Official Free Agency/Offseason Thread

[Joemailman]

The following Packers had their contracts voided yesterday and will presumably be free agents:

Adrian Amos, Dean Lowry, Jarran Reed, Randall Cobb, Mercedes Lewis, Mason Crosby, Robert Tonyan.

Key offseason dates:

February 21-March 7 - Window for applying franchise or transition tags.

February 28-March 6 - NFL Combine

March 13-15 - Legal negotiating period for free agents.

March 15 - New league year begins at 3:00 PM at which point free agent signing can begin.

March 26-29 - NFL Owners Meetings

April 27-29 - NFL Draft

[RashanGary]

You see that Tex? 16M in dead money from previous seasons. Now we can do it again and clear 16, but we’re still 16 in hole. Keeping Rodgers another year makes for an even worse situation on dead cap. He’s going to be traded.

[Fritz]

Which of those guys, if any would people like to see come back? Regardless of Rodgers's preferences.

I think Lewis is a great locker room guy and teacher and he can still block. If he's willing to come back at a low price, I say good. Tonyan I'd like to see back, too, on a one-year "prove it" contract, if that's possible. I like Mason Crosby, but I think he's lost too much leg strength. Jarran Reed could be useful, but not for much money and not if you draft some young bucks that need to play. I like Adrian Amos but I wonder if he's fallen off the age cliff. He seemed just a half-step slow last season. Randall Cobb and Dean Lowry both seem like decent human beings, but I think neither helps enough to warrant a roster spot.

[call_me_ishmael]

Amos is a thinker. He was such a good addition for the team for years. It does make you wonder if with changing life situations, etc the grind can become too much. I see a guy like JJ Watt say they just don't want to do the off-season again, that it's just too much work and they want to spend their time on other stuff like family, etc.

It does make you wonder how many hours these dudes are putting in.

[call_me_ishmael]

You see that Tex? 16M in dead money from previous seasons. Now we can do it again and clear 16, but we’re still 16 in hole. Keeping Rodgers another year makes for an even worse situation on dead cap. He’s going to be traded.

I don't think the two things are related. Pretty much any team that has been good for several years now is in cap hell. Shit happens. That's what happens when good players need to get paid. Packers are very top heavy - highest paid player at most of their good positions and they just lost the highest paid WR.

[texaspackerbacker]

You see that Tex? 16M in dead money from previous seasons. Now we can do it again and clear 16, but we’re still 16 in hole. Keeping Rodgers another year makes for an even worse situation on dead cap. He’s going to be traded.

Actually, no, I didn't see anything about 16M in dead money. It might be that, but it wasn't in Joe's post above.

As for the list, I'm surprised Amos is on it. I think/hope they still find a way to keep him. Ditto that for Tonyan. As for the rest, either they are old and probably not going anyplace anyway (Lewis and maybe Cobb) or old and probably retiring (Crosby - as I said, I wish they'd keep him as an assistant coach or PS guy in case whoever our new Kicker is gets hurt or in a slump). Lowry I really want to be gone, and Reed isn't much better.

[Fritz]

Amos is a thinker. He was such a good addition for the team for years. It does make you wonder if with changing life situations, etc the grind can become too much. I see a guy like JJ Watt say they just don't want to do the off-season again, that it's just too much work and they want to spend their time on other stuff like family, etc.

It does make you wonder how many hours these dudes are putting in.

These guys are the elite of the elite. They were the best players ever at their high schools, and probably some of the best athletes ever at their colleges. So I can only imagine that to compete at this high a level would require more training, and more intense training, than we mortals can really comprehend. So I do wonder if you can only do that for so long before it just becomes too much. I like Amos, too. I think he played well up until this past year. But maybe it's all just too much to keep doing, or maybe he's lost a half-step. I don't know. But the guy was a good addition to this team.

[Joemailman]

I hope they keep Tonyan and Reed. Don't care much about the rest. Yes, they did write off 16M in dead cap. Not good, but 5 teams are worse.

[run pMc]

The following Packers had their contracts voided yesterday and will presumably be free agents:

Adrian Amos, Dean Lowry, Jarran Reed, Randall Cobb, Mercedes Lewis, Mason Crosby, Robert Tonyan.

I might be misreading this, but they are all free agents. Their expiring contracts had void years on them, so they are no longer on the team but still count against the cap for the amount of money pushed into those void years. It's basically dead cap space. It's also how Kevin King counted against the cap this year even though he was a free agent.

I would resign none of them if Rodgers isn't playing for GB. Several still were in GB because of Rodgers, if he's not here they might go elsewhere with him.
I would make low offers to Lewis and Tonyan if he is. Maybe Cobb, but only because they need a cheap vet or two in the WR room. No to Crosby - love the guy but he doesn't have the leg anymore for touchbacks. Reed was so-so, Lowry and Amos had bad years and look done. These are all aging players with no upside and most showed clear declines in their play. There is no sane reason to sign an aging player in decline to anything more than a one year deal, and some of these guys will look elsewhere for longer/better contracts.

[bobblehead]

I might consider bringing Reed back if he is still cheap. He can disrupt games when he is motivated. I wouldn't break the bank for him by any means though. The rest can walk.....especially if it gets Rodgers to agree to a trade.

[Joemailman]

I might be misreading this, but they are all free agents. Their expiring contracts had void years on them, so they are no longer on the team but still count against the cap for the amount of money pushed into those void years. It's basically dead cap space. It's also how Kevin King counted against the cap this year even though he was a free agent.

I would resign none of them if Rodgers isn't playing for GB. Several still were in GB because of Rodgers, if he's not here they might go elsewhere with him.
I would make low offers to Lewis and Tonyan if he is. Maybe Cobb, but only because they need a cheap vet or two in the WR room. No to Crosby - love the guy but he doesn't have the leg anymore for touchbacks. Reed was so-so, Lowry and Amos had bad years and look done. These are all aging players with no upside and most showed clear declines in their play. There is no sane reason to sign an aging player in decline to anything more than a one year deal, and some of these guys will look elsewhere for longer/better contracts.

They are all free agents. Packers had until yesterday to sign them to extensions.

Full list of Packers unrestricted free agents is:

Adrian Amos, Randall Cobb, Dean Lowry, Mason Crosby, Allen Lazard, Robert Tonyan, Jarran Reed, Marcedes Lewis, Dallin Leavitt, Jonathan Ford, Eric Wilson, Keisean Nixon, and Justin Hollins.

Restricted free agents are Tyler Davis, Krys Barnes and Yosh Nijman.

[red]

Bring reed back

Everyone keeps saying we need to draft more guys for the d-line. Well, here’s a guy that isn’t too bad and shouldn’t cost a ton of money

The rest can go. I don’t want to hear about “locker room leaders”, when we looked as shitty as we did last year. The leadership in this team didn’t do much in that Detroit game to get the rest of the team fired up, or being smart

[Fritz]

I'm curious: how is a guy finishing his rookie year (Jonathan Ford) an unrestricted free agent after one year of being on the roster but never playing?

[Joemailman]

I'm curious: how is a guy finishing his rookie year (Jonathan Ford) an unrestricted free agent after one year of being on the roster but never playing?

That should have been Rudy Ford.

[Fritz]

That should have been Rudy Ford.

Oh. I thought maybe they just wanted Jonathan Ford to go away.

[RashanGary]

Bring reed back

Everyone keeps saying we need to draft more guys for the d-line. Well, here’s a guy that isn’t too bad and shouldn’t cost a ton of money

The rest can go. I don’t want to hear about “locker room leaders”, when we looked as shitty as we did last year. The leadership in this team didn’t do much in that Detroit game to get the rest of the team fired up, or being smart

For sure. I’m growing tired of Rodgers always rambling on about the older guys being so important. It’s a young man’s game. Draft guys who are ambitious and driven and they won’t need an old guy taking up a roster spot to explain to them why working out is important. And does Rodgers even work out in the offseason? That guy is full of some bullshit lately. And I like him for his conspiracy theories.

[Joemailman]

Listened to an interview with Lazard. His agent and Packers are talking. However, I didn't get the impression he thinks anything will get done before he enters free agency.

[Bretsky]

For sure. I’m growing tired of Rodgers always rambling on about the older guys being so important. It’s a young man’s game. Draft guys who are ambitious and driven and they won’t need an old guy taking up a roster spot to explain to them why working out is important. And does Rodgers even work out in the offseason? That guy is full of some bullshit lately. And I like him for his conspiracy theories.


Listen to the pro Rodgers homers like Wilde and Tausch

Even they admit Rodgers doesn't have the same offseason regiment he once had

They also note he was very very very pro OTA's up until a few years ago

And then admit some within the organization feel it's time to move on

SHHHHHHHHHHHHh; Bob McGinn has merit

[Joemailman]

Rams and LB Bobby Wagner have agreed to part ways. If Released, Rams will have 7.5 million of dead money and save 5 million on the cap.

[Joemailman]

Packers have restructured the contracts of Preston Smith and Jaire Alexander, saving about 16 million on the cap in 2023. According to Spotrac, this gets them about 6 million under the cap.

[ThunderDan]

And we have the following players to resign or replace:
Amos, Cobb, Lowry, Crosby, Lazard, Tonyan, Reed, Lewis, Leavitt, J Ford, Wilson, Nixon, Barnes and Nijman.

That's at least 4 starters, our K and the swing 3rd T.

[Teamcheez1]

Packers have restructured the contracts of Preston Smith and Jaire Alexander, saving about 16 million on the cap in 2023. According to Spotrac, this gets them about 6 million under the cap.

Now if we can get rid of both Rodgers and Bakh, we’ll be well on our way to reshaping the team.

[texaspackerbacker]

The media pukes which so many of ya'all adore are now saying that the Packers are NOT gonna be in rebuilding mode this year hahahahaha. All I can say about that is DUH!!!

[Joemailman]

The media pukes which so many of ya'all adore are now saying that the Packers are NOT gonna be in rebuilding mode this year hahahahaha. All I can say about that is DUH!!!

What are you talking about? It was always common knowledge Packers would restructure contracts this year to stay competitive. There will probably be a couple more.

[ThunderDan]

What are you talking about? It was always common knowledge Packers would restructure contracts this year to stay competitive. There will probably be a couple more.

Exactly, that amount of restructuring is just enough to sign our draft picks. Still have to sign a bunch of guys to be starters with not much cap space to do it. So, we are going to have to clear more space to sign average FAs or start a bunch of rookies.

[run pMc]

Packers have restructured the contracts of Preston Smith and Jaire Alexander, saving about 16 million on the cap in 2023. According to Spotrac, this gets them about 6 million under the cap.

added void year to each. not a fan of that but hopefully by then it won't bite them. Also sounds like they are working on restructures for Bakhtiari and either a restructure or extension for Clark. I'd try to extend him if possible, he's got 2 years left on his current contract I think, and probably has 3-4 good years left in the tank.

[run pMc]

The media pukes which so many of ya'all adore are now saying that the Packers are NOT gonna be in rebuilding mode this year hahahahaha. All I can say about that is DUH!!!

They were over the cap by a significant amount (~$20M) before reworking Jaire, Preston, and Aaron Jones. They HAD to do something by Mar 15 to get under the cap.
I would think they might look at extending Gary with some of that space. They'll also need several million to sign draft picks, and then a few million beyond that for mid-season signings and IR settlements.
It's not like they have tons of space to go on a FA spending spree... this is basically to get under the cap. It does mean they are about out of contracts they can rework this year.

[texaspackerbacker]

It's NOT the restructuring that is a surprise. Anybody with a lick of sense knew the Packer would be manipulating the cap like that. What's surprising is those media shitheads - always so late to the game - finally coming to the conclusion that the Packers are in it to win it next season, same as always - DUH. How many idiotic articles have there been as well as stupid lines in here about "reshaping the team" and similar crap?

Ya'all worry worts who get in such a tizzy about the salary cap need to do some thinking for yourself instead of following your favorite media puke, mostly from out of town who don't know or care about the Packers and in fact wish ill for the team they are supposed to be covering.

As I have said many times, there are few things more stupid and disgusting in sports than a team you like "rebuilding" - tearing down/having a "boom or bust" mentality. Thankfully, the Packers don't have and haven't had for a long long time that idiotic mentality, and for us in Wisconsin, thankfully neither have our teams in basketball and baseball.

[run pMc]

How many idiotic articles have there been as well as stupid lines in here about "reshaping the team" and similar crap?

I haven't really read any tbh. I tend to read APC and JSO and don't read stuff like Florio. If you're watching ESPN, most of those personalities know nothing with the exception of a few who are actually reporting stories, not stating their own opinions.
There's a difference between an opinion/editorial and an actual new story. McGinn and his "Packers are disgusted with Rodgers" is at its heart an opinion piece he's based on gut feeling and reading some tea leaves. Rapaport reporting that Jets have inquired about Rodgers is a story.

A roster is going to average something like 30% turnover every year, so "reshaping" or whatever people call it is nonsense.
As for "rebuilding", I don't think that applies to GB either -- they have a lot of players under contract next season already (if you include the futures contracts etc.) and a number of talented players. Compare with the Bucs, who will be rebuilding with a number of key players becoming FA, Brady's retirement, and their cap space mess.

It's entirely possible Rodgers feels the team would be rebuilding THE OFFENSE if they don't bring back some of "his guys" like Tonyan, Lewis, Cobb, Lazard, Crosby (he also named Bakhtiari), but that's not a full rebuild. That's a list of mostly aging players who any GM would probably look to replace based on their age, contracts, and performance last year. Even on offense, they still have a solid OL and Jones/Dillon, plus a pair of young WRs who might get better as soon as next season.

I'm not sure what you're reading or listening to, but I stay away from the national media -- they often can't even get the names of players right. The JSO reporters and even press credentialed guys like Andy Herman are much more plugged in to what's going on and will give you a more sane perspective on what's happening.

[Bretsky]

I don't hear anybody noting GB is going to rebuild.

Whether we end up with the Lova Machine or Karen as our QB's we're not looking to rebuid.

And ditching low level low upside older guys like Randall Cobb and Mercedes Lewis for younger talent who can improve a lot is NOT rebuilding, as some would like to us believe.

[red]

Maybe the team has already been “built” with a nice young core and we just need a fucking QB that will actually run the system the HC wants him to run, and not just do his own thing

There is a chance we have a better record next season if/when love is under center and everyone is on the same page as to what they should be doing

[RashanGary]

The last couple of years the packers pushed so much into this year that even after they clear all the space it’ll still barely get them back to even. When you get to the point where the can was already kicked, the advantage goes away.

[call_me_ishmael]

I don't hear anybody noting GB is going to rebuild.

Whether we end up with the Lova Machine or Karen as our QB's we're not looking to rebuid.

And ditching low level low upside older guys like Randall Cobb and Mercedes Lewis for younger talent who can improve a lot is NOT rebuilding, as some would like to us believe.

Eh, I 100% think they're rebuilding if they go to Love, but they still need to get under the cap this year and field a team. Restructures to me don't suggest anything one way or another.

[Joemailman]

Eh, I 100% think they're rebuilding if they go to Love, but they still need to get under the cap this year and field a team. Restructures to me don't suggest anything one way or another.

Teams that are rebuilding don't restructure contracts for guys like Aaron Jones and Preston Smith. They do what the Bears did last year and trade or release veteran players with big contracts to get draft picks and create cap room now and for the future.

[run pMc]

Eh, I 100% think they're rebuilding if they go to Love, but they still need to get under the cap this year and field a team. Restructures to me don't suggest anything one way or another.

I don't think so. I think if they go to Jordan Love at QB they will do everything they can to surround him with enough talent to be competitive. I think a young QB benefits from a solid OL, good run game and strong defense. Replacing a QB is not rebuilding.

If they really were rebuilding it might be smartest to rip the bandaid off...that would look closer to tanking this year though. Don't see that happening.
Doubt they bring back Preston if they are rebuilding.

[call_me_ishmael]

They're gonna have to pay the piper at some point. It is advantageous to all parties to do it quickly when they move on from the QB so the next guy gets a reloaded roster by year 3 and 4. Interesting philosophical question - did the Packers rebuild after 2007? Man, IDK :)

[Joemailman]

They're gonna have to pay the piper at some point. It is advantageous to all parties to do it quickly when they move on from the QB so the next guy gets a reloaded roster by year 3 and 4. Interesting philosophical question - did the Packers rebuild after 2007? Man, IDK :)

I think they're going to try to get out of this gradually. Last year they let Z go. This year it will likely be Amos and a few others. Next year might be Bakhtiari. It will likely be years before the Packers are a major player in free agency again, but the aim is to have a soft landing instead of having a fire sale 1 year like the Bears did last year.

[Fritz]

I think they're going to try to get out of this gradually. Last year they let Z go. This year it will likely be Amos and a few others. Next year might be Bakhtiari. It will likely be years before the Packers are a major player in free agency again, but the aim is to have a soft landing instead of having a fire sale 1 year like the Bears did last year.

My concern is that in doing so, you end up with mediocrity or less in Love's first year or two starting, and then when - if - he comes into his own as a QB, you don't have the financial means to take advantage. I wonder if they'd be better off doing what the Bears did, letting Love and the team suck for two years while he gets his sea legs, and then try to build more around him as he enters the best years of his career.

But it's all just guessing that I'm doing, so my point of view is only that.

[Joemailman]

My concern is that in doing so, you end up with mediocrity or less in Love's first year or two starting, and then when - if - he comes into his own as a QB, you don't have the financial means to take advantage. I wonder if they'd be better off doing what the Bears did, letting Love and the team suck for two years while he gets his sea legs, and then try to build more around him as he enters the best years of his career.

But it's all just guessing that I'm doing, so my point of view is only that.

I don't think you want to do what the Bears did. The fact that Fields has so little talent around him makes it difficult to judge how good Fields is. Great athlete, but is he a very good QB?

[texaspackerbacker]

My concern is that in doing so, you end up with mediocrity or less in Love's first year or two starting, and then when - if - he comes into his own as a QB, you don't have the financial means to take advantage. I wonder if they'd be better off doing what the Bears did, letting Love and the team suck for two years while he gets his sea legs, and then try to build more around him as he enters the best years of his career.

But it's all just guessing that I'm doing, so my point of view is only that.

That concern might be justified. However, it ain't gonna happen until after the Aaron Rodgers years, and unlike ya'all poor pitiful misguided types who expect that now or no later than a year from now, I fully expect that to be a few years away. But yeah, when he is gone, whether it's Love or somebody else, we can expect a period of mediocrity unless we get lucky and find the next Favre or Rodgers. If not, two mediocre years might be decidedly the low end.

What absolutely isn't gonna happen, though, is that lacking financial means either in actual funds or cap-wise.

[Fritz]

You know, Tex, he probably doesn't have to work until he's 67. I don't think he needs his full social security.

[run pMc]

That concern might be justified. However, it ain't gonna happen until after the Aaron Rodgers years, and unlike ya'all poor pitiful misguided types who expect that now or no later than a year from now, I fully expect that to be a few years away. But yeah, when he is gone, whether it's Love or somebody else, we can expect a period of mediocrity unless we get lucky and find the next Favre or Rodgers. If not, two mediocre years might be decidedly the low end.

What absolutely isn't gonna happen, though, is that lacking financial means either in actual funds or cap-wise.

Financial means to do what?
I agree they won't put themselves in a cap situation like the Saints - the team is run differently and smarter than that - but they have pushed a lot of money out and they will have to pay/absorb that eventually. It's likely they just plan to do that the year after Rodgers retires, but by then there may not be enough cap space to do anything except be shitty. If regular season wins matter so much to you I'd think you'd want to avoid that.

[texaspackerbacker]

You know, Tex, he probably doesn't have to work until he's 67. I don't think he needs his full social security.

Who do you mean? Rodgers? 67 is a bit of a stretch, even 57. I wouldn't be surprised if he could still be effective at 47 - just a couple years beyond Brady. Not saying he would, but coul;d? Probably. How did you get off onto that aspect of the topic anyway?

runpMc, you sort of have to ask Fritz that. He brought up "financial means". I'll just say, there are two sides to it: actual money and the salary cap. Say if Elon Musk owned a team, he'd never be short of money, but he'd still have the cap. The Packers aren't like Musk, but they are never gonna run out of actual money due to the corporate structure and all the extra revenue coming in. And as I always say, the cap can always be handled - just look at that chart in somebody's earlier post. The "cap hell" teams are the consistent winners, while the teams doing like some of ya'all would like are perennial losers - Bears, etc.

[sharpe1027]

Who do you mean? Rodgers? 67 is a bit of a stretch, even 57. I wouldn't be surprised if he could still be effective at 47 - just a couple years beyond Brady. Not saying he would, but coul;d? Probably. How did you get off onto that aspect of the topic anyway?

runpMc, you sort of have to ask Fritz that. He brought up "financial means". I'll just say, there are two sides to it: actual money and the salary cap. Say if Elon Musk owned a team, he'd never be short of money, but he'd still have the cap. The Packers aren't like Musk, but they are never gonna run out of actual money due to the corporate structure and all the extra revenue coming in. And as I always say, the cap can always be handled - just look at that chart in somebody's earlier post. The "cap hell" teams are the consistent winners, while the teams doing like some of ya'all would like are perennial losers - Bears, etc.
Nobody wants to be like the Bears. They have no cap issues because they don't have good players they need to keep.

Packers can sign anyone the want every free agency period because the cap doesn't really matter at all. They can just do some financial moves and it's all good. Why the hell don't they sign the top free agent options every single year? Idiots.

[run pMc]

To those who say "the cap can be cooked" -- it can, but not to an unlimited extent. The restructuring they are currently doing will cost them next year. Rodgers -- if he's back -- has a $59M bonus. If he retires after next season he has a Post-June 1 22.7M cap hit in 2024 and a 45.4M cap in 2025. That's on top of the restructured money you just kicked to 2024. What happens when you've kicked out 40-50M of money taking up 20% of your 2024 salary cap? What happens if you kick it further out, piling on top of the 45M Rodgers would count?

Cook away, sooner or later you won't be able to field a team (see: Bears).

If you only look at the team for 2023, they are better off at QB with Rodgers. If you look at the team over the next 3 years they are better off without him and giving Love a shot.
If he sucks you don't have to exercise his 5th year option and are likely drafting Caleb Williams or Drake May (both better prospects IMO than Jordan Love).
If he doesn't suck you have your next QB and can use the 5th year option to buy time to hammer out an extension. Either way, if Rodgers is gone you'd have the cap space to do it. You don't right now.

[texaspackerbacker]

sharpe's sarcasm actually sounded pretty good hahahaha, and runpMc saved me the trouble by replying just about what I would have, in the first line anyway. That horror scenario is exactly why I see Rodgers staying for at least the rest of his current contract, maybe longer.

The Bears actually WILL field a team, and they probably will win a few games hahahahaha. As you say, their cap problems are NOT the reason they still suck - perennially.

NO WAY NO WAY NO WAY they would be better off the next three years without Rodgers than with him. And if they consider him worthy, they absolutely could keep Love beyond his rookie contract - assuming Love doesn't just insist on going somewhere else.

[Fritz]

sharpe's sarcasm actually sounded pretty good hahahaha, and runpMc saved me the trouble by replying just about what I would have, in the first line anyway. That horror scenario is exactly why I see Rodgers staying for at least the rest of his current contract, maybe longer.

The Bears actually WILL field a team, and they probably will win a few games hahahahaha. As you say, their cap problems are NOT the reason they still suck - perennially.

NO WAY NO WAY NO WAY they would be better off the next three years without Rodgers than with him. And if they consider him worthy, they absolutely could keep Love beyond his rookie contract - assuming Love doesn't just insist on going somewhere else.

My earlier post, which you asked about, came about as a result of your many posts which suggest Rodgers could yet play and play and play for years and years. So I started thinking about Rodgers being elderly and still trying to suit up, and I thought, why would anyone do that to themselves? And the reason, for most of us, is that we have to work for a long time to qualify for full social security so we can retire. So it made me laugh to think of Rodgers keeping on and on and on because he needed to get to full social security age.

So it was just the workings of my strange mind. I tried to find an age-progression picture of Rodgers looking like an old, old man to supplement my post, but couldn't find one.

[run pMc]

Rodgers will NOT be playing for GB in 2025.
He's been having to take time for the last 3-4 off seasons to decide if he wants to keep playing, how many times do you think he's going to do that before he hangs it up? How many times will he do that before the FO says 'Nope'?
His contract is going to end up being an absolute albatross that will force them into rebuilding mode, simply because they won't have cap space to sign/keep most of their best players.

Beyond the mental and political aspects of him playing 3 more seasons, there's the physical part of it -- dude did not look like he was having a lot of fun out for most of last year, and he did not seem to enjoy getting hit in the cold. His arm is still ok, but his legs are not there. I don't think he would be willing to change his style to be a quick throw pure pocket passer a la Brady, that's not what made him special anyway.

He might announce on McAfee that he's done (he isn't). If he has two seasons left in him, I'd be surprised.
Sorry Fritz. If he needs scotch money, he can always sell his share of the Bucks.

[SudsMcBucky]

If you only look at the team for 2023, they are better off at QB with Rodgers. If you look at the team over the next 3 years they are better off without him and giving Love a shot.
If he sucks you don't have to exercise his 5th year option and are likely drafting Caleb Williams or Drake May (both better prospects IMO than Jordan Love).
If he doesn't suck you have your next QB and can use the 5th year option to buy time to hammer out an extension. Either way, if Rodgers is gone you'd have the cap space to do it. You don't right now.

That's not true, though. They won't have the 2023 season to evaluate to see if they should or shouldn't exercise his 5th year option. They have to decided that THIS offseason, before seeing how he'd do if they turned the reigns over to him in '23.

[run pMc]

That's not true, though. They won't have the 2023 season to evaluate to see if they should or shouldn't exercise his 5th year option. They have to decided that THIS offseason, before seeing how he'd do if they turned the reigns over to him in '23.

Yeah, but it's not until May 3, and I suspect they know whether they want to or not. It's a question of if they can.
They won't be able to afford both Rodgers and Love's 5th year option without some major cap gymnastics.
If Rodgers comes back for one more season and then retires and they don't exercise Love's 5th year option they have nobody at QB and Rodgers retirement cap hit.

[texaspackerbacker]

My earlier post, which you asked about, came about as a result of your many posts which suggest Rodgers could yet play and play and play for years and years. So I started thinking about Rodgers being elderly and still trying to suit up, and I thought, why would anyone do that to themselves? And the reason, for most of us, is that we have to work for a long time to qualify for full social security so we can retire. So it made me laugh to think of Rodgers keeping on and on and on because he needed to get to full social security age.

So it was just the workings of my strange mind. I tried to find an age-progression picture of Rodgers looking like an old, old man to supplement my post, but couldn't find one.

Because ultimately, it's a fun kids game, and (I testify first hand) you don't stop enjoying fun kids stuff just because you get old. And I say again, he could, barring serious injury, play effectively as long or longer than Brady did. True about not working to Social Security age (although I have a job about 3-4 hours a week even at age 75), but IMO, playing football is more fun than work. Who among us wouldn't if we could?

runpMc, I sure didn't see what you saw - a guy not having fun. Maybe due to injury or uncharacteristic lack of success at times, but in general no. And he went out of his way to demonstrate that his legs ARE still plenty good, at least for his age. And saying NOT in all caps/being so definite about indefinite things, I told my oldest grandson when he was 12, about 15 years ago now, always say "it seems" or "probably" or "IMO" because if you say something like you know for sure and you're wrong, you're basically lying.

And "major cap gymnastics" are like shit - they HAPPEN regularly, not to mention the hugely increasing cap.

[SudsMcBucky]

Yeah, but it's not until May 3, and I suspect they know whether they want to or not. It's a question of if they can.
They won't be able to afford both Rodgers and Love's 5th year option without some major cap gymnastics.
If Rodgers comes back for one more season and then retires and they don't exercise Love's 5th year option they have nobody at QB and Rodgers retirement cap hit.

But that's not what you said. Your post said "if Love sucks, then........." The point is, they're gonna have to make that option decision BEFORE they really know if he sucks or not. They're not going to learn anything new between in the next 2 months.

[run pMc]

If Rodgers is the starting QB for GB in 2025 -- three years from now -- I will buy Vikings season tickets. That's how sure I am. If I'm wrong, it's not lying, it's because a very, very low probability event came true.
Has nothing to do with lying/honesty.

Football is a fun kids game until 310 pound men want to smash into you at 18+ mph and plant you under the turf repeatedly, and then have the public scrutinize your every move. It's a fun game, but it's a business at that level. There were numerous times last year the telecast showed him either yelling at receivers and coaches or giving them death stares. Dude was frustrated, often. Maybe that's because they lost 9 games and might have played bad enough to lose a few others, but when you're not having fun doing that it makes you not want to work all year and go through it again. I simply don't think Rodgers is mentally or physically prepared to go thru that for 3 more years. He's a tough guy and a FHOF but at some point soon he'll decide he's done.

[run pMc]

But that's not what you said. Your post said "if Love sucks, then........." The point is, they're gonna have to make that option decision BEFORE they really know if he sucks or not. They're not going to learn anything new between in the next 2 months.

OK, so if Love sucks and Rodgers is gone -- if they have him on the 5th year they have a sucky QB who can bridge to their next QB they got in the draft.
If he sucks and he's NOT on the 5th year, they start over with a new QB.
If he's great and he's not on the 5th year they have to compete with others to sign him, which could be iffy considering they made him sit for 3 years and he clearly wants to play.
etc.

It's true they will have to decide on the 5th year option without having seen him play much.
I do think they already know if Love is good or not and will option him depending on what happens with Rodgers.
I don't see how they can 5th year option him AND afford a 59M payout for Rodgers on their cap. We'll probably know what they're doing with Rodgers before they decide on Love.

[bobblehead]

They will exercise the 5th option regardless. They are not going to let him walk after this next season should rodgers return.

[red]

They will exercise the 5th option regardless. They are not going to let him walk after this next season should rodgers return.

You know the 5th year option for a Qb is already over 20 million?

That’s a lot for a guy who we still might not know if he can play or not if Eric comes back

And at that point, you’ve squandered away the best reason for drafting a QB early, getting a few good years of cheap QB play

[texaspackerbacker]

If Rodgers is the starting QB for GB in 2025 -- three years from now -- I will buy Vikings season tickets. That's how sure I am. If I'm wrong, it's not lying, it's because a very, very low probability event came true.
Has nothing to do with lying/honesty.

Football is a fun kids game until 310 pound men want to smash into you at 18+ mph and plant you under the turf repeatedly, and then have the public scrutinize your every move. It's a fun game, but it's a business at that level. There were numerous times last year the telecast showed him either yelling at receivers and coaches or giving them death stares. Dude was frustrated, often. Maybe that's because they lost 9 games and might have played bad enough to lose a few others, but when you're not having fun doing that it makes you not want to work all year and go through it again. I simply don't think Rodgers is mentally or physically prepared to go thru that for 3 more years. He's a tough guy and a FHOF but at some point soon he'll decide he's done.

hahahahahaha Well, at least you prefaced it with "I don't think ....." - you're making progress. Three years is actually the end of the glorious current contract, right? I wouldn't bet too much against you on that. Many in here and otherwise think he will be gone 1 or 2 or even 3 years sooner. Your premise is actually the moderate idea. If you turn out to be right, we should have three wonderful years, and then a penalty to pay in dead money or whatever. The cap will be through the roof by then anyway, though, and without Rodgers, the team just might go down for a few years, so "cap hell" would hardly be noticed. I tend to think, though, that the more likely scenario is that after the three years, Rodgers comes back for 2 or 3 moreon a cap friendly contract and at a slightly lower total pay due to a slight downturn in quality of play at the age he will be then.

I said "fun game" and we all "would if we could". That "would if we could" kinda implies we are the 310 pounders ourselves or we have the athleticism to handle the situation and/or ability to thrive based on talent. That would be kinda fun, wouldn't it?

And thinking you know what's in Rodgers' heart and mine, that's a slippery slope too. Admittedly, I do it too, but of course, when I do it, it's eminently logical rather than intentionally stirring up trouble (the media shitheads) or believing those media shitheads (many in here). I've seen some of those "looks" and "death stares" (your words) too. In addition to being deserved in some cases, they plus the "yelling" could just as well be corrective and thus improving to the young players. I'll put Rodgers as a teammate up against just about anybody else on any team, way better than for example, Tom Brady.

[Joemailman]

Peter Bukowski Retweeted
Kassidy Hill
@KassidyGHill

Is there a scenerio where Allen Lazard is with the Packers this season?

Gutekunst: “Oh sure, yes.”

A year ago this time a lot of people around here thought Aaron Jones was done in Green Bay. Still hope.

[texaspackerbacker]

I said last season it was slam dunk sure Jones stayed, and I say now, there's a strong chance Lazard stays too - 60/40, maybe 70/30.

There's another bunch of articles saying Rodgers is probably gone hahahaha. Are people in here really stupid enough to believe that media shit? I suppose some are.

[Jaire]

There's another bunch of articles saying Rodgers is probably gone hahahaha. Are people in here really stupid enough to believe that media shit? I suppose some are.

I'm just listening to Gute's and AR's comments the last two days. AR has made his decision from the sounds of it. It seems Gute has too. The only question is whether they can agree on how to part ways that works for both sides. Just trying to read through what AR has said, I think he's going to another team: will GB let him go where he wants? His options are not nearly as good as the last two years. It is possible that he is thinking of retiring, but I'm assuming not. It's hard not to think that San Fran is his real choice: would GB ever let that happen? It will be interesting to see where he goes; and that will be known within two weeks imo.

[texaspackerbacker]

Yeah right hahahahahahahahahahahahaha

[Joemailman]

Vikings release Eric Kendricks. Will save 9.5 million on cap.

[run pMc]

Not surprised, he's an undersized 30 something year old LB.
He's been a good player for them, but with Brian Flores in at DC, their performance last year and their cap situation it's expected their defense will have a lot of new faces.

[Sparkey]

A Jets contingent landed in California 40 minutes ago. Jets Team Owner, Woody Johnson and the GM, Head Coach and O/C to visit with Rodgers in person after a conference call yesterday.

Deal is in place between Packers and Jets. All depends on if Rodgers wants to play this year.

[red]

A Jets contingent landed in California 40 minutes ago. Jets Team Owner, Woody Johnson and the GM, Head Coach and O/C to visit with Rodgers in person after a conference call yesterday.

Deal is in place between Packers and Jets. All depends on if Rodgers wants to play this year.

Did they all crawl on his knees from the jet to his holiness’ compound?

[ThunderDan]

Did they all crawl on his knees from the jet to his holiness’ compound?

They need the head coach to pick him up at the MSP airport.

[Joemailman]

Ravens place non-exclusive franchise tag on Lamar Jackson. His salary will be at 32.4 million. Other teams can negotiate with him. If a team signs him to an offer sheet, Ravens have 5 days to decide whether to match the offer and keep him. If they don't, they get 2 1st round picks from the team signing him.

[Bretsky]

A Jets contingent landed in California 40 minutes ago. Jets Team Owner, Woody Johnson and the GM, Head Coach and O/C to visit with Rodgers in person after a conference call yesterday.

Deal is in place between Packers and Jets. All depends on if Rodgers wants to play this year.



J.E.T.S. JETS JETS JETS


I can hear Tex chanting :)))

[call_me_ishmael]

Ravens place non-exclusive franchise tag on Lamar Jackson. His salary will be at 32.4 million. Other teams can negotiate with him. If a team signs him to an offer sheet, Ravens have 5 days to decide whether to match the offer and keep him. If they don't, they get 2 1st round picks from the team signing him.

I think they’d be able to trade him for more, but clearly they did their homework or they’d have used the exclusive tag. I like the idea of letting the market set a rate. Lamar can’t be happy about this because the two first rounders will lower his salary I believe.

[run pMc]

I think they’d be able to trade him for more, but clearly they did their homework or they’d have used the exclusive tag. I like the idea of letting the market set a rate. Lamar can’t be happy about this because the two first rounders will lower his salary I believe.

I think a big part of it is teams don't want to give out fully guaranteed contracts. Some owners were pissed when Cousins and especially last year Watson got them. For guaranteed money you have to put the same amount in an escrow, that's a ton of money doing nothing for you. You could argue there's collusion going on with teams publicly saying Nope to Lamar so fast. That, plus the injuries and lack of agent. 26 year old former MVP QBs don't become available unless there's something else going on.

[bobblehead]

I think a big part of it is teams don't want to give out fully guaranteed contracts. Some owners were pissed when Cousins and especially last year Watson got them. For guaranteed money you have to put the same amount in an escrow, that's a ton of money doing nothing for you. You could argue there's collusion going on with teams publicly saying Nope to Lamar so fast. That, plus the injuries and lack of agent. 26 year old former MVP QBs don't become available unless there's something else going on.

Whats going on is that he gets hurt, and he hasn't done squat in the playoffs. Combine those things and his value isn't what he believe it to be. However, I am shocked, that given the ludicrous contracts being signed, no one has offered him something to his liking.

[Fritz]

I'm wondering if we're going to hear, starting in a couple days, of the Jets talking with representatives for Randall Cobb and Mercedes Lewis...

[run pMc]

I'm wondering if we're going to hear, starting in a couple days, of the Jets talking with representatives for Randall Cobb and Mercedes Lewis...

They have to clear cap space to take Rodgers contract, so look for that as well. I wouldn't be surprised if there were some other players traded to make this happen.
They just traded for Chuck Clark, maybe they dump Jordan Whitehead for cap space since Clark is cheaper. They could conceivably redo a number of contracts (Corey Davis, CJ Mosley, Laken Tomlinson, Carl Lawson) to do what GB has done - convert salary to bonus - for cap space.

[RashanGary]

Rodgers cap hit for his next team is 21, 30, 49 and 43. It’s an average of 36M per year. His contract is very reasonable to whoever he’s traded to. The Packers cap hits would be 10M higher in each year.

[RashanGary]

And he’s likely to retire before the contract plays out. It’s a good contract to trade for. That’s how they made it. They made it tradable.

[red]

Rodgers cap hit for his next team is 21, 30, 49 and 43. It’s an average of 36M per year. His contract is very reasonable to whoever he’s traded to. The Packers cap hits would be 10M higher in each year.

yeah, its really good for the next 2 years for the next team

there should be no trade hangups over the cap hits

[red]

so z smith just demanded his release form the queens

what the hell is that all about?

seemed like a had a good first year out of the 3 he signed up for, and he's never been a problem type of guy

plus the queens just got ranked as like that best team to play for

so what the hell?

ras?

[Joemailman]

Z did nothing the 2nd half of the year. Vikings are 15 million over the cap even after cutting Eric Kendricks. Maybe Z has doubts about Vikings being able to stay competitive. I actually thought Vikings might cut him. It would save them 12 million on the cap.

[Jaire]

And he’s likely to retire before the contract plays out. It’s a good contract to trade for. That’s how they made it. They made it tradable.

Everything I've read now indicates that this was the worst contract of the century. Gute's gonna be givin' the Jets picks before it's all done.

This whole thing since drafting Love in 2020 has been a cluster &*^) every which way. I have zero confidence in the FO at this point.

[run pMc]

so z smith just demanded his release form the queens

what the hell is that all about?

seemed like a had a good first year out of the 3 he signed up for, and he's never been a problem type of guy

plus the queens just got ranked as like that best team to play for

so what the hell?

ras?

He was being floated as a cap casualty; maybe he was approached to redo his contract and balked... or maybe he decided he doesn't like Brian Flores or his vision of the defense next year.
Z is a little bit of an oddball. Who knows with him.

EDIT: current spin is it's about money.

10 minutes after Smith's tweet, NFL Network's Ian Rapoport reported that while Smith had requested his release, likely in pursuit of a more lucrative deal, the Vikings are actually not interested in cutting him loose.
https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nfl/vikings-reportedly-decline-pro-bowl-lb-zadarius-smiths-request-for-release-but-he-says-goodbye-anyway/ar-AA18r6gt

[Fritz]

Z always seems to be chasing a little bigger paycheck. Guess I can't blame him. But he does seem to wear out over the course of a season - he relies on his violent explosiveness, I think, and as he wears down over the season he seems to lose that, then start guessing and taking shots to get to the QB that may or may not be part of the plan.

My impression anyway.

[bobblehead]

Z has received the upfront money on the deal already and wants to be released so he can do that again. Typical athlete. Can't wait for next CBA.

[bobblehead]

I read he isn't happy because he will "only" receive 13.8M in cash for year 2

[red]

I read he isn't happy because he will "only" receive 13.8M in cash for year 2

doesn't make much sense

he's due to make more in 2023 then he did last year

but you never know

[red]

Z has received the upfront money on the deal already and wants to be released so he can do that again. Typical athlete. Can't wait for next CBA.

he only got a 5 million dollar signing bonus, the meat of the contract is in the salaries and roster bonuses

[bobblehead]

I looked up his deal and you are right. He didn't get a ton of cash last year. After all bonuses it was just under 14M. I guess he thinks after being healthy and getting 10.sacks he can get some big signing bonus. At his age, if he plays put this deal he isn't likely to break the bank on his next.

[red]

I looked up his deal and you are right. He didn't get a ton of cash last year. After all bonuses it was just under 14M. I guess he thinks after being healthy and getting 10.sacks he can get some big signing bonus. At his age, if he plays put this deal he isn't likely to break the bank on his next.

thats kinda what i'm thinking too

i wonder if the current deal had a tiny signing bonus because he was coming of the bad injury, and somehow thinks he can get a big signing bonus or something

IDK. his current deal looks pretty damn good to me

[Fritz]

Z is glad you're not his agent, Red.

[bobblehead]

thats kinda what i'm thinking too

i wonder if the current deal had a tiny signing bonus because he was coming of the bad injury, and somehow thinks he can get a big signing bonus or something

IDK. his current deal looks pretty damn good to me

If he hits the open market someone will drop a $20 mil bonus on him. Teams are crazy. He would effectively get a 2yr/40 mil with like 2 years he will never see on the back end.

[run pMc]

Z is good for about 8-10 games and then he tails off. Also, injuries. You kind of wonder if he's going to get a character-concerns rep after GB and MIN, but some team will give him 10M easy for 8-10 games of about a sack per game and then a disappearing act.
Pass rushers are always at a premium.

If MIN says they want to keep him that makes patching up that relationship interesting.

[Fritz]

Z is good for about 8-10 games and then he tails off. Also, injuries. You kind of wonder if he's going to get a character-concerns rep after GB and MIN, but some team will give him 10M easy for 8-10 games of about a sack per game and then a disappearing act.
Pass rushers are always at a premium.

If MIN says they want to keep him that makes patching up that relationship interesting.

Packers retain Kesean Nixon on a one-year deal.

Good news. First good solid Packer news is a while.

[KYPack]

Jimmy G to da Raidahz

Mike White (Jet backup) to the Dolphins

Packers holding out for a better comp package from the less options Jets as we speak?

Whole lotta shakin goin on.

[red]

Packers retain Kesean Nixon on a one-year deal.

Good news. First good solid Packer news is a while.

Thank god. I thought we finally found a return guy and we’re just gonna let him walk out the door

Why just 1 year though? Seems odd

[MadScientist]

Packers retain Kesean Nixon on a one-year deal.

Good news. First good solid Packer news is a while.

Yep. At last, something we can all agree is a good thing for the Packers. And 1 year 6M seems pretty reasonable for both sides.

[Fritz]

Jimmy G to da Raidahz

Mike White (Jet backup) to the Dolphins

Packers holding out for a better comp package from the less options Jets as we speak?

Whole lotta shakin goin on.

I don't think it's the Packers holding up the show, KY. Maybe Rodgers is doing it because he'd be embarrassed if all he could draw was a second round pick.

[KYPack]

I don't think it's the Packers holding up the show, KY. Maybe Rodgers is doing it because he'd be embarrassed if all he could draw was a second round pick.

Yeah, I'd agree. That would be dirty dirty pool.

This deal will go down in the next couple days

[red]

bears sign tremaine edmunds to a big ass deal

[Joemailman]

Adam Schefter
@AdamSchefter

Jets are actively working to reach an agreement with Packers’ free-agent WR Allen Lazard, per league sources. There is another team involved, and no final decision, but the Jets are trying to reunite Lazard and OC Nathaniel Hackett.

Cobb next?

[Teamcheez1]

Cobb next?

Supposedly AR wants the Jets to sign Jordy Nelson before he finally commits.

[red]

Cobb next?

this is just getting too funny

[Joemailman]

I think this is evidence that the Packers and Jets have a deal. Now the Jets are trying to get Rodgers on board.

[Joemailman]

I think this is evidence that the Packers and Jets have a deal. Now the Jets are trying to get Rodgers on board.

Or maybe not. :-D



Justis Mosqueda
@JuMosq

Mike Garafolo on NFL Network just said the biggest holdups in the Aaron Rodgers trade are the compensation (trade details) and the financial compensation (Aaron Rodgers' 2023 cash)

So just the little things

[Fosco33]

Lamar. Sure HC a diva. Skipped ota’s. Tweets that he turned down 3yr 133m fully guaranteed.

[texaspackerbacker]

I hear that two of the ya'all crowd's favorite media pukes disagreed with the media puke who claimed a deal with the Jets was "done".

[Fosco33]

I can’t believe Brady wants Gronk. He was old. Brady’s such a diva.

[call_me_ishmael]

Lamar. Sure HC a diva. Skipped ota’s. Tweets that he turned down 3yr 133m fully guaranteed.

I'm sure all QBs are Divas and I know what you're doing but c'mon man Lamar and Aaron there is no comparison who is the bigger diva and puts themselves out there. Lamar in general seems to keep his business private, I'm pretty shocked he tweeted that.

[Fosco33]

I don’t think any of them are real divas.

I can understand why some here want to move on from Aaron but the amount of silly comments by fans deserves some balance. I’ve been fine moving on from AR since M3 left. It’s a young mans game for the most part.

[run pMc]

FWIW (i.e., not much until confirmed) ESPN and NFL reporters are saying on social media that NYJ are going after Lazard and have interest in Cobb and Big Dog. They wouldn't do that unless Rodgers was a very good bet to join them.

The Bears have been pretty active -- I thought they did ok with their trade out of #1, until someone pointed out others have gotten more. Still, they have DJ Moore, Mooney, ESB, Claypool, and Velus Jones. Not a bad group.
Adding to the OL is a smart move for them. I wonder if they keep David Montgomery... I kind of doubt i..
Trading Roquan and then signing Edwards and Edmunds is kind of an interesting move. Roquan is better than either of them, but both are solid guys. Still, they have issues elsewhere on defense, seems a little weird to drop so much money into ILBs. They did front load a lot of it, so their current cap space can eat it up. Still a lot of dough, and in a year where there are some good off ball LBs in the draft.

Bringing back Keisean is a good move, but surprised it's only a 1 year deal. I guess is basically a 1 year $4M with another $2M in incentives, so not bad. My guess is Nixon wanted more money and longer contract but GB didn't want to pay that much for a #4CB/KR. Happy for the guy though - seems like a good teammate. I don't expect GB to be big players in FA, maybe picking up a cheap vet at S or WR who can be reliable. They've worked some real magic finding gems the last two years with Nixon, Rasul, Devondre... maybe they get lucky again.

[KYPack]

I hear that two of the ya'all crowd's favorite media pukes disagreed with the media puke who claimed a deal with the Jets was "done".

What are you talking about, oh Wise One?

[Fritz]

And goom-bye to Jarran Reed, as they say in parts of Michigan.

[Joemailman]

Jason B. Hirschhorn

Adding David Montgomery strongly suggests that the #Lions won't bring back Jamaal Williams.

Perhaps a certain quarterback might add Williams to his wish list.

If true, this is the biggest shocker so far. I'd take Jamaal over Montgomery any day.

[texaspackerbacker]

What are you talking about, oh Wise One?

You didn't read that Rapaport and Shefter disagreed with Wingo?

[Joemailman]

Packers have placed 2nd round tender on RFA Yosh Nijman. It is worth 4.3 million.

[KYPack]

You didn't read that Rapaport and Shefter disagreed with Wingo?

I don't read every article that comes down the pike.

That's like trying to pick fly shit out of pepper.

I use PR and my phone as my filter.

When I see a flock of posts and a GIF of Mad doing a Mexican war dance, I'll know the deal is down and I can start reading stuff.

Why do you read all this shit if you think those guys are pukes, goofs, etc?

[run pMc]

Packers have placed 2nd round tender on RFA Yosh Nijman. It is worth 4.3 million.

That's really a no-brainer. To get a starting RT for < $5M is rare.
Andre Dillard has started all of 5 games in his career and just got paid about $9-10M/year.

After the Chris Lindstrom contract, the Elgton Jenkins contract looks like a steal too.

First week of FA is always crazy. Teams overpay all the time.

I'm very curious to find out how the redshirt guys (Sean Rhyan, Rasheed Walker, Caleb Jones) look in camp. If 2 out of those 3 turn into serviceable players, they are in good shape. Hell, if one of Walker/Jones can fill in at RT, that's a big deal. It's very difficult to have 3 OL on expensive 2nd or 3rd contracts, and they have Bakh and Jenkins there now.

(I think Zach Tom is the future LT, but GB might not see it that way.)

[RashanGary]

That's really a no-brainer. To get a starting RT for < $5M is rare.
Andre Dillard has started all of 5 games in his career and just got paid about $9-10M/year.

After the Chris Lindstrom contract, the Elgton Jenkins contract looks like a steal too.

First week of FA is always crazy. Teams overpay all the time.

I'm very curious to find out how the redshirt guys (Sean Rhyan, Rasheed Walker, Caleb Jones) look in camp. If 2 out of those 3 turn into serviceable players, they are in good shape. Hell, if one of Walker/Jones can fill in at RT, that's a big deal. It's very difficult to have 3 OL on expensive 2nd or 3rd contracts, and they have Bakh and Jenkins there now.

(I think Zach Tom is the future LT, but GB might not see it that way.)

In brief service, don’t remember if it was preseason or if he got a few snaps, but Rasheed Walker seemed to move well at tackle. Rhyan, who knows. But yeah, let’s hope. Love doesn’t need to be learning how to do it in the NFL under conditions Rodgers faced early last year.

[red]

lol, pats sign ju ju for 3 years 33 million

about the same that lazard got

i would take ju ju all day long over lazard, and its not even close

juju is a #1, lazard is a #3

[run pMc]

lol, pats sign ju ju for 3 years 33 million

about the same that lazard got

i would take ju ju all day long over lazard, and its not even close

juju is a #1, lazard is a #3

Yeah, agree.

NE loses Jacobi Meyers for that amount. Getting Ju Ju for that is pretty good. Not sure he's a #1 but he's a good #2 for sure.
Lazard is a good #3 so a step up. The Lazard signing was clearly to lure Rodgers. The Jets WR room wasn't the problem last year.

[Joemailman]

Packers signed Tyler Davis after not tendering him. Probably league minimum contract or close to it.

[Fritz]

Packers signed Tyler Davis after not tendering him. Probably league minimum contract or close to it.

That’s about as exciting as a picture of Phyllis Diller naked.

Ugh.

[Joemailman]

That’s about as exciting as a picture of Phyllis Diller naked.

Ugh.

Get used to it. Packers don't have the cap room to make any Salma Hayek signings.

[Joemailman]

Hey Fritz!



The Packers Wire
@ThePackersWire

The Packers signed a new long snapper, agreeing to a deal with former Rams snapper Matt Orzech on Wednesday.

[run pMc]

That’s about as exciting as a picture of Phyllis Diller naked.

Ugh.

Does this top it?


The Green Bay Packers are signing long snapper Matt Orzech to a three-year deal
Former LS for the Rams. Look out, Jack Coco.

[Fritz]

I feel the blood stirring in my loins.

[Sparkey]

Tonyan signs with Bears.

[Harlan Huckleby]

who is this "Phyllis Diller"?

[Harlan Huckleby]

Tonyan signs with Bears.

the nfl sucks

[Joemailman]

Safety depth.


The Green Bay Packers announced the signing of former San Francisco 49ers safety Tarvarius Moore on Friday.

Moore, a third-round pick of the 49ers in the 2018 draft, is entering his sixth NFL season in 2023. He has played in 61 career games (13 starts).

Moore and long snapper Matt Orzech – a signing also announced on Friday – are the Packers’ first two outside free-agent additions of the 2023 league year.

Moore has played over 1,000 career snaps on special teams and has 26 career special teams tackles.

After starting eight games for the 49ers in 2020, Moore suffered a ruptured Achilles before the 2021 season and didn’t return until 2022. Last season, he played only 41 defensive snaps over 13 games.

[ThunderDan]

He will be cut by the end of the month.

[Fritz]

Or he’ll be a special teams demon.

[run pMc]

Dean Lowry signs with the Vikings. 2 years, 8.5M, 3M bonus.
Feels like a weird move but I guess that's not a huge contract. Vikes are doing some odd things but maybe this is a Flores thing.

GB will have to draft or sign a pair of DL unless they think one of their bench guys can make the jump. They are very thin there.

[run pMc]

Or he’ll be a special teams demon.

Possbily. He ran a 4.32 40 before tearing his Achilles, so he's probably not as fast or agile, but it looks like he has over 1000 snaps on both defense and ST, so he should have a place on the team either way.
This might mean the end of Rudy Ford or another player (Dallin Leavitt?) in the safety group who played ST.

He goes 6'2", 200 and rates in the mid 60's on PFF, so he's ok. They could do worse at safety. His cousin is former NBA player Antonio McDyess.

Until Rodgers is traded it's going to be a little murky figuring out how they navigate the cap and FA, right now they've basically kicked more stuff down the road after adding void years to Rasul's contract. They've redone basically every contract they can, maybe after Rodgers cap hit is gone they'll be able to absorb more of this.

[sharpe1027]

That’s about as exciting as a picture of Phyllis Diller naked.

Ugh.

Considering the decay that's happened by now, that's maybe a tad harsh?

[Joemailman]

Packers sign Rudy Ford to 1 year deal.

[red]

Packers sign Rudy Ford to 1 year deal.

an actual bright spot last year

not sure if he's full time starter material, but the kid plays with heart

[Joemailman]

an actual bright spot last year

not sure if he's full time starter material, but the kid plays with heart

Might have to change the More Banjo thread to More Ford thread.

[Fritz]

Well, it looks like they're paying attention to the special teams unit, anyway. And that is important. Between these signings (Nixon, Ford, the long snapper, the backup safety) and having four seventh round picks, I'd think Bisaccia will have plenty of tools to use next season.

And if Joe Barely can actually get the defense to play together, and if he can learn what a blitz is, maybe they'll keep their heads above water next season while Love takes his lumps and the young receivers grow.

[King Friday]

I don’t see how Love has to take lumps. At this point, he should be able to step in and win. He’s not a rookie. Rodgers was ready when he stepped in, it was merely our defense that was not. I think our defense has the talent to succeed. I may not be sold on the DC, but the talent is there. IF the defense can be a top 12 unit, there is NO reason to believe that the Packers have little chance to fight for a playoff spot. I’m not saying Love makes us a title contender. However, he certainly should be a guy who can get this roster to the postseason. If a guy like TL can do it in Jax his second year, Love should be able to do it in 2023 as a guy who has been in the league and seen a few bullets already.

[Joemailman]

Pretty amazing how Packers are approaching free agency. Packers have 5 WR's on their roster. 4 were rookies last year. The other has bounced around on practice squads. But their free agency signings have been to bolster DB/ST. I'm not worried they don't have a plan. Just curious as to what the plan is going to look like. Packers will have less than 10 million in cap space once the Rodgers trade goes through.

[texaspackerbacker]

I don’t see how Love has to take lumps. At this point, he should be able to step in and win. He’s not a rookie. Rodgers was ready when he stepped in, it was merely our defense that was not. I think our defense has the talent to succeed. I may not be sold on the DC, but the talent is there. IF the defense can be a top 12 unit, there is NO reason to believe that the Packers have little chance to fight for a playoff spot. I’m not saying Love makes us a title contender. However, he certainly should be a guy who can get this roster to the postseason. If a guy like TL can do it in Jax his second year, Love should be able to do it in 2023 as a guy who has been in the league and seen a few bullets already.

There's an acorn of truth here. Yes, Love should be able to be at least decent - up to the standard of average QBs around the league BUT he won't be Aaron Rodger level quality - not what Rodgers was early on, not what Rodgers was in his prime, and not what Rodgers likely still would/will be. And I doubt Love will ever come close to that level. He's probably not gonna be far from his ceiling his first year as a starter. That 10-7 type record some have talked about is probably within reach and will continue to be. If that's what ya'all are willing to settle for just so you don't have Rodgers' drama to whine about, then yeah you'll get your wish - what I'd call mediocrity for the foreseeable future. If we were Bears or Lions fans, that would actually be an upgrade, but we Packer fans have been spoiled to expect more than that - except for ya'all Rodgers haters in here anyway.

[texaspackerbacker]

Pretty amazing how Packers are approaching free agency. Packers have 5 WR's on their roster. 4 were rookies last year. The other has bounced around on practice squads. But their free agency signings have been to bolster DB/ST. I'm not worried they don't have a plan. Just curious as to what the plan is going to look like. Packers will have less than 10 million in cap space once the Rodgers trade goes through.

This says a couple of things, maybe. It says we maybe draft a TE and probably a WR too fairly early - many have thought that about TE anyway, and it says that just maybe, they are expecting the Rodgers trade NOT to go through, which would leave that $10 million plus what they wouldn't have to absorb from the trade. I said "maybe" - I honestly don't believe that myself at this point, but it is a glimmer of hope.

[Fritz]

Pretty amazing how Packers are approaching free agency. Packers have 5 WR's on their roster. 4 were rookies last year. The other has bounced around on practice squads. But their free agency signings have been to bolster DB/ST. I'm not worried they don't have a plan. Just curious as to what the plan is going to look like. Packers will have less than 10 million in cap space once the Rodgers trade goes through.

It is a strange plan, whatever it is. Sort or a rebuild by trading Rodgers - they're not 'running it back' again with the same crew, as they were not interested in Cobb or Lewis and were not able to affort Lazard, and apparently didn't want Tonyan back, either.

Yet their cap situation is so messed up they've maxed out every contract they can, with void years on void years. So they're really in a position to have to pay the piper, starting this year, and into the next couple. So it's not the kind of rebuild where a team sucks and cuts people and puts out a semi-pro team so they can A. get the cap situation under control and B. get a high draft pick.

I think any young QB who has never been a starter in the NFL probably needs a year as a starter to really be able to see the whole field and understand in an instant what he sees. I think the seasoning helped Love, but I do think he'll be learning a lot now. Now, next year, he ought to be good, if he is going to be good.

There is also a weird dearth of defensive linemen at this point. So they either have to pick over the scraps or draft two defensive linemen to fill out the roster. Or both.

[run pMc]

It is a strange plan, whatever it is. Sort or a rebuild by trading Rodgers - they're not 'running it back' again with the same crew, as they were not interested in Cobb or Lewis and were not able to affort Lazard, and apparently didn't want Tonyan back, either.

Yet their cap situation is so messed up they've maxed out every contract they can, with void years on void years. So they're really in a position to have to pay the piper, starting this year, and into the next couple. So it's not the kind of rebuild where a team sucks and cuts people and puts out a semi-pro team so they can A. get the cap situation under control and B. get a high draft pick.

I think any young QB who has never been a starter in the NFL probably needs a year as a starter to really be able to see the whole field and understand in an instant what he sees. I think the seasoning helped Love, but I do think he'll be learning a lot now. Now, next year, he ought to be good, if he is going to be good.

There is also a weird dearth of defensive linemen at this point. So they either have to pick over the scraps or draft two defensive linemen to fill out the roster. Or both.

(Going on the assumption the Rodgers trade goes thru, which it 99% will.)
Jordan Love will certainly go thru his ups and downs next year. AR went 6-10 his first year, I think Jordan Love can do that if not better. 10-7 and a WC spot would be pretty good for first year starter. Once teams get more film on him they will try to make him uncomfortable and he'll have to adjust to that. They'll 5th year option him and unless he stinks on ice he'll be the QB next year. Even a mid-level starting QB making $20M is apparently a good deal these days. Next season I'll be looking for growth and improvement, and then consistency. If he can do all that, he'll be fine. Maybe not HOF good like Favre/Rodgers, but plenty of mediocre QBs have gotten pretty far into the playoffs and a few have won a SB (or in Eli Manning's case, two).

I'm curious at how they are filling out the roster and working thru FA; it's hard to tell how things will shake out until AR is dealt. Do they get any players back from the NYJ in the trade? They will want a veteran WR in the room for the young guys. I also think they will draft a WR, but I don't think it will be before R3.
I do think they'll pick a TE before the end of Day2 and that will be to improve the passing game. That they signed a couple safeties and brought back Tyler Davis probably means they are nibbling around the edges and building some depth, and also tells me they think the FA safeties might be better than most of the safeties in the draft. I still think they'll pick a safety in the draft, but maybe now just one instead of two.
DL might end up being their R1 pick if Breese is there.

As far as I can tell they need 2 more players each at TE, WR, and DL. To fill some of these spots they'll see if anyone gets cut or wait until wave 3 of FA to pick up someone halfway competent on the cheap.
They don't have much cap space after the AR trade, but next year they will be in better shape to absorb some of this cap mess. Next off season they should try to get out from any remaining bad contracts and void years to free up the cap space tied up by them.

[Teamcheez1]

Dean Lowry signed by Vikings.
Addition by subtraction.

[run pMc]

Lions signed Chauncey Gardner-Johnson, Cameron Sutton, and Emmanuel Mosley. Their secondary gets a big makeover. Oh, and they have something like 5 picks inside the top 100 in the draft.
Lots of people have them favored to win the NFCN.

[run pMc]

Dean Lowry signed by Vikings.
Addition by subtraction.

Mostly agree. I didn't think he was very good against the run - got moved out of his gap too often. Didn't play as well as the year before either.
Lowry was probably a nice depth piece forced into a starting role. All in all, not a bad draft pick (he got a 2nd contract with GB) but not someone I'd go out of my way to sign to a THIRD contract. Good for him for getting paid and having a pretty long NFL career for a Day 3 pick. I'm not sad that GB didn't drop 4M a year on him though.

GB will need to find players who can take up all of Lowry/Reed's snaps. Wyatt and Slaton can certainly do that, but they need at least one more GOOD DL in case of injury, etc. I have no faith the highlight-less Johnathon Ford or journeyman Chris Slayton will make a jump. The departed Jack Heflin was probably better than either.

[Fritz]

What a weird year. The Loins will be favored to win the division for the first time since probably Wayne Fontes was the coach back in the 90's. Crazy world.

[run pMc]

Media pukes reporting that Aaron Jones, Christian Watson, and Romeo Doubs are traveling to California to train with Jordan Love.
Imagine: a QB who wants to build chemistry with other skill players before camp!

[run pMc]

What a weird year. The Loins will be favored to win the division for the first time since probably Wayne Fontes was the coach back in the 90's. Crazy world.

They have a really good OL, and some young cheap talent with Jameson Williams and Amon St. Brown. I think they'll miss Jamaal Williams, but DeAndre Swift isn't a bad player and David Montgomery is fine.
Their defense was abysmal to start but improved over the season to at least mediocre.

Weird thing is what is their long term plan at QB? Goff? The Tim Boyle Laser Show? They haven't been known for fine QB play or for developing a good one, but he has two years left on his deal.

I wonder if they will fall a bit back to Earth because of tougher schedule, high expectations, nobody overlooking them, etc. but the NFC more or less stinks -- Philly, SF, Dallas, and Detroit are probably the top 4 at this point, for what little that's worth.

I do think trading Stafford for picks and taking Goff's contract and getting good production from him was a smart and very gutsy move. Will be interesting to see what else Brad Holmes has up his sleeve.

[Fritz]

They have a really good OL, and some young cheap talent with Jameson Williams and Amon St. Brown. I think they'll miss Jamaal Williams, but DeAndre Swift isn't a bad player and David Montgomery is fine.
Their defense was abysmal to start but improved over the season to at least mediocre.

Weird thing is what is their long term plan at QB? Goff? The Tim Boyle Laser Show? They haven't been known for fine QB play or for developing a good one, but he has two years left on his deal.

I wonder if they will fall a bit back to Earth because of tougher schedule, high expectations, nobody overlooking them, etc. but the NFC more or less stinks -- Philly, SF, Dallas, and Detroit are probably the top 4 at this point, for what little that's worth.

I do think trading Stafford for picks and taking Goff's contract and getting good production from him was a smart and very gutsy move. Will be interesting to see what else Brad Holmes has up his sleeve.

This is what's concerning. You could always count on the Loins to have a GM who didn't know jack about GM-ing. That goes all the way back to Russ Thomas, who was the GM in the 60's into the 80's or so, and was purportedly Bill Ford Sr.'s bag man, keeping Ford under wraps as he drank and drank his way through his often-sad life. He was intensely personally loyal to Bill Ford and the Ford family, so Russ's GM-ing skills were not as important to the family as they might be to a different kind of owner.

So it went, except for the blip of the 90's when I think Chuck Schmidt was GM. But even that fell apart.

But now this Brad Holmes guy actually seems to know what he's doing. Damn.

[Joemailman]

Ari Meirov
@MySportsUpdate

The #Packers are re-signing LB Justin Hollins to a 1-year, $1.2M deal, per source.

Hollins recently took a visit with the Giants and is coming off a 3.5 sack season.

Hollins provided pretty good pass rush at times last year. Believe he was not so good against the run. He'll be needed though until Gary comes back.

[run pMc]

Hollins is a good athlete, showed some of that as well as giving "paycheck chasing" effort. He's not good against the run.
Still, he's a good pickup for a 4th Edge rusher... he's better than what they've had there with Garvin and Hamilton IMO.

[Fritz]

For sure. How many times did we see those guys flailing away ineffectually, like a poster trying to convince Tex of something reasonable and obvious?

[texaspackerbacker]

The Rodgers hating crowd in here wouldn't know "reasonable and obvious" if it bit them in the ass.

[bobblehead]

https://www.msn.com/en-us/autos/news/packers-paying-price-for-aggressive-approach/ar-AA192vwm?ocid=msedgdhp&pc=U531&cvid=10040229f2104b5fe6c1413de08e324e&ei=53

This could go in about 3 places, but this seemed like a reasonable place.

"Safety Adrian Amos is the ultimate case-in-point. Through multiple restructures by the team, which included the insertion of void years to cut down on his annual cap numbers, Amos counts $7.95 million on this year’s salary cap.

Amos, of course, is a free agent who spent his Thursday being wined and dined by his hometown Baltimore Ravens. And yet, he has the seventh-highest cap charge on the team.

To be sure, Amos is the extreme example, but he provides the ultimate argument to the salary-cap-isn’t-real crowd. The salary cap is real, and Amos, defensive tackle Dean Lowry ($3.01 million), defensive tackle Jarran Reed ($1.49 million), receiver Randall Cobb ($1.39 million), tight end Marcedes Lewis ($1.05 million), kicker Mason Crosby ($1.05 million) and tight end Robert Tonyan ($500,000) provide more than $16 million worth of examples. That’s two or three good players the Packers can’t afford."

[bobblehead]

Also contained within the article:

-Bakhtiari’s cap charge in 2024 is set to explode to $40.58 million, the most expensive at the position by more than $12 million.

- Clark’s cap charge in 2024 will rise to $27.49 million, second only to future Hall of Famer Aaron Donald.

- Jaire Alexander’s cap charge in 2024 will increase to $24.36 million, fourth-most among corners.

- Running back Aaron Jones’ cap charge in 2024 will rise to $17.17 million, second-most among running backs.

[Fritz]

Also contained within the article:

-Bakhtiari’s cap charge in 2024 is set to explode to $40.58 million, the most expensive at the position by more than $12 million.

- Clark’s cap charge in 2024 will rise to $27.49 million, second only to future Hall of Famer Aaron Donald.

- Jaire Alexander’s cap charge in 2024 will increase to $24.36 million, fourth-most among corners.

- Running back Aaron Jones’ cap charge in 2024 will rise to $17.17 million, second-most among running backs.

Sounds like the team will have to be very, very different in 2024.

[run pMc]

https://www.msn.com/en-us/autos/news/packers-paying-price-for-aggressive-approach/ar-AA192vwm?ocid=msedgdhp&pc=U531&cvid=10040229f2104b5fe6c1413de08e324e&ei=53

This could go in about 3 places, but this seemed like a reasonable place.

"Safety Adrian Amos is the ultimate case-in-point. Through multiple restructures by the team, which included the insertion of void years to cut down on his annual cap numbers, Amos counts $7.95 million on this year’s salary cap.

Amos, of course, is a free agent who spent his Thursday being wined and dined by his hometown Baltimore Ravens. And yet, he has the seventh-highest cap charge on the team.

To be sure, Amos is the extreme example, but he provides the ultimate argument to the salary-cap-isn’t-real crowd. The salary cap is real, and Amos, defensive tackle Dean Lowry ($3.01 million), defensive tackle Jarran Reed ($1.49 million), receiver Randall Cobb ($1.39 million), tight end Marcedes Lewis ($1.05 million), kicker Mason Crosby ($1.05 million) and tight end Robert Tonyan ($500,000) provide more than $16 million worth of examples. That’s two or three good players the Packers can’t afford."


100% agree with this, and is a reason I don't like void years. Even if a player reaches end of contract and isn't on your team, you're still paying for them.



Also contained within the article:

-Bakhtiari’s cap charge in 2024 is set to explode to $40.58 million, the most expensive at the position by more than $12 million.

- Clark’s cap charge in 2024 will rise to $27.49 million, second only to future Hall of Famer Aaron Donald.

- Jaire Alexander’s cap charge in 2024 will increase to $24.36 million, fourth-most among corners.

- Running back Aaron Jones’ cap charge in 2024 will rise to $17.17 million, second-most among running backs.

I think Bakh could be gone next offseason, they'd gain 21.5M in cap savings by cutting him or trading him.

Jaire might see another restructure, which worries me pushing all that out. The other thing that worries me is that most great corners aren't great for long, and he's undersized to boot. He should still be good and if used properly is a shutdown-half-the-field type of player. He could also be used as trade bait, but I think they try to let his contract ride and rework it if his performance slips (it shouldn't until 2025).

Kenny Clark is remarkably young and could actually get an extension to potentially move some money around. Compared to what DaRon Payne and other DL are getting his contract is a lot but not terrible. His cap number might not look as bad in a year, but I agree it's too high. Good in the locker room and in general, and he's been their best DL for the last ? years, playing next to underperforming or bad players.

Aaron Jones... I think they are drafting a RB in the draft, and might be completely rebooting their backfield in 2024. I don't see them extending Jones at age 30, I don't know if they'll keep Dillon either. I have a feeling they were hoping Kylin Hill would push Dillon and maybe even Jones. Jones was without a doubt their most consistent playmaker last year and they need him but you can't pay a 30y/o RB that kind of money when you have cap issues.

Every team has some highly comped players, are these bad contracts? Do you think they are bad players, or badly coached? I'm not sure myself...if I had to guess, I'd lean towards GB handing out too much guaranteed money -- maybe they have to bc it's GB -- and that bites them.

[run pMc]

One I forgot to mention - Devondre Campbell. Cutting him or in 2024 would gain you a little cap room (2.7M) so it might not happen, especially if Quay flops, but Campbell had a rough start to last season. Not sure he's worth that contract. This year will be important for him.
Rasul could also be a target for a cut or redo, depending on this season. He'd save them 6M in 2024 if they cut. I think they keep him though... he's kind of a fun player when he's not messing around with DET FGs.

[texaspackerbacker]

I've pretty much laid off this topic because if Rodgers is gone, the season and beyond is in the toilet regardless of anything else. Just the same, getting rid of quality players who are not way over the hill is just stupid. That applies to Campbell, obviously Aaron Jones, Clark, Jaire, probably Rasul, and a lot of others. I would extend and do what's needed to keep all of them. This does not apply to Preston Smith, who IMO is pretty far over the hill. And I wouldn't overpay to keep Bakhtiari either - although for those who still do worship that sacred cow, he too could be retain without the horrible cap hit if it was handled right.

[Fritz]

Tex, you probably liked George Allen and his Over the Hill Gang back in the 70's didn't you? I mean, except that you liked the Cowpukes. But the concept, you probably liked.

[texaspackerbacker]

The only thing I ever liked about George Allen was after his coaching career, and that's unmentionable in this part of the forum hahahaha (or was that his son?) Macaca!

There's a colossal difference between retaining your own quality players - which is mostly a financial thing, and going after quality players from other teams. Furthermore, regarding Allen and the '70s era, I'm pretty sure the free agency rules were different back then and maybe salary cap too, if it existed at all. Most of what Allen did was trades and giving up draft picks - which I considered stupid then, and which nobody is really suggesting the Packers do now, at least not like Allen did.

And yeah, the Cowboys were my second favorite team even before I was in Texas, going back to the days when they and the "Dallas Texans" of the AFL had a veritable blood feud which resulted in Lamar Hunt getting chased out to K.C, and his team named the Chiefs. And when I moved here, thanks to the army, so much more so, they were my second team. Ya'all are probably gonna have sad times for years if Rodgers really is gone. I, on the other hand, have the Cowboys to root for, not to mention a great resurgence of Badger football. It's gonna suck to be ya'all hahahaha - be careful what you wish for.

[run pMc]

I've pretty much laid off this topic because if Rodgers is gone, the season and beyond is in the toilet regardless of anything else. Just the same, getting rid of quality players who are not way over the hill is just stupid. That applies to Campbell, obviously Aaron Jones, Clark, Jaire, probably Rasul, and a lot of others. I would extend and do what's needed to keep all of them. This does not apply to Preston Smith, who IMO is pretty far over the hill. And I wouldn't overpay to keep Bakhtiari either - although for those who still do worship that sacred cow, he too could be retain without the horrible cap hit if it was handled right.

Preston could be gone after the season, but the way they redid his contract doesn't save them much if they do... I think like 2.5M in 2024.

How would you handle Bahktiari's contract? It expires after the 2024 season and they just redid it. His cap number balloons next year and they save a lot of money by releasing him. Are you saying they extend him? if they wanted to do void years they would likely already have done that when they redid it this year. I'm curious what you view as "handled right" means.

I agree you don't want to get rid of quality players if you don't have to, but age and contracts along with cap space might demand it. I love Aaron Jones but giving a 5-9 30 year old RB 17M in 2024 is not smart. Maybe they can do something to keep him but you're likely extending him and asking him to take a paycut or something. Again, RBs have short careers and can be replaced without too much trouble, so paying a lot for one is iffy.

I wouldn't give up on this season or those beyond it, especially if the Super Bowl isn't your thing. I don't expect them to win the SB, and I'd be surprised if they win 10+ games, but they should be more interesting and possibly more fun than last year. We at least get to see what the MLF offense will look like, and we can see if/how JL, Watson, Doubs, and other young players develop. Free agency -- once they unwind their cap mess -- as well as NFL's push for parity will likely get GB back into playoffs sooner than you might think. I remember the bad old days of the 80's, they aren't going back to that. The league and the GB FO are too smart for that now.

[RashanGary]

I could see one or two down years. That’s why I wouldn’t mind next years first from the Jets. It would give us two 2024 1sts (one presumably in the top 15). If we see our QB, we could move up with the two firsts and the 2025 first to get our guy if Love flops.

[Anti-Polar Bear]

https://www.msn.com/en-us/autos/news/packers-paying-price-for-aggressive-approach/ar-AA192vwm?ocid=msedgdhp&pc=U531&cvid=10040229f2104b5fe6c1413de08e324e&ei=53

This could go in about 3 places, but this seemed like a reasonable place.

"Safety Adrian Amos is the ultimate case-in-point. Through multiple restructures by the team, which included the insertion of void years to cut down on his annual cap numbers, Amos counts $7.95 million on this year’s salary cap.

Amos, of course, is a free agent who spent his Thursday being wined and dined by his hometown Baltimore Ravens. And yet, he has the seventh-highest cap charge on the team.

To be sure, Amos is the extreme example, but he provides the ultimate argument to the salary-cap-isn’t-real crowd. The salary cap is real, and Amos, defensive tackle Dean Lowry ($3.01 million), defensive tackle Jarran Reed ($1.49 million), receiver Randall Cobb ($1.39 million), tight end Marcedes Lewis ($1.05 million), kicker Mason Crosby ($1.05 million) and tight end Robert Tonyan ($500,000) provide more than $16 million worth of examples. That’s two or three good players the Packers can’t afford."

With all due respect, you folks without a meaningless bachelor’s in accounting (not to mention, having passed the not-so-easy Wisconsin CPA exams) have no fucking clue what y’all barking about when the subject pertains to the NFL salary cap.

“Dead money” has already been accounted for, cash flow-wise. The Packers currently have about $17M in dead money. That doesn’t mean they don’t have $17M to spend on free agents. They can simply create $17M in cap space by “cooking the cap.” Sure, doing such would lead to more dead money in the future. But such dead money would be offset by expiring contracts and the ever increasing salary cap. And trust me, cooking the cap ain’t gonna be banned in the future.

Some examples of why dead money is irrelevant: Had the Packers terminate underachiever Cletidus Clark instead of restructuring his contract, they would be fucked with $20M in “dead money.” Yet, they would actually gain $3M in cap space with the move; next season, Clark’s contract would be off the books and they would get something like $20M in cap space! The fucking Panthers currently have over $51M in dead money. Illogic says they should be in a so-called cap he’ll. Yet, the fucking Panthers currently have more cap space available than the fucking Packers!

Mic drop as I go back to flipping burgers - all because tunderdan won’t hire me be a CPA.

[run pMc]

You're partly right, APB. The dead money has been paid already, and thus accounted for cash flow-wise. It still counts against the cap, in future years generally speaking. If they restructure a $10M salary down to $2M and pay the rest in a bonus, that 'cooks' the cap by spreading that $8 across the remainder of the contract. Let's say it's over two years in this example Cash flow-wise, it's paid out, and the amount against the current year is $6M (2 + 8/2) instead of 10, but the remaining 4 is added to whatever is owed next year. It doesn't vanish, it accumulates into a future year.

You can cook a cap by adding void years, redoing all your significant 2nd contracts so the salaries are small, etc. but sooner or later you run out of cap space or redoable contracts or both. If you overcook your cap you can end up with a lot of that cooked money hitting your cap all at once and putting you in cap hell.

The Panthers aren't in cap hell despite eating a lot of money for DJ Moore, McCaffrey and Anderson because they have very few players left with big contracts -- Brian Burns and Shaq Thompson lead the way at 16M and 14M. They could probably do something with Burn's contract, I believe it's the 5th year. Next year they have a ton of cap space. GB has several contracts where they are paying out 20M. GB right now looks like they have quite a bit of space, but they need $9 million more to trade AR, plus some for draft picks etc.

Cap can be cooked, but not indefinitely. There are limits, and not just the cap itself. You have to have workable contracts to cook. Some of GBs contracts aren't easy to get out of, not just AR's. Has Russ Ball lost a step? They've done a lot of cooking already.

[RashanGary]

The Packers could probably make about 30 or 40 more million if they max voided everyone possible. But then they’re out of ways to cook the cap.

[Fritz]

Preston could be gone after the season, but the way they redid his contract doesn't save them much if they do... I think like 2.5M in 2024.

How would you handle Bahktiari's contract? It expires after the 2024 season and they just redid it. His cap number balloons next year and they save a lot of money by releasing him. Are you saying they extend him? if they wanted to do void years they would likely already have done that when they redid it this year. I'm curious what you view as "handled right" means.

I agree you don't want to get rid of quality players if you don't have to, but age and contracts along with cap space might demand it. I love Aaron Jones but giving a 5-9 30 year old RB 17M in 2024 is not smart. Maybe they can do something to keep him but you're likely extending him and asking him to take a paycut or something. Again, RBs have short careers and can be replaced without too much trouble, so paying a lot for one is iffy.

I wouldn't give up on this season or those beyond it, especially if the Super Bowl isn't your thing. I don't expect them to win the SB, and I'd be surprised if they win 10+ games, but they should be more interesting and possibly more fun than last year. We at least get to see what the MLF offense will look like, and we can see if/how JL, Watson, Doubs, and other young players develop. Free agency -- once they unwind their cap mess -- as well as NFL's push for parity will likely get GB back into playoffs sooner than you might think. I remember the bad old days of the 80's, they aren't going back to that. The league and the GB FO are too smart for that now.

The above is where I'm sitting, mentally, these days. It's not that I "hate" Rodgers - sure I whine about his personality sometimes, but he doesn't abuse women or children or kill people, so in my eyes he's a better person than many NFL players. I just got tired of the drama the past couple of years. Will he or won't he? How much say will he have over personnel? Are his emotional needs being met by the front office? And while he played at a high level prior to last year, some of that, at least, was the brilliance of Davante Adams. But still, Rodgers is the best QB I've ever seen play in Green Bay, going back to Bart Starr. I'm just ready for the next chapter - see if and how the young guy develops, see what MLF's offense "really" looks like, see how the front office, completely untethered from Rodgers's "requests," drafts this year and who they sign or don't sign. Just time to turn the page, for me. I know Tex doesn't feel that way, and that's fine. Rodgers has brought a bunch of success to GB, at least up until the playoffs, and since Tex doesn't care much about the playoffs, then that's not a big deal for him.

[Anti-Polar Bear]

You're partly right, APB. The dead money has been paid already, and thus accounted for cash flow-wise. It still counts against the cap, in future years generally speaking. If they restructure a $10M salary down to $2M and pay the rest in a bonus, that 'cooks' the cap by spreading that $8 across the remainder of the contract. Let's say it's over two years in this example Cash flow-wise, it's paid out, and the amount against the current year is $6M (2 + 8/2) instead of 10, but the remaining 4 is added to whatever is owed next year. It doesn't vanish, it accumulates into a future year.

You can cook a cap by adding void years, redoing all your significant 2nd contracts so the salaries are small, etc. but sooner or later you run out of cap space or redoable contracts or both. If you overcook your cap you can end up with a lot of that cooked money hitting your cap all at once and putting you in cap hell.

The Panthers aren't in cap hell despite eating a lot of money for DJ Moore, McCaffrey and Anderson because they have very few players left with big contracts -- Brian Burns and Shaq Thompson lead the way at 16M and 14M. They could probably do something with Burn's contract, I believe it's the 5th year. Next year they have a ton of cap space. GB has several contracts where they are paying out 20M. GB right now looks like they have quite a bit of space, but they need $9 million more to trade AR, plus some for draft picks etc.

Cap can be cooked, but not indefinitely. There are limits, and not just the cap itself. You have to have workable contracts to cook. Some of GBs contracts aren't easy to get out of, not just AR's. Has Russ Ball lost a step? They've done a lot of cooking already.

Who gives a fuck about being hit with a dead money of $20M when you gain an extra $3M in cap space? Who gives a fuck about having $50M in dead money when you have $60M in cap space?

Only a bunch of fat white pigs and that fat desert camel in Jacksonville give a fuck. Dead money is nothing but an accounting tool the owners utilize to keep labor expenses down. Like, yo, let’s cut Cletidus Clark cos Nutz could do what Clark does (3 sacks a season, inability to dominate the trenches and a penchant for disappearing for long stretches in the season) for far less frogskins; Cletidus’ dead cap of $20M gives us pigs an excuse not to spend frogskins on hotshot players til the goddamn CBA forces us to!

Absence of Butte, which vet currently on the Packers roster is worthy of a big contract? Only J-Alex. Perhaps Gary Lightbody, too, if he can continue to ascend post injury. The dead money of Amos, Tonyan, Crosby, Lowry, and even Butte, among others, ain’t gonna mean shit in 3 years when the Packers will be something like $100M under the cap - which will force them to go on a spending spree, per the CBA.

[texaspackerbacker]

Where to start, so much to comment on hahahahaha.

APB, as always, great job analyzing the cap; Lousy job analyzing Clark. That chart somebody posted a while back about the cap and dead money and where all the teams stand really said it all. Pushing things to the limit is really the way to go if you want to win - that plus getting lucky is the formula. Yeah, dead money is already paid; Yeah also, it counts against the cap; The thing is, it gets spead out.

That spreading out, runpMc, is the answer to "what I'd do about Bakhtiari's contract". First of all, I'm not the one to ask, because I have way lower regard for that sacred cow than just about anybody. But assuming (dubiously) that he is worth keeping, you just do what has been done with so many other good players, extend extend extend, and don't worry about the fact the cap hits continue after the guy is gone. Similarly, Aaron Jones shouldn't have a cap hit of $17 million, but he absolutely shouldn't be gone. In other words, he more than any others mentioned should be extended and the cap hit spread out. The Panthers were stupid to get rid of the players they got rid of, but that's somebody else's problem.

As for a "bright future" with Love, Watson, Doubs, etc., Watson is gonna be absolutely great if he stays healthy, but he will probably go to waste to a great extent with Love rather than Rodgers at QB. Doubs is like a lot of other WRs around the league, ok, maybe even good, but not great. If the Packers are gonna be anything other than solidly below average with Love as QB, Aaron Jones is one key, and the D stepping up - as is highly unlikely with Joe Barry - is the other key. That, a healthy Watson, and special teams not blowing it, and you get up to maybe 9 or 10 wins. I would think 5-8 wins is a lot more likely. That's what's on that page ya'all want to turn to. Be careful what you wish for.

[Anti-Polar Bear]

Tex, what do you call someone who produces 3 sacks season, is a milksop in the trench, especially vs the run, and does more disappearing acts than a teenager flipping burgers - all while getting paid $18M/yr?

A: An overrated, overpaid, underachiever.

[texaspackerbacker]

I call him a top five, maybe top 2 or 3 interior D Lineman in the league who gets way too much blocking attention due to lesser players around him (maybe Wyatt will help that situation) and a scheme where a lot of what he's supposed to do is occupy blockers while the LBs zoom in or out to make the tackles and get the sacks.

[run pMc]

I tend to lean closer to Tex's assessment of Kenny Clark. He's a bit overpaid and didn't have a great year, but he has had very little help on the DL and is frequently doubled teamed.

per https://www.packersnews.com/

For the season, he was double-teamed on 190 of his 809 defensive snaps or 23.5% of the time. He was doubled on 120 pass plays and 70 run plays.
By comparison, Gary was double-teamed on 15.4% of his 376 snaps. Surprisingly, he was doubled on just 10.5% of pass plays.


Who gives a fuck about being hit with a dead money of $20M when you gain an extra $3M in cap space?
Depends on the player and how tight against the cap you are.
When you cook the cap, the money does not just evaporate away, you still have to account for it in a future cap year. The cap is not unlimited. Each restructure is essentially a new loan, borrowed against future cap space.

If you think Jaire is the only player worthy of a big contract, you'd be letting a number of very good players go. I'm not sure I'd go that far.
As for Bahktiari's contract, they just redid it for this year, pushing money out until next year - his final year. That they didn't add any void years is telling. It likely means he either doesn't want to do any favors for GB, or he wants to keep open the possibility of an extension. Void years can get in the way of that.

[Joemailman]

OBJ going to Ravens.

[Fritz]

OBJ going to Ravens.

Plays three games, makes an impact. Packer fans bitch that Guter didn't sign him. Gets hurt in fourth game - just an "aggravating" injury. Misses two games. Comes back. Plays in two more. Gets hurt again. etc, etc.

[Teamcheez1]

OBJ going to Ravens.

The shocker is they’re paying him $15M guaranteed. This to a guy who has barely played the last 3 years with 2 ACL injuries and the wrong side of 30.

[run pMc]

Ravens WR group has not been very good, especially after they traded Hollywood Brown. He's the de facto #1 and he has guaranteed money. Not a bad setup for him.
I also wonder if he knows something about the Lamar situation. I can't believe he's so concerned with only the money that he'd play for a team without a top 10 QB. Tyler Huntley isn't bad, but IIRC he's on a one year RFA deal and he's no Lamar.

Weird signing. He wasn't a fit for GB, schematically or cap-wise anyway.

[Fritz]

Ravens WR group has not been very good, especially after they traded Hollywood Brown. He's the de facto #1 and he has guaranteed money. Not a bad setup for him.
I also wonder if he knows something about the Lamar situation. I can't believe he's so concerned with only the money that he'd play for a team without a top 10 QB. Tyler Huntley isn't bad, but IIRC he's on a one year RFA deal and he's no Lamar.

Weird signing. He wasn't a fit for GB, schematically or cap-wise anyway.

I don't know if anyone else in the league would've even come close to matching that number, given what his injury history/age is. So at that rate, I kinda doubt OBJ would care if Brett Hundey's mom was throwing the football for the Ravens.

Weirdly overpaid for what they're going to get.

[run pMc]

Lions trade Jeff Okudah to ATL for a R5 pick.
Okudah was the #3 overall pick a few years back. He's had injury problems and has been inconsistent but with good coaching and support around him is young enough where he could still be decent.

Prevailing theory is DET will take a CB with one of their R1 picks.

[Fritz]

Lions trade Jeff Okudah to ATL for a R5 pick.
Okudah was the #3 overall pick a few years back. He's had injury problems and has been inconsistent but with good coaching and support around him is young enough where he could still be decent.

Prevailing theory is DET will take a CB with one of their R1 picks.

Lions really pooped the bed on that one.

But that was the previous GM, who came from the scraggly Belichik coaching bush.

[run pMc]

I actually liked what I saw of Okudah his last year at OSU. Thought he was a good prospect coming out. I still think he could be good in the right system.
Detroit has until recently been such a dysfunctional place that a change of scenery will probably do him good.

The previous GM and Matt Patricia were... not good. I think Flores might be the only Belichick coach to do much good after NE. Josh McDaniels is a good OC, but I don't know that he has what it takes to be a HC. Rich Bissacia took that LV team to the playoffs as interim HC after the Gruden mess, and they took a big step back under McDaniels.

People complain about Gute and his drafts, and he's definitely made some mistakes, but if you look around the rest of the NFCN you see the other teams haven't done better with what they've had to work with.

[Fritz]

Lots of guys still lingering out there, including Cobb and Lewis, I think.

[run pMc]

They'll sign post-draft, or post-Rodgers trade.
As veteran guys to help rookies/young players they'd be great adds, but I wouldn't play them much. There's not much juice left in either player.

[Fritz]

They'll sign post-draft, or post-Rodgers trade.
As veteran guys to help rookies/young players they'd be great adds, but I wouldn't play them much. There's not much juice left in either player.

They would both have some value - Lewis as blocker and mentor if they draft an athletic tight end who does not know how to block - and Cobb as a third-down safety valve and someone to teach the young WR's how to be a pro.

But is that worth two roster spots? Heck, I don't know.

[sharpe1027]

They would both have some value - Lewis as blocker and mentor if they draft an athletic tight end who does not know how to block - and Cobb as a third-down safety valve and someone to teach the young WR's how to be a pro.

But is that worth two roster spots? Heck, I don't know.

No

[RashanGary]

So Harvey, at the top of the draft, who are we hoping for at 15 as a perfect fit?

[MadScientist]

Cobb wad a good safety valve.for Rodgers, but he won't be as useful for Love, with them running the MLF offense, instead of the Rodgers offense. The vet mentoring has some value, but not at the expense of better talent.

[run pMc]

I agree you don't want to sign Cobb over drafting a WR with upside, but if they can keep a roster spot for Johnathon Ford (who didn't play a single snap) and all these special teams safeties, they could find a spot for a veteran who can help the young guys for one more year and potentially be a deep bench backup for fair catching punts and being an outlet on 3rd and 4.

(EDIT: I can't believe I'm making an argument for keeping Cobb. I'm fine if they don't.)

Cobb may not have value because JLove is now the QB, I'm not sure. If they draft 2 WRs I don't think they'd try to bring him back. I don't think Gute wants him back anyway, he probably has the Rodgers stank on him.
They'll probably go after another Sammy Watkins type and release them mid-season. It's entirely possible the one year Cobb, Watkins and Lazard had with the rookies was enough to point them in the right direction for this year, although it's early in their careers to be the old guys in the WR room.

My guess is they do something like Mingo and/or Wicks in R4-5 and just hope there's good coaching to bring the whole bunch along.

[sharpe1027]

There's a reason Cobb is still available. He wasn't getting open last year. Without Rodgers targeting him, I suspect they can get as much out of undrafted FA at this point.

[Bretsky]

along with Cobb we can bring back Geronimo Allison and Ruvell Martin. They are all about the same to me

[Bretsky]

So Harvey, at the top of the draft, who are we hoping for at 15 as a perfect fit?


The OSU WR or the Iowa Edge would be really nice fits

[Fritz]

Cobb wad a good safety valve.for Rodgers, but he won't be as useful for Love, with them running the MLF offense, instead of the Rodgers offense. The vet mentoring has some value, but not at the expense of better talent.


I've argued occasionally that a player like Mercedes Lewis could be a good signing for his leadership and mentoring. But then it occurs to me - isn't that what the coaches are for? And so many of these coaches are former players, anyway.

[Bretsky]

[/B]

I've argued occasionally that a player like Mercedes Lewis could be a good signing for his leadership and mentoring. But then it occurs to me - isn't that what the coaches are for? And so many of these coaches are former players, anyway.



I don't want "2" roster spots used up by Joey and Mercedes.

[Joemailman]

The Philadelphia Eagles and quarterback Jalen Hurts have reached agreement on a five-year, $255 million extension, including $179.304 million guaranteed, a source told ESPN's Adam Schefter on Monday.

Hurts' deal is the biggest total contract in NFL history, besting Deshaun Watson's $230 million contract signed last year with the Cleveland Browns. Watson's contract, however, is fully guaranteed.

Hurts extension includes a no-trade clause -- a first in Eagles history, a source told Schefter.

A lot of money. But the fact this is not fully guaranteed is not good news for Lamar Jackson.

[bobblehead]

So Harvey, at the top of the draft, who are we hoping for at 15 as a perfect fit?

They should almost certainly go BPA since it will be a CB, EDGE or OL. Given the makeup of the top 15 players in this draft its doubtful it would be any other position. Any of those 3 help the roster. There is no such thing as too many pass rushers or shut down corners. And an OL can't be "too strong".

Then in the 2nd round grab 2 TEs.

[run pMc]

They should almost certainly go BPA since it will be a CB, EDGE or OL. Given the makeup of the top 15 players in this draft its doubtful it would be any other position. Any of those 3 help the roster. There is no such thing as too many pass rushers or shut down corners. And an OL can't be "too strong".

Then in the 2nd round grab 2 TEs.

Agree. BPA and it's probably OL, EDGE or CB. I really don't know how they manage that secondary, maybe Barry can deploy 4 CB defense.

[run pMc]

A lot of money. But the fact this is not fully guaranteed is not good news for Lamar Jackson.

Yeah, 5 years $255M is a lot of money for Hurts. I think he's good and I actually liked him over JLove that draft year, but I don't think he's that good. QB market is crazy though... even middling ones are expensive.
Anyway, good for Philly, they have a QB signed long term.
As for Lamar, dude needs to suck it up and realize he's not getting a fully guaranteed contract. Not with his play-style/injury history.

Players who negotiate without an agent can often end up with hard feelings towards the team. I think Rashan Gary is this way?

[Fritz]

They should almost certainly go BPA since it will be a CB, EDGE or OL. Given the makeup of the top 15 players in this draft its doubtful it would be any other position. Any of those 3 help the roster. There is no such thing as too many pass rushers or shut down corners. And an OL can't be "too strong".

Then in the 2nd round grab 2 TEs.


I assume you're assuming the Jets trade goes through?

I suppose you are right in your analysis, but if they take a corner, I'll be unhappy now - then probably glad they did it in two years.

I don't know what to make of Stokes. He was so, so promising his first year, and then his second year was not very good at all - and then he sustained a serious injury. So I have no idea what to expect. I wonder what happened to him in that second year? He just wasn't nearly as good.

[MadScientist]

Five players suspended, including four from Detroit. https://www.reuters.com/sports/nfl/five-players-suspended-violating-nfl-gambling-policy-2023-04-21/

[red]

Cobb wad a good safety valve.for Rodgers, but he won't be as useful for Love, with them running the MLF offense, instead of the Rodgers offense. The vet mentoring has some value, but not at the expense of better talent.

yeah, great safety valve. paid him 8.4 million over the last 2 years to catch 28 and 34 passes. and just 1 TD last year when when he was the only real vet with lizard and a bunch of rookies. and he still couldn't get targets

and don't forget he's the one the spilled the beans about eric calling audibles to the rookies that he hasn't used in a decade and then bitching at them for somehow not knowing them. maybe that why he didn't get many looks?

[run pMc]

For the cap cooking crowd: after the Rodgers trade, GB will have $57.1M in dead money. Per OTC:

Dead Money
Name Cap Number
Aaron Rodgers $40,313,570
Adrian Amos $7,950,000
Dean Lowry $3,007,875
Jarran Reed $1,492,000
Randall Cobb $1,391,668
Marcedes Lewis $1,050,000
Mason Crosby $1,005,000
Robert Tonyan $500,000
Amari Rodgers $461,782
TOTAL $57,143,579

The Base Salary Cap is $224,800,000

[Joemailman]

For the cap cooking crowd: after the Rodgers trade, GB will have $57.1M in dead money. Per OTC:

Dead Money
Name Cap Number
Aaron Rodgers $40,313,570
Adrian Amos $7,950,000
Dean Lowry $3,007,875
Jarran Reed $1,492,000
Randall Cobb $1,391,668
Marcedes Lewis $1,050,000
Mason Crosby $1,005,000
Robert Tonyan $500,000
Amari Rodgers $461,782
TOTAL $57,143,579

The Base Salary Cap is $224,800,000

nm

[Joemailman]

For the cap cooking crowd: after the Rodgers trade, GB will have $57.1M in dead money. Per OTC:

Dead Money
Name Cap Number
Aaron Rodgers $40,313,570
Adrian Amos $7,950,000
Dean Lowry $3,007,875
Jarran Reed $1,492,000
Randall Cobb $1,391,668
Marcedes Lewis $1,050,000
Mason Crosby $1,005,000
Robert Tonyan $500,000
Amari Rodgers $461,782
TOTAL $57,143,579

The Base Salary Cap is $224,800,000

You can always cook the cap.

https://media3.giphy.com/media/YJjvTqoRFgZaM/200.webp?cid=ecf05e47q6zmmevj3iqjaergd5idmw9at9ly9 mfkjfsz3jih&ep=v1_gifs_search&rid=200.webp&ct=g

[call_me_ishmael]

Packers are gonna have so much damn cap space next year OMG. Big shopping spree for that dude.

[run pMc]

Packers are gonna have so much damn cap space next year OMG. Big shopping spree for that dude.

Aaron Jones and David Bahktiari have big cap numbers next year because of all the restructuring. My guess is they will trade/release Bahktiari and gain cap relief, but lose a very good LT. I think they'll keep Jones.
They also need to sign Gary to a long term contract, and 5th year option Jordan Love.

They will definitely have cap space to operate, but I wouldn't expect a big spending spree. It only looks like they have more cap space than they actually will.

[RashanGary]

Aaron Jones and David Bahktiari have big cap numbers next year because of all the restructuring. My guess is they will trade/release Bahktiari and gain cap relief, but lose a very good LT. I think they'll keep Jones.
They also need to sign Gary to a long term contract, and 5th year option Jordan Love.

They will definitely have cap space to operate, but I wouldn't expect a big spending spree. It only looks like they have more cap space than they actually will.

Yeah. They’re back in a decent spot. Within a year or two the cap will be completely back to healthy. It’s nice to have that flexibility to make a financial run of pushing things ahead. They kind of exhausted that the last three years and need to start over.

[RashanGary]

Lamar got 260 with 185 guaranteed. Hurts got 255 with 180 guaranteed. I don’t think Lamar got a great deal. I feel like he’s worth more than Hurts. But I guess Hurts is a little more accurate.

[red]

Lamar got 260 with 185 guaranteed. Hurts got 255 with 180 guaranteed. I don’t think Lamar got a great deal. I feel like he’s worth more than Hurts. But I guess Hurts is a little more accurate.

i don't think it matters who is better. the next guy up is gonna get a touch more money then the last. as long as you're a top 10 QB

[texaspackerbacker]

I read that Rasul Douglas just hinted in a Tweet that the Packers may be bringing back Adrian Amos. Good news if true, IMO.

[Fritz]

My god, I agree with Tex about something. I think a back end of Darnell "Whiff" Savage and a bunch of late-round picks, UDFA's, and the free agent they signed for ST is not going to cut it. You're not even using a talented young guy who can use the year to learn. You're just throwing bodies out there. Bring Amos back, see if any of the chaff has the potential to become wheat, and look for a safety in the next draft.

[Joemailman]

Packers have not issued uniform numbers 2, 31 and 89 to any of the rookies. Mason Crosby, Adrian Amos and Marcedes Lewis. So there's a chance.

[Joemailman]

My god, I agree with Tex about something. I think a back end of Darnell "Whiff" Savage and a bunch of late-round picks, UDFA's, and the free agent they signed for ST is not going to cut it. You're not even using a talented young guy who can use the year to learn. You're just throwing bodies out there. Bring Amos back, see if any of the chaff has the potential to become wheat, and look for a safety in the next draft.

Packers also have Tarvarius Moore, who they signed in March. He started 8 games for 49ers in 2020. He was hurt in 2021 and played mostly special teams in 2022.

[Sparkey]

Crazy how if they bring back Amos, they still have his dead cap number plus whatever they sign him for.

[smuggler]

That's the nature of shifting cap into dead years.

[Fosco33]

I saw Jones to Baltimore and Bacteria to Chiefs as rumors. Would love to see that - if you’re gonna rebuild - cut the capfat, stock the picks and hope for the best.

[Spaulding]

I saw Jones to Baltimore and Bacteria to Chiefs as rumors. Would love to see that - if you’re gonna rebuild - cut the capfat, stock the picks and hope for the best.

I don't know that the front office or coaches view is a rebuild, only inevitable change. Nothing helps a young QB like blind side protection and a good running game. Would hate to them trade either this year, especially Jones. I think they might surprise teams with the weaker schedule and go 9 and 8 or even possibly 10 and 7. That might be enough to make the playoffs in a weaker NFC too.

[texaspackerbacker]

Basically, they don't need a rebuild. They have successfully rebuilt on the fly pretty much all over the roster. Now all they need is a QB. If it was still Rodgers, the Packers would be the best in the league. With Love, who knows. Some people, especially some of the team's decision makers, think Love is the man. I'm doubtful of that, but I say lets give him a chance and not make stupid trades - tearing down to rebuild is ALWAYS stupid.

[MadScientist]

Basically, they don't need a rebuild. They have successfully rebuilt on the fly pretty much all over the roster. Now all they need is a QB. If it was still Rodgers, the Packers would be the best in the league. With Love, who knows. Some people, especially some of the team's decision makers, think Love is the man. I'm doubtful of that, but I say lets give him a chance and not make stupid trades - tearing down to rebuild is ALWAYS stupid.

I agree they have rebuilt on the fly. This team is loaded with potential. The receivers and especially the TE's need a bit more experience, but it looks like the talent is there. I think Love will be a good to very good QB in this system. If he gets better touch on the deep passes, he can be great. In the NFL tearing down and rebuilding rarely makes sense. It works in baseball because of lack of a cap and the existence of the minor leagues. There are too many players needed, and the draft is too much of a crap shoot to really make a full rebuild work.

[sharpe1027]

I agree they have rebuilt on the fly. This team is loaded with potential. The receivers and especially the TE's need a bit more experience, but it looks like the talent is there. I think Love will be a good to very good QB in this system. If he gets better touch on the deep passes, he can be great. In the NFL tearing down and rebuilding rarely makes sense. It works in baseball because of lack of a cap and the existence of the minor leagues. There are too many players needed, and the draft is too much of a crap shoot to really make a full rebuild work.

Arguably, they did the NFL version of a rebuild, which as you said isn't the same as other sports. They traded or let go in free agency former contributors and loaded up on a lot of draft picks in the process.

[Teamcheez1]

Interesting article on relative intelligence of fan bases

https://sports.yahoo.com/packers-fans-among-most-intelligent-144753738.html