add another explosive offensive player at the trade deadline. Explored options. Didn’t like the value of some of the in-season trade opportunities.

Oh well.

[Joemailman]

It's clear he sees the ILB group as a bigger problem than DL. Of course, he may have just been propping up a group (DL) that's come in for a lot of criticism lately.

[GB-Brandon]

I would ask the people bad mouthing Martinez, would you rather replace him with a rookie - even a fairly highly drafted one? I'd say the only way we should lose Martinez is if we can sign somebody from another team who is clearly better.

Switching to a 4-3 would solve a lot of problems including Martinez needing to basically do the job of two players. 4-3 would also make the Smiths DEs, which they pretty much play like now. You'd then have OLBs behind them actually covering outside runs and short zones in the passing game.

Personally i like Martinez but based on what he is asked to do he isn’t good enough. That doesn’t mean he isn’t a good football player and can’t be used more effectively in a different situation like you shared(contributing in a 4-3). Yes, he had a lot of tackles but where were most of those tackles being made? He didn’t excel in pass coverage either. His PFF ranking this year was horrible and was the worst of his career. All of this with the combination of Pettine being hell bent on his scheme creates a scenario where paying Martinez big $ gives many a serious cause for concern that is warranted.

I am not certain there is anyone that will be available to us in the draft that can come in day 1 and full-fill what Pettine asked Martinez to do in 2019. In fact Isiah Simmons is probably the only guy in the draft I would even feel comfortable trying to do that with and he will be long gone by the time the Packers draft. The other option I could see is signing a guy like Cory Littleton and rolling the dice. He is “Great” in coverage and rated out considerably higher then Martinez overall. He is consistently around the ball and appears to be able to get to the sideline faster in pursuit. I’m thinking he will be somewhere around 4 years 50 million. I don’t believe the Rams will be able to afford him so he should make it to free agency.

With that said there still gonna need to improve the Lowry/Lancaster fiasco or it won’t matter who they sign at ILB.

[call_me_ishmael]

I would ask the people bad mouthing Martinez, would you rather replace him with a rookie - even a fairly highly drafted one? I'd say the only way we should lose Martinez is if we can sign somebody from another team who is clearly better.

Switching to a 4-3 would solve a lot of problems including Martinez needing to basically do the job of two players. 4-3 would also make the Smiths DEs, which they pretty much play like now. You'd then have OLBs behind them actually covering outside runs and short zones in the passing game.

Is it crazy to think they might give the dysfunctional Jets a call for another former Raven in the middle that TT and presumably Gooter absolutely loved a few years back?

[Joemailman]

Is it crazy to think they might give the dysfunctional Jets a call for another former Raven in the middle that TT and presumably Gooter absolutely loved a few years back?

?

[GB-Brandon]

?


I think he is talking about CJ Mosley. Never gonna happen. Good player but he is 1 year into an 85 million dollar contract with 50 guaranteed.

[texaspackerbacker]

Yeah, it sounds like Mosely is too expensive. I'm not too sure Littleton is an upgrade from Martinez, and 4 years $50 million probably is a higher price tag than Martinez. Remember, that same guy who said Littleton has good coverage skills also said Martinez has good coverage skills hahahaha. Take it with a grain of salt. Better the devil we know than the probably higher priced devil we don't know.

As somebody said, it sounds like from that press conference they are more concerned with ILB than the D Line. If true, that's a damn shame.

[Fritz]

If Gutey thinks the team is set on the defensive line, then maybe he should re-watch the tape of the NFCC. And Montravius Adams? This was year three for him, and he couldn't get off the bench. How can you be excited about that?

[GB-Brandon]

Yeah, it sounds like Mosely is too expensive. I'm not too sure Littleton is an upgrade from Martinez, and 4 years $50 million probably is a higher price tag than Martinez. Remember, that same guy who said Littleton has good coverage skills also said Martinez has good coverage skills hahahaha. Take it with a grain of salt. Better the devil we know than the probably higher priced devil we don't know.

As somebody said, it sounds like from that press conference they are more concerned with ILB than the D Line. If true, that's a damn shame.

Having more power upfront on the DL would no doubt help cover up some of Martinez’s deficiencies but as long as Pettine continues to run his 2 DL sets some of Martinez’s limitations would most likely continue to be exposed. With what is most likely available to the Packers bringing him back to a team friendly deal might be an option. Martinez appears to like being in Green Bay and it will ultimately come down to how much the Packers value the position(and what Martinez is willing to accept) moving forward.


If Gutey thinks the team is set on the defensive line, then maybe he should re-watch the tape of the NFCC. And Montravius Adams? This was year three for him, and he couldn't get off the bench. How can you be excited about that?

Yeah, M.Adams has to be moved over to the “bust category” quickly and counting on him moving forward shouldn’t be an option. If Reagor is off the board at pick 30 then I would have no problem with the Packers selecting Raekwon Davis if he is still available. He is a very good run defender up front.

https://youtu.be/2QkesWBDNec

[texaspackerbacker]

That two man D Line you're talking about is actually a de facto 4 man line, as the Smiths (or Fackrell if one of them moves inside) play it like DEs instead of OLBs. The problem with that, of course, is no OLB behind them to turn in running plays. It's worse when you have a 3 man line - which actually is 5, and two of them are the two Northwestern slugs - still no strength inside, and nobody to stop plays from getting outside except DBs. And when those DBs are in man coverage, which they usually are, then it's wide open for an outside run. It's a wonder more teams don't do to us what the Niners did.

Actually calling it a 4-3 and having a couple real OLBs would help a lot. Using zone pass coverage would help a lot. For some reason, though, I doubt Pettine will do that.

Signing somebody like Chris Jones or Reader or maybe drafting somebody like Raekwon Davis would make that 2 man line a lot better - paired with Clark, but it still wouldn't solve the problem outside.

Martinez really isn't the problem. There just is too much left on his shoulders to stop as it is now. I doubt even a better ILB - if indeed any of those mentioned are better - would have success under the circumstances we have now.

[GB-Brandon]

That two man D Line you're talking about is actually a de facto 4 man line, as the Smiths (or Fackrell if one of them moves inside) play it like DEs instead of OLBs. The problem with that, of course, is no OLB behind them to turn in running plays. It's worse when you have a 3 man line - which actually is 5, and two of them are the two Northwestern slugs - still no strength inside, and nobody to stop plays from getting outside except DBs. And when those DBs are in man coverage, which they usually are, then it's wide open for an outside run. It's a wonder more teams don't do to us what the Niners did.

Actually calling it a 4-3 and having a couple real OLBs would help a lot. Using zone pass coverage would help a lot. For some reason, though, I doubt Pettine will do that.

Signing somebody like Chris Jones or Reader or maybe drafting somebody like Raekwon Davis would make that 2 man line a lot better - paired with Clark, but it still wouldn't solve the problem outside.

Martinez really isn't the problem. There just is too much left on his shoulders to stop as it is now. I doubt even a better ILB - if indeed any of those mentioned are better - would have success under the circumstances we have now.

Well “de facto 4” or not you still have two guys with there hand in the dirt at the point of attack and it runs extremely light. The scheme itself takes an awful lot to be successful IMO. I think with the addition of DL you suggested along with Isiah Simmons is what it would take but not sure that is realistic considering draft capital and $ needed. Simmons is 6’4 230lb and claims to run 4.31(almost a half second faster then Martinez) is explosive and it shows on tape, plus is a very instinctive player. Your gonna need a “World Beater” like that to pull it off for sure.

So I blame Pettine for “pigeon holing” us into a scheme that is almost impossible to have the cumulative talent and resources needed to run. It will certainly almost never happen with a franchise QB cap hit. BTW, I wanted them to switch to a true 4-3 years ago and run nickel out of that.

Edit: Christian Jones staying healthy concerns me.

[pbmax]

I tend to think Pettine, like Rexy, wants to be able to run heavy for run D and light for pass rush.

I hope Gute thinks the pass rush is OK and just knows but doesn't want to tip his hand that he needs a run stuffer.

[Freak Out]

Having more power upfront on the DL would no doubt help cover up some of Martinez’s deficiencies but as long as Pettine continues to run his 2 DL sets some of Martinez’s limitations would most likely continue to be exposed. With what is most likely available to the Packers bringing him back to a team friendly deal might be an option. Martinez appears to like being in Green Bay and it will ultimately come down to how much the Packers value the position(and what Martinez is willing to accept) moving forward.



Yeah, M.Adams has to be moved over to the “bust category” quickly and counting on him moving forward shouldn’t be an option. If Reagor is off the board at pick 30 then I would have no problem with the Packers selecting Raekwon Davis if he is still available. He is a very good run defender up front.

https://youtu.be/2QkesWBDNec

Yes please.

[GB-Brandon]

Yes please.

I’m actually starting to like it even more and even adding another via Free Agency(Michael Brockers or Quinton Jefferson) after Senior Bowl. I think Jefferson will be more cap friendly.

I’m still torn on whether to re-sign Martinez or go after Cory Littleton and it will probably come down to $. I still want to add another one in draft and early.

Singing AJ Green is a huge component to the following picks. I understand Green will be 32 and has injury history but we’re gonna have to gamble somewhere. I can’t believe I’m saying this but we need to shore up the defense as Rodgers gets older which makes this a huge signing.

Post Senior Bowl:

Pick 30- Raekwon Davis. DL, Alabama-Elite size and strength and is very good against the run and did it in the SEC. He can also get after it a little pushing the pocket. Huge upgrade IMO over Lancaster and Lowry.

Pick 62- Jordyn Brooks ILB, Texas Tech - Way too much value to pass up here at a need. Not only is he fun to watch and a leader for Texas Tech but also graded out well at all the areas of concern for Packer LB’s last year(stopping run, pass coverage, putting pressure on). We will need to see at Combine but the tape is “buyer friendly”. A real strong combine could push him out of reach here.

Round 3-Kj Hill WR, Ohio State - Could be this years Terry Mclaurin. He is just “NFL Ready” which makes him a perfect fit for what we’re trying to do on offense. He fits scheme perfectly. Massively talented receiver class allows him to fall to us. College production was there. “Smooth Operator” that can create separation and flip his hips.

https://247sports.com/Article/KJ-Hill-Senior-Bowl-NFL-Draft-stock-potential-destinations-Ohio-State-Buckeyes-142705533/

Also showed at Senior Bowl he can beat people vertically.

Round 4- Quintez Cephus WR, Wisconsin- We might have to trade up here a little to get him IMO. He is very twitchy in short area spaces along with great hands and can win contested catches(50/50 balls). He does well off press coverage. He really reminds me a lot of James Jones. If he stayed another year at Wisconsin he most likely would be a 2nd round pick. Will need to improve overall route tree.

Rounds 5-7- Need to find OL talent and depth.

[texaspackerbacker]

Not much to disagree with there. I think I would prefer Devin Duvernay of Texas to K.J. Hill, although either would be good in the third round.

[call_me_ishmael]

I wonder if Justin Herbert would interest Goot Goot. He checks every box it seems except accuracy apparently.

[Joemailman]

Kiper has Packers taking KJ Hamler in his mock. That has been a fairly popular Packers pick so far. https://www.reddit.com/r/DynastyFF/comments/etc290/mel_kipers_2020_mock_10_released_today/

[Bretsky]

If Gutey thinks the team is set on the defensive line, then maybe he should re-watch the tape of the NFCC. And Montravius Adams? This was year three for him, and he couldn't get off the bench. How can you be excited about that?

ADAMS...right up GB's alley. If you got up close to him you'd see an incredibly ripped freak athletic looking guy. Another Tarzan who plays like Jane. It seems like we always have 2-3 underachievers who were drafted based on measurables as opposed to production. Time to move on from him and Burks so lesson our ratios

[Joemailman]

I wonder if Justin Herbert would interest Goot Goot. He checks every box it seems except accuracy apparently.

QB's with accuracy in college do not have a good track record in the NFL. I have heard though that he improved his accuracy in 2019.

[Joemailman]

ADAMS...right up GB's alley. If you got up close to him you'd see an incredibly ripped freak athletic looking guy. Another Tarzan who plays like Jane. It seems like we always have 2-3 underachievers who were drafted based on measurables as opposed to production. Time to move on from him and Burks so lesson our ratios

Adams in 2017, Khyri Thornton in 2014, Datone Jones in 2013, Jerel Worthy in 2012. Not TT's strong point. Hopefully Gutey can do better. Burks emerged on ST, so he probably sticks for now.

[pbmax]

Datone Jones was at least minimally useful on pass rush from inside. But that was about it. The others, woof.

http://packerrats.com/showthread.php?29671-Official-2017-Packers-Third-Round-Pick-Montravius-Adams&highlight=adams

I don't know why the board was so worried about the fact that his production seemed best when he was a sophomore in 2014 and then they had to find a new role for him and fewer snaps.

[GB-Brandon]

Kiper has Packers taking KJ Hamler in his mock. That has been a fairly popular Packers pick so far. https://www.reddit.com/r/DynastyFF/comments/etc290/mel_kipers_2020_mock_10_released_today/

He is 5’9 175lbs(even smaller then Tyreek Hill) though and is gonna most likely primarily be limited to the slot. Might be a bit of a reach IMO at receiver this year at #30. Hamler is a smaller version of Parris Campbell and quite frankly I’d rather have Campbell even though he had an injury riddled rookie season. I expect a break out season from Campbell in 2020.

[Deputy Nutz]

There are a couple of sites out there on the interweb that allows you to do a complete mock draft. I suggest doing it a couple of times versus just looking at players you would like the Packers to get in each round. Its not 100% accurate but its more realistic than just wanting a certain player each round.

https://thedraftnetwork.com/mock-draft-machine

https://fanspeak.com/ontheclock-nfl-mock-draft-simulator/

As pieces of the 2020 draft slowly come together, Senior Bowl, Combine, personal workouts etc... Teams and "experts" start to put their draft boards together and there is a lot of fluctuation. For instance Jalen Hurts didn't do himself any favors at the Senior Bowl and has seen his draft stock dip. He was a QB that if he put it all together at the Senior Bowl and Combine could have been considered a low end first round selection. Now he might drop to some where from a late second to a late 3rd pick.

What I have done for a couple of drafts, is put together draft tiers for positional groups. It's actually quite fun for me. I wish I had the time in the fall to track the production of those tiers to see if I was right or wrong, but hell Mel Kiper doesn't care what a player does after the draft. Why should I?

[run pMc]

There are a couple of sites out there on the interweb that allows you to do a complete mock draft. I suggest doing it a couple of times versus just looking at players you would like the Packers to get in each round. Its not 100% accurate but its more realistic than just wanting a certain player each round.

This is a good piece of advice if you're curious about mock drafting... the first time I tried it my draft turned out crazy because I had a couple of reaches and luxury picks (Clyde Edwards-Helaire as A.Jones backup/successor) that I somewhat-regretted by the late rounds. (I got the ILB revamped though! :))
One thing it does show is where there is depth in the draft -- there were WRs available in R6 and 7 that would be upgrades/even tradeoffs from who GB had on their roster, for example, but OTs better than Alex Light were hard to find by round 4.

[ThunderDan]

There are a couple of sites out there on the interweb that allows you to do a complete mock draft. I suggest doing it a couple of times versus just looking at players you would like the Packers to get in each round. Its not 100% accurate but its more realistic than just wanting a certain player each round.

https://thedraftnetwork.com/mock-draft-machine

https://fanspeak.com/ontheclock-nfl-mock-draft-simulator/

As pieces of the 2020 draft slowly come together, Senior Bowl, Combine, personal workouts etc... Teams and "experts" start to put their draft boards together and there is a lot of fluctuation. For instance Jalen Hurts didn't do himself any favors at the Senior Bowl and has seen his draft stock dip. He was a QB that if he put it all together at the Senior Bowl and Combine could have been considered a low end first round selection. Now he might drop to some where from a late second to a late 3rd pick.

What I have done for a couple of drafts, is put together draft tiers for positional groups. It's actually quite fun for me. I wish I had the time in the fall to track the production of those tiers to see if I was right or wrong, but hell Mel Kiper doesn't care what a player does after the draft. Why should I?

I use fanspeak. Right now it is pretty hit and miss with draft positions of the players. It is much better after the combine.

[George Cumby]

Adams in 2017, Khyri Thornton in 2014, Datone Jones in 2013, Jerel Worthy in 2012. Not TT's strong point. .

Man, if TT had the eye for DL that he did for WR.........

[run pMc]

Man, if TT had the eye for DL that he did for WR.........

Yeah, he was pretty spotty. He did find Mike Daniels, Kenny Clark, BJ Raji, Johnny Jolly, and sign Ryan Pickett, Howard Green, and Cullen Jenkins. Interesting that most of his good DL work was early in his tenure. I wonder if that was the work of a scout who moved up/out in position...

[pbmax]

Yeah, he was pretty spotty. He did find Mike Daniels, Kenny Clark, BJ Raji, Johnny Jolly, and sign Ryan Pickett, Howard Green, and Cullen Jenkins. Interesting that most of his good DL work was early in his tenure. I wonder if that was the work of a scout who moved up/out in position...

I wonder if it was scout's reporting OR advice being given by Schneider or Dorsey.

Ted used to say he occasionally needed to be reminded that you just can't draft the athletic traits. You need football players too.

[esoxx]

Yeah, he was pretty spotty. He did find Mike Daniels, Kenny Clark, BJ Raji, Johnny Jolly, and sign Ryan Pickett, Howard Green, and Cullen Jenkins. Interesting that most of his good DL work was early in his tenure. I wonder if that was the work of a scout who moved up/out in position...

Jenkins was a Mike Sherman acquisition.

Cue Tank in 3, 2, 1...

[SudsMcBucky]

Just ran a quick 3 round mock.

Packers #30: Patrick Queen, LB
#62: KJ Hamler, WR
#94: Darnay Holmes, CB

Some other notes of interest, Wisconsin guys drafted in 1st 3 rounds: Jonathan Taylor, #31 to KC, Zach Baun #83 to Denver, Tyler Badass #90 to Cleveland

[pbmax]

Jenkins was a Mike Sherman acquisition.

Cue Tank in 3, 2, 1...

Mike Sherman never missed the playoffs with Ron Wolf's players.

[Bretsky]

Just ran a quick 3 round mock.

Packers #30: Patrick Queen, LB
#62: KJ Hamler, WR
#94: Darnay Holmes, CB

Some other notes of interest, Wisconsin guys drafted in 1st 3 rounds: Jonathan Taylor, #31 to KC, Zach Baun #83 to Denver, Tyler Badass #90 to Cleveland


Love Baun

[call_me_ishmael]

Wait the dude's real last name is Badass? That is truly incredible.

[Cheesehead Craig]

Wait the dude's real last name is Badass? That is truly incredible.

It's actually Biadasz. But Badass is much better.

[George Cumby]

Yeah, he was pretty spotty. He did find Mike Daniels, Kenny Clark, BJ Raji, Johnny Jolly, and sign Ryan Pickett, Howard Green, and Cullen Jenkins. Interesting that most of his good DL work was early in his tenure. I wonder if that was the work of a scout who moved up/out in position...

That's actually not a bad body of work, unfortunately his misses were so.......... damaging.

[jklowan]

Something like this would be nice

30 Kenneth Murray - LB Oklahoma
62 Isaiah Wilson - OT Georgia
94 Jordyn Brooks - LB Texas Tech
126 Devin Duvernay - WR Texas
157 Quintez Cephus - WR Wisconsin
172 Ezra Cleveland - OT Boise State
189 Khalil Davis - IDL Nebraska
201 Ray Lima - IDL Iowa State
219 James Proche - WR SMU

Sign a TE and a CB in free agency and get ready to roll

[Deputy Nutz]

Love Baun

Is there a Badger you don't love? Baun played like shit during the Rose Bowl.

[run pMc]

This one fell out of the draft network mock machine, after about 10 iterations LOL. I'd be happy if this happened, but then again I am an amateur who knows slightly more than a houseplant about scouting.
30 Patrick Queen, LB LSU
62 Jalen Reagor, WR TCU
94 Hakeem Adeniji, OT Kansas
126 Davon Hamilton, IDL Ohio State
157 Justin Strnad, LB Wake Forest
172 Josiah Deguara, TE Cincinnati
189 Naquan Jones, IDL Michigan State
201 Terence Steele, OT Texas Tech
219 Quintez Cephus, WR Wisconsin

Remakes the LB position with two rangy tacklers (I have a small draft crush on Strnad), give some big DL dudes up front to replace Lancaster/Adams, and a pair of OT of which at least one should see the field soonish with good coaching. I have a soft spot for the Cincy TE - I think he could be a decent H-back type or push Tonyan. I think TEs will get a makeover. Draft left me a little wanting at WR, but the TE might help. Reagor can return punts/kicks although I bet they keep Swervin Ervin there. Cephus and a few other WRs drop in most of the drafts - my guess the allegations against him might have him off some boards completely.
Another guy I liked is Rick Spielman's kid JD -- he's small but quick, smooth, and productive.

Didn't get a RB, but there might one late or as a UDFA. Would love to find a back like Salvion Ahmed who has a rocket strapped to his back -- SF kills with speed and RAC, MLF's offense could use a little of that. Dexter Williams better bring his A game to camp, Ervin and even Tra Carson passed him up.

I took to drafting multiples at spots thinking if you hit 50/50 that means you probably got one good one of each.

[Bretsky]

Is there a Badger you don't love? Baun played like shit during the Rose Bowl.



FOR SURE

I never like Jim Sorgi or Scott Tolzien. Sorgi had a bunch of ability but played stupid and choked often. Tolzien just wasn't talented enough to be on the field.

[Bretsky]

This one fell out of the draft network mock machine, after about 10 iterations LOL. I'd be happy if this happened, but then again I am an amateur who knows slightly more than a houseplant about scouting.
30 Patrick Queen, LB LSU
62 Jalen Reagor, WR TCU
94 Hakeem Adeniji, OT Kansas
126 Davon Hamilton, IDL Ohio State
157 Justin Strnad, LB Wake Forest
172 Josiah Deguara, TE Cincinnati
189 Naquan Jones, IDL Michigan State
201 Terence Steele, OT Texas Tech
219 Quintez Cephus, WR Wisconsin

Remakes the LB position with two rangy tacklers (I have a small draft crush on Strnad), give some big DL dudes up front to replace Lancaster/Adams, and a pair of OT of which at least one should see the field soonish with good coaching. I have a soft spot for the Cincy TE - I think he could be a decent H-back type or push Tonyan. I think TEs will get a makeover. Draft left me a little wanting at WR, but the TE might help. Reagor can return punts/kicks although I bet they keep Swervin Ervin there. Cephus and a few other WRs drop in most of the drafts - my guess the allegations against him might have him off some boards completely.
Another guy I liked is Rick Spielman's kid JD -- he's small but quick, smooth, and productive.

Didn't get a RB, but there might one late or as a UDFA. Would love to find a back like Salvion Ahmed who has a rocket strapped to his back -- SF kills with speed and RAC, MLF's offense could use a little of that. Dexter Williams better bring his A game to camp, Ervin and even Tra Carson passed him up.

I took to drafting multiples at spots thinking if you hit 50/50 that means you probably got one good one of each.



RAEGOR and CEEPHUS !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! On board. Would love our WR group with these two added

[texaspackerbacker]

I like this, especially the idea of getting Reagor in the second round rather than first.

If you combine a draft like this with a free agent signing of Reader or Chris Jones or somebody almost as good in the D Line, and either retain Martinez or sign somebody like Littleton - approximately equal quality, then we would be much improved. What I wouldn't want, though, would be to go with a rookie, even a first round pick, as the primary ILB - basically replacing Martinez.

[Deputy Nutz]

Tolzien had one of the better pro careers for a Badger QB. Like 99% of the Badger qb's Sorgi and Tolzien were game managers.

Baun is looking like a 2nd round draft pick. Some "experts" see him as a possible first round pick as an edge rusher or a 4-3 weak side linebacker.

Anyways...

Started breaking down the inside linebacker position if I was a GM that desperately needed an inside linebacker to start day one you would have to look at drafting one of the top 3 guys with first round grades, Simmons, Queen, or Murray. The rest of the top ten that I am looking at are bad. The name I keep hearing out everyone else is the Jordyn Brooks from Texas Tech. I like his film as a top 5 inside linebacker, but he also would need a ton of work to be considered a starter in 2020.

The Packers missed on Mack Wilson from Alabama last year. His film wasn't great but I thought he was 3rd rounder and he ended up going in the 5th round, but he was productive with starting 14 games and playing the majority of all the snaps for Cleveland. He only had one tackle for a loss, one sack and no turnovers.

[run pMc]

If we assume their engine AI and rankings are reasonable -- what I learned from running the Draft Network's Mock Draft Engine multiple times:

(1) Quality OT are hard to come by outside the top 15 picks this year.
Signing Bulaga -or- someone like Veldheer and hoping a high round pick can eventually step in a la Jenkins might be the approach. I actually wouldn't be surprised if they took an OT in R1.

(2) The DL run the gamut but depending on what you are looking for I think there can be some decent sleepers. Some luck and scheme fit is needed.
With money going to Clark and Lowry they likely draft help since it will likely be cheaper/younger with upside.

(3) Only a few ILB have coverage ability, and they will get snapped up early.
Either Murray and Queen (or both) were usually available at 30, but gone by 35 every time. There are a few big safeties (Duggar, Chinn) who might switch or could play hybrid, and there were one or two raw prospects (e.g., Davis-Gaither) with cover ability, so there's always that. I liked Strnad paired with Queen because both are instinctive and can run, and GB needs more speed. As mentioned before, GB gets repeatedly burned over the middle and that has to stop. There aren't many Cory Littletons around; I'm skeptical they sign a pricey vet. I do think Gute will overhaul this position.

(4) WRs and RBs could be had deep into Day 3, although they seemed to fall into tiers and so you might have to 'reach' for a pick - e.g., taking the 76th best player at 62 because they are the best available WR, and all the OT/DL stunk or were projects/not high priority positions.
ESB could replace Allison, plus they have Lazard, so unless they sign a FA WR I think Gute waits until Day 2-3 to pick 2 WR. Getting better at TE can also help lift the passing game as well. Graham is very overpriced for his production and he can't run anymore, and Tonyan still looks like a clueless rookie at times. Sternberger should at least be the TE2 but they need help here for MLF offense. Speed at RB would be nice -- Ervin has potential.

(5) You are at the mercy of the board and who is available.
It sounds trite, but you can't go into thinking "I'll just take player X at pick Y" because there's a good chance they won't be there -- and if they are, there might be someone available you like even more.

(6) Most players have warts...lots of warts...and will need coaching to fix fundamentals or be ready to play significant snaps in Year 1.
It's hard to step in as a rookie and start over a vet. If you're drafting a DL in R5, they most likely are a project and expecting them to play like Clark in Week 1 is a stretch. If you do play them early and often, be prepared for some bumps. The scouting reports for some players are terrifying, if you believe them.

(7) Trading down is a better possibility than trading up.
If there's a player -- like a QB -- who falls and a team wants to get them on a R1 5 year contract, being at pick 30 isn't a bad place to trade from. I'm not sure there's a lot of difference between the 30th and 40th best player, especially if the players you most wanted at 30 are all gone. I feel like the GB roster has a few holes it can't completely fill by drafting, and trading up will only reduce that further. Plus, MLF and Gute have had a year to see what they need for their scheme, and that will prompt more personnel changes.

[Deputy Nutz]

https://thedraftnetwork.com/mock-draft-machine
Mock draft 1/28/20
Big board has changed a little since the Senior Bowl. The trend that I am seeing in round one and round two is that if the Packers are going to need a top flight receiver and inside linebacker they are going to have to trade up in the second round, maybe the first round. If I wait until the second round on receiver the best I come up with is Donovan Peoples-Jones from Michigan. I thought he was too much of an under achiever at Michigan. I typically don't like Michigan receivers.

30
Kenneth Murray, LB
Oklahoma
-I like Queen better but he is running up the draft boards, and quite frankly I don't know if Murray or Queen will be there at 30.

62
Josh Jones, OT
Houston
- Had a fantastic Senior Bowl and might move up into first round consideration. He is a very athletic big man that demonstrates great athleticism in pass pro.

94
Tyler Johnson, WR
Minnesota
- this sort of started a trend on Big Ten Receivers. Johnson is polished, and is more of a long strider that can attack the football down field.

126
Solomon Kindley, IOL
Georgia
- Big and athletic interior blocker that could be a massive force in the zone run game.

157
Tyler Clark, IDL
Georgia
- Another Georgia guy, Solid at 6'4" 300lbs, could be a solid 4 tech defeating reach blocks and double teams

172
Quintez Cephus, WR
Wisconsin
- Cephus's draft status will depend on his combine, if he can run 4.5 or better at the combine he won't be available any where close to the 6th round, I am thinking more like the 3rd round, and I wouldn't hesitate to draft him in the third round with a good combine.

189
Reggie Robinson II, CB
Tulsa
- I don't know anything about him.

201
K.J. Hill, WR
Ohio State
- Three receivers might be over kill, but he dropped, I drafted

219
Chris Orr, LB
Wisconsin
- I think Orr will be a sleeper in this draft. The kid is a heck of a football player with an full throttle approach. The "experts" are sleeping on him but like Cephus if he shows out at the combine he could be a late day 2 pick.

[run pMc]

201
K.J. Hill, WR
Ohio State
- Three receivers might be over kill, but he dropped, I drafted

I'm a fan of KJ Hill. I don't think he's explosive, but Brain Hartline is coaching those OSU guys to run routes and Hill did a good job of finding open spots. I liked McLaurin much more last year, but in the late rounds I could see Hill being a security blanket guy and zone buster type who helps move the chains.
He's not a big guy but you can put him in the slot and he'll beat guys with his routes. For all the talk about GB's big receivers, I don't think it's as valuable as route separation with Rodgers. He won't throw a lot of 50/50 balls for a tall receiver to outjump the CB to get. (If he did, Jimmy Graham would be an All-Pro.) Hill is a senior so he's had time to develop and could be seen as a receiving option Rodgers can "trust".

Also -- I don't like Michigan receivers either. DP-J doesn't wow me, but I'm open to being convinced.

[Smidgeon]

Keep up the good work, Rats. Unlike the last couple years, I'm already finding myself intrigued by the possibilities long before the draft.

[pbmax]

Bobble, we are we, the BPA caucus, finding ourselves this year?

I am feeling the need, the need for needs based drafting in Round 1.

I am hoping this passes after FA.

[Deputy Nutz]

The 30th selection of the draft offers some interesting possibilities, although none that I would really like to face as a GM other than knowing that we must of had one heck of a season to be drafting this low in the draft.

The other good news about this draft and how it sets up for the Packers is that the offensive tackle depth is pretty good, and the wide receiver depth is pretty good. So if the Packers are desperate to add in those two categories there is going to be a quality first round talent available there.

The Bad news is that inside linebacker is pretty thin, and if the Packers are counting on one of the top three guys to be there at 30 they are taking a real chance, because I am not sure there is a rookie with starting potential after the first three.

With receiver depth a plus in this draft I have starting looking at names a little deeper down the list. I haven't made any constructive lists at this point but there are couple of interesting prospects that don't yet have a first round grade.

Denzel Mims WR Baylor
Tyler Johnson WR Minnesota
Micheal Pittman JR WR USC
Van Jefferson WR Florida
Isaiah Hodges WR Oregon St.
KJ Hill WR Ohio St.

[George Cumby]

Keep up the good work, Rats. Unlike the last couple years, I'm already finding myself intrigued by the possibilities long before the draft.

IKR, bless our boys in the trenches grinding through the film and scouting reports.