Gute’s profile

[RashanGary]

Thompson pulled the trigger on some really high upside guys like Harrell, Sherrod, Raji and Collins. He only hit on Collins and Rodgers with his super high risk picks.

He made his hay with the decent upside, great football players like Nelson, Matthew’s, Sitton, Lang, Jennings, Jones, Finley, Davante and Clark.


Gute is different. Every high pick has been a swing for the fences. Jaire, Gary, Savage, Love. The smaller guys have 4.3 speed and the bigger guy is off the charts athlete and the QB has elite upside for the position. Every single pick is a massive fielder type home run swing.


Swing for the fences and fill in the holes with free agents and scrap heap finds seems to be Gutes profile compared to the mostly safe and consistent Thompson. We’ll see how it shakes out.

[RashanGary]

I kind of like the swings for the fences in the draft with filling in using other avenues. You can find late round and free agent hole fillers. You only really get stars in the draft so swing for the fences on every swing. Lower average but more likely to he a moon shot.

[HarveyWallbangers]

I’m not sure Harrell and Sherrod Were anymore high upside than the likes of CMIII and Clark. The guys you mentioned for Gute were all first round picks. The guys you mentioned for TT were all post-1st round picks—except for high end guys like Clark and CMIII. Clay was an incredible athlete coming up who started for one year in college.

I’m not sure this holds wash.

[Bretsky]

Is the Love Machine a swing for the fence ? Is he as athletic as say, Lamar Jackson ? I'm too lazy to look it up but I would not have considered him tot be off the charts home run guy

[Joemailman]

Is the Love Machine a swing for the fence ? Is he as athletic as say, Lamar Jackson ? I'm too lazy to look it up but I would not have considered him tot be off the charts home run guy

He's certainly well above average in terms of athleticism, but I don't think I'd put him Jackson's class. He's a physical specimen who need to be developed.

https://thedraftnetwork.com/player/jordan-love/PbA4nRzHfK


Jordan Love isn’t without his warts but he possesses a high-level physical skill set and peaks on tape that reveal the ceiling of a potential dynamic NFL starting quarterback. His arm talent and mobility is perfect for the trends of today’s NFL and there is no limitations to what he can do on the field. The full playbook is open for Love and then some. With that said, he does need to make notable strides in several key areas including decision-making, timing and accuracy to achieve his ceiling. An early investment in Love is a bet on yourself to be able to develop his overall game but his upside is worth the calculated risk.

[Jaire]

Harrell #16 (Jets jumped us for Regis at #14 -- Gute, the madman, picks up Jaire and grabs an extra first). Harrell was a great prospect though and a big swing. Bad luck

AJ Hawk #5 (but that was a different era and the following year had all the HoFers. It was kind of bad luck to have so high a pick that year.) Hawk was a very safe pick.

The guys that Gute is swinging on are not that risky imo. The scouts did their HW (They had followed Savage for several years). Gute is swinging. That's the only way to play draft and develop. TT did it too but TT did NOT like moving up. Said he even wasn't sure he would move up for Mathews again years later. You have to move (up or down) when you draft low. The Colts like moving down. If you don't get a top tier pick you need to take more swings in later rounds or focus on non premiere positions. Gute has moved up every year now in Rd one. THAT is the real difference. Almost EVERY year the tier one players are gone when we pick (except Clark). And some draft classes are weak and thin. Gute just plays the board better imo.

He won't waste picks on guys like Randall, Perry, Datone, Sherrod (i.e. the left overs). That is where you really swing and miss. Also blowing picks on Neal, Worthy, Thornton....... These were bad "swings" even a bit desperate.

And this is the other difference. TT said on day one (to Brandt) that he would not get any FAs. But that is where you get the pieces you can't get in the draft.

So, overall Gute has a much better approach.

[GB-Brandon]

Gute’s Profile? LOL!!!!

You mean an RAS chart and binoculars at the combine!!!!

Give me a Fucken break!!!

[Jaire]

The Scouts were following Savage for two years. Don't think it's RAS. He was targeted. Many of the Packers' picks are targeted for a long time. Gute is in the mold of TT. He's a scout. That hasn't changed.

And the Packers Big Board is very small is pretty short (as most GMs). I hope it's shorter than TT's which had too many prospects that shouldn't have been drafted.

[texaspackerbacker]

If Love has any kind of upside like Lamar Jackson, he sure didn't show it in college like Jackson did. If he was that kind of a runner, I would assume the Packers would put in a few packages for him as a wildcat or returner or Tavon Austin/Tyler Ervin type or whatever.

I'd agree, Gute hit it big time with his first couple of drafts, but I'm thinking he totally blew it with Love - except maybe for lighting a fire under Aaron Rodgers.

[Jaire]

We know nothing of Love really. He has a big arm. Can make all the throws. I would never bet against GB taking a QB with a first. Oh and from what Rodgers is saying I think he might be good. But Love has not played a down yet.

In other news, Stafford is likely going to San Fran. That team gonna be scary good the next 4 to 6 years.

[GB-Brandon]

The Scouts were following Savage for two years. Don't think it's RAS. He was targeted. Many of the Packers' picks are targeted for a long time. Gute is in the mold of TT. He's a scout. That hasn't changed.

And the Packers Big Board is very small is pretty short (as most GMs). I hope it's shorter than TT's which had too many prospects that shouldn't have been drafted.

I’m not so convinced of that. Maybe they were with Savage or I could also see with Jaire or even Love but if you go side by side down the picks Gute pretty much drafted just about everyone with high RAS measurable’s with some lacking “Consistent Production.”

One of Thompson’s main legs of the chair holding up his picks or a draft pick was “Production.” He talked of it all the time. Gute has bypassed this requirement many times and taken more chances on measurable’s with a prospect that had less then stellar production.

So if your gonna spew this stuff please get it right. When we get into draft season I’m going to be presenting information fast and I don’t have time to go back and forth on things that just aren’t true!!!!

[Fritz]

We know nothing of Love really. He has a big arm. Can make all the throws. I would never bet against GB taking a QB with a first. Oh and from what Rodgers is saying I think he might be good. But Love has not played a down yet.

In other news, Stafford is likely going to San Fran. That team gonna be scary good the next 4 to 6 years.

I'm sixty years old, and I absolutely agree with that statement.

As for Stafford going to SF, where'd you hear that?

[easy cheesy]

https://ninerswire.usatoday.com/2021/01/23/49ers-detroit-lions-agree-to-part-with-qb-matthew-stafford/

Possibility...

[Jaire]

.So if your gonna spew this stuff please get it right. When we get into draft season I’m going to be presenting information fast and I don’t have time to go back and forth on things that just aren’t true!!!!

Actually Savage mentioned it when he was drafted. Specifically he mentioned that GB (and only GB)scouts were at his practices even a year before the draft. GB was all over him b4 draft. His speed is on the game tape. You don't need a combine. So yeah, it's RAS but also take and production with him. They don't TARGET every pick. They didn't target Gary. They didn't expect him to be on the board. What they said.

Why shout? And please CITE ONE PIECE OF EVIDENCE that Gute only looks at RAS. Just one testimony. I have never heard this in 3 years. Did Gute say that? Anyone in the FO? Anyone who left? Ever? This is your fantasy. Now it's clear he's big on SPARQ. So was Wolf. So what? Do you want the plodders that TT too often grabbed?

Do you mean that Gute and his most meticulous tape watchers in the NFL are doing that ALL for a smoke screan? They actually just go off SPARQ??? They are top 5 in the league in scouting (esp late round). That hasn't changed since TT. They are always looking for an edge there too.

Again, you are literally the first person in 10 years I have heard suggest this.

I do agree with you that Gute has moved away from production. BUT YOU NEED to develop an edge on draft day. Gary was the #1 DL prospect since HS. Don't do GROUP THINK. Do your own research. Find out why he didn't produce. That's how to gain an edge.

And did Clay Matthews have production?? How much "production" did Randall and Rollins have? Production was not the only guide for TT either.

I'm just relating what Savage said and what the GB FO has said.

[GB-Brandon]

Actually Savage mentioned it when he was drafted. Specifically he mentioned that GB (and only GB)scouts were at his practices even a year before the draft. GB was all over him b4 draft. His speed is on the game tape. You don't need a combine. So yeah, it's RAS but also take and production with him. They don't TARGET every pick. They didn't target Gary. They didn't expect him to be on the board. What they said.

Why shout? And please CITE ONE PIECE OF EVIDENCE that Gute only looks at RAS. Just one testimony. I have never heard this in 3 years. Did Gute say that? Anyone in the FO? Anyone who left? Ever? This is your fantasy. Now it's clear he's big on SPARQ. So was Wolf. So what? Do you want the plodders that TT too often grabbed?

Do you mean that Gute and his most meticulous tape watchers in the NFL are doing that ALL for a smoke screan? They actually just go off SPARQ??? They are top 5 in the league in scouting (esp late round). That hasn't changed since TT. They are always looking for an edge there too.

Again, you are literally the first person in 10 years I have heard suggest this.

I do agree with you that Gute has moved away from production. BUT YOU NEED to develop an edge on draft day. Gary was the #1 DL prospect since HS. Don't do GROUP THINK. Do your own research. Find out why he didn't produce. That's how to gain an edge.

And did Clay Matthews have production?? How much "production" did Randall and Rollins have? Production was not the only guide for TT either.

I'm just relating what Savage said and what the GB FO has said.


I don’t disagree with you in regards to Savage. I am simply saying we need get back to keeping an eye on “Production” in the mid to late rounds and quite just picking combine champions. Start getting back to getting value like we did with guys like AJ, J. Williams, Blake Martinez, Dean Lowry, Corey Linsley, Fackrel, Micah Hyde etc etc.

This is where you build your roster and need to find contributors and decent to good football players and an occasional star. The older I get the more I understand what Thompson was doing as far as the draft part and Gute is not following this to a tee as you suggest.

[GB-Brandon]

“Oren Burks” is all I need to say!!!

[RashanGary]

I'm kind of with Brandon here that Gute seems to swing for athletic fences with his plate approach. I like it so far with Jaire, savage and Gary all being elite athletes who are panning out early.

[Joemailman]

https://ninerswire.usatoday.com/2021/01/23/49ers-detroit-lions-agree-to-part-with-qb-matthew-stafford/

Possibility...

It seems like the most likely scenario. Stafford will want to go to a team he thinks can win now. He'll likely want to go to a team that stresses a balanced offense as opposed to what he's had in Detroit all these years. Due to the injury epidemic that happened in SF this year, they have the 12th pick which gives them an advantage over teams like Bears and Colts.

[GB-Brandon]

I don’t believe Gute has the ability to look at film and see it the way Ted Thompson could look at it and see it the same way. That was a special gift from God Thompson had. So the “Gute Profile” is a bit flawed in that sense and he has to rely more in these RAS charts.

That’s the real Deal!!

[GB-Brandon]

Savage “Had Production” at Maryland though so he was not a reach in the “Ted Thompson Formula.” The thing with Savage was did Gute give up too much to get him was the issue.

Maybe we find out today!!!

[Jaire]

I don’t disagree with you in regards to Savage . I am simply saying we need to get back to keeping an eye on “Production” in the mid to late rounds and quite just picking combine champions. Start getting back to getting value like we did with guys like AJ, J. Williams, Blake Martinez, Dean Lowry, Corey Linsley, Fackrel, Micah Hyde etc etc.

This is where you build your roster and need to find contributors and decent to good football players and an occasional star. The older I get the more I understand what Thompson was doing as far as the draft part and Gute is not following this to a tee as you suggest.

Ah. I understand you better. You like that approach. I think it needs to be a mix to get the edge in the draft.

Savage produced. I didn't follow Jaire but I assume he was great in college. Jenkins was a SEC stud. Just Gary was projection. Again I didn't follow the last two drafts too much. And no one is the scout that TT was. Gute is good at oline I hear. Gotta trust your scouts and coaches where you are weak. Also Sternberger, Deguara, Keke were film/ production / scouting picks.

They got cute will Rollins and Randall (more a character problem anyway). But last two years they drafted producers in the late rounds. Hopefully they learn from Jones, Burks, and Rollins. Also Dillon did a lot in college.

I think they mix it up. And Gary did do his job at Michigan. He was raw and we knew that, but you gotta swing when you can, just prudently and taking out as many risk factors as you can. (We are really lucky to have Mike Smith in that room.)

And I never suggested he is following TT to a T. Quite the opposite. The changes I noticed are for the better: they got stuck drafting need and away from "Trust your board", or at least how they made their board was too influenced by need. Not being afraid to move around has really improved Gute's early part of the draft..

But perhaps you are correct on the production part. I haven't followed the draft as closely. I agree wholeheartedly on Burks but I haven't seen another Burks (and that was just after TT's Jones debacle). Gute's WRs were also really good picks in that pretty weak draft for late rounders.

And I was very happy with the OL in round 6 last year. All those day 3 picks and UDFA really made that draft palatable. Who was merely RAS there?

[GB-Brandon]

Ah. I understand you better. You like that approach. I think it needs to be a mix to get the edge in the draft.

Savage produced. I didn't follow Jaire but I assume he was great in college. Jenkins was a SEC stud. Just Gary was projection. Again I didn't follow the last two drafts too much. And no one is the scout that TT was. Gute is good at oline I hear. Gotta trust your scouts and coaches where you are weak. Also Sternberger, Deguara, Keke were film/ production / scouting picks.

They got cute will Rollins and Randall (more a character problem anyway). But last two years they drafted producers in the late rounds. Hopefully they learn from Jones, Burks, and Rollins. Also Dillon did a lot in college.

I think they mix it up. And Gary did do his job at Michigan. He was raw and we knew that, but you gotta swing when you can, just prudently and taking out as many risk factors as you can. (We are really lucky to have Mike Smith in that room.)

And I never suggested he is following TT to a T. Quite the opposite. The changes I noticed are for the better: they got stuck drafting need and away from "Trust your board", or at least how they made their board was too influenced by need. Not being afraid to move around has really improved Gute's early part of the draft..

But perhaps you are correct on the production part. I haven't followed the draft as closely. I agree wholeheartedly on Burks but I haven't seen another Burks (and that was just after TT's Jones debacle). Gute's WRs were also really good picks in that pretty weak draft for late rounders.

And I was very happy with the OL in round 6 last year. All those day 3 picks and UDFA really made that draft palatable. Who was merely RAS there?

Jaire was great pick that I was completely on board with. He had “Massive Production.” I also like the trade back to acquire the extra pick. I’m not mad at Gute on “All of His Plays.”

It’s mostly how he has handled the thing last year and missing out some guys who I thought were better “Football Players” that he passed over for RAS numbers and projections. I also was really pissed he didn’t draft Jeffery Simmons(Who Had Massive Production)instead of Gary and then this DL thing would already be handled.

But I really want to focus on this game today!!!

[Jaire]

(Don't reply.)

I didn't like last year's draft either. Glad I didn't follow it leading up. But it hinges on Love. And I get the move. And I liked day three a lot.

Oh. And I really wanted Simmons or Lawrence. With you there. But I get Gary. I'm with you on Savage too. He was my favorite safety, but that move up was a lot to pay. Again, I unsderstand the FO's love for Collins 2.0. They really miss him. And Savage is going to be good. I can't knock it too much.

[Jaire]

Ok. Now that the season is over.

I felt the same way Brandon did about this draft. I just wanted to wait it out since there is absolutely nothing they could do during the season to fix it without wrecking the future of this team.

Gute did not do what is needed to make this team a champion. It began with not replacing Pettine. Going back further, they would not let MLF get the special teams coach he wanted. You can't win without superior coaching especially in GB where you don't get annually top 10 picks.

They wasted the first two days of the 2020 draft. Didn't even run Dillon in 4th Quarter. RB is very low on priority last draft. That was way to cute a pick with all their glaring needs. They needed DL and OT (behind on drafting both and TRENCHES win playoffs -- we've seen that in now two last NFCGs), & WR. They could have addressed ONEof those at least. Nada. Instead, they they kicked Rodgers in the gut...... and MLF (DC & STC especially). This loss is on Gute and Murphy.

It was a good draft for WR. That's what you take, not bench warmers at RB & QB. We saw this before with MM and TT too (though tbh I think Gute has done better -- they were far more stubborn and blind in addressing needs, not doing FA, not moving in the draft: some credit in the debacle is due).

Now, at this point, the most important thing by far is realizing their mistakes. Number one. They can correct them. But I am not confident they see their deficiencies. There is a very good core on the team and Gute was building that in 2018 & 2019. MLF is a winner (but still learning). They could use an alpha DC with a bit of Arians and Boles mentality. This team is still soft but trending right. Doesn't need to "break kneecaps" just bring mental toughness and fight. MLF gets way to rattled in adversity. A strong defense will help him.

I'm not sure those things happen. I am confident they can draft and Scout especially WR and OL (their strength) what they need and with less draft capital than almost any team. And I do like where MLF is trying to steer the offense. Defense is trending right. I don't have great confidence it will happen.

[RashanGary]

I'm good with the whole structure, from Murphy down to pettine and Hackett. It was a tough loss. Missing Bakh hurt in that game for sure. Helping turner a little on the right side is easier than helping Wagner and Turner all game on both sides. Just a tiny bounce of bad luck at the end there. And a ref Job too.

[Zool]

Team came out flat for the entire first half yesterday. Maybe M4 isn't a rah rah guy and is more cerebral? TB was flying everyone from the coin toss. GB got a fire under their ass late in the 3rd. They need an emotional leader. I thought that was Z, but he's not been the same fiery guy this year.

[Joemailman]

I'm good with the whole structure, from Murphy down to pettine and Hackett. It was a tough loss. Missing Bakh hurt in that game for sure. Helping turner a little on the right side is easier than helping Wagner and Turner all game on both sides. Just a tiny bounce of bad luck at the end there. And a ref Job too.

The loss of Bakhtiari weakened both Tackle positions. Bakhtiari at LT is better than Turner, and Turner at RT is better than Wagner.

[GB-Brandon]

Ok. Now that the season is over.

I felt the same way Brandon did about this draft. I just wanted to wait it out since there is absolutely nothing they could do during the season to fix it without wrecking the future of this team.

Gute did not do what is needed to make this team a champion. It began with not replacing Pettine. Going back further, they would not let MLF get the special teams coach he wanted. You can't win without superior coaching especially in GB where you don't get annually top 10 picks.

They wasted the first two days of the 2020 draft. Didn't even run Dillon in 4th Quarter. RB is very low on priority last draft. That was way to cute a pick with all their glaring needs. They needed DL and OT (behind on drafting both and TRENCHES win playoffs -- we've seen that in now two last NFCGs), & WR. They could have addressed ONEof those at least. Nada. Instead, they they kicked Rodgers in the gut...... and MLF (DC & STC especially). This loss is on Gute and Murphy.

It was a good draft for WR. That's what you take, not bench warmers at RB & QB. We saw this before with MM and TT too (though tbh I think Gute has done better -- they were far more stubborn and blind in addressing needs, not doing FA, not moving in the draft: some credit in the debacle is due).

Now, at this point, the most important thing by far is realizing their mistakes. Number one. They can correct them. But I am not confident they see their deficiencies. There is a very good core on the team and Gute was building that in 2018 & 2019. MLF is a winner (but still learning). They could use an alpha DC with a bit of Arians and Boles mentality. This team is still soft but trending right. Doesn't need to "break kneecaps" just bring mental toughness and fight. MLF gets way to rattled in adversity. A strong defense will help him.

I'm not sure those things happen. I am confident they can draft and Scout especially WR and OL (their strength) what they need and with less draft capital than almost any team. And I do like where MLF is trying to steer the offense. Defense is trending right. I don't have great confidence it will happen.

Yes, this is exactly how it is and where we are at. The last year has gone from me thinking we might have the right people in place to not having much confidence at all. When you see the same level of Incompetence(Pettine) and you do nothing about it something is very very wrong!!!

When you are knocking on the door of a Greatness and the whole world knows you need DL help and a WR help but your so Fucken arrogant that you trade up for QB and ignore it all offseason basically something is very very wrong!!

And now we have a head coach that is starting to have an early legacy of not being able to handle the “Bigger Moments.” I started to see this and post about this later in the season and found it to be disturbing. I had know idea it would grow to the level of this magnitude that reared its ugly head yesterday!!

With all the components in play this whole thing is in “Critical Condition.” Horrible loss and I don’t trust these guys to be able to make the right moves to get us out of it!!! The main reason is because they just aren’t “Great”

[Jaire]

I have hope for MLF.

He created a historically great offense with an historically non impressive squad. He studied his but off to win in the red zone and got it to an insane 80%. He self criticizes and fixes his mistakes. The guy is a great one imo. He just needs a DC that complements his weaknesses or is at least as good as him. Nothing but credit to him. He's really young and will figure it out far more likely than not.

Now.........will Gute and Murphy? And again, I really like some of the corrections he has made to TT's way. He's still very much from the Ron Wolf (and Wolf was a Raiders RAS guy btw) and TT tree and that is a good thing. He deserves some credit. Now can he learn like MLF from his mistakes and make the needed changes? MM and TT never did.

I have some hope. And I must admit I know nothing of Murphy and cannot comment except that they emerged very well from the much much worse dumpster fire 2 years ago. So many were crying doomsday then. I was worried but really liked the MLF hire from day one. This time it's their mistakes; it's their fire. Can they learn from MLF?

[GB-Brandon]

My hope for MLF was that he wasn’t questioning Rodgers on the 4th down but was questioning his personnel and that wavered his faith. Which he still should of went for it but at least I could kind of see his thinking. MLF was the one pushing the front office for a trade for another weapon before the trade dead line which many believe Murphy killed!!! Murphy is a Fucken Clown!!!

But yeah, if we can get LaFluer more of what he needs to run his offense I think that part of it could be okay!!! Once again I don’t know if I can trust Gute to do this!!

[Bretsky]

Ok. Now that the season is over.

I felt the same way Brandon did about this draft. I just wanted to wait it out since there is absolutely nothing they could do during the season to fix it without wrecking the future of this team.

Gute did not do what is needed to make this team a champion. It began with not replacing Pettine. Going back further, they would not let MLF get the special teams coach he wanted. You can't win without superior coaching especially in GB where you don't get annually top 10 picks.

They wasted the first two days of the 2020 draft. Didn't even run Dillon in 4th Quarter. RB is very low on priority last draft. That was way to cute a pick with all their glaring needs. They needed DL and OT (behind on drafting both and TRENCHES win playoffs -- we've seen that in now two last NFCGs), & WR. They could have addressed ONEof those at least. Nada. Instead, they they kicked Rodgers in the gut...... and MLF (DC & STC especially). This loss is on Gute and Murphy.

It was a good draft for WR. That's what you take, not bench warmers at RB & QB. We saw this before with MM and TT too (though tbh I think Gute has done better -- they were far more stubborn and blind in addressing needs, not doing FA, not moving in the draft: some credit in the debacle is due).

Now, at this point, the most important thing by far is realizing their mistakes. Number one. They can correct them. But I am not confident they see their deficiencies. There is a very good core on the team and Gute was building that in 2018 & 2019. MLF is a winner (but still learning). They could use an alpha DC with a bit of Arians and Boles mentality. This team is still soft but trending right. Doesn't need to "break kneecaps" just bring mental toughness and fight. MLF gets way to rattled in adversity. A strong defense will help him.

I'm not sure those things happen. I am confident they can draft and Scout especially WR and OL (their strength) what they need and with less draft capital than almost any team. And I do like where MLF is trying to steer the offense. Defense is trending right. I don't have great confidence it will happen.


:bclap::bclap::bclap::bclap::bclap:

[texaspackerbacker]

I have hope for MLF.

He created a historically great offense with an historically non impressive squad. He studied his but off to win in the red zone and got it to an insane 80%. He self criticizes and fixes his mistakes. The guy is a great one imo. He just needs a DC that complements his weaknesses or is at least as good as him. Nothing but credit to him. He's really young and will figure it out far more likely than not.

Now.........will Gute and Murphy? And again, I really like some of the corrections he has made to TT's way. He's still very much from the Ron Wolf (and Wolf was a Raiders RAS guy btw) and TT tree and that is a good thing. He deserves some credit. Now can he learn like MLF from his mistakes and make the needed changes? MM and TT never did.

I have some hope. And I must admit I know nothing of Murphy and cannot comment except that they emerged very well from the much much worse dumpster fire 2 years ago. So many were crying doomsday then. I was worried but really liked the MLF hire from day one. This time it's their mistakes; it's their fire. Can they learn from MLF?

A generally good post. One of the few things I fault LaFleur for is keeping Pettine as DC, and I'm not totally sure that was his decision.

[GB-Brandon]

A generally good post. One of the few things I fault LaFleur for is keeping Pettine as DC, and I'm not totally sure that was his decision.

Which is another problem in this Oligarchy that I have expressed since I’ve been here!!