Official Packers Offseason/Free Agency Thread

[red]

Brass has done a fantastic job in last 2mo. Aaron, trade Tae, Campbell, Douglas, tonyan, etc.

Just need MVS and a good draft. And extend Jaire.

Pretty impressive.

MVS fucking blows

titans just sent a 2023 6th round pick to the rams for robert woods

[Fosco33]

MVS fucking blows

titans just sent a 2023 6th round pick to the rams for robert woods

Most here shat on Adams for a few years. MVS has speed, length, etc. there

[Bretsky]

Most here shat on Adams for a few years. MVS has speed, length, etc. there

Consider me apathetic; don't really care either way on MVS. Don't think he's worth more than 7ish/yr

Would take a healthy Fuller

LOVE HW's suggestion; go get Brandon Cooks

See if you can give up a 3rd maybe (all our 3rd suck anyways) for Brandon Cooks

[Joemailman]

MVS is an incomplete receiver. He's poor on contested balls. But teams have to respect his speed. He was missed very much against 49ers in playoff game.

[Bretsky]

MVS is an incomplete receiver. He's poor on contested balls. But teams have to respect his speed. He was missed very much against 49ers in playoff game.


IMO Dillon was the most missed.

So how much do you pay MVS ? 5 to 6 MIL on a 2 year deal ? Wondering if teams are going to overpay since we're in the FA period

[texaspackerbacker]

Brass has done a fantastic job in last 2mo. Aaron, trade Tae, Campbell, Douglas, tonyan, etc.

Just need MVS and a good draft. And extend Jaire.

Pretty impressive.

Absolutely.

I think you pay MVS what it takes, which likely will be more than $5-6m a year. I would guess $25-30m spread over 3 years with maybe a couple voids at the end. That plus either Fuller or Cole would set us up fine at WR, and maybe drafting a WR would be gravy.

[call_me_ishmael]

Brass has done a fantastic job in last 2mo. Aaron, trade Tae, Campbell, Douglas, tonyan, etc.

Just need MVS and a good draft. And extend Jaire.

Pretty impressive.

Agreed.

[call_me_ishmael]

IMO Dillon was the most missed.

So how much do you pay MVS ? 5 to 6 MIL on a 2 year deal ? Wondering if teams are going to overpay since we're in the FA period

Man I don’t like how much they paid Douglas and I wouldn’t be super happy with more than one year of MVS at this price. We need to rebuild the position through the draft.

Part of me wonders if this whole trade Adams thing was the Gooter plan all along.

[texaspackerbacker]

Drafting WRs is a hit and miss situation more than most positions. I want MVS and at least one other proven guy. I'd even take Julio Jones if he was cheap enough along with either Cole or Fuller. Draft a WR somewhere, but probably not first round, and don't count on the guy too much. Look at last year - a couple of rookie stars and at least a couple of probable busts.

[Joemailman]

Man I don’t like how much they paid Douglas and I wouldn’t be super happy with more than one year of MVS at this price. We need to rebuild the position through the draft.

Part of me wonders if this whole trade Adams thing was the Gooter plan all along.

I read MVS was looking for a 1 year deal at 7-10M. If he was going to get that, I suspect he would have already gotten it. 6M sounds about right to me.

[Fritz]

MVS is an incomplete receiver. He's poor on contested balls. But teams have to respect his speed. He was missed very much against 49ers in playoff game.

He's got a hands problem. I just don't like guys who regularly drop the ball. And Lazard had or has a little bit of that, too.

[run pMc]

I've rooted for the kid, but always felt disappointed by MVS. I say let him dangle a bit and try to bring him back on a 'discount' if possible. He's talented but has never put it all together, and at this point you have to think he is what he is. His talent is $10M but his production is more like $2M.

His hands have improved but are still shaky at times and he's not a contested catcher. Was absolutely gobsmacked Maurice Drayton had him on the hands team for onsides kicks vs. CHI (week 14. The Bears recovered of course, with 82 seconds to play).

I think he has more value in MLF's offense than others but I'd be disappointed if he signed a multiyear deal for $8-10M per. Would prefer they draft a burner with better hands to run 9 routes for less.

[texaspackerbacker]

The way to beat the cap is not with a one year $7-10m contract. It's multi-year and a prorated bonus. Also, if you see MVS as a high ceiling work in progress, as I do, you don't want to lose him after he has a good year/possible breakout year.

[red]

The way to beat the cap is not with a one year $7-10m contract. It's multi-year and a prorated bonus. Also, if you see MVS as a high ceiling work in progress, as I do, you don't want to lose him after he has a good year/possible breakout year.

high ceiling, work in progress?

the fucking guy is 27. just 2 years younger then adams who some on here think was too old to keep

he's about to be a 5th year vet, he should have gotten it all together by now

rashan gary is already gotten it figured out, he's 24. alexander is already all world, he's 25

time to flush the turd and quit thinking its gonna magically grow into margot robbie if we just give it a bit more time

[Bretsky]

The way to beat the cap is not with a one year $7-10m contract. It's multi-year and a prorated bonus. Also, if you see MVS as a high ceiling work in progress, as I do, you don't want to lose him after he has a good year/possible breakout year.



I see him as a deep threat with sporadic consistency. An ideal #3/4 type WR.
I'd value him at about 4-5 MIL/year....probably closer to 5

[Fosco33]

Wonder how much cutting Carlos (best punter we’ve had in awhile) for OConnell was assessing his holds on kicks vs cap.

[red]

I see him as a deep threat with sporadic consistency. An ideal #3/4 type WR.
I'd value him at about 4-5 MIL/year....probably closer to 5

agree his a #3 or 4

[Joemailman]

From Tom Silverstein:


The one-year deal #Packers TE Robert Tonyan received is worth $3.7M and includes $1.75M in incentives, according to a source. The #Packers had to pay because at least three other teams were interested in signing him despite coming off a torn ACL. Says what people think of him.

[bobblehead]

high ceiling, work in progress?

the fucking guy is 27. just 2 years younger then adams who some on here think was too old to keep

he's about to be a 5th year vet, he should have gotten it all together by now

rashan gary is already gotten it figured out, he's 24. alexander is already all world, he's 25

time to flush the turd and quit thinking its gonna magically grow into margot robbie if we just give it a bit more time

MVS has already turned into a legit NFL WR. He isn't/won't ever be Adams so that comparison is foolish. He also isn't a top pick like the other guys you mentioned. And a 2 year difference in age when guys are effectively signing 3 year deals is huge.

That being said, I don't want to overpay him. Reports of him getting $10 million/per are a joke. I'm a huge fan and I will be pissed if we sign him for that. $7 mil is max I can see paying and even that seems a bit stiff. I was thinking $18m for 3 years myself.

[bobblehead]

I see him as a deep threat with sporadic consistency. An ideal #3/4 type WR.
I'd value him at about 4-5 MIL/year....probably closer to 5

You see him from 2 years ago. In the NFCC game in 2020 he was really good. This season he was pretty good when healthy. He is a legit #2/3 who becomes a legit #2 when the MVP is the one throwing to him. All he needed to become better was for our QB to stop staring down Adams all the time.....mission accomplished.

[bobblehead]

Wonder how much cutting Carlos (best punter we’ve had in awhile) for OConnell was assessing his holds on kicks vs cap.

I think it was about the fact that he looked cold after Dec 1st.

[Jereamiah]

Good. I thought Bears or Vikings might want him.

Well, it appears as if the Vikes are in on Smith now. Not confirmed yet, but all signs point to him in vikes Purple next year ;)

[Fritz]

About Bojo versus Irish guy . . . I've read in ACME that the contracts are actually pretty similar, so I'd say - as I have elsewhere - that the holds on kicks had a whole lot to do with it. That and punting badly in cold weather.

One thing I can't figure out is why teams don't use the backup QB as a holder any more. It's not like holders are getting hurt all the time, and then, if you use the backup QB, you have the potential for a fake or for getting a pass or play off if the snap sucks. You could even use a backup WR as a holder, if you wanted to keep Bojo. But his punting really fell off once it got cold. Weird, as he'd punted in Buffalo before.

As for Z Smith, well, if the Vikes sign him, just run to his side a lot. He doesn't hold an edge well and can get fooled on screens, too.

[Joemailman]

About Bojo versus Irish guy . . . I've read in ACME that the contracts are actually pretty similar, so I'd say - as I have elsewhere - that the holds on kicks had a whole lot to do with it. That and punting badly in cold weather.

One thing I can't figure out is why teams don't use the backup QB as a holder any more. It's not like holders are getting hurt all the time, and then, if you use the backup QB, you have the potential for a fake or for getting a pass or play off if the snap sucks. You could even use a backup WR as a holder, if you wanted to keep Bojo. But his punting really fell off once it got cold. Weird, as he'd punted in Buffalo before.

As for Z Smith, well, if the Vikes sign him, just run to his side a lot. He doesn't hold an edge well and can get fooled on screens, too.

I know when MM made the switch to punter as holder, he said it had more to do with practice. The backup QB can't be at one end of the field with the offense and at the other end of the field with the ST unit at the same time.

As for Bojo, maybe Buffalo let him go after the 2020 season for the same reason(s) the Packers did after the 2021 season.

[red]

yeah, kickers and punters are both equally not doing much during practice, so they may as well work together at something

[Jereamiah]

Smith signed with Minnesota ;)

[call_me_ishmael]

They signed Jarran Reed. I think I like it. Man would I love it though if a DL or Premier edgy in R1 though. Harv would you happy with one of the Georgia boys, namely the gigantic DT who could be a solid end or maybe even the Rashan Gary clone at edge? Given that they haven't moved on from Dynamic Dean Lowry, is it safe to say he's back w/ the Pack next year?

If you leave this draft with a DL, OLB, two WR, and a stud college linemen in the first 5 picks, I would feel very, very good about the roster for the upcoming season. Especially if they took a flyer on Julio down by the school yard.

[Joemailman]

Reed had a great year in 2018, and has been up and down statistically since then. He has been durable, starting every game the last 2 years. He's listed as 6-3, 313 lbs.

[run pMc]

Big mean dude, can really play when he wants to. Not sure he always wants to. Lancaster is a FA and Keke is gone, so they need someone to play on the DL. So the DL group is now Clark, Reed, Lowry, Slaton and Trashcan Heflin. Would be nice to see them draft another DL to develop as a long-term running mate for Kenny.

[George Cumby]

Reed had a great year in 2018, and has been up and down statistically since then. He has been durable, starting every game the last 2 years. He's listed as 6-3, 313 lbs.

I think this is a big deal.

He's got some tread on his tires, don't need to burn a pick on inside DL this year.

He's pretty active, can spell Big KC or could we put him next to Clark with Smith and Gary on the edges? That sounds like a matchup problem for the O.

[George Cumby]

Yeah.

Good pick up.

Big, strong, active, fast.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PoXQVuw9n1I

[Joemailman]

I think this is a big deal.

He's got some tread on his tires, don't need to burn a pick on inside DL this year.

He's pretty active, can spell Big KC or could we put him next to Clark with Smith and Gary on the edges? That sounds like a matchup problem for the O.

Watched some film of him that Larry McCarren went through. He was lining up all over the line, not just NT or 1T.

[Upnorth]

My opinion on Reed is an above average to low end good player.
Best part of the pick up and what makes him a great fit is availability. Always ready to go and plays lits of snaps. He will make the others better because they can breath a bit. Never played less tham 75% of the snaps from what ive read.
Can flash the occasional big play, but I like consistant

[scharpcheddar]

Twitter.
Chiefs have signed former Packers WR Marquez Valdes-Scantling, per @AdamSchefter.

More wideout reinforcements on the way ������

[texaspackerbacker]

Supposedly $30 up to $36 million over 3 years. I thought we'd keep him. I wish we'd kept him, but not at that price. Good job, MVS, taking advantage of the Chiefs.

[RashanGary]

Supposedly $30 up to $36 million over 3 years. I thought we'd keep him. I wish we'd kept him, but not at that price. Good job, MVS, taking advantage of the Chiefs.

So far we let go Davante, MVS, Zadarius and Patrick. Clearly the cap has an affect because there is no reason to get worse if you can just sign everyone. In fact, why not sign everyone and go out and get free agents if there is no such thing as the cap??

[call_me_ishmael]

So far we let go Davante, MVS, Zadarius and Patrick. Clearly the cap has an affect because there is no reason to get worse if you can just sign everyone. In fact, why not sign everyone and go out and get free agents if there is no such thing as the cap??

Are those players actually better than a draft pick or a different player at the same dollar amount would be? Man, IDK, Davante is overrated IMO. Been saying he was a #2 (foolishly) for years. He is a good #1 but he isn't Randy Moss or a game changer. He's Reggie Wayne (maybe).

Zadarius is another good player and solid pass rusher who could very well be missed and return to his stud status. We shall see.

MVS - meh.

[run pMc]

MVS signs with KC, 3 year $30M+ deal. Good for him. Wish him luck.
Too rich for my blood personally.

EDIT: saw others already posted. Nevermind.

[Joemailman]

Packers will likely make a move for a WR, but it might not happen until after the draft. Teams that are able to draft WR's may look to unload veterans. Last year, Devondre Campbell didn't sign until June. Packers traded for Randall Cobb on the eve of the season. Rasul Douglas was picked up after the season started.

[Joemailman]

Chandon Sullivan visiting the Vikings.

[Bretsky]

Are those players actually better than a draft pick or a different player at the same dollar amount would be? Man, IDK, Davante is overrated IMO. Been saying he was a #2 (foolishly) for years. He is a good #1 but he isn't Randy Moss or a game changer. He's Reggie Wayne (maybe).

Zadarius is another good player and solid pass rusher who could very well be missed and return to his stud status. We shall see.

MVS - meh.


Let's say we use our 22nd pick on a WR who we lock up for an economical contract for 5 years

Let's say we use round 2 to draft another legit option at WR and lock him up for another 4 years (better than MVS)

And we were able to keep Campbell, Douglas, and the new FA DL as well.

I'd say that's a win in my book.

[ThunderDan]

Are those players actually better than a draft pick or a different player at the same dollar amount would be? Man, IDK, Davante is overrated IMO. Been saying he was a #2 (foolishly) for years. He is a good #1 but he isn't Randy Moss or a game changer. He's Reggie Wayne (maybe).

Zadarius is another good player and solid pass rusher who could very well be missed and return to his stud status. We shall see.

MVS - meh.

Adams is the best WR in the league. If we had paired him with a legitimate 2 he would have been talked about with a Moss.

Randy had Chris Carter on the other side.

[call_me_ishmael]

Adams is the best WR in the league. If we had paired him with a legitimate 2 he would have been talked about with a Moss.

Randy had Chris Carter on the other side.

I disagree he is the best WR in the league and so does the league. Another player was just traded for a bigger haul and signed a contract worth 10% more. Agreed about Randy and obviously that's unfair - nobody is Randy except for Randy, but he isn't TO, Cheetah or Prime Julio even. He is really good - Reggie Wayne esque, but Reggie Wayne is an all-time great because of longevity and consistency more so than being physically dominant.

[Upnorth]

Let's say we use our 22nd pick on a WR who we lock up for an economical contract for 5 years

Let's say we use round 2 to draft another legit option at WR and lock him up for another 4 years (better than MVS)

And we were able to keep Campbell, Douglas, and the new FA DL as well.

I'd say that's a win in my book.

Let's say gute shits the bed draft wise. I feel Campbell Douglas and Reed with a manageable cap figure and room for a couple more fa is a win and worth the trade

[run pMc]

Let's say gute shits the bed draft wise. I feel Campbell Douglas and Reed with a manageable cap figure and room for a couple more fa is a win and worth the trade

It could happen. The thing about draft picks is that oh so tantalizing potential. If your R1 WR pick turns into John Ross or Rae Carruth then you're no better. I would hope Gute can do better than Amari Rodgers, MVS, or ESB with the picks he has.

Getting the cap space is helpful now and in the future, but losing Adams makes them a worse team until they fix their WR depth.

[Joemailman]

It could happen. The thing about draft picks is that oh so tantalizing potential. If your R1 WR pick turns into John Ross or Rae Carruth then you're no better. I would hope Gute can do better than Amari Rodgers, MVS, or ESB with the picks he has.

Getting the cap space is helpful now and in the future, but losing Adams makes them a worse team until they fix their WR depth.

Gute's track record in the 1st 2 rounds haa been pretty good though. 3 elite players (Alexander, Jenkins, Gary) and several others with the potential to get there (Myers, Stokes, Savage, Dillon). Only one bust (Josh Jackson). Problem has been the 3rd round. 2 busts (Burks, Sternberger) and 2 off to slow starts (DeGuara, Rodgers). Chances of a pretty good haul in 1st 2 rounds would appear to be pretty good.

[RashanGary]

I disagree he is the best WR in the league and so does the league. Another player was just traded for a bigger haul and signed a contract worth 10% more. Agreed about Randy and obviously that's unfair - nobody is Randy except for Randy, but he isn't TO, Cheetah or Prime Julio even. He is really good - Reggie Wayne esque, but Reggie Wayne is an all-time great because of longevity and consistency more so than being physically dominant.

I agree. For a while Adams was underrated but now that he is the so called best in the league, I disagree. Even when we talked about best all time Packer WRs, everyone put Sharpe, Hutson and Lofton ahead of Adams. A bunch put Jordy ahead.

Adams is a probowler and legit #1. But he is not spectacular. But honestly, neither was Jerry Rice.

[RashanGary]

Gute's track record in the 1st 2 rounds haa been pretty good though. 3 elite players (Alexander, Jenkins, Gary) and several others with the potential to get there (Myers, Stokes, Savage, Dillon). Only one bust (Josh Jackson). Problem has been the 3rd round. 2 busts (Burks, Sternberger) and 2 off to slow starts (DeGuara, Rodgers). Chances of a pretty good haul in 1st 2 rounds would appear to be pretty good.

Just about every WR in this years class is too slight in size. Even shorter WRs should weight 190 and these guys do not.

[RashanGary]

Just about every WR in this years class is too slight in size. Even shorter WRs should weight 190 and these guys do not.

I take it back. I looked through the top WRs in the NFL and a bunch are 180-190.

[Upnorth]

I agree. For a while Adams was underrated but now that he is the so called best in the league, I disagree. Even when we talked about best all time Packer WRs, everyone put Sharpe, Hutson and Lofton ahead of Adams. A bunch put Jordy ahead.

Adams is a probowler and legit #1. But he is not spectacular. But honestly, neither was Jerry Rice.

What makes players like Adams and rice great (Adams is no where near rice imo) are down after down after down of excellence.
Rodgers wants old reliable, always has since cutting his teeth with driver and Jennings.
Thats what we need, not a flashy guy. Well without mvs I guess we need a flashy guy as well, but down in down out is more important.

Also jones can sit out wide and be a dam fine flashy guy. If covered by a linebacker he is a great mismatch, do they pivot a safety? If they do what can Lazard and Lewis do now?
I wonder if we rock a 3 rb set sometimes, jones out wide, dillion and Taylor in. Either of those two can catch as well.
Feels like the 2 years when ahman green was the top wr in terms of catches. Not ideal but can win a few games.

[Upnorth]

What makes players like Adams and rice great (Adams is no where near rice imo) are down after down after down of excellence.
Rodgers wants old reliable, always has since cutting his teeth with driver and Jennings.
Thats what we need, not a flashy guy. Well without mvs I guess we need a flashy guy as well, but down in down out is more important.

Also jones can sit out wide and be a dam fine flashy guy. If covered by a linebacker he is a great mismatch, do they pivot a safety? If they do what can Lazard and Lewis do now?
I wonder if we rock a 3 rb set sometimes, jones out wide, dillion and Taylor in. Either of those two can catch as well.
Feels like the 2 years when ahman green was the top wr in terms of catches. Not ideal but can win a few games.

I still feel like we should get Landry and fuller, if cheap. If expensive heck no.
Still draft a couple because we need to plan for future.

Edit, I Did Not mean to quote myself, I ment to edit my post.
Or maybe I'm a narcissist.

[ThunderDan]

Adams is a probowler and legit #1. But he is not spectacular. But honestly, neither was Jerry Rice.

You can disregard anything RG says from now on after his stupidity about Jerry Rice.

[HarveyWallbangers]

You can disregard anything RG says from now on after his stupidity about Jerry Rice.

Correct, and don’t buy the nonsense about his 40 time. San Fran coaches were probably hand timing somewhere in the middle of nowhere in Mississippi. Times recorded back then at some random pro day are extremely untrustworthy. Watch him take slants to the house and tell me he was slow.

[Bretsky]

It would be nice is Amari Rodgers is not a bust. He had 4 dam catches last year and that is pretty terrible for a guy guys said he liked in the 2nd round. All our past decent wrs…Jennings Nelson j Jones devante….etc at least had in the 30 to 40 range in catches. Ecen with Cobb hurt this dude was invisible

[texaspackerbacker]

Gute's track record in the 1st 2 rounds haa been pretty good though. 3 elite players (Alexander, Jenkins, Gary) and several others with the potential to get there (Myers, Stokes, Savage, Dillon). Only one bust (Josh Jackson). Problem has been the 3rd round. 2 busts (Burks, Sternberger) and 2 off to slow starts (DeGuara, Rodgers). Chances of a pretty good haul in 1st 2 rounds would appear to be pretty good.

Good analysis, and a lot more relevant than hashing out how good Davante and various other past WRs were (we'll find out a lot about Adams this year when it isn't Rodgers throwing to him).

I've been strongly against drafting a WR early in past years. I have my doubts about it even this year, but almost certainly we will get one in the four first and second round picks. And I do tend to trust Gutekunst to pick a good one. That's not easy, as it seems like there are as many disappointments as successes among high picks. I say disappointment instead bust because some of them settle in as decent #2 and 3 WRs after drafted with higher expectations, and that kind of guy you can usually find them in mid or late rounds. You can bet whoever we get they will seem better with Rodgers throwing to them.

[Joemailman]

It would be nice is Amari Rodgers is not a bust. He had 4 dam catches last year and that is pretty terrible for a guy guys said he liked in the 2nd round. All our past decent wrs…Jennings Nelson j Jones devante….etc at least had in the 30 to 40 range in catches. Ecen with Cobb hurt this dude was invisible

He needs to come back quicker. I was surprised how unexplosive he looked last year. MLF made reference earlier this year to "what kind of shape Amari Rodgers shows up in". At the combine last year, his 40 time was just okay, but his 10 yard split was terrible, and his agility times were poor. He'll never be a burner, but again, he needs to get quicker.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/E0RPWdyWQAUivkA.png

[call_me_ishmael]

For 5'9", I would think they want him quite a bit thinner. I am really surprised they drafted someone like that. Doesn't seem explosive at all.

[Fritz]

It would be nice is Amari Rodgers is not a bust. He had 4 dam catches last year and that is pretty terrible for a guy guys said he liked in the 2nd round. All our past decent wrs…Jennings Nelson j Jones devante….etc at least had in the 30 to 40 range in catches. Ecen with Cobb hurt this dude was invisible

Right there is where you're wrong, Bretsky. Invisible? See that short, chubby guy on the sideline? That's not the towel guy - that's Amari Rodgers. Yeah, that overweight guy. Hard to miss.

On another topic, while I obviously do not have inside information, such as how much money the Packers thought MVS was worth, it's interesting that Aaron Rodgers thought publicly last offseason that the Packers didn't utilize him to keep or attract good players in or to Green Bay. He said he could help.

Davante Adams clearly did not want to stay. MVS did not feel compelled to stay (admittedly it could be that the Pack did not offer him nearly as much as KC). ESB, while not a great player, couldn't wait to get the hell out of Dodge. So when are we going to see some of that Aaron Rodgers recruiting magic?

[Joemailman]

Chandon Sullivan signing with Vikings.

[Joemailman]

Davante Adams clearly did not want to stay. MVS did not feel compelled to stay (admittedly it could be that the Pack did not offer him nearly as much as KC). ESB, while not a great player, couldn't wait to get the hell out of Dodge. So when are we going to see some of that Aaron Rodgers recruiting magic?

You just wait. Kumerow will be here.

[bobblehead]

Tip of the hat to those who said we could keep everyone. All we lost was both starting WR, starting RT, and our slot cb. Of course some are well aware that thise guys are all easily replaceable, but it makes me wonder why all these other teams are willing to pay them....what rubes.

[Upnorth]

Hey I just checked, Keenan Cole is still available. I take back my fuller is our best option comment earlier.

I think Cole was held back by his qbs. He will be a solid #2 we for us.

Plus he has kr pr experience and even played a few CB snaps

[call_me_ishmael]

Tip of the hat to those who said we could keep everyone. All we lost was both starting WR, starting RT, and our slot cb. Of course some are well aware that thise guys are all easily replaceable, but it makes me wonder why all these other teams are willing to pay them....what rubes.

Any or all of the above could have been back in the Packers wanted them back, though. This post is disingenuous at best. One could argue they were overpaid and not worth the money and the assets they will get in exchange for them exceeds their contributions at their costs.

[run pMc]

You just wait. Kumerow will be here.

LOL. Yeah, and Jared Abbrederis is holding on line 3.

[Joemailman]

Packers signing former Raiders CB Keisean Nixon. Primarily a key special teams player.

[Upnorth]

Any or all of the above could have been back in the Packers wanted them back, though. This post is disingenuous at best. One could argue they were overpaid and not worth the money and the assets they will get in exchange for them exceeds their contributions at their costs.

Sure we could have kept davante, but would then have lost rasul. We could have kept any 2 of Turner mvs chandon or all three, but would have had nothing for more important players

[RashanGary]

Sure we could have kept davante, but would then have lost rasul. We could have kept any 2 of Turner mvs chandon or all three, but would have had nothing for more important players

We do not have nor can we create enough space to keep everyone. Choices had to be made. They made as much space as they could and kept as many as they could.

[texaspackerbacker]

We did, we do, and we could have - at least everyone except maybe Z. Smith. Davante would have been affordable either with the franchise tag or on a contract like he signed with Oakland (oops). MVS could have been re-signed for about what KC is paying, but I guess the Packers decided he wasn't worth that much. This offseason is far from over, but IMO, we could win and be near the top even with no help other than what we get in the draft, but I'm fairly sure we sign either Fuller or D. Smith or maybe J. Jones, maybe even land Metcalf or some other big fish.

[Upnorth]

We did, we do, and we could have - at least everyone except maybe Z. Smith. Davante would have been affordable either with the franchise tag or on a contract like he signed with Oakland (oops). MVS could have been re-signed for about what KC is paying, but I guess the Packers decided he wasn't worth that much. This offseason is far from over, but IMO, we could win and be near the top even with no help other than what we get in the draft, but I'm fairly sure we sign either Fuller or D. Smith or maybe J. Jones, maybe even land Metcalf or some other big fish.

So there are cap casualties. And past choices are impacting the cap

[texaspackerbacker]

I meant to say D. Parker, not D. Smith (DeVante) in my post above.

What cap casualties? Zadarius maybe, but more likely they just chose not to pay him big with the bad back history. Adams and MVS easily could have been signed for what they got from the other teams, except Adams supposedly wanted to go for other reasons and MVS was not deemed to be worth what it woulda cost to keep him. I think Davante does ok with the Raiders but worse than he did here with Rodgers, and I think MBS goes on to have a good career with the Chiefs. I wish we coulda kept him, but Gutekunst and LaFleur know better.

The cap can always be defeated by smart accounting practices i.e. cooked.

[King Friday]

The cap can always be defeated by smart accounting practices i.e. cooked.

This is just a flat out lie, Tex. The entire purpose of the cap is to force a limitation on teams in terms of what they can spend. While teams can certainly use techniques to push money out, and benefit from periods where increasing revenues work to push the cap higher, it is impossible to ALWAYS defeat it.

The fact the Packers are losing players is precisely because of the cap. I'm sure the Packers would've preferred to keep several of the guys who moved on...but they choose not to pay higher contractual amounts PRECISELY because of the cap. That is the ONLY reason those guys are no longer in Green Bay.

So, you can't ALWAYS cook the cap and get what you want.

[texaspackerbacker]

When I say "smart accounting practices i.e. cap-cooking" I just worded it that way to annoy ya'all negativists (is that what they call trolling?). What I mean is perpetually doing exactly what we have been doing - big bonuses, long term contracts, tiny first year salary/cap hit, back loaded probably with void years at the end. And then when it's time to pay the piper, you do it all over again. Sure, in 3 or 5 or 7 or 10 years when Rodgers actually retires and maybe a similar or lesser situation with other guys contracts at some point in the future, we might have a period of badness - or not with the expected increase in the cap, but we postpone that as long as possible and have continued great success as long as we have Rodgers. Thankfully, LaFleur, Gutekunst, et al seem to think that way too.

[bobblehead]

Any or all of the above could have been back in the Packers wanted them back, though. This post is disingenuous at best. One could argue they were overpaid and not worth the money and the assets they will get in exchange for them exceeds their contributions at their costs.

Agreed. If the packers wanted to pay MVS $10 mil and D 28 Mil and Turner whatever he got, we could have destroyed the cap for 4 years instead of 2. Or alternatively we could have started the lineup from the movie major league for 2 years.

I ask you then, if the cap could be cooked and we could have brought them all back, and Rodgers wanted MVS back, and I would think we wanted our starting RT back, probably a solid CB as well.....why didn't we? Is Gutes just stupid and TRYING to lose?

[bobblehead]

We do not have nor can we create enough space to keep everyone. Choices had to be made. They made as much space as they could and kept as many as they could.

No JH, we are just stupid. They could have brought everyone back, and signed 3 premium FAs, but Gutes doesn't really want to win or something.

[bobblehead]

We did, we do, and we could have - at least everyone except maybe Z. Smith. Davante would have been affordable either with the franchise tag or on a contract like he signed with Oakland (oops). MVS could have been re-signed for about what KC is paying, but I guess the Packers decided he wasn't worth that much. This offseason is far from over, but IMO, we could win and be near the top even with no help other than what we get in the draft, but I'm fairly sure we sign either Fuller or D. Smith or maybe J. Jones, maybe even land Metcalf or some other big fish.

See, tex says so. No wonder ARod is pissed. Gutes is sabotaging him by not bringing in 53 pro bowlers to crush the Owl.

[RashanGary]

No JH, we are just stupid. They could have brought everyone back, and signed 3 premium FAs, but Gutes doesn't really want to win or something.

That is just it. If the cap can be cooked, why not cook it and keep your team together? Why let so many go?

[run pMc]

The cap can be manipulated, but there are limits. The Packers are just about at that limit. There simply aren't any sizable contracts left to cook for 2022 with the exception of an extension for Jaire or Amos.
When you push or stretch money out over years - even void years - it doesn't go away, it grows into a pile of future cap space.
Check this out: https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/green-bay-packers/cap/2022/
They actually have about $24M in dead cap money for 2022 - money that could have been used to sign other players. Kevin freaking King isn't suiting up for GB but he'll count $3M+ against the cap this year.

It makes sense to keep Rodgers and keep trying for an Owl as long as it looks possible, and I think we all agree that at some point it's going to be very ugly because the dead cap numbers are going to grow. (Yes, the cap will also, but I don't think the growth of the cap is going to keep pace...especially with Rodgers contract if he retires in 2 years.) Claiming the cap can be indefinitely cooked is not true.

As for additional off-season moves, I'd consider offering the comp R4 or an R5 for Davante Parker... he's at best the #3 on the depth chart behind Tyreek and Waddle, he has two years on his contract that are about what MVS got, and he's a better WR. They will need to get a veteran WR of at least reasonable quality, asking Cobb, Lazard, and Amari Rodgers to be your top 3 WRs is a stretch. (And yes, I'm assuming they will draft a WR or two, but history shows it is unusual for rookie WRs to be superstars out of the gate.)

I don't know about Julio Jones, I feel like dude is always hurt and he's like 33 now.

Will Fuller is either secretly good, on steroids, or hurt. I don't think you can count on him for more than 8-10 games a season - he's hurt more than Kevin King.

If you are active in Free Agency, you are most likely paying at-or-above market rates for players who might be reaching the downside of their careers. (i.e., you're probably overpaying) Ascending players tend to be kept by their teams, Davante and Tyreek notwithstanding. GB made this mess by either not drafting WRs, or not drafting good ones.

[texaspackerbacker]

See, tex says so. No wonder ARod is pissed. Gutes is sabotaging him by not bringing in 53 pro bowlers to crush the Owl.

The off-season ain't over yet.

[RashanGary]

The off-season ain't over yet.

Why not cook the cap more and keep guys like Davante, Zadarius and MVS?

[NewsBruin]

To pile onto pMc"s point, re-working contracts to "cook the cap" also makes players trade-proof and cut-proof until the last year of their deal. Maybe someone like Jaire is a no-brainer to keep, but if any of our "cooked" players is permanently injured or becomes a lockerroom liability, the team's already written the check and the cap hit comes due once he's off the roster.

It's great if you're the trading partner: The offering team is eating the bonus part of the cap hit, so you're paying below-market and you have much less cap penalty if you want to cut him during his contract.

[texaspackerbacker]

Why not cook the cap more and keep guys like Davante, Zadarius and MVS?

How many times does it need to be said, Davante wanted to go, Zadarius is a bad investment with that back problem, and MVS was deemed to be not worth the money (I wish they had kept him, but apparently the people running the team don't have as good an opinion of him as I do). None of that was about cap problems.

The Raiders will regret paying Davante' The Vikings will strongly regret paying Zadarius; And the Chiefs will be glad they paid Valdez-Scantling.

[Bretsky]

I don't think anybody said Zadarius is a bad investment. With no cap, I'd keep him in a second as he's a great pass rusher. We've got plenty of reserves in GB is we're not considering the cap.

If he's healthy Minnesota got a deal for his talents. But with a salary cap, we had to let him go.

[bobblehead]

I don't think anybody said Zadarius is a bad investment. With no cap, I'd keep him in a second as he's a great pass rusher. We've got plenty of reserves in GB is we're not considering the cap.

If he's healthy Minnesota got a deal for his talents. But with a salary cap, we had to let him go.

Haven't you been paying attention? We did NOT have to let him go, we chose to.

[Upnorth]

If I didnnt have to worry about cap room I would definitely have z and mvs. Plus I would actively be lookiing at available dt and ot right now. Plus I would get Julio and fuller and Landry. Because why not? We have top 10 cash flow. Stupid to not get these guys.

Also the Raiders niners and patriots have the 3 highest ticket revenues so they should have the best free agents becausecap doesn't matter.
Or dallas and the giants.

But that's not how it really works.

[Anti-Polar Bear]

I don't think anybody said Zadarius is a bad investment. With no cap, I'd keep him in a second as he's a great pass rusher. We've got plenty of reserves in GB is we're not considering the cap.

If he's healthy Minnesota got a deal for his talents. But with a salary cap, we had to let him go.

I

[Anti-Polar Bear]

I don't think anybody said Zadarius is a bad investment. With no cap, I'd keep him in a second as he's a great pass rusher. We've got plenty of reserves in GB is we're not considering the cap.

If he's healthy Minnesota got a deal for his talents. But with a salary cap, we had to let him go.

I’m with ole Tex on this and that.

Mien zuruck seems to be getting better, but last year, I flipped burgers through months of mild back pain. How many inexcusable absence did I miss? Zero; I am tougher than Brett Favre. But suppose I missed a tons of workdays. What do you think woulda happened? Even at $7.25/hr, they woulda terminated me.

The NFL ain’t any different from any other place. The unproductive bee always gets terminated from the hive. Z’s zuruck rendered him unproductive last season. Hence, his termination from the Packers. The Packers, with respect to the current cap, coulda paid Z $14M/yr if that’s what they desired. Cook the fucking cap. But if McDonald’s won’t pay an unproductive worker $7.25/hr, what makes you think the Packers would pay Z $14M a year?

[Upnorth]

I’m with ole Tex on this and that.

Mien zuruck seems to be getting better, but last year, I flipped burgers through months of mild back pain. How many inexcusable absence did I miss? Zero; I am tougher than Brett Favre. But suppose I missed a tons of workdays. What do you think woulda happened? Even at $7.25/hr, they woulda terminated me.

The NFL ain’t any different from any other place. The unproductive bee always gets terminated from the hive. Z’s zuruck rendered him unproductive last season. Hence, his termination from the Packers. The Packers, with respect to the current cap, coulda paid Z $14M/yr if that’s what they desired. Cook the fucking cap. But if McDonald’s won’t pay an unproductive worker $7.25/hr, what makes you think the Packers would pay Z $14M a year?

z had more snaps than bak last year. We kept bak.
You cook the cap guys don't appear to apply logic to your evidence pieces.
The future money we spend today does have negative consequences. Sometimes the team feels it is worth it (like bak) so.etimes they don't see it that way (like z). I mean taken to an extreme we could keep everybody this year and add a ton but can we even field a team in a year or two?
Current choices have future implications.

[Anti-Polar Bear]

If I didnnt have to worry about cap room I would definitely have z and mvs. Plus I would actively be lookiing at available dt and ot right now. Plus I would get Julio and fuller and Landry. Because why not? We have top 10 cash flow. Stupid to not get these guys.

Also the Raiders niners and patriots have the 3 highest ticket revenues so they should have the best free agents becausecap doesn't matter.
Or dallas and the giants.

But that's not how it really works.

You Canadians still worship the Queen of England, so y’all must still be using the metric system. No wonder you ain’t got a fucking clue how the NFL really works. Yes “ain’t” is an American word. It came from the hill folks - who then introduced it to the Blacks - upon their devolution from the classy and sophisticated Brits. I ain’t no hill folk, nor am I Black, but decided to start using “ain’t” after seeing Tarantino’s Django Unchained.

Anyways, there’s this thing in the NFL called revenue sharing. If Bezos makes it rain and pays the NFL $10 billion a year. Assuming my math ain’t fucked, each team gets $312.5M. The players get 48% of that sum. In other words, each team gets, at the minimum, $150M to spend on players in a given season. Note that Bezos ain’t the only one feeding the NFL. Bottom line is, ain’t matter that the Packers’ “owners” are a bunch of middle-class folks like Bobble; not billionaires like Jerry Jones.

Revenue sharing allows the Packers to compete for players with the Cowfuckers. The cap, in the modern era, merely serves as an excuse for the Jerry Jones of the NFL to cut labor expenses. I mean, a dollar more Jones has to pay a player is a dollar less he takes home.

As a wise man once said, so long as cash flow keeps a-flowing, the cap can always be cooked.

[run pMc]

what makes you think the Packers would pay Z $14M a year?
Z's cap hit was $28M, the cap savings by cutting him was closer to 14 or 15M.

If there is no cap, what does Russ Ball do? If he cooks the cap, why does it need to be cooked? Answer: because it had limits, and you can't indefinitely outflank limits.

Also: that $24M in dead cap space they have this year is over 11% of their cap, meaning they are really working with ~88% of normal cap space to sign FA or their own players

[Upnorth]

You Canadians still worship the Queen of England, so y’all must still be using the metric system. No wonder you ain’t got a fucking clue how the NFL really works. Yes “ain’t” is an American word. It came from the hill folks - who then introduced it to the Blacks - upon their devolution from the classy and sophisticated Brits. I ain’t no hill folk, nor am I Black, but decided to start using “ain’t” after seeing Tarantino’s Django Unchained.

Anyways, there’s this thing in the NFL called revenue sharing. If Bezos makes it rain and pays the NFL $10 billion a year. Assuming my math ain’t fucked, each team gets $312.5M. The players get 48% of that sum. In other words, each team gets, at the minimum, at $150M to spend on players in a given season. Note that Bezos ain’t the only one feeding the NFL. Bottom line is, ain’t matter that the Packers’ “owners” are a bunch of middle-class folks like Bobble; not billionaires like Jerry Jones.

Revenue sharing allows the Packers to compete for players with the Cowfuckers. The cap, in the modern era, merely serves as an excuse for the Jerry Jones of the NFL to cut labor expenses. I mean, a dollar more Jones has to pay a player is a dollar less he takes home.

As a wise man once said, so long as cash flow keeps a-flowing, the cap can always be cooked.

Tv revenues ain't the only revenues available to teams. That's why the packers are a have team not a have not. Our tickets are above average. Our stadoum capacity is above average. Our stadium is sold out. Hence cash flow positive. If the cap ain't 'real' there are only a couple teams who beat us in cash. But a team with less cash flow won the last 2 Super bowls. If you can ingnore the cap and build the team you want and not have consequences then fuck it lets get us some of them free agents. Ain't no thang

[Anti-Polar Bear]

z had more snaps than bak last year. We kept bak.
You cook the cap guys don't appear to apply logic to your evidence pieces.
The future money we spend today does have negative consequences. Sometimes the team feels it is worth it (like bak) so.etimes they don't see it that way (like z). I mean taken to an extreme we could keep everybody this year and add a ton but can we even field a team in a year or two?
Current choices have future implications.

Back maladies tend to linger, even with surgery. A tear in a knee can be surgically repaired. Bak and Z: apples and oranges.

[Anti-Polar Bear]

Z's cap hit was $28M, the cap savings by cutting him was closer to 14 or 15M.

If there is no cap, what does Russ Ball do? If he cooks the cap, why does it need to be cooked? Answer: because it had limits, and you can't indefinitely outflank limits.

Also: that $24M in dead cap space they have this year is over 11% of their cap, meaning they are really working with ~88% of normal cap space to sign FA or their own players

I’m using numbers from Z’s recent deal with the Queens. According to spotrac, the 3 year deal averaged $14M a year. $3.3M cap hit in 22!

Let’s be real here, the only reason we’re chatting about “dead money” in part and the cap as a whole is because the cap got fucked by the “aberration.” Not even the NFL’s highly paid, Ivy League-educated team of economists could forecast the aberration. Packers had to cook the cap a tons for the “Last Dance.” Hence, the increase in dead money this year. Things being normal, upnorth would be like, cutting Z is akin to Thompson cutting Wahle - unnecessary.

If the Packers needed more cap space this year, they could always cook the cap further. Sure, all things being equal, the ‘24 cap might show something like a dead money of $60M. But all ain’t gonna be equal. Bezo’s gonna make it rain. Some contracts will expire and some will get extended or renewed. And who’s to say the Packers can’t cook the cap in ‘24?

[texaspackerbacker]

You ain't wrong, APB hahahaha, either about the apples to oranges thing or the NFL income stream, which of course translate to cap or the "aberration". Assuming your 48% to the players thing comes from the CBA, it's required to. Even with the small market and all, though, I'm not so sure the Packers are all that radically on the receiving end of revenue sharing. A sold out stadium every game, massive money from NFL logo gear, etc., I would think they are at least in the mid range among teams bringing in money.

[Anti-Polar Bear]

Tv revenues ain't the only revenues available to teams. That's why the packers are a have team not a have not. Our tickets are above average. Our stadoum capacity is above average. Our stadium is sold out. Hence cash flow positive. If the cap ain't 'real' there are only a couple teams who beat us in cash. But a team with less cash flow won the last 2 Super bowls. If you can ingnore the cap and build the team you want and not have consequences then fuck it lets get us some of them free agents. Ain't no thang

Every team in the NFL has positive cash flow - thanks to revenue sharing. Despite the cap being ever present, every team was able to compete for Deshaun Watson’s service. Proof? The Saints are supposedly in a cap hell - thanks Brees - yet they were a legitimate player for Watson.

Haves and have nots are determined by QBs, not the fucking cap.

[RashanGary]

The cap can only be cooked so far. They are almost out of contracts to rework and extensions to dole out.

Hence they made some business decisions and moved on from a few good players.

[texaspackerbacker]

I don't think anybody said Zadarius is a bad investment. With no cap, I'd keep him in a second as he's a great pass rusher. We've got plenty of reserves in GB is we're not considering the cap.

If he's healthy Minnesota got a deal for his talents. But with a salary cap, we had to let him go.

I didn't say he IS a bad investment for the Packers. They probably got their money's worth out of him. I said he will be a bad investment for the Vikings and would have been for the Packers if we paid enough to keep him. He's an injury waiting to happen.

No, we didn't need to let him go for the cap. If it's true his cap hit for the Vikings is only $3+ million, we easily could have done that.

[Joemailman]

I didn't say he IS a bad investment for the Packers. They probably got their money's worth out of him. I said he will be a bad investment for the Vikings and would have been for the Packers if we paid enough to keep him. He's an injury waiting to happen.

No, we didn't need to let him go for the cap. If it's true his cap hit for the Vikings is only $3+ million, we easily could have done that.

Z's cap hit if the Packers kept him was going to be 28 million, because the Packers cooked the cap last year to keep him on the team.

[texaspackerbacker]

Of course we could have restructured him, probably for about the same as the Vikings got him for, but it wouldn't have been wise given his back injury history.

Speaking of the Vikings, did I miss a comment somewhere in here? Or didn't poor Chandon Sullivan merit even a mention - signing with them. $2-3 million on a one year deal, I liked him and was sort of hoping we'd keep him too, but that seems like a bit much to pay him hahahahaha.

[Upnorth]

Of course we could have restructured him, probably for about the same as the Vikings got him for, but it wouldn't have been wise given his back injury history.

Speaking of the Vikings, did I miss a comment somewhere in here? Or didn't poor Chandon Sullivan merit even a mention - signing with them. $2-3 million on a one year deal, I liked him and was sort of hoping we'd keep him too, but that seems like a bit much to pay him hahahahaha.

Very solid #4 CB. Great for depth. But could he play st well? If not that maybe why we let him walk.

[Fritz]

Very solid #4 CB. Great for depth. But could he play st well? If not that maybe why we let him walk.

As others have commented, it looks like the organization has woken up to the idea that fixing ST requires not only an experienced, expert ST coach, but also players who are more than spare part backups on offense or defense.

I don't know if Sullivan played ST - I suppose as a fan I ought to have known. I did like him as a depth guy, but probably they figure they can get Shemale Jean Claude Van Damme from last year to take that on, and play ST.

[Joemailman]

As others have commented, it looks like the organization has woken up to the idea that fixing ST requires not only an experienced, expert ST coach, but also players who are more than spare part backups on offense or defense.

I don't know if Sullivan played ST - I suppose as a fan I ought to have known. I did like him as a depth guy, but probably they figure they can get Shemale Jean Claude Van Damme from last year to take that on, and play ST.

Sullivan played only a little on ST last year, after playing quite a bit the previous 2 years. He was probably deemed expendable with SJC probably playing more this year, and the trio of starting corners taking a lot of snaps in slot.

[run pMc]

I think Jaire-Stokes-Rasul are mostly outside corners, although you could play Jaire in the slot. Sullivan was the slot corner and was occasionally picked on there but in general not a tire fire. Not a bad player, but they can do better.
Thing about Jaire is he was pretty close to a lockdown corner on the outside, and if you can shutdown half/third of the field that's worth a lot, plus he's on the small side with a shoulder injury, so you might not want him playing a lot of slot snaps where run support is part of the role.

Paying Sullivan $3M would have been a luxury, they can likely get someone cheaper and as good if not better via draft or FA. I didn't love what I saw from SJC last year in preseason and his regular season snaps were almost exclusively on ST so he might not be anything more than depth. Replacing Sullivan and Henry Black (while providing competition for Savage/depth at S) would be the priorities on the back end of the D... not anywhere as urgent as fixing their WR issues, but there's a definite need there.

[Fritz]

Sullivan played only a little on ST last year, after playing quite a bit the previous 2 years. He was probably deemed expendable with SJC probably playing more this year, and the trio of starting corners taking a lot of snaps in slot.

I wonder a bit about last year's later round guys, Shemar whoever and Isaiah McDuffie. I wonder if they're really going to be ST guys only, or if either can contribute on the field. I tend to think not - especially McDuffie, as it seems first-year ILB's can pick up the system quickly enough to contribute. But we'll see. Maybe they were already drafting with ST in mind last year, and with Oral Burks, Ty Summers, ESB, and these guys, it really was just the long snapper, Bojo-as-holder, and Maurice Drayton who were the culprits.

[Joemailman]

Due to a lack of height and lack of elite speed, SJC was drafted to play slot. However, he didn't play slot much in college, so he was learning a new position. Whether he can overcome his physical shortcomings remains to be seen. He was definitely drafted as a football player, not so much as an athlete. His RAS score has to be among the lowest of anyone Gute has drafted.

https://www.si.com/.image/c_fit%2Ccs_srgb%2Cfl_progressive%2Cq_auto:good%2Cw _620/MTgwMjgwMTAwMTI0NjMyOTQw/shemar.jpg

[RashanGary]

Due to a lack of height and lack of elite speed, SJC was drafted to play slot. However, he didn't play slot much in college, so he was learning a new position. Whether he can overcome his physical shortcomings remains to be seen. He was definitely drafted as a football player, not so much as an athlete. His RAS score has to be among the lowest of anyone Gute has drafted.

https://www.si.com/.image/c_fit%2Ccs_srgb%2Cfl_progressive%2Cq_auto:good%2Cw _620/MTgwMjgwMTAwMTI0NjMyOTQw/shemar.jpg

Last year was said to be a shallow draft. A bunch of seniors that should have been in the pool were allowed to go back to school for an extra year. All of those 5th year seniors will be in this years draft. So this years is supposed to be extra deep.

[Fritz]

What really surprised me was when someone posted Amari Rodgers's RAS score - it was awfully, awfully low for a guy drafted in the third round who Gutes supposedly considered in the second round.

[bobblehead]

https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nfl/jerry-jones-reveals-simple-reason-for-trading-amari-cooper/ar-AAVADXh?ocid=msedgdhp&pc=U531&cvid=ac33a6db7115490a90879ab9f2784bb0

Stupid Jerry Jones thinks the salary cap forced him to choose how to allocate money. Doesn't that moron know that he could have simply cooked the books and kept everyone?

[Upnorth]

https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nfl/jerry-jones-reveals-simple-reason-for-trading-amari-cooper/ar-AAVADXh?ocid=msedgdhp&pc=U531&cvid=ac33a6db7115490a90879ab9f2784bb0

Stupid Jerry Jones thinks the salary cap forced him to choose how to allocate money. Doesn't that moron know that he could have simply cooked the books and kept everyone?

So that's why everyone thinks he is a poor owner. He just doesn't know about cooking the books!

[RashanGary]

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nfl.com/_amp/packers-coach-matt-lafleur-trading-wr-davante-adams-tough-for-me-personally

Matt Lafleur cites the Packers having to get below the salary cap as a reason for the Davante trade.

What do you think of that, Tex and APB??

[RashanGary]

Andrew Brandt said people who say the salary cap is not real have never managed a salary cap.

[Upnorth]

Andrew Brandt said people who say the salary cap is not real have never managed a salary cap.

Salt meets wound.

[RashanGary]

I think we all know there are ways to manipulate the cap and pay later. Nobody is saying that is not possible. But I think most of us also understand that there is a price to pay later when you do that.

[texaspackerbacker]

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nfl.com/_amp/packers-coach-matt-lafleur-trading-wr-davante-adams-tough-for-me-personally

Matt Lafleur cites the Packers having to get below the salary cap as a reason for the Davante trade.

What do you think of that, Tex and APB??

So the various dumbasses are still whining and ranting about this hahahahaha. I'm fine with it being just me and APB (and Gutekunst and LaFleur) who see things the way they are. Any media pukes or posters spewing bogus shit either are just stirring up trouble or ignorant.

LaFleur said that as a very short term thing. He also said the cap wasn't gonna keep the team from keeping anybody they needed. The Packers had numerous things they could have done/still can do to decrease the number against the cap (Alexander, Amos to name a couple). These likely will be done as needed when the Packers sign free agents at WR, etc. I just heard Gutekunst say they won't be restricted about who they sign before the season.

Regarding Jerry Jones, he probably is one of the "poorest" or least liquid owners. His net worth is listed at $8.6 billion, but nearly $7 billion of that is the Cowboys team. Even so, they haven't exactly been having a fire sale.

So whine on, ignoramuses. The off-season is far from over. I'm expecting the Packers to pick up one or more quality WR FAs as well as any other bargain that might come along.

[call_me_ishmael]

I think we all know there are ways to manipulate the cap and pay later. Nobody is saying that is not possible. But I think most of us also understand that there is a price to pay later when you do that.

I think everyone does that. The question is is it worth it? Depends on your perspective but I’d rather be great followed by a suck then just be good.

[texaspackerbacker]

You nailed it on the tradeoff, CMI.

Myself, I'll take consistently good over your "great and suck" thing.

[Bretsky]

You nailed it on the tradeoff, CMI.

Myself, I'll take consistently good over your "great and suck" thing.



I wanna be more than a Fart in the Wind :)

[texaspackerbacker]

That could be taken as support for either choice, Bretsky. Who won the damn last Super Bowl or lost it for that matter? How about the year before that or the year before that? Farts in the wind, I'd say. Who has been damn good for 25 or 30 years? It doesn't get much beyond the Packers.

What I really came on to say, though, is that there is a guy named Basaraski who makes YouTube videos that ya'all negativists really ought to check out. He says $15 million in cap space now - half of that needed for rookies, but that's before extending/restructuring Alexander and several others to further increase the cap space.

[Bretsky]

That could be taken as support for either choice, Bretsky. Who won the damn last Super Bowl or lost it for that matter? How about the year before that or the year before that? Farts in the wind, I'd say. Who has been damn good for 25 or 30 years? It doesn't get much beyond the Packers.

What I really came on to say, though, is that there is a guy named Basaraski who makes YouTube videos that ya'all negativists really ought to check out. He says $15 million in cap space now - half of that needed for rookies, but that's before extending/restructuring Alexander and several others to further increase the cap space.



Tex Tex Tex; you fail to understand the Fart in the Wind Concept Ron Wolf was quoted out as using many many many years ago when asked about his tenure in Green Bay and the fact that they were one and done despite having all kinds of opportunities with Brett Favre to win multiple Super Bowls. Currently that's the state of Rodgers.

And are you really pimping a YouTube guy :) Hell I could start making those vids if I wanted to tomorrow; I'd take the media guys every day of the week over a youtuber I've never heard of.

[HarveyWallbangers]

Tex Tex Tex; you fail to understand the Fart in the Wind Concept Ron Wolf was quoted out as using many many many years ago when asked about his tenure in Green Bay and the fact that they were one and done despite having all kinds of opportunities with Brett Favre to win multiple Super Bowls. Currently that's the state of Rodgers.

And are you really pimping a YouTube guy :) Hell I could start making those vids if I wanted to tomorrow; I'd take the media guys every day of the week over a youtuber I've never heard of.

Basaraski is pretty good. I'd take him and some other youtubers over most of the mainstream media folks. Some of the youtubers only post click bait, but a lot of them are good. You have to be able to identify which ones are good or not. :)

They'll need closer to $10m going into the season though. A Jaire extension would probably free up around $7m, so we have about $12m to play with. Wouldn't have been enough to sign Adams and everybody else (despite Tex's comments), but we knew the salary cap situation wasn't as dire as national media guys made it out to be. There are 2-3 spots they will shore up with cheaper veterans ahead of the draft--because Gutey doesn't like going into the draft with obvious needs. I don't know how they would be able to go into the draft without an obvious need at WR though.

[bobblehead]

So that's why everyone thinks he is a poor owner. He just doesn't know about cooking the books!

Unless its a Saving and Loan!! BOOM!

Thats a Jerruh joke, not a political joke just in case anyone is offended.

[bobblehead]

So the various dumbasses are still whining and ranting about this hahahahaha. I'm fine with it being just me and APB (and Gutekunst and LaFleur) who see things the way they are. Any media pukes or posters spewing bogus shit either are just stirring up trouble or ignorant.

LaFleur said that as a very short term thing. He also said the cap wasn't gonna keep the team from keeping anybody they needed. The Packers had numerous things they could have done/still can do to decrease the number against the cap (Alexander, Amos to name a couple). These likely will be done as needed when the Packers sign free agents at WR, etc. I just heard Gutekunst say they won't be restricted about who they sign before the season.

Regarding Jerry Jones, he probably is one of the "poorest" or least liquid owners. His net worth is listed at $8.6 billion, but nearly $7 billion of that is the Cowboys team. Even so, they haven't exactly been having a fire sale.

So whine on, ignoramuses. The off-season is far from over. I'm expecting the Packers to pick up one or more quality WR FAs as well as any other bargain that might come along.

So, who are we going to restructure to sign the draft picks?

[texaspackerbacker]

Basaraski is pretty good. I'd take him and some other youtubers over most of the mainstream media folks. Some of the youtubers only post click bait, but a lot of them are good. You have to be able to identify which ones are good or not. :)

They'll need closer to $10m going into the season though. A Jaire extension would probably free up around $7m, so we have about $12m to play with. Wouldn't have been enough to sign Adams and everybody else (despite Tex's comments), but we knew the salary cap situation wasn't as dire as national media guys made it out to be. There are 2-3 spots they will shore up with cheaper veterans ahead of the draft--because Gutey doesn't like going into the draft with obvious needs. I don't know how they would be able to go into the draft without an obvious need at WR though.

It would have been a close call to pay him the franchise tag amount, $19m or so, all of it hitting the cap in one year. To pay him on a deal like the Raiders, though. (I haven't heard their exact first year cap hit) would have been less than $10 million - easily doable.

Also, (and this should answer bobblehead's question, since he failed to read earlier posts), There's Alexander - I'll just go with your $7m figure, Harvey. Also Amos probably another $4 or so, Lowery $4 something if cut, $2 or 3 from restructuring, Crosby - I'd like to see him cut for I think it's $4.7 or 4.8, but maybe $2 or 3 if he's extended, maybe a couple of others I'm not recalling at the moment, but that's minimum of about $16 million saved in addition to the $15 million or so we apparently have right now. I'll go with your figure of $10 million for the season, Harvey. Basaraski said $7.5m or so for drafted players, but there's always a few in season items so $10 is probably about right.

Anyway, that would leave $20 million plus for free agents before the season, probably at least one Fuller-quality WR and maybe the $10-12m for the 3 defensive FAs Basaraski mentioned yesterday (or something similar) and still have money left over.

I always hated it when Ted Thompson did not play it close to the edge with the salary cap. Gutekunst, based on both his words and deeds, is coming a lot closer to the way I'd like to see it.

[run pMc]

Some of your numbers are off Tex.

Cutting Crosby only saves them about $2M, and they already restructured Amos this month - they converted $5.8M of 2022 salary into signing bonus, adding 4 void years, clearing $4.704M of cap space with Green Bay. They can't really do anything else with him.

They have Alexander and Lowry left, and that's it. There are no other moves they can really do that are worthwhile... and if they cut Crosby or Lowry, they have to sign players who can fill those positions. Those are starters, you fill them with scrubs you risk making your team worse...and kicker is a position where if a team neglects it, it is at their peril. Aside from those two, there are no more contracts to cook the cap with - any other cap space will be from cuts, and there aren't many left that might sense (Lowry, Crosby).

Adams' cap hit is under $10M but goes up to like $30M next year. You could have kept Adams, sure, if he wanted to stay here but he didn't so it doesn't really matter. They should have extended him last year but Bill O'Brian and his stupid GMing gave Hopkins a crazy contract that Adams wanted to approach/pass. I don't think you pay a WR what is basically QB money.

Unused cap space used to get rolled over into the next year, but I think that changed? I'm ok with them carrying a little extra cap space over to next year if that's still allowed.
You do need cap room to sign your draft picks and also carry a little space into the season to sign injury replacements.

I'm pretty sure Ball and the FO know what they're doing... it's their job. Pre-covid they hadn't made a lot of bad cap mgmt moves, they'll figure this out. I think we agree any narrative suggesting they can keep everyone is crazy. It's normal for successful teams lose players.

[RashanGary]

So the various dumbasses are still whining and ranting about this hahahahaha. I'm fine with it being just me and APB (and Gutekunst and LaFleur) who see things the way they are. Any media pukes or posters spewing bogus shit either are just stirring up trouble or ignorant.

LaFleur said that as a very short term thing. He also said the cap wasn't gonna keep the team from keeping anybody they needed. The Packers had numerous things they could have done/still can do to decrease the number against the cap (Alexander, Amos to name a couple). These likely will be done as needed when the Packers sign free agents at WR, etc. I just heard Gutekunst say they won't be restricted about who they sign before the season.

Regarding Jerry Jones, he probably is one of the "poorest" or least liquid owners. His net worth is listed at $8.6 billion, but nearly $7 billion of that is the Cowboys team. Even so, they haven't exactly been having a fire sale.

So whine on, ignoramuses. The off-season is far from over. I'm expecting the Packers to pick up one or more quality WR FAs as well as any other bargain that might come along.

Matt Lafleur literally said that they traded Adams in part because of the salary cap. Do not include Lafleur and Gute in your little fantasy.

[texaspackerbacker]

LaFleur also said they had the ability to retain anybody they needed or wanted to retain. And Gutekunst was on just yesterday from that meeting in Florida saying basically the same thing. And their actions past, present, and future say it's no fantasy. So you're going over to the dark side now and siding with the dumbasses, RG? They'll be proven dead wrong between now and the start of the season.

runMc, I must have missed it about restructuring Amos. They have Molsen on the P.S. who may be better than Crosby at this age and cheaper - or if they think Crosby is still good, they could restructure him for that $2 million or more. Lowry is not exactly a starter, borderline last year and probably down the ladder a bit with Reed coming in. Even if they only restructure him and you're correct that there isn't anybody else, that's rock bottom minimum of $11m plus the $15m now. Subtract the $10m and you still have $16m to use on FAs. That's plenty of you structure the contracts effectively, and Gutekunst et al are pretty good at that.

As for Adams, I just said they could have kept him, not that it was wise to do so. I'm thinking when all is said and done we will be better off because of the trade - 2, maybe 3 good WRs to replace him and MVS, either FAs or draft picks as well as some additional help at other positions in the draft from the acquired picks.

[jklowan]

Unless a big name wr drops in our lap I think we end up with a late round trade for Sterling Shepard and Devante Parker, then draft a couple. Both cheap vet options with little long term commitment.

[RashanGary]

I am on the dark side in siding with the people who think there is only so much you can do to stretch the salary cap this year. They have already done most of what can be done.

Another downside of those void year contracts is when you cut the player and they sign a deal with someone else, you do not get a compensatory pick back. It kind of snowballs with bad effects because dead cap space hits later too. So you pay for it twice.

I liked the old way of doing it where you were always getting extra picks in the compensatory draft pool and always had money to keep your core guys. Tt also used to do deals a year early and I liked that too because then the player was affordable on the whole contract.

[run pMc]

I think they're waiting for the asking price for some of these aging/hurt players on the market before making any offers.
I'm also wondering if there will be some post-draft cuts.

Would be expecting a lot from rookies to pick up the bulk of what Adams what producing. Rookie WRs usually take a little time to develop.

[KYPack]

Tex, you are getting obnoxious.

Do you call people dumb asses bc they don't agree with you?

The cap is the cap.

You bleat constantly on here that we are all stupid, yet you propose various moves to get under the cap.

Who is goofy? you or us.

You need to get with baby Tanky and start Tex and Tanks cap cooking shack and bait shop.

That way we can all ignore both your asses.

Since your evaluation of Dave Bahktieri, I don't take much of what you post seriously anyhow.

Rodgers don't need an OLine?

ARE YOU FUCKING SHITTING ME?

Both lines are the engine room of any sound football team.

[red]

Tex, you are getting obnoxious.

Do you call people dumb asses bc they don't agree with you?

The cap is the cap.

You bleat constantly on here that we are all stupid, yet you propose various moves to get under the cap.

Who is goofy? you or us.

You need to get with baby Tanky and start Tex and Tanks cap cooking shack and bait shop.

That way we can all ignore both your asses.

Since your evaluation of Dave Bahktieri, I don't take much of what you post seriously anyhow.

Rodgers don't need an OLine?

ARE YOU FUCKING SHITTING ME?

Both lines are the engine room of any sound football team.

you just come out from the rock you've been living under for almost 20 years?

[KYPack]

Red, I've been under that rock a lot longer than that.

[texaspackerbacker]

Tex, you are getting obnoxious.

Do you call people dumb asses bc they don't agree with you?

The cap is the cap.

You bleat constantly on here that we are all stupid, yet you propose various moves to get under the cap.

Who is goofy? you or us.

You need to get with baby Tanky and start Tex and Tanks cap cooking shack and bait shop.

That way we can all ignore both your asses.

Since your evaluation of Dave Bahktieri, I don't take much of what you post seriously anyhow.

Rodgers don't need an OLine?

ARE YOU FUCKING SHITTING ME?

Both lines are the engine room of any sound football team.

Sorry you see it that way hahahaha. Some of these fools, though, are in complete denial of the obvious, and they are that way in a negative way.

Anybody seeing the cap as a problem that can't be easily overcome in fact is a dumbass. I hope that ain't you. Some of them deserve the label because of consistent dumbassery over time. I don't recall you being that way, but you seem to be lumping yourself in with those "goofy" bastards. All that the Packers have done in recent history and are continuing to do supports what I say about the cap.

As for Bakhtiari and the importance of the O Line in general, I never said Rodgers "don't need an O Line". I did say (and I stand by it) that a smart mobile QB like him can get by with mediocrity in the O Line. Somebody like Brady and a lot of others can't. The running game is where the O Line makes more of a difference, and Bakhtiari hasn't impressed me much there. As I hope you know, the Packers do most of their successful running plays inside tackle. I don't see Bakhtiari as any more than mediocre on those outside zone or off tackle plays. That's pretty much supported by how the team did without him both passing and running. I'm glad he's back. I hope he's healthy and earns the big money they're paying him. And I hope he performs as good as some of ya'all think he is. But either way, whether he does or doesn't play that good, I expect the Packers will be about as good as they were without him last year.

Both lines huh? Our D Line hasn't exactly set the world on fire either, especially everybody other than Kenny Clark. But it's the rest of the D, where the Packers are strong - DBs, OLBs, and when we got a quality ILB - that makes the difference.

[Anti-Polar Bear]

https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nfl/jerry-jones-reveals-simple-reason-for-trading-amari-cooper/ar-AAVADXh?ocid=msedgdhp&pc=U531&cvid=ac33a6db7115490a90879ab9f2784bb0

Stupid Jerry Jones thinks the salary cap forced him to choose how to allocate money. Doesn't that moron know that he could have simply cooked the books and kept everyone?

Cooper’s 5 year $100M deal with Dallas included a puny $10M signing bonus. Jones coulda converted Cooper’s $20M base salary this year into signing bonus and add two bogus years to the contract. Cooper’s cap hit for 2022? $7M (2M prorated signing bonus from original contract + 4M prorated signing bonus from restructure + 1M minimum wage base salary).

A $7M cap hit ain’t gonna fuck the Cowfuckers into a cap hell. It sure as fuck ain’t gonna prevent the Cowfuckers from signing/re-signing all the bums they’ve signed/re-signed.

Jones, being the pig he is, simply deemed Cooper unworthy of $20M. Pig used the cap as an excuse to get rid of Cooper.

If the Packers had a pig owner, Cletidus Clark woulda been terminated already. The Packers will be paying Clark $15M this year in real cash. $15M for a Yokozuna who averaged 3 sacks a season. And if sacks don’t tell the whole picture, then check this out: Clark can’t hold Gilbert Browns’ jockstrap as a run defender. Yokozuna’s overrated…and overpaid.

[bobblehead]

LaFleur also said they had the ability to retain anybody they needed or wanted to retain.

You really pick and choose. He was basically saying we can keep anybody we want, but at a cost of guys we CHOOSE to let go....or at a cost of losing more guys in the future because we ate even MORE future cap.

[SudsMcBucky]

Cooper’s 5 year $100M deal with Dallas included a puny $10M signing bonus. Jones coulda converted Cooper’s $20M base salary this year into signing bonus and add two bogus years to the contract. Cooper’s cap hit for 2022? $7M (2M prorated signing bonus from original contract + 4M prorated signing bonus from restructure + 1M minimum wage base salary).

A $7M cap hit ain’t gonna fuck the Cowfuckers into a cap hell. It sure as fuck ain’t gonna prevent the Cowfuckers from signing/re-signing all the bums they’ve signed/re-signed.

Jones, being the pig he is, simply deemed Cooper unworthy of $20M. Pig used the cap as an excuse to get rid of Cooper.

If the Packers had a pig owner, Cletidus Clark woulda been terminated already. The Packers will be paying Clark $15M this year in real cash. $15M for a Yokozuna who averaged 3 sacks a season. And if sacks don’t tell the whole picture, then check this out: Clark can’t hold Gilbert Browns’ jockstrap as a run defender. Yokozuna’s overrated…and overpaid.

Just because someone doesn't deem a particular WR worthy of a $20M/year contract doesn't necessarily make him a pig. Maybe he's a smarter businessman than you. Now I'm mad at you for actually making me defend something Jerruh did.

[bobblehead]

Cooper’s 5 year $100M deal with Dallas included a puny $10M signing bonus. Jones coulda converted Cooper’s $20M base salary this year into signing bonus and add two bogus years to the contract. Cooper’s cap hit for 2022? $7M (2M prorated signing bonus from original contract + 4M prorated signing bonus from restructure + 1M minimum wage base salary).

A $7M cap hit ain’t gonna fuck the Cowfuckers into a cap hell. It sure as fuck ain’t gonna prevent the Cowfuckers from signing/re-signing all the bums they’ve signed/re-signed.

Jones, being the pig he is, simply deemed Cooper unworthy of $20M. Pig used the cap as an excuse to get rid of Cooper.

If the Packers had a pig owner, Cletidus Clark woulda been terminated already. The Packers will be paying Clark $15M this year in real cash. $15M for a Yokozuna who averaged 3 sacks a season. And if sacks don’t tell the whole picture, then check this out: Clark can’t hold Gilbert Browns’ jockstrap as a run defender. Yokozuna’s overrated…and overpaid.

I think the cowboys did that stuff already. That is why he is taking a dead cap hit for 22 million this year. He simply had to pay eventually (well, he is paying right now), and he decided that making it a dead cap hit of 40 million at some unspecified date would make his team uncompetitive.

[Anti-Polar Bear]

I think the cowboys did that stuff already. That is why he is taking a dead cap hit for 22 million this year. He simply had to pay eventually (well, he is paying right now), and he decided that making it a dead cap hit of 40 million at some unspecified date would make his team uncompetitive.

You thought wrong.

Cooper signed his latest Dallas deal in 2020. Played last season on a $22M cap charge. Who the fuck cooks the cap for a player whose salary is $20M in exchange for a $22M cap hit?

[Anti-Polar Bear]

Just because someone doesn't deem a particular WR worthy of a $20M/year contract doesn't necessarily make him a pig. Maybe he's a smarter businessman than you. Now I'm mad at you for actually making me defend something Jerruh did.

Hence, the salary cap.

You don’t see Jones or any other pig crying about the existence of the cap. Without a cap, the pigs would be bidding with each other for players. It would be like the old MLB where only the few teams with fat owners are competitive year in and year out. Sure, those teams win on the field. But at the cost of a fucked profit margin. Pigs seek to get fatter, not fucked.

The NFL salary cap gives the pigs an excuse to cut labor expenses. Jones has 22M in dead cap, so he says to Kroenke, “I see you only have a dead cap of $5M; your turn to spend frogskins on the playas, hombre. And you better spend. We pigs as a whole must spend 95% of the cap or the playas get free frogskins.”

[texaspackerbacker]

You really pick and choose. He was basically saying we can keep anybody we want, but at a cost of guys we CHOOSE to let go....or at a cost of losing more guys in the future because we ate even MORE future cap.

Oh, so you can read his mind hahahaha. He basically was telling fans and idiots of the media, r-e-l-a-x, the whole cap thing was overblown. Am I reading his mind now? Maybe, but his and Gutekunst's actions strongly say that it's the way I say it is, not the way the panicky fools in here and in the God damned media think it is.

APB, I guess you and I don't agree on everything. I have and mostly have always had a high opinion of Kenny Clark, although I sort of do tend to downgrade the importance of those "yokozumas" - especially on offense, but to some extent even on defense.

Regarding Jerry Jones, I usually have good things to say about him, but if the Amari Cooper thing was as you said - just $10 million bonus, that's a great example of how not to handle the cap. If you have enough confidence in a guy to offer him the $100m, then you ought to have confidence to pay him a lot bigger bonus. As I said though the last time Jones' name came up, the great majority of his wealth is the value of the team. Maybe he is a lot more cash-strapped than the Packers for example. If that's the case, though, he ought to be able to go to the bank and borrow for it.

[bobblehead]

You thought wrong.

Cooper signed his latest Dallas deal in 2020. Played last season on a $22M cap charge. Who the fuck cooks the cap for a player whose salary is $20M in exchange for a $22M cap hit?

I didn't mean specifically with Cooper. I meant in general. And the answer to your query is "a responsible person who is planning ahead".

[Anti-Polar Bear]

I didn't mean specifically with Cooper. I meant in general. And the answer to your query is "a responsible person who is planning ahead".

Then, after trading Cooper, Jones immediately handed Demarcus Lawrence a 3 year, $40M contract restructure that guarantees $30M. This contract is preceded by the 5 year, $105M ($65M guaranteed) deal Jones gave Lawrence in 2019. Not to mention, Jones cooked the cap in 2020 and turned $15M of Lawrence’s salary that season into signing bonus. Lawrence’s cap hit in 2023 will be $26M, with a dead cap of $35M if Jones decides to terminate ole D-Law.

I know the cap can always be cooked in 2023, but you’re telling me Lawrence’s numbers depict Jones as a “responsible person who is planing ahead?”

No shame in admitting that you’ve been debunked, hombre…see Onion thread in FYI for more.

[Joemailman]

Whitney Mercilus retires. Was hoping he might come back for one more shot.

[texaspackerbacker]

I read an article discussing a potential trade with the Steelers for Chase Claypool - not much said about what the Packers would give up. Two years left at low pay on Claypool's rookie contract. He was a 2nd round pick, and he's pretty good. I don't think it would be smart to give up a first rounder for him, though, a second rounder maybe.

[Upnorth]

I read an article discussing a potential trade with the Steelers for Chase Claypool - not much said about what the Packers would give up. Two years left at low pay on Claypool's rookie contract. He was a 2nd round pick, and he's pretty good. I don't think it would be smart to give up a first rounder for him, though, a second rounder maybe.

Don't see how the Steelers go for a lower 2nd than what they spent on a good #2 wr. They might go for a 2 and a 3 but even then thats stupid for them.imo. he is on rookie contract and this doesnt help there biggest need, qb.

[Fritz]

On a different topic, I saw the dumbest article in the world on ACME today. The headline was "ESPN Reporter: Trade Price for Seahawks WR DK Metcalf Is at Least Two First-round Picks." Hmmm. Sounds like the Seahawks front office is letting it be known that it's going to cost an awful lot. But as it turns out, the article was just a bunch of reporters speculating. ESPN called up reporters from about six teams, called up a reporter covering the Seahawks, and asked the reporters to come up with trade packages. The Jets' reporter came up with the best package, an equivalent to two first-round picks, and the Seahawks reporter said he didn't think even that would be enough so he wouldn't take it. So no, the Seahawks are not asking for two first rounders - a bunch of reporters sat around in a group jerk and came to that conclusion themselves, then reported it with a misleading headline.

This need to have new content 24/7 has really caused any journalistic standards to go right down the crapper.

[Joemailman]

On a different topic, I saw the dumbest article in the world on ACME today. The headline was "ESPN Reporter: Trade Price for Seahawks WR DK Metcalf Is at Least Two First-round Picks." Hmmm. Sounds like the Seahawks front office is letting it be known that it's going to cost an awful lot. But as it turns out, the article was just a bunch of reporters speculating. ESPN called up reporters from about six teams, called up a reporter covering the Seahawks, and asked the reporters to come up with trade packages. The Jets' reporter came up with the best package, an equivalent to two first-round picks, and the Seahawks reporter said he didn't think even that would be enough so he wouldn't take it. So no, the Seahawks are not asking for two first rounders - a bunch of reporters sat around in a group jerk and came to that conclusion themselves, then reported it with a misleading headline.

This need to have new content 24/7 has really caused any journalistic standards to go right down the crapper.

The guy who wrote that article, Justis Mosqueda, is mainly known for making smart-ass comments on Twitter. He is best left ignored. Aaron Nagler and Andy Herman on Cheesehead TV are much better.

[run pMc]

The guy who wrote that article, Justis Mosqueda, is mainly known for making smart-ass comments on Twitter. He is best left ignored. Aaron Nagler and Andy Herman on Cheesehead TV are much better.

It was an ESPN story.
Some of the beat reporters are pretty good, some are shockingly awful. I think Silverstein is decent for the JSO.

I don't want to trade for Metcalf. He's in a contract year - they'd be trading away what they got for Adams to sign him to what Adams did, and Adams is a better receiver.
Metcalf is a good player, but he's maybe a Top 10 receiver with a good QB throwing to him. Adams was a Top 2 (and possibly the top) WR... that's a losing proposition.

They're better off keeping their cap from completely shattering and keeping the draft picks. Young talent that's under long, cheap contracts is incredibly valuable when you have a $50M QB on the payroll.

[HarveyWallbangers]

It was an ESPN story.
Some of the beat reporters are pretty good, some are shockingly awful. I think Silverstein is decent for the JSO.

I don't want to trade for Metcalf. He's in a contract year - they'd be trading away what they got for Adams to sign him to what Adams did, and Adams is a better receiver.
Metcalf is a good player, but he's maybe a Top 10 receiver with a good QB throwing to him. Adams was a Top 2 (and possibly the top) WR... that's a losing proposition.

They're better off keeping their cap from completely shattering and keeping the draft picks. Young talent that's under long, cheap contracts is incredibly valuable when you have a $50M QB on the payroll.

I agree with everything here.

[texaspackerbacker]

You get Metcalf or some other established WR, and you pretty much get a known quantity. You draft somebody, and you get an unknown. It seems to me that WRs are more likely than a lot of positions to be feast or famine, kinda unpredictable because the college game doesn't necessarily translate to the pro game. Maybe it does a little more with all the talent in the SEC - a point in favor of Burks, maybe.

I doubt we can snag Metcalf, but I'd be very much in favor of giving up the two picks we got for Davante to get him, maybe even two #1s. Of course, if you do that, you need to have a long term deal in place with him before committing to the trade. I also would give as much as a second rounder to get Claypool, although I think we maybe could get him for less. It's known what he can do, which you can't say for most draft picks.

A draft day deal wouldn't surprise me, but it's looking more and more like the Packers aren't gonna do a trade or go after one of the remaining FAs until after they try their luck in the draft. If that's the case, my choice (apparently along with a lot of others in here) would be Burks. To me, he is the most like Davante Adams of the bunch. I never liked Anquan Bolden, and it scares me when he's compared to him. Deebo might be a better comparison. Then, I'd like to see the Packers grab Kevin Austin, who would likely be an upgrade from MVS. Fourth round for him would be great, third round would be tolerable.

[red]

You get Metcalf or some other established WR, and you pretty much get a known quantity. You draft somebody, and you get an unknown. It seems to me that WRs are more likely than a lot of positions to be feast or famine, kinda unpredictable because the college game doesn't necessarily translate to the pro game. Maybe it does a little more with all the talent in the SEC - a point in favor of Burks, maybe.

I doubt we can snag Metcalf, but I'd be very much in favor of giving up the two picks we got for Davante to get him, maybe even two #1s. Of course, if you do that, you need to have a long term deal in place with him before committing to the trade. I also would give as much as a second rounder to get Claypool, although I think we maybe could get him for less. It's known what he can do, which you can't say for most draft picks.

A draft day deal wouldn't surprise me, but it's looking more and more like the Packers aren't gonna do a trade or go after one of the remaining FAs until after they try their luck in the draft. If that's the case, my choice (apparently along with a lot of others in here) would be Burks. To me, he is the most like Davante Adams of the bunch. I never liked Anquan Bolden, and it scares me when he's compared to him. Deebo might be a better comparison. Then, I'd like to see the Packers grab Kevin Austin, who would likely be an upgrade from MVS. Fourth round for him would be great, third round would be tolerable.

we can't get metcalf now, we don't have any money to give him a new deal, and no way is he gonna allow to be traded anywhere without a new deal

we have the picks to pull off the trade, but we no longer have the cap to do it

[Bretsky]

You get Metcalf or some other established WR, and you pretty much get a known quantity. You draft somebody, and you get an unknown. It seems to me that WRs are more likely than a lot of positions to be feast or famine, kinda unpredictable because the college game doesn't necessarily translate to the pro game. Maybe it does a little more with all the talent in the SEC - a point in favor of Burks, maybe.

I doubt we can snag Metcalf, but I'd be very much in favor of giving up the two picks we got for Davante to get him, maybe even two #1s. Of course, if you do that, you need to have a long term deal in place with him before committing to the trade. I also would give as much as a second rounder to get Claypool, although I think we maybe could get him for less. It's known what he can do, which you can't say for most draft picks.

.



NO NO and NO to Metcalf and your idea. We just traded the 2nd best WR and an incredibly huge financial commitment for 1st and 2nd round draft pick. So why would we turn around and trade that, or a bit more, for a top 10ish WR who we'll most likely have to pay 25-30MILish per year. By that logic, either we got screwed in the Adams deal, or we're getting screwed on this one value wise.

I would embrace getting Claypool for a 3rd round draft pick. Hell in round 3 at this point I'll take anything that can play :)) I'd love to trade for the Texan WR as well. But if I'm trading for a WR,it's not for a guy with an expiring contract.

And I'd still embrace Jarvis Landry, Will Fuller, or Julio Jones (not in that order). BUT those guys are not signed for a reason. IMO they want too much money and certainly well more than any GM wants to pay. The $$$ for WR's has been blowing up lately and not in a good way. I say, Stop the Insanity !!!!!!!!!!!

We have to sign Alexander and Jenkins among others next year. Can't break the bank on a WR unless we are at peace with losing others

[Bretsky]

We have possibly the GOAT and the best QB in the NFL; we need to draft two high WR's and let AROD work with them, develop a chemistry, and be great together.
Still need to sign one vet most likely because the talent we have is pretty shitty but youth on 5yr deals w/o busting the cap is the solution here

[texaspackerbacker]

Metcalf is as good or damn close to as good as Adams and a lot younger. And this shit about not enough money with the cap situation just doesn't fly. A new contract with him would have a nice low cap number. We have $15 million on the cap now, $7 or 8 million even counting what will go for draft picks, and we still will be extending Jaire giving us a lot more cap space along with various other things that can be done if needed.

We'll have a winning team with Rodgers any of the many ways we could go, but I still think getting Metcalf or some other top level guy like A.J. Brown or Deebo or Claypool would be better than just leaving it all up to the draft.

[Bretsky]

Metcalf is as good or damn close to as good as Adams and a lot younger. And this shit about not enough money with the cap situation just doesn't fly. A new contract with him would have a nice low cap number. We have $15 million on the cap now, $7 or 8 million even counting what will go for draft picks, and we still will be extending Jaire giving us a lot more cap space along with various other things that can be done if needed.

We'll have a winning team with Rodgers any of the many ways we could go, but I still think getting Metcalf or some other top level guy like A.J. Brown or Deebo or Claypool would be better than just leaving it all up to the draft.



Devante is way way better than Metcalf. Metcalf has the measurables and is faster but that's it. I'd also question his ability to be a good teammate when things are not going well (if that matters). Devante is an elite route runner; Metcalf doesn't have that type of ability. He's a nice home run hitter and he's young and tall and fast. And I'd take him for twenty MIL a year but not much more cause I have character concerns and we've did pretty well avoiding dreama queen WR's lately.. I just don't think he's close to Devante Adams

[run pMc]

I agree with Bretsky. It's foolish to trade high picks for a player that is due for a big extension -- you're giving away picks AND chewing up your cap.
If they DO go that route, I would prefer Terry McLaurin to Metcalf anyway. I think he'd fit the GB offense better and probably fit the locker room better... while likely costing (somewhat) less. It would still be a bad idea.

Their cap situation has made it very difficult to acquire or sign a WR to an expensive contract. Not impossible, but pretty dang difficult if you want to sign your draft picks and keep some space for mid-season emergencies.

Also, Davante > Metcalf even if you consider the age. The idea of trading for and giving Metcalf $25M a year isn't a comforting one: I'm not convinced he's a top 5 WR for one thing, and I'd be worried about how he'd handle himself after getting paid.

They are going to have to get some cheap talent (draft picks) who are signed past next season (Lazard and Cobb are on 1-years) AND who can play some ST. Cap space, succession planning, roster construction, and Coach Bisaccia are going to be considerations too.

[texaspackerbacker]

That's probably the way it will work out - just hoping to get lucky with draft picks. I'd prefer to go with somebody proven in the league (yeah, McLaurin fits that description too), but I doubt it happens. I do think Metcalf at age 24 will be better over the next few years than Adams not playing with Rodgers, though. Bottom line is, Rodgers will make whoever we have at WR better, and the team will be a winner even if we had to just go with what we have now, which of course won't happen.

[SudsMcBucky]

WR's that get paid QB level money is a bad recipe for ANY team. I'm glad we didn't pay Devante what he got and I certainly don't want to pay any other WR that much money. It can be better utilized elsewhere.

[Upnorth]

If we pick up a couple ok looking wr in the draft I thunk a good fa adfition would be tyrann Mathieu. I think he will be cheap after draft and has a few goid years left. Get a 4 yr contract and upgrade our secondary. I remember him as an asset in the run game and a sure tackling saftey.

Thoughts?

[Bretsky]

If we pick up a couple ok looking wr in the draft I thunk a good fa adfition would be tyrann Mathieu. I think he will be cheap after draft and has a few goid years left. Get a 4 yr contract and upgrade our secondary. I remember him as an asset in the run game and a sure tackling saftey.

Thoughts?



LOVE THE THOUGHT; and I think he's a well respected leader as well. Just not sure how cheap he'd be. What do you think he goes for ? 5 to 7 mil/year or less ?

But he'd bring some things we don't have

[Upnorth]

I think a 4 yr 36 mil contract would work. He is good for at least 2 more solid years.
Or if he baulks at that 3 yr 30 mil.
In the 4 yr try to have a 1st yr cap hit of 5 mil
In the 3 yr have 1st year of 7.

[RashanGary]

https://twitter.com/pff/status/1513502224361693187?s=21&t=tUGF0fxCkVrsBtmAvQAi8Q

Highest graded defenders under 25 years old. Rashan Gary! Nice!

[Joemailman]

Packers hosting Sammy Watkins on a visit. He did not catch a lot of balls last year, but he did average 14.6 YPR. He is often injured. Gute tried to sign him as a free agent in 2018. He was the 1st wide receiver drafted in the great 2014 wide receiver class that included Mike Evans, OBJ, Brandin Cooks, Davante Adams, Allen Robinson, Jarvis Landry, Jared Abbrederis and Jeff Janis.

[Upnorth]

Packers hosting Sammy Watkins on a visit. He did not catch a lot of balls last year, but he did average 14.6 YPR. He is often injured. Gute tried to sign him as a free agent in 2018. He was the 1st wide receiver drafted in the great 2014 wide receiver class that included Mike Evans, OBJ, Brandin Cooks, Davante Adams, Allen Robinson, Jarvis Landry, Jared Abbrederis and Jeff Janis.

Good list but you definitely saved the best for last.

Seriously thoigh a cheap cooks or Watkins would be nice to see pre draft, I just doubt it does.
If we did though I could see it improving wr talent at our draft pic. Other teams might not feel pushed to get a wr as much early if another wr hungry team is reduced in urgency.

[SudsMcBucky]

Green and Gold agree to deal with Sammy.

https://twitter.com/AdamSchefter/status/1514668100221874185

[Teamcheez1]

Anyone know the rules for signing USFL players? I’m guessing the Packers will be looking for some players for training camp.

[bobblehead]

Anyone know the rules for signing USFL players? I’m guessing the Packers will be looking for some players for training camp.

https://twitter.com/fcflio/status/1515492452328779778

Here ya go....Bring him in!!!!

[Teamcheez1]

Colin Cowherd is reporting that Tom Silverstein is saying Packers are taking calls on Jordan Love.

[bobblehead]

Colin Cowherd is reporting that Tom Silverstein is saying Packers are taking calls on Jordan Love.

Is this like the scene from Ferris Buehler?

[RashanGary]

Colin Cowherd is reporting that Tom Silverstein is saying Packers are taking calls on Jordan Love.

Id be ecstatic if we got a late 2 or early 3.

[run pMc]

Colin Cowherd is reporting that Tom Silverstein is saying Packers are taking calls on Jordan Love.

Really? I didn't see anything about it on Spoon's twitter feed, and you'd think JSO would have mentioned it by now.

I'll believe it when I see it, although Love compares well to this year's prospects so you never know.

[texaspackerbacker]

DeSean Jackson is out there waiting to be signed. He'd be worth a try for not much over the veterans minimum. Sprinter speed usually doesn't diminish much with age. I bet he's still sub 4.4 at age 35. Him, Watkins, and a young guy in the draft like Christian Watson would be pretty good IMO.

[Fritz]

Id be ecstatic if we got a late 2 or early 3.

I don't think I'm ready to see him traded. I'd like to keep him this year and see how he looks This is year three - and really, if you Loved him, you could conceivably have Rodgers go this year and next, then extend Love and go. Or pick up that fifth year option and see what he does, just roll the dice.

[texaspackerbacker]

Trading Love sooner rather than later should bring more in return, as the other team would have control of him longer. Of course, he could show great improvement - here or elsewhere, but somehow I doubt that.

It's too bad the NFL doesn't have something like minor league baseball or developmental league basketball. If he stays with the Packers, Love will be old and stale by the time Aaron Rodgers finally hangs it up.

[jklowan]

So apparently Toney is on the trading block, I know a bunch of you wanted him, can a 3rd get it done and would you?

[Joemailman]

So apparently Toney is on the trading block, I know a bunch of you wanted him, can a 3rd get it done and would you?

This article sheds some light on why Giants are looking to move him. I think I'll pass.

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/kadarius-toney-rumors-giants-shopping-former-first-round-pick-wide-receiver-per-report/

The Giants are looking to trade wide receiver Kadarius Toney, according to the New York Daily News. New York is reportedly making calls to see what it can get in return for the young wideout ahead of the draft. Toney hasn't shown up to voluntary minicamp, which wouldn't seem like that much of an issue had his rookie campaign not been dramatic.

Toney seemingly referenced the report in an Instagram post. Against a black background, Toney wrote, "You gone hurt yo own damn feelings tryna hurt mine, idgaf about nothing."

The No. 20 overall pick out of Florida played in 10 games last season, catching 39 passes for 420 yards. He had an incredible outing against the Dallas Cowboys in Week 5, when he caught 10 passes for 189 yards, but even his highlight of the year came with drama, as he was ejected that afternoon for throwing a punch.

Toney missed time in 2021 due to multiple injuries, was placed on the reserve/COVID-19 list twice and was subject to the wrong kind of headlines in the preseason. Last summer, Toney reportedly did not finish either of the Giants' two rookie minicamp practices due to a cleat issue and an injury. He then missed voluntary workouts because he had not signed his rookie contract, which was unusual. As Dan Duggan of The Athletic reported, this was different since rookies sign waivers that protect them in case of injury during offseason programs.

The New York Daily News reported that Toney's commitment came into question behind the scenes in 2021 due to "lack of playbook study" and "poor meeting behavior." It also didn't help that he missed so much time from preseason to the end of the year due to multiple issues.

It remains to be seen if the Giants are set on moving on from Toney, but they are reportedly exploring what they could potentially get in return for him.

[Bretsky]

So apparently Toney is on the trading block, I know a bunch of you wanted him, can a 3rd get it done and would you?

I would take him for a 3rd in a second but not more. Even a better idea. Trade Jordan love for him :)). Now if his attitude sucks then pass

[Joemailman]

I would take him for a 3rd in a second but not more. Even a better idea. Trade Jordan love for him :)). Now if his attitude sucks then pass

If his attitude didn't suck, I don't think they'd be looking to trade him. He's a talented guy.

[run pMc]

I heard at UF he didn't know his routes and a lot of stuff was guesswork or ad-libbed. That's probably an exaggeration some scout threw out there pre-draft last year, but if he's not showing commitment (or ability) to learn a college offense I think Rodgers would eat him alive for not knowing his routes on Hinkle Field.

He's talented as hell and would be a great fit in the offense, but it sure seems like he has a major issue between the ears. Unless you could get him to commit to a career reboot and "learning his cradt" I wouldn't trade anything for him. Without that, he'll probably be waived, bounce around a few teams, and vanish. Dude's already got money, if he's a head case or doesn't "love the game" he's not gonna work.

[run pMc]

DeSean Jackson is out there waiting to be signed. He'd be worth a try for not much over the veterans minimum. Sprinter speed usually doesn't diminish much with age. I bet he's still sub 4.4 at age 35. Him, Watkins, and a young guy in the draft like Christian Watson would be pretty good IMO.

Well you definitely get slower as you age, even sprinters. ;) That said, I wouldn't be against bringing in Jackson AFTER the draft -- there's not much point in doing it now. He's kind of a head-case, he's old, and I'd bet his asking price is still likely higher than his value so he'll still be out there, and Gute will have a better idea of his roster then. Might as well see how the board falls before bringing another rental.

Personally I'd prefer Julio over Desean, but the money:value thing probably isn't there yet. Wait it out.

[Fritz]

This article sheds some light on why Giants are looking to move him. I think I'll pass.

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/kadarius-toney-rumors-giants-shopping-former-first-round-pick-wide-receiver-per-report/

The Giants are looking to trade wide receiver Kadarius Toney, according to the New York Daily News. New York is reportedly making calls to see what it can get in return for the young wideout ahead of the draft. Toney hasn't shown up to voluntary minicamp, which wouldn't seem like that much of an issue had his rookie campaign not been dramatic.

Toney seemingly referenced the report in an Instagram post. Against a black background, Toney wrote, "You gone hurt yo own damn feelings tryna hurt mine, idgaf about nothing."

The No. 20 overall pick out of Florida played in 10 games last season, catching 39 passes for 420 yards. He had an incredible outing against the Dallas Cowboys in Week 5, when he caught 10 passes for 189 yards, but even his highlight of the year came with drama, as he was ejected that afternoon for throwing a punch.

Toney missed time in 2021 due to multiple injuries, was placed on the reserve/COVID-19 list twice and was subject to the wrong kind of headlines in the preseason. Last summer, Toney reportedly did not finish either of the Giants' two rookie minicamp practices due to a cleat issue and an injury. He then missed voluntary workouts because he had not signed his rookie contract, which was unusual. As Dan Duggan of The Athletic reported, this was different since rookies sign waivers that protect them in case of injury during offseason programs.

The New York Daily News reported that Toney's commitment came into question behind the scenes in 2021 due to "lack of playbook study" and "poor meeting behavior." It also didn't help that he missed so much time from preseason to the end of the year due to multiple issues.

It remains to be seen if the Giants are set on moving on from Toney, but they are reportedly exploring what they could potentially get in return for him.



Man, if you're the Gints, this was a big fug-up. You were arrogant enough to think you'd straighten him right out, that you could "manage" him.

A big "I'll pass" on that guy. Yuck.

[Upnorth]

Man, if you're the Gints, this was a big fug-up. You were arrogant enough to think you'd straighten him right out, that you could "manage" him.

A big "I'll pass" on that guy. Yuck.

I am willing to be a broken record and say if we can get him for a Watkins deal go for it. 0 risk to us, no cost to cap unless he turns into something.
I really think Lazard and Watkins (two tough blocking wr) could sort him out

[Joemailman]

Packers reported to be interested in trading for Darren Waller. Would be for 2nd round pick. Report is original Adams trade would have been Adams for Waller and 1st round pick. However, NFL wouldn't allow trade because Waller hadn't signed his franchise tag tender.

[red]

Packers reported to be interested in trading for Darren Waller. Would be for 2nd round pick. Report is original Adams trade would have been Adams for Waller and 1st round pick. However, NFL wouldn't allow trade because Waller hadn't signed his franchise tag tender.

i like it

instead of taking flyer on an unknown TE in the second, spend that pick on a proven commodity

he's be expensive though

guys kinda old though, already 29

[Upnorth]

Why did he crater last year. Worst catch percentage, lower ypc.

[Anti-Polar Bear]

Packers reported to be interested in trading for Darren Waller. Would be for 2nd round pick. Report is original Adams trade would have been Adams for Waller and 1st round pick. However, NFL wouldn't allow trade because Waller hadn't signed his franchise tag tender.

It was actually Adams - not Waller - who refused his franchise tender. Guess it was Adams’ way of saying “fuck you” to the Packers on his way out. However, ain’t nothing stopping the Packers from returning the fuck you by trading the 2 in the Adams trade back to LV for Waller, except maybe LV changing it’s mind.

Guess Mad’s boi, Adams, is looking forward to doping it up in Vegas with ole Waller. Ok, I keed. Looks like Waller has succeeded in defeating his demons. Waller would definitely look good in the Green and Musta Yella in real life…and on Madden.

[Anti-Polar Bear]

i like it

instead of taking flyer on an unknown TE in the second, spend that pick on a proven commodity

he's be expensive though

guys kinda old though, already 29

6.8 M cap hit this year. 7 next year. Not cheap but pretty cap friendly to me.

TEs balling into their late 30’s is not an unfamiliar sight. Gonzalez did it. Cook is doing it. Get it done!

[jklowan]

I'm a hard pass on Waller, I'll take my chances with the draft and post draft/june cut downs

[texaspackerbacker]

It was actually Adams - not Waller - who refused his franchise tender. Guess it was Adams’ way of saying “fuck you” to the Packers on his way out. However, ain’t nothing stopping the Packers from returning the fuck you by trading the 2 in the Adams trade back to LV for Waller, except maybe LV changing it’s mind.

Guess Mad’s boi, Adams, is looking forward to doping it up in Vegas with ole Waller. Ok, I keed. Looks like Waller has succeeded in defeating his demons. Waller would definitely look good in the Green and Musta Yella in real life…and on Madden.

True about it being Adams instead of Waller. I doubt it about the "fuck you" on the way out though. If Adams had signed that and the trade somehow got cancelled, I assume he would have been stuck with a deal he didn't want. If this is the way the Adams deal went down, and the prospective deal now is a way of getting around that rule, it begs the question, why didn't they just do the same deal - Waller for that second rounder going back - the following day after the Adams deal?

I'm not worried about the cap hit, as a moderate extension should be able to bring Waller's cap hit down to not much over half what it is currently. I'm also not to worried about him having a bad year - supposedly due to injuries and Covid X 2 last season. The idea of having an established TE instead of a pig in a poke they could draft is good to me. TEs it seems are even less sure of success as pros than WRs coming into the league. What bothers me a little bit is that we were already solid at TE, and what we need is WRs, but I guess one less second rounder or lower if they can negotiate it still leaves us plenty to shore up the WR group.

[RashanGary]

Tex, why on earth would we trade the best receiver in the league for two crapshoot picks that have almost no chance of being as goood as Adams if money wasnt a factor? Are the Packers just stupid? Or does the cap actually have an affect on teams?

[texaspackerbacker]

As I understand it, because Adams damn near demanded it or at least wouldn't play with the franchise tag and balked at a cap friendly extension. And is he the best receiver in the league? I guess we will see over the next few years if he thrives without Rodgers. I lean toward a no on that. As for the "two crapshoot picks", I was moderately pleased with the deal, all things considered, and I think the Packers will end up better off for it both this year and more so beyond.

[run pMc]

First, no way are they better without Adams. Dude was arguably the best WR last year.
You are right that they may be better down the road without him though.

More than anything Adams told GB he wanted to play for the Raiders. It was 'his team' growing up, one of his best friends and college buddies is QB there, he has family out there and is building a house out there. It was more of a 'didn't want to risk his body on a one-year deal' thing and would rather play there than a FU to GB or anything else. GB tried to match the LV 's contract but he still chose LV.

Back to the long term: it helps the cap and the team in certain ways: it allowed them to bring back Campbell and Rasul, and getting more picks means they can bring in some younger WR Day 1/2 talent that they desperately need.

As for Waller, I hear he wants a new contract, which is why he's on the trading block. All the guaranteed money is his contract is paid up, so he's easy to trade, and he sees other TEs getting paid and wants in. I suppose you can't blame him, but it does make you wonder if he's going to be a malcontent or not, what he'd be willing to sign for, and how much he has left at 29 going on 30. If you can talk him into playing this year on his contract and then talking an extension next offseason, then you might get somewhere. He's a pretty darn good TE and would instantly improve their receiving group, albeit from the TE room. The other part is, GB may be incentivized to extend or give him some guaranteed money to reduce the cap hit from taking on his modest contract. I could see them extending him a year and turning a chunk of his salary this year into a bonus.

Days before the draft, and all the rumors are in full bloom.

[RashanGary]

The Packers didnt have to trade Adams. They chose too. The narrative that he chose LV is wrong. The Packers CHOSE to trade him to LV.

[texaspackerbacker]

No, RG, you are confusing the facts. As I said, as runpMc also described, Adams virtually demanded the trade, and based on his own words, not out of hate for the Packers, but because he wanted to play for the Raiders. His contract was up; He refused to play under the franchise tag; He held all the cards and refused the Packers' best offer. Not trading him would have probably meant having him sit out the season and going eventually going elsewhere with the Packers getting nothing.

[Bretsky]

The Packers didnt have to trade Adams. They chose too. The narrative that he chose LV is wrong. The Packers CHOSE to trade him to LV.


HONESTLY THIS REALLY DESERVES IT"S OWN THREAD

What really happened with the Devante Adams situation ?

Wilde and Tauscher have discussed this in detail and they've chatted with other Packer Beat writers about it as well. They wish Devante would come out and tell his side of the story and give us the why's of how things shook out how they did.

What changed ? A year ago Devante Adams wanted an extenstion from the Green Bay Packers.

There was a fallout somewhere. Somewhere.

Wilde noted he's sad about the departure for many reasons. He went into detail on who his guys have been over the years. The guys who are the nicest and open and honest to give him the truth about the goings on with the Packers.

He credited Tauscher, Davante Adams, and the early years of Aaron Rodgers as his guys. Also noted Preston Smith is outstanding as well. He's sad Devante is not around anymore to be his guy and noted it's kind of awkward now because the questions he wants to ask Devante (who still texts him back) are not comfortable ones.

I admire guys like Wilde and Tausch, who want to know the truth.

[Bretsky]

No, RG, you are confusing the facts. As I said, as runpMc also described, Adams virtually demanded the trade, and based on his own words, not out of hate for the Packers, but because he wanted to play for the Raiders. His contract was up; He refused to play under the franchise tag; He held all the cards and refused the Packers' best offer. Not trading him would have probably meant having him sit out the season and going eventually going elsewhere with the Packers getting nothing.



The relationship between GB and Adams was not positive and thus he wanted out IMO. GB just granted his wish. They chose to trade him instead of going through another uncomfortable power struggle with a star player who was not longer happy to be a Packer

[HarveyWallbangers]

HONESTLY THIS REALLY DESERVES IT"S OWN THREAD

What really happened with the Devante Adams situation ?

Wilde and Tauscher have discussed this in detail and they've chatted with other Packer Beat writers about it as well. They wish Devante would come out and tell his side of the story and give us the why's of how things shook out how they did.

What changed ? A year ago Devante Adams wanted an extenstion from the Green Bay Packers.

There was a fallout somewhere. Somewhere.

Wilde noted he's sad about the departure for many reasons. He went into detail on who his guys have been over the years. The guys who are the nicest and open and honest to give him the truth about the goings on with the Packers.

He credited Tauscher, Davante Adams, and the early years of Aaron Rodgers as his guys. Also noted Preston Smith is outstanding as well. He's sad Devante is not around anymore to be his guy and noted it's kind of awkward now because the questions he wants to ask Devante (who still texts him back) are not comfortable ones.

I admire guys like Wilde and Tausch, who want to know the truth.

You worship beat writers and other people's opinions too much. :)

And it's Davante.

[Joemailman]

How Packers were built:

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FRTTHyzXIAE5WeA?format=jpg&name=4096x4096

[texaspackerbacker]

A lot of names I didn't know we have/never heard of there.

[run pMc]

Wow - just saw Jaire is the only one left from 2018. Others either signed elsewhere (MVS, ESB, Burks) or didn't pan out (Jackson, Moore, Scott etc.)

[Bretsky]

You worship beat writers and other people's opinions too much. :)

And it's Davante.

I wish I had the ability to close my eyes to the truth but I always want the why

[Joemailman]

Rob Demovsky is reporting Packers will pick up 5th year option on Darnell Savage. I wonder if that decision was contingent on who Packers drafted in Round 1.

[Fritz]

The timing is interesting.