Packers vs. Saints Discussion Thread

[Joemailman]

Packers lead all-time series 17-10.

Last meeting: September 12, 2021. Packers lost to Saints 38-3 on opening weekend in a game played in Jacksonville.

Saints are 1-0 after beating Tennessee Titans 16-15 week 1. They play on Monday Night week 2 at Carolina.

Derek Carr is now their QB. Chris Olave is their top receiver. With Kamara suspended, Jamaal Williams is their top RB.

Early odds have Packers favored by 2.

Moneyline: Saints +105, Packers -125

Over/under 43

[texaspackerbacker]

I was way off about the Atlanta game, naively thinking maybe Joe Barry finally figured out now to be a DC, and underestimating the Falcons running game. I had seen Bijan Robinson play at U. Texas, and he didn't seem that impressive.

As for the Saints, I'm probably gonna risk getting burned the same way again. Jamal Williams and whoever else don't run like Bijan. And Carr is a more traditional QB. Running QBs are always scary - the reason it seemed so impressive the way we handled Justin Fields. Why Barry wouldn't or couldn't apply some of the same stuff against Atlanta, I'm not sure. I think the Packer D will get the job done against New Orleans and Barry will get more credit than he deserves.

Even if Jones and Watson still can't play, I expect the Packers to move the ball and score pretty well, and I strongly suspect Jones to play.

[QBME]

Saints looked average at best tonight against Carolina.

[Joemailman]

Saints looked average at best tonight against Carolina.

Saints defense has dominated, albeit against mediocre offenses. They're nothing special on offense.

[NewsBruin]

They're going to start a practice-squadder at RB with Kamara suspended and Jamaal injured.

And if you get the chance, listen to the Saints' broadcast team. Deuce McAllister is a joy of a color analyst.

[SudsMcBucky]

I was way off about the Atlanta game, naively thinking maybe Joe Barry finally figured out now to be a DC, and underestimating the Falcons running game. I had seen Bijan Robinson play at U. Texas, and he didn't seem that impressive.

As for the Saints, I'm probably gonna risk getting burned the same way again. Jamal Williams and whoever else don't run like Bijan. And Carr is a more traditional QB. Running QBs are always scary - the reason it seemed so impressive the way we handled Justin Fields. Why Barry wouldn't or couldn't apply some of the same stuff against Atlanta, I'm not sure. I think the Packer D will get the job done against New Orleans and Barry will get more credit than he deserves.

Even if Jones and Watson still can't play, I expect the Packers to move the ball and score pretty well, and I strongly suspect Jones to play.

You watched Bijan play for Texas and your takeaway was that he wasn't that impressive??? Interesting take.

[ThunderDan]

They're going to start a practice-squadder at RB with Kamara suspended and Jamaal injured.

And if you get the chance, listen to the Saints' broadcast team. Deuce McAllister is a joy of a color analyst.

And so, Barry won't think that the Saints will be able to run the ball and will play nickel defense the whole day as the Saints gash us over and over with the run.

[Fritz]

And so, Barry won't think that the Saints will be able to run the ball and will play nickel defense the whole day as the Saints gash us over and over with the run.

Joe Barely. Ugh. He sucks. You're probably right. The guy seems to have no sense of how to respond to what an offense is trying to do.

[texaspackerbacker]

I wonder sometimes if Barry himself or LaFleur or Gutekunst are exposed to this and other forums and postings to see how damn near unanimous it is among fans that Barry is totally worthless. I mean I can see them not being constantly swayed by fan views, but this has gotten so obvious that you'd think there would be some rumblings among the decision makers. Those of you who supposedly have inside knowledge if anybody, what if anything are you hearing?

[run pMc]

You watched Bijan play for Texas and your takeaway was that he wasn't that impressive??? Interesting take.

LOL yeah. I didn't watch him much but I could see the contact balance and the rare ability to make cuts at full speed. You never know for sure if they'll pan out in the pros until they play, but I think he's a future star at RB. He's gonna give a lot of teams problems.
The Falcons and Bears share some similarities, except the Falcons actually spent FA money on defense in areas that should help them improve, and they already had a good OL and Allgeier. CHI is bottom quarter level talent still, ATL is not.
Also, go back and watch some Justin Fields. That dude's confidence is shot. He's a fantastic athlete, but he's a slow processor with his reads and I think he doesn't trust himself or the offense anymore. After last year and these first 2 games, it sure looks like CHI has officially ruined him.

I haven't watched the Saints, but with no Kamara and no Jamaal they could have trouble running the ball, which is good for GB. Their OL is ok but not what it once was, and while Olave and Thomas are a good set of receivers I think GB can matchup and give them some trouble. Derek Carr is an average to slightly above average NFL starter, which isn't nothing but I'm not sure he's better than Jordan Love.

Hopefully Watson and Jones can play. Not having Elgton is worrisome. Does Bahktiari play? I don't trust Royce or Rhyan, and doubt they move Tom to LG and play Njiman unless they absolutely have to.
This is probably a better matchup than ATL tbh. If they can pressure Carr and prevent Olave/Thomas from going off, they have a good chance. GB's run D is still not great but their secondary is pretty good.

They have some good players on D but I feel like a lot of them are old now. I wonder if GB's speed at receiver and using a lot of pre-snap motion will give them problems.

Bottom line: NO travels from CAR to GB on a short week, I think GB bounces back from a tough ATL loss and narrowly wins.

[run pMc]

I have 3 issues with Barry as the DC hire:

(1) He's a nepotism hire who has a track record of poor results as a DC.
(2) He hasn't shown much ability to adjust his scheme to fit his players, which is how you capitalize on their strengths and innovate.
(3) For that matter, he's bad at adjustments, period. Especially in-game. He goes into a game with a plan and sticks with it, even if it doesn't work or the other team has figured out how to counter it. Exhibit A: Atlanta game. Sure didn't seem like they did much adjusting to stop the run in the 4Q. When a rookie is toting the rock all day at 6.5 yards a clip, you need to do something about it.

[beveaux1]

I have 3 issues with Barry as the DC hire:

(1) He's a nepotism hire who has a track record of poor results as a DC.
(2) He hasn't shown much ability to adjust his scheme to fit his players, which is how you capitalize on their strengths and innovate.
(3) For that matter, he's bad at adjustments, period. Especially in-game. He goes into a game with a plan and sticks with it, even if it doesn't work or the other team has figured out how to counter it. Exhibit A: Atlanta game. Sure didn't seem like they did much adjusting to stop the run in the 4Q. When a rookie is toting the rock all day at 6.5 yards a clip, you need to do something about it.

Why didn’t he call a run blitz to mess with the QB-RB timing? Why didn’t he replace Enegbare or Ford after it was obvious they were picking on that combination? Why was Wyatt on the field when he was collapsed on the run on almost every play? Even changing up the spacing of the DL might have shortened some of those runs because the gap would have changed.

Some of the problems are personnel, but some are scheme. If we can see it, they sure ought to be able to see it from a booth at the top of the stadium.

[bobblehead]

Saints defense has dominated, albeit against mediocre offenses. They're nothing special on offense.

Saints have longest run of holding teams under 21 points. Its over a season now. You don't do that by accident, that D is very good. My prediction is that we lose because they run for 300 yards and we can only put 17 on the board. Some people will blame our offense for being pathetic. Everyone will blame Joe Barry more.

[Fritz]

Well, when you have a young QB and a young offense and players are moving pieces, in and out with injury, you're more likely to cut them some slack, as opposed to a defense with the vast majority of its pieces in place, and the vast majority of those pieces being first-rounders.

And defense is supposed to start faster than offense.

So I'm ready to lay another turd at Joe Barely's feet, for sure. Unless the Packers lose 9 - 7 or something.

[run pMc]

Starting Saints safety Marcus Maye suspended for Substance violation. #alliteration

will miss Sunday's game.

[Fritz]

I've been wondering about another one of the Packers' infamous third-round picks: Sean Rhyan. He's in his second year now, and the usual fluff pieces appeared during training camp: he learned his lessons, he's playing faster and better because now he knows how it all works, etc etc. Okay. Now Elgton Jenkins goes out and we get . . . Rolled Royce Newman. Didn't Jon Runyan start starting by his second year? Don't a lot of guards usually figure it out after year one and become starters?

This does not bode well for yet another Green Bay third rounder. If he can't displace Rolled Royce, he's not that good, I don't think.

[run pMc]

I think they plugged Royce in because it was mid-game and he'd done it before.
I got the impression that Royce was not a given as the starter this week, it sounded like there would be "competition" for that, which I took to mean Rhyan and possibly Tom if he shifts over to LG and they put Njiman in at RT.

Jenkins has an MCL, which I took to mean he's out 4-6 weeks. Hopefully it's not more than that.

[Joemailman]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/F6ftgOrXEAA1WoC?format=jpg&name=medium

[Joemailman]

I think they plugged Royce in because it was mid-game and he'd done it before.
I got the impression that Royce was not a given as the starter this week, it sounded like there would be "competition" for that, which I took to mean Rhyan and possibly Tom if he shifts over to LG and they put Njiman in at RT.

Jenkins has an MCL, which I took to mean he's out 4-6 weeks. Hopefully it's not more than that.

MCL's can run 2-6 weeks. Packers have not yet placed Jenkins on IR, so they may be hoping it's less than 4.

[Anti-Polar Bear]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/F6ftgOrXEAA1WoC?format=jpg&name=medium

Holy fuck, the Baby Spice Girl (Christine) is limited participation. The over/under for how many plays Watson will play Sunday is 2.5. Put me down for the under, Bobble!

[Fritz]

It's worrisome to me that both Aaron Jones and Chistian Watson are still being either held out or limited. There are only four days until the game. I have a feeling they're both going to miss, again.

This is the part where, uh, Joe Barely's defense is supposed to carry the team. Saints' offense missing its two top running backs, piloted by an average NFL QB.

But then Taysom Hill wil probably run wild.

I get angry even thinking about how many resources have been put into this defense, and how lousy it's been.

[NewsBruin]

The Saints have rushing success using Taysom Hill QB Power formations, but they don't do entire games with it, and it exposes Taysom's deep wounded-duck throws.

[ThunderDan]

The Saints have rushing success using Taysom Hill QB Power formations, but they don't do entire games with it, and it exposes Taysom's deep wounded-duck throws.

Which should work perfectly against Barry's defensive scheme.

[Fritz]

Which should work perfectly against Barry's defensive scheme.

This is my concern. I just have no faith in that guy's ability to get the defense to rise to the occasion.

[Joemailman]

Most of the country, including Alaska and Hawaii will get Saints at Packers. Kenny Albert and Jonathan Vilma with the call. Northwest Wisconsin and most of Minnesota will get Chargers at Vikings. Kevin Kugler and Mark Sanchez with the call. LP of Michigan will get Falcons at Lions. Adam Amin and Mark Schlereth with the call.

https://506sports.com/2023/03-FOX-E.png

[run pMc]

matchup Jaire on Olave, Rasul on Thomas and hope that Shaheed doesn't burn Nixon too bad.
Pass rush the heck out of Carr and maybe he throws up a bad pick.

NO's OL has had some issues. I think there will be some running lanes for both teams. Going to be up to the defenses. I think NO's D will give Jordan Love some trouble.
Turnover battle will matter. Looks to me like Watson is doubtful and Jones is probable based on Thu practice.

I would hope/expect the defense to come out fired up, being at home and after last week. I'd want to wash that bad taste out of my mouth if I were a GB defender.

[smuggler]

Watson is going to ball out and you're going to be forced to cheer, APB.

Sadly, it won't be this wek...

[Joemailman]

MLF said Watson not practicing today was planned. Not a setback.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/F6k3AfrXIAABPR4?format=jpg&name=medium

[Sparkey]

LeFleur said they are juggling practice with guys because of the short week next week.

[Anti-Polar Bear]

Watson is going to ball out and you're going to be forced to cheer, APB.

Sadly, it won't be this wek...

Christine has a penchant for dropping rocks, but we ain’t questioning her game. We’re questioning her vag.

Butte played only 4 plays for the Jesters, and that’s still 4 times more plays than Christine has played. Suffice it to say, Christine “Baby Spice Girl” Watson is less reliable than a deadbeat dad who deserted his offspring.

Christine pisses me off more than a punter who refuses tackle pisses off the Kentucky.

[bobblehead]

It's worrisome to me that both Aaron Jones and Chistian Watson are still being either held out or limited. There are only four days until the game. I have a feeling they're both going to miss, again.

This is the part where, uh, Joe Barely's defense is supposed to carry the team. Saints' offense missing its two top running backs, piloted by an average NFL QB.

But then Taysom Hill wil probably run wild.

I get angry even thinking about how many resources have been put into this defense, and how lousy it's been.

I get angry when the pieces don't suck, but the product does. I mean our OLB room can play. The ability is undeniable. The only weakness are the safeties. The players all have talent and he can't design a gameplan, or get them to play in a way that stops Desmond Ridder.

[ThunderDan]

This is my concern. I just have no faith in that guy's ability to get the defense to rise to the occasion.

I think Barry gets them to rise to the occasion. He just doesn't have them in a position to succeed.

I really thought last week, a lot of Packers on the D played well. The issue was we were putting 6 in the box for a lot of the game. ATL went man to man and let their RBs run where they wanted. Barry needed to put 7 in the box and bring a safety down to help. Make ATL throw to beat you, not allow them to run for over 200 yards.

[SudsMcBucky]

Christine has a penchant for dropping rocks, but we ain’t questioning her game. We’re questioning her vag.

Butte played only 4 plays for the Jesters, and that’s still 4 times more plays than Christine has played. Suffice it to say, Christine “Baby Spice Girl” Watson is less reliable than a deadbeat dad who deserted his offspring.

Christine pisses me off more than a punter who refuses tackle pisses off the Kentucky.

:bclap::bclap::bclap:

[Joemailman]

Rob Demovsky
@RobDemovsky
Elgton Jenkins told ESPN that at this point he doesn’t believe that he will go on injured reserve.

Sprained MCLs can have varying return times but this means he could be back in fewer than 4 weeks.

He wasn’t wearing the knee brace today in the locker room.

[run pMc]

Good news on Jenkins. Before the MCL report came out, he had a bulky brace on it and would only say it wasn't season ending. I'm guessing he misses the next game and maybe has an outside chance of playing in the Thu game vs. DET.

[MadScientist]

Good news on Jenkins. Before the MCL report came out, he had a bulky brace on it and would only say it wasn't season ending. I'm guessing he misses the next game and maybe has an outside chance of playing in the Thu game vs. DET.

Given the short turnaround, I expect they will hold him out on the Thursday game and give him the extra 10 days. OTOH, if Watson is out this week, I think he will play Thursday.

[Joemailman]

Aaron Nagler
@AaronNagler

Coach says Aaron Jones, Christian Watson, David Bakhtiari, Lukas Van Ness and Jaire Alexander will be listed as Questionable to play against Saints.

[Bretsky]

Aaron Nagler
@AaronNagler

Coach says Aaron Jones, Christian Watson, David Bakhtiari, Lukas Van Ness and Jaire Alexander will be listed as Questionable to play against Saints.



Wonder how long Kristy is going to be out. This injury stuff seems to be his pattern

[Joemailman]

Including his last year at NDSU, this is the 3rd straight year he's missed games due to hamstring.

[run pMc]

Not sure I understand all the stuff with Watson here. Dude has a pretty tightly wound build, I think until the training staff figure him out he'll have hamstring issues. He wasn't the only one with them.
I'd also be very very reluctant to say a player has a vag as well -- with what they endure in training, practice and games, they all have to have a certain degree of toughness. The injury rate in the NFL is basically 100% and many of those injuries a layperson would need a LOT longer to recover from, and these guys are back out on the field getting beat up again.

That rant over, I think all of them play on Sunday, except perhaps Watson, although he did practice a bit today.

As for the rest of the team, I think GB has some favorable matchups, but the fact that the run blocking of their OL -- even with Bakhtiari and Jenkins -- has been pretty meh is a concern. Dillon wasn't great, but the vast majority of the yards he did get vs ATL were after contact. OL needs to do better resetting the LOS, and the RB needs to do better with vision and balance. The NO OL has had problems this season so far against TEN and CAR, so I think Rashan and Kenny could get some against them. Veterans on defense ultimately let the young offense down vs. ATL, I suspect they'll be motivated to right that wrong.

[Freak Out]

They can win without Watson...not sure about Jones though. The OL better fucking ball because the Saints DL can bring it. Milf needs to make sure both Reed and Romeo get the ball a bunch. Luke Vader needs to get involved as well.

LETS GO!

[bobblehead]

I wouldn't count on getting the running game started against this defense.

[Fritz]

The offensive line certainly seems more adept at pass blocking than run blocking. I'm curious who'll get the start at tackle if Bakh doesn't go. Probably Walker - but will Rolled Royce get the start next to him, or will they move Tom toLG and throw Nijman outside at RT?

And where's that third round pick from last year, Sean Rhyan?

[KYPack]

This shapes up to be a slobberknocker. NO's defense are a bunch of strong, ugly, nasty dudes. They are more of a NFC North team than we are. A lot falls on our D. The Ain't love to run , but are missing their top RB's. Our D has to come to play today cause NO comes to hit you on both sides of the ball. Hopefully we can get some coverage and 23 can cover Olave, another key component in the Saints attack.

Let's hope Carr gives us a pick or two and we win a close one.

It's Alumni weekend. This usually doesn't affect the ballgame one way or the other. But it's always a kick to see a bunch of ex-Packers staggering around, nursing their hangovers. They used to let the Alumni players go out for the coin toss re-enactment. That ended when Nitschke almost started a fist fight with the Chargers.

[QBME]

Bahk, Jones and Watson declared inactive for today.
Ugh.

[KYPack]

Bahk, Jones and Watson declared inactive for today.
Ugh.

Also Jaire. We need 23 for today.

What happened with him?

[run pMc]

Also Jaire. We need 23 for today.

What happened with him?

Back injury popped up late in the week. Probably saving him for the DET matchup.