The Next Few Years - Rebuild Mode

[wist43]

These picks do nothing to improve the 2020 team...

Dillion and Josiah Duhwtf will play and contribute, but their impact will be very modest.

Love of course is a long-term project - and a big project at that. He's got terrible mechanics, is inaccurate, makes poor decisions, and makes an incredible number of poor throws. He's got one hell of a long way to go before he can even serve as the game day backup.

So, given that this draft is going to provide no help this year, and Rodgers will be one year closer to calling it a career - the following might be our near term reality:

1) Rodgers will certainly be gone after 2022, if not 2021.

2) P Smith is on a 3 year deal and is likely gone after 2021.

3) Ditto for Amos.

4) Z Smith is on a 4 year deal and will be over 30, so he's gone thereabouts.

5) Bacteria will probably be gone after 2020.

6) Jones will be gone next year.

7) Adam's will be getting long in the tooth.

That's 3-4 years with no realistic shot at a Championshp, and a pretty depleted roster by 2022.

We can't expect Gute will do anything to actually flesh out the roster - so I'm guessing our best hope is that we fail spectacularly enough to be able to dump Gute and Lefluer after the 2022 season.

That's the only lipstick I can put on this pig. Horrific last 2 days for the Green Bay Packers.

[Bretsky]

Wisty, I'm alone here with my Eliott Wolf for GM sign on the bus. Wanna jump on :))) ?

[Bretsky]

on the brighter side, since Gutebag pretty much sucks at the Draft, at least he utilizes Free Agency. Teams will cut some players still

We can find better left overs than the Whitewater Jesus' on our roster

[GB-Brandon]

I think you summarized it pretty spot on. I just hope we can get rid of Gute and LaFluer sooner. These two crooks have robbed every Packer fan of a couple more legitimate bites at the Apple for a World Championship. Anyone that has a half a brain can see what these Clowns are doing here. Its just gonna be a massive disaster.

All this explains why Gute went out immediately and signed Kirksey on the Cheap. Then going out and bringing in Wagner on a cheap deal. Then eventually bringing in Funches on cheap deal. Its called patching a roster up for a “Tanker Job” and little “Bitch Boy LaFluer” is right in it with him. There doing a tear down and trying to run the Tennessee Titans system with Jordan Love on the QB rookie deal. They want to get good draft picks and $ to put there new vision in place. So in other words they have decided to sacrifice some good opportunities now too implement there vision which they feel gives us a better chance later. I disagree and it’s a shame that they are being allowed to even do this.

I just want to see how this ends with Rodgers. I mean i don’t even see how the motivation level of the players could be where it needs to be with all this going on. Then there is the virus and if there will be a season or not. The only reason I see for Rodgers to even play this out is for the $ so it will be very interesting how this continues to play out.

I really hope Gute and LaFleur are gone by no later then the end of the 2022 season as you described.

There not winnng a Super Bowl here with Jordan Love. Jordan Love couldn’t even win the Fucken Frisco Bowl.

[Radagast]

I think you summarized it pretty spot on. I just hope we can get rid of Gute and LaFluer sooner. These two crooks have robbed every Packer fan of a couple more legitimate bites at the Apple for a World Championship. Anyone that has a half a brain can see what these Clowns are doing here. Its just gonna be a massive disaster.

All this explains why Gute went out immediately and signed Kirksey on the Cheap. Then going out and bringing in Wagner on a cheap deal. Then eventually bringing in Funches on cheap deal. Its called patching a roster up for a “Tanker Job” and little “Bitch Boy LaFluer” is right in it with him. There doing a tear down and trying to run the Tennessee Titans system with Jordan Love on the QB rookie deal. They want to get good draft picks and $ to put there new vision in place. So in other words they have decided to sacrifice some good opportunities now too implement there vision which they feel gives us a better chance later. I disagree and it’s a shame that they are being allowed to even do this.

I just want to see how this ends with Rodgers. I mean i don’t even see how the motivation level of the players could be where it needs to be with all this going on. Then there is the virus and if there will be a season or not. The only reason I see for Rodgers to even play this out is for the $ so it will be very interesting how this continues to play out.

I really hope Gute and LaFleur are gone by no later then the end of the 2022 season as you described.

There not winnng a Super Bowl here with Jordan Love. Jordan Love couldn’t even win the Fucken Frisco Bowl.


Wow, how uninformed and just plain wrong you are.

To start with, following the replacing of Ted Thompson as GM, Brian Gutekunst took a Packers team that was faltering under Mike McCarthy and players mostly acquired by the former GM and with new coaches/players helped the Packers to a 13-3 regular season record, an NFC North Division title, and a spot in the NFC Championship game. I'd say that that should garner some well deserved respect for GB's current GM and HC.

Next, no GM on any NFl team has an unlimited supply of money to spend. Hiring players "on the cheap" can also be looked at as, responsibility managing a teams resources to acquire the best players that the team can afford. We hear these same whiners every year, but like last season they groan and then they cheer over acquisitions like the two Smiths.

Last, the disparity between the 2018 and 2019 Utah State Football teams is not Jordan Loves fault. The 2019 team lost a ton of Seniors from the 2018 team and the school changed Head Coaches from 2018 to 2019. The 2019 coaches ordered players like Love to take greater risk with the football as they were losing games. Love's 2019 record at Utah State reflects the poor coaching that he was obligated to obey.

Experts agree that Jordan Love has superior physical skills. His decision making skills have come into question (due to his 2019 Utah State season), but I believe that a change of environment./team will serve to justify GB's confidence in him. Furthermore, as he comes under the wings of the GB coaches, I believe that he could emerge as the hoped for future of the Packers.

[texaspackerbacker]

Good Post, Radagast

[mraynrand]

The Packers picks just show that they are moving on from Stubby’s offense. And why shouldn’t they? They brought in a new coach and he wants to run his stuff. Rodgers can get aboard this season (and next and more if lucky) or he can get bent.

[wist43]

The problem is philosophical... same as with TT.

Draft " good players" regardless of position, and with the miracle of osmosis a good team will emerge over time.

My argument against Ted was that he never worked to actually build a complete team. 2010 was literally a fluke - as Ron Wolf would say, "a fart in the wind".

A more accurate measure of what the philosophy gets you is the entire decade that followed. The year we lost to Seattle in the NFC Championship game was the sole exception, when they actually acquired fit pieces in an attempt to win it all.

What Gute has done this year is a complete reset, and we are once again having to look 4 years out, despite having a roster that wasn't too far from actually competing.

We're gonna win games over the next few years, but the truth is we're not really contenders.

[mraynrand]

I’d use ‘retool’ over ‘reset’ but semantics semantics. (I’ll retool you!). Packers are actually in a better position to run the offense that gutted their defense last year. And a brilliant mind and seasoned veteran like Rodgers should be able to run it to perfection. Unless he’s lost it. The irony is it’s an offense that’s optimized for extending his career.

[ThunderDan]

The problem is philosophical... same as with TT.

Draft " good players" regardless of position, and with the miracle of osmosis a good team will emerge over time.

My argument against Ted was that he never worked to actually build a complete team. 2010 was literally a fluke - as Ron Wolf would say, "a fart in the wind".
Sorry wrist, can’t agree with you here.

TT brought one of the best 13 year runs in football to GB. We went to 4 NFC Championship games and won the Super Bowl. We went to the playoffs 9 out of 13 years. It would have been great to have won more Super Bowls but we were competing for the Championship most every year.

TT lost it mentally at the end and should have been replaced 2 or 3 years earlier by Murphy but wasn’t out of respect.

[Upnorth]

I get the love pick, Rodgers does get hurt so a good backup who we can develop to be the QB of the future.
I like the Dillon pick and think there is a ton of upside to the pick. Also last year was I believe Jones healthiest year so good pick that way.

But Debra??? My phone auto corrected deguara to Debra. Rather than change it, I think it's an accurate prediction of his impact this year. If we are hell bent on a te at this point at least grab a better prospect. This guy looks slow.....

[pbmax]

I think this is exactly the wrong read of Gutekunst's draft.

I agree that they don't address 2020 team needs, and you could read that as some kind of planning for the future.

But Gute is on record now that Love isn't here as anointed successor. His job is to get prepare and that is it and that Rodgers is the starter. I don't remember Ted saying anything that definitive when they drafted an even more qualified Rodgers.

So see my new thread for what is actually happening and how its possibly worse.

[ThunderDan]

I think this is exactly the wrong read of Gutekunst's draft.

I agree that they don't address 2020 team needs, and you could read that as some kind of planning for the future.

But Gute is on record now that Love isn't here as anointed successor. His job is to get prepare and that is it and that Rodgers is the starter. I don't remember Ted saying anything that definitive when they drafted an even more qualified Rodgers.

So see my new thread for what is actually happening and how its possibly worse.
When your QB goes 346/540 for over 4,000 yards and 30 Tds you don’t need to say much about the guy you draft in round 1 as his replacement.

[Bretsky]

I think this is exactly the wrong read of Gutekunst's draft.

I agree that they don't address 2020 team needs, and you could read that as some kind of planning for the future.

But Gute is on record now that Love isn't here as anointed successor. His job is to get prepare and that is it and that Rodgers is the starter. I don't remember Ted saying anything that definitive when they drafted an even more qualified Rodgers.

So see my new thread for what is actually happening and how its possibly worse.


If I embrace your theory I would consider GuteBAG grossly incompetent to run an NFL Draft

[mraynrand]

I see the running back and TE picks as being similar to TT drafting Raji and Matthews in 2009. Love also, if Rodgers just can't get with the program.

[wist43]

I think Dillon and duhwho will be productive in Lefluer's system. But how does that move the needle to overtake the better teams ahead of us??

Our defense isn't better, and it wasn't good enough last year; we have arguably the worst receiving Corp in the NFL; and Rodgers is all but out the door.

It's not "semantics", it's math and reality.

Add in the misses on Jackson, Burks, and maybe Gary... and it's easy to see the wheels spinning but not being good enough to win it all.

[Bretsky]

I think Dillon and duhwho will be productive in Lefluer's system. But how does that move the needle to overtake the better teams ahead of us??

Our defense isn't better, and it wasn't good enough last year; we have arguably the worst receiving Corp in the NFL; and Rodgers is all but out the door.

It's not "semantics", it's math and reality.

Add in the misses on Jackson, Burks, and maybe Gary... and it's easy to see the wheels spinning but not being good enough to win it all.



The day when I call Wist the voice of reason has arrived...... :)))))

[Bretsky]

I think Dillon and duhwho will be productive in Lefluer's system. But how does that move the needle to overtake the better teams ahead of us??

Our defense isn't better, and it wasn't good enough last year; we have arguably the worst receiving Corp in the NFL; and Rodgers is all but out the door.

It's not "semantics", it's math and reality.

Add in the misses on Jackson, Burks, and maybe Gary... and it's easy to see the wheels spinning but not being good enough to win it all.



You are right around the corner from admitting Pettine is really not that much better than Dom

[mraynrand]

I think Dillon and duhwho will be productive in Lefluer's system. But how does that move the needle to overtake the better teams ahead of us??

Our defense isn't better, and it wasn't good enough last year; we have arguably the worst receiving Corp in the NFL; and Rodgers is all but out the door.

It's not "semantics", it's math and reality.

Add in the misses on Jackson, Burks, and maybe Gary... and it's easy to see the wheels spinning but not being good enough to win it all.

OK, I get the critiques of missed picks. But that's not the point of your own thread. You rebuild when your roster is depleted and your HOF QB is out the door. The pros are still like college, except with a longer window of opportunity. You can't stay pat assuming your HOF QB is gonna play until he's 40. Colleges know their starting QB will graduate or leave a year early, so they keep recruiting. The Packers changed their coach. Most teams would have to alter their strategy after that. The Packers under TT and Stubby started drafting different players for his system. When Capers came in they drafted guys to play 3-4. Although not as big a shift, the Packers are moving to Flower Power offense, like it or not. It doesn't feel like a rebuild because Rodgers is playing through it and they never tanked to 1-4 wins. So it's a retool. Change on the fly. Hopefully, Rodgers will accept it and thrive. But the Packers now have a plan in place in case he doesn't.

[RashanGary]

I think the Packers are more committed to running the ball in Rodgers twilight and subscribe to TTs philosophy that the worst time to get a QB is when you need one

[RashanGary]

Everyone thought we were doomed last year too. This is just status quo at packerrats

[Packers4Glory]

Gute can’t draft. These 2 drafts make little sense when you factor in Gary at 12 last year. Spend in FA & draft projects early in drafts do not mesh. Pick one or the other. Not this. This makes no sense.

[Packers4Glory]

Someone please defend not investing capital early in these drafts since Jordy’s injury in getting a WR.

[sharpe1027]

If the running game improves with these picks enough to open things up for Rodgers, this thread won't agree well. If it doesn't, then it's hard to see how this start to the draft can be seen as anything but a big miss for the short term.

[George Cumby]

Gute can’t draft. These 2 drafts make little sense when you factor in Gary at 12 last year. Spend in FA & draft projects early in drafts do not mesh. Pick one or the other. Not this. This makes no sense.

This might be the case. It's too early to tell just yet but I'm leaning this direction.

[Packers4Glory]

This might be the case. It's too early to tell just yet but I'm leaning this direction.

I'm not even saying these 3 picks might not turn out to be good. They easily could.

However running backs can be had whenever and we didn't need to spend a 2nd round pick on one with the 2 headed machine we currently have. If a later one doesn't pan out as much we can look at it again next year.

Drafting a 6th round graded H-back in the 3rd also makes zero sense. we dind't need to reach for him, and even if we didn't get him, it's not a franchise breaking miss. again, there were bigger holes to fill on both lines, WR, and ILB. Even a DB would have made more sense there. to think that he was truly their highest rated player left on the board is either really insulting to us fans, or they're really that inept and making up a draft board.

[mraynrand]

Drafting a 6th round graded H-back in the 3rd also makes zero sense.

I'm skeptical about the reliability of the draft round grading systems. You build a team with the players you want. What was Kittle's draft round grade? He was picked in the fifth and fit SF's offense pretty well. Maybe he lasted that long because no one thought he would fit their O. Maybe the TE would have been drafted in the fourth had GB let him slide. Maybe to a team that liked what the Ravens have been doing, for example.

[Bretsky]

I'm skeptical about the reliability of the draft round grading systems. You build a team with the players you want. What was Kittle's draft round grade? He was picked in the fifth and fit SF's offense pretty well. Maybe he lasted that long because no one thought he would fit their O. Maybe the TE would have been drafted in the fourth had GB let him slide. Maybe to a team that liked what the Ravens have been doing, for example.

Klttle was projected to go about where he did


DRAFT PROJECTION Round 4

BOTTOM LINE H-back type who lacks the desired size for in-line blocking but certainly has the technique and willingness to do it. He has good hands and flashes an ability to challenge as a pass catcher on all three levels. Kittle has the athleticism and blocking ability to become an effective move tight end if paired in the right system.

[Smidgeon]

I'm not even saying these 3 picks might not turn out to be good. They easily could.

However running backs can be had whenever and we didn't need to spend a 2nd round pick on one with the 2 headed machine we currently have. If a later one doesn't pan out as much we can look at it again next year.

Drafting a 6th round graded H-back in the 3rd also makes zero sense. we dind't need to reach for him, and even if we didn't get him, it's not a franchise breaking miss. again, there were bigger holes to fill on both lines, WR, and ILB. Even a DB would have made more sense there. to think that he was truly their highest rated player left on the board is either really insulting to us fans, or they're really that inept and making up a draft board.

This is the Collins argument all over again. Let them play before you judge their value. You could be right. But "round grades" will always have appropriate exceptions.

[gbgary]

These picks do nothing to improve the 2020 team...

Dillion and Josiah Duhwtf will play and contribute, but their impact will be very modest.

Love of course is a long-term project - and a big project at that. He's got terrible mechanics, is inaccurate, makes poor decisions, and makes an incredible number of poor throws. He's got one hell of a long way to go before he can even serve as the game day backup.

So, given that this draft is going to provide no help this year, and Rodgers will be one year closer to calling it a career - the following might be our near term reality:

1) Rodgers will certainly be gone after 2022, if not 2021.

2) P Smith is on a 3 year deal and is likely gone after 2021.

3) Ditto for Amos.

4) Z Smith is on a 4 year deal and will be over 30, so he's gone thereabouts.

5) Bacteria will probably be gone after 2020.

6) Jones will be gone next year.

7) Adam's will be getting long in the tooth.

That's 3-4 years with no realistic shot at a Championshp, and a pretty depleted roster by 2022.

We can't expect Gute will do anything to actually flesh out the roster - so I'm guessing our best hope is that we fail spectacularly enough to be able to dump Gute and Lefluer after the 2022 season.

That's the only lipstick I can put on this pig. Horrific last 2 days for the Green Bay Packers.

pretty much if they keep rodgers for 2-3 more years but i think they'll take the $5m and start the rebuild after 2020 if rodgers doesn't fully give in and run MLF's system the way he wants it run. no more mashup offense. all the old shit rodgers loves so much gone. 2019 was a wasted year in that process...except MAYBE it showed rodgers that shit doesn't work anymore. if he gives in that'll buy him 2021...but then he's gone for sure and they'll save $17m+ and it's love's turn. lol

[pbmax]

except MAYBE it showed rodgers that shit doesn't work anymore. if he gives in that'll buy him 2021...but then he's gone for sure and they'll save $17m+ and it's love's turn. lol

Going 13-3 with the offense out performing the defense is a funny way to show that something doesn't work.

Much more likely that 2019 showed that in this offense Jamaal WiIliams is no enough as a featured back even if he can pass block AND that the TE position was horrible.

I also take it that The Flower wasn't too keen on Danny Vitale as an offensive option.

[mraynrand]

Much more likely that 2019 showed that in this offense Jamaal Williams is not enough as a featured back even if he can pass block AND that the TE position was horrible.

exactly.

[wist43]

ALL 5 GUYS AT PFF GAVE THE PACKERS AN



F

LOT OF LAUGHING

[Bretsky]

ALL 5 GUYS AT PFF GAVE THE PACKERS AN



F

LOT OF LAUGHING




Can you post the Link ?

I know at Pro Football Focus in an interview I listed to message was basically they are saying GB is setting themselves up for down the road

[GB-Brandon]

ALL 5 GUYS AT PFF GAVE THE PACKERS AN



F

LOT OF LAUGHING

Like i said Thursday.

“GREEN BAY BROWNS”.

And everyone jumped down my throat.

[Fritz]

I don't think Wist is right about a complete rebuild. He's posted that the Packers should trade the Smiths, trade Rogers when it's possible, trade everyone of value, start over. Blow it all up because this draft has been so horrible. I disagree.

I don't think Wist goes far enough. I think the Packers should move the franchise to another city altogether, and rename the team. Fuck it. If Gute and The Flowe and Murphy messed it up that damn bad, they don't deserve to have an NFL franchise to run.

[GB-Brandon]

These people that want to live in “Never Ever Land” will be brought to there knees when we’re 2-14

[Bretsky]

I don't think we're going there. I think if healthy Rodgers still gets us to 7; call it 9 or 10 and an early bounce from the playoffs and another late draft pick in round one next year.

I also think Gutebag will sign a WR who gets cut as a FA between now and the start of the season

[GB-Brandon]

Wow, how uninformed and just plain wrong you are.

To start with, following the replacing of Ted Thompson as GM, Brian Gutekunst took a Packers team that was faltering under Mike McCarthy and players mostly acquired by the former GM and with new coaches/players helped the Packers to a 13-3 regular season record, an NFC North Division title, and a spot in the NFC Championship game. I'd say that that should garner some well deserved respect for GB's current GM and HC.

Next, no GM on any NFl team has an unlimited supply of money to spend. Hiring players "on the cheap" can also be looked at as, responsibility managing a teams resources to acquire the best players that the team can afford. We hear these same whiners every year, but like last season they groan and then they cheer over acquisitions like the two Smiths.

Last, the disparity between the 2018 and 2019 Utah State Football teams is not Jordan Loves fault. The 2019 team lost a ton of Seniors from the 2018 team and the school changed Head Coaches from 2018 to 2019. The 2019 coaches ordered players like Love to take greater risk with the football as they were losing games. Love's 2019 record at Utah State reflects the poor coaching that he was obligated to obey.

Experts agree that Jordan Love has superior physical skills. His decision making skills have come into question (due to his 2019 Utah State season), but I believe that a change of environment./team will serve to justify GB's confidence in him. Furthermore, as he comes under the wings of the GB coaches, I believe that he could emerge as the hoped for future of the Packers.


Then enjoy the “Pipe Dream”

[George Cumby]

ALL 5 GUYS AT PFF GAVE THE PACKERS AN



F

LOT OF LAUGHING

This has meaning if we have a comparison set of data.

Not saying it isn't accurate, but, historically, how on point are their grades?

[GB-Brandon]

I don't think we're going there. I think if healthy Rodgers still gets us to 7; call it 9 or 10 and an early bounce from the playoffs and another late draft pick in round one next year.

I also think Gutebag will sign a WR who gets cut as a FA between now and the start of the season

I’m pretty sure Rodgers is frustrated with this incompetence more then me. He might say go play “Love” and get me the hell out of here.

I know i would of if they ignored getting me any help year and year and just pissing in my face.

[GB-Brandon]

See, some people are already doing it. Go out and make all these stupid and ignorant moves which basically disgrace Rodgers and then run back to Rodgers to save us.

That shit is done.

It’s over. The a Packer organization is gonna have to figure this out all on their own this time.

[George Cumby]

Rodgers isn't saving shit. His play has really fallen off.

Adding a power running back and a TE who can block and catch only helps him in the latter part of his career.

I'm not in love with this draft, but I can convince myself there is a method to the madness.

[mraynrand]

Of course. The draftnicks said the Packers needed WR ILB and OT. Since they didn’t get those, the grade is F. So what?

[George Cumby]

Of course. The draftnicks said the Packers needed WR ILB and OT. Since they didn’t get those, the grade is F. So what?

Right. Because who really knows how the Packers brass grades their current players and what their needs are?

[GB-Brandon]

Well I’m sorry. If the Packer Brass thinks we have the offensive line in play to show off some big Power Run Game and command that way then they are thoroughly delusional. Adding a Power back and an H-Back to existing pieces isn’t even close.

This is a “Clown Show Rebuild”

[MadtownPacker]

Fuck Rodgers feelings.

[GB-Brandon]

Rodgers isn't saving shit. His play has really fallen off.

Adding a power running back and a TE who can block and catch only helps him in the latter part of his career.

I'm not in love with this draft, but I can convince myself there is a method to the madness.

Of course he isn’t saving shit cause we haven’t given him shit to do much of anything. It’s a miracle he is doing what he has.

[RashanGary]

I'm skeptical about the reliability of the draft round grading systems. You build a team with the players you want. What was Kittle's draft round grade? He was picked in the fifth and fit SF's offense pretty well. Maybe he lasted that long because no one thought he would fit their O. Maybe the TE would have been drafted in the fourth had GB let him slide. Maybe to a team that liked what the Ravens have been doing, for example.

That kittle mentality works in the NFL. Just having that is a big shiny feather in any prospects cap.

[RashanGary]

Fuck Rodgers feelings.

:lol:

[Bretsky]

This draft has the Michigan Tarzan/Jane pick written all over it

[RashanGary]

People who dont like the Packers OL didn't watch a lot of football last year. Marshmallow started for NE last year and was a turnstile like we haven't seen since Barbre. The Panthers went through a stretch where their guys were getting bull dozed play after play with no answer for four quarters.

Pack got #6 grade from PFF. That is realistic.

SF and Indy only two who were clearly better last year .

[GB-Brandon]

Trade Rodgers to New England and let him win a couple Super Bowls instead of having to deal with this “Clown Show”

[Bretsky]

I did get a kick out of a positive AROD interview last week when he noted since GB drafted him they haven't selected a round one offensive player at the talent ...or whatever they call it..position........and he was looking forward to seeing what they do early on.

Hey AROD, they drafted the first round one guy at a talent position since you..................it was a QB...............lol

[texaspackerbacker]

Take this idiotic rebuild shit and shove it up your ass - anybody seriously swallowing that crap.

[RashanGary]

EDIT: I needed a refresher. Dallas and NO had some great stretches too.

[Bretsky]

People who dont like the Packers OL didn't watch a lot of football last year. Marshmallow started for NE last year and was a turnstile like we haven't seen since Barbre. The Panthers went through a stretch where their guys were getting bull dozed play after play with no answer for four quarters.

Pack got #6 grade from PFF. That is realistic.

SF and Indy only two who were clearly better last year .


Wagner is nowhere near Bulago
Turner is average
They C is good but not great
Back is very good

They are cohesive and decent but they won't be able to overpower any good DL. Well maybe ours and all that Northwestern Power.....but not a good DL

[MadtownPacker]

Maybe we should be asking if Mr Eyerolls is getting what he deserves. More embarrassment after the niner bitch slapping he took.

[Bretsky]

Take this idiotic rebuild shit and shove it up your ass - anybody seriously swallowing that crap.



Another 13-3 year Tex ?

[GB-Brandon]

It’s like all these Packer Fans can’t get enough of the “Clown Show”

Everyone just loves a good Circus I guess.

[RashanGary]

Wagner is nowhere near Bulago
Turner is average
They C is good but not great
Back is very good

They are cohesive and decent but they won't be able to overpower any good DL. Well maybe ours and all that Northwestern Power.....but not a good DL

True. More smart and steady than dominant.

[Bretsky]

Maybe we should be asking if Mr Eyerolls is getting what he deserves. More embarrassment after the niner bitch slapping he took.

That is a fair point

I listened to an Ahman Green (great guy) interview last week and they asked him to compare Favre's mannerisms to Rodgers

He pointed out if you messed up Favre normally would react and note we'll get em next time

He also pointed out all these Rodgers eyerolls and mannerisms are not healthy for the team and the WR's go back and watch film and notice them.

[MadtownPacker]

Another 13-3 year Tex ?Yep. Rodgers start 1-2 gets knocked out. Love Machine comes in and takes a 12-1 journey.

[Fritz]

These people that want to live in “Never Ever Land” will be brought to there knees when we’re 2-14

Never Ever Land?

Dude, you are like an Old Testament Prophet, but you've got to work on those literary references.

[GB-Brandon]

Take this idiotic rebuild shit and shove it up your ass - anybody seriously swallowing that crap.

Well it’s either a “rebuild” or a “purge”

That’s your choice to make.

[Bretsky]

True. More smart and steady than dominant.

agree, like Rodgers

Smart and steady...the recipe for being good

[RashanGary]

But with smart and steady, along with a very smart and steady QB, along with some nice run/pass personnel...... You can mix things up and have a whole style that works. Not a shove it down your throat group, more of a well rounded group.

It's different than the dominant pass teams we're used to and different than the dominant run teams we envy.

But it has its advantages to be so well rounded. Will be fun to see some sick bowling ball runs where dbs get injured mixed with some sick precision passes to Adams, mixed with some back breaking first downs where the defense guesses run and some back breaking first downs where the defense guesses pass.

It's a good offense. Im buying.

[Bretsky]

Yep. Rodgers start 1-2 gets knocked out. Love Machine comes in and takes a 12-1 journey.


That would be pretty dam Funny

I thought a Super Bowl with Rodgers was still possible Mad; top rated group of WR's ever to come into the NFL Draft. About 10 guys that can start right away and make an immediate impact. And they are gone

[Bretsky]

But with smart and steady, along with a very smart and steady QB, along with some nice run/pass personnel...... You can mix things up and have a whole style that works. Not a shove it down your throat group, more of a well rounded group.

It's different than the dominant pass teams we're used to and different than the dominant run teams we envy.

But it has its advantages to be so well rounded. Will be fun to see some sick bowling ball runs where dbs get injured mixed with some sick precision passes to Adams, mixed with some back breaking first downs where the defense guesses run and some back breaking first downs where the defense guesses pass.

It's a good offense. Im buying.



I'll say the obvious again; with this roster you have to assume about a dozen if's will happen . We will be good, not great...steady, not dominant. Playoffs, and done soon after

[GB-Brandon]

Now the Niners are in “Put the Pedal to the Metal Mode”

Go look at that draft. Thats called setting yourself up to win.

If you can’t look at our draft and see “Rebuild” then you got more problems then being a Packer fan.

[RashanGary]

As Rodgers evolves into a generational field general, the diverse personnel highlight Rodgers well rounded skillset as well as his elite decision making.

[Bretsky]

As Rodgers evolves into a generational field general, the diverse personnel highlight Rodgers well rounded skillset as well as his elite decision making.


If Rodgers becomes a game manager we can't afford to draft projects; the talent around him is just not that good.

[MadtownPacker]

That would be pretty dam Funny

I thought a Super Bowl with Rodgers was still possible Mad; top rated group of WR's ever to come into the NFL Draft. About 10 guys that can start right away and make an immediate impact. And they are goneDont get down yet B. My spidey sense is telling me all these dynamics are going to make for a interesting and successful season.

Rodgers pissed is always a good thing.

[RashanGary]

How the fuck is taking luxury pieces tanking. Most teams are just trying to patch up their nightmare trench situations and we're getting specialized pieces to put the offense over the top as a run/pass team.thst highlights our QBs decision-making qualities.

Fuck. If it's not the most win now decision making around a very specific QB skillset I've ever seen than it's pure, fuck it, I'm not even trying.

Investing in trenches is the most common sense, long lasting approach that ever existed. We're adding final pieces to a puzzle or just giving up.

[Bretsky]

Prosche might be ok for where we are at. He's a player; wonders what his RAS is ?

[RashanGary]

If Rodgers becomes a game manager we can't afford to draft projects; the talent around him is just not that good.

Rodgers is a game manager. He's not Wilson or Mahommes anymore. He's a cross between Brady and the athletes. Still has the arm and movement of prime Brady but now has the decision making of weathered Brady. He's a generational game manager. And game managers win. Brady, Aikman, Eli, etc. AR is an elite game manager and now he has the tools to manage a whole variety of attack methods

[Bretsky]

He's better than you think....and I'm not a Rodgers Homer......... I give you Mahommes and Wilson

Who else do you take over Aaron Rodgers in a single game ? Not many. He's probably still top 5 or 7 at worst.

[GB-Brandon]

Never Ever Land?

Dude, you are like an Old Testament Prophet, but you've got to work on those literary references.

Then call it “Hell” or “NFL Football Purgatory”

Bottom line is if your a Packer fan your not gonna have much fun for a long long time.

It will take a Lombardi like god to deliver us out of this.

[GB-Brandon]

Rodgers is a game manager. He's not Wilson or Mahommes anymore. He's a cross between Brady and the athletes. Still has the arm and movement of prime Brady but now has the decision making of weathered Brady. He's a generational game manager. And game managers win. Brady, Aikman, Eli, etc. AR is an elite game manager and now he has the tools to manage a whole variety of attack methods

Watch him go win two Super Bowls with Belichick and you can sit around and go “But But But But But abut But”

Our organization has lost there Fucken minds.

[Bretsky]

Rodgers isn't saving shit. His play has really fallen off.

Adding a power running back and a TE who can block and catch only helps him in the latter part of his career.

I'm not in love with this draft, but I can convince myself there is a method to the madness.


His play has fallen but his decision making is what carried us. Most guys would be throwing picks left and right to the plethora of talent we throw out there at WR

[Teamcheez1]

As Rodgers evolves into a generational field general, the diverse personnel highlight Rodgers well rounded skillset as well as his elite decision making.

If Rodger's decision-making does not improve from last year, it will be a long season.

[gbgary]

If Rodger's decision-making does not improve from last year, it will be a long season.

yup. he passed up a lot of open guys to end up taking a sack, throwing it away, or just missing a throw to someone else.

[Bretsky]

From CBS LOSERS of the NFL Draft


QB Losers
Aaron Rodgers

Look, I don't want to doubt Rodgers, who might be the best quarterback I've ever seen. But … he's not that guy anymore, and he hasn't been that guy in at least three years — arguably five! Rodgers, who is tied for the career lead in touchdown percentage (among quarterbacks who debuted after 1963, at least) at 6.0%, hasn't been above a 4.6% mark in either of his past two seasons. He has only been above average in yards per attempt twice in the past five seasons and is coming off a pedestrian 7.0 mark. He can't be counted on to just elevate mediocre talent, but the Packers seem to have no interest in upgrading his passing game weapons. That could be seen as a vote of confidence in Davante Adams and Allen Lazard, except the Packers made no significant moves to upgrade the receiving corps a year ago, either. I'm deeply confused by the Packers approach in the draft — which included an heir apparent to Rodgers, despite the latter being under contract at a significant cap hit through at least 2022, and a third running back with their first two picks — but I don't know how you could argue it was good for Rodgers. His team is letting him down in the twilight of his career,

[wist43]

He's better than you think....and I'm not a Rodgers Homer......... I give you Mahommes and Wilson

Who else do you take over Aaron Rodgers in a single game ? Not many. He's probably still top 5 or 7 at worst.

Brees, Mahomes, Wilson, Garoppalo, Jackson, Brady, Wentz, Murray, Stafford... probably a few more.

All of those QB's are, as of today, better than Rodgers.

[GB-Brandon]

If Rodger's decision-making does not improve from last year, it will be a long season.

How could it improve? He is still gonna have the same scrub receivers that for the most part can’t get open.

Nothing changes is Nothing changes. Does that make sense?

[call_me_ishmael]

Brees, Mahomes, Wilson, Garoppalo, Jackson, Brady, Wentz, Murray, Stafford... probably a few more.

All of those QB's are, as of today, better than Rodgers.

Jimmy G is not better than Rodgers. The rest, maybe.

[wist43]

Okay guys... I agree Rodgers play has fallen off considerably, but as I noted in another post, given enough talent around him, even Nick Foles can win a Super Bowl.

Which is why Gutes reboot in this draft is just disgusting.

[GB-Brandon]

Brees, Mahomes, Wilson, Garoppalo, Jackson, Brady, Wentz, Murray, Stafford... probably a few more.

All of those QB's are, as of today, better than Rodgers.

I disagree. Just about all those QB’s have far more weapons then Rodgers. It’s hard to get a real pulse on Rodgers right now due to brand new scheme and lack of playmakers within the system.

[GB-Brandon]

Jimmy G is not better than Rodgers. The rest, maybe.

Either is Murray, Stanford or Wentz. Lol

[Upnorth]

Brees, Mahomes, Wilson, Garoppalo, Jackson, Brady, Wentz, Murray, Stafford... probably a few more.

All of those QB's are, as of today, better than Rodgers.

You cannot believe garoppalo and went are better... hell I don't think it is hard to see Stafford as inferior. And Brady? I don't know. I agree with the top 5 or 7 statement of bretsky

[wist43]

I disagree. Just about all those QB’s have far more weapons then Rodgers. It’s hard to get a real pulse on Rodgers right now due to brand new scheme and lack of playmakers within the system.

But a lot of those struggles were on Rodgers.

If you looked at the all 22's, and endzone shots when they showed them, Rodgers would simply not look at guys who were wide open - and a lot of times if he did look at them, he wouldn't pull the trigger.

It is why I wasn't as down on Graham as most of you guys b/c he was actually open a lot, but Rodgers simply had tunnel vision for Adams, and we were punting on the next play.

Perhaps Gute and Lefluer looked at that repeatedly happening, couldn't get Rodgers to come around, and that is why they decided to reset??

I don't know of course... but on the surface what they are doing makes no sense without some underlying reason that we're unaware of.

[wist43]

You cannot believe garoppalo and went are better... hell I don't think it is hard to see Stafford as inferior. And Brady? I don't know. I agree with the top 5 or 7 statement of bretsky

Wentz certainly had a better year statistically last year, and Garoppolo is in his prime and very talented. Stafford is better too.

Rodgers is still a serviceable starter, but no way can he carry a team like he used to.

The fact that Gute did absolutely nothing to improve the team for next year, tells us all we need to know about what they think of Rodgers.

Gute's draft this weekend was all about 3 years from now - when Rodgers will no longer be on the team.

[Carolina_Packer]

I'm skeptical about the reliability of the draft round grading systems. You build a team with the players you want. What was Kittle's draft round grade? He was picked in the fifth and fit SF's offense pretty well. Maybe he lasted that long because no one thought he would fit their O. Maybe the TE would have been drafted in the fourth had GB let him slide. Maybe to a team that liked what the Ravens have been doing, for example.

Kittle was good at Iowa, but his game went to another level in San Fran. Perhaps Iowa didn't ask him to do some of the things that he's being asked to do now. Credit to any fifth rounder who take advantage of the opportunity, and sticks around, but he's clearly also worked very hard. Clearly, he was underappreciated coming out.

Dillon, for example, was not asked to catch passes, but in the post-season all star games and workouts, showed a good ability to do so, which is a plus. He has also indicated he wants to be great at blitz pickup, which will be necessary to play on more obvious passing third downs. If he can bring both dimensions, as well as his size, speed and running ability, he can be a weapon. I'm glad they got him, given that both established backs are in their final year of their respective contracts.

[Bretsky]

Not sure about the grading,but this one definitely fails the eye test

If somebody would have posted our players Gutebag took five days ago and asked, how would you like this...all of our reactions would have been......WHAT the F'ck !

[Bretsky]

Brees, Mahomes, Wilson, Garoppalo, Jackson, Brady, Wentz, Murray, Stafford... probably a few more.

All of those QB's are, as of today, better than Rodgers.



I think your crazy Wist. Give those guys our WR's and they'd be throwing double the picks as Rodgers and about the same for TD's. n

[GB-Brandon]

But a lot of those struggles were on Rodgers.

If you looked at the all 22's, and endzone shots when they showed them, Rodgers would simply not look at guys who were wide open - and a lot of times if he did look at them, he wouldn't pull the trigger.

It is why I wasn't as down on Graham as most of you guys b/c he was actually open a lot, but Rodgers simply had tunnel vision for Adams, and we were punting on the next play.

Perhaps Gute and Lefluer looked at that repeatedly happening, couldn't get Rodgers to come around, and that is why they decided to reset??

I don't know of course... but on the surface what they are doing makes no sense without some underlying reason that we're unaware of.

It’s somewhat of a mystery. I will agree that Rodgers was up and down most of the season. There are times he looked really good and others where it was frustrating to watch. I don’t think that other then Adams that he had much confidence in these guys.

MVS for example. There was a game mid to late season. Can’t exactly remember but Scantling beat coverage and was streaking down field and Rodgers put the ball downfield right on him in which would of been an easy TD and Scantlng whiffed it. I’m pretty sure at that moment Rodgers was done with Scantling. Now we also saw Rodgers miss some throws that he normally makes too. Also, under extreme pressure in the cold in a playoff game he made some big time throws. As far as I’m concerned that’s still my guy. It’s not like Rodgers can’t make all the throws anymore. We all know what happened against the Niners.

I also think LaFluer and Rodgers were bumping heads a little and some of that was even seen during games.

Here is My bottom line with it all and why I’m so shocked. They went 13-3 in the first year of a brand new scheme. Even Bakh said recently that were all gonna play a little faster next year in the the 2nd year of the scheme. I expect a little improvement maybe in Lazard and some of the others but not earth shattering. Rodgers is tweeting and talking of excitement of possibly getting offensive firepower early in the draft. So with things not going perfectly optimal on offense but going into the second year of the scheme it makes perfect sense to me that the next step is getting the HOF QB some upgraded weapons. To me it’s just a no-brainer.

To me the next step isn’t going and trading up for a QB in round 1 and ignoring all receivers all draft long in one of best and deepest receiver classes of all time.

To me the next step isn’t bringing injury proned Devin Funches as your only upgrade.

There has to be some internal issue going on between Rodgers, Gute and LaFluer. I also think Gute is an ego freak. He has done everything pretty much in his power to jettison anything with Thompson’s name on it as soon as he could. He wants it to be “his team”

As i explained in another post I don’t belive the Packers brought in the right people when McCarthy and Thompson were let go.

[wist43]

I think your crazy Wist. Give those guys our WR's and they'd be throwing double the picks as Rodgers and about the same for TD's. n

I think too much was made of our lack of production being the fault of the receivers.

While I do believe we are sorely lacking for talent at WR, I dont put it all on them, Rodgers was a big part of the problem too.

I will c/p my post from above as explanation.


But a lot of those struggles were on Rodgers.

If you looked at the all 22's, and endzone shots when they showed them, Rodgers would simply not look at guys who were wide open - and a lot of times if he did look at them, he wouldn't pull the trigger.

It is why I wasn't as down on Graham as most of you guys b/c he was actually open a lot, but Rodgers simply had tunnel vision for Adams, and we were punting on the next play.

Perhaps Gute and Lefluer looked at that repeatedly happening, couldn't get Rodgers to come around, and that is why they decided to reset??

I don't know of course... but on the surface what they are doing makes no sense without some underlying reason that we're unaware of.

[mraynrand]

But a lot of those struggles were on Rodgers.

If you looked at the all 22's, and endzone shots when they showed them, Rodgers would simply not look at guys who were wide open - and a lot of times if he did look at them, he wouldn't pull the trigger.

It is why I wasn't as down on Graham as most of you guys b/c he was actually open a lot, but Rodgers simply had tunnel vision for Adams, and we were punting on the next play.

Perhaps Gute and Lefluer looked at that repeatedly happening, couldn't get Rodgers to come around, and that is why they decided to reset??

Maybe they're lighting a fire under his ass. And protecting themselves if it doesn't work. My best guess is that 1) they aren't deliberately trying to sabotage themselves. 2) they aren't complete morons and can actually coach and run an organization and 3) maybe aren't great, but have a clue and 4) since they brought in Flower, maybe they thought they should go all in and run his offense and 5) if Rodgers doesn't like it, he can get bent.

[wist43]

It’s somewhat of a mystery. I will agree that Rodgers was up and down most of the season. There are times he looked really good and others where it was frustrating to watch. I don’t think that other then Adams that he had much confidence in these guys.

MVS for example. There was a game mid to late season. Can’t exactly remember but Scantling beat coverage and was streaking down field and Rodgers put the ball downfield right on him in which would of been an easy TD and Scantlng whiffed it. I’m pretty sure at that moment Rodgers was done with Scantling. Now we also saw Rodgers miss some throws that he normally makes too. Also, under extreme pressure in the cold in a playoff game he made some big time throws. As far as I’m concerned that’s still my guy. It’s not like Rodgers can’t make all the throws anymore. We all know what happened against the Niners.

I also think LaFluer and Rodgers were bumping heads a little and some of that was even seen during games.

Here is My bottom line with it all and why I’m so shocked. They went 13-3 in the first year of a brand new scheme. Even Bakh said recently that were all gonna play a little faster next year in the the 2nd year of the scheme. I expect a little improvement maybe in Lazard and some of the others but not earth shattering. Rodgers is tweeting and talking of excitement of possibly getting offensive firepower early in the draft. So with things not going perfectly optimal on offense but going into the second year of the scheme it makes perfect sense to me that the next step is getting the HOF QB some upgraded weapons. To me it’s just a no-brainer.

To me the next step isn’t going and trading up for a QB in round 1 and ignoring all receivers all draft long in one of best and deepest receiver classes of all time.

To me the next step isn’t bringing injury proned Devin Funches as your only upgrade.

There has to be some internal issue going on between Rodgers, Gute and LaFluer. I also think Gute is an ego freak. He has done everything pretty much in his power to jettison anything with Thompson’s name on it as soon as he could. He wants it to be “his team”

As i explained in another post I don’t belive the Packers brought in the right people when McCarthy and Thompson were let go.

I was willing to wait and see on Gute and Lefluer... and I loved Gute's offseason last year.

This offseason is just mystifying to me though. This draft, even if some of these players pan out, is indefensible.

[wist43]

Maybe they're lighting a fire under his ass. And protecting themselves if it doesn't work. My best guess is that 1) they aren't deliberately trying to sabotage themselves. 2) they aren't complete morons and can actually coach and run an organization and 3) maybe aren't great, but have a clue and 4) since they brought in Flower, maybe they thought they should go all in and run his offense and 5) if Rodgers doesn't like it, he can get bent.

And all of that adds up to rebuilding.

[GB-Brandon]

I want Rodgers to demand a trade. I want him to go somewhere where he actually gets some of the things he has earned the right to have. I’d love to see what him and Belichick could do together in a situation that actually promotes all of his talents and allows him to flourish.

I am sick and tired of the Green Bay Packers organization cutting him off at the knees and yes it’s basically sabotage. Fuck LaFleur!! He is nowhere close to Rodgers greatness!!!

[George Cumby]

I think the team is in need of a name change.

The Green Bay Rodgers.

[call_me_ishmael]

Either is Murray, Stanford or Wentz. Lol

Stafford is really damn good and tough, just in a perpetually bad situation. Wentz is really damn good and absolutely better than Rodgers the past two years.

[GB-Brandon]

Let’s copy the Tennessee Titans. They are such the gold standard of success. There big offensive philosophy has produced so many championships.

It’s just Amazing!!!

[call_me_ishmael]

I want Rodgers to demand a trade. I want him to go somewhere where he actually gets some of the things he has earned the right to have. I’d love to see what him and Belichick could do together in a situation that actually promotes all of his talents and allows him to flourish.

I am sick and tired of the Green Bay Packers organization cutting him off at the knees and yes it’s basically sabotage. Fuck LaFleur!! He is nowhere close to Rodgers greatness!!!

Why would you want your best player to demand a trade? It kind of sounds like you're not much of a fan.

[GB-Brandon]

Stafford is really damn good and tough, just in a perpetually bad situation. Wentz is really damn good and absolutely better than Rodgers the past two years.

Stanford gets a little limp though sometimes in pressure time. Throws too many picks too.

Yeah he puts up a lot of yards but yeah.

You might need a mental health evaluation if you chose Stafford over Rodgers.

[GB-Brandon]

Why would you want your best player to demand a trade? It kind of sounds like you're not much of a fan.

I am a fan. Born in the city: go to the games. Die Hard.

I’m sick and Fucken tired of it. He has made this shit ass front office look way smarter then they fucken are.

I am tired of them not supporting him. These jackass’s have cost him being the hands down Goat and the Packers having more Super Bowls.

And then Fuck Face Gute pulls this shit and doesn’t give him one Fucken weapon other then an H-Back and a short yardage ball carrier.

It’s bullshit. Rodgers deserves a chance to win another Super Bowl rather then always trying to save face for the same assholes that cut him off at the knees.

[Massive J]

Fuck Rodgers feelings.


yup. he passed up a lot of open guys to end up taking a sack, throwing it away, or just missing a throw to someone else.


I think the team is in need of a name change.

The Green Bay Rodgers.

Somebody had to say it. :-)

[wist43]

Why would you want your best player to demand a trade? It kind of sounds like you're not much of a fan.

I agree with trading Rodgers... we're a good team, but not legitimate contenders. The Niners kicked the ever lovin fuck out of us 2x last year, they've improved, we haven't. The Saints, Bucs, Cowboys, Seahawks, Eagles, Chiefs, Ravens and probably Cardinals are all better than we are.

Everything Gute has done this offseason has been about the team after Rodgers; so, trade him while he still has a little bit of value and move on. He gets to go to an organization that is in win now mode, we get rid of the circus atmosphere and drama, and get a draft pick.

We're not winning a SB in the next 4 years, so just trade him and move on.

[mraynrand]

And all of that adds up to rebuilding.

Maybe they’re pretty much rebuilt.

[pbmax]

These people that want to live in “Never Ever Land” will be brought to there knees when we’re 2-14

No. We just know the difference between tire fire and boiling over on the stove.

[pbmax]

Maybe they’re pretty much rebuilt.

wist has switched the tape deck to his greatest hits from 2008 and 2013.

[ThunderDan]

I want Rodgers to demand a trade. I want him to go somewhere where he actually gets some of the things he has earned the right to have. I’d love to see what him and Belichick could do together in a situation that actually promotes all of his talents and allows him to flourish.

I am sick and tired of the Green Bay Packers organization cutting him off at the knees and yes it’s basically sabotage. Fuck LaFleur!! He is nowhere close to Rodgers greatness!!!

We literally cannot trade ARod for 2 years. The cap hit would destroy us.

[Teamcheez1]

We literally cannot trade ARod for 2 years. The cap hit would destroy us.

In two years, Rodgers will be a shell of his former self or out of football.

[Joemailman]

We literally cannot trade ARod for 2 years. The cap hit would destroy us.

Cannot now. But there would be cap savings of almost 5 million if cut or traded following 2020 season.

[HarveyWallbangers]

I thought that was after the 2021 season. At the time Rodgers contract would be reasonable, so he might be a trade asset.

[pbmax]

He can be traded in combination with a post June designation (disclaimer: I do not know whether its possible to designate a trade post-June, but this guy thinks it is) this summer.

https://cheeseheadtv.com/blog/can-the-packers-trade-aaron-rodgers-if-so-when-520?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter


2020: Post June Trade - YES

$1.964M cap savings in 2020*. The Packers would have to take $14.352M in a signing bonus proration and $5.24M for the roster bonus just paid as dead money charges in 2020. That would result in $1.964M in cap saving for 2020. It leaves a dead money charge in 2021 of $31.556M. Since Rodgers' scheduled cap number for 2021 is $36.352M, the team would have $4.796M more in cap space than overthecap is currently projecting for 2021. Note with Covid-19, the expected increase in the salary cap is problematic.

[wist43]

wist has switched the tape deck to his greatest hits from 2008 and 2013.

Well we're certainly back at the crossroads of 9-7/10-6 in perpetuity vs going for championships.

TT/Gute's philosophy is 9-7/10-6 in perpetuity, and that's what most of you guys prefer. Myself, I want Lombardi Trophies.

I was very happy with Gute's offseason last year, but this year he did a 180, and told Rodgers to fuck off in the process.

Gutes draft this weekend closed the door on any hope of winning another title in the Rodgers era.

[GB-Brandon]

Aaron could be willing to restructure his deal in an effort to make a trade happen with the condition that he approves the trade partner.

A trade with New England for example which would allow Rodgers to win a couple more Super Bowls and further cement the genius of Belichick. This would work for Gute and Flower because the Packers have like zero chance of seeing Rodgers in Super Bowl.

If Rodgers is as upset as I’ve been hearing i don’t see any reason why he wouldn’t be willing to do this.

[GB-Brandon]

Time to let Aaron Rodgers go and move on.

[GB-Brandon]

The other option is Rodgers could just flat out retire and sit out of a year and then ask for his release of rights later. He doesn’t need the $ anymore.

This is a move I like the most which throws the shit right back onto Gute and Bitch Boys face and forces these tools to play there big Pipe Dream replacement. Fucken Idiots.

There is zero reason other then $ to QB a rebuilding football team going nowhere that continues to undermine him.

[texaspackerbacker]

Idiocy. Sheeeesh.

[GB-Brandon]

Idiocy. Sheeeesh.

I know. The Packers don’t want to win as badly as Rodgers wants too!!!

[Bretsky]

IMO here's the reality

Gutebag over estimates the talent on his own roster

[wist43]

Okay fellas, here is a PFF podcast from today... Steve and Sam. Very knowledgeable guys. Have a lot of respect for both these guys

Winners and losers... they do winners first, so of course we're not in that segment, lol. They start in on the Packers at the 50 minute mark, and spend the next 20 minutes trying to wrap their brains around the idiocy that is Gute's draft. Sam even throws in a clip from White Men Can't Jump :)


https://youtu.be/IiGlyRkkJnA

[Rastak]

Okay fellas, here is a PFF podcast from today... Steve and Sam. Very knowledgeable guys. Have a lot of respect for both these guys

Winners and losers... they do winners first, so of course we're not in that segment, lol. They start in on the Packers at the 50 minute mark, and spend the next 20 minutes trying to wrap their brains around the idiocy that is Gute's draft. Sam even throws in a clip from White Men Can't Jump :)


https://youtu.be/IiGlyRkkJnA


Yea, PFF was not a huge fan from what I read outside of that podcast, which I should listen to.

[wist43]

For the record...

- I like Dillon as a player - Don't like the pick though.

- QB's are pretty much impossible to evaluate, so who knows how Love will turn out. Your guess is as good as Gutes.

- Duhwho will be used as an H-back/FB. They'll scheme gadget/motion plays for him and use him as a lead blocker for Dillon.

- No one else from this class will be able to contribute anything to this years team. All of them are strictly developmental/PS/ST guys.

----------------------------------------------------------

As I said in the OP, this draft is all about 3-4 years down the line. Rodgers is all but done in Green Bay - probably after this year.

Aaron Jones is gone when he hits UFA. Same thing for Linsley, and maybe Bacteria too.

Lefluer wants to run 60-65% of the time, and gadget/scheme a minimal passing game - don't really need good WR's to do that.

[wist43]

Yea, PFF was not a huge fan from what I read outside of that podcast, which I should listen to.

Vikings are one of their winners...

All 3 of the other NFC North teams got better.

Green Bay is still the betting favorite in Vegas with an o/u wins of 9.5

Green Bay 9.5
Minnesota 9
Chicago 8.5
Detroit 6.5

Everyone is expecting GB to decline.

[GB-Brandon]

For the record...

- I like Dillon as a player - Don't like the pick though.

- QB's are pretty much impossible to evaluate, so who knows how Love will turn out. Your guess is as good as Gutes.

- Duhwho will be used as an H-back/FB. They'll scheme gadget/motion plays for him and use him as a lead blocker for Dillon.

- No one else from this class will be able to contribute anything to this years team. All of them are strictly developmental/PS/ST guys.

----------------------------------------------------------

As I said in the OP, this draft is all about 3-4 years down the line. Rodgers is all but done in Green Bay - probably after this year.

Aaron Jones is gone when he hits UFA. Same thing for Linsley, and maybe Bacteria too.

Lefluer wants to run 60-65% of the time, and gadget/scheme a minimal passing game - don't really need good WR's to do that.

I agree with all this except I don’t believe they will re-sign Bakh. He isn’t a perfect fit for what they want to do and Gute doesn’t want anything with Thompson’s name on it on the roster. This is also the same reason Kenny Clark won’t get resigned either.

It’s a Total Rebuild.

I don’t think Rodgers is even coming back this year as there isn’t much reason too but to get an injury that ends his career. If the season is called then i can almost guarantee he won’t be back ever.

[Bretsky]

Okay fellas, here is a PFF podcast from today... Steve and Sam. Very knowledgeable guys. Have a lot of respect for both these guys

Winners and losers... they do winners first, so of course we're not in that segment, lol. They start in on the Packers at the 50 minute mark, and spend the next 20 minutes trying to wrap their brains around the idiocy that is Gute's draft. Sam even throws in a clip from White Men Can't Jump :)


https://youtu.be/IiGlyRkkJnA




Thanks for posting Wist; these are entertaining and give us more of a non bias national view all over

[GB-Brandon]

Thanks for posting Wist; these are entertaining and give us more of a non bias national view all over

I posted 5 national views in another thread. They all said pretty much the same thing.

[GB-Brandon]

Vikings are one of their winners...

All 3 of the other NFC North teams got better.

Green Bay is still the betting favorite in Vegas with an o/u wins of 9.5

Green Bay 9.5
Minnesota 9
Chicago 8.5
Detroit 6.5

Everyone is expecting GB to decline.

Oh I’m sure fans around the division are doing kart wheels over this last 3 day event. I know my phone has been blowing up by rival fans friends I have.

[texaspackerbacker]

Some of ya'all really seem to eat up this media shit. Those assholes are a bunch of know nothings. Your average Packer fan has a better grasp on what this team is doing than those assholes. And by average fan, I sure as hell don't mean ya'all negativist fools.

[ThunderDan]

Some of ya'all really seem to eat up this media shit. Those assholes are a bunch of know nothings. Your average Packer fan has a better grasp on what this team is doing than those assholes. And by average fan, I sure as hell don't mean ya'all negativist fools.

So we didn’t need to improve our WR, DL, ILB and OL.

We went out and got a bunch of OL, that’s about it from our needs list.

[pbmax]

So we didn’t need to improve our WR, DL, ILB and OL.

We went out and got a bunch of OL, that’s about it from our needs list.

Well, not in the draft. But they did sign Funchess and the Canadian guy at WR.

And they signed Kirksey at ILB, who is a better talent at LB than Martinez if healthy.

DL is UDFAs plus street FA. Not sure what is there.

The help there just didn't come from the draft.

[Fritz]

I agree with all this except I don’t believe they will re-sign Bakh. He isn’t a perfect fit for what they want to do and Gute doesn’t want anything with Thompson’s name on it on the roster. This is also the same reason Kenny Clark won’t get resigned either.

It’s a Total Rebuild.

I don’t think Rodgers is even coming back this year as there isn’t much reason too but to get an injury that ends his career. If the season is called then i can almost guarantee he won’t be back ever.


Well, now I can say I've been around forever, because it's all come around, full circle. The section above in boldface type is EXACTLY what the criticism of Thompson was the first few years he was the GM. Wow.

You can apparently just dredge up all the old shit, plug in the new names, and boom, you've got your post.

The parallels between what people said after Rodgers got drafted are also there. Such disrespect to such a dedicated, golden quarterback - not getting him the piece or pieces he needs for that one more SuperBowl.

On that note, I know QB is the most important position, but I wonder if guys playing other positions, who have players drafted at their position ALL THE TIME with no one ever saying anything, get a little irked that somehow it's sacreligious to draft a QB while Rodgers is here.

[pbmax]

Well, now I can say I've been around forever, because it's all come around, full circle. The section above in boldface type is EXACTLY what the criticism of Thompson was the first few years he was the GM. Wow.

You can apparently just dredge up all the old shit, plug in the new names, and boom, you've got your post.

The parallels between what people said after Rodgers got drafted are also there. Such disrespect to such a dedicated, golden quarterback - not getting him the piece or pieces he needs for that one more SuperBowl.

On that note, I know QB is the most important position, but I wonder if guys playing other positions, who have players drafted at their position ALL THE TIME with no one ever saying anything, get a little irked that somehow it's sacreligious to draft a QB while Rodgers is here.

When critics have no evidence, they resort to mind reading.

[Upnorth]

The more I think about this draft the more I'm actually liking it. They have a theme, a goal that they plan for and they executed it. Since day one the flower has preached running game and this draft definitely was running game heavy. This draft if average should help the team for the foreseeable future. Unless flower gets fired and they get a new philosophy, then boy they screwed the pooch.
If love turns into a top 10 QB and we stick with this philosophy and the rest of the draft is average in results this is a cornerstone draft for the future of the team.

I, fan with limited knowledge, wanted wr addressed, and ilb and te in that order. They, professionals who have shown potential, went the direction the coach has planned for. I'm becoming very optimistic about this draft.

[mraynrand]

When critics have no evidence, they resort to mind reading.

That's really what you think, isn't it?

[Fritz]

The more I think about this draft the more I'm actually liking it. They have a theme, a goal that they plan for and they executed it. Since day one the flower has preached running game and this draft definitely was running game heavy. This draft if average should help the team for the foreseeable future. Unless flower gets fired and they get a new philosophy, then boy they screwed the pooch.
If love turns into a top 10 QB and we stick with this philosophy and the rest of the draft is average in results this is a cornerstone draft for the future of the team.

I, fan with limited knowledge, wanted wr addressed, and ilb and te in that order. They, professionals who have shown potential, went the direction the coach has planned for. I'm becoming very optimistic about this draft.

I don't know that I;'m optimistic, as you are, but I do agree with you that they do have a plan and clearly are implementing that plan. The Flower has a specific idea of the offense and Gutes is getting the players that fit that idea. Whether it works or not, we will see. But plugging (buttplugging?) the holes with a shiny new piece and hoping the hodgepodge will work out seems more reminiscent of the last couple of years under MM (though this was not all his fault; still, that whole "re-evaluating the offense" theme of the last few years seemed to revolve around getting slightly different pieces to try to get Rodgers to take them over the top).

Whereas MM gave lip service to the run, over and over, but abandoned ship pretty quickly (not saying this was wrong; just saying that's what seemed to happen),, it appears The Flower is really, really committing to running the ball and passing off play action. This could actually help Rodgers lengthen his career.

Still, I am in the camp that wanted a wide receiver fairly early on. But we'll see how it all goes.

[wist43]

Well, not in the draft. But they did sign Funchess and the Canadian guy at WR.

And they signed Kirksey at ILB, who is a better talent at LB than Martinez if healthy.

DL is UDFAs plus street FA. Not sure what is there.

The help there just didn't come from the draft.

The problem max is that means we're going to be status quo from last year, and last year we weren't good enough.

Let me hear your argument that says we surpassed SF, NO, and now Dallas, TB, and SEA??

[sharpe1027]

The problem max is that means we're going to be status quo from last year, and last year we weren't good enough.

Let me hear your argument that says we surpassed SF, NO, and now Dallas, TB, and SEA??

Fair point, but I question whether expecting a rookie WR (even one in the first late round) to put us above those teams is realistic. If not, then we fail by that measure regardless.

[GB-Brandon]

The more I think about this draft the more I'm actually liking it. They have a theme, a goal that they plan for and they executed it. Since day one the flower has preached running game and this draft definitely was running game heavy. This draft if average should help the team for the foreseeable future. Unless flower gets fired and they get a new philosophy, then boy they screwed the pooch.
If love turns into a top 10 QB and we stick with this philosophy and the rest of the draft is average in results this is a cornerstone draft for the future of the team.

I, fan with limited knowledge, wanted wr addressed, and ilb and te in that order. They, professionals who have shown potential, went the direction the coach has planned for. I'm becoming very optimistic about this draft.

Yes, “the theme” which i explained in another thread. They traded in the sports car for a Fucken pick up truck. Nothing against pick up trucks but there a dime a dozen and you can pretty much get one at any time. High valued sports cars are much more difficult to obtain and are fewer and farther between.

My point is they could of done this switch at any time. There was zero reason to do it now coming off a 13-3 season. This has become what an2nd year GM and 1st year head coach felt more comfortable with. Meaning they don’t know what the hell to do with a Sports Car.

[GB-Brandon]

Fair point, but I question whether expecting a rookie WR (even one in the first late round) to put us above those teams is realistic. If not, then we fail by that measure regardless.

Once again there has been a lack of effort regarding this for years.

[GB-Brandon]

You can put Jordan Love pick over to the side for a second and look at the rest of the draft. I would say the premise is obviously clear.

[GB-Brandon]

Once again there has been a lack of effort regarding this for years.

Rookie WR won’t produce? How about drafting players in the 1st round two years in a row that won’t even get off the Bench?

[Upnorth]

Yes, “the theme” which i explained in another thread. They traded in the sports car for a Fucken pick up truck. Nothing against pick up trucks but there a dime a dozen and you can pretty much get one at any time. High valued sports cars are much more difficult to obtain and are fewer and farther between.

My point is they could of done this switch at any time. There was zero reason to do it now coming off a 13-3 season. This has become what an2nd year GM and 1st year head coach felt more comfortable with. Meaning they don’t know what the hell to do with a Sports Car.

I love your analogy and think it makes me even more optimistic for this draft. sports cars look awesome, sound awesome, work at high level for a short period and then break down or need major retooling.

pickup trucks just do the dam work. you got to get a decent one or its garbage, but you can expect it to get the job done.
there seems to be less and less starting quality qbs around so switching to a run base is going to spread and as it spreads d will catch up then we swing back to pass. so be in front of the curve, which we are right now with this draft.
earlier on some one asked if this put us in front of some team in the NFL. the only one we really aren't in front of is SF. Dallas, Philly,sea - I don't see how you can say we are behind them. NO, I don't know but it will be interesting. .. TB, if gronk is a healthy gronk I don't see anyone who can match them with their other receivers, just too much. trubisky would look like a probowler there. if gronk is just a jag, I think we have them beat. so SF is an issue. perhaps Arizona as well. but a rookie wr who was anything short of randy Moss in his rookie season ain't moving that needle. you want to catch them, win in the trenches. rookie rb have more impact than any other rookie position from what I have seen, so you want to close the gap in one year perhaps a bowling ball is what we need. plus they lost Joe Staley....

[Packers4Glory]

So we didn’t need to improve our WR, DL, ILB and OL.

We went out and got a bunch of OL, that’s about it from our needs list.

they did nothing but throw up hail mary's hoping 2 things get fixed. DL and WR.

the 2 things they really needed to fix they mostly stood pat. nobody was brought in to seriously shore those areas up. Funchess isn't a difference maker and doesn't have a high ceiling. they didn't draft a single player to help those 2 areas. DL they signed a cut dolphin player. odds are he's JAG.

[GB-Brandon]

I love your analogy and think it makes me even more optimistic for this draft. sports cars look awesome, sound awesome, work at high level for a short period and then break down or need major retooling.

pickup trucks just do the dam work. you got to get a decent one or its garbage, but you can expect it to get the job done.
there seems to be less and less starting quality qbs around so switching to a run base is going to spread and as it spreads d will catch up then we swing back to pass. so be in front of the curve, which we are right now with this draft.
earlier on some one asked if this put us in front of some team in the NFL. the only one we really aren't in front of is SF. Dallas, Philly,sea - I don't see how you can say we are behind them. NO, I don't know but it will be interesting. .. TB, if gronk is a healthy gronk I don't see anyone who can match them with their other receivers, just too much. trubisky would look like a probowler there. if gronk is just a jag, I think we have them beat. so SF is an issue. perhaps Arizona as well. but a rookie wr who was anything short of randy Moss in his rookie season ain't moving that needle. you want to catch them, win in the trenches. rookie rb have more impact than any other rookie position from what I have seen, so you want to close the gap in one year perhaps a bowling ball is what we need. plus they lost Joe Staley....

I’m a Badger fan so I Love SMASH MOUTH. I had Dillion in some of my mocks and I think He is gonna be a star. That H-back they got is tough as nails and can catch. Jenkins(who they got last year) and Billy Turner are road graders. They basically added another 3 tough as nails type interior OL in the draft. Wagner who they brought in is a power RT. He just isn’t as good a pass blocker as Bulaga.

There is no doubt LaFluer wants to beat people up like the Niners did to us last year. Some scars were obviously created from that game and our front office said fuck it. We’re gonna kick some peoples teeth in cause it don’t feel good when ours got kicked in. It’s a copy cat league.

I’m not rooting against it. If Gute makes a trade or brings someone in at the WR position I’ll change my toon. I hope they can pull it off.

[GB-Brandon]

We need Dillon to be the next Earl Campbell!!!!

[texaspackerbacker]

We don't NEED Dillon at all. He might be an upgrade from our very adequate #2 RB. Hopefully, Jamal Williams becomes primarily our fullback and Dillon is good enough to rotate with Jones as RB.

[GB-Brandon]

“Power Football” and let Aaron win it at the end. Go get another receiver Gute.

[GB-Brandon]

We don't NEED Dillon at all. He might be an upgrade from our very adequate #2 RB. Hopefully, Jamal Williams becomes primarily our fullback and Dillon is good enough to rotate with Jones as RB.

I disagree. Dillon is gonna be a huge part of this offense. Jones won’t even be re-singed.

[pbmax]

That's really what you think, isn't it?

Its what critics think I think.

I think.

[pbmax]

The problem max is that means we're going to be status quo from last year, and last year we weren't good enough.

Let me hear your argument that says we surpassed SF, NO, and now Dallas, TB, and SEA??

You don't know that those teams are improved.

Packers beat Dallas and Seattle. Beat Vikes twice and they beat NO in NO.

TB who knows what to expect.

San Fran remains a matchup problem.

[wist43]

You don't know that those teams are improved.

Packers beat Dallas and Seattle. Beat Vikes twice and they beat NO in NO.

TB who knows what to expect.

San Fran remains a matchup problem.

So your argument that we've improved is that those other teams might not have improved??

That's your argument??

[GB-Brandon]

I will say Seattle didn’t do much. They have two RB’s coming off big injuries. They brought in a bunch of old foggies and don’t have Clowney re-signed. They have zero pass rush on there roster.

[GB-Brandon]

Dallas has massive problems on defense that they ignored.

[GB-Brandon]

NO has a QB that could fall off at any moment.

[GB-Brandon]

The Niners are the target. Gute needs to get another receiver and hope we can play them tough and let Rodgers win game at the end.

Only Chance. But there are also things called injuries etc etc. so we see.

[pbmax]

So your argument that we've improved is that those other teams might not have improved??

That's your argument??

You are guessing.

We do know the Packers were the better team last year versus all but SF.

[pbmax]

So your argument that we've improved is that those other teams might not have improved??

That's your argument??

Or you can hav Harv's version where the improvement you think you see in the draft is belied by losses to veterans.


49ers and Vikings got players (mostly younger players) to replace the players they lost.

49ers traded for Trent Williams to replace a retiring Joe Staley, drafted Javon Kinlaw to replace a traded DeForest Buckner, drafted Brandon Aiyuk to replace Emmanuel Sanders. They also traded Matt Breida. Is that a roster upgrade for 2020? What else have they done?

The Vikings lost Stefon Diggs, Linval Joseph, Everson Griffin, their top three CBs, and some complementary pieces (Weatherly, OL, Kearse, Sendejo, etc.). I think they had a nice draft, but they have a lot to replace. For this year I don’t think they are better.
Long-term, they are. I don’t know if Cousins is somebody they can trust to win 3-4 games in the playoffs.

Seattle has mostly treaded water, and their draft doesn’t look any better than the Packers draft.

Dallas looks scary, but they always do.

Tampa Bay looks talented, but Brady fell off a lot last year.

Saints and Eagles are tough, but New Orleans hasn’t exactly been a playoff juggernaut. They won the year before we did, and have been massive playoff disappointments since.

49ers are still the team to beat IMHO. There are a lot of good teams in the NFC. This draft seemed to be all about Gutey getting guys the Flower wanted.

I am personally less worried about NO.

[Bossman641]

It's almost like Gute zagged when the rest of the league zigged. Everyone else saw the Chiefs and is chasing speed and explosiveness at the skill positions. Gute/MLF went the Tenn/SF route instead. The problem is we don't have a defense as stout as either of those teams.

[wist43]

It's almost like Gute zagged when the rest of the league zigged. Everyone else saw the Chiefs and is chasing speed and explosiveness at the skill positions. Gute/MLF went the Tenn/SF route instead. The problem is we don't have a defense as stout as either of those teams.

I think it's pretty obvious that Gute and Lefluer want to move on from Rodgers as soon as possible.

To that end, draft his replacement, spit in his face by not giving him what he wanted, i.e better receivers, and pound away in the draft chasing scheme/philosophy changing players.

I actually agree with the power approach, always have. But, and it's a big but, that is not the personnel or QB they inherited - a HOF QB - so, given our QB and his credentials, Lefluer was the wrong hire since he and Gute were determined to force change.

It was always destined to end like this - I see it now that we're here, but I didn't see it coming to tell you the truth. I thought Gute and Lefluer would try to maximize Rodgers while he was here - I was wrong.

[GB-Brandon]

I didn’t sleep Thursday Night or Friday Night. The whole thing was rather traumatic. Part of the reason I moved back here and bought a home near Lambeau Field was because of the New GM(Gute) and believed it was the “Green Light” to get Rodgers finally what he needed. It’s basically been three drafts and offseason of the opposite. It’s so crazy that yes you start to think sabotage. I have sat here from my couch and watched film and studied weapons every offseason and was able to pin point guys that the Packers passed on. The list of some of them includes mainly down below. These are guys that i thought should of been targeted and coveted prior to the draft.

Joe Mixon
Courtland Sutton
Calvin Ridley
Parris Campbell
Deebo Samuel
AJ Brown
DK Metcalf
Brandon Aiyuk
Jalen Reagor
Denzel Mimms
Tee Higgins

Now a few of these guys would of required moving around the board but the point is the Packers moved around the board for players such as Jordan Love and Darnell Savage under Gute. They moved up for Spriggs under Thompson so they can do it.

The fact is Gute and his team are professional scouts so they had to see the value in some of these guys. If they didn’t then I question there credentials. To never draft one or maneuver to get one has to make you wonder what the underlying motivation is/was.

I still love being in Green Bay during football season and head south after the season but this has been a real bummer with this Rodgers thing.

It’s like what could of been.

[Bretsky]

I have you ask where you heard this Brandon; I was a big Eliott Wolf guy and I wanted them to hire Hoody Genius JR ...aka...the best OC in the NFL as our head coach. I heard Flower came in with a list of DC's and Petine was at the top

You reference the new coaching needing to bring Petine to get the job and JMAC said no way

Where did you hear this ? It makes sense to me how this went down but i"m curious

[GB-Brandon]

Not only did they not get any of those guys but they took it a step farther and didn’t draft a receiver in the last two entire drafts and haven’t taken one as early as the second round since Devante Adams.

[GB-Brandon]

I have you ask where you heard this Brandon; I was a big Eliott Wolf guy and I wanted them to hire Hoody Genius JR ...aka...the best OC in the NFL as our head coach. I heard Flower came in with a list of DC's and Petine was at the top

You reference the new coaching needing to bring Petine to get the job and JMAC said no way

Where did you hear this ? It makes sense to me how this went down but i"m curious

You hear things in this community. Its possible to run into an old Packer having a few drinks at a bar or hear other noise. I’m not here to spread rumors. I thought it was common knowledge that McDanials wanted the job and a lot of control and it was never gonna work with asshole egomaniac Mark Murphy. One of those main things was the new coach having to retain Mike Pettine. From there if you remember the whole thing with McDanials stalled. LaFluer was looking for his first big coaching opportunity and of course was willing with Pettine so the rest is history. I believe McDaniels more or less ran from the job after realizing the power structure in place.

To me the Packer Power structure has been abused. That’s why i sometimes refer to it as “dysfunctional”. It was like they did this big fake clean up job getting rid of Capers and Thompson and then McCarthy. If you look deeper Murphy is still at the top of the totem pole somehow and really nothing has changed other then Gute spending a few more dollars one year in free agency.

I only talk of this now because of what there doing too AR12. People can think what they want about Aaron but he has been a warrior for this franchise. He does massive outreach in the community for kids stuggling with diseases. Just a lot of things he doesn’t have to do. I think he is overly misunderstood. If i was Rodgers I would be demanding a trade after everything he has done.

So yeah hear we are in 2020 turning into some power running team. We’ll see what happens.

[George Cumby]

To me the Packer Power structure has been abused.


This makes sense.

[sharpe1027]

They seemed to be focused on an improved running game.

Let's assume for a moment the goal wasn't to stick it to Rodgers and give up on next year. If the running game is more reliable in the sense of consistently churning out 3-4 yard chunks in early downs, how much better would the team be?

[Packers4Glory]

I have you ask where you heard this Brandon; I was a big Eliott Wolf guy and I wanted them to hire Hoody Genius JR ...aka...the best OC in the NFL as our head coach. I heard Flower came in with a list of DC's and Petine was at the top

You reference the new coaching needing to bring Petine to get the job and JMAC said no way

Where did you hear this ? It makes sense to me how this went down but i"m curious

That was my dream when Ted was gone and they fired MM. I was definitely more aboard the JMac train than the GM because I really didn't have a feel either way other than I wanted something different than Ted's philosophy of simply draft building. So my preference was Wolf. I would even have preferred Dorsey.

[Packers4Glory]

You hear things in this community. Its possible to run into an old Packer having a few drinks at a bar or hear other noise. I’m not here to spread rumors. I thought it was common knowledge that McDanials wanted the job and a lot of control and it was never gonna work with asshole egomaniac Mark Murphy. One of those main things was the new coach having to retain Mike Pettine. From there if you remember the whole thing with McDanials stalled. LaFluer was looking for his first big coaching opportunity and of course was willing with Pettine so the rest is history. I believe McDaniels more or less ran from the job after realizing the power structure in place.

To me the Packer Power structure has been abused. That’s why i sometimes refer to it as “dysfunctional”. It was like they did this big fake clean up job getting rid of Capers and Thompson and then McCarthy. If you look deeper Murphy is still at the top of the totem pole somehow and really nothing has changed other then Gute spending a few more dollars one year in free agency.

I only talk of this now because of what there doing too AR12. People can think what they want about Aaron but he has been a warrior for this franchise. He does massive outreach in the community for kids stuggling with diseases. Just a lot of things he doesn’t have to do. I think he is overly misunderstood. If i was Rodgers I would be demanding a trade after everything he has done.

So yeah hear we are in 2020 turning into some power running team. We’ll see what happens. These guys are not going to like Aaron if this thing starts off poorly. I think we'll see some passive little shots as we build up to the season at the braintrust but if the wheels are wobbly 4-6 weeks in, I think it's going to go to a whole new level. He has every right to be pissed.

They've turned him into a game manager because aside from Adams nobody is open, so he just throws the ball away and lives to fight another down. Nobody can get separation. They tried to fix the TE spot with 2 old FA signings and neither worked out. I'm encouraged at what I saw from JS but it's still a giant question and no real solution if that fails. We've had some good luck in 2nd rounds with WR so it made no sense to go try and sign the next Henry at RB. He'd probably have been there in the 3rd anyway. and then the new TE in the 5th or 6th.

Instead of following the speed kills blueprint of KC we're trying to look like the Titans crappy offense when MF was in charge of that. It makes little sense. Aaron can still wing it but damn he needs a little help outside of Adams.

[GB-Brandon]

They seemed to be focused on an improved running game.

Let's assume for a moment the goal wasn't to stick it to Rodgers and give up on next year. If the running game is more reliable in the sense of consistently churning out 3-4 yard chunks in early downs, how much better would the team be?

There making some pretty damn good progress building there scheme. I’m not doubting that at all. Still you look at teams like the Niners and they have multiple weapons in the passing game and always adding(Deebo Samuel 2nd round, Brandon Aiyuk 1st round, Sanders was a trade). Same with the Titans with Aj Brown and Cory Davis (1st and 2nd round picks).

We’re soft here. Maybe they finally address it next year but that might be too late. I think a quick way to salvage the situation is to make a trade for a guy like AJ Green(just using him as an example). You do something like that and you ease Rodgers and give him a clearer 2-3 year window to go after it. They would get the draft pick back used for the trade when they decide to trade Rodgers so they could essentially leverage the Love pick. Doing something like this would put ease on what some believe to be a toxic situation.

This would be amazing and a best case scenario IMO.

I believe Gute can salvage this if he is willing too.

[wist43]

They seemed to be focused on an improved running game.

Let's assume for a moment the goal wasn't to stick it to Rodgers and give up on next year. If the running game is more reliable in the sense of consistently churning out 3-4 yard chunks in early downs, how much better would the team be?

What I think happened is Rodgers went off script far too much for Lefluer's liking; and, combined with his whining, and at times subpar play - that was the result of him wanting to do it his way - resulted in Gute and Lefluer simply deciding to press forward with their plan without any consideration to or for Rodgers.

The result is going to be a divorce - most likely after next season.

I expect the team will regress. They overachieved last year and will come back to the mean. There'll be some angst and finger pointing and I told ya so - and he'll be traded.

If Carr doesn't move the needle this year in Vegas, probably to the Raiders. At least that seems like the most logical place.

[GB-Brandon]

What I think happened is Rodgers went off script far too much for Lefluer's liking; and, combined with his whining, and at times subpar play - that was the result of him wanting to do it his way - resulted in Gute and Lefluer simply deciding to press forward with their plan without any consideration to or for Rodgers.

The result is going to be a divorce - most likely after next season.

I expect the team will regress. They overachieved last year and will come back to the mean. There'll be some angst and finger pointing and I told ya so - and he'll be traded.

If Carr doesn't move the needle this year in Vegas, probably to the Raiders. At least that seems like the most logical place.


Oh yeah. Gruden and Mayock would make that happen in their sleep. Don’t count out the Chargers or Patriots either.

Unfortunately for us I believe the “separation” will happen before the divorce. I think the Packers are in for a big surprise and Gute Fucken deserves every bit of it.

[GB-Brandon]

These guys are not going to like Aaron if this thing starts off poorly. I think we'll see some passive little shots as we build up to the season at the braintrust but if the wheels are wobbly 4-6 weeks in, I think it's going to go to a whole new level. He has every right to be pissed.

They've turned him into a game manager because aside from Adams nobody is open, so he just throws the ball away and lives to fight another down. Nobody can get separation. They tried to fix the TE spot with 2 old FA signings and neither worked out. I'm encouraged at what I saw from JS but it's still a giant question and no real solution if that fails. We've had some good luck in 2nd rounds with WR so it made no sense to go try and sign the next Henry at RB. He'd probably have been there in the 3rd anyway. and then the new TE in the 5th or 6th.

Instead of following the speed kills blueprint of KC we're trying to look like the Titans crappy offense when MF was in charge of that. It makes little sense. Aaron can still wing it but damn he needs a little help outside of Adams.

I know. That’s why they are in love with Love. Think of Marriotta, Tannehill, Goff, Garapalo

That’s what they want.

All these people think it’s sooooooooo cool now. Let’s see in a couple years.

[Packers4Glory]

I know. That’s why they are in love with Love. Think of Marriotta, Tannehill, Goff, Garapalo

That’s what they want.

All these people think it’s sooooooooo cool now. Let’s see in a couple years.

I think Love has a much higher ceiling than those guys. It’s hard to say where the floor is based on 2018/2019 differences. So many factors at work. I think we know he has some learning to do on x’s & o’s so in 3 years he *should be ready if he has any football intelligence & can absorb some of Rodgers decision making processes.

Part of those issues the Titans team has was a lack of playmakers at WR. Just a shitty group for a young QB. You still need playmakers & guys who can separate & get open

[GB-Brandon]

I think Love has a much higher ceiling than those guys. It’s hard to say where the floor is based on 2018/2019 differences. So many factors at work. I think we know he has some learning to do on x’s & o’s so in 3 years he *should be ready if he has any football intelligence & can absorb some of Rodgers decision making processes.

Part of those issues the Titans team has was a lack of playmakers at WR. Just a shitty group for a young QB. You still need playmakers & guys who can separate & get open

I’m not so sure. Either year all I really see that’s special is some arm strength and an ability to whip the ball out in some situations kinda “Mahommes like”. That’s great but I’m not sold on the mental side of this kid hence the 17 picks at a much slower level of play at Utah State. Rodgers and Mahommes see the field in a genius like level. You can’t always teach it as the game just comes so fast and there are many many things to process. This LaFluer offense will help like it did for Tannehill so it’s possible.

To expect him to though to be Rodgers is just crazy. There will be lots of things to watch like how he handles NFL pass rushers, game speed, his ability to be a student of the game etc etc etc.

Only time will tell. I’m luke warm on the prospect and I’m ICE COLD on the timing of it.

People thought Kizer had tons of upside too. In fact Gute “had to have him”

[call_me_ishmael]

It's almost like Gute zagged when the rest of the league zigged. Everyone else saw the Chiefs and is chasing speed and explosiveness at the skill positions. Gute/MLF went the Tenn/SF route instead. The problem is we don't have a defense as stout as either of those teams.

I don't disagree in general but I would like to point out that SF is fast as hell and is trying to increase speed with everybody else. WAY faster than the Packers, as evidence by no one being to catch up with them.

[mraynrand]

What I think happened is Rodgers went off script far too much for Lefluer's liking; and, combined with his whining, and at times subpar play - that was the result of him wanting to do it his way - resulted in Gute and Lefluer simply deciding to press forward with their plan without any consideration to or for Rodgers.

One can only hope.

[pbmax]

This makes sense.

??!!

[sharpe1027]

I know. That’s why they are in love with Love. Think of Marriotta, Tannehill, Goff, Garapalo

That’s what they want.

All these people think it’s sooooooooo cool now. Let’s see in a couple years.

Yes, everyone's saying it soooooo cool. Look at all the posts saying how cool it is!!!

I think you made your point, 50 times over.

[pbmax]

The part I love about the power play conspiracy theory is that its apparently been underway since the 2014 draft.

[wist43]

The part I love about the power play conspiracy theory is that its apparently been underway since the 2014 draft.

I guess you've been too busy polishing all those Lombardi Trophies from the past 9 years to notice??

Inject some more of that green and gold heroin max ;)

Ted and his philosophy wasted 15 years of HOF QB play, and all we got was 1 Lombardi... I know you're alright with that, but I'm not.

[mraynrand]

I guess you've been too busy polishing all those Lombardi Trophies from the past 9 years to notice??

All 9 of them are in SF, right?

[mraynrand]

Gloom and Doom:

Gloom = Wist43
Doom = GB-Brandon


You two bore the hell out of me

[pbmax]

I guess you've been too busy polishing all those Lombardi Trophies from the past 9 years to notice??

Inject some more of that green and gold heroin max ;)

Ted and his philosophy wasted 15 years of HOF QB play, and all we got was 1 Lombardi... I know you're alright with that, but I'm not.

The non-falsifiability of your "NO MOR SUPER BOWLS" predictions are boring. The rants are ok.

But when your theory of what is wrong with the Packers approach collects EVERY TEAM except the Patriots, it doesn't offer much.

[mraynrand]

But when your theory of what is wrong with the Packers approach collects EVERY TEAM except the Patriots, it doesn't offer much.

But..but..but...every team doesn't have RODGERS, or FAVRE....They are wasting the careers of the two greatestestest QBs ever because THEY REFUSE TO SURROUND THEM WITH THE TALENT THEY NEED TO WIN!

[pbmax]

You draft a WR in the first two rounds, you have a shot with a rookie WR of getting to play in the NFC Championship Game - 2014

You don't draft a WR in the first two rounds, you have a shot with UDFA WR of getting to play in the NFC Championship Game - 2016

You don't draft a WR in the first two rounds, you have a shot with UDFA WRs of getting to play in the NFC Championship Game - 2019

You draft a WR in the first two rounds, you have a shot with a rookie WR of getting to play in the NFC Championship Game - 2020

[GB-Brandon]

The non-falsifiability of your "NO MOR SUPER BOWLS" predictions are boring. The rants are ok.

But when your theory of what is wrong with the Packers approach collects EVERY TEAM except the Patriots, it doesn't offer much.


Well sorta. The Packers “AND THE JETS” are the only two teams in the entire NFL not to draft an offensive Non-QB skill position player(WR,TE,RB) since 2002 in the 1st round.

Probably not a “Winning Formula” to be in the lead on any lists WITH THE JETS.

[pbmax]

But..but..but...every team doesn't have RODGERS, or FAVRE....They are wasting the careers of the two greatestestest QBs ever because THEY REFUSE TO SURROUND THEM WITH THE TALENT THEY NEED TO WIN!

The cascade effect is fun too. Like a Turing machine given a Twitter account:

1. Gute and La Fleur are dumb for trading up for a QB and then taking a RB and TE. Stephen A Smith doesn't agree that those were team needs.

2. Gute and LaFleur got distracted taking back control and sticking it Rodgers for calling audibles and leading the offense to be 8th in DVOA!

3. Drafting a future QB, RB and TE will not help the team this year! Look at the Cowboys smart drafting and all the Super Bowls it produces!

4. I mean, I like a more run-oriented, smash mouth offense like Jax or Tenn, but Rodgers doesn't!

5. He's such a pretty boy, prima donna, with his throwing not to the other team! I want him traded to make way for the new exotic smash mouth footballI I have been calling for all along!

6. Huzzah Gute and LaFleur, Rodgers has been the problem all along!

...Exist in a super position of rooting for failure by the front office and QB simultaneously for five more months...

7. Why is Rodgers still throwing the ball to Jones!

[pbmax]

Well sorta. The Packers “AND THE JETS” are the only two teams in the entire NFL not to draft an offensive Non-QB skill position player(WR,TE,RB) since 2002 in the 1st round.

Probably not a “Winning Formula” to be in the lead on any lists WITH THE JETS.

Don't get me wrong. I am a fan of BPA and BVA (best value) draft approaches, but I understand that when applied rigidly, you can get bad results.

The failures of devaluing WR, ILB and safety have long been evident. It would be relatively simple to work up a model that says you can win with safeties, ILBs, WR and RBs from any round, but you need high level talent at QB, LT, CB, DT and EDGE. But that workup doesn't tell you when the best thing you can do to improve the team is to deviate from that overall strategy.

Before I declare that they WAY under-estimated their need to trade up for Aiyuk in the first or Pittman in the second, I need to see them as pros and compare him to what Funchise gives them this year. Same with Queen and Kirksey.

[Packers4Glory]

[QUOTE=GB-Brandon;1059358]

Only time will tell. I’m luke warm on the prospect and I’m ICE COLD on the timing of it.

/QUOTE]

I like the prospect a lot. I dont' like the timing considering what we did in the 1st last year. But he's got all the tools you could hope for physically and you can coach what he needs. It's just a matter of can he soak it up and can we coach. I think Rodgers will be cool to him but he's not responsible for developing the kid.

[GB-Brandon]

The cascade effect is fun too. Like a Turing machine given a Twitter account:

1. Gute and La Fleur are dumb for trading up for a QB and then taking a RB and TE. Stephen A Smith doesn't agree that those were team needs.

2. Gute and LaFleur got distracted taking back control and sticking it Rodgers for calling audibles and leading the offense to be 8th in DVOA!

3. Drafting a future QB, RB and TE will not help the team this year! Look at the Cowboys smart drafting and all the Super Bowls it produces!

4. I mean, I like a more run-oriented, smash mouth offense like Jax or Tenn, but Rodgers doesn't!

5. He's such a pretty boy, prima donna, with his throwing not to the other team! I want him traded to make way for the new exotic smash mouth footballI I have been calling for all along!

6. Huzzah Gute and LaFleur, Rodgers has been the problem all along!

...Exist in a super position of rooting for failure by the front office and QB simultaneously for five more months...

7. Why is Rodgers still throwing the ball to Jones!

I think it’s actually more of this and that is a lot of us have been patiently waiting for the organization to help Rodgers out for quite some time now. We’ve seen bad decision after bad decision in regards to this and we have still hung in there hoping for the best over and over. I don’t believe most of us want the Packers to fail and it’s actually quite the opposite. We finally are at the point this year where we have ran out of chances/opportunities to do this. This was literally “The Last Dance” and these evil assholes go out and trade up for a QB and ignore the WR position all together. This is just ruthless and quite frankly is a black eye and an embarrassment to Green Bay Packer football.

It just amazes me at what length people will go to defend these guys. They could literally do anything and some people would cheer it on which is a huge part of the problem. So you wanna go and continue to throw your little Pom Poms on and cheer mediocrity on then go right ahead because not supporting your HOF QB sufficiently is pure mediocrity. No two ways about it.

Now it’s so big that national media is constantly talking about it and Rodgers is MIA. Vegas is getting ready to put up a betting line of when Rodgers leaves the Packers or gets traded. But yeah, keep those heads buried deep in sand.

[mraynrand]

Well sorta. The Packers “AND THE JETS” are the only two teams in the entire NFL not to draft an offensive Non-QB skill position player(WR,TE,RB) since 2002 in the 1st round.

Probably not a “Winning Formula” to be in the lead on any lists WITH THE JETS.

I’m trying to remember the round one WRs who played in the last two Packer SB victories.

[GB-Brandon]

Have some Fucken balls and trade Rodgers and play your Fucken fairy tale picks!!!!!!

If it’s so Fucken Great and Amazing then step the fuck up.

Quit playing all the little bitch chicken shit games.

Message to Fraud Fuck Gute!

[mraynrand]

It just amazes me at what length people will go to defend these guys.

That’s a nice straw man. Also, if you look in the mirror you’ll see a guy who does the exact same thing except as a photo negative. You are dreadfully boring, Doom.

[GB-Brandon]

Don't get me wrong. I am a fan of BPA and BVA (best value) draft approaches, but I understand that when applied rigidly, you can get bad results.

The failures of devaluing WR, ILB and safety have long been evident. It would be relatively simple to work up a model that says you can win with safeties, ILBs, WR and RBs from any round, but you need high level talent at QB, LT, CB, DT and EDGE. But that workup doesn't tell you when the best thing you can do to improve the team is to deviate from that overall strategy.

Before I declare that they WAY under-estimated their need to trade up for Aiyuk in the first or Pittman in the second, I need to see them as pros and compare him to what Funchise gives them this year. Same with Queen and Kirksey.


This is my biggest issue. This is thrown around as a spin tactic all the time and an excuse made by fans for the front office not to aggressively go after certain guys but when the same front office jumps off the reservation and “reaches” for other players all the sudden the defense becomes well maybe these particular guys were higher on the Packers board etc etc etc.

It’s just so hypocritical and such bullshit.

[GB-Brandon]

I’ve been nothing but consistent. I’ve actually gotten behind some of our picks so to call me “Doom and Gloom” is just ridiculous and childish.

It would be hard for me to believe that anyone gets as excited as I do about a Packer game. Just tired of the bullshit.

[Upnorth]

Have some Fucken balls and trade Rodgers and play your Fucken fairy tale picks!!!!!!

If it’s so Fucken Great and Amazing then step the fuck up.

Quit playing all the little bitch chicken shit games.

Message to Fraud Fuck Gute!

this completely reminds me of the mentality of the 2008 off season. But we still have a top 5-7 QB (or better) a likely better run game, a likely better receiving group (year three for a couple wr, year two for our pass catching te) slightly worse ol. Our weakest d link was ilb and it improved a little and savage is n year two.
While I would have liked to see a wr drafted, I think you have to be slightly more rational Brandon. step away from the ledge. or keep hanging out in the bottom of wists avatar.

[Deputy Nutz]

It would be hard for me to believe that anyone gets as excited as I do about a Packer game. Just tired of the bullshit.

You said you played some ball at a "high" level, why are you so invested? You were able to play the game at a "high" level. You got yours, why can't you enjoy this for what it is?

[wist43]

The non-falsifiability of your "NO MOR SUPER BOWLS" predictions are boring. The rants are ok.

But when your theory of what is wrong with the Packers approach collects EVERY TEAM except the Patriots, it doesn't offer much.

Well, your comparison falls apart because 3 teams had HOF QB's during that stretch (NO), and 1 of them is polishing trophies, and we're perpetually building for the future that only arrives once every 15 years??

What's wrong with that picture??

[GB-Brandon]

You said you played some ball at a "high" level, why are you so invested? You were able to play the game at a "high" level. You got yours, why can't you enjoy this for what it is?

Cause it never goes away number 1. Maybe it has something to do with what’s in the water in GB or getting baptized at birth by St Vince, not sure. I also don’t know how anyone can watch Aaron Rodgers play football and not get excited. It’s just not something you see everyday.

I played with pro QB’s and against along the way and I was a free safety so to me it’s just honoring greatness.

Wasn’t Vince Lombardi “All About Greatness”?

I’m not sure i understand the disconnect here.

[Deputy Nutz]

You just seem way over invested, and that is ok. Just most guys I know that played ball at a "high" level don't really invest too much time or passion into pro football

[oldbutnotdeadyet]

Cause it never goes away number 1. Maybe it has something to do with what’s in the water in GB or getting baptized at birth by St Vince, not sure. I also don’t know how anyone can watch Aaron Rodgers play football and not get excited. It’s just not something you see everyday.

I played with pro QB’s and against along the way and I was a free safety so to me it’s just honoring greatness.

Wasn’t Vince Lombardi “All About Greatness”?

I’m not sure i understand the disconnect here.

Mr Peabody, can we go back in time before the draft in the Way Back Machine cause I really enjoyed your posts back then. Now, they are getting old cause you won't stop bitching about something you can't change. All we can do as fans is either switch teams or ride it out hoping for the best.

[GB-Brandon]

You just seem way over invested, and that is ok. Just most guys I know that played ball at a "high" level don't really invest too much time or passion into pro football

Hey look. I’m not here to write an Autobiography. I’ve been challenged here across the board which is fine and the only reason i even brought it up was because you questioned “My Knowledge of football”.

The Green Bay Packers are a big part of my life and it is what it is. I have several friends that i played with throughout the years that are just as passionate about their respective favorite team.

[Deputy Nutz]

Do you have a daily Packer jacket that you wear?

[GB-Brandon]

Mr Peabody, can we go back in time before the draft in the Way Back Machine cause I really enjoyed your posts back then. Now, they are getting old cause you won't stop bitching about something you can't change. All we can do as fans is either switch teams or ride it out hoping for the best.

Trust me, I’d very much rather ENJOY writing posts about how the Packers are gonna smoke the rest of the NFL. As this shock is wearing off I am closely looking into some of these picks. I am on board with some of these picks also . I’m still trying to form some contrast around all of this.

At this point I’m gonna refrain from this subject until more news comes out or Gute does something big to alleviate the situation which is what I am hoping for.

If I do write posts regarding the situation in the near future i am going to keep them in this thread. I don’t see any wrong doing in having a thread to express how people really feel. If someone can’t stand to read it then please ignore this thread. I will focus my posts to what the other threads are themed after but you must understand sometimes these things have a part or parts in other things being discussed.

[GB-Brandon]

Do you have a daily Packer jacket that you wear?

Nope.

I’m too busy with my tin foil hat in my moms basement. :talk:

[pbmax]

Well, your comparison falls apart because 3 teams had HOF QB's during that stretch (NO), and 1 of them is polishing trophies, and we're perpetually building for the future that only arrives once every 15 years??

What's wrong with that picture??

That one is the outlier and NO is just like GB.

Think about past multiple winners:

Dallas was great for a stretch but its possible Aikman wasn't the best player on any of those teams.

San Fran was like GB and I wish we had drafted on D like they did in the 1980s. Outliers just like Patriots now. Though Young's one SB seems closer to the GB experience.

Washington got 3 superb owls without the same QB repeating. Possibly the most impressive coaching job outside of Belichick overcoming his GM.

[mraynrand]

I’ve been nothing but consistent. I’ve actually gotten behind some of our picks so to call me “Doom and Gloom” is just ridiculous and childish.

It would be hard for me to believe that anyone gets as excited as I do about a Packer game. Just tired of the bullshit.

EVIL!!

You are just “Doom.” Wist is “Gloom”

[Fritz]

Cause it never goes away number 1. Maybe it has something to do with what’s in the water in GB or getting baptized at birth by St Vince, not sure. I also don’t know how anyone can watch Drew Barrymore and not get excited. It’s just not something you see everyday.

I played with pro QB’s and against along the way and I was a free safety so to me it’s just honoring greatness.

Wasn’t Vince Lombardi “All About Greatness”?

I’m not sure i understand the disconnect here.

There you go.

[run pMc]

There you go.

LOL

[wist43]

That one is the outlier and NO is just like GB.

Think about past multiple winners:

Dallas was great for a stretch but its possible Aikman wasn't the best player on any of those teams.

San Fran was like GB and I wish we had drafted on D like they did in the 1980s. Outliers just like Patriots now. Though Young's one SB seems closer to the GB experience.

Washington got 3 superb owls without the same QB repeating. Possibly the most impressive coaching job outside of Belichick overcoming his GM.

Nobody has wanted a power running game more than me... you certainly didn't.

How many battles have we had - really me and everyone else in here, b/c you guys are such homers - over the years as you guys defended McCarthy's finesse running game, b/c of the type of OL they preferred??

So now we're transitioning to a power game, and that's fine, but you should always be "playing for now" if you have a HOF QB - unless the roster is too depleted to realistically make a run. In that case plan to build as quickly as possible and go for titles from there.

Gute and Lefluer did an awesome job last year - both of them. Gute filled some major holes, and Lefluer should have been COY in my opinion.

Then comes this offseason and Gute spends major draft capital and stops the momentum to draft a question mark for 4 years down the line?? That is straight out of WTF??

It is not the talk of league b/c everyone is dazzled by the brilliance of it; no, it is the talk of the League b/c everyone is baffled by the stupidity of it.

[mraynrand]

Wist, read slowly what you wrote. You answer the WTF that baffles you and the talking hairdos.

[wist43]

Wist, read slowly what you wrote. You answer the WTF that baffles you and the talking hairdos.

Now this is WTF?? :)

Have you been hitting the sacramental wine again??

[mraynrand]

Now this is WTF?? :)

Have you been hitting the sacramental wine again??

The answer to what puzzles you is in your own post.

[pbmax]

They are not, currently, transitioning to a power running game. Outside zone isn't power by scheme or style.

Now its possible that The Flower really wants to be run dominant but that hasn't happened yet. And it will take more than three O line drafted in the fifth round.

[wist43]

The answer to what puzzles you is in your own post.

I think you're puzzled :duel:

[wist43]

They are not, currently, transitioning to a power running game. Outside zone isn't power by scheme or style.

Now its possible that The Flower really wants to be run dominant but that hasn't happened yet. And it will take more than three O line drafted in the fifth round.

So according to max, we have no identity, we are not transitioning to anything, Rodgers is a happy camper, and the team is improved and steaming toward a championship??

Got it ;)

[GB-Brandon]

They are not, currently, transitioning to a power running game. Outside zone isn't power by scheme or style.

Now its possible that The Flower really wants to be run dominant but that hasn't happened yet. And it will take more than three O line drafted in the fifth round.

I don’t understand how this is so hard to understand. The draft gives you a clear vision of “what their doing” or “attempting to do”. This was draft a QB and bunch of “Big Ass’s and Bigs legs” literally so there is your direction. Then look at LaFluer’s background and principles and I believe it is pretty obvious there re-building into that. You also don’t move up and draft QB’s in the first round to sit on the bench forever. I am so so sorry that this is so hard for you.

Call it a Re-tool, Re-build, Change of Philosophy or whatever you want. The fact is their moving towards players to play out LaFluers principals. The real question is how long will it take them to complete it. That should be the narrative moving forward . We’re just wasting our time with all this DENIAL.

[GB-Brandon]

So according to max, we have no identity, we are not transitioning to anything, Rodgers is a happy camper, and the team is improved and steaming toward a championship??

Got it ;)

It’s called “DENIAL”.

[mraynrand]

So according to max, we have no identity, we are not transitioning to anything, Rodgers is a happy camper, and the team is improved and steaming toward a championship??

Got it ;)

not to POWER running as you claimed

[mraynrand]

I think you're puzzled :duel:

read it again

[esoxx]

I’m trying to remember the round one WRs who played in the last two Packer SB victories.

Andre Rison

Keith Jackson was listed as a TE but he was not there for his blocking.

[mraynrand]

Andre Rison

Keith Jackson was listed as a TE but he was not there for his blocking.

I actually totally forgot about Rison. :) :oops:

(hopefully we won't be in desperate need of a malcontent due to injuries this year...)

[GB-Brandon]

Antonio Brown is still out there.

[Sparkey]

https://www.acmepackingcompany.com/2020/4/28/21237982/packers-2020-draft-class-matt-lafleur-revamped-offense-aj-dillon-run-focus-play-action

[GB-Brandon]

I actually totally forgot about Rison. :) :oops:

(hopefully we won't be in desperate need of a malcontent due to injuries this year...)

Mike Holmgren has tons of funny stories about Rison.

[GB-Brandon]

https://www.acmepackingcompany.com/2020/4/28/21237982/packers-2020-draft-class-matt-lafleur-revamped-offense-aj-dillon-run-focus-play-action

Yeah there gonna try and “mix and match” all over the place but there still isn’t the necessary short area speed to stir the drink on the perimeter. It’s why the Niners traded up for Aiyuk.

Gotta have it to make this offense hum.

Rams are kinda the same deal.

[Bretsky]

https://www.acmepackingcompany.com/2020/4/28/21237982/packers-2020-draft-class-matt-lafleur-revamped-offense-aj-dillon-run-focus-play-action


Hope it works; that has to be about the least scary set of personnell I've ever heard

But gotta give the idea preps; since we don't have a bunch of WR talent just split out both backs !!

[GB-Brandon]

Hope it works; that has to be about the least scary set of personnell I've ever heard

But gotta give the idea preps; since we don't have a bunch of WR talent just split out both backs !!

You got ZERO to stress the safeties or the back end. It’s called “Double Devante” and everyone else sags on sloppy receivers with zero jets to blow by anyone. You gotta put fear in those safeties and we just don’t have it.

Its like a “slow moving puzzle”

[hoosier]

You don't know that those teams are improved.

Packers beat Dallas and Seattle. Beat Vikes twice and they beat NO in NO.

TB who knows what to expect.

San Fran remains a matchup problem.

Keep in mind, as well, that last spring San Fran had not yet become San Fran. Either they are building a dynasty or--more likely, I suspect--there is a huge amount of variation among top teams from one year to another. At the very least we need to recognize that every year is a different team, and very few teams manage to stay at the top year after year. Whiners could become the next 2012-14 Seahags, but the more likely scenario is that they become the 2016-17 Falcons or the 2018-19 Eagles: up one year, down the next.

[wist43]

read it again

You read it again... heroin addict

[GB-Brandon]

This has been such a “Horror Movie” that somehow everyone has forgotten about “Mastermind Mike Pettine” too and his “Cancerous Film”

We play Tennessee and Niners. Some of these other team we play like to run the ball too. Even a team like the Colts with Marlon Mack and Johnathan Taylor could cause Pettine to lose hair he no longer has.

[mraynrand]

Andre Rison

Keith Jackson was listed as a TE but he was not there for his blocking.

I mean, but seriously, I was thinking back an d Sharpe and Lofton were the only R1 WR I could think of the Packers drafting. And it's SOP for the Packers - they drafted Lary Elkins in '65 and Barry Smith in '73

Even as 'Ends' only Ron Kramer and Jug Gerard were drafted in the first and Hutson was before the draft I believe.

Packers just don't draft revceivers in the first, but when they do, they mean it. :)

[mraynrand]

You read it again... heroin addict

you're not gonna figure it out are you?

[Zool]

Too lazy to read the whole thread, but did Javon Walker get mentioned too?

[Zool]

Glad to see I took a couple days off and the usual suspects are having the same conversations.

[mraynrand]

Too lazy to read the whole thread, but did Javon Walker get mentioned too?

He doesn't count because he didn't lead them to a Super Bowl. Needed to catch that pop up in Philly.

[mraynrand]

Glad to see I took a couple days off and the usual suspects are having the same conversations.


I'm shocked, shocked to see senseless arguing on a sports forum!

[GB-Brandon]

Keep in mind, as well, that last spring San Fran had not yet become San Fran. Either they are building a dynasty or--more likely, I suspect--there is a huge amount of variation among top teams from one year to another. At the very least we need to recognize that every year is a different team, and very few teams manage to stay at the top year after year. Whiners could become the next 2012-14 Seahags, but the more likely scenario is that they become the 2016-17 Falcons or the 2018-19 Eagles: up one year, down the next.

San Fran became “San Fran” because of John Lynch. Look at his picks and free agency moves and trades. Look how he targeted players that brought extreme value while addressing needs.

He is not taking missed-steps backwards like blowing first round picks back to back with no immediate production. He is constantly loading that roster with elite talent all over the place.

That is not what’s happening here. We added a few pieces but nowhere near the warchest SF continues to maneuver and assemble.

They are winning the “Arms War” hands down.

[Bretsky]

I'm shocked, shocked to see senseless arguing on a sports forum!


What else do you do when there is no FB for months

We could argue about he Jordan Series....what else is there ?

[mraynrand]

Look how he targeted players that brought extreme value while addressing needs.

Sounds like the job description for a GM. I assume your measuring stick is championships.

[wist43]

you're not gonna figure it out are you?

We're importing power run blockers. It is the term being used to describe the type of players being used in Shanahan's zone scheme. It is not accurate from the standpoint of zone vs traditional trapping and pulling, but it is being used nonetheless.

Multiple backs being used at the same time, split out, H-back, I-formation, motion, with TE or 3 wides... that's where we're heading. Which is what I pointed out when they reached for Duhwho in the 3rd.

You certainly can't say Lefluer's template for OL matches fat Mikes, no?? Their both zone schemes... how about we call it "Ayn's Powned Scheme"??

Happy now??

Sheesh, get a bone to chew on dude!!

[wist43]

San Fran became “San Fran” because of John Lynch. Look at his picks and free agency moves and trades. Look how he targeted players that brought extreme value while addressing needs.

He is not taking missed-steps backwards like blowing first round picks back to back with no immediate production. He is constantly loading that roster with elite talent all over the place.

That is not what’s happening here. We added a few pieces but nowhere near the warchest SF continues to maneuver and assemble.

They are winning the “Arms War” hands down.

Amen to that.

[mraynrand]

We're importing power run blockers. It is the term being used to describe the type of players being used in Shanahan's zone scheme. It is not accurate from the standpoint of zone vs traditional trapping and pulling, but it is being used nonetheless.

Multiple backs being used at the same time, split out, H-back, I-formation, motion, with TE or 3 wides... that's where we're heading. Which is what I pointed out when they reached for Duhwho in the 3rd.

You certainly can't say Lefluer's template for OL matches fat Mikes, no??

The point is why should you be surprised they didn't go for the guys you all wanted when they're heading in a different direction. Why draft WRs to run Stubby's offense when you're not running that offense. It's pretty basic.

[Sparkey]

The point is why should you be surprised they didn't go for the guys you all wanted when they're heading in a different direction. Why draft WRs to run Stubby's offense when you're not running that offense. It's pretty basic.
And that's what is exciting about Green Bay. They started a transition to a new offensive philosophy and amazingly went 13-3 running a hodge podge of MM and LeFluer offenses. Year 2, Rodgers should be that much better and more of LeFluers offense should be installed.

[mraynrand]

And that's what is exciting about Green Bay. They started a transition to a new offensive philosophy and amazingly went 13-3 running a hodge podge of MM and LeFluer offenses. Year 2, Rodgers should be that much better and more of LeFluers offense should be installed.

And if Rodgers has full buy in, it should work really well. His incentive can be (at least) that it will extend his career. And maybe a little self assessment/honesty might tell him he can't be the EO guy anymore given obvious and ever-increasing physical limitations.

[wist43]

The point is why should you be surprised they didn't go for the guys you all wanted when they're heading in a different direction. Why draft WRs to run Stubby's offense when you're not running that offense. It's pretty basic.

Why did SF trade up to draft Aiyuk, when then run the very offense we're trying to emulate??

I had been up and down on Aiyuk and Reagor leading up to the draft, but by draft day I had settled in on Reagor, Aiyuk, Mims, and Blacklock in that order.

Max tried to argue that rookie WR take time to develop, and therefore wouldn't contribute much year 1, but that argument doesn't hold up when considered against 1) our stable of receivers, and 2) all of the innovative ways an OC could use talented athletes like that.

When I heard we traded up, I was hoping to hear Aiyuk or Mims.

As it is now... we're stuck with watching our 2020 1st round draft pick hold a clipboard for 2 years. Pretty sure both Aiyuk and Reagor will be more productive than that.