Aaron Jones Being Released

[Joemailman]

Well now we know why they signed Jacobs.

[Tony Oday]

Man I wish they had kept them both.

[KYPack]

Well now we know why they signed Jacobs.

But Joe, according to the Packerrat pinhead squad, you can always cook the cap, why don't we keep em both?

[Frozen Tundra]

I called it, but wished I was wrong and felt kind of dumb for suggesting it. I was glad a couple of other people talked me out of it.

Now I'm back to feeling shitty again.

This is hard news. I guess the good news we take away from this, Gute is absolutely dead serious about doing every single thing he thinks needs to be done to win that trophy. There won't be any sentimental decisions. The whole team is on notice now; every single job has to be earned.

[pittstang5]

So.....

I'm thinking...had the Packers landed J. Taylor last year...Jones would have been released now as well. Gute must think Jones only has a year or so left and wants to get rid of him early? Or he's tired of him being hurt all the time.

Jones is gonna sign with a rival methinks to try to stick to the Pack if this is all true.

[Joemailman]

So.....

I'm thinking...had the Packers landed J. Taylor last year...Jones would have been released now as well. Gute must think Jones only has a year or so left and wants to get rid of him early? Or he's tired of him being hurt all the time.

Jones is gonna sign with a rival methinks to try to stick to the Pack if this is all true.

I could see him signing with the Vikings. Bears signed D'Andre Swift and Lions have David Montgomery and Jahmyr Gibbs. Actually Cowboys lost Tony Pollard today so they might be interested. And Jones might want to finish his career in Texas.

[Frozen Tundra]

I could see him signing with the Vikings. Bears signed D'Andre Swift and Lions have David Montgomery and Jahmyr Gibbs. Actually Cowboys lost Tony Pollard today so they might be interested. And Jones might want to finish his career in Texas.

I've already read that the Cowboys have called his agent.

[pittstang5]

I've already read that the Cowboys have called his agent.

Makes sense - reunite with McCarthy and isn't Pollard a FA as well.

[Frozen Tundra]

Makes sense - reunite with McCarthy and isn't Pollard a FA as well.

Only for an hour or so - Titans already signed him!:razz:

Man, we can't take our eye off the TV for a minute this afternoon. My wife's trying to figure out what the hell is going on with NFL football on a weekday in March that has me so mesmerized....

[QBME]

Huh,

Somebody knows something I (we) sure do not

[run pMc]

Don't like the Jacobs for Jones swap, but I have some sentimental bias there. Jones was the extra gear for this offense over the last 3 years, and the cliche of being the heart and soul of the offense this last year is true. I would love to have him back but I have a feeling he'll get offers elsewhere GB won't want to match.

Class act on and off the field. Great Packer. If he's not back I'll be sad but I wish him the best.

[George Cumby]

Bummer.

But better a year early than a year late (?).

Hard to replace his leadership

Do they keep Dillon at a bargain price?

[MadtownPacker]

Well that’s effed up!! Thought we would be having two legit RBs. I’m going to trust management on this one due to the injury history. Still sad to see him go.

[red]

thats completely fucked

shows that lefleur and gutey have no respect for hm

trying to force aj dillon into his spot for a couple years, then cutting the guy who changed the game completely when he was on the field

[Joemailman]

thats completely fucked

shows that lefleur and gutey have no respect for hm

trying to force aj dillon into his spot for a couple years, then cutting the guy who changed the game completely when he was on the field

Problem was he just wasn't on the field enough.

[Teamcheez1]

thats completely fucked

shows that lefleur and gutey have no respect for hm

trying to force aj dillon into his spot for a couple years, then cutting the guy who changed the game completely when he was on the field
That’s the issue. He wasn’t on the field much last year. An oft injured RB turning 30 getting paid $10M+. That’s the business side of football.

[red]

Problem was he just wasn't on the field enough.

problem was when he was healthy the coach would just "forget" to put him back in. or go away from him when he had a hot hand

[MadtownPacker]

I’m feeling better about this after reading Reds outrage. He is a major fuck up when it comes to these things so now I know it was the right call. Jones greatness was part of his downfall. Great enough to get us there but a deep playoff run carried the concern he would get banged up. For all we know he was feeling beatdown in the second half of the SF game.

Bottom line this group will compete the next few years with fresh horses at almost all spots. Why wouldn’t you have a fresh one at the spot where youth might matter most. Just wouldn’t be a good gamble.

[Joemailman]

Well that’s effed up!! Thought we would be having two legit RBs. I’m going to trust management on this one due to the injury history. Still sad to see him go.

For about an hour we had the best RB tandem in football. Those were good times.

[MadtownPacker]

For about an hour we had the best RB tandem in football. Those were good times.Yeah my kid sent me a text about Jacobs before I got on here to read what you mofos had to say. I was already counting the rings… :jig:

[Bretsky]

Gute and AJO's agents were in negotiations to restructure the deal for a while. I love AJO. Gute did himself no favors when he commented right after the last playoff game that Jones would absolutely be back as a Packer.

His agent was trying to use the late run to get him some serious ching and GB was not having it.

I just hope GB didn't JordyNelson Aaron Jones

[texaspackerbacker]

Calm down, people. There's still a 50/50 chance Jones will re-sign with the Packers, and we will have two great RBs.

The Cowboys lost Pollard who is very similar to Jones, so I could see how they would want him, especially with McCarthy. Considering Jones' age and injury history, though, there's a significant chance the Cowboys and everybody else will try to lowball him. If that happens, I could certainly see him coming back to the Packers. I highly doubt this was a hostility thing. Gutekunst probably told him to test the market and come back if he couldn't get what he hopes for.

I was hoping to have us draft a RB to rotate with Jones - now Jacobs, but having both would probably be best.

And for ya'all cap panickers, hell yeah, all things are possible.

[Frozen Tundra]

,,
I was hoping to have us draft a RB to rotate with Jones - now Jacobs, but having both would probably be best.


I'd still draft an RB, probably Day Three. If we were to sign Jones, that'd be the end of AJ, and our only other back would be Wilson - who Gute claims to love, and says he has a great future, etc, but I'm not convinced. I'd be uncomfortable knowing he was all we had on the shelf.

[Fritz]

LeFleur must be bumming. If they could’ve kept Jones AND had Jacobs, LeFleur would’ve had TWO really good running backs to ignore for long, crucial stretches of games.

[sharpe1027]

I just hope GB didn't JordyNelson Aaron Jones

I hope not too. Jacobs is younger than Jones by four years, so I don't see the comparison to Nelson and Graham as particularly good.

[Joemailman]

Aaron Wilson
@AaronWilson_NFL

#Vikings are having constructive dialogue with former #Packers running back Aaron Jones with some optimism that a potential deal could be reached for him to remain in NFC North after being released by Green Bay, per league sources @KPRC2

I would think at this point in his career he would want to go to a team with a better chance of making the playoffs. Vikings right now have as big a question mark at QB as any team in football.

[call_me_ishmael]

I just don't get it. Sure, the cap number is lower for the dude this year, but they are paying Jones either way. Seems kinda silly. AJO is a unique player and team MVP.

[Frozen Tundra]

I would think at this point in his career he would want to go to a team with a better chance of making the playoffs. Vikings right now have as big a question mark at QB as any team in football.

I think they not only have a question mark regarding the position itself, but an even bigger cultural question mark about their ability to even figure out how to solve the first question mark. Unless their master plan revolves around waiting until 2025 and signing Rodgers when he's used up the Jets, and then waiting another 15 years until it's Jordan's turn.

Fran Tarkenton was their highwater mark for franchise quarterbacks. Culpepper stirred up some excitement for a minute or two, until the rest of the league figured out he was as dumb as a rusty horseshoe, but in the half century since Tark, Cousins was really as close as they've come. And now they're right back to Square One.

They had a shitty enough year to get the #11 pick, but in a year that's only about 3-4 QBs deep (at best) in terms of likely 1st year quality starters. There are another 3-4 who may have a realistic chance to be developed into a franchise quarterback, but not quickly enough to mean anything significant to Jones (and even then, only with a decent coaching staff, and we poached Sean Mannion from them. It sounds like they really did assume that when he retired, he'd become their Tom Clements).

Unless they trade up, I don't know if they have any option. If the Bears cut Fields, they'd be fools not to snatch 'im up, but the Bears will never do anything that smart. They have 9 picks, and in a draft where the 1st round is bursting with OL, they could maybe move up a few spots with a team who needs a lineman (which they do not) and steal a QB. Otherwise, it's probaby Darnell or Garrapolo, and if I'm Aaron Jones, at that point I say "screw it, I'll go with Green Bay for whatever, and get my ring".

[King Friday]

I highly doubt Jones will sign with Green Bay after being released. If there is a chance, it is significantly lower than 50-50. Money clearly was a key factor here, so Jones is now focused on getting top dollar. Green Bay did right by him by releasing him early, so he has a great chance at landing a strong deal. Honestly, this breakup was largely forced by Rodgers and his demands for retaining players who provided little long term value to the team. Gute has done a good job worming his way out of that, but it wasn’t going to happen without some pain. We got the best of Aaron Jones in Green Bay, and he’ll proudly enter the Packers HOF in the not too distant future.

[Joemailman]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GIeF-FEWsAAohV9?format=jpg&name=large

[run pMc]

Yep. 1year, $7million is what I've heard.
Vikes released Alexander Mattison and signed Sam Darnold at QB. Will be a new backfield for MIN.

Is really going to be hard to watch Jones run against GB.

[Joemailman]

I think Jones made a bad decision here. He's likely played his last playoff game.

[Anti-Polar Bear]

I think Jones made a bad decision here. He's likely played his last playoff game.

Virtually everyone has an ego. The ego keeps the tilting poker player at the tables and consequently turns her into a notorious punter.

Jone’s ego is telling him to sign with the Queens for a chance to stick it to the German Shepherd twice a year.

[George Cumby]

I think Jones made a bad decision here. He's likely played his last playoff game.

Vikes are a dumpster fire at this point.

[Joemailman]

The coolest Packer since Donald Driver will be wearing purple in the most artificial environment in the NFL with either Sam Darnold or a rookie as his QB. Sigh.

[King Friday]

Certainly seems like this is Jones trying to stick it to the Packers. It’s not like he’s making a king’s ransom for the Vikings compared to what the Packers were looking for him to accept, and he signed very quickly. This will absolutely impact his legacy as a Packer, no different than Favre. Still a great Packer, but this move will reduce his luster as a former Packer…and how much extra coin did he get for that? Not much.

[NewsBruin]

Or he saw a field of FAs (no complete/healthy feature backs, though: Derrick Henry, Joe Mixon, JK Dobbins, D'Onta Forman, Alexander Mattison, CE-H) and draftees, and felt squeamish about what was available for starter money. A one-year deal for a running back is practically a final contract (not even a signing bonus that could get split to next season's cap when the Vikings part ways with him after missing the playoffs).

His 1-for-$7M is better than Ekeler, Zack Moss, Antonio Gibson, or Gus Edwards' got for per-year values. Only Saquon, Josh Jacobs, Pollard, and D'Andre got better so far, and a flipside way of looking at it is those spots are no longer available.

I got nothing against AJ signing quickly once he was told to take less or start packing.

Plus, Jones has four games against common opponents that he can look good against, particularly the Bears.

[Anti-Polar Bear]

Certainly seems like this is Jones trying to stick it to the Packers. It’s not like he’s making a king’s ransom for the Vikings compared to what the Packers were looking for him to accept, and he signed very quickly. This will absolutely impact his legacy as a Packer, no different than Favre. Still a great Packer, but this move will reduce his luster as a former Packer…and how much extra coin did he get for that? Not much.

Like I said, everyone has an ego, defined by the layman as “a person's sense of self-esteem or self-importance.” And that ego is as fragile and as sensitive as fuck.

We all know Bobble’s ego is as big as his net worth. That’s why he refuses to “acknowledge” myself as his “tribal chief,” as “head of the table” and/or as Packerrats’ top capologist. Yeah, yeah - we all would like to see Cody Rhodes finish his damn story at Wrestlemania, what, 40? Ain’t gonna happen. Roman Reigns is too damn good.

Anyways, unlike y’all, I am wishing ole AA-Ron the best in purple, except when he suits up against my beloved Pack.

[call_me_ishmael]

Are they not paying this dude either way? They are paying _more_ on the cap for a worse player. It doesn’t make a lot of sense to me. That said that’s looking at one year in isolation knowing new Jones is front loaded. Still, I like old jones and don’t think this was a good choice

[MadtownPacker]

I think Jones made a bad decision here. He's likely played his last playoff game.Have to wonder how those knees will hold up with so many turf games.

Hard truth is Packers likely got 80% of his best years if not all of them. This was the right move.

[MadScientist]

Have to wonder how those knees will hold up with so many turf games.

Hard truth is Packers likely got 80% of his best years if not all of them. This was the right move.

Yep, he doesn't have much left. He will probably have a few games where he's healthy and will shine, but injuries will knock him out for chunks of the season, and age conquers all, especially in NFL RB's.

[Deputy Nutz]

Rumors were the Packers wanted Jones to reduce his number by 50% which would have been between 5-7 million in a hometown discount. Crazy that he is reportedly going to sign with Minnesota for the same price. I guess ego and feelings will always play in this game.

I really like Jones and think he is a top 5 or 6 back in the league, unfortunately he missed too much time. Jacobs is fine, obviously he lead the league in rushing two seasons ago and he is only 26. From a a business decision this all made sense.

[texaspackerbacker]

Oh well. I wish they'd kept Jones, but all things considered, we're better off with Jacobs. I was expecting Jones to soak some team for a really big amount for a fairly long term, but no, just $7 million for one year. If the Packers didn't want to pay him that much, maybe they know something about him, injury-wise.

This Jacobs contract is like something I haven't heard before, 1 year, then 3 more of team options - that's pretty team friendly. If he flounders, the Packers don't owe him anything past the first year. But if he's good, we've got him for four years at today's money. And at age 26, he should be good for that long.

Now let's draft a good 2nd or 3rd rounder to rotate with him - ideally IMO Braelon Allen.

[MadtownPacker]

Yep, he doesn't have much left. He will probably have a few games where he's healthy and will shine, but injuries will knock him out for chunks of the season, and age conquers all, especially in NFL RB's.I am liking that he went purple. He will be motivated against the Packers but Jacobs will be motivated to show he is better than his predecessor.

[run pMc]

Have to wonder how those knees will hold up with so many turf games.

Hard truth is Packers likely got 80% of his best years if not all of them. This was the right move.

Long term I agree. I think Jacobs is tough and can be on the field all three downs. He's 220 pounds and will be a problem to tackle in December at Lambeau.

Aaron Jones is going to be beloved by his Vikings teammates quickly. He's genuinely a good dude and I wish him the best of luck (minus 2 games). If they run him like they tried to run Cook or Mattison on that field he's going to have a knee injury by Game 6 though.

For MIN, I don't know what they are doing. Are they rebuilding? I assume they are going to chase a QB in Round 1 (McCarthy? Nix? Penix?) in the second tier below Caleb/Maye/Daniels. Do the GM or HC have some kind of grace period? That team is not going to be expected to threaten for the NFCN crown; maybe they think they can squeak to a 7 seed but I think that's very optimistic. Aside from Cousins, there wasn't much on the market for QBs, especially after Baker and Russell signed. Are they tanking? I can't figure it out yet, after the draft it will make more sense what they are doing.

Also - if they trade for Justin Fields they are insane.

A HC usually gets one chance to hitch his wagon to a QB, a GM might get two chances. I'll be very curious to see what MIN (and CHI) do.

Back to Aaron Jones -- I would've thought he'd go to HOU or DAL instead. Maybe even JAX. He definitely wanted to stay close and stick it to Gute. I don't blame him, in a way. He already did one big pay cut, why take another when he did everything he could to prove his value?
Not gonna hate on him, he's a Packer HOF'er. All the same, I suspect he will regret his decision. He'd have been an awesome RB2 to pair with Jacobs.

[Patler]

I will miss Aaron Jones, a truly exciting player to watch. I suspect the team will miss him too. Players talk about the personality of a team changing from year to year, some years more than others. Last year was a big change with Rodgers leaving and Love taking over. Next year may be as well. I think Jones especially, but Dillon too were strong, positive influences on the team character. It will be different.

I was hoping he would stay, and the draft would supply his eventual replacement. I hoped he would retire a Packer.

Jacobs can be a true workhorse type of back, something Jones never was because the team has always preached the need to manage his workload. If he had a busy series of downs, the next series he was on the bench. Understandable, with as small as Jones is. But, he was a great, great asset to have; and for the most part I think the Packers used him well to get the most out of him for a long time. A back like Jacobs might make it easier to develop a rhythm in the offense, because he will play series after series.

It will seem wrong to watch him on any team other than GB, especially so in a purple jersey. But, realistically, it is doubtful he will be playing in 2026 no matter where he is or could have been.

[Joemailman]

Andy Herman
@AndyHermanNFL

Who will have the better next 2 seasons in the NFL?
Aaron Jones 9.7%
Josh Jacobs 90.3%
2,611 votes
·
23 hours left

[Patler]

Jones missed a lot of time this year, which could be a foreshadowing of the future for an aging back, but in the previous four years he missed only four games in total. That's very good for the position.

With the way he performed at the end of the season, it is hard to see him go.

[Patler]

Jacobs did not perform particularly well in 2023. Is he one of those RBs who plays very well, but for a very short time? Remains to be seen. He didn't have a lot of carries in college, unlike some who flame out early in the NFL.

Ever since John Brockington, I don't count on backs for more than a few years.

[Joemailman]

Jacobs did not perform particularly well in 2023. Is he one of those RBs who plays very well, but for a very short time? Remains to be seen. He didn't have a lot of carries in college, unlike some who flame out early in the NFL.

Ever since John Brockington, I don't count on backs for more than a few years.

There was a lot going on last year. He was coming off a 2022 season where he had almost 400 touches. That might have taken something out of him. The Raiders put the franchise tag on him and he didn't report until late August when they agreed to a contract. The Raiders offense was horrible last year, especially once Garoppolo went out with an injury.

I believe the Packers will be better about not overusing him. Don't think you'll see him with any more 400 touch seasons.

[texaspackerbacker]

What I saw on film was that , similar to Jones, Jacobs looked faster than his 40 time. I also saw some shiftiness although maybe not quite as much as Jones. Jacobs has some power, but Jones had more than a lot of RBs too. In short, they are fairly similar. I'm wondering if Jacobs' downturn last year might have been a bit of dogging it because he got franchised. If so, it could show an attitude problem, but it's more good thing than bad, because it could mean he's still about as good as he was in his two big years.

I also think the Packers should not overuse him - as I've been saying, draft somebody good on the second day to rotate with him.

[Patler]

There was a lot going on last year. He was coming off a 2022 season where he had almost 400 touches. That might have taken something out of him. The Raiders put the franchise tag on him and he didn't report until late August when they agreed to a contract. The Raiders offense was horrible last year, especially once Garoppolo went out with an injury.

I believe the Packers will be better about not overusing him. Don't think you'll see him with any more 400 touch seasons.

All true, but..... It just seems that often when backs go through a year like that, after a number of highly productive years, they just lose something, and never again approach what they once were.

GB is going from a 5yds/carry rb to a 4yds/carry rb. Jones never averaged less then 4.6/carry over a season. Jacobs has twice been under 4.0/carry (3.9 in 2020, 3.5 last year).

What I hope is that Jacobs becomes the workhorse, consistent running back that Dillon always teased at being but never really was, and that GB finds a quick, fast and elusive runner and receiver to replace what Jones was, even if for fewer touches per game than Jones was.

GB is only half done rebuilding their backfield.

[Fritz]

Agreed. They still need Jones’s replacement, and that’s not going to be easy to find.

Man, I was hoping he’d be back for one more year, and the Packers would draft his understudy this April.

[Joemailman]

All true, but..... It just seems that often when backs go through a year like that, after a number of highly productive years, they just lose something, and never again approach what they once were.

GB is going from a 5yds/carry rb to a 4yds/carry rb. Jones never averaged less then 4.6/carry over a season. Jacobs has twice been under 4.0/carry (3.9 in 2020, 3.5 last year).

What I hope is that Jacobs becomes the workhorse, consistent running back that Dillon always teased at being but never really was, and that GB finds a quick, fast and elusive runner and receiver to replace what Jones was, even if for fewer touches per game than Jones was.

GB is only half done rebuilding their backfield.

I'll be reasonably satisfied if Jacobs is a solid workhorse like David Montgomery. I think he has a chance to be a bit more than that. I agree they need a quicker back as an alternative. Will Shipley of Clemson comes to mind.

[Fritz]

They’re still going to be drafting a running back or two in April.

[MadtownPacker]

All true, but..... It just seems that often when backs go through a year like that, after a number of highly productive years, they just lose something, and never again approach what they once were.

GB is going from a 5yds/carry rb to a 4yds/carry rb. Jones never averaged less then 4.6/carry over a season. Jacobs has twice been under 4.0/carry (3.9 in 2020, 3.5 last year).Ok but how many rush attempts? Because if it is a big difference I will take Jacobs getting 4 consistently. Jones broke big plays often so I have to question how the average came to be. It damn sure wasn’t from him grinding it out every week.

[sharpe1027]

Jacobs may not be flashy, but he's plenty good enough to punish defenses if they don't respect the run. I don't know we need a speedy back, but we need more depth.

[red]

even better that our best player last year cost to much money to keep, his replacement costs more, and somehow we give nixon 6 million a year

[Frozen Tundra]

GB is going from a 5yds/carry rb to a 4yds/carry rb. Jones never averaged less then 4.6/carry over a season. Jacobs has twice been under 4.0/carry (3.9 in 2020, 3.5 last year).

A lot of people are saying that they don't see much difference between Jones and Jacobs, but this is a significant one right there. I think a lot of fans still don't quite seem to get how special Jones was and sorta still is.

Aaron Jones has an extraordinary YPC average - eye-poppingly impressive. His YPC is 5.0. In the entire history of the NFL, of all running backs with 850+ carries, only 3 averaged more than Jones, and 2 of those 3 are named either Jim Brown or Mercury Morris.

He's one of only 3 players who have gained 5.25 YPC in 4 separate seasons, and the other 2 are 50's legends Brown and Joe Perry. For the sake of reference, Ahman Green and Jim Taylor each managed that only once for Green Bay. Marshall Faulk and Barry Sanders each did it 3 times, OJ Simpson did it twice, and Ladainian Tomlinson did it once.

That's the company that Aaron Jones is in. For several years now, I've just been baffled by how many Packer fans (and the league as a whole) do not seem to grasp what a very, very rare player Aaron Jones is. It's going to be a damned long time before we ever see another running back in Green Bay like we've enjoyed the last few years.

I suspect Jacobs' YPC is going to trend sharply upwards very soon, but as it stands right now, it's hard to deny that we gave up one of the most purely productive running backs in the history of not only the Green Bay Packers but the entire NFL and replaced him with someone who statistically seems very unlikely to ever hit the mark left by Jones. But, odds are, Jones is unlikely to clear that bar himself going forward over the next couple of years.

Jacobs may never be the RB Jones was, and in fact, almost certainly will not be. Statistically, it's very unlikely, because Jones truly was a historically great running back - I mean, truly great. Our chances of scooping up another consecutive player who is one of the most productive RBs of all time is like expecting to have 2 all-time great quarterbacks in a row, let alone 3 - and who in their right mind could ever believe something like that can, happen, right?
:wink:





What I hope is that Jacobs becomes the workhorse, consistent running back that Dillon always teased at being but never really was, and that GB finds a quick, fast and elusive runner and receiver to replace what Jones was, even if for fewer touches per game than Jones was.

GB is only half done rebuilding their backfield.

Totally agree. I just hope the second piece of the puzzle is a rookie, rather than another FA, but I'd be shocked if he signed another UFA for the position when we have so many Day Two picks in a year with so many Day Two RBs.

[bobblehead]

Tundra...Is it possible to grasp everything you said, Love Jones to death, but realize he is going to be one the wrong side of 30 next season?

I'll miss him. If I were GM he would have finished his last season in GB for $9 million instead of Jacobs for even more. But the reality of the NFL is that he had trouble staying on the field. We tried to stick with Bak because of his talent. That didn't work out. This could have gone either way and I would have been fine with it.

[MadtownPacker]

Frozen - You stayed out in the cold too long and froze your huevos and sense off!!! No fucking way is Jones as good as Ahman. Ahman on this team last season = SB appearance. Shit Jones even spotted Ahman a fumble in SF so you can’t say about Ahman fumbling. And he damn sure isn’t as good as Jim Brown. Jones probably wouldn’t have last one season in that time.

Loved Jones when he was doing his thing but can’t put him in the workhorse category IMO.

[Frozen Tundra]

Tundra... Is it possible to grasp everything you said, Love Jones to death, but realize he is going to be one the wrong side of 30 next season?



Oh, yeah, absolutely. In fact, that's exactly how I feel. Like you, I'm not sure I'd have had the stone-cold balls to move on from him this season but if Gute thinks it's the right call, I support him. He probably knows a few things about the overall situation that you and I don't see. Maybe there's more going on with his knee or overall health that is strictly internal information; maybe the trainers have reported that the hamstring and/or the knee are not recovering as well as we fans can observe. Maybe they're reporting that his recovery from those injuries is not on a pace that they would have expected, that he's reached that point in his career where suddenly the everyday aches and pains of an NFL running back are not responding and bouncing back as quickly and as easily as they did a couple of years ago.

Maybe there are even more soft tissue things that don't rise to the level of mandated reporting, but when added up paint a picture of a player who's aging out more quickly than people outside the organization would see. Because that really is a thing in sports, and something GMs have to account for.

Could be any one of those things, but it could simply be that internally, they see a player who's wearing down more quickly than we reaize.

Or, it could be that this is an example of cutting a player a year too early rather than risk doing it a year too late. Which is a judgment call that I would completely support, because it tells me our GM is not afraid to make ruthless and unpopular decisions if he feels that's in the best interest of the team.

I just keep in mind that in Gute's worldview, this is our window. I think he had a master strategic plan that centered on our Super Bowl window opening in 2025, with 24 being the year that our young team would make a playoff run and get soime postseason experience to prepare them for a serious Lombardi run in 25. But that the second half of 23 essentially became our 2024, and jumped our timetable a full year.

And (if that is true) these 2 FA signings suggest that he gets that, that he's committed to going all in; that he's erring on the side of extreme caution, and unwilling to risk that opportunity by betting our entire stack of chips on the hope that a 30-year old running back who suddenly suffered at east 2 injuries last season is going to stay healthy for 6 solid months in 2024.

Which is why this is a bold move that I completely support, no matter how sad it makes me. For the players and the fans, it's a game, but for the front office it's a cut-throat, coldblooded business. I'm glad we seem to finally have a GM who gets that, and is capable of doing whatever it takes to move the entire team forward. Even when his decisions are very painful to see. I'm glad he's there to make those calls, because it sure as hell wouldn't be something I could do.

[Frozen Tundra]

Frozen - You stayed out in the cold too long and froze your huevos and sense off!!! No fucking way is Jones as good as Ahman. Ahman on this team last season = SB appearance. Shit Jones even spotted Ahman a fumble in SF so you can’t say about Ahman fumbling. And he damn sure isn’t as good as Jim Brown. Jones probably wouldn’t have last one season in that time.

Loved Jones when he was doing his thing but can’t put him in the workhorse category IMO.

Oh, I'm definitely not saying Jones is as "good" as Jim Brown; that man is a legend who literally defined how the position should and would always be played for the rest of the NFL's history.

And I'm sure not going to argue that he was "better" than Ahman Green; declaring someone a "better" back is a broad, comprehensive term that goes beyond mere statistical numbers. I'm not afraid to die on a hill if I truly believe my argument is a good one, but neither one of those two hills even come close.

If you offer me a choice between 7 years of Aaron Jones in his prime, and 7 years of prime Ahman Green, and as much as I love Aaron, I'm taking Green 10 times out of 9. Because it's about so much more than just stats; Green was an absolute force of nature, a gamechanger every time he broke the huddle, not just when he had the ball. When Green was on the field, the entire defense changed their whole look. I'm old enough to have seen Jim Taylor and Paul Hornung play (still have their autographs), and I'd put Green right up there with those two - second only to Taylor.

I'm only saying that in terms of pure statistical productivity, which is one of the important meaures of what makes a back great but not the only one, Aaron Jones has had an amazing run in Green Bay. And we're lucky to have been here to see it, and I just hope that as he moves on to the next phase of his career, we all regard him with the proper appreciation.

I threw together a table comparing his stats to Ahman, but I can't figure out how to get it to display here. Hopefully it's not too hard to work out; Jones is the first "column" of numbers, and Green is the right-hand column.

Obviously, Green's career totals are way ahead of Jones, because he played 12 seasons and Jones only 7. But when you look at the stats in terms of game-by-game and season-by-season, Jones has a clear edge overall. Out of 13 significant statiscal categores, the two are remarkably close in many (if not most), but Ahman only has the edge in 2 of the 13 - yards per game, in which he has just a 1-yard advantage, and carries per game, where he leads 13.9-12.1. And in some of the others, Jones is significantly ahead (yds per carry, yds per season, and several of the receiving categories).



Jones Green
Rushing yds/yr 848 767
YDS per carry 5 4.5
YDS per game 61.2 62.2
ATT per game 12.1 13.9
Rushing TD/year 7 5
Receptions per year 38 31.5
Receptions per game 2.8 2.6
Rec. Yds/year 296.6 240.2
Rec. Yds/game 7.8 7.6
Rec. TD/game 2.6 0.08
Total yards per year 1147.7 1143.5
Total TD per year 9 6.6
Fumbles per carry 1/78.6 1/56.9

(source: statmuse)

And you can't get around the fact that of the hundreds of men who have played running back in the modern era, when one of them puts up a couple of very significant statistics (yards per carry) that have been matched or exceeded only by players like Jim Brown, Mercury Morris, and Joe Perry, that's an extraordinary accomplishment. Hundreds of other players (including a few Packers) have played many years in this league and not even come close to that. I understand that yeah, blocking schemes, coaches, Aaron Rodgers, etc, but is there really anything else about the Packers offense over the last 7 or 8 years that jumps off the page and stands out as so unique and so completely unparalled in NFL history that it would explain a running back who's good (or even really, really good) being one of only 3 players who equalled Jim Brown and Joe Perry in number of seasons with 5.25 yards per carry?

Especially in seasons where they went 7-9. 6-9-1, and 8-9? An argument could be made for 2020 (13-3), but were the 2017, 2018, and 2022 Packers legendary teams who could carry a back to greatness? Every one of those season were years where the Packers basically sucked, Rodgers struggled, and the only thing about the offense that actually worked was handing it to Aaron Jones. He wasn't coasting behind dynamic, powerhouse offenses who dominated the league and opened up numerous opportunities for the RB to exploit imbalances - he was it. He was the the most productive part of the offense all 3 of those years. On RPO plays, every D knew there was a strong likelihood it was going to be Aaron coming out of the backfield, because that was basically all we had to offer. It wasn't the offense carrying Aaron, and Aaron taking advantage of them. It was Aaron carrying the team.

Again, I'm not saying he was one of the greatest backs of all time. The statistics only go so far, and I would have a hard time arguing that it should go anywhere near that far. But I think at some point, when you're looking at Aaron's career, you have to accept that he has rather quietly put in a truly amazing body of work (unmatched in many key ways by any other back in his era) and we have to stand back, look at it, and acknowledge that he was the key factor in all of those seasons. You give the man the ball, and he gets yards. Year in, year out. I really don't believe he gets the respect and appreciation he's earned here in Green Bay.

[sharpe1027]

I'd be interested in the statistics just for Green's time with the Packers. The Seattle and Houston years are going to bring his averages down.

[Fritz]

To my mind, Green was the better back. He could go the distance, and he could plow through the line and get that crucial three yards (unless he was tripped by one of his own guards). After he stopped wearing those forearm pads, he quit fumbling so much, too. If Aaron Jones had Green's size, he'd be Ahman Green but with better receiving skills. Both really good backs, but to my mind Green was much better. In fact, one of the best Packer running backs ever. Ever.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KWLuCbobQtc

[call_me_ishmael]

Ahman Green was freaky deaky and one of the most talented Packers ever.

[MadtownPacker]

I'd be interested in the statistics just for Green's time with the Packers. The Seattle and Houston years are going to bring his averages down.
Damn why you gotta chop down Frozen’s big post with little facts like that? :lol:

I didn’t even think about the Seattle years. Yep take out the 2 Seattle years and his last three after he left GB and it changes a lot. If we go just by the Packers stats it might get ugly.

[Deputy Nutz]

Green Averaged over a 1000 yards a season during his time in Green Bay, he had 54 rushing touchdowns in 8 seasons along with 350 receptions and another 15 touchdowns. He only played in 5 games in 2005, and was brought back in 2009 and never started a game for GB.

2003 he pretty much put the team on his back when Favre broke his thumb and rushed them into the playoffs.

Green shouldn't just be considered one of the best ever in Green Bay, but should get recognition as one of the top 15-20 backs of all time in the NFL. Green is the all time leading rusher for GB, he is considered the 2nd best running back in the history of the Packers. I would say Jones is invited to the party, and even say he is securely in the top 5.

If you want to compare them in their 6 prime years in Green Bay Green has over 8000 yards rushing vs 5500 for Jones. Jones did lead the league in 2019 with 16 rushing TDs, Green had 15 in 2003. 320 receptions for Green vs 263 for Jones.

[sharpe1027]

Damn why you gotta chop down Frozen’s big post with little facts like that? :lol:

I didn’t even think about the Seattle years. Yep take out the 2 Seattle years and his last three after he left GB and it changes a lot. If we go just by the Packers stats it might get ugly.

Because I am the culo rat.

[MadtownPacker]

Because I am the culo rat.Translation - Just like when you get stuck babysitting your bad behaving little nephew.. but you are an even bigger asshole :lol:

https://images7.memedroid.com/images/UPLOADED806/5da27f4c1f6e9.jpeg

[sharpe1027]

Jones is an amazing running back. I'm sad to see him leave. I understand why the Packers moved on.

All three of those things can be true.

[Frozen Tundra]

Jones is an amazing running back. I'm sad to see him leave. I understand why the Packers moved on.

All three of those things can be true.

There's a fourth thing that may be equally true... it could be that the main reason he left was not because he felt dissed, or that he was greedy - it could be that he hears his clock ticking a lot more loudly than we can hear it, and realizes there's a good chance this is going to be his last "payday" contract. It's possible that he thinks however much guaranteed money he makes on this contract is the last money he ever makes in the NFL, and just couple million more dollars is all the bottom line he needs to know.

I've loved the guy and respected him too long to not give him the benefit of the doubt at this stage. I just wish him well, and hope he piles up 17 straight 100 yard games as the Vikings crash and burn their way to a 4-13 record (sweeping both the Bears and the Lions). He was a dedicated Packer who bled green and gold until the day the Packers told him they didn't want to pay him what he asked, and which point he owed the team nothing.

I have to say, though, that he may have outsmarted himself. The Vikings might just wear him out with 20-25 carries a game, whereas if he had stayed here and tandemed with Jacobs, he might have stretched his career out another season as a rotational back.

[run pMc]

Green was the better back. Jones has been the best back since Green. Maybe Jacobs changes that.

[Patler]

Several Packer reporters have stated that Jones aggravated his hammy again on his last carry against the 49ers, and it was serious enough that there was some doubt about if he would have been available a week later if the Packers had won.

This likely influenced their negotiations with him.

[run pMc]

I heard that too, I think it was the JSO reporters. That all sounds like speculation, but if his legs are fragile at this point they aren't going to get much better... and even with an offseason to heal, how long would he stay healthy?

[Fritz]

And that is the downside. I loved the guy, I had hoped they'd bring him back, but I understand that his availability was an issue. It was a fairy-tale story that he was hurt so much during the season, then got healthy at the end and at times put the team on his back in the playoffs. Or at least was the reason Love had so many open receivers. But next year, he could be healthy the first eight games, but miss the rest of the season. Not such a fairy tale there.

I love Aaron Jones, but I understand why they did what they did.

[Joemailman]

And that is the downside. I loved the guy, I had hoped they'd bring him back, but I understand that his availability was an issue. It was a fairy-tale story that he was hurt so much during the season, then got healthy at the end and at times put the team on his back in the playoffs. Or at least was the reason Love had so many open receivers. But next year, he could be healthy the first eight games, but miss the rest of the season. Not such a fairy tale there.

I love Aaron Jones, but I understand why they did what they did.

Yep. I read the Packers offer was 4 million with 2 million in incentives. I suspect the incentives had to do with number of games played. I can understand why the Packers would want that. I can understand why Jones didn't.

[Bretsky]

HOW MANY GAMES over the past 5 YEARS did Aaron Jones and Josh Jacobs miss due to injuries ?

[Joemailman]

HOW MANY GAMES over the past 5 YEARS did Aaron Jones and Josh Jacobs miss due to injuries ?

I think age is a calculation when RB's nearing 30 years old have injuries. If they were close to same age, it likely would have turned out differently.

[red]

thats an interesting "leak" that the team put out about an injury that the vikings saw no problem with

almost seemed like the packers saw that the fans weren't too happy about the release, and decided to put this little nugget into the ears of the reporters that are basically on the team payroll

gutey might do a fine job at building a team, but he sure seems like a complete piece of shit the way he handles things

[Joemailman]

thats an interesting "leak" that the team put out about an injury that the vikings saw no problem with

almost seemed like the packers saw that the fans weren't too happy about the release, and decided to put this little nugget into the ears of the reporters that are basically on the team payroll

gutey might do a fine job at building a team, but he sure seems like a complete piece of shit the way he handles things

What leak? I saw him pull up and thought he was hurt. I'm sure the reporters saw it too.

[sharpe1027]

thats an interesting "leak" that the team put out about an injury that the vikings saw no problem with

almost seemed like the packers saw that the fans weren't too happy about the release, and decided to put this little nugget into the ears of the reporters that are basically on the team payroll

gutey might do a fine job at building a team, but he sure seems like a complete piece of shit the way he handles things

Would the Vikings even gave known about the reinjury? If it's factual correct, I don't mind finding out about it.

[MadtownPacker]

What leak? I saw him pull up and thought he was hurt. I'm sure the reporters saw it too.
Yeah don’t listen to Red, he would be jaded if a truck stop hooker didn’t fall in love with him. Probably thinks he’s like Gere in Pretty Woman.

If you go in the game thread pretty sure I mention Jones looking hurt in the second half. Something was off for sure.

[Frozen Tundra]

Edie: double post

[Frozen Tundra]

thats an interesting "leak" that the team put out about an injury that the vikings saw no problem with

almost seemed like the packers saw that the fans weren't too happy about the release, and decided to put this little nugget into the ears of the reporters that are basically on the team payroll


I was just going to say the exact same thing. I've found it very interesting how much inside information about the Jones contract negotiations somehow found its way out into the media the minute the fan base starting howling about it.

We didn't hear Word One about Bakhtiari, or any other contract discussions, and we never do - every year, that information is shut down tighter than a drum. Not so much as a peep, yet with Jones, we may as well have all been listening in on every phone call, because suddenly we know how the whole thing went.

Edit: my wife's in bed, I'm bored, I spent about 40 minutes watching most of the 4th quarter of the Niners game (and now, I'm googling local therapists to call tomorrow and help me get through the trauma.) But Jones' last carry was a short run up the middle with about 6 1/2 minutes to go, and I didn't see anything remarkable there. But his second to last run was that 53-yarder with 9:37 left in the 4th; if this story is true, that must be where it happened. I didn't see anything noteworthy there, either, except that he started to get gassed around the 35-yard line and steadily slowed down a little bit from that point on, I didn't see any point where he suddenly seemed to feel something. Slowed it down several times, and honestly, everything I saw just looked like a guy getting a little weary in the 4th quarter of a 100 yard+ game.

The last 5-7 yards, he was spinning and leaping laterally trying to break through and pile up a few more, couple of sudden starts and stops, quick bursts, so there were a lot of points there where he could have easily tweaked something, but again - he didn't favor it. When he got off the ground, he was jumping and hopping up and down, dancing, and he seemed pretty OK there. Then Wilson came in and spelled him for a few snaps before his final carry.

At the end of the possession, there wasn't anything special on the sideline. I saw a lot of shots with Jones standing around talking to players, but I didn't see him talking to any of the staff, nobody was checking out the leg, and he sure didn't go into the tent. Everything semed normal. The only attention I saw him get from the staff was when a trainer was hydrating him and wiping the water off his face with a towel.

He was on the field for the final possession, but with Green Bay trailing with a minute and a half left, it was all passing plays. Except for two plays where he ran short outside routes as a dump-off option, he was just hanging back waiting for the blitz. He never really ran anywhere near full speed; just trotted around. But the point is, he was oin the field, not in the tent or the locker room.

He just didn't look to me like a guy who'd suffered a hamstring injury that would make him questionable the following week; that first time he popped that hammy in the regular serason, he knew right away, and he was done fpr the day. The fact that Green Bay left him in the game after that run doesn't seem consistent with aggravating the hamstring enough that he'd be doubtful for the next week.

So I dunno... could be true, could be bullshit. I didn't see anything really convincing. Jones has been a good soldier so far; hasn't talked at all about what happened. But if this is a lie, it may be enough to motivate him into calling bullshit on it.

[Fritz]

Does any of this really matter or is this just us whiling away the time until the draft talk really heats up?

[Patler]

Fans like to think their feelings and opinions mean something to the team. but they really don't mean much to them at all. There was no uproar over the Jones situation. Minor disappointment, nothing more than that. Certainly nothing that would cause the Packers to fabricate some grand story not based in fact.

As for contract negotiation leaks, the vast majority come from the players side of the table.

[bobblehead]

Yeah don’t listen to Red, he would be jaded if a truck stop hooker didn’t fall in love with him. Probably thinks he’s like Gere in Pretty Woman.

If you go in the game thread pretty sure I mention Jones looking hurt in the second half. Something was off for sure.

And I bitched about MiLF not using him in the second half until the very end of the game when it was too late. Now we have an explanation of why we stopped doing what worked so well in the first half.

Was releasing this information a "piece of shit" move? Meh. Not if its true. The truth is simply the truth.

[bobblehead]

Fans like to think their feelings and opinions mean something to the team. but they really don't mean much to them at all. There was no uproar over the Jones situation. Minor disappointment, nothing more than that. Certainly nothing that would cause the Packers to fabricate some grand story not based in fact.

As for contract negotiation leaks, the vast majority come from the players side of the table.

And in todays world (I hate to sound like Tex) the media is constantly getting caught for flat out fabricating things. So who knows if ANYONE from EITHER side actually leaked this. It could have been a guy with an opinion, or it could have been "leaked" by a waterboy who wanted to feel relevant.

[Frozen Tundra]

As for contract negotiation leaks, the vast majority come from the players side of the table.

I would have a hard time imagining any reason Jones might have thought it would be to his advantage to get this information out in the media.

[Fritz]

And in todays world (I hate to sound like Tex) the media is constantly getting caught for flat out fabricating things. So who knows if ANYONE from EITHER side actually leaked this. It could have been a guy with an opinion, or it could have been "leaked" by a waterboy who wanted to feel relevant.

Probably leaked by someone older. Because the older you get, the more you leak.

[Patler]

As for contract negotiation leaks, the vast majority come from the players side of the table.


I would have a hard time imagining any reason Jones might have thought it would be to his advantage to get this information out in the media.


Simple. To make fans feel sorry for him.

[Frozen Tundra]

Simple. To make fans feel sorry for him.

Jones doesn't strike me as being stupid enough to think that would make people feel sorry for him, or desperate enough to really care that much. I give him a lot more credit than that.

[Bretsky]

I think AJO loves the fans of GB and his image is important to him. That is why the leak gets released about how he was JordyNelson''d.

[bobblehead]

Jones doesn't strike me as being stupid enough to think that would make people feel sorry for him, or desperate enough to really care that much. I give him a lot more credit than that.

Perceptions from afar are funny things. I met Derek Jeter once...what an asshole. I met Terell Owens once. What a decent respectful young man. Told his friend to stop swearing in front of the ladies (casino workers). Jones strikes me as a good guy, but I have no idea if he would leak that or not. And he might just not be as classy and decent as we all perceive him to be from afar.

[run pMc]

I think things were leaked from both sides to control the narrative. I suspect it was Jones' agent, not Jones himself. GB also stated they wanted him to take a pay cut in half, but they didn't mention that a big chunk was in incentives.
Ultimately, it's just negotiating that got public. It's just seeing how the sausage is made.

I do wonder what changed from Gute saying he "absolutely" wanted Jones back to him being released... unless it was unspoken and assumed that Gute "absolutely" wanted Jones back at a specific price point.

And the timing on the Jacobs signing doesn't really impact things from what I've heard. They asked Jones to take the pay cut first, and when he said no they moved on to sign Jacobs.
If you ask a player to take a cut and they say no, you either cut them or risk every player thinking it's a bluff and calling you on it.

[ThunderDan]

I think things were leaked from both sides to control the narrative. I suspect it was Jones' agent, not Jones himself. GB also stated they wanted him to take a pay cut in half, but they didn't mention that a big chunk was in incentives.
Ultimately, it's just negotiating that got public. It's just seeing how the sausage is made.

I do wonder what changed from Gute saying he "absolutely" wanted Jones back to him being released... unless it was unspoken and assumed that Gute "absolutely" wanted Jones back at a specific price point.

And the timing on the Jacobs signing doesn't really impact things from what I've heard. They asked Jones to take the pay cut first, and when he said no they moved on to sign Jacobs.
If you ask a player to take a cut and they say no, you either cut them or risk every player thinking it's a bluff and calling you on it.

Having an ex-NFL player as a client, I agree with all of this.

Our client signed a nice 2nd contract. Had a down year and the club came back asking for a paycut or be cut. Funny his agent wasn't anywhere to be found when the team wanted him to take a paycut but was there every step of the way for the 2nd contract signing.

Our client bet on himself, got cut and signed a 1 year deal with another team. He played well and got a good 3rd contract that lasted until he retired.

[ThunderDan]

Sunday afternoons at the office are so much fun during tax time. At least I can read PackerRats for a couple minute escape here and there.

[Frozen Tundra]

Perceptions from afar are funny things. I met Derek Jeter once...what an asshole. I met Terell Owens once. What a decent respectful young man. Told his friend to stop swearing in front of the ladies (casino workers). Jones strikes me as a good guy, but I have no idea if he would leak that or not. And he might just not be as classy and decent as we all perceive him to be from afar.

Whether he's an intelligent man or not, my point was I don't think he's a stupid enough man to believe that this would somehow make people angry at the team. Why would it? If Gutekunst had good reason to believe that Jones wasn't healthy enough to pay him $11,000,000, why would that piss fans off? Only an idiot would think the fans are going to rise up like, "Oh, poor Aaron, how dare Gutekunst not want to take care of him." That'd just be stupid; of course the fans would support not spending that kind of money on an injured player.

[Frozen Tundra]

I do wonder what changed from Gute saying he "absolutely" wanted Jones back to him being released... unless it was unspoken and assumed that Gute "absolutely" wanted Jones back at a specific price point.


Who says anything changed? Language like "I absolutely want Jones back this year", or "I absolutely expect Jones back this year", is totally meaningless. It's ambiguous, completely noncomittal "GM speak" for "he may be back, he may not, too early to make any promises". I think it's just implied that it would entirely depend on how negotiations went, because everyone knew that he would be asked to restructure.

Gutekunst may be a lot of things, but he's no fool. He knows how to speak the language. He knew damned well that in a couple of weeks he was going to ask Jones to take a huge pay cut, and he's not dumb enough to think Jones was just going to take it without (at best) some serious pushback. And he's smart enough to know there was a good chance Jones would refuse it altogether. Saying things like "we really want Aaron back, we love him, Aaron's the heart and soul of our team, we definitely expect him back" makes the fans happy because they think the team is committed to keeping him, and then when the negotiations go bad and he gets released, Gutekunst looks like hey, at least he really tried. Not his fault. It just didn't work out.

[Bretsky]

Curious; which is a bigger punch in the Sack ?

Gutebag asking Jordy to come back at 2 Million / Year ? Which in retrospect, choosing to sign Jimmy for 10MIL/Year instead of giving Jordy, who wanted to stay in GB, a reduced wage of around 5-6..... who had 60 catches for a shit team that year, was a bad call

OR

Gutebag asking Jones to come back at 4 Million ?


The second call might turn out to be the right now. The first was not.

[Jaire]

Probably leaked by someone older. Because the older you get, the more you leak.

Underrated comment

[Patler]

Having an ex-NFL player as a client, I agree with all of this.

Our client signed a nice 2nd contract. Had a down year and the club came back asking for a paycut or be cut. Funny his agent wasn't anywhere to be found when the team wanted him to take a paycut but was there every step of the way for the 2nd contract signing.

Our client bet on himself, got cut and signed a 1 year deal with another team. He played well and got a good 3rd contract that lasted until he retired.

There are also pro athletes who take a complete hands-off approach, leaving everything up to agents and advisors for negotiations. They don't even want to know the give-and-take that goes on, just having final approval on the best deal his people think they can get.

Leaks, lies and exaggerations often come from the agents, not the players directly; or from the players "inner circle" or as we have often seen, family members who may or may not know the facts.

[Patler]

Curious; which is a bigger punch in the Sack ?

Gutebag asking Jordy to come back at 2 Million / Year ? Which in retrospect, choosing to sign Jimmy for 10MIL/Year instead of giving Jordy, who wanted to stay in GB, a reduced wage of around 5-6..... who had 60 catches for a shit team that year, was a bad call

OR

Gutebag asking Jones to come back at 4 Million ?


The second call might turn out to be the right now. The first was not.

Nelson played the one season and was done with football. Cutting Nelson was not a mistake.

Graham played 5 more years (4 of significance), caught 160 passes, scored 20 TD. GB just paid him too much, as did the Bears for his two seasons there.

[sharpe1027]

I agree that letting Nelson go was okay, and Graham was overpaid.

[bobblehead]

Whether he's an intelligent man or not, my point was I don't think he's a stupid enough man to believe that this would somehow make people angry at the team. Why would it? If Gutekunst had good reason to believe that Jones wasn't healthy enough to pay him $11,000,000, why would that piss fans off? Only an idiot would think the fans are going to rise up like, "Oh, poor Aaron, how dare Gutekunst not want to take care of him." That'd just be stupid; of course the fans would support not spending that kind of money on an injured player.

Maybe, maybe not. We just have no idea what is true unless a guy goes on the record. In the end if we win Gutes is awesome and if we don't he blows. Want fans to get over trading Rodgers, have Love turn into a winner. Want to get over Jones, make the Owl with Jacobs. Its really all us fans care about in the end. I once worked for a bar manager that was a prick, but he ran a good bar and the tips were outrageous. I was ok with his attitude.

[bobblehead]

There are also pro athletes who take a complete hands-off approach, leaving everything up to agents and advisors for negotiations. They don't even want to know the give-and-take that goes on, just having final approval on the best deal his people think they can get.

Leaks, lies and exaggerations often come from the agents, not the players directly; or from the players "inner circle" or as we have often seen, family members who may or may not know the facts.

Are you telling me that Greg Jennings sister didn't understand offensive schemes better than Rodgers did?? The hell you say.

[smuggler]

Curious; which is a bigger punch in the Sack ?

Gutebag asking Jordy to come back at 2 Million / Year ? Which in retrospect, choosing to sign Jimmy for 10MIL/Year instead of giving Jordy, who wanted to stay in GB, a reduced wage of around 5-6..... who had 60 catches for a shit team that year, was a bad call

OR

Gutebag asking Jones to come back at 4 Million ?


The second call might turn out to be the right now. The first was not.

The Packers never asked Jordy to come back on $2/year. In fact, they paid him $2.88 million for his 2018 season in Oakland.

They wanted him back at ~$3 million more than that, but the problem was the Raiders ended up paying Jordy about $10.2 million for one season.

If you're Jordy, do you prefer $5.9 mil from the Packers for 2018 (fair price), or $13 mil from the Packers and Raiders in 2018 (hilariously overpriced)?

Can't blame Jordy for taking the money, but don't act like Green Bay lowballed him. And Jordy actually played every snap when he dressed for games, unlike Jones.

[run pMc]

Once-greats in the twilight of their careers with expiring contracts rarely resign with the same team, because they will be offered much less than the last year of their prior contract AND some other team is going to overpay for them. It's pride, and a last chance cash grab - I honestly don't blame them for it.
Letting him go get paid double and getting to live in the Bay Area is honestly doing Jordy a favor.

Jordy was a great player for GB, but he wasn't worth 10M in his last season. We're laughing at Lazard's contract and (no offense to Lazard) he wasn't half the player Jordy was.

GB's entire WR corps made $10M last season (lol) and is the envy of many in the league.

[Fritz]

Are you telling me that Greg Jennings sister didn't understand offensive schemes better than Rodgers did?? The hell you say.

Two things, Bobble. Let me edumucate you. First, as far as meeting celebrities, the key is that we generally meet them once. I love that Terrell Owens was cool, and all power to him. But Jeter - maybe he had a hemmhoroid that day, or he just found out his mom was having an affair with his best friend; I don't know. Or maybe he IS an asshole. I have no idea. But meeting someone once - it's maybe not a good idea to judge that, although I agree with your implicit assumption that celebrities KNOW this and really ought to be on their best behavior with the public. But they're human. And like I said, Derek Jeter may well be an asshole. Your perception might be right.

But on to my bigger point: it is a little know FACT that Greg Jennings's sister is, in fact, Aaron Rodgers. Don't aks me how I know that; just know it's true. So yes, Greg Jennings's sister does understand offensive schemes, not better than Aaron Rodgers, but just as well.

[red]

Two things, Bobble. Let me edumucate you. First, as far as meeting celebrities, the key is that we generally meet them once. I love that Terrell Owens was cool, and all power to him. But Jeter - maybe he had a hemmhoroid that day, or he just found out his mom was having an affair with his best friend; I don't know. Or maybe he IS an asshole. I have no idea. But meeting someone once - it's maybe not a good idea to judge that, although I agree with your implicit assumption that celebrities KNOW this and really ought to be on their best behavior with the public. But they're human. And like I said, Derek Jeter may well be an asshole. Your perception might be right.

But on to my bigger point: it is a little know FACT that Greg Jennings's sister is, in fact, Aaron Rodgers. Don't aks me how I know that; just know it's true. So yes, Greg Jennings's sister does understand offensive schemes, not better than Aaron Rodgers, but just as well.

i've never liked jeter ever since he gave jessica alba herpes

prick

[Bretsky]

The Packers never asked Jordy to come back on $2/year. In fact, they paid him $2.88 million for his 2018 season in Oakland.

They wanted him back at ~$3 million more than that, but the problem was the Raiders ended up paying Jordy about $10.2 million for one season.

If you're Jordy, do you prefer $5.9 mil from the Packers for 2018 (fair price), or $13 mil from the Packers and Raiders in 2018 (hilariously overpriced)?

Can't blame Jordy for taking the money, but don't act like Green Bay lowballed him. And Jordy actually played every snap when he dressed for games, unlike Jones.


Who is your source on what GB offered Jorday Nelson ? I thoght they had offered him 5MIL at the time too til this year but I think that was put out there by GB.

[Fritz]

i've never liked jeter ever since he gave jessica alba herpes

prick

Oh.

Okay, so he's a diseased dick.

And Bobble was right.

[smuggler]

Who is your source on what GB offered Jorday Nelson ? I thoght they had offered him 5MIL at the time too til this year but I think that was put out there by GB.

If they offered him $2mil on a new signing, that's $4.8m total. How little do you think they offered him? 2 or 3 seems reasonable and a conservative estimate.

[bobblehead]

Oh.

Okay, so he's a diseased dick.

And Bobble was right.

I'll agree its not fair to judge a person based on one meeting in a casino no less, but I can give 2 examples that speak to character. TO telling his posse to stop cursing in front of women. Thats not nothing in my book (plus he was super nice to EVERYONE). Jeter acted like the high school jock you wanted to punch in the face (unless you are Nutz, in which case you WERE that guy...kidding nutz). He belittled his "friends", had a general arrogance, and stiffed the waitress that brought him a drink. I asked her later if anyone in his crew took care of her and she said no. Ball busting among friends is awesome. With the Jeter "crew" it was him being a dick and his posse telling him he was great. Its a snapshot, but its an ugly snapshot.

[Fritz]

That is ugly. He sounds like he was a real Richard.

[Bretsky]

Does any of this really matter or is this just us whiling away the time until the draft talk really heats up?



It doesn't matter; but forums are boring w/o pot stirring

Honestly, if anybody doesn't realize Gutey is Heartless they have not been paying attention.

And so be it; be heartless, as long as you can get us a championship or two

He's been here 8 years now. BOth Ron and Ted had one already.

Get to it Guetbag !! :)

[Joemailman]

It doesn't matter; but forums are boring w/o pot stirring

Honestly, if anybody doesn't realize Gutey is Heartless they have not been paying attention.

And so be it; be heartless, as long as you can get us a championship or two

He's been here 8 years now. BOth Ron and Ted had one already.

Get to it Guetbag !! :)

He's not heartless. But he can't afford to be sentimental. There's a difference.

[Bretsky]

If they offered him $2mil on a new signing, that's $4.8m total. How little do you think they offered him? 2 or 3 seems reasonable and a conservative estimate.



They wanted to Jordy to come back at a base salary of 2 MIL/year. Gutie has no interest in bringing Nelson back. It's water under the bridge now, but that is what I've heard a few say what he was offfered. A couple sports guys from the media, the most credible one of which is Wilde, who had a ton of ins with Jordy Nelson, Devonte Adams, and even Rodgers....although his relationship with Rodgers has soured the past 5 years.

[Bretsky]

He's not heartless. But he can't afford to be sentimental. There's a difference.

maybe, or maybe he's somethwere in between. REgardless we'll all embrace him once he wins a SB

[Fritz]

Hard to believe Guter's going into his eighth year. Seems like it's only year four or so, and he's gathering the pieces for the next iteration of Packer greatness.

But man, he had some shit drafts early on, didn't he?

[bobblehead]

They wanted to Jordy to come back at a base salary of 2 MIL/year. Gutie has no interest in bringing Nelson back. It's water under the bridge now, but that is what I've heard a few say what he was offfered. A couple sports guys from the media, the most credible one of which is Wilde, who had a ton of ins with Jordy Nelson, Devonte Adams, and even Rodgers....although his relationship with Rodgers has soured the past 5 years.

I am getting old, but I thought Jordy's biggest bitch is they cut him and didn't even talk to him about a restructure. Am I just that forgetful?

edit: with the help of the google thing I found articles about the packers way lowballing him. Jordy's bitch was that they weren't fair. Lets be honest though. Jordy was going to be 33 to start the next year. He had a 700 yard season with the Raiders and then no one else would offer him a deal. The Raiders are the definition of a stupid franchise. Gutes made the right business decision.

[Fritz]

Funny, I recall that TT was the GM when the whole Jordy thing went down.

But I think he'd just stepped down, and the Jordy Nelson stuff happened a few months later.

[Bretsky]

I am getting old, but I thought Jordy's biggest bitch is they cut him and didn't even talk to him about a restructure. Am I just that forgetful?

edit: with the help of the google thing I found articles about the packers way lowballing him. Jordy's bitch was that they weren't fair. Lets be honest though. Jordy was going to be 33 to start the next year. He had a 700 yard season with the Raiders and then no one else would offer him a deal. The Raiders are the definition of a stupid franchise. Gutes made the right business decision.



I am not saying it was right or wrong. With Jordy catching 60 balls for the sad Raiders I think he could have done way better in that year with Rodgers. Jimmy was not a good signing of course

You should really download Wisconsin on Demmand. Some of these guys who have close relationships with Packer players get direct scoops and it's interesting to hear.

Jordy really wanted to finish his career in GB and he was fine taking a big paycut. HE just didn't want to get bent over. Gute didn't want him. So be it.


And Devonte was very bitter GB let him go into his contract year. One year before he left he wanted to extened with GB and it sounds like the stalemate was about 2MIL/year. it's very rare to let a superstar go into his contract year. Gute did with Adams. That is what lost him. And then once Devonte was out the door he threw out this big contract to make his image look good with GB. But he knew he had zero chance at that point.

ALSO, DID YOU KNOW ?

Ron Wolf interviewed for the Green Bay Packers job years ahead of when he took the job. He interviewed wth Judge Parins (Before Bob Harlan was hired and retructured who had the power).
After the interview, Ron Wolf immediately removed his name from consideration. It was a messed up system then were the GM had very little control over anything. Harlan came in and changed that. And Marcia later changed it again.

[Teamcheez1]

Don’t believe everything you hear. I’m a little skeptical of these versions of events.

[Bretsky]

Don’t believe everything you hear. I’m a little skeptical of these versions of events.


I undoubtedly do not believe everything I hear

[bobblehead]

Bretsky, I don't think they botched the Adams situation though. So he is pissed off, oh well. That doesn't mean they botched it. Personally I was on record that they should have torn it apart a year earlier trading Rodgers at max value, Adams at max value (which they may have done anyway) and moving on from Bak at the same time. It was clear we had cap issues and age issues at key places. I wanted to cut/trade everyone over 28 at the time, even Jones. We did all that over a 3 year period, and I still think they held on too long. Players are always butt hurt, but thats life.

[Joemailman]

When I look at the Packers current situation, and I look at Davante Adams' current situation, I have a hard time coming to the conclusion that the Packers are the ones who botched the situation.

[smuggler]

Bretsky just a fanboy cuck at this point and I can't be bothered to spend effort on some elderly hick who can't or won't count to five.

[MadtownPacker]

Daammnn!! Went hard on his ass! Can someone pick B off the floor and get him into an Uber?

I was Adams fan #1. Have to say without a doubt the current set would not be here if Davante had been signed to a big deal. We already know how successful feeding him the ball was. It just wasn’t a championship winning formula when going against the high powered teams in the playoffs.

[Bretsky]

Bretsky, I don't think they botched the Adams situation though. So he is pissed off, oh well. That doesn't mean they botched it. Personally I was on record that they should have torn it apart a year earlier trading Rodgers at max value, Adams at max value (which they may have done anyway) and moving on from Bak at the same time. It was clear we had cap issues and age issues at key places. I wanted to cut/trade everyone over 28 at the time, even Jones. We did all that over a 3 year period, and I still think they held on too long. Players are always butt hurt, but thats life.



Honestly, I would not argue with anything you note. It worked out thanks to Gute hitting on a multitude of WR's. In a normal secnario, I don't think you let Adams walk but it did work out.
And yes, he is bitter

[Fritz]

Bretsky, what's with you carrying the torch for all these bitter ex-Packers?

[bobblehead]

So the Raiders gave up a 1/2 for Adams, who is 30 now, paid him absolute top dollar. We paid Jacobs near top dollar for a RB and gave up nothing as he turns 26. One is a smart organization doing smart things. I'll let you decide which.

[KYPack]

So the Raiders gave up a 1/2 for Adams, who is 30 now, paid him absolute top dollar. We paid Jacobs near top dollar for a RB and gave up nothing as he turns 26. One is a smart organization doing smart things. I'll let you decide which.

The youngest team in the league and the only team that got younger after participating in free agency.

[run pMc]

Trading high picks for the right to sign/extend a player to an expensive contract is a bad idea. Especially when they are nearing 30.

Jordy was past his prime and I think GB is the sort of team who won't even offer an aging player on an expiring contract a deal that both matches the expected production and the player's asking price.
Great Packer in his prime but by 2017 he didn't have much left in the tank - he had 482 yards on 53 catches that last year in GB. Granted, some of it was with Brett Hundley at QB, but 9.1 ypc is not good for a guy lining up outside.

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/gnb/2017.htm

If GB had better WR depth or had signed someone better than Jimmy Graham the next year nobody would have blinked an eye.

[Frozen Tundra]

Personally I was on record that they should have torn it apart a year earlier trading Rodgers at max value, Adams at max value (which they may have done anyway) and moving on from Bak at the same time. It was clear we had cap issues and age issues at key places. I wanted to cut/trade everyone over 28 at the time, even Jones. We did all that over a 3 year period, and I still think they held on too long. Players are always butt hurt, but thats life.

I was really disappointed when Gutekunst didn't do something very much like that after that disaster in the divisional game against the Niners. That was the sound of our window slamming shut, and the time to start rebuilding was when Rodgers would bring the greatest return. Sell high; cash out those assets at their peak.

I thought we were going to time-warp straight back to the mid-70s. Up to that point (2020), Gutekunst hadn't shown much talent for finding talent in the draft, and I thought he needed as many extra picks as we could get to have a chance at rebuilding a team. When he didn't do that, I was pretty disgusted with him; thought he just didn't have the balls to make the tough calls.

The draft day jackpots he hit in 2022 and 2023 completely changed that. It turned out a lot better than any of us probably could have expected. But at the time, there were a lot of unhappy campers in Cheesehead World.

[bobblehead]

The youngest team in the league and the only team that got younger after participating in free agency.

We might bring back Crosby yet, which would instantly make us the 2nd oldest roster in the NFL.