2022 Second Round Pick, #34, Christian Watson Discussion Thread

[George Cumby]

The Wide many wanted?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fJOzX3Zq-Mg

6' 5" 211#

Combine:

40: 4.36
Vertical: 38.5
Broad: 136"

Pro-day:

Bench: 18
Shuttle: 4.19
3-Cone: 6.96

[Joemailman]

https://i0.wp.com/ras.football/wp-content/uploads/2020/01/javon-walker-ras-6056.png?resize=806%2C522&ssl=1
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FOiLyRtXMAcGt-E?format=png&name=small

[Upnorth]

Wow.

[George Cumby]

Thanks, Joe.

Welp.

This is the burner specimen who can take the top off of defenses that I wanted.

[King Friday]

This kid will be highly dangerous in an offense helmed by Rodgers.

[red]

well, i wanted him at #22, so i guess we should be happy

i think i would have rather taken him at #28 if we wanted him that bad and keep both seconds though

[texaspackerbacker]

ALL RIGHT! This is the pick I and probably a lot of others wanted. Now we need to have him produce. I think with Rodgers at QB, we can count on that. Adams and MVS gone, Watkins and Watson added? I'll take that as a net positive in the short term and a probable large positive in the longer term ........ and we got the additional first rounder besides. Good Job, Gutekunst.

[George Cumby]

Tex, I hope you are right.

That may be the first time I have ever typed those words in that combination.

[red]

watch the end around and imagine that being added to our offence


https://youtu.be/OONTzaccY2g

[red]

it sure seems like you can just throw the ball as high and as far as you can, and he'll just go get it


https://youtu.be/lXxyhSib_VU

[George Cumby]

He's returned two kicks for TD's.

Can we see him being used on 'Teams?

[Bretsky]

ALL RIGHT! This is the pick I and probably a lot of others wanted. Now we need to have him produce. I think with Rodgers at QB, we can count on that. Adams and MVS gone, Watkins and Watson added? I'll take that as a net positive in the short term and a probable large positive in the longer term ........ and we got the additional first rounder besides. Good Job, Gutekunst.



COME ON MAN; you can't count these two as a positive over the best WR in the NFL

yes, it may work out fine; but nobody in the universe would take Watson and Watkins over Devante Adams and MVS

[Bretsky]

He's returned two kicks for TD's.

Can we see him being used on 'Teams?


Given our talent at WR I don't think we can afford to use him on ST and risk the injury. It's nice that we got a big with great speed though.

[Joemailman]

Given our talent at WR I don't think we can afford to use him on ST and risk the injury. It's nice that we got a big with great speed though.

I'll bet they use him as a gunner.

[texaspackerbacker]

COME ON MAN; you can't count these two as a positive over the best WR in the NFL

yes, it may work out fine; but nobody in the universe would take Watson and Watkins over Devante Adams and MVS

I absolutely do think he will have at least as good a career as Adams. With Rodgers at QB, I could see him being as productive even early as Chase and Jefferson. And of course, he'll be excellent when Adams is just a distant memory. Is Adams even the NFL best WR now? I guess we'll find out the next couple years with the Raiders. I'm betting he's not.

I hope that's sarcasm about being a gunner. I could see him returning kicks, though.

[King Friday]

it sure seems like you can just throw the ball as high and as far as you can, and he'll just go get it


https://youtu.be/lXxyhSib_VU

And the difference in talent between the NDSU QB and Rodgers will make this kids head explode. This has the potential to be a hell of a pick and continue GB's second round WR streak.

[King Friday]

Dp

[Joemailman]

I absolutely do think he will have at least as good a career as Adams. With Rodgers at QB, I could see him being as productive even early as Chase and Jefferson. And of course, he'll be excellent when Adams is just a distant memory. Is Adams even the NFL best WR now? I guess we'll find out the next couple years with the Raiders. I'm betting he's not.

I hope that's sarcasm about being a gunner. I could see him returning kicks, though.

Not sarcasm at all. He's got the perfect size/speed combo you need in a gunner. After last year, you still think ST don't matter?

[HarveyWallbangers]

Gotta post this here


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TmDRs1LbrlU

[Joemailman]

Gotta post this here



You gonna be paying out for a Watson jersey for your daughter?

[Vincenzo]

We lost a pick moving up 19 spots.
“ "Green Bay opened the day with two second round selections – the No. 53 and No. 59 picks. The Packers traded both to the Minnesota Vikings for the right to take Watson at No. 34.

No wonder the Vikings took the trade. If Watson doesn’t pan out, Gute is gonna look like a dope.

[HarveyWallbangers]

You gonna be paying out for a Watson jersey for your daughter?

No doubt about that one. She said if Watson got drafted by the Packers, he would be her favorite player. But not if he went elsewhere. :) She'd still like him, but Aaron Jones or Jaire would still be her favorite.

[HarveyWallbangers]

We lost a pick moving up 19 spots.
“ "Green Bay opened the day with two second round selections – the No. 53 and No. 59 picks. The Packers traded both to the Minnesota Vikings for the right to take Watson at No. 34.

No wonder the Vikings took the trade. If Watson doesn’t pan out, Gute is gonna look like a dope.

I'd like to think Gute will look like a genius. Hopefully, he turns into a game wrecker like a Tyreek Hill.

[HarveyWallbangers]

Gute seemed pretty happy about this one in his press conference.

[HarveyWallbangers]

Highest wonderlic :)


Pete Thamel
@PeteThamel

Christian Watson was 5-9, 155 pounds when he played for Robert Weiner as a junior at Tampa Plant. He was the No. 536 player *in the state of Florida.* Credit NSDU for the eval and Watson for the commitment to development. Also had the highest WR Wonderlic.

[Anti-Polar Bear]

Poor man’s Miles Austin who couldn’t even make the Wisconsin-Stevens Point 103 men roster. And don’t even bother to get me startled with Watson’s dysfunctional hybridization, Tex.

Shoulda gone with Ty Thornton and his glorious 4.28 40.

[HarveyWallbangers]

Nice!

https://mobile.twitter.com/PMPPod/status/1520193943195037697

[Anti-Polar Bear]

And the difference in talent between the NDSU QB and Rodgers will make this kids head explode. This has the potential to be a hell of a pick and continue GB's second round WR streak.

I hope the future is as optimistic as you see it. But there

[Anti-Polar Bear]

And the difference in talent between the NDSU QB and Rodgers will make this kids head explode. This has the potential to be a hell of a pick and continue GB's second round WR streak.

I hope the future is as optimistic as you see it. But there’s also a material difference in talent between hip-hop NFL corners and, for the lack of better words, the pale-skinned corners Watson annihilated in D3.

I notice that Hoody Genius traded up for Ty Thornton. Dude’s gonna be a thorn to cover. 4.28 40!

[Anti-Polar Bear]

Revision: Ty Thornton is a poor man’s Randy Moss.

[Jaire]

Highest wonderlic :)

Yeah. When you listen to him, he's clearly a bright kid.

[Jaire]

I'm not worried about this kid at lesast being a very solid starter, possibly star.

GB prides itself on its drafting of number one receivers. They haven't missed on a round one or two in a very long time.

He will be able to contribute right away on special teams, sweeps, and screens. He seems very determined, hard working, and is also smart. A good kid too: He checks every box as a "Packer" receiver.

[King Friday]

We lost a pick moving up 19 spots.
“ "Green Bay opened the day with two second round selections – the No. 53 and No. 59 picks. The Packers traded both to the Minnesota Vikings for the right to take Watson at No. 34.

No wonder the Vikings took the trade. If Watson doesn’t pan out, Gute is gonna look like a dope.

I don't think so. The Packers moved all-in on a championship chase over the next 2-3 years. Having an extra pick is meaningless if we don't have capable WRs. They flew off the board the last 2 days. Waiting wasn't an option. Even if the kid doesn't pan out, it wasn't a mistake by Gute to go after him. It was a major need for the team, and it would've been risky to stay in the latter part of the 2nd and wait.

[Jaire]

I don't think so. The Packers moved all-in on a championship chase over the next 2-3 years. Having an extra pick is meaningless if we don't have capable WRs. They flew off the board the last 2 days. Waiting wasn't an option. Even if the kid doesn't pan out, it wasn't a mistake by Gute to go after him. It was a major need for the team, and it would've been risky to stay in the latter part of the 2nd and wait.

WHat I mean:

They should have gone Wyatt, then Watkins. It's clear this draft was ALL IN now. Not sure I llke it.

[Joemailman]

Just an idle thought:

In 2009 a lot of people initially thought Packers overpaid to move up and draft Clay Matthews. I felt they did it because if they didn't the Patriots would take Matthews for themselves.

Same thing here. Packers paid a lot to move up. Maybe in part they did it because if not Vikings might take Watson and they'd be trying to cover Watson and Justin Jefferson for the next 8-10 years.

[Jaire]

He was voted best receiver by the DBs at the Senior Bowl: could not be covered and got open. He still seems to fight the ball at times, but has adequate hands.

He has the shiftiness of a sub 6.0' receiver.

He tracks the ball well (unlike MVS), and can blow the top off.

Dedicated, smart, "Packer" type receiver. My top pick for LaFleur's system. (Again, I'm very concerned that Burks won't get open in the NFL like K'Neal Harry. Watson will get open.)

He can contribute right away: blocking, screens, sweeps, deep balls.

[Joemailman]

He was voted best receiver by the DBs at the Senior Bowl: could not be covered and got open. He still seems to fight the ball at times, but has adequate hands.

He has the shiftiness of a sub 6.0' receiver.

He tracks the ball well (unlike MVS), and can blow the top off.

Dedicated, smart, "Packer" type receiver. My top pick for LaFleur's system. (Again, I'm very concerned that Burks won't get open in the NFL like K'Neal Harry. Watson will get open.)

He can contribute right away: blocking, screens, sweeps, deep balls.

Given the RAS scores of Walker, Wyatt and Watson, I wonder if Packers even had a 1st round grade on Burks.

I also wonder if Packers would have taken Watson at 28 if Wyatt had not been available.

[Jaire]

I think Chris Simms is the best draft analyst. He misses occasionally -- who doesn't? But given Watson's high character, I don't see the downside. Simms had Watson as his number two receiver. Packers take developmental receivers, not finished products (so too with most high picks). It also reminds me that one of the coaches is his division said that Watson was the best receiver in the FCS since Randy Moss.

I am very happy with this pick and the Wyatt pick.

https://twitter.com/CSimmsQB/status/1520189492711280642?s=20&t=BosyCb7vR8rBdruCUAyAwA

[Upnorth]

He was voted best receiver by the DBs at the Senior Bowl: could not be covered and got open. He still seems to fight the ball at times, but has adequate hands.

He has the shiftiness of a sub 6.0' receiver.

He tracks the ball well (unlike MVS), and can blow the top off.

Dedicated, smart, "Packer" type receiver. My top pick for LaFleur's system. (Again, I'm very concerned that Burks won't get open in the NFL like K'Neal Harry. Watson will get open.)

He can contribute right away: blocking, screens, sweeps, deep balls.

If the Sr bowl dbs think he was the best that says something. Metal sharpens metal and if he challenges them he must be at least decent. No he will.habe stokes pushing him on speed and jaire for technique. I think we got a good wr here. Hate giving up the 2 2nds but really could not wait based on who was gone already. I thought someone would get him in 1st actually.

[Anti-Polar Bear]

If the Sr bowl dbs think he was the best that says something. Metal sharpens metal and if he challenges them he must be at least decent. No he will.habe stokes pushing him on speed and jaire for technique. I think we got a good wr here. Hate giving up the 2 2nds but really could not wait based on who was gone already. I thought someone would get him in 1st actually.

Maybe proof read your posts before you post. “Sr bowl DBs think he was the best that says something.”

If you’re a Sr Bowl DB, there has got to be something wrong with you. I mean, you don’t see Sauce and Stingray playing in Sr bowls, do you? Nope. The best corners enter the draft prior to their senior year of eligibility.

A bunch of JAG DBs saying Watson is the best they’ve ever covered ain’t saying much, hombre. I mean, I once shut down Darren Charles. Charles ain’t in any shape, form, matter or antimatter the best WR ever conceived in cold, dark and dull Wisconsin. That honor belongs to Bill Schroeder.

[Upnorth]

Maybe proof read your posts before you post. “Sr bowl DBs think he was the best that says something.”

If you’re a Sr Bowl DB, there has got to be something wrong with you. I mean, you don’t see Sauce and Stingray playing in Sr bowls, do you? Nope. The best corners enter the draft prior to their senior year of eligibility.

A bunch of JAG DBs saying Watson is the best they’ve ever covered ain’t saying much, hombre. I mean, I once shut down Darren Charles. Charles ain’t in any shape, form, matter or antimatter the best WR ever conceived in cold, dark and dull Wisconsin. That honor belongs to Bill Schroeder.

So regardless of the talent these db have they also competed against pierce and dotson, who are also highly regarded prospects.
They said watson was the best. That says something and it isn't negative.
I'm not saying watson = moss from this. I'm saying he was recognized by a group of players whose job is to shut down wr that he is the best there.
Maybe understand what is being said before commenting.
Dude is an athletic freak. He has potenial. He is 1 of 3 wr I thought might be an ok #1if he develops. The others were injured, and I down grade watson already due to the competition he faced. That is why I repeatedly said there was no sure #1 wr, only a bunch of #2.

I am amused that a player who I think is comparable to your boy dk is garbage in your eyes. I doubt he will be as good but he is the best wr athlete since dk imo.

[Joemailman]

DK and Watson are very different. DK outweighs Watson by 20 pounds. He is all about straight speed and power. Watson is almost as fast, but is also a much more flexible athlete.

[Upnorth]

DK and Watson are very different. DK outweighs Watson by 20 pounds. He is all about straight speed and power. Watson is almost as fast, but is also a much more flexible athlete.

True, but athletic freaks both of them. I didn't see the comparison until today and I have run I to twice so far. Maybe it is some random draft guys hyping the pick, but I'm hoping it's accurate.
If he is 75% Metcalf still a good pick imo

[Vincenzo]

I think Chris Simms is the best draft analyst. He misses occasionally -- who doesn't? But given Watson's high character, I don't see the downside. Simms had Watson as his number two receiver. Packers take developmental receivers, not finished products (so too with most high picks). It also reminds me that one of the coaches is his division said that Watson was the best receiver in the FCS since Randy Moss.

I am very happy with this pick and the Wyatt pick.

https://twitter.com/CSimmsQB/status/1520189492711280642?s=20&t=BosyCb7vR8rBdruCUAyAwA
Good job man, I with you on all this, especially about Wyatt and Watson - they have me all pumped this weekend!

[Jaire]

A bunch of JAG DBs saying Watson is the best they’ve ever covered ain’t saying much, hombre. I mean, I once shut down Darren Charles. Charles ain’t in any shape, form, matter or antimatter the best WR ever conceived in cold, dark and dull Wisconsin. That honor belongs to Bill Schroeder.

No. Just the best at the senior bowl. Not nothing, not GOAT.

[Vincenzo]

I don't think so. The Packers moved all-in on a championship chase over the next 2-3 years. Having an extra pick is meaningless if we don't have capable WRs. They flew off the board the last 2 days. Waiting wasn't an option. Even if the kid doesn't pan out, it wasn't a mistake by Gute to go after him. It was a major need for the team, and it would've been risky to stay in the latter part of the 2nd and wait.
Great point. Last night I had to let it digest that we actually gave up a juicy 2nd rounder to move up to 34. You have to admit that it was at the very least, a BOLD move.
I still can’t believe we did it.

[Anti-Polar Bear]

True, but athletic freaks both of them. I didn't see the comparison until today and I have run I to twice so far. Maybe it is some random draft guys hyping the pick, but I'm hoping it's accurate.
If he is 75% Metcalf still a good pick imo

YouTube “Miles Austin.” Watson not only looks like Austin, he plays like Austin.

I’d rather have a poor man’s Randy Moss (Thornton) than a poor man’s Austin.

[HarveyWallbangers]

38 on the Wunderlic. Wyatt and Walker both scored in the single digits. :lol:

[Scott Campbell]

I'm going on record and way out on a limb to predict he has a way better career than Joey Harrington.

[Anti-Polar Bear]

I'm going on record and way out on a limb to predict he has a way better career than Joey Harrington.

S’up, Campbell, how many wives do you have now?

[Scott Campbell]

Still just the one.

Except most days it feels like 11-12.

[Anti-Polar Bear]

Still just the one.

Except most days it feels like 11-12.

Welcome back. :)

[RashanGary]

Where the hell was Scott Campbell when we had GB Brandon causing havoc? Campbell would have destroyed Brandon.

[RashanGary]

How does APB not like a 6'4" 210 lb 4.36 WR. This guy is right up your alley, APB.

[bobblehead]

So harv great 17 minute video. I actually watch the whole thing. Some people are calling him a Randy Moss or MVS clone but I'm thinking more Julio Jones. My best guess is he's instantly an upgrade from MVS.

As for tex thinking we upgraded with Watkins and Watson. That's just crazy. Watkins is a poor man's devonte, but that's kind of an insult to poor people. He's more like a flat broke. No checkbook, shot credit eating out of a garbage can devonte. That production is going to have to be made up for through every single guy on the offense.

[bobblehead]

How does APB not like a 6'4" 210 lb 4.36 WR. This guy is right up your alley, APB.

The 40 never excites me, but his 10-yard split three cone and short shuttle or insane for a guy his size

[texaspackerbacker]

So harv great 17 minute video. I actually watch the whole thing. Some people are calling him a Randy Moss or MVS clone but I'm thinking more Julio Jones. My best guess is he's instantly an upgrade from MVS.

As for tex thinking we upgraded with Watkins and Watson. That's just crazy. Watkins is a poor man's devonte, but that's kind of an insult to poor people. He's more like a flat broke. No checkbook, shot credit eating out of a garbage can devonte. That production is going to have to be made up for through every single guy on the offense.

I'm thinking more along the lines of Watkins an upgrade from MVS (even though not exactly the same type WR), and Watson a sure long term upgrade on Adams and at least comparable even in the first couple years - net upgrade with the two over the outgoing too. Of course, Doubs has to beat out St. Brown hahahaha for the trifecta. Do you know anything about Doubs, being from Nevada, bobblehead?

[Anti-Polar Bear]

Where the hell was Scott Campbell when we had GB Brandon causing havoc? Campbell would have destroyed Brandon.

Campbell’s a poor man’s Rand. Might not be poor, though. I recall Campbell mentioning his fabulous ski trips back in the days. As Bobble likes to brag, one has to have sumptuous frogskins to ski.

[Anti-Polar Bear]

How does APB not like a 6'4" 210 lb 4.36 WR. This guy is right up your alley, APB.

I dig Thornton more. 4.28 > 4.36

[RashanGary]

Great, he can block.

Problem is he doesnt catch well.

I guess you have to have your priorities.


Dysfunction. Bad pick.

[RashanGary]

A pass catcher whos not good at catching passes. Dysfunction.

[texaspackerbacker]

Are you talking about Watson or Doubs?

[RashanGary]

Are you talking about Watson or Doubs?

Watson. I could care less about some late round flyer. Using two premium picks on a pass catcher whos not good at catching passes doesnt make a lick of sense.

[bobblehead]

.

[bobblehead]

Watson. I could care less about some late round flyer. Using two premium picks on a pass catcher whos not good at catching passes doesnt make a lick of sense.

He had 2 drops with lance as his QB. Drops can often be a guy trying to do too much with limited chances. His hands look good on tape.

[texaspackerbacker]

I watched the video, and I saw no indication he can't catch - a lot of imperfect passes from I think two different QBs, and he snagged them. As for the two premium picks, in hindsight, I wish they had taken him and Wyatt in the first and passed on Walker - keeping both second rounders. But if the choice is paying that price or not getting him, I'm damn glad they paid the price.

[texaspackerbacker]

My first thought about Doubs is I think I'd rather have Malik Taylor. I'm willing to give him a chance to prove otherwise though.

[Bretsky]

Watson. I could care less about some late round flyer. Using two premium picks on a pass catcher whos not good at catching passes doesnt make a lick of sense.


I can't tell if you are being serious; you are always kinda a GUTE homer. Do you really not like Watson ? I think he has the chance to be a stud.

Now, honestly, I would have definitely not traded 2 second round draft picks for him. I'd have employed HW's strategy of waiting til there were 2 WR's I really liked and traded up then. AND if Alex Pierce is one of the guys you wanted, and Tolbert, both were there at 53 so we could have kept out picks.

Since Gute overpaid to move up, we have to assume he loved Watson and really considered him a class above the guys like Sky Moore, Pierce, Tolbert, and Pickens

I'm going to wait and see if it works

[HarveyWallbangers]

RG doesn

[run pMc]

I'm ok with the pick, but the process was a little meh. Giving up BOTH R2's to Minny felt like a lot, and I'm hearing people say they effectively lost the equivalent of a late R3 on the trade value charts.
So... that part hurts.
Also, Watson is a project, which means he has upside but also that he has a long way to go. That's fine and all, and maybe you put him in the MVS role and let him be your KR and gunner for good measure. He'll have to play ST since Cobb and Watkins likely won't, and you need big fast guys there. So he can contribute in some ways right away, but it's a pretty big investment for a WR4 and KR. Of course, next year he might come back into the 2023 training camp and be an absolute monster, which is not nothing. If he becomes GB's version of DK, this looks pretty good.

As for his hands, I don't think they're bad but I do think they need work. Almost every WR that comes into pros does; pro QBs throw with such velocity it's incredible. He supposedly works at the Juggs machine daily and he'll want to continue that. I hope Cobb takes him and Amari under his wing and makes them do the crazy Juggs drills Jordy and others used to do.... he'll be ok. MVS's hands weren't great but they improved, and Davante worked on his hands a lot.

I think he's more flexible and has a bigger frame than MVS. His speed translates to the field, and word is he's a hard worker and good kid, so he's a good addition. He'll block and do the things they ask him to do, and honestly you could argue that Drake London isn't that much better than this kid.

I'll be rooting big time for him, and he has a lot of upside. I just think they paid a lot to get him and worry the Packers coaches might fail to develop his potential.

[RashanGary]

Well see. Im going to root for both him and Walker. Its just two major projects with huge question marks in some of the most important areas.

I feel about this pick and the Walker pick about how Fritz felt about Gary three years ago.

Hopefully Im wrong. If Gute hits a couple home runs it will shut me up for quite some time.

[HarveyWallbangers]

I'm ok with the pick, but the process was a little meh. Giving up BOTH R2's to Minny felt like a lot, and I'm hearing people say they effectively lost the equivalent of a late R3 on the trade value charts.
So... that part hurts.
Also, Watson is a project, which means he has upside but also that he has a long way to go. That's fine and all, and maybe you put him in the MVS role and let him be your KR and gunner for good measure. He'll have to play ST since Cobb and Watkins likely won't, and you need big fast guys there. So he can contribute in some ways right away, but it's a pretty big investment for a WR4 and KR. Of course, next year he might come back into the 2023 training camp and be an absolute monster, which is not nothing. If he becomes GB's version of DK, this looks pretty good.

As for his hands, I don't think they're bad but I do think they need work. Almost every WR that comes into pros does; pro QBs throw with such velocity it's incredible. He supposedly works at the Juggs machine daily and he'll want to continue that. I hope Cobb takes him and Amari under his wing and makes them do the crazy Juggs drills Jordy and others used to do.... he'll be ok. MVS's hands weren't great but they improved, and Davante worked on his hands a lot.

I think he's more flexible and has a bigger frame than MVS. His speed translates to the field, and word is he's a hard worker and good kid, so he's a good addition. He'll block and do the things they ask him to do, and honestly you could argue that Drake London isn't that much better than this kid.

I'll be rooting big time for him, and he has a lot of upside. I just think they paid a lot to get him and worry the Packers coaches might fail to develop his potential.

What's ironic is that it's been reported that the Packers started trying to trade up for him at pick #30, so they obviously really liked him. They offered the same compensation to the teams above the Vikings (including the Vikings at pick #32). The offers were rejected. If the offer had been accepted, the Packers would look good on the trade value chart. In the end it didn't matter because they got the same player for the same price.

[Bretsky]

I'm ok with the pick, but the process was a little meh. Giving up BOTH R2's to Minny felt like a lot, and I'm hearing people say they effectively lost the equivalent of a late R3 on the trade value charts.
So... that part hurts.
Also, Watson is a project, which means he has upside but also that he has a long way to go. That's fine and all, and maybe you put him in the MVS role and let him be your KR and gunner for good measure. He'll have to play ST since Cobb and Watkins likely won't, and you need big fast guys there. So he can contribute in some ways right away, but it's a pretty big investment for a WR4 and KR. Of course, next year he might come back into the 2023 training camp and be an absolute monster, which is not nothing. If he becomes GB's version of DK, this looks pretty good.

As for his hands, I don't think they're bad but I do think they need work. Almost every WR that comes into pros does; pro QBs throw with such velocity it's incredible. He supposedly works at the Juggs machine daily and he'll want to continue that. I hope Cobb takes him and Amari under his wing and makes them do the crazy Juggs drills Jordy and others used to do.... he'll be ok. MVS's hands weren't great but they improved, and Davante worked on his hands a lot.

I think he's more flexible and has a bigger frame than MVS. His speed translates to the field, and word is he's a hard worker and good kid, so he's a good addition. He'll block and do the things they ask him to do, and honestly you could argue that Drake London isn't that much better than this kid.

I'll be rooting big time for him, and he has a lot of upside. I just think they paid a lot to get him and worry the Packers coaches might fail to develop his potential.

Well on paper the Vikings didn

[HarveyWallbangers]

Well on paper the Vikings didn

Quite typing apostrophes. :) I'm so tired of this happening to me.

[Bretsky]

What the heck . Ok I will try this again

[Bretsky]

Quite typing apostrophes. :) I'm so tired of this happening to me.

I did a long reply from cell and there was no apostrohes

[Bretsky]

To runpnc. On paper the vikes didn’t get fair value in trading down with Detroit so they were looking for somebody to overpay to get value back. I have much higher expectations for Watson year one then you do . I think we can see 800 yards and 60 to 70 receptions if Green Bay doesn’t add a veteran wr

[Bretsky]

What's ironic is that it's been reported that the Packers started trying to trade up for him at pick #30, so they obviously really liked him. They offered the same compensation to the teams above the Vikings (including the Vikings at pick #32). The offers were rejected. If the offer had been accepted, the Packers would look good on the trade value chart. In the end it didn't matter because they got the same player for the same price.

I really wish they would have slipped into round one so we get that fifth year option

[Bretsky]

Rg you need to get out of the old fritz Rashan Gary zone. I was there with fritz. I am supposed to be the questioner of gutebag and you function as his attorney

[RashanGary]

Rg you need to get out of the old fritz Rashan Gary zone. I was there with fritz. I am supposed to be the questioner of gutebag and you function as his attorney

I cant this year. You turned on the Gary tape and you saw knock back on ever snap, violent hands, a really good one arm stab to create an edge.

You turn on Watson and you see a clumsy pass catcher.

You turn on Walker and you see hesitation and false steps.

Its not the same this year. This year theyve been emboldened by the Gary pick and think they can draft bad ball players because theyre athletes. But the thing theyre missing is thats not what happened with Gary.

[HarveyWallbangers]

I had Snoop Conner rated much higher than the consensus (RB20 instead of RB28). He went RB13.
I had Mike Woods rated much higher than the consensus (WR25 instead of WR39), He went WR25.

I've talked about both as being sleepers that I like.

Those are the ones that make you feel good. :)

[Bretsky]

I cant this year. You turned on the Gary tape and you saw knock back on ever snap, violent hands, a really good one arm stab to create an edge.

You turn on Watson and you see a clumsy pass catcher.

You turn on Walker and you see hesitation and false steps.

Its not the same this year. This year theyve been emboldened by the Gary pick and think they can draft bad ball players because theyre athletes. But the thing theyre missing is thats not what happened with Gary.


In the Real World I am a mortgage lender and very good at what I do. The first time homebuyers working with me are very well prepared. They often ask me for input.

The two things I tell to every homebuyer are

1. The most important thing is you are comfortable with your monthly payment on any house you fine
2. The next thing is ....don't fall in love with a house to the point where you convince yourself to overpay. IF you do, and end up overpaying, keep in mind you are going down a road of very high risk. If a home does not appraise out a seller may make you come in with a bunch of money to make the deal work...or lose the home And if that occurs and/or it ends up not being the perfect home you can regret it for a long long time.

I hope the two picks you really question were not examples of Gute really falling in love with a player and overdrafting and/or overpaying. The Wyatt pick seems like a very solid pick for Green Bay

I almost wish he'd have taken Wyatt at 22, Watson at 28, and keep those 2nds. Giving both of those up, man it seems like the buyer choosing to overpay for his house.

[HarveyWallbangers]

Got this page bookmarked to come back to in a couple of years, if we are still alive.

[texaspackerbacker]

I on the other hand was a Realtor for nearly twenty years in the "real world, Bretsky. Part of my job was to be like the "capologist" - finagle the mortgage provider to allow and enable buyers to get what they really wanted and were happy with. And like with the salary cap, they were invariably able to find a way to make it work and enjoy what they wanted.

If Watson is remotely as good as what it seems, he's worth every bit of what we traded to move up and get him. What were they gonna do in the late second anyway? Draft some damn O Lineman or ILB?

Yes, Harvey, do that - even late in the '22 season. By then, getting Watson will be like that "dream house".

[Bretsky]

I like Watson the player and I think he gets 60 to 70 catches and 800ish yards year one and turns out very good long term for the Packers.

I'm luke warm on Walker and would not have taken him

[RashanGary]

I would have liked to have seen them move back to the beginning of the second round and pick up a high 3rd.

Wyatt and Metchie as our first two picks would have been good.

Then Trey McBride and maybe an edge in the 2nd round would be good.

Plus we would have an extra high 3rd.

[Bretsky]

I on the other hand was a Realtor for nearly twenty years in the "real world, Bretsky. Part of my job was to be like the "capologist" - finagle the mortgage provider to allow and enable buyers to get what they really wanted and were happy with. And like with the salary cap, they were invariably able to find a way to make it work and enjoy what they wanted.

If Watson is remotely as good as what it seems, he's worth every bit of what we traded to move up and get him. What were they gonna do in the late second anyway? Draft some damn O Lineman or ILB?

Yes, Harvey, do that - even late in the '22 season. By then, getting Watson will be like that "dream house".


I'm pretty good at getting the buyers what they want; I just want to put them in a good place financially and understand each step of the process. There are realtors who aren't up front as well, and push buyers these days to "do what it takes" to win and grossly overpay for homes when financially it will hurt them. It's interesting out there

[Bretsky]

I would have liked to have seen them move back to the beginning of the second round and pick up a high 3rd.

Wyatt and Metchie as our first two picks would have been good.

Then Trey McBride and maybe an edge in the 2nd round would be good.

Plus we would have an extra high 3rd.


I like Metchie too bur reports lately seem to be that he has a ways to go before he plays in 2022

[Upnorth]

One thing I think we need to recognize about watson, no 2022 rookie receiver has as high of a ceiling. The guy has more potential than anyone else this class. Plus he is one of the best run blockers. He can take the top off a d like Lafluer wants and has better hands than mvs.

Is he replacing Adams? No. He replaces mvs and is likely better.

[RashanGary]

Got this page bookmarked to come back to in a couple of years, if we are still alive.

Youre on the side of Tex. I like my chances :wink:

[Bretsky]

In the end, I really like the player, but I hated giving up two 2nd round draft picks to get him.
I'd have rather picked him at 28.

I hope in a few years all three of our top picks are in the Pro Bowl

[HarveyWallbangers]

Youre on the side of Tex. I like my chances :wink:

You're going to lose this one, and no chance we were taking Metchie--even if he was healthy.

[Bretsky]

You're going to lose this one.


I hope so !!!

I think you two should create an OVAL OFFICE bet !!!

[HarveyWallbangers]

I hope so !!!

I think you two should create an OVAL OFFICE bet !!!

Did he pay up on your bet? :)

[Bretsky]

Did he pay up on your bet? :)



He just owes me a brewsky there. We'll make it happen sometime.

I TRIED upping the ante to a lap dance but he ignored me.

I kinda felt guilty taking his beer. There was NO way Jamison Williams was getting into round 2. Honestly GB takes him if he's there.

[texaspackerbacker]

I hope that's not me you're talking about. I don't remember any such bet.

As for this thing about Watson, I'd bet a lot that he is an NFL star sooner rather than later. Jameson Williams will not amount to much even after he recovers. Watson - assuming he avoids major injury and plays anything like projected, will be extremely better.

[Bretsky]

I hope that's not me you're talking about. I don't remember any such bet.

As for this thing about Watson, I'd bet a lot that he is an NFL star sooner rather than later. Jameson Williams will not amount to much even after he recovers. Watson - assuming he avoids major injury and plays anything like projected, will be extremely better.


Nope, the bet was not with you

I hate seeing Jamison Williams in our division

I like Watson Tex, but I'm not crowing him to be remotely comparable to a border HOF talent til I see him play for a while

[HarveyWallbangers]

Davante Adams, Randall Cobb, Jordy Nelson, Greg Jennings

I trust this organization to get a 2nd round WR right. Just like I trust them to get a 4th round OL right and all 3rd round picks wrong, so my ranking Zach Tom ahead of Sean Rhyan may be right in the end. :)

[call_me_ishmael]

Harv what is your general view of the draft? It sounds like it was well done to me.

[HarveyWallbangers]

Harv what is your general view of the draft? It sounds like it was well done to me.

I like it. There were things I would have done differently, but a lot of holes were filled. I'd like a slot CB and safeties, but otherwise it's hard to say this team has a lot of holes. Some say TE, but if Tonyan can get back after a stint on the PUP, I think Tonyan, Marcedes, Deguara, Dafney/Davis (who I think could surprise), will be alright. We'll see. I'm excited about this class.

[HarveyWallbangers]

ESPN


Pre-Draft Analysis
Watson is a big target with outstanding speed, longer arms and big hands. He's a threat to take the top off the coverage and is an instinctive open-field runner with good contact balance. Watson is a hands catcher with good body control and a wide catch radius. He's a smooth mover for his size and flashed as a route runner the week of the Senior Bowl. -- Steve Muench

Post-Draft Analysis
The Packers desperately needed a big-bodied receiver, and they get one in Watson. He has the physical traits to become a great receiver, but is raw coming out of the run-heavy offense. While his potential is impressive, the early production might be less than fans would like. -- Matt Miller

[Fritz]

In the end, I really like the player, but I hated giving up two 2nd round draft picks to get him.
I'd have rather picked him at 28.

I hope in a few years all three of our top picks are in the Pro Bowl


In three years, we'll see if Watson turns out to be worth the price - if he's that much better than Metchie, Pickens, and especially Pierce, who was taken at #53 I think.

One way to frame it is would you rather have Watson, or Pierce and another player who was available at #59 and would have been of interest to the Pack. We will know in three years.

[RashanGary]

Im warming up to the Watson pick. Elite talent. Itll be interesting to see if they can get him up to speed and if he works on his craft diligently. Hes got a shot.

[HarveyWallbangers]

Chris Simms and this dude know. :)


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LIy1cpIbp84

[RashanGary]

Chris Simms and this dude know. :)


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LIy1cpIbp84

Im so torn on this guy. His speed isnt even his #1 trait when i watch him, its his movement skills at that size. Its ridiculous. He has the ability to be elite getting off the line with his explosiveness and length. He has the ability to be an elite route runner with his suddenness and agility. He has the ability to be elite after the catch with his movement and size. AND hes fast as lightning.

HOWEVER!!!!!

Hes also got suspect ball skills. Thats such a big part of receiver. I dont know if you can coach that out of him.

[RashanGary]

You are just going to have to live with the drops. Its like MVS, hell go for 65 yards and a tud on a perfect deep ball and then hell drop one put right in his hands. Youre going to have that with Watson.

[RashanGary]

I could see Watson having a similar rookie year to MVS (580 yards)

We should be able to line him up like MVS and run deep while Watkins and Lazard work underneath.

It will be interesting to see if he can round out his game and have some other go-to routes, or if hell round into a complete player.

[HarveyWallbangers]

His hands are better than MVS. His ball tracking and route running are miles ahead of MVS.

[Joemailman]

You are just going to have to live with the drops. Its like MVS, hell go for 65 yards and a tud on a perfect deep ball and then hell drop one put right in his hands. Youre going to have that with Watson.

Who cared about drops? Lots of good receivers have drops, because they're the ones getting open. MVS failed to become elite because he seldom caught contested balls. That's different than drops.

The receivers in the NFL with the most drops in 2021:

J. Chase
D. Samuel
D. Moore
T. Kelce
D. Mooney
C. Kupp
K. Allen
C. Lamb
J. Waddle
J. Jefferson
T. Hill
M. Williams
M. Pittman

[ZachMN]

Some of you seem to forget how bad 'Tae was when he was younger. Only bad part of this is we didn't have overlap with 17 but we have Lazard and now Watkins plus maybe Cooper will step up as well. That along with a potentially kick ass (finally) defense will make all this chatter moot. You want a guy that is still growing and this kid seems to be. Like someone said he has a high ceiling.

[texaspackerbacker]

His hands are better than MVS. His ball tracking and route running are miles ahead of MVS.

You beat me to saying that, Harvey. Also, MVS undoubtedly had less targets, catches, and yards as a rookie than Watson should get for the obvious reason: we had Davante.

[HarveyWallbangers]

Watson (#1) and Doubs (#7) at Senior Bowl practice. It's cool that those two were teammates down there. Plus, Khalil Shakur and Bo Melton. If you go to youtube, you can click the links below to just see the 1 on 1s for each individual player.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XsJYlqqRHgE

[bobblehead]

In three years, we'll see if Watson turns out to be worth the price - if he's that much better than Metchie, Pickens, and especially Pierce, who was taken at #53 I think.

One way to frame it is would you rather have Watson, or Pierce and another player who was available at #59 and would have been of interest to the Pack. We will know in three years.

My hunch is that he will look the best of that lot, but because he has an elite QB. I think if we had taken Pickens or Pierce I would say the same about them.

[RashanGary]

My hunch is that he will look the best of that lot, but because he has an elite QB. I think if we had taken Pickens or Pierce I would say the same about them.

DJ Moore is having 1,200 yard seasons with Cam, Kyle Allen, Bridgewater and Darnold.

DJ Moore is the most underrated WR in the game and balls out no matter who the QB is.

[texaspackerbacker]

My hunch is that he will look the best of that lot, but because he has an elite QB. I think if we had taken Pickens or Pierce I would say the same about them.

Obviously I agree with that completely, but with Watson, it will just be by a wider margin because he will be a better player than either of those others or any other WR drafted this year.

RG, you might be right that Moore is good, but having those big yardage seasons is a product of how much a team emphasizes the pass game as well as what other receivers they have, and I don't think Carolina had many other good ones.

[RashanGary]

Comparing MVS to Watson

Watson
1.45 seconds from 0-10 yards
1.00 seconds from 10-20 yards
1.91 seconds from 20-40 yards
4.36 40 yard dash

MVS
1.55 second from 0-10 yards
1.03 seconds from 10-20 yards
1.79 seconds from 20-40 yards
4.37 40 yard dash


Theyre both 6-4 and 206 Lbs for MVS and 208 lbs for Watson.

Watson shows more juice out of the gates with a 1.45 10 yard split compared to 1.55 for MVS

But MVS shows more top end speed, running the last 20 yards in a blazing 1.79 seconds compared to Watsons 1.91.

Watson shows a lot more explosion in his jumps. 38.5 inch compared to 30.5 inch verts.

Watson 6.96 3 cone
MVS 6.85 3 cone

Watson 4.19 shuttle
MVS 4.17 shuttle

They have similar agility scores for their height

Both have iffy hands.

Watson rarely broke tackles. MVS rarely breaks tackles.

Watson looks a lot more explosive and agile with the ball in his hands, changing speeds and making cuts regularly. He used his explosiveness to erase angles and get away from guys. MVS seemed a little more linear and didnt make a lot of guys miss despite having similar agility numbers.

[RashanGary]

I do expect Watson to be better on the short and especially intermediate routes. He has more upside to be a complete WR with his explosiveness out of breaks and with the ball in his hands.

Theyre the same height and weight with the same 40 time and same agility numbers, but theyre very different players.

[Joemailman]

That's amazing that MVS only had a vertical of 30.5. A lot of 300+ lb. linemen do better than that. I guess that's why he was never good at 50/50 balls. He couldn't elevate over guys the way you would think a guy with his height would. The fact that Watson's vertical is 8 inches more is a huge difference between the two.

[RashanGary]

That's amazing that MVS only had a vertical of 30.5. A lot of 300+ lb. linemen do better than that. I guess that's why he was never good at 50/50 balls. He couldn't elevate over guys the way you would think a guy with his height would. The fact that Watson's vertical is 8 inches more is a huge difference between the two.

The jumps are a huge difference and that 10 yard split is a huge difference in Watsons favor.

The 20-40 yard time is a huge difference in MVS favor.

I dont think jumps are nearly as important as speed for WR.

The biggest difference between the two on the field is Watsons burst compared to MVS long speed.

I hope Watson goes after the ball more aggressively and can get open underneath better.

Hes not that much of a better athlete than MVS though.

Lets not get too excited about height and speed because we already had it and it wasnt that great.

[RashanGary]

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.prideofdetroit.com/platform/amp/2017/3/6/14828170/2017-nfl-combine-relative-athletic-scores-for-the-wide-receivers-zay-jones-ryan-switzer-cooper-kupp

Shows how ras scores correlate to success.

[texaspackerbacker]

What was MVS's Wonderlic? I think I read Watson was 38 which should help a lot in digesting LaFleur's fairly complex system. Just looking at the videos, Watson seemed to run good routes and make tough catches - which MVS was spotty at best on.

I thoroughly expect Watson to be an absolute star with the Packers, sooner rather than later, probably even his first year. All of that is barring injury, of course.

[HarveyWallbangers]

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.prideofdetroit.com/platform/amp/2017/3/6/14828170/2017-nfl-combine-relative-athletic-scores-for-the-wide-receivers-zay-jones-ryan-switzer-cooper-kupp

Shows how ras scores correlate to success.

The RAS scores are not correct on that site. They have Jordy at 5.1, but he scored higher than 7.2. Cobbs score is off also.

[bobblehead]

DJ Moore is having 1,200 yard seasons with Cam, Kyle Allen, Bridgewater and Darnold.

DJ Moore is the most underrated WR in the game and balls out no matter who the QB is.

Yes, but that has nothing to do with my point. My point is that all these receivers are similar and the likely best outcome will be from the one with the best QB.

[Fritz]

Well, you'd think so, but for rookies, maybe not. Amon Ra St.Brown had a spectacular rookie year with Jared Goff. Aaron Rodgers is tough on rookies, so it might take to year two or three to see how Watson shakes out.

I still think it's going to be interesting to see how Watson shakes out compared to the guys drafted behind him - I think six were drafted after Watson in the second round. The Packers must've liked him way, way better than Pickens and Pierce and Skyy Moore, since they could've gotten any of those much cheaper than what they paid for Watson.

We'll see in a few years.

[texaspackerbacker]

This will be a perfect storm for Watson - the team's top receiver, actually top two from last year gone, the GOAT QB throwing to him, and a generally pass first team in a generally pass first league.

Yeah, Aaron Rodgers is tough on rookies - or to be more precise, he's tough on people making dumb mistakes. Watson had a 38 Wonderlic score and (supposedly) good football IQ. That should carry weight in a positive way with Rodgers, but even if it doesn't, Rodgers won't have many other better possible places to throw. Watson should end up with at least as good a year as Adams had last year and much better than Adams will have this year with the Raiders. I expect him to not only have a lot better season than the WRs drafted after him as well as a better season than the WRs drafted before him.

[Joemailman]

Well, you'd think so, but for rookies, maybe not. Amon Ra St.Brown had a spectacular rookie year with Jared Goff. Aaron Rodgers is tough on rookies, so it might take to year two or three to see how Watson shakes out.

I still think it's going to be interesting to see how Watson shakes out compared to the guys drafted behind him - I think six were drafted after Watson in the second round. The Packers must've liked him way, way better than Pickens and Pierce and Skyy Moore, since they could've gotten any of those much cheaper than what they paid for Watson.

We'll see in a few years.

I think the idea that Arod won't throw to rookies is a bit overblown. In 2018 MVS had almost 600 yards receiving and EQ had over 300 despite missing 4 games with injuries. He didn't throw as much to Adams as a rookie, but that team had Jordy and Cobb in their prime. Those 2 guys combined for 2800 receiving yards.

I think Watson will have the most receiving yards by a packer rookie since Sterling Sharpe. https://www.statmuse.com/nfl/ask/most-receiving-yards-player-green-bay-packers-in-a-rookie-season

[HarveyWallbangers]

Well, you'd think so, but for rookies, maybe not. Amon Ra St.Brown had a spectacular rookie year with Jared Goff. Aaron Rodgers is tough on rookies, so it might take to year two or three to see how Watson shakes out.

I still think it's going to be interesting to see how Watson shakes out compared to the guys drafted behind him - I think six were drafted after Watson in the second round. The Packers must've liked him way, way better than Pickens and Pierce and Skyy Moore, since they could've gotten any of those much cheaper than what they paid for Watson.

We'll see in a few years.

I can’t wait to see how he does compared to the guys drafted in front of him.

[RashanGary]

Just had Watsons position coach on 107.5 the fan in Green Bay.

He glowed about Watson. Said his drops happened when he was trying to turn it up and make a big play. Said he got better and better as he understood the game more and focused on catching the ball first. Said Watson has good hands.

Said hes a dedicated blocker and good at it.

Said he was always the most athletic player on the field but also worked hard on his releases, his his route running and his overall game.

Said hes one of the smartest players hes coached.

Said he would take hard coaching well and if Rodgers is demanding, hell take it in stride and get better. Likes to be coached hard.

A glowing endorsement of Watson the person and the player.

[Fritz]

I think the idea that Arod won't throw to rookies is a bit overblown. In 2018 MVS had almost 600 yards receiving and EQ had over 300 despite missing 4 games with injuries. He didn't throw as much to Adams as a rookie, but that team had Jordy and Cobb in their prime. Those 2 guys combined for 2800 receiving yards.

I think Watson will have the most receiving yards by a packer rookie since Sterling Sharpe. https://www.statmuse.com/nfl/ask/most-receiving-yards-player-green-bay-packers-in-a-rookie-season

I'm not saying he won't throw to them at all. He's just really hard on them, and he will ignore them for stretches if they screw up. He's not like Favre, who'd go right back to a guy who screwed up, help him get his confidence back.

Like Harv, I can't wait to see how this kid stacks up in a few years against the ones drafted behind him. I hope, of course, that he's great.

[QBME]

I'm just waiting...expecting... on the first or second set of downs whenst in the first game Arod times up and connects with the kid up the seam in a full gallop....

[Fritz]

I'm just waiting...expecting... on the first or second set of downs whenst in the first game Arod times up and connects with the kid up the seam in a full gallop....

Or it's third down, and the kid cuts left, Rodgers throws right. Wait a beat, camera close up, Rodgers rolls eyes.

Ah, hell. It's too soon for that kind of cynicism.

Touchdown, Rodgers to Watson!

[HarveyWallbangers]

I get a kick out of the scoring reports. He’s raw. Not really. His Dad was an NFL player and coach. Has anybody looked at him running routes vs the likes of Tolbert and Doubs at the Senior Bowl.

https://www.espn.com/blog/green-bay-packers/post/_/id/52140/christian-watsons-father-a-packers-draft-pick-in-1993-hopes-sons-path-to-green-bay-wont-be-as-rocky

[RashanGary]

I get a kick out of the scoring reports. He’s raw. Not really. His Dad was an NFL player and coach. Has anybody looked at him running routes vs the likes of Tolbert and Doubs at the Senior Bowl.

https://www.espn.com/blog/green-bay-packers/post/_/id/52140/christian-watsons-father-a-packers-draft-pick-in-1993-hopes-sons-path-to-green-bay-wont-be-as-rocky

Yeah, it doesnt make sense that he would be raw. I hope he comes in right away and puts up 600+ as a rookie. That would be a good sign. And in doing it, I hope he shows some promise in short, intermediate and longer routes.

[RashanGary]

One of McGinns scouts said he was linear and had build up speed. I dont know if he ever watched him because Watson looks explosive and has instant speed. His 10 yard split was ridiculous. This scout just assumed that he was tall so had that long speed. He was just talking out of his ass.

[RashanGary]

The fastest 10 yard splits recorded at the combine ever were Chris Johnson and Henry Ruggs at 1.43. Christian Watson had a 1.45. And you see it on tape. He turns it up instantly. Thats what makes him look so freakishly athletic on tape. For his height, hes as sudden as youll ever see.

He turns it up after catching those come back routes and erases angles instantly.

[run pMc]

Tyquan Thornton had a 1.41 10 yard split this year, just unbelievably fast.
Prospects are getting much better coaching/training at the 40. Used to be unusual to have a 10yd split under 1.5. It's still pretty darn good to have a split that fast, or for your flying 20 to be under 1.9.

[Sparkey]

https://jetsxfactor.com/2022/03/31/ny-jets-draft-christian-watson-complete-wr-prospect/

Interesting read:

"The 2022 NFL draft is flush with quality wide receiver prospects of all varieties.

There are route artists like the Ohio State duo of Chris Olave and Garrett Wilson, jump-ball monsters like Drake London and George Pickens, electric open-space threats like Treylon Burks and Jameson Williams, and everything in-between.

However, no single player possesses as many traits on the receiver prospect checklist as North Dakota State's Christian Watson..."

[RashanGary]

Tyquan Thornton had a 1.41 10 yard split this year, just unbelievably fast.
Prospects are getting much better coaching/training at the 40. Used to be unusual to have a 10yd split under 1.5. It's still pretty darn good to have a split that fast, or for your flying 20 to be under 1.9.

I believe thats the record. Ruggs and Chris Johnson previously shared it at 1.43 I believe

[RashanGary]

Jordy Nelson ran a 4.51 40 yard dash.
From 20 yards to 40 he clocked 1.87 seconds

MVS ran a 4.37 40 yard dash
From 20-40 he clocked 1.79 seconds

Christian Watson ran a 4.36
From 20-40 he clocked 1.91 seconds


Christian Watson has ridiculous burst out of the gate but his long speed isnt what you think. Jordy actually tested out better long speed despite running the 40 significantly slower.

[RashanGary]

Eric stokes ran that last 20 yards in 1.75. No one is gonna run by him.

[King Friday]

Jordy Nelson ran a 4.51 40 yard dash.
From 20 yards to 40 he clocked 1.87 seconds

MVS ran a 4.37 40 yard dash
From 20-40 he clocked 1.79 seconds

Christian Watson ran a 4.36
From 20-40 he clocked 1.91 seconds


Christian Watson has ridiculous burst out of the gate but his long speed isnt what you think. Jordy actually tested out better long speed despite running the 40 significantly slower.

Watson is barely behind Jordy in long speed, and short speed is far more meaningful in the NFL. MVS was only a deep threat and not much else because he didn't have that short speed. He had to run a 9 route to get open, because his separation could only happen 15 yards downfield. Watson has the opportunity to be a far more impactful receiver if he can put everything together.

[Joemailman]

Jordy Nelson ran a 4.51 40 yard dash.
From 20 yards to 40 he clocked 1.87 seconds

MVS ran a 4.37 40 yard dash
From 20-40 he clocked 1.79 seconds

Christian Watson ran a 4.36
From 20-40 he clocked 1.91 seconds


Christian Watson has ridiculous burst out of the gate but his long speed isnt what you think. Jordy actually tested out better long speed despite running the 40 significantly slower.

Can't rule out the possibility that his long speed is better if someone is chasing him.

[RashanGary]

The more I go through Watsons big plays, the more a few patterns stick out.

Most of his big plays were either seam routes or come back routes where he turned it up field after the catch and burst for 20 extra yards. I saw a back shoulder where he looked really natural.

The majority of the other big plays were end around and runs. Hes really dynamic with the ball in his hands. Its his number one trait.

I think to start out, you run him as a deep decoy and then work comebacks and back shoulders off of that. Unlike MVS, this speedster can back shoulder. Then add in some jet sweeps and screens to get the ball in his hands and use that part of his game. Maybe have him return kicks.

Then you hope he starts to round out the rest of his game with time.

[texaspackerbacker]

He's smart enough to learn all the routes from day one and agile enough to execute them. I expect him to be the most productive receiver from the first regular season games.

[RashanGary]

He's smart enough to learn all the routes from day one and agile enough to execute them. I expect him to be the most productive receiver from the first regular season games.

We will see.

This is no different than you saying we were gonna keep Adams and MVS and then back tracking when we did neither.

You think you know everything and then you dont but it doesnt stop you from going right back to knowing everything.

[HarveyWallbangers]

One note about level of competition. I read that the MVFC had more players drafted then most of the Group of Five conferences. The MVFC is the SEC of FBS. That conference regularly beats FCS teams. NDSU has won 6 straight games against Power 5 teams (Iowa, Minnesota, Iowa State, Kansas State, Kansas, Colorado). SDSU, Northern Iowa, and others have beaten Power 5 schools. Last year, South Dakota State beat Colorado State by 19. Missouri State lost to Oklahoma State by 7. Southern Illinois lost to Kansas State by 8. South Dakota lost to Kansas by 3. Northern Iowa lost to Iowa State by 6. So, they went 1-4, but no loss by more than 8 points and NDSU didn't play an FBS team.

So, if you are looking at guys from NDSU, Northern Iowa, etc. realize that, though they play FCS, they play a schedule on par with most Group of Five teams. Outside of the AAC (Cincinnati), NDSU would have won a majority of the Group of Five conferenes last year (and going back the last 10 years). Appalachian State, a recent convert from FCS that NDSU has dominated, made the championship game of the Sun Belt the last two full seasons.

[texaspackerbacker]

We will see.

This is no different than you saying we were gonna keep Adams and MVS and then back tracking when we did neither.

You think you know everything and then you dont but it doesnt stop you from going right back to knowing everything.

hahahahaha That's what forums are all about. Who in this forum or anyplace else anticipated Adams being gone/demanding the trade? I over estimated the value of MVS, I guess. I didn't think another team would pay that much, and the Packers would retain him for a little less. I think that also was the general consensus.

As for Watson, he has all the physical and mental tools, he has the GOAT QB throwing to him, and he has a situation where nobody else is clearly "the guy". Why would he not be great right from the start?

[run pMc]

I expect him to be the most productive receiver from the first regular season game

Of the roookies? Yeah. Of all the WR? Well...by end of year I could see it.
I guess it depends on how you define 'productive' - recs? yards? ypc? he could easily be a 15 recs at 20 ypc 9-route monster, but I'd expect better from a R2 pick.

You could be right - he did pretty good against Senior Bowl competition and while he is raw he has a lot of upside. By all accounts he's a hard worker and I think as he learns the offense and THEN learns how Rodgers likes routes run he'll figure it out. If I want to be optimistic I would expect a year of gradual growth followed by a big Year 2 jump, but I want to see him in real games against pro CBs first. More realistically I expect his first year to be bumpy but at a minimum he will be given lots of chances to produce.

[texaspackerbacker]

I meant of all the Packer receivers, but honestly it wouldn't surprise me if he outperformed all the WRs in the league.

[run pMc]

Yeah I meant of the Packer receivers, not the league... but ok. I like your optimism. Don't see it that way, but if you're going to aim high, aim high.

[RashanGary]

I watched the highlight reel and had initially thought he showed a lot of quickness and agility. But upon further review its more straight line explosiveness than it is short area quickness.

I dont think he has as much upside as a route runner as I initially thought.

He can run a go route. Hes fast. As a change up, off of that, he runs a good come back and looks coordinated back shouldering. He also looks explosive with the ball in his hands. I dont see him being a complete player, but he has one go-to quality (speed) and a couple change ups off of that. I dont see him sinking his hips and having those sudden breaks in his routes. Hes limited. But he can be a nice piece in a rotation and do a few things well.

He can do a few more things than MVS did (come backs, back shoulders, screens and jet sweeps.) If he masters his high upside areas, he can still end up a great pick who you can lean on for a few go-to routes.

[Jaire]

The sheer negativity, RG. smh

We don't draft a dude at 34 unless he's graded there. I don't think GB has changed its draft philosophy or ability. Pittsburg and GB are the best when it comes to WR: Pittsburg def got a Pittsburg receiver, GB a couple of GB receivers: the whole world is unhinged, but at least this has not changed.

But Doubs is the better route runner at this point.

We have our WRs of the future. These are in the same mold as what we've drafted the last 16 years.

[run pMc]

I think his height is going to make him struggle with certain things, and while I think his play speed is close to his track speed, I don't know that you can say the same for his agility. As a prospect he has tons of upside and at a minimum is a better MVS. From what I hear he can learn a playbook and wants to get better, so what he has between the ears seems promising for his career prospects as well. You gotta admit the prospect of running play-action with him matched up against a 5-11" CB on a go route seems advantageous for GB.

Give him time. He may never be Davante Adams deadly with his routes, but a defense will have to account for his size/speed, and he will get better.

[RashanGary]

James Jones had a few go-to routes. Jordy had a few go-to routes. Cobb was slot receiver who settled into zones well.

Davante and Jennings kind of did it all.

Its not going to stop Watson that he has a few go-to strengths. MLF and Rodgers will learn what Watson does well and put him in position for success.

The nice thing about Watsons strengths is that they work together. A go route and a stop route are a good mix (especially when Watson is so dynamic once the ball is in his hands on the come back.) A go route and a back shoulder are a good mix. Plus you can get the ball in his hands with screens and jet sweeps. Plus he blocks.

I have high hopes that theyll get the most out of Watsons strengths. Rodgers has fed the ball to different types over the years. Watson is just the latest weapon for 12 to learn how to feed.

[RashanGary]

Jordy was a big body. Once he got positioning, no one could fight him off his spot. He was unfazed by contact. He rarely operated with any degree of separation but was open anyway because of his size and body positioning was so strong. He did run a good out and up that was the one route that hed be wide open. Watson cant do what Jordy did.

Davante, Driver and Jennings could cut any direction and create separation. They were always open. Watson cant do that. Hes not a good route runner.

MVS had elite build up speed. Once he got going deep no one could catch him. Watson might be able to do that even though his build up speed isnt as good. His speed out of the gates is elite and his long speed is good.

What Watson does seem to do well is get yards with the ball in his hands. He can do that. He runs a good go route and can back shoulder and runs a good stop route. Hopefully its enough. 32 teams passed on him for a reason. James Jones was kind of limited and still had a good career.

[Jaire]

All good points, RG.

MVS has clocked at 22 mph. Watson at 23: he has another gear at times, and ELITE take off as you say. (He's also been reported at a 4.21.) Another difference is that Watson tracks the ball and catches better down field in stride. Speed kills. They will bring him along slowly. Another thing is that he has a much better work ethic as a rookie than MVS. So..... at the worst he's a better MVS in my opinion, with a lot more he can do. I think he has a decent floor for a speed guy.

Teams passed because he has a ways to go. LIS GB always takes "their guys" high in the second (see Jordy, Jennings, Cobb). Davante is an exception because that was the deepest class in like 20 years. We grabbed him where GB valued him, higher than other teams: and they like their developmental stars. Watson has the tools to be great, but will take a few years while I expect he'll get 600-800 yards in year one. I actually think Doubs is farther ahead in route running.

edit: oh, and he BLOCKS. That probably sent him up a round on MLF's personal board. ;)

[RashanGary]

The best comp for Watson is MVS. Tall, skinny, fast. Not good in traffic. Not good route runner.

Watson does a couple things MVS didnt do.

1. He can back shoulder
2. He runs a good stop route
3. Hes explosive with the ball in his hands


If MVS is a 700 yard receiver being mostly a one trick pony, Watson can be 1,000 yards and a couple trick pony.

Most of MVS big plays were deep posts where he got behind coverage. I could see Watson having those plays and a few others.

[RashanGary]

Watson can run

Go routes
Stop routes
Stop n go
Deep posts (like MVS)
Screens
Jet sweeps


He can do a few things more than MVS but hes more like MVS than any other recent Packer receiver in that hes straight line fast, but limited.

[HarveyWallbangers]

Ugh!

[King Friday]

Watson can run

Go routes
Stop routes
Stop n go
Deep posts (like MVS)
Screens
Jet sweeps


He can do a few things more than MVS but hes more like MVS than any other recent Packer receiver in that hes straight line fast, but limited.

RG...Watson never had the chance to truly run multiple routes during much of his college career. He played on a run first offense. He may very easily learn how to run routes at the next level and become a monster. To me, his ceiling is much higher than MVS because long speed was all MVS had. Didn't matter if he could learn to run other routes... He did not possess the size or short explosiveness to take advantage of them. That is not true of Watson. True, he may not reach his full potential, but if he does he will be much better than MVS.

[Upnorth]

To me Watson's floor (unless he is a complete bust) is mvs.
His ceiling on the other hand is higher than any of the other wr drafted this year besides Jamison Williams.

He is going to a perfect place for him as well. Has a hof qb throwing, a team that needs speed and a coach that uses players creatively. His backfield plays are fun and he is great with the ball in his hands, and our existing top 2 receivers are some of the best blocking wr in the league.

[RashanGary]

I challenge anyone to find one play where Watson creates separation with route running agility (either breaking in or breaking out.)

You cant because they dont exist.

The idea that Watson has all of this potential as a route runner is not accurate.

Hes a skinny, linear, 6-4. He has a good go route and a good stop route. Nothing else exists on his tape.

Hes also good with the ball in his hands.

But hes not a good route runner and doesnt show potential to be one.

MVS was a one trick pony. Watson has a couple tricks.

I see him maxing out at about 1,000 yards per season. A good notch better than MVS. But I dont see elite anything with Watson.

[HarveyWallbangers]

A 1000 yard WR would be pretty good. MVS never reached 700 yards.

[HarveyWallbangers]

Here you go RG. Almost every catch of Watson's college career in chronological order from his freshman year.


https://youtu.be/ltiBvs-14ZU

[Upnorth]

After watching that video I'm convinced trey lance was drafted to high.

Watson is an unrefined wr whose ceiling is incredibly high. Speed, burst, anyone else watch that video and think of jordy?

He moves faster than it looks like he's moving.

[call_me_ishmael]

I don't know too nany 6'4" people that can stop on a dime and are quick as a cat. We shall see what happens.

[Joemailman]

I actually think Watson's footwork looked pretty good on some of the short throws where he has to quickly turn upfield. You don't see him running a lot of patterns with a sharp break in or out, but that doesn't mean with some coaching that he can't do those things. When the Packers drafted A.J. Dillon, a lot of people said he wasn't a good receiver because he didn't catch many passes at Boston College. Turns out his pass receiving skills are just fine. Watson will never look like Greg Jennings running routes, but if he can develop a rapport with Rodgers and Love, he should be a dynamic player.

[George Cumby]

I watched a little over half of that and here's what I see:

Incredible body control and ability to adjust to the ball, fast, explosive, athletic, good hands, nifty quick feet.

The first catch was really impressive.

I think this kid will be fun to watch grow.

[RashanGary]

I counted 9 in breaking or out breaking routes in his college career. And half of them were long crossers where he didnt get separation on his break.

I see him similar to MVS but with a good come back route and good with the ball in his hands. So I think hell out perform MVS. He does a little more. He might be more consistent than MVS hauling in the long passes too.

But like MVS, hes limited in his route running. Not only does he not get separation with most of his routes, but he also doesnt body out defenders and make contested catches. That limits him from being a consistent 7 catch a game type player. Its more feast and famine with him unless they scheme him the ball a couple times per game.

We badly needed a deep threat. He brings a lot to the table in that regard. I see no reason he cant get 6 or 700 yards in year 1 like MVS did as a rookie. I see no reason he cant get a little better and be a 1,000 yard guy.

I dont think hell ever be a volume pass catcher. He just doesnt have the skillset.

[Tony Oday]

He will not have more than 40 catches for 500 yards at best.

Now I think in the future he will be a stud!

[Joemailman]

I counted 9 in breaking or out breaking routes in his college career. And half of them were long crossers where he didnt get separation on his break.

I see him similar to MVS but with a good come back route and good with the ball in his hands. So I think hell out perform MVS. He does a little more. He might be more consistent than MVS hauling in the long passes too.

But like MVS, hes limited in his route running. Not only does he not get separation with most of his routes, but he also doesnt body out defenders and make contested catches. That limits him from being a consistent 7 catch a game type player. Its more feast and famine with him unless they scheme him the ball a couple times per game.

We badly needed a deep threat. He brings a lot to the table in that regard. I see no reason he cant get 6 or 700 yards in year 1 like MVS did as a rookie. I see no reason he cant get a little better and be a 1,000 yard guy.

I dont think hell ever be a volume pass catcher. He just doesnt have the skillset.You may be right that he won't be a high volume catcher, if by that you bean 100+ receptions. Guys like Watson with a high yards per catch don't catch that many passes. Of the top YPC guys in the NFL last year, none were close to 100 catches. You can be elite without 100 catches. Did you watch Deebo Samuel or Ja'Marr Chase last year?

[HarveyWallbangers]

Mike Evans is a Hall of Famer in my book. He’s only caught more than 74 balls twice.
DeSean Jackson has only caught more than 62 balls once.

Yet I would take them over Jarvis Landry and his 100 catches and 998 yards.

You can affect the game greatly if you have 60 catches at 15+ yards/catch.

[RashanGary]

MVS affected the game greatly with 35 catches per season as a literal one trick pony.

Watson has a couple tricks. His stop route is money and he turns it up field like a beast. His go route is money.

And I think you scheme him the ball once or twice a game on screens and end arounds.

Plus he blocks.

Ive seen him look pretty good back shouldering too. Thats a really nice piece to go with a go route.

Just being a legit deep threat makes him valuable and I think hes more than that.

I just dont think hes a #1.

If he pans out the way I think he might, everyone will be happy with the pick.

[RashanGary]

Tall guys have more to overcome as route runners because theyre not as sudden. Usually they use their size to box out. Occasionally you see a tall skinny guy make it. But its rare.

I dont think Watson is a raw route runner. I think hes limited because of the high center of gravity and lack of big body to make up for it.

But just like Rashan Gary willed himself into being a 10 sack a year guy, Watson could will himself into being a well rounded player.


MVS-like production is his floor. #3 WR.

And I guess Ill say he has a high ceiling despite being limited as a route runner because will power and work ethic can make up for physical limitation. I just see a vertical sort of #2 WR as his ceiling. But he sure could prove me wrong on that and round out his game.

[RashanGary]

NFL receiver rooms dont look like basketball teams. Taller isnt an advantage.

Three guys have been over 6-4 and under 215 pounds and really made it. Keyshon Johnson, Randy Moss and AJ Green.

So Watson will be a rarity if he becomes a legit #1 WR.

He has to overcome being taller (less agile) and small bodied (less able to box out.)

Theres no saying he cant be a #1, but I doubt he will be.

He has route running limitations and box out limitations too. Hes gonna have to work at it.

[RashanGary]

Of all the tall skinny guys who have ever played, hes different than all of them. Its hard to find a comp.

Deep threat like MVS but better with the ball in his hands than any of the guys that came before him.

If he makes it, hes going to be a unique player. I cant think of anyone with his height and weight with a similar skill set, especially the YAC.

[RashanGary]

I went through the top 150 all time players. Careers like Robert Woods, Randall Cobb and Amari Cooper. There are 5 tall skinny guys

Randy Moss
AJ Green
Herman Moore
Keyshon Johnson
Ed McCaffrey

Being tall (limits ability to create separation) and skinny (limits ability to box out) is not a good combo to be an NFL receiver.

But Watson looks to be able to get deep and run that stop route (and turn it up field) and get screens and jet sweeps.

He might end up being a good #2 or maybe he grinds and works his way to being a rare tall skinny #1.

[Joemailman]

RG, sure getting everybody worked up over at FF. :p

[HarveyWallbangers]

He's obsessed about Watson. I think it's because I told him that Watson was a perfect fit for the Packers. He's shitting on the other guy I liked and said would be a perfect fit for the Packers on FF too, Zach Tom. I think he was drunk when he posted that and didn't realize he was on FF and not Packer Rats.

Did you watch the Senior Bowl 1 on 1s with Watson and Doubs? Tell me what you think about the potential of each to beat press coverage.

[texaspackerbacker]

I went through the top 150 all time players. Careers like Robert Woods, Randall Cobb and Amari Cooper. There are 5 tall skinny guys

Randy Moss
AJ Green
Herman Moore
Keyshon Johnson
Ed McCaffrey

Being tall (limits ability to create separation) and skinny (limits ability to box out) is not a good combo to be an NFL receiver.

But Watson looks to be able to get deep and run that stop route (and turn it up field) and get screens and jet sweeps.

He might end up being a good #2 or maybe he grinds and works his way to being a rare tall skinny #1.


I'd hardly call Watson skinny. Also, why isn't Calvin Johnson on your list? Harold Carmichael? probably a lot of others. Megatron would seem to be the most obvious to compare to Watson. Having Rodgers throwing to him and not having any other obvious more likely target is gonna propel Watson to extreme stats sooner rather than later.

[HarveyWallbangers]

Since 2014 there has been one player/year on average that has been 6'4"+ and 215 or smaller. It's a dumb argument. None of them ran close to the 40yd or 10yd time that Watson did. Martavis Bryant (who was a great talent but had a 10 cent head--which is why he went in the 4th round) was closest at 4.42 (with a 1.57 split).

[Jaire]

Mike Evans is a Hall of Famer in my book. He’s only caught more than 74 balls twice.
DeSean Jackson has only caught more than 62 balls once.

Yet I would take them over Jarvis Landry and his 100 catches and 998 yards.

You can affect the game greatly if you have 60 catches at 15+ yards/catch.

Indeed.

Julio Jones & Sammy Watkins were both possession / no YAC receivers last year, a lot like Landry has always been. Tonyan, Cobb, Watkins, Lazard, and Jones / Dillon are the reliable guys.

The three draft picks can all be dangerous, take off the top types, explosive plays. You don't need much from them. It's MLF's time to shine: he's just gotta scheme them and Rodgers stay within the plan.

But these three picks are the best since Adams. They are all in the "mold" we like. Tae gave his thumbs up to Watson; James Jones likes all three. They have the mind set it takes (which MVS did not acquire until in his third year, per Rodgers). All three are farther along than MVS who got 600 in his rookie year. In the short term: some bumps. But I like all three, esp Doubs and Watson.

[bobblehead]

I counted 9 in breaking or out breaking routes in his college career. And half of them were long crossers where he didnt get separation on his break.

I see him similar to MVS but with a good come back route and good with the ball in his hands. So I think hell out perform MVS. He does a little more. He might be more consistent than MVS hauling in the long passes too.

But like MVS, hes limited in his route running. Not only does he not get separation with most of his routes, but he also doesnt body out defenders and make contested catches. That limits him from being a consistent 7 catch a game type player. Its more feast and famine with him unless they scheme him the ball a couple times per game.

We badly needed a deep threat. He brings a lot to the table in that regard. I see no reason he cant get 6 or 700 yards in year 1 like MVS did as a rookie. I see no reason he cant get a little better and be a 1,000 yard guy.

I dont think hell ever be a volume pass catcher. He just doesnt have the skillset.

Route running refinement can be taught. And we schemed Adams the ball 2x a game and he did nothing with it, so I see that as an upgrade. MVS improved his route tree every season. I think we got a poor mans Julio and a Rich mans MVS. That could shape out to be a very good WR.

[bobblehead]

I went through the top 150 all time players. Careers like Robert Woods, Randall Cobb and Amari Cooper. There are 5 tall skinny guys

Randy Moss
AJ Green
Herman Moore
Keyshon Johnson
Ed McCaffrey

Being tall (limits ability to create separation) and skinny (limits ability to box out) is not a good combo to be an NFL receiver.

But Watson looks to be able to get deep and run that stop route (and turn it up field) and get screens and jet sweeps.

He might end up being a good #2 or maybe he grinds and works his way to being a rare tall skinny #1.

A skinny 22 year old is different than a skinny 25 year old. By age 25 Watson could go 225. A couple real off seasons with NFL trainers makes a lot of difference. However, the packers have drafted in a way that gives me serious hope. When you have a really strong run game you need to be able to take the top off. Think 80s Raiders. We have the best QB ever at throwing the deep ball. If we run the offense the way its meant to be run, we have the horses necessary. 2 years ago Tennessee opened each playoff game with a bomb completed in the first few plays. Thats who we want to be.

[bobblehead]

I'd hardly call Watson skinny. Also, why isn't Calvin Johnson on your list? Harold Carmichael? probably a lot of others. Megatron would seem to be the most obvious to compare to Watson. Having Rodgers throwing to him and not having any other obvious more likely target is gonna propel Watson to extreme stats sooner rather than later.

CJ was a rock solid 235...He was shannon sharp with a 4.4 40. Skinny isn't the word I think of.

[run pMc]

A skinny 22 year old is different than a skinny 25 year old.

He turned 23 yesterday.
For the record I agree his floor is MVS; I think he can do all the things MVS -- which KC proved has value -- and potential to do more with better agility and rookie season route running skills. Don't think MVS was ever a KR either, you don't put slouches back there to do that. I think his ceiling is probably something like DK Metcalf, I'm not sold on him approaching Julio or Moss although the kid supposedly is a hard worker.

[texaspackerbacker]

I don't know how all the Watson stuff ends up in the Doubs thread hahahaha, but I will copy my post from there in here too:

Yeah, all those guys will get a few more targets than they got when Adams was there, and yeah, likely none of them individually will match Adams, maybe not even any two. However, CLEARLY - IMO - Watson will get targeted the most and will get the most receptions. Why? Because nobody else except him will be worthy of the most targets. Whether he plus the second place guy - Watkins, Lazard, or whoever surpass Adams, not so clear, but regardless, the team will be fine, and Watson will be great even as a rookie.

And I say again, Watson will have a better year with Rodgers throwing to him than Adams will have with Carr throwing to him. Mark it down as a prediction.

[run pMc]

I don't understand this:

none of them individually will match Adams
AND

Watson will have a better year with Rodgers throwing to him than Adams will have with Carr throwing to him

Do you mean the Packers will do better than the Raiders? Because if Watson can't match Adams, how would he have a better year? Can you explain what you mean?

[texaspackerbacker]

I meant Watson alone and maybe even he and whoever is second together likely won't match Adams' total last year.

As for the other, for about the third time now, I'm saying Rodgers to Watson will outdo Carr to Adams.

[HarveyWallbangers]

Jordy didn’t have a lot of sharp cutting on his college highlights.


https://youtu.be/XMdxvNl4Dbo

[HarveyWallbangers]

Breakdown of what Watson will bring to the Packers scheme


https://youtu.be/Z9355rCy5Tg

[RashanGary]

[QUOTE=HarveyWallbangers;1116300]Jordy didn

[RashanGary]

Breakdown of what Watson will bring to the Packers scheme


https://youtu.be/Z9355rCy5Tg

There are two big qualities that help guys get bulk targets. 1. Creates separation on breaks. 2. Big body to box out and then hes always open. Jordy was a big body who was unfazed by contact.

I dont think Watson does either, but hes probably the 3rd type that you love to have. Hes a vertical threat and has a go to underneath route (the come back route.) Hes also really good with the ball in
his hands. He has strengths.

Hes going to be an explosive piece. Almost every one of McGinns scouts thought hed be a player. One guy didnt like him.

[RashanGary]

Im on board with him being a good piece. Hes a unique athlete, but I dont buy the super hype that hes some generational talent and the best receiver in the draft. I just think some of the hype goes too far.

[bobblehead]

Im on board with him being a good piece. Hes a unique athlete, but I dont buy the super hype that hes some generational talent and the best receiver in the draft. I just think some of the hype goes too far.

I feel that way about every prospect. You can never guarantee how guys are going to turn out. But I don't have any reason to doubt Watson anymore than I have reason to doubt. Drake London

[RashanGary]

I feel that way about every prospect. You can never guarantee how guys are going to turn out. But I don't have any reason to doubt Watson anymore than I have reason to doubt. Drake London

Yeah, I have questions about all of the guys from this draft. Garrett Wilson, Olave, Williams and Dotson all have size questions. Drake London is a possession type who thrives in tight quarters and has a speed question. Burks has a speed question and whether he really understands the game question. Watson doesnt really use his size well boxing out and doesnt win on his breaks.

I dont think any of them are slam dunks and all of them do enough different things well that you picture them contributing.

We got a vertical weapon with some underneath ability in the second round. We probably got the best deal.

And like has been said, Watson fits what we do with the run game and vertical ability.

[RashanGary]

Watson is MVS with a comeback route and better YAC.

If MVS was a 700 yard guy, Watson might be 1,000.

I thought Watson showed potential for a back shoulder too. If he masters that, he might be a vertical #1 WR.

[Fritz]

I like the Toure kid, the seventh rounder. I think he'll develop and by mid-year-three be the real deal.

[Bretsky]

Watson has had his share of drops according the the mediaheads watching TC; not over the top excesssive but enough

Romeo has been more consistent there and appears more developed but Watson has the upside.

And whispers....Jordan Love has looked ok

[RashanGary]

I watched a little bit of the QBs when I went to practice. Love looked clearly more athletic than Rodgers. Was accurate on all but one throw.

But it all changes with a pass rush and disguised defenses.

I doubt Love will be good but theres still an outside chance.

[HarveyWallbangers]

Watson has had his share of drops according the the mediaheads watching TC; not over the top excesssive but enough

Romeo has been more consistent there and appears more developed but Watson has the upside.

And whispers....Jordan Love has looked ok

In OTAs this was true. No drops for Watson in minicamp, but Doubs had some drops. Normal rookie stuff.

[Upnorth]

In OTAs this was true. No drops for Watson in minicamp, but Doubs had some drops. Normal rookie stuff.

Best part of offseason is making shit up and then fighting about it. Packers gave us a lot of joy this offseason with this draft class.

Watson has incredible potential. I have been drinking homer juice on him more and more. By the start of training camp I could see myself saying he will break rookie td record.

[HarveyWallbangers]

https://packerswire.usatoday.com/2022/06/22/packers-rookie-christian-watson-enjoyed-real-solid-spring/

[Bretsky]

Best part of offseason is making shit up and then fighting about it. Packers gave us a lot of joy this offseason with this draft class.

Watson has incredible potential. I have been drinking homer juice on him more and more. By the start of training camp I could see myself saying he will break rookie td record.


EARLY ON I even heard some severe fluffy's about Amari Rodgers......BUT now reality has set in.

Whispers that Rodgers doesn't deserve a roster spot are leaking. NOW......Watson, and Romeo, and even the 7th rounder...............have been flashing really good at practices

[Joemailman]

EARLY ON I even heard some severe fluffy's about Amari Rodgers......BUT now reality has set in.

Whispers that Rodgers doesn't deserve a roster spot are leaking. NOW......Watson, and Romeo, and even the 7th rounder...............have been flashing really good at practices

https://monophy.com/media/pO7JLm4jQoaPL2jPOZ/monophy.gif

[HarveyWallbangers]

I’ve actually heard good things about Amari this camp. He’ll probably be taking Cobb’s snaps by the end of the year.

[Joemailman]

He did have a very good day at one of the minicamp practices. At any rate, with Watkins, Cobb and Lazard all unrestricted free agents after this year, there's almost no way he doesn't make the team.

GREEN BAY – Amari Rodgers had a good practice on Day 2 of the Green Bay Packers’ minicamp.

The second-year receiver caught a 15-yard pass over the middle from Aaron Rodgers with cornerback Rasul Douglas draped all over him to convert a third-and-10 during a 2-minute drill.

Later in that drive, he made a fingertip catch on a wheel route that Rodgers overthrew on second down.

And he made an impressive one-handed grab in the end zone that drew “oohs” from teammates during a drill in which the ball is purposely thrown behind the receiver.

[George Cumby]

I’ve actually heard good things about Amari this camp. He’ll probably be taking Cobb’s snaps by the end of the year.

Please, God.

[Upnorth]

He did have a very good day at one of the minicamp practices. At any rate, with Watkins, Cobb and Lazard all unrestricted free agents after this year, there's almost no way he doesn't make the team.

There you go. Our Adams replacement...

[RashanGary]

Christian Watson 50% bust
Doubs 65% bust
Amari Rodgers 80% bust
Toure 90% bust

Well be lucky if we get one player out of this group of misfits.

I feel a lot better about the OL we took the last few years. Runyan, Newman, Rhyan, Tom. I like their chances.

[Jaire]

Christian Watson 50% bust
Doubs 65% bust
Amari Rodgers 80% bust
Toure 90% bust

Well be lucky if we get one player out of this group of misfits.

I feel a lot better about the OL we took the last few years. Runyan, Newman, Rhyan, Tom. I like their chances.

wow

rg went from negative nellie to od'ing on blackpills

[Joemailman]

RG is just in troll mode right now.
https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQldh7MnhpIdvxanUWxU4E0cdRwsEr6U G-g4cJN5E9OCOY2Ke8S0PLEX6XMIpiKoaSL3_8&usqp=CAU

[RashanGary]

I’m glad to be wrong about Watson. I had my doubts, but his upside looks unquestionable now. He creates separation! He’s a worker! He brings contagious energy! He blocks! He’s a legit deep threat.

Definitely more dangerous than MVS on the crossers and horizontal stuff. Wins deep.

I’m optimistic! Harvey was right!

Gonna be some frustrating drops. But he’s a playmaker.

[RashanGary]

Doubs looks like a player too. 2 of 2 on those two picks will be huge for Rodgers twilight.

[Anti-Polar Bear]

I’m glad to be wrong about Watson. I had my doubts, but his upside looks unquestionable now. He creates separation! He’s a worker! He brings contagious energy! He blocks! He’s a legit deep threat.

Definitely more dangerous than MVS on the crossers and horizontal stuff. Wins deep.

I’m optimistic! Harvey was right!

Gonna be some frustrating drops. But he’s a playmaker.

He ain’t the bomb if he ain’t on the field. Watson is soft and fragile.

[red]

what did watsons first two drops of the game look like?

the first long TD pass he had kinda looked like he had problems finding it again. it was a high lob and he actually caught it with his inner elbows.

then on the third TD, it was a dart right to him, and he tracked it and caught it perfectly

any chance his problems come from the high lobs that rodgers throws. losing in the lights or sun or domes are just not knowing how to turn his head right?

its hard to catch a fly ball if you haven't played baseball in awhile or have never done it before. same with fielding a punt.

maybe he just needs some time adjusting to rodgers flight trajectory

[bobblehead]

Oooof....the Amari Rodgers stuff from June is painful to read. I hadn't scrolled back far enough to see anything to shame myself, but I own him in a dynasty league, so comments weren't necessary.

[bobblehead]

Watkins is a poor man's devonte, but that's kind of an insult to poor people. He's more like a flat broke. No checkbook, shot credit eating out of a garbage can devonte. That production is going to have to be made up for through every single guy on the offense.

Sometimes I amuse myself...but I defy anyone to tell me I was wrong.

[Joemailman]

Sometimes I amuse myself...but I defy anyone to tell me I was wrong.

I thought he looked decent before his injury this year. Since he came back he looks like he's either not 100%, or he's afraid to run all out for fear of injuring the hamstring again. Which is exactly what happened to him last year. Got hurt and hardly had any catches after he came back from the injury. His snap count is going down (22/36% last night), so maybe we'll see Toure more.

[call_me_ishmael]

I think Sammy Watkins should have been cut in camp. He looks like ass, is not a long term player, and shouldn't play anymore this year if they're tanking. For a #3 overall pick, what a bust of a career.

[Jaire]

Watson (to change the subject) is flashing what he can do. The three rooks have a bright future. I do hope AR finishes his contract. If they get some more OL help next draft, the offense can flourish again. Just a rough year, as was predicted. Not a great plan: crossing their fingers and hoping it would work out.

They need time, but the rooks are very dedicated and will develop faster than most, barring injuries.

The near term future is bright. Get a new DC and they can be competitive the next two years, esp with a little help on the line.

[bobblehead]

I think Sammy Watkins should have been cut in camp. He looks like ass, is not a long term player, and shouldn't play anymore this year if they're tanking. For a #3 overall pick, what a bust of a career.

Oh, if we are tanking he needs to see every snap.

[bobblehead]

Watson (to change the subject) is flashing what he can do. The three rooks have a bright future. I do hope AR finishes his contract. If they get some more OL help next draft, the offense can flourish again. Just a rough year, as was predicted. Not a great plan: crossing their fingers and hoping it would work out.

They need time, but the rooks are very dedicated and will develop faster than most, barring injuries.

The near term future is bright. Get a new DC and they can be competitive the next two years, esp with a little help on the line.

I am 100% convinced the horses up front are on the roster. They just need to play together and be consistent. Jenkins probably needs the off season to get right. Bak has FINALLY strung together some nice starts. Tom is going to be a stud.

[run pMc]

They have the pieces on the OL if they can stay healthy. Contracts could be an issue. I like Tom. I expect 2 out of Njiman, Bahk, and Jenkins are gone this offseason because they can't keep them all.

As for the WRs - Watkins looked better pre-injury. He's had a few moments but overall agree he looks slow or hurt. He's done.
Two good consecutive games for Watson is a very good sign. I think Watson, Doubs, and Toure could make for a good group if they continue to develop. They need more help at receiver though.

[Joemailman]

Oh, if we are tanking he needs to see every snap.

:razz: I thought the same thing. If we're tanking, bench Christian Watson!

[HarveyWallbangers]

This offseason is going to be wild and crazy, but Watson and Doubs give some hope for the next few years at WR. I have no idea who the Packers will be able to afford to keep, but this team still has a lot of talent. Just a year where everything that could go wrong, went wrong. Replace Barry, find a way to keep the OL together, resign Aaron Jones, and who knows for next year.


Next Gen Stats
@NextGenStats

Christian Watson reached a top speed of 20.97 mph on his 63-yard TD reception, the fastest speed by a Packers' ball carrier this season.

Watson has reached 20+ mph on 12 plays from scrimmage this season, trailing only Tyreek Hill (18).


Ross Uglem
@RossUglem

Tyreek Hill snaps: 491
Christian Watson snaps: 224

[bobblehead]

They have the pieces on the OL if they can stay healthy. Contracts could be an issue. I like Tom. I expect 2 out of Njiman, Bahk, and Jenkins are gone this offseason because they can't keep them all.

As for the WRs - Watkins looked better pre-injury. He's had a few moments but overall agree he looks slow or hurt. He's done.
Two good consecutive games for Watson is a very good sign. I think Watson, Doubs, and Toure could make for a good group if they continue to develop. They need more help at receiver though.

I'm not so convinced that 2 of them are gone. My best guess if ARod retires/goes then Bak would be traded as the senior citizen of the group. You don't allow good players in their prime to get away if you expect to win games.

[bobblehead]

:razz: I thought the same thing. If we're tanking, bench Christian Watson!

LOL, looking to be true, but he has to play...specifically I want Love/Watson/Doubs out there building chemistry. If the punishment is we win games and draft lower so be it.

[bobblehead]

This offseason is going to be wild and crazy, but Watson and Doubs give some hope for the next few years at WR. I have no idea who the Packers will be able to afford to keep, but this team still has a lot of talent. Just a year where everything that could go wrong, went wrong. Replace Barry, find a way to keep the OL together, resign Aaron Jones, and who knows for next year.

Sadly I lose the quotes in quotes, but the conclusion is "faster than Tyreek Hill and 8" taller" Thats a pretty good place to be.

[Joemailman]

Watson on that catch/run reminded me of James Lofton's 83 yard TD run against the Giants in 1982. Ran past everybody and didn't even look like he was running hard.

[texaspackerbacker]

Nobody in here praised Watson more than I did. I said and still say he is gonna be GREAT - as good or better than any WR picked by anybody in the past few years, Chase, Jefferson, whoever. I wasn't as positive about Doubs, but I am now. He should be an excellent #2 WR behind Watson. And I want to see Aaron Rodgers throwing to them for several more years.

[Anti-Polar Bear]

Watson on that catch/run reminded me of James Lofton's 83 yard TD run against the Giants in 1982. Ran past everybody and didn't even look like he was running hard.

Meh.

I saw rookie Greg Jennings catch a slant from Bert Favor and took it to the house to beat the San Diego Bolts.

[run pMc]

Meh.

I saw rookie Greg Jennings catch a slant from Bert Favor and took it to the house to beat the San Diego Bolts.

I'm surprised you're not all-in with Watson, given your feelings about Metcalf.

[RashanGary]

This offseason is going to be wild and crazy, but Watson and Doubs give some hope for the next few years at WR. I have no idea who the Packers will be able to afford to keep, but this team still has a lot of talent. Just a year where everything that could go wrong, went wrong. Replace Barry, find a way to keep the OL together, resign Aaron Jones, and who knows for next year.

Mf runs like a deer! He’s gonna have some drops but he’s gonna make some plays. Those crossers are gonna work. He erases angles

[Joemailman]

He ain’t the bomb if he ain’t on the field. Watson is soft and fragile.

Sign here please.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FixOYRjWAAM8L6D?format=jpg&name=small

[George Cumby]

^ Hahahahahahahahaha

[Anti-Polar Bear]

I'm surprised you're not all-in with Watson, given your feelings about Metcalf.

Metcalf got his knee chopped off; was back the next week. The guy is Bert Favor tough.

Someone touches Watson’s helmet and he’s out of the game for “precautionary” reasons. I dislike soft and fragile players, aka, milksops.

There’s 5 games left. The over/under on how many games Watson will play is 3.5. I took the under.

[NewsBruin]

The trio of hamstring muscles do a lot and have to compete against the stronger quad and glute muscles. From a complete nonprofessional, for-a-brief-flash-in-my-thirties athlete, hamstring injuries happen when someone goes too hard too fast without ramping up to the effort. I assume veterans get them a lot because they need to warm up before being suddenly explosive. I assume young guys get them because they've slacked in the offseason and are trying to catch up to camp shape or they're juicing too hard and their connective tissue can't handle the muscle it's attached to. Either way, I always have negative opinions about young dudes with hamstring injuries.

I'm glad they let Watson sit until his hamstrings were healed. If he comes back too early, he'll need surgery and might permanently lose speed and quickness.

[texaspackerbacker]

Metcalf got his knee chopped off; was back the next week. The guy is Bert Favor tough.

Someone touches Watson’s helmet and he’s out of the game for “precautionary” reasons. I dislike soft and fragile players, aka, milksops.

There’s 5 games left. The over/under on how many games Watson will play is 3.5. I took the under.

You can't blame the player - Watson or anybody else - for that stupid “precautionary” concussion shit. They get their helmet taking away and aren't allowed to go back in. Last week, Watson took a helmet to helmet hit, and it was the other guy who went out with a concussion. Nothing against Metcalf - I generally agree with you about him, but Watson, I say again, is gonna be as good or better than him or anybody else drafted in recent history. Like run pMc said, you ought to be all in for Watson as a similar player to Metcalf.

[George Cumby]

"stupid “precautionary” concussion shit. "

Well, you are an SME in stupid and shit.

[texaspackerbacker]

Didn't we have a whole thread about that stupid concussion shit? I don't mind going over it all again hahahaha. It's the same kind of dumbassery that is prevalent in a lot of other venues that are unmentionable here. For the money those guys are paid, they ought to be exposed to risks. For every Jim McMahon or Lyle Alzado - both of which likely were what they were from drugs more than head shots, there are probably a hundred Aikmans or Steve Youngs or Favres who survived a bunch of concussions and came out just fine.

[George Cumby]

"who survived a bunch of concussions and came out just fine."

LOL.

[texaspackerbacker]

As I said, Aikman, Steve Young, Favre, and others too numerous to mention? Who didn't - that was not tainted by drug use, PEDs, etc.? Very damn few if any.

I literally always answer questions. How about you do the same. You might even be able to dig up one or two weird exceptions.

[George Cumby]

Favre, who was never smart, can barely string together a coherent sentence.

The last time I heard Steve Young on the radio he, very obviously, has suffered cognitive decline.

But you're just a walking, talking Confirmation Bias; you see and hear only what you want to and are impervious to facts, reason and understanding. Any of your epically wrong posts on what happens on the football field are proof positive of this.

[texaspackerbacker]

hahahahaha Favre seems pretty normal. I saw Young on pregame shows, etc. years after he retired, and he seemed fine. You might be right about more recently, but given your perspective on things, I tend to doubt it. And I guess you're punting on answering about anybody else or very many others. Wise thing to do when you're wrong.

Edit: when I Googled Steve Young, the first thing that showed up was that he had some sort of mental disorder since childhood. The second thing that showed up was that he was coherent enough to intelligently discuss both that and the concussion thing from playing. He apparently still is an active NFL analyst.

[run pMc]

I don't have a problem with them taking Watson out, he just came back from a concussion. You become more susceptible to them, the more you get (and more recent/frequent they are). I'd rather they sit him for a game to protect his future career.

Football is a brutal meatgrinder sport. While some players can recover just fine, there are plenty of others who haven't, and I don't just mean Dave Duerson, Junior Seau and Mike Webster. Aikman and Young retired because of the concussions they suffered -- they didn't want their heads to be full of scrambled eggs. Emmitt Smith can barely talk. Sam Shields wishes he never played football. It's actually a longer list than you might think.

I've known plenty of non-pro athletes who have gotten concussions, and there is no way any of them would be allowed by their doctors to go back and play contact sports with a week's recovery. Some of them had long lasting effects from them. It's no joke.

[George Cumby]

And I guess you're punting on answering about anybody else or very many others. Wise thing to do when you're wrong.
.

I'm not punting, I'm just not wasting more time than I already have on an internet argument with a willfully ignorant fuckwit who ignores evidence, facts, reason and science.

And again, you would be the SME on being wrong.

[Joemailman]

Pardon the interruption but...

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Fi5TtT0XoAc2uyP?format=jpg&name=small

[Fosco33]

"who survived a bunch of concussions and came out just fine."

LOL.

Seau, Jovan Belcher, Aaron Hernandez…

There are sooo many it’s hard to even recall without help from internet searches. Blaming drugs for cte… ������*♂️

[run pMc]

Offensive Rookie of the Month - nice.
Watson is one of the bright spots as we watch the season slide away. I'd actually love to see them play all 3 rookie WRs together to see what they have.
Watson/Doubs could be foundational players on offense.