What's your opinion of this head coach???

[Patler]

In 11 NFL seasons as head coach, his record stands at 79-104. He has made the playoffs twice and is 1-2 in playoff games.

Does he deserve another head coach opportunity?

[beveaux1]

Sounds like someone like Sam Wyche. I don’t think I’d be interested.

[Patler]

Sounds like someone like Sam Wyche. I don’t think I’d be interested.

Good guess! But not the one I have in mind.
I wouldn't be interested in Wyche either. I think he is dead.

[RashanGary]

Kyle Shannahan?

[call_me_ishmael]

Man this could be anybody. I have no idea. The record sort of speaks for itself unless it is an ass organization. Who is it?

[call_me_ishmael]

This is so unbelievable. How does he have _that_ record. The playoffs record doesn't add up either. It's possible ChatGPT is making this up though.


which NFL coach has a 79-104 record historically?


As of my last update in January 2022, Mike McCarthy had a historical record of 79-104 as an NFL head coach. McCarthy previously coached the Green Bay Packers for over a decade from 2006 to 2018 before becoming the head coach of the Dallas Cowboys in 2020. Please verify this information since records may have changed after my last update.

[ThunderDan]

No way are those numbers correct for MM. Checked wiki and they have him at 165-100-2.

[Patler]

This is so unbelievable. How does he have _that_ record. The playoffs record doesn't add up either. It's possible ChatGPT is making this up though.

What do you mean, the playoffs record doesn't add up? Made the playoffs twice; 1-1 one year, 0-1 the other.

[RashanGary]

McCarthy is 155-97-2

One of the all time best records.

[bobblehead]

Obvious answer is no. I cant think of who that could be. Especially in an era where guys last 4 years. Its actually someone still around and in consideration?

[Patler]

Not Shanahan or MM.

[Patler]

Obvious answer is no. I cant think of who that could be. Especially in an era where guys last 4 years. Its actually someone still around and in consideration?

Rumor is he could have another HC job next year.

[call_me_ishmael]

What do you mean, the playoffs record doesn't add up? Made the playoffs twice; 1-1 one year, 0-1 the other.

I think ChatGPT was wrong. Was gonna say MM couldn't be 1-2 since he won 4 in a row to win the SB.

[bobblehead]

McCarthy is 155-97-2

One of the all time best records.

He also made the playoffs enough times to make me hate him for losing way more than 2x.

[ThunderDan]

Harbough from MI?

[Guiness]

No coach has run up that sort of a record. The closest I could think of is Lovie Smith, Wikipedia says he's 95-103 with 6 playoff appearances. And no, I certainly would not want him...well, maybe as a D coordinator? Nah

[RashanGary]

Hmmmm…… 11 years, we should know who it is. Rex Ryan :lol:

[call_me_ishmael]

That homie down in ATL was the definition of medocire and had a super fugly wife for a rich coach but he won at least two playoff games.

[bobblehead]

My first guess was norv turner but I looked him up and it didn't match.

[bobblehead]

No coach has run up that sort of a record. The closest I could think of is Lovie Smith, Wikipedia says he's 95-103 with 6 playoff appearances. And no, I certainly would not want him...well, maybe as a D coordinator?

And that was my second guess

[bobblehead]

Hmmmm…… 11 years, we should know who it is. Rex Ryan :lol:

Not 11 years I'm pretty sure.

[call_me_ishmael]

Lovie was my first guess as well. Yeah, this is a tough one. Looking at lists of coaching candidates for next year, I don't see any clue there either. 11 years is a long time - must have a forgiving owner or multiple stints.

[bobblehead]

Okay, I googled NFL coaches by win total and nobody has a 79 and 104 record.

[RashanGary]

Hmmmm…… 11 years, we should know who it is. Rex Ryan :lol:
Gary Kubiak?

[RashanGary]

Jason Garrett

[RashanGary]

Mike McCarthy is probably going to finish with wins totals that put him up around Chuck Knox, Dan Reeves, Chuck Noll, Marty Schottwnheimer, Curly Lambeau.

[red]

norm van brocklin, sam wyche and lovie smith are the only 3 i can find with records anywhere close to that

[Patler]

OK, OK; I'm tilting things a bit to make a point. Those 11 seasons are not all of his years as head coach. But there is a significant difference for those 11 and all of his other seasons. (That should help! :-D)

[Joemailman]

John Fox?

[Patler]

Not Fox, or any other mentioned so far.

[HarveyWallbangers]

Billy B without Brady?

[Patler]

Billy B without Brady?

Yup! Five years in Cleveland, 2000 when Brady didn't play, 2008 when Brady missed the season injured and 4 years since Brady left. That's a whole lot of seasons, a whole lot of games and a whole lot of mediocrity.

There are rumors that one or more teams are interested in TRADING for Belichick. The coach they will get is the one who has coached those 11 mediocre seasons, not the 6xSB Champ, unless they can convince Brady to unretire again!

Just goes to show that the best way to be a great coach is to have a HoF quarterback.

[run pMc]

Feels like you're doing a little cherry picking on the years, but I agree with your point overall: if you're a competent coach and you have a HoF level QB, you should have longevity and be well regarded.

I'll go farther and say I think BB is a very good coach, especially defensively, and he has some smart approaches to use of players. I think he has some quirks that work against him, his being the de facto GM among them - he's got some real head scratcher picks.
In a vacuum, I wouldn't want a coach who averaged about 7 wins a season to be the new HC of my team.

Trading for Belichick would be crazy, and I could see the CAR owner doing it. That guy is not football smart.

[RashanGary]

Well having a crappy QB doesn’t help him. He’s good.

[Patler]

Feels like you're doing a little cherry picking on the years, but I agree with your point overall: if you're a competent coach and you have a HoF level QB, you should have longevity and be well regarded.

I'll go farther and say I think BB is a very good coach, especially defensively, and he has some smart approaches to use of players. I think he has some quirks that work against him, his being the de facto GM among them - he's got some real head scratcher picks.
In a vacuum, I wouldn't want a coach who averaged about 7 wins a season to be the new HC of my team.

Trading for Belichick would be crazy, and I could see the CAR owner doing it. That guy is not football smart.

Not cherry picking at all. I included every single year that he didn't have Brady as his starting QB. If I wanted to cherry pick, I could have included just the pre-Brady and post-Brady years, excluding 2008 when Brady was injured. BB would have looked even worse then.

In six years before Brady became his starter, he was a combined 41-55 at Cleveland and NE. That would get most coaches fired.

In the four seasons after Brady, so far he is 27-34. Most teams would move on after four years of that, too.

The Brady years were magical. The other 11 years, very ordinary.

[Patler]

Well having a crappy QB doesn’t help him. He’s good.

In Cleveland he had Bernie Kosar and Vinny Testaverde for most of the games, with a few by Mark Rypien and Mike Tomczak. Record of 36-44 with one winning season.

In 2000 in NE, Drew Bledsoe was his starter. He finished 5-11.

Not sure I can blame 6 seasons at 41-55 on crappy QBs.

[bobblehead]

Yup! Five years in Cleveland, 2000 when Brady didn't play, 2008 when Brady missed the season injured and 4 years since Brady left. That's a whole lot of seasons, a whole lot of games and a whole lot of mediocrity.

There are rumors that one or more teams are interested in TRADING for Belichick. The coach they will get is the one who has coached those 11 mediocre seasons, not the 6xSB Champ, unless they can convince Brady to unretire again!

Just goes to show that the best way to be a great coach is to have a HoF quarterback.

I have made this point several times as I don't consider hoody the "GOAT". I can think of a lot of coaches I think are better. I don't ignore the Brady years, but I don't pretend its the whole story either. I attended a couple of his games while he was with Cleveland....tire fire comes to mind.

[Fritz]

I really can't imagine why anyone would hire Belichik at this point. Which means an organization like Carolina will probably go chasing him.

[Patler]

I have made this point several times as I don't consider hoody the "GOAT". I can think of a lot of coaches I think are better. I don't ignore the Brady years, but I don't pretend its the whole story either. I attended a couple of his games while he was with Cleveland....tire fire comes to mind.

Like you, I've never been a big fan. When NE hired him, my first thought was, "Really??" Then, the various scandals, questionable actions, etc. Have to give him credit for the Brady years, but.....

[KYPack]

Yeaqh, I think BB's legacy is Brady's legacy and it looks diminished for BB at this point. On Big Bill's next home, I see a lot of speculation for Carolina and a little for San Diego.

I'd think SD would have a lot of appeal for Belichick. Solid QB, good pieces on D that need organization, cool place to live, cooler to be retired in, etc.

You'd think Kraft will try to get as much as he can for BB.

What can he get?

Magic 8 ball says Unclear at this time.

[run pMc]

I'm sure someone will give BB a shot as HC (if he chooses to keep coaching), but I'd be leery of doing so. For one thing, his record without Brady has been iffy (as others have shown) and for another, the culture he installs is not for everyone. I think he'd want a big piece of the personnel decisions also, and that would be problematic. Personally, if I were an owner I'd go for a someone on the upswing like Ben Johnson (the DET OC). If BB wanted to just be a DC I'd be falling over myself to hire him - dude is a sharp defensive mind - but that's it.

This is just my opinion, but I don't think defensive-oriented coaches are good HC's in general. I think you do better with an Offensive guru type or a Special Teams coach. ST coaches have to be quick thinkers, good teachers, and able to communicate with everyone on the team. Offensive gurus bring in a system and usually have some innovation. Defense is pretty hit-and-miss and subject to luck, frankly, and unless you get lucky with a genius young OC you're basically the Bears.

[Fritz]

I just can't see how, this long after Brady in New England, anyone thinks Belichik is some genius. Brady in NE, Belichik is Hoody Genius. Brady not in New England, Belichik is Creepy Uncle Hoody.

[RashanGary]

He had some really good defenses in NE. It wasn’t all Brady. He’s not as good as they portrayed him the last 10 years, but he’s not as bad as his worst years indicate either.

[Joemailman]

Chuck Noll and Tom Landry didn't win any Super Bowls after their HOF QB was gone either.

[Patler]

He had some really good defenses in NE. It wasn’t all Brady. He’s not as good as they portrayed him the last 10 years, but he’s not as bad as his worst years indicate either.

I don't know.....

One year in Cleveland he was 11-5. Before and after that year he was 25-39.
One year in NE after Brady left he was 10-7. Before and after that season: 18-29, so far.
The year before Brady became the starter he was 5-11 in NE.
In 11 seasons without Brady, he has made the playoffs only twice, winning just one playoff game..

Tom Brady without BB had a lot of success.
BB without Brady in 11 seasons has done very little.

[Patler]

Chuck Noll and Tom Landry didn't win any Super Bowls after their HOF QB was gone either.

Its not just about Super Bowls, its coaching success overall. Getting to the playoffs. Having some success in the playoffs.

Noll is another one who had a long so-so career apart the core group that won the SBs. I look at him not much different than BB. He had an 8 year run of great success, and 15 years mostly out of the playoffs or sneaking in and not doing much.

Tom Landry? Now there was a coach! May not have won, but got to championship games/Super Bowls with different QBs and different team makeups (Meredith, Morton, White, Staubach). His teams adapted to the strengths of the players he had running, passing, defense. Good records and playoff appearances year after year, and doing well in the playoffs. He was an innovator who adjusted to his own players and to league trends.

[MadtownPacker]

I feel that Love would do better with an older coach. Thinking Holmgren Favre dynamic. I feel that Belichick would come to the Packers and have a better season than Pepe LePew. LaFleur was ok for rodgers and even that had trouble. Now starting to wonder if he’s the right coach for such a young team.

Patler would you say M3 is better than Belichick? He won and went I many playoffs with erron but also now winning in Texas. :lol:

[run pMc]

I think QB is such an important and high leverage position that any coach is going to look good or bad depending on who they have under center.
Belichick is a good coach but he doesn't transcend that limitation. Maybe that's a criticism against him being some kind of GOAT coach.

Personally I'm skeptical he's the GOAT coach, I can think of a few other coaches who are as deserving of such a title. (Walsh, Shula, Landry)

Would I hire him if I was an owner and needed to replace my HC? Probably not. At least, he would not be my first choice. Smart guy, good coach, but I'd want someone with more of a younger, innovative vibe, and also someone with a focus on the offensive side of the ball. BB is a defensive guy.

Now if I'm CHI he fits right into their whole ethos of Monsters of the Midway and always having trash QBs, so there's that. But if I'm the Chargers I'm looking for someone who can build a strong system around Justin Herbert and Co.

[Patler]

I feel that Love would do better with an older coach. Thinking Holmgren Favre dynamic.

Holmgren was 44, with no HC experience during Favre's first season as a starter.
LaFleur is 44 now, during Love's first season as a starter, but has years of HC experience.

Holmgren looked old, LaFleur looks like a kid.

[Patler]

Patler would you say M3 is better than Belichick? He won and went I many playoffs with erron but also now winning in Texas. :lol:

No.

You can't ignore all the wins during the season, and the NFC championship games he got to. But too often I think he was outcoached, or intimidated, too cautious, whatever, losing playoff games he should have won. He had the teams and situations to get to many more than one Super Bowl. BB took advantage of his opportunities. McCarthy did not.

[MadtownPacker]

Holmgren was 44, with no HC experience during Favre's first season as a starter.
LaFleur is 44 now, during Love's first season as a starter, but has years of HC experience.

Holmgren looked old, LaFleur looks like a kid.
I knew when I said that you would blast me with something! You slammed me against a wall and backhanded me. :lol:

[MadtownPacker]

No.

You can't ignore all the wins during the season, and the NFC championship games he got to. But too often I think he was outcoached, or intimidated, too cautious, whatever, losing playoff games he should have won. He had the teams and situations to get to many more than one Super Bowl. BB took advantage of his opportunities. McCarthy did not.
Agreed, the M3 years were filled with giant disappointments. Too often being on the bad side of an upset left the impression M3 was only as good as Rodgers was that day.

What if he was to win one with Dak? I would be shocked because Dak always chokes. M3 would also have to beat his nemesis SF. Something he couldn’t do with peak Rodgers.

[Joemailman]

I knew when I said that you would blast me with something! You slammed me against a wall and backhanded me. :lol:


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[run pMc]

Agreed, the M3 years were filled with giant disappointments. Too often being on the bad side of an upset left the impression M3 was only as good as Rodgers was that day.

What if he was to win one with Dak? I would be shocked because Dak always chokes. M3 would also have to beat his nemesis SF. Something he couldn’t do with peak Rodgers.

I'd be shocked too. DAL is a good team but I think if they play SF they lose.
Also, Dak has a tendency to have a real bad stinker every so many games and is a bit of a choker. Just like his coach.

M3 did have a few chances to get to the SB. The number of NFCCG he got to speaks to how good those teams were. Favre's last year they were close, but 2014 was the year that really stands out.

[texaspackerbacker]

The reason McCarthy just might have a better shot in Dallas than he had in Green Bay is that he has Jerry Jones & son effectively GMing. True, Dak ain't Aaron Rodgers, but he is damn good, better than some in here give him credit for. And the team surrounding him, D and O both, is probably significantly better than what Rodgers had.

The Niners seem kinda bi-polar. They were way up when they beat the Cowboys, and they have lost to an inferior team or two also. Maybe McCarthy will catch them in a down spiral if both get that far.

[bobblehead]

He had some really good defenses in NE. It wasn’t all Brady. He’s not as good as they portrayed him the last 10 years, but he’s not as bad as his worst years indicate either.

I'll play devil's advocate for fun. Brady always played the short game and chewed clock. He audibled to run plays more than any good QB ever. He kept Hoody's Ds rested and on the sideline a lot.

The NBA uses stats like "per 100 possessions". The NFL is in the dark ages using "per game" stats to rank things. I want to see Love's points per possession at the end of the season. Yards per play. ect.

[bobblehead]

Holmgren was 44, with no HC experience during Favre's first season as a starter.
LaFleur is 44 now, during Love's first season as a starter, but has years of HC experience.

Holmgren looked old, LaFleur looks like a kid.

Ouch....patlerized. Mad, I'll give you the advice I give Tex in FYI. Hit google before you hit enter.

edit: now I am fully confident I'll get owned within 24 hours on something.

[RashanGary]

I'll play devil's advocate for fun. Brady always played the short game and chewed clock. He audibled to run plays more than any good QB ever. He kept Hoody's Ds rested and on the sideline a lot.

The NBA uses stats like "per 100 possessions". The NFL is in the dark ages using "per game" stats to rank things. I want to see Love's points per possession at the end of the season. Yards per play. ect.

True. Brady loved to win. Not saying he didn’t make spectacular passes, but he never went out of his way for them. He just did the simple things 100% right 100% of the time over and over and over. And mixed in some awesome shit too.

[Fritz]

True. Brady loved to win. Not saying he didn’t make spectacular passes, but he never went out of his way for them. He just did the simple things 100% right 100% of the time over and over and over. And mixed in some awesome shit too.

To me, this is as good a summary of Brady as I've seen.

I would agree with Patler's assessment of Magic Mike. And I also agree that Dak seems to poop the bed, pretty badly, in big games. I don't see him and the team getting past SanFran.

[bobblehead]

True. Brady loved to win. Not saying he didn’t make spectacular passes, but he never went out of his way for them. He just did the simple things 100% right 100% of the time over and over and over. And mixed in some awesome shit too.

*sigh* I hate that guy.

[run pMc]

I'll play devil's advocate for fun. Brady always played the short game and chewed clock. He audibled to run plays more than any good QB ever. He kept Hoody's Ds rested and on the sideline a lot.

The NBA uses stats like "per 100 possessions". The NFL is in the dark ages using "per game" stats to rank things. I want to see Love's points per possession at the end of the season. Yards per play. ect.

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/gnb/2023.htm

Look under Team Stats and Rankings, it shows yards/play (5.4 so far), and also shows points per possession (1.97). These are Team stats but you could probably get Love's individual stats with some digging.

NE didn't have what I would call an explosive offense with Brady, the 18-1 year being the exception. His other years was a lot of option routes where he's dumping short/intermediate to Welker or Edelman, and he also had Gronk (and for a while Hernandez). James White, Danny Woodhead, Rex Burkhart, etc. would catch 5-8 passes too. He was a bit of a check down guy at times, but he stayed ahead of schedule and would dog walk down the field until they could grind it into the EZ or find a kill shot. Brady was a very very quick processer and accurate. That's what got him so far. Paired with Belichick's penchant for devising clever opponent-specific game plans (esp on D) they were consistently one of the better teams in the league. Having what was mostly a garbage division during all that time helped too.