Life without Bakhtiari

[RashanGary]

I’d like to see Jenkins just for the hell of it. Maybe it makes the decision easier

[Bretsky]

I agree. I don’t know how to sign Jones and Bach and I really like ajo

[bobblehead]

Bakh hurt his chest. He will be back sooner than later. You sign the franchise LT. Let Jones walk. Today sucked, lets not get stupid.

[RashanGary]

Bakh hurt his chest. He will be back sooner than later. You sign the franchise LT. Let Jones walk. Today sucked, lets not get stupid.

Might have cracked ribs. That’s a few weeks. He’s not gonna want to play with that. But I think we’ve determined Turner is a sure fire cut as soon as the season is over

[RashanGary]

Big dick Nick foles is starting to turn da bears into a contender. Ugh.

Our Rick, Wisconsin Rick Wagner looked clumsy as fuck in that left sided stance. It looked like he was thinking about his setup like I do when i switch to my right handed club on the golf course. I can swing left or right, but I only use the right handed club if I’m in trouble and can’t swing left. I don’t think he’s the answer. Let’s try Jenkins. Kid can make himself a lot of money if he’s serviceable.

[HarveyWallbangers]

Sounds like Bakh might be fine. Wagner was horrid as LT.

[call_me_ishmael]

Bakh hurt his chest. He will be back sooner than later. You sign the franchise LT. Let Jones walk. Today sucked, lets not get stupid.

This. All day every day. Aaron Jones is a good running back but there are way more guys capable of toting the rock than their are being a booked tackle.

[bobblehead]

Might have cracked ribs. That’s a few weeks. He’s not gonna want to play with that. But I think we’ve determined Turner is a sure fire cut as soon as the season is over

Agree. Turner has only one skill. 2nd level engagement. Thats not enough in this league.

[bobblehead]

Sounds like Bakh might be fine. Wagner was horrid as LT.

Also agree. Switching sides isn't as easy as some make it sound. And agree with using Jenkins there. He is the 2nd best OL and plays on the left side. I'd prefer him out there to wagner.

[RashanGary]

Agree. Turner has only one skill. 2nd level engagement. Thats not enough in this league.

My eyes tend to flow to the ball on run plays, but theoretically he should be able to reach when he’s the backside tackle on stretch plays. Unfortunately we don’t see much cuz our RB can’t do it.

[texaspackerbacker]

I haven't heard anything other than chest injury, but I too think it probably isn't very serious. If QBs and RBs can play that way, it ought to be easier for an O Lineman.

Bakhtiari and the O Line got exposed Sunday probably more than any other aspect of the Packers. No way we could run over Bakhtiari's spot. And regarding pass blocking, I don't know if it is a defect in the blocking scheme or Bakhtiari having a "it's not my job" kind of attitude, but I'm getting fed up with outside blitzers racing right past him with no adjustment on his part to get them. That, it seems to me, is compounded by the fact that he lines up the way he does - which to me is a giveaway that he is gonna block inward on pass plays. I know the guy is a sacred cow to so many of ya'all, but I can't help thinking he is about a half step above ordinary - fairly good but not great like so many think.

[Sparkey]

It seemed a weird game plan. Hardly any misdirection and entirely too focused on throwing.

Again, Rodgers was so focused on Adams, he missed reads and held the ball too long.

Hopefully, just a one off cluster and not a sign of the future. Can't help but think back a few years to the Broncos game that exposed the offense..

[bobblehead]

My eyes tend to flow to the ball on run plays, but theoretically he should be able to reach when he’s the backside tackle on stretch plays. Unfortunately we don’t see much cuz our RB can’t do it.

I'm more talking about his deficiencies in other areas. Below average pass blocker. Not great in straight up run blocking where he must engage a large man right in front of him.

[bobblehead]

It seemed a weird game plan. Hardly any misdirection and entirely too focused on throwing.

Again, Rodgers was so focused on Adams, he missed reads and held the ball too long.

Hopefully, just a one off cluster and not a sign of the future. Can't help but think back a few years to the Broncos game that exposed the offense..

Tampa is very good against the run, which is why we went pass heavy. It was working until it wasn't. Just like I often say, running is a must. Once Bakh went down and the Tampa D stopped honoring the run they pinned back the ears and game was over.

[RashanGary]

I'm more talking about his deficiencies in other areas. Below average pass blocker. Not great in straight up run blocking where he must engage a large man right in front of him.

He was definitely a theory piece to fit into the outside zone scheme. Since it’s only a theory here and we can’t run that style of offense with the horses we have, Turner is a complete waste of space.

[bobblehead]

He was definitely a theory piece to fit into the outside zone scheme. Since it’s only a theory here and we can’t run that style of offense with the horses we have, Turner is a complete waste of space.

I think they reached for a guy who could do something they wanted to do and he does it well. I think they got enamored with that one skill set and ignored the rest of his body of work.

[Joemailman]

I think they were willing to overpay for Turner because of his alleged ability to play RT. At the time, Bulaga was coming off of a season ending injury. I'm surprised they like him at RT more than Wagner. I know Wagner was overmatched at LT, but thought he was solid at RT. Turner would seem like a likely cut candidate after this year, but MLF seems to like him.

[texaspackerbacker]

Wagner was bad at LT, but face it, the sacred cow, Bakhtiari was not very damn good either on Sunday. Whoever they were up against may have been the cause of their lame-assed play. I think against most teams, Wagner or Jenkins or Nijman or whoever could do about as good a job as Bakhtiari - who so many of ya'all want to spend #22 million a year on.

[Patler]

Wagner was bad at LT, but face it, the sacred cow, Bakhtiari was not very damn good either on Sunday. Whoever they were up against may have been the cause of their lame-assed play. I think against most teams, Wagner or Jenkins or Nijman or whoever could do about as good a job as Bakhtiari - who so many of ya'all want to spend #22 million a year on.

Per stats out today, in 29 passing plays, Bakhtiari wasn't responsible for so much as a single pressure, let alone a hit or sack. What game were you watching?

[RashanGary]

I think they reached for a guy who could do something they wanted to do and he does it well. I think they got enamored with that one skill set and ignored the rest of his body of work.

And it’s compounded because we hardly do the one thing he’s good at. If we were doing 50% outside zone and those moving bootleg pockets that play off the zone running, great.... half the time we’re doing what he does well. But we do that maybe 10% of the time and the other 90% exaggerates his weaknesses

[texaspackerbacker]

hahahahahaha Who puts out those stats?

[GB-Brandon]

The offensive line got way overhyped. My guys told me Turner was a disaster at pass blocking in camp. Wagner is nothing more then a stop gap and will break against top competition.

Packers can not afford to lose Bak against any good to great team. If we were to lose him against a team like the Bears it would be lights out!!!

[KYPack]

Wagner was bad at LT, but face it, the sacred cow, Bakhtiari was not very damn good either on Sunday. Whoever they were up against may have been the cause of their lame-assed play. I think against most teams, Wagner or Jenkins or Nijman or whoever could do about as good a job as Bakhtiari - who so many of ya'all want to spend #22 million a year on.

Tex On this topic you are totally full of shit. You don't want to keep DB because you are an Aaron Jones fan boy (or fan man) . That's OK everybody has their favorites. But it is stone lame to make up tales of poor performance to denigrate a player. Which you have started doing constantly. Read Patlers post, those are the numbers. They grade every player every play. This is by experts'. They know what they are talking about

David Bahktieri is a marquee left tackle in the NFL. You speak of sacred cows? Well he's your whipping boy. Numbers of times, I've seen your posts about how poorly he has played, they are way off.

You are a long time fan. But so are many who post on here. Do you think you can bullshit all these savvy fans who see the same game you are watching?

We've been thru this rodeo with you before. You got rolled then and you will get rolled now. There are 30 or so NFL OLine coaches who would give their right arm to get an LT with the skills of Bahktieri. We need him to get back in harness or our season is in serious jeopardy.

[Sparkey]

DB sucks. That's what I've learned from reading TPBs posts. I've also learned that any Karl Swanke or Greg Koch that is available would be just as good.

Lol. Those were the days.

[texaspackerbacker]

KY, You've got your opinion and I've got mine. I don't say Bakhtiari is bad, just that he is overrated. We can't run for shit over his position, and if there is a strong pass rush, he is maybe above average, but nothing all that special. Aaron Rodgers for years has been getting flushed out of the pocket virtually all the time on pass plays. Whatever good reputation the O Line has is due to his mobility. This year, there actually had been less pressure on the QB - until last Sunday. Somebody posted that Bakhtiari was perfect on 29 snaps or something like that? That sure wasn't what I saw. Granted, it got even worse when he went out, but that is a pretty low bar to say Bakhtiari is better than Wagner.

I've said many times, we ought to be able to cook the cap to retain him, Linsley, and especially Aaron Jones. However, if the powers that be don't want to be like Mike Sherman and play the fine edge of things - if they decide to make sacrifices, they damn well better not lose other good players to keep Bakhtiari.

Now I'll sit back and laugh while all you fans of the sacred cow talk him up hahahahahaha.

[Rastak]

Per stats out today, in 29 passing plays, Bakhtiari wasn't responsible for so much as a single pressure, let alone a hit or sack. What game were you watching?


Patlerized....hahaha Tex, you watching the all 22? I didn't think so.

I used to but cannot care enough anymore to keep my NFL subscription alive. Even when I did it was pretty damn hard to grade OL.

[Rastak]

Tex On this topic you are totally full of shit. You don't want to keep DB because you are an Aaron Jones fan boy (or fan man) . That's OK everybody has their favorites. But it is stone lame to make up tales of poor performance to denigrate a player. Which you have started doing constantly. Read Patlers post, those are the numbers. They grade every player every play. This is by experts'. They know what they are talking about

David Bahktieri is a marquee left tackle in the NFL. You speak of sacred cows? Well he's your whipping boy. Numbers of times, I've seen your posts about how poorly he has played, they are way off.

You are a long time fan. But so are many who post on here. Do you think you can bullshit all these savvy fans who see the same game you are watching?

We've been thru this rodeo with you before. You got rolled then and you will get rolled now. There are 30 or so NFL OLine coaches who would give their right arm to get an LT with the skills of Bahktieri. We need him to get back in harness or our season is in serious jeopardy.


I'll side with KY everytime. Tex, you have a right to your opinion but realize just like alot of my opinions, they are fucking wrong.

[bobblehead]

And it’s compounded because we hardly do the one thing he’s good at. If we were doing 50% outside zone and those moving bootleg pockets that play off the zone running, great.... half the time we’re doing what he does well. But we do that maybe 10% of the time and the other 90% exaggerates his weaknesses

Yep. good point. We found out that the rest of our line and our best RB is best suited to run inside zone.

[texaspackerbacker]

Rastak, you worthless piece of shit, why the hell do you even show up here? Of course you let your NFL subscription lapse because your team sucks hahahahaha.

I stand by what I said, we have had near zero success running over Bakhtiari's spot - and it's pretty lame to blame the RBs for that. And while Bakhtiari isn't horrible in pass blocking, he certainly ain't worth 22 million a year and sacrificing other good players. And he either doesn't have a clue about adjusting to stop an outside blitz or else the scheme is flawed if he isn't supposed to step out and block that speed burner coming in just to his left.

And yeah, Bobblehead, we do a helluva lot better running inside zone ...... and that says volumes about the blocking inside as opposed to the blocking by Bakhtiari and whoever is at RT.

[run pMc]

you worthless piece of shit, why the hell do you even show up here?

Feel the love.

When you find a good LT you keep them as long as you can (and they are playing good). DB falls into that category.
LT is a premium position and very few teams (if any) make it deep into the playoffs without a good one.

[bobblehead]

Rastak, you worthless piece of shit, why the hell do you even show up here? Of course you let your NFL subscription lapse because your team sucks hahahahaha.

I stand by what I said, we have had near zero success running over Bakhtiari's spot - and it's pretty lame to blame the RBs for that. And while Bakhtiari isn't horrible in pass blocking, he certainly ain't worth 22 million a year and sacrificing other good players. And he either doesn't have a clue about adjusting to stop an outside blitz or else the scheme is flawed if he isn't supposed to step out and block that speed burner coming in just to his left.

And yeah, Bobblehead, we do a helluva lot better running inside zone ...... and that says volumes about the blocking inside as opposed to the blocking by Bakhtiari and whoever is at RT.

It actually says very little about that. It says something about which type of block they each execute best, but you can't run block with 3 guys. It takes 5...and even more. Its an entire offensive team effort.

[texaspackerbacker]

You can't have a running game with just 3 O Linemen, but a single play? Yeah, that happens at times, even two wedging out an opening for a quick hitter. What can't happen is for a RB to have a decent gain without decent blocking - unless you're Barry Sanders or something, and even he took a lot of losses.

[KYPack]

Many pro football sites rate big Dave the #1 LT in the game. Most rate him in the top 3. But big Tex says he can't run block. Sometimes Tex says he can't play.

Tex is crazy on this subject.

[RashanGary]

Bakh going to be out. After all of these years of football, seeing guys break out on year's 2, 3 or even sometime 4..... There's even QB's like Gannon or Tannenhill who break out in year's 8 and 9....

After seeing so much progression of guys as they come into their prime, its kind of become for me a two-part story as the season develops. 1. Can we win a championship and will we win this game and 2. With the salary cap and the restrictions on being able to pay everyone, are there guys developing who make the future look bright?

So..... The Texans have pretty much played the who's who of top tier defenses. They've had a rough start. Our injury situation looks pretty bad. The winning this game and winning a SB this year are starting to feel worriesome with potential for painful. But..... Bakhtiari is our absolute biggest name on the, (who we gonna keep going forward) list. Even with a loss, there is a big storyline about the future that is going to unfold on Sunday. I sort of hope to see elgatron out there. If he's good or even average in his first start, the next couple year window opens up quite a bit if we can let Bakh go.

Of course I doubt anyone on our roster is going to be that good, but I doubted the WR turned corner in the NFL (Sam shields) would be an upper tier corner out of the gate and I doubted Aaron Rosgers would be able to adequately fill Favres shoes. Hell, I always liked Lizard, but I doubted the undrafted WR would be as good as he is.

So the life without Bakhtiari storyline is deeply compelling for me at this point. It opens up the window for ARs final year's in green bay if someone somehow steps forward!

[RashanGary]

And Jenkins makes himself a very rich man if he can play LT. He’ll command top guard dollar and mid upper tackle dollar if he can play our there. Everyone and their side chick wants a pro bowl LG who can be servixable at LT when an injury happens. That's a high paid NFL player if I ever saw one

[texaspackerbacker]

Many pro football sites rate big Dave the #1 LT in the game. Most rate him in the top 3. But big Tex says he can't run block. Sometimes Tex says he can't play.

Tex is crazy on this subject.

If RG is correct about Bakhtiari being out, we'll get some indication of what we can do without him Sunday. I'm betting things are not noticeably worse without him. "Many pro football sites" a full of shit hahahaha. I know what I'm seeing, stats be damned.

[KYPack]

I totally disagree. Are you getting your Packer broadcasts via Kazakhstan or something?

[texaspackerbacker]

KY, there are people in here I have a lot of respect for, and some not much, a few none at all. I've always considered you one of the good ones. I'm not gonna criticize you, but I do disagree. As bad as it is to ever have Packer injuries, the slight good about this one is we will really get an indication of how valuable Bakhtiari is - if we have to do without him.

[Patler]

If RG is correct about Bakhtiari being out, we'll get some indication of what we can do without him Sunday. I'm betting things are not noticeably worse without him. "Many pro football sites" a full of shit hahahaha. I know what I'm seeing, stats be damned.

Do you? Do you really know what you are seeing? I know many times I don't, and I suspect you don't either.

In the game day thread you referred to Bakhtiari not giving a damn and not adjusting to outside rushers. I don't know the specific plays you have in mind, but I do know on some that I recall Aikman even stated it was the RB's responsibility to hold up or delay the blitzer, (and probably also secondarily for Rodgers to recognize it and adjust by getting the ball out quickly, rolling away from pressure, etc.) The LT isn't always responsible for the widest rusher on that side. Stats reporting no pressures allowed by Bakhtiari would suggest that you are wrong about those plays. If he should have adjusted as you proposed, he would have been dinged for at least partial responsibility on the pressure, hit or sack. Yet, in 29 plays, he had none.

I suspect you see a result, then blame the nearest player without knowing anyone's actual responsibility on the play. It is easy to do, especially on long passing plays blaming the closest DB chasing the receiver. Often, it is another DB who blew the play, but he isn't even in the picture. So, too, with blocking schemes.

[Patler]

As bad as it is to ever have Packer injuries, the slight good about this one is we will really get an indication of how valuable Bakhtiari is - if we have to do without him.

Maybe, maybe not. Will you fully evaluate how many times Bakhtiari's replacement is given help, when Bakhtiari would have been left alone? Will you know how much it might change the game plan or play calls to compensate for Bakhtiari being out? Will you know if a mistake by his replacement has an adverse result elsewhere?

[texaspackerbacker]

LaFleur says ya'all's sacred cow is a game time decision.

[RashanGary]

Maybe, maybe not. Will you fully evaluate how many times Bakhtiari's replacement is given help, when Bakhtiari would have been left alone? Will you know how much it might change the game plan or play calls to compensate for Bakhtiari being out? Will you know if a mistake by his replacement has an adverse result elsewhere?

Tex probably won't, but....... I think it's must see TV for me because I am crossing my fingers we have a replacement on the roster

[Zool]

If you guys would quit quoting and responding to Tex and Brandon, I would never have to see what they post. I should have blocked them a long time ago. This is almost perfect.

[KYPack]

If you guys would quit quoting and responding to Tex and Brandon, I would never have to see what they post. I should have blocked them a long time ago. This is almost perfect.

OK Zoolski

[Sparkey]

Signing Bahktiari just became a little more difficult.

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/ravens-sign-ronnie-stanley-to-five-year-extension-starting-left-tackle-to-be-with-baltimore-through-2025/

Up to 22.6 million per year

[Joemailman]

Signing Bahktiari just became a little more difficult.

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/ravens-sign-ronnie-stanley-to-five-year-extension-starting-left-tackle-to-be-with-baltimore-through-2025/

Up to 22.6 million per year

I'm not sure that really changes anything. Reports are Bakhtiari was already looking to be highest paid LT, which was Tunsil at 22M.

[Patler]

Interesting:


Coming into 2020, CBS Sports ranked Stanley as the No. 2 offensive linemen in the entire NFL, sitting behind only Packers tackle David Bakhtiari.

[Joemailman]

Packers might not be willing to match the Tunsil and Stanley contracts because Bakhtiari is almost 3 years older than those guys.

[call_me_ishmael]

They'll work it out. I put it at essentially a zero percent chance he walks. Worst case, they will franchise and trade him for a high pick. Or as I like to call it, the Javon Walker you-can-dance-if-you-want-to special.

[texaspackerbacker]

That idea works for me, CMI.

[RashanGary]

Ronnie Staley, all pro, 26 years old just signed a 5 year 100 extension. Bakh ain't getting that 22 he was shooting for. Will be lucky to get the 18 the Packers offered.

[RashanGary]

Just saw there were escalators in Staleys deal. Still, at Bakhs age he shouldnt touch Staleys deal.

[call_me_ishmael]

Just saw there were escalators in Staleys deal. Still, at Bakhs age he shouldnt touch Staleys deal.

He literally just turned 29 a few weeks ago. Stanley turns 27 in a few months. You get way too caught up in age. Teddy T signed a 32 or 33 year old Chad Clifton to a 3 year deal.

This will get done. Stop worrying.

[Patler]

I look at Bakhtiari as being in his prime years. I would have no concerns about another 4 year contract, if that's what works out. I see him as a much different case than Bulaga, due to injury history.

[run pMc]

I look at Bakhtiari as being in his prime years. I would have no concerns about another 4 year contract, if that's what works out. I see him as a much different case than Bulaga, due to injury history.

Agree. He's been very lucky/healthy in general, and OL can usually play into their early 30's effectively. They still need to find/groom a successor, but signing him would delay the urgency of that. Some salary cap magic will be needed, but it's possible.