QB experts, do Love’s fundamentals look better?

[RashanGary]

https://twitter.com/ArmedDangerQBS/status/1634298953557737472?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5 Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1634298953557737472%7Ctwgr% 5Ed4249132d6c4f58300f3d00a68abadea13f831f9%7Ctwcon %5Es1_c10&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fd-22848956853946256037.ampproject.net%2F230227154100 0%2Fframe.html

[RashanGary]

They said his left foot was coming down without great balance so his accuracy was affected. Sounds like he’s working on that. What about the throwing motion? Is that more compact?

Rodgers has said a few times he takes time to really hone in on one or two things. Im sure Jordan would have listened to coaches and gotten better, but it can’t hurt to have an all time great tell you to spend a lot of time just engraining one or two things at a time and slowly build your foundation like that.

[Joemailman]

His release is definitely quicker. He had a tendency to get hit as we was throwing in 2021 due in part to a slower release. It resulted in him getting an injured shoulder in the 1st preseason game. The quicker release combined with him processing things mentally faster makes him very different from the guy we saw in 2020-21.

[RashanGary]

His release is definitely quicker. He had a tendency to get hit as we was throwing in 2021 due in part to a slower release. It resulted in him getting an injured shoulder in the 1st preseason game. The quicker release combined with him processing things mentally faster makes him very different from the guy we saw in 2020-21.

Rodgers looks effortless in how he unleashes with that little hop motion where he’s just instantly spinning it. I wouldn’t say Love looks like that when he throws now, but he’s grown in that direction. He looks impressive the way he’s generating all that power in a fairly quick motion.

Who knows. These guys are impressive athletes. It’s hard for me to know if one guy is better than the next because they all look good to me.

[RashanGary]

I liked the way Rodgers style looked easier to get off when he was falling away or had to instantly get one off. Love’s looks a little more conventional. But Brady always looked really conventional and he’s been an all time great.

Peyton Manning, Phil Rivers and Drew Bree had little stutter steps and sort of slinged it in rhythm with those. Like
The small steps helped them stay balanced and didn’t take a lot of time so they could throw it when the time came.

I’ve seen guys do it different ways. Love seems to be trying to model Brady more than Rodgers or the shuffle step guys. I guess whatever feels natural to you and works.

[call_me_ishmael]

I just saw something from Rob Reischel about how the Packers really think he can be a great starter. If that's the case, there's no choice but to find out. Good starter? Maybe not, but a top 5-6 QB, yeah you've gotta kick the tires on that one and hope to get your 15 years before the inevitable one way ticket to the Big Apple.

[run pMc]

Yes, Love's fundamentals have improved. Rodgers had horrible fundamentals and fixed those, it can be done. Rodgers has a crazy arm so he can get away with a lot most QB can't or shouldn't.

Love's mobility isn't bad, his arm strength is fine, he can go to a 2nd or 3rd read, and his footwork is better than it was. He doesn't get flustered easily, his body language is generally good. Keeps his eyes downfield, doesn't scream like Brady.
Love will need to work on manipulating coverage with his eyes, and also reading coverages -- same as any young QB, but he's shown improvement from his college tape. His playing time last year showed an improvement over the previous year.

I think if MLF is anywhere as good as some think he should be able to coax some "good enough" QB play out of Jordan Love. The Shanahan offense is supposed to be QB friendly.
I am skeptical he's a top 5 QB, but I think he could have a few very good years, especially if surrounded with good skill players & scheme. If they can manage a passable defense they could even make some noise in a bad NFC. I'd rather have his contract (including the 5th year option) than Derek Carr's.

[Upnorth]

I cant not comment on fundamentals, but I can comment on how great it is to see Jones, Watson and Doubs working out together in Cali. Need to fly Rolle in there as Toure in there as well.

I remember seeing a cut up of two qbs throwing side by side years ago. I believe it was Tebow and Brady. The wind up and release was a stark stark difference. I dont care too much about technique (i cant see it one way or another) but a slow release is a death blow. How fast does Love's Release look compared to other elite qbs?

[run pMc]

His release isn't the quickest, and it still is a little elongated but it's better than it was. I think it's quick enough but could be improved. Would be very interesting to see a side by side of AR and JL. Might have to dig some up.

Meanwhile, here are JL's throws vs. PHI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gkIONmDiN4E
You can see he's more polished with feet and delivery. There are things MLF can work with but I'm not sure he'll be elite.

Edit: here's from the NO preseason game. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7w8x2wGNCoc
Granted it's preseason but he's not awful. Is he good though? I need more data lol.
Gute and MLF have seen enough to be ok going forward with him.

Edit2: here's preseason the year before(2021): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XrOgoOQ148w
he looks more polished in the NO game.

[RashanGary]

I see the biggest difference from between the 2021 tape to the eagles. He seems more comfortable with his feet.

The latest workout tapes he looks more controlled after delivery. He used to spin around after the throw and he unbalanced where now he looks balanced. But that’s with no one rushing him.

It looks like his release speeded up a little, but after watching Rodgers, it seems a tick slow for sure.

[RashanGary]

I watched a video where they broke frames way down and compared Rodgers to Marino. They’re about equal with release.

[RashanGary]

Watched some Marino highlights. Different from Rodgers in that Rodgers really exaggerated that little hop thing, but similar in that they look like they’re throwing darts more than winding up and throwing a football.

[MadtownPacker]

In the Eagles game Love appeared taller and stronger in the pocket and was decisive in his throws. I don’t give a damn what you say everyone caught the passes he threw when we saw him last season. His passes actually looked smooth and catchable. Hitting guys in stride for easy YAC Maybe I am biased and imagined it that way but the rest of you fucks didn’t imagine it that way too?

Where Harlan in this subject?

[Joemailman]

I see the biggest difference from between the 2021 tape to the eagles. He seems more comfortable with his feet.

The latest workout tapes he looks more controlled after delivery. He used to spin around after the throw and he unbalanced where now he looks balanced. But that’s with no one rushing him.

It looks like his release speeded up a little, but after watching Rodgers, it seems a tick slow for sure.

If you're going to compare his release to that of Rodgers, it's going to look a bit slow. But you can probably say the same thing about every other QB in the NFL.

[Fritz]

One area that Love still needs to work on is the eye-roll. But I think that comes with experience and confidence.

[Sparkey]

His work with Tom Clements is paying off. Clements is an incredible QB coach. A former CFL qb, he knows how to talk "qb". Is it any coincidence that the arrival of Clements coincides with the progress Love has made with his footwork and carriage.



https://cheeseheadtv.com/blog/packers-retention-of-tom-clements-is-big-news-for-jordan-love-118

"It's the things we've worked on the most, which is footwork, the proper drop, going through your progression, not getting stuck on a receiver, not being late with the ball," Clements said of Love after his appearance against the Philadelphia Eagles. "We work on different route concepts each week, we did a lot in the spring, but then you have to see it play out when you have a defense out there. You have to be able to go from 1-2-3 to your outlet quickly, and you can't lock on a guy. You have to process information quickly, figure out where to go, and your footwork plays into that as well. If your feet are right, and you're seeing things right, you're able to decide where to go with the ball. His footwork, rhythm and getting the ball off on time is where he's gotten a lot better.”

[run pMc]

Clements was a good hire. Was a little surprised he came back this year, but am glad he did. I think he's important in JL's development, he certainly helped AR.

[Tony Oday]

I 100% hope I am wrong but man Love just doesn't look good when he plays, again I hope he is a top 10 QB, hell I hope he is the best QB to play for the Pack I just do not see it.

[Upnorth]

I watched a video where they broke frames way down and compared Rodgers to Marino. They’re about equal with release.

Considering I always thought Marino was on another level to everyone else ever then love will be slower than 12 by default.

[RashanGary]

One area that Love still needs to work on is the eye-roll. But I think that comes with experience and confidence.

LMFAO!!!!

[RashanGary]

Considering I always thought Marino was on another level to everyone else ever then love will be slower than 12 by default.

Yeah. They broke the frames way down. The guy said he was hearing Marino was the quickest ever and wanted to compare. It was dead equal. Rodgers might have been a hair quicker.

Both guys look like they’re throwing darts.

[Joemailman]

Clements was a good hire. Was a little surprised he came back this year, but am glad he did. I think he's important in JL's development, he certainly helped AR.

One more reason to be optimistic about Love. I don't think he's be back if he thought Love was a hopeless cause.

[red]

i'd like to see a QB run lefluers system and actually allow jones and dillon to run the ball more then rodgers allowed them to

a QB that hits the easy wide open throw over the middle instead of always trying for the low percentage ball deep along the sideline

the one small chance that rodgers allowed love to take the field this year, we saw that.

i think theres a reason that rodgers didn't take anymore snaps off after we all saw that love looked half way decent. if rodgers was that scared, then maybe we should all have some hope

[Fritz]

I'm with ya on that, Red. I'm actually excited to see a QB run LeFleur's system, see how it actually looks in action. As in the latter MM years, I think Rodgers bent the offensive system to his will, so I don't think we've really seen what a pure LeFleur system will look like.

I'm also excited by the possibility that the Packers won't end every half with only one timeout because they used them up waiting til the last second every play to get the play off. Very exciting. Maybe even occasionally run the hurry-up and try to put the other team's defense on its heels.

[RashanGary]

If your tendency on 3rd and short is to never take deep shots, defenses can dial in and stop you more consistently. Rodgers Packers were unpredictable on 3rd and short so the defense had to cover the whole field. Those shots help in other ways.

[red]

If your tendency on 3rd and short is to never take deep shots, defenses can dial in and stop you more consistently. Rodgers Packers were unpredictable on 3rd and short so the defense had to cover the whole field. Those shots help in other ways.

True, but you don’t have to run the deep route on 3rd and short every single time. And you don’t always have to throw to the deep guy every time when you have 3 other guys open short but past the marker

If you want to go deep on the first 3rd and short of the game, fine. Wanna do it the second time, cool. If you want to do it late in the game when we just need a drive to eat up clock or to give the defense a breather, not such a good time

[Joemailman]

Who knew you could utilize speed in the middle of the field like this?


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y0le1gJqspg

[call_me_ishmael]

Is that Love or a blown coverage though? My understanding is Aaron doesn't throw over the middle often but I would be shocked if he wouldn't make that throw.

[Joemailman]

Is that Love or a blown coverage though? My understanding is Aaron doesn't throw over the middle often but I would be shocked if he wouldn't make that throw.

It's called getting rid of the ball quickly and in rhythm so the receiver has a chance to make a move before the defender is on him. Something Rodgers didn't do enough of in recent years, especially last year.

[Fritz]

Joe, you've been a bad boy. The NFL has blocked your video. Be ready for some goombas with vinyl jackets featuring The Shield to come knocking on your door some night soon.

[ThunderDan]

Is that Love or a blown coverage though? My understanding is Aaron doesn't throw over the middle often but I would be shocked if he wouldn't make that throw.

Seriously, you are asking this question. ARod has been completely averse to throwing over the middle. I can't count how many times in the game day thread people commented on the WR, RB, TE running across the middle wide open at the 1st down marker and ARod going for the 20 yard sideline throw instead.

[call_me_ishmael]

Seriously, you are asking this question. ARod has been completely averse to throwing over the middle. I can't count how many times in the game day thread people commented on the WR, RB, TE running across the middle wide open at the 1st down marker and ARod going for the 20 yard sideline throw instead.

Sure, no doubt he doesn't always do it. But this throw to 9 was wide open, it's not like Rodgers _never_ does it. I have little doubt Rodgers would have made this throw.

This data driven read implies he throws over the middle on ~25% of throws, which is much lower than the league leaders at ~50%

https://www.acmepackingcompany.com/by-the-numbers/2020/5/7/21247582/aaron-rodgers-packers-pass-direction-middle-of-field-shot-selection-2019

[Fritz]

Sure, no doubt he doesn't always do it. But this throw to 9 was wide open, it's not like Rodgers _never_ does it. I have little doubt Rodgers would have made this throw.

This data driven read implies he throws over the middle on ~25% of throws, which is much lower than the league leaders at ~50%

https://www.acmepackingcompany.com/by-the-numbers/2020/5/7/21247582/aaron-rodgers-packers-pass-direction-middle-of-field-shot-selection-2019

Given that, I suppose if you're an opposing team's DC, you'd edge your coverage over to the sidelines, figuring unless someone was running wide, wide open over the middle, Arod wasn't going to go there. Makes Adams's over-the-back-shoulder grabs even more amazing.

[run pMc]

Given that, I suppose if you're an opposing team's DC, you'd edge your coverage over to the sidelines, figuring unless someone was running wide, wide open over the middle, Arod wasn't going to go there. Makes Adams's over-the-back-shoulder grabs even more amazing.

I think he eschews throws in the middle of the field because they are more likely to be intercepted there. They are easier throws, but there are usually more lurking defenders to watch for.
The number of sideline throws Rodgers has been able to complete is incredible, but I think his accuracy at throwing them has diminished in recent years.

Avoiding use of the MOF is making it harder for yourself and your offense. I think JL will use it much more, but I also think he'll throw more picks.

Also, throwing a deep sideline pass on 3rd and short is stupid unless you drew someone offside or you know you can convert on 4th down a la Jalen Hurts butt push.

[sharpe1027]

Interceptions stats are often overrated. I'll take occasional interceptions in exchange for multiple drive saving throws any day of the week. Most of the time, an interception leads to the same result as a poor punt.

[Fritz]

I do recall in the KC game a couple years ago that Love sure did seem like he had a long, slow windup. Sure, I've watched Rodgers for years, but I've seen a few other QB's over my football-watching life, and Love seemed super slow. I don't recall if he looked quicker against Philly; I imagine so.

[texaspackerbacker]

Wrong. Sharpe. One of if not the primary thing that makes Rodgers the GOAT is the mindset not to throw interceptions. We can only hope Love (if indeed he will be the next Packer QB) absorbed that and is approximately the same.

[Joemailman]

I do recall in the KC game a couple years ago that Love sure did seem like he had a long, slow windup. Sure, I've watched Rodgers for years, but I've seen a few other QB's over my football-watching life, and Love seemed super slow. I don't recall if he looked quicker against Philly; I imagine so.

I think it's much quicker. Not like Rodgers, but a big improvement.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iu-xeb0BF5M

[sharpe1027]

https://www.footballperspective.com/nfl-offenses-were-more-hurt-by-sacks-than-interceptions-in-2019/

Some pretty good arguments that sacks have more effect on a game than picks.

[sharpe1027]

Team records when finishing a game with 0 sacks:

2019: 49-16 (0.754)
2014-2018: 225-86-1 (0.723)
1990s: 472-166-0 (0.740)

Team records when finishing a game with 0 INTs:

2019: 153-90-1 (0.629)

2014-2018: 770-378-3 (0.670)

1990s: 1157-522-1 (0.689

[Fritz]

So the key would be mostly having a killer offensive line. Plus a QB who was squirrelly enough to avoid the sack.

[sharpe1027]

So the key would be mostly having a killer offensive line. Plus a QB who was squirrelly enough to avoid the sack.

Hard to say just from the base statistics. Fewer sack is sometimes the result of other things like a good running game or how the offense is setup and run.

[Fritz]

I just thought of something: the offensive line coach should make any offensive lineman who gives up a sack in a game wear . . .

wait for it . . .

a sackcloth the next week at practice.

[RashanGary]

Sacks happen more often at the end of the game when you’re losing and have to pass too. So if you have a zero sack game, you’re likely to have been ahead.

Zero sack games are less common. You probably have a superior OL/QB/Running game if you give up zero sacks.


I’m not surprised zero sack games lead to more wins than zero interception games.

[sharpe1027]

Sacks happen more often at the end of the game when you’re losing and have to pass too. So if you have a zero sack game, you’re likely to have been ahead.

Zero sack games are less common. You probably have a superior OL/QB/Running game if you give up zero sacks.


I’m not surprised zero sack games lead to more wins than zero interception games.

Can't you say the same thing for interceptions?

[run pMc]

https://www.footballperspective.com/nfl-offenses-were-more-hurt-by-sacks-than-interceptions-in-2019/

Some pretty good arguments that sacks have more effect on a game than picks.


Among other reasons, this is why TD/INT ratio is becoming a near useless statistic. The worst plays for an offense are no longer interceptions, because they are so rare. The worst plays now are sacks, which happy more than three times as often, and are about 35-40% as harmful as a given interception.

I'd heard somewhere that a sack is roughly the equivalent of one-third of an INT, which seemed kind of a funny way to put it. The idea being that most drives that have a sack or an offensive penalty end without points. Personally, I think an INT can be pretty devastating, but a 40 yard heave that gets picked off is basically a punt and is less hurtful than a corner who picks off a late throw to the flat and houses it.

Avoiding interceptions and being turnover-adverse is important, but not at the expense of avoiding throws to certain parts of the field, or just taking what a defense is giving you. I noticed Rodgers started to really have an issue with that late in teh M3 years, and it's continued with MLF. He's proud (and protective) of his legacy as having the best TD-to-Int ratio, etc. I liked knowing that Rodgers wouldn't throw a pick, and it was always a shock when he did. Seeing open receivers on a TV broadcast be ignored is pretty annoying though. There's room for a middle ground there...it's not either/or. They can avoid turnovers AND use the MOF.

As for sacks, most football analysts and insiders believe it's largely a QB stat now, i.e., most sacks are the QBs fault. i'm not sure I'd go that far, but it's probably 2/3 their fault. Point is, the QB has the ball, they should have an internal clock telling them to either throw it on time or away.

Speaking of which, remember when (early in his career) the crowd used to cheer Brett Favre for throwing the ball away instead of trying to laser it into a non-existent window? I always thought that was funny.

[run pMc]

Sacks happen more often at the end of the game when you’re losing and have to pass too. So if you have a zero sack game, you’re likely to have been ahead.

Zero sack games are less common. You probably have a superior OL/QB/Running game if you give up zero sacks.


I’m not surprised zero sack games lead to more wins than zero interception games.

I'm not surprised zero sack games lead to wins either, they are more rare, and likely indicate you have an offense that is stopping the other team's pass rush cold. If your QB has time and a clean jersey, he's going to have a good day. More rare also could mean more fluky, statistically speaking.

Plenty of QBs have thrown a pick and won the game.

Perhaps a better indicator would be turnover margin. Not to be Captain Obvious, but I'd expect the team that turns the ball over less (or not at all) in a game is more likely to win a pretty significant amount of the time.

[sharpe1027]

I'm not surprised zero sack games lead to wins either, they are more rare, and likely indicate you have an offense that is stopping the other team's pass rush cold. If your QB has time and a clean jersey, he's going to have a good day. More rare also could mean more fluky, statistically speaking.

Plenty of QBs have thrown a pick and won the game.

Perhaps a better indicator would be turnover margin. Not to be Captain Obvious, but I'd expect the team that turns the ball over less (or not at all) in a game is more likely to win a pretty significant amount of the time.

Winning turnover margin by one means you win 66% of the time. It goes up even higher if you win by more than one.

That being said, correlation is not always the same as causation. It's likely that the turnover rate is higher when teams are trailing late in games. That means that losing a game causes some turnovers, which is kinda the opposite of turnovers causing a team to lose.

[sharpe1027]

Punts are turnovers too, they're just voluntary.

[MadScientist]

Team records when finishing a game with 0 sacks:

2019: 49-16 (0.754)
2014-2018: 225-86-1 (0.723)
1990s: 472-166-0 (0.740)

Team records when finishing a game with 0 INTs:

2019: 153-90-1 (0.629)

2014-2018: 770-378-3 (0.670)

1990s: 1157-522-1 (0.689

There are a lot more games where both teams have 0 picks than where both teams have 0 sacks. This is going to drive the win percentages down for a team with zero picks.

[sharpe1027]

https://www.footballperspective.com/guest-post-are-interceptions-overrated/#more-23508


Despite throwing a high number of picks, Luck has consistently won games, and erased double digit deficits in many of those victories. While interceptions are damaging to his overall stats (both traditional and advanced), his risk/reward balance is probably closer to optimal than any other quarterback in the league, especially considering his relatively weak supporting cast. In contrast, take a closer look at Aaron Rodgers. Despite owning the lowest interception rate in NFL history, he has a middling record in close games, and a downright terrible record when coming from behind. Why? He’s not taking the risks necessary to optimize his chances of winning. Even when trailing, which calls for a more aggressive strategy, Rodgers will usually take a sack rather than force a throw downfield. Avoiding interceptions keeps his stats looking pretty, but he has almost certainly left several wins on the table in the process

[Fritz]

https://www.footballperspective.com/guest-post-are-interceptions-overrated/#more-23508

And another big "ouch" to Tex, who has maintained that Rodgers's lack of interceptions is THE most important stat a QB can have. The reasoning here makes sense, to me at least.

[texaspackerbacker]

A BULLSHIT article by know-nothing media shithead if there ever was one - perfect for the haters, though.

[call_me_ishmael]

It is quite interesting. I wonder if the same data holds up for players that aren't Andy Luck. He's got luck in the last name for crying out loud!

[sharpe1027]

A BULLSHIT article by know-nothing media shithead if there ever was one - perfect for the haters, though.

Any comments on the data analysis to backup your personal opinion? If not, you're just another shithead media puke pretending your opinion is fact.

[run pMc]

A BULLSHIT article by know-nothing media shithead if there ever was one - perfect for the haters, though.


Any comments on the data analysis to backup your personal opinion? If not, you're just another shithead media puke pretending your opinion is fact.

I would also like to know what Tex's supportive points and overall argument are.
Please be specific.

[Fritz]

I can only imagine that at this moment Tex is scouring a thesaurus, looking for new words to say things like "shithead" and "dumbass" so he can respond to us.

What are we all doing? Let's get back to Love's fundamentals. I heard he's working out with Aaron Jones and Christian Watson and Romeo Doubs. "Hey, guys, how was my eye roll after that last crappy route you ran?"

[run pMc]

I can only imagine that at this moment Tex is scouring a thesaurus, looking for new words to say things like "shithead" and "dumbass" so he can respond to us.

What are we all doing? Let's get back to Love's fundamentals. I heard he's working out with Aaron Jones and Christian Watson and Romeo Doubs. "Hey, guys, how was my eye roll after that last crappy route you ran?"

Maybe they're working on their hand signals.

[sharpe1027]

While working out with your WRs in the off-season is not a guarantee of success, it sure cannot hurt.

[Bretsky]

A BULLSHIT article by know-nothing media shithead if there ever was one - perfect for the haters, though.


If they G'd dam media whore Karen Sharen wouldn't go on his no nothing ass kissing suck buddy on every Tuesday spewing his whining agenda's all this shit might have never happened

[Bretsky]

While working out with your WRs in the off-season is not a guarantee of success, it sure cannot hurt.

Honestly this is great to hear; Love working out with Aaron Jones, Dubster, and my favorite Watson is a great sign he's puting in the extra work and becoming a positive leader.

Once upon a time, a Packer quarterback, back in 2008, invited the entire team over to his joing for a barbeque, paid for it all, and showed leadership and team building potential. He made comments on how he's never going to go out like the guy he was replacing. Ya, not turning out that way.

[RashanGary]

Honestly this is great to hear; Love working out with Aaron Jones, Dubster, and my favorite Watson is a great sign he's puting in the extra work and becoming a positive leader.

Once upon a time, a Packer quarterback, back in 2008, invited the entire team over to his joing for a barbeque, paid for it all, and showed leadership and team building potential. He made comments on how he's never going to go out like the guy he was replacing. Ya, not turning out that way.

It’s crazy, young guys for the most part appreciate their opportunity and don’t take it for granted. After seeing late stage Favre evolve into a guy who felt so entitled that he didn’t have to show up for offseason work, you’d think Rodgers would have taken notice of how off putting that is to regular people who feel so blessed to have the chance to get filthy rich playing football. But he’s literally doing the same thing.

I guess the stardom and ass kissing that goes along with being a star QB is hard to resist. It made entitled ass holes out of back to back HOF QBs who have very different personality styles.

[George Cumby]

^ I'm fairly convinced having people fawn over someone 24/7 rewires their brains and not in a good way.

I'd love to see a study on it with brain scans.

[bobblehead]

Honestly this is great to hear; Love working out with Aaron Jones, Dubster, and my favorite Watson is a great sign he's puting in the extra work and becoming a positive leader.

Once upon a time, a Packer quarterback, back in 2008, invited the entire team over to his joing for a barbeque, paid for it all, and showed leadership and team building potential. He made comments on how he's never going to go out like the guy he was replacing. Ya, not turning out that way.

Pretty sure he never made any such comments. Its a nice touch and all, but it didn't actually happen.

[bobblehead]

^ I'm fairly convinced having people fawn over someone 24/7 rewires their brains and not in a good way.

I'd love to see a study on it with brain scans.

I'd like to be the person fawned over 24/7 for a decade and judge for myself.

[Fritz]

I really liked Samari Toure - why doesn't the poor bastard get invited to work out with these guys? I thought he showed some potential last year.

[George Cumby]

I'd like to be the person fawned over 24/7 for a decade and judge for myself.

Hahahahaha.

Good point.

Need to increase the sample size so I'll join you as a test subject.

[bobblehead]

We need a poll:

I hated the Love pick and predicted he would flop, but now I hate Rodgers so I'm convincing myself he has improved so much he will be the next HoF Packer QB

Needs to be a choice.

[Bretsky]

Pretty sure he never made any such comments. Its a nice touch and all, but it didn't actually happen.

I admit I listen to all the Packer media guys. So you can several of them liars or not...depending on your views. They are the ones who have stated the comments part in talking with the youthful Aaron Rodgers, who honestly was not treated well at all by BF.

[Bretsky]

We need a poll:

I hated the Love pick and predicted he would flop, but now I hate Rodgers so I'm convincing myself he has improved so much he will be the next HoF Packer QB

Needs to be a choice.


I'm confused; what poll do you want ? I'll make it if it hasn't been done yet

[MadtownPacker]

I'd like to be the person fawned over 24/7 for a decade and judge for myself.I doubt you would act much different than you do now. :lol: