Romeo, Romeo Wherefore Art Thou, Romeo?

[Patler]

The Doubs situation is being discussed in at least two threads related to weekly games. Since this is a significant situation that will likely last a while, I thought it deserved its own thread. (Besides, I got frustrated try to find things about Doubs that I wanted to respond to in threads having titles wholly related to something else! :) )

[Patler]

This article from last January might shed some light on Doubs. Different guy. I can see where the Packers would have had no idea Doubs was unhappy with his role until he didn't show up. https://www.golongtd.com/p/the-real-romeo-part-i-youve-got-to

Doesn't it seem that Doubs' actions this week are contrary to the person and personality portrayed in that article? The article describes a player who keeps his head focused on the things he can control, not worrying about what he can't control. Doing the right things in the right way, the best way that he can. A team-first guy who doesn't draw attention to himself, who doesn't promote himself.

Does he have the wrong people (or agent) chirping in his ear about his "role" on the team?

[Patler]

What the heck was Doubs thinking? Concerned about his role at this point of this season??

Week 1 - Doubs was the team leader in targeted passes with 7. Not a huge number, but more than anyone else.

Week 2 - Doubs was the leading receiver in yardage, tied for the lead in receptions with only 3, but in a game with a backup QB who threw only 14 passes. Watson didn't have a single pas thrown his way, and said after the game that he couldn't care less, because the objective was to win and he did what he needed to do to get the win.

Week 3 - again, with a backup QB and very few passes thrown (19) Two to Doubs, the same as Watson. Reed had 6, Kraft 3.

Week 4 - Doubs with 8 targets, the same as Reed, behind only Kraft with 9 and Wicks 13.

On the season, Doubs has played more snaps than any other receiver (per an article I read) and has been targeted 20 times, trailing only Reed and Wicks who each have been targeted just 22 times.

Where is the slight to Doubs in those 4 games?

[Patler]

Trade him.


Patler, this was my instant thought. I think it means we are both old (school).


You know he is my fav but sadly yes trade him.

A trade is the only alternative, unless Doubs has come to the team and said; "I'm an idiot. I don't know what I was thinking. I am, always have been, and always will be willing to do whatever is asked of me to help this team win. I am sorry for my actions. It won't happen again."

- If Doubs is not repentant, his anger will continue to fester and only get worse.
- A Packers' strength is the depth at WR. Forcing to any one would be detrimental.
- Discontent left alone can spread. Who's next to complain about his role?
- Doubs is a good player, not a special player. He can't be treated as special.

[Patler]

I think they need to try to work things out before deciding to trade him. They had issues with Jaire last year and have been able to work them out. Not sure how much you would get in a trade for a guy who just decided not to show up to practice without any notification.

I see this as a completely different situation from that with Jaire. Jaire was stupid, put himself out of place, elevated a personal interest, but never quit on the team. He didn't compromise on his preparation or performance.

Doubs quit on the team

[MadtownPacker]

This has brought a dark cloud to my weekend. Yeah if he doesn’t have a 180 there is no way he can stay on the team. Probably even a public apology. While I don’t agree he cant be a special player you are right he isn’t one yet. That might be part of the issue but regardless of him being right or wrong he shit the bed and is now laying in it. How did shit get to this point is what is stunning. Has to be someone whispering in his ear to go nuclear out of nowhere.

[Patler]

This has brought a dark cloud to my weekend. Yeah if he doesn’t have a 180 there is no way he can stay on the team. Probably even a public apology. While I don’t agree he cant be a special player you are right he isn’t one yet. That might be part of the issue but regardless of him being right or wrong he shit the bed and is now laying in it. How did shit get to this point is what is stunning. Has to be someone whispering in his ear to go nuclear out of nowhere.

It's such a stupid, stupid time to have done this. They played two games (and won both) with a backup QB who passed mostly only as a distraction. Who can complain about their role in either of those games?

One game got out of hand almost immediately, destroying any plan they had for the game.

In the only "normal" game this year, Doubs was the leader in passes targeted to him.

[Fritz]

It's such a stupid, stupid time to have done this. They played two games (and won both) with a backup QB who passed mostly only as a distraction. Who can complain about their role in either of those games?

One game got out of hand almost immediately, destroying any plan they had for the game.

In the only "normal" game this year, Doubs was the leader in passes targeted to him.

As I understand the situation, he was particularly unhappy with this week's game plan, which I am guessing featured a lot more Wicks-and-Reed stuff to cover for Watson's absence, and Doubs likely felt like he was the logical guy to pick up some slack in the game plan. Maybe that was the proverbial straw for him, after the focus on feeding Wicks the ball the last two games despite his less-than-stellar start to the season.

I think the article Joe posted suggests that Romeo Doubs must have German blood coursing through his veins: don't talk about what is happening. Be stoic, don't explain. And so, in typical German fashion, nothing gets said, nothing gets talked about, but the resentments and angers build up until there is a sudden, seemingly surprising reaction.

I do think there's a way out here. The more serious suggestion would be that MLF and Love go talk to him and make nice - how important he is to the team, etc. Then a meeting with Doubs's agent in which the agent is apprised of how little leverage Doubs has, and a warning to the agent that he needs to do a better job of helping Doubs understand how he's damaging his own future payday, and perhaps a warning to the agent to quit prodding Doubs about how underappreciated he is (if that's what the team thinks the agent is doing). In other words, do a little ass-kicking, but kick the agent's ass, not Doubs's (that's part of an agent's job). Then craft a careful statement about not wanting to be a distraction, maybe mention "misunderstandings" (so much easier for people than straight up saying they fucked up), apologize for the misunderstanding and for being a distraction when really all Doubs has ever wanted was to help the team win, etc, etc. You know, the modern-day-athlete's version of an "apology." Everybody says it's cool, no problem. Next game Doubs gets maybe an extra throw or two, then back to just game planning without taking him into particular consideration.

OR somebody close to Doubs says "Oh, he's so stoic, he was actually just really sick and he didn't want anyone to know," and Doubs indirectly and reluctantly confirms this, then the whole usual "misunderstandings" thing, and then he's back, only wanting to help the team, etc.

That's the modern-day version of things. Athletes, politicians, straying spouses: a sorta-kinda apology ("I'm so sorry this has all gotten so bad!") that relies on the idea of misunderstanding, as if a lack of communication or poor communication is the real problem, not that someone plain did something stupid or shitty or both.

And if Doubs isn't amenable to any of this (I still think a sit-down with MLF would do wonders), well, then you have to either suspend him indefinitely or pretend it's all okay and then try to trade him, though in that case, the team has zero leverage and will get very little in return.

We all have read reports in the past of some of the wide receivers getting together with Love in the offseason to practice, or getting together amongst themselves to train. I think Reed has been mentioned in that regard. Was Doubs ever mentioned? I'm wondering how the other receivers see him. He seems like a bit of a loner.

[Anti-Polar Bear]

Doubs is from LA. Game’s in LA. By all accounts, Doubs is a humble fellow.

There can only be one logical reason for all this drama: Doubs has gotten himself suspended on purpose to avoid the notorious LA gang cribs.

[sharpe1027]

This makes it easier to decide who to keep when all the rookie WR contracts end.

[bobblehead]

This makes it easier to decide who to keep when all the rookie WR contracts end.

Yep. Extend Watson if he can be had for a modest price. Lay the groundwork for Reed and Wicks. Trade Doubs and draft a WR next year. Of course this is all hypothetical as I doubt you will get any of these guys to sign for under market because thats not the way it works anymore. Instead keep them competing til the end and pony up for the best ones.

[King Friday]

Reed is obviously a keeper. I believe Wicks will develop into that as well. Adams has plenty of issues with drops his first few years, then worked his way out of it. Wicks has the talent to be a true #1 if he works at it. The Doubs situation may give the Packers an opportunity to bring a veteran WR in next year to help develop guys like Wicks, Melton and Heath.

I now wonder if not having a veteran presence in the room was something that allowed the malcontent to fester. It’s nice having a room filled with great young talent, but often having someone who understands the league and the longer term view helps with the young kids. We just don’t have ANY veteran leadership on offense, and that may have been part of the issue.

[bobblehead]

How about dish Romeo to the Raiders with a 5th for their malcontent WR...that Adams guy. Then sign Bak to light a fire under Walker.

WE'RE GETTING THE BAND BACK TOGETHER!!!

[Teamcheez1]

Not going to get any return on your investment if you trade him.
His remaining salary on his rookie contract is a drop in the bucket.
It would be bad precedent as an organization to give into whatever his demands are, if any.
I’m not sure we know exactly what is going on, but MLF and company are paid to resolve these type of issues.

[MadtownPacker]

How about dish Romeo to the Raiders with a 5th for their malcontent WR...that Adams guy. Then sign Bak to light a fire under Walker.

WE'RE GETTING THE BAND BACK TOGETHER!!!
That’s what my Lowe’s local Packer Backer (he is from WI) said to me yesterday. It’s the only way to heal my heart. Let’s fukin do it!

[MadtownPacker]

Not going to get any return on your investment if you trade him.
His remaining salary on his rookie contract is a drop in the bucket.
It would be bad precedent as an organization to give into whatever his demands are, if any.
I’m not sure we know exactly what is going on, but MLF and company are paid to resolve these type of issues.You are right except the last part. LeFleur and crew are supposed to prevent these issues. He has let us go from contender to pretender and it’s barely week 5.

[King Friday]

There is no point being the best team in the NFL in Sep and Oct. The Eagles looked unbeatable last year in the first 8-9 weeks. MLF couldn’t prevent Love’s injury, and despite it he’s kept the team in position to be 3-2 with a good performance today. I doubt many coaches in the league could’ve gotten 2 wins with Willis. Quit with the bitching.

[MadtownPacker]

Quit with the bitchin?? We are discussing the hot topic of the week. I would say there is plenty to be unhappy with this week. The record is not the problem right now. I would argue if Pepe LePew had left Willis in for the vikings game maybe it’s a win.

[King Friday]

You just said MLF has made us a pretender. That is bitching, and also untrue.

Willis wasn’t beating the Vikings if neither Purdy or Stroud could.

[MadtownPacker]

It’s me saying my opinion on a sports forum. Bitching is what your old lady does when you don’t listen so use better wording if your gonna jam me up.

He is the HC and as far as I’m concerned he gets all the credit and all the blame.

You also don’t know what Willis would have done. You just know he played excellent when given the chance.

[texaspackerbacker]

Doubs is from LA. Game’s in LA. By all accounts, Doubs is a humble fellow.

There can only be one logical reason for all this drama: Doubs has gotten himself suspended on purpose to avoid the notorious LA gang cribs.

An acorn of good sense hahahahaha. The gangs probably put pressure on Doubs to throw the game or else they do something to his family - that qualifies as a personal problem. Getting suspended for one game would be a logical reaction. Sarcasm? Ask bobblehead, he's the expert.

[King Friday]

You also don’t know what Willis would have done. You just know he played excellent when given the chance.

Against mediocre competition, sure. The Vikings are not mediocre.

[MadtownPacker]

Against mediocre competition, sure. The Vikings are not mediocre.
I just think his feet could have been the difference. All week I didn’t like the idea of throwing Love in there against such a tough defense.

[King Friday]

I just think his feet could have been the difference. All week I didn’t like the idea of throwing Love in there against such a tough defense.

Love could’ve won in spite of that if we had a fucking kicker.

[MadtownPacker]

Love could’ve won in spite of that if we had a fucking kicker.True and that’s where I go back to placing the blame on Pepe LePew. Shit has been haunting us since last season and then we get new problems.

[King Friday]

True and that’s where I go back to placing the blame on Pepe LePew. Shit has been haunting us since last season and then we get new problems.

MLF isn’t responsible for roster build. That is Gute.

[red]

True and that’s where I go back to placing the blame on Pepe LePew. Shit has been haunting us since last season and then we get new problems.

yep, something isn't right at 1265 right now


MLF isn’t responsible for roster build. That is Gute.

he is responsible for team discipline, or complete lack there of

[Fritz]

Well, if Doubs was unhappy about his role on the team, how does watching Wicks's mediocre play on Sunday affect his case? Wicks caught two of seven targets. How many were pure Love misses, and how many were Alan Lazardish drops?

Admit it: they could've really used Doubs. He's the safety blanket, the go-to guy when they absolutely must have a catch.

I don't know why Doubs pulled this stuff - I think he's a really closed-off, keep-it-to-yourself-until-you-can't-hold-it-in-and-then-react-suddenly-and-harshly kind of guy. He needs counseling, maybe.

I hope the team and he can work this out, he can come back, be a good teammate, and help this team. Wicks is dropping the ball. Metaphorically and literally.

[red]

Well, if Doubs was unhappy about his role on the team, how does watching Wicks's mediocre play on Sunday affect his case? Wicks caught two of seven targets. How many were pure Love misses, and how many were Alan Lazardish drops?



i can think of 2 clear drops off the top of my head, maybe 3

one pass he pretty much just swatted to the ground, and there was one long pass that went right through his hands that the announcers somehow said the defender tipped even though he didn't touch it

[bobblehead]

We need him to come back and be a good soldier. If he does that and puts up decent numbers he will get paid. He won't get Tyrique Hill money, but I imagine MVS payday is well within reach. But not if he destroys his career before its gets going.

[texaspackerbacker]

Exactly. LaFleur or whoever obviously came to the conclusion that Wicks was a better WR. That conclusion is looking pretty shaky.

Doubs is kinda like a very instinctive but not super athletic LB on defense - often better than the higher potential guy.

[MadtownPacker]

Agree with Tex and Bobble. That what I like about Doubs. He is the working man type and instinctual. Can’t coach that.

I don’t think the fans will hold it against him once he makes some catches. Pepe LePew needs to get a talking to also for letting shit get out of control. Barely beating your coach buddy when his team sucks isn’t enough to look past his part. Fucking hairgel addict!!

[Patler]

yep, something isn't right at 1265 right now

he is responsible for team discipline, or complete lack there of

Isn't this a bit overly negative at this point? Just three weeks ago, after Willis' first game, the vibe around the team was extremely positive. A united group willing to do what was needed to get a win, headed by Christian Watson saying he didn't care at all that a pass wasn't thrown to him as long as they won.

Now, one player has had a melt-down. There are 53 players on the roster, another handful from the practice squad regularly involved in game planning. I don't think that one player going off the rails is indicative of an overriding management problem, or a lack of discipline.

Now, they must get Doubs back in line or move on from him. I think it is a Doubs problem, not a team problem.

[MadtownPacker]

If Doubs is a Packer it is a team problem.

You really don’t think the HC has any involvement or responsibility in these matters?

[Fritz]

Isn't this a bit overly negative at this point? Just three weeks ago, after Willis' first game, the vibe around the team was extremely positive. A united group willing to do what was needed to get a win, headed by Christian Watson saying he didn't care at all that a pass wasn't thrown to him as long as they won.

Now, one player has had a melt-down. There are 53 players on the roster, another handful from the practice squad regularly involved in game planning. I don't think that one player going off the rails is indicative of an overriding management problem, or a lack of discipline.

Now, they must get Doubs back in line or move on from him. I think it is a Doubs problem, not a team problem.


I’d say it’s a “both” problem. MLF needs to use his diplomatic skills here. He needs to assure Doubs of his importance to the team, remind him that being a good teammate will get him a bigger payday than sitting out, and also let it be known (without being too harsh) that Doubs’s behavior ain’t gonna fly.

This is a big part of being a great coach - getting your players to buy in. Now, you can’t MAKE a guy buy in, but if you’re skilled at it you can help guys like Doubs. I get a sense Doubs isn’t so much a narcissistic jerk as he is a proud, intense guy who never learned to talk it out. In the sixties, you could trade his ass and be the Tough Coach Autocrat, but times are different. MLF needs to take Doubs on a journey of self-discovery.

I can’t believe I wrote that. Not something I’d have said fifteen years ago.

[Patler]

Perhaps I didn't state it well, because you both seem to have misunderstood what I meant. I agree that MLF needs to go to Doubs and try to get Doubs back onboard. I did not mean Doubs was on his own to come back or be traded.

My comment was in response to Red writing:


yep, something isn't right at 1265 right now

he is responsible for team discipline, or complete lack there of

which I thought implied that there is a management problem with the Packers and/or a problem with team discipline, evidenced by what Doubs has done. I don't think there is evidence that either exists. I think the problem is specific to Doubs, not the result of a team problem or something wrong in the organization.

Doubs' problem BECOMES a team problem, but it's a "Doubs problem" not the result of or caused by a management problem or team discipline issue (i.e. "team problem").

[Fritz]

Gotcha. That makes sense.

Plus, it’s a long season. It’s too soon for us to panic, except for our immediate post-game panics, which are traditional.

I see what you mean, though, and agree. Now, if the beer vendor in section 116 starts complaining, all bets are off.

[sharpe1027]

I agree with Patler.

[MadtownPacker]

Appears you misunderstood me as well. I don’t think the Packers are in disarray. The “management problem” with players starts and ends with Pepe. If he doesn’t handle his shit then the next level comes in. Gute has no involvement, yet.

[MadtownPacker]

I agree with Patler.
You scared of him? Mofo is like the boogeyman if you get your facts twisted. :lol:

[MadtownPacker]

I gotta hit you up Patler, what are your thoughts on Romeo after Wicks dropfest? Would he have been the difference so it wasn’t a close game? I tend to believe so. Love didn’t have his ace.

[Patler]

I gotta hit you up Patler, what are your thoughts on Romeo after Wicks dropfest? Would he have been the difference so it wasn’t a close game? I tend to believe so. Love didn’t have his ace.

I haven't watched the game yet, maybe tonight. Until I see the nature of the Wicks drops, I won't jump to a conclusion.

That said, I like Doubs as a player, and I hope he comes back fully committed, because it seems Wicks is not yet ready to assume a primary WR role.

[Fritz]

I haven't watched the game yet, maybe tonight. Until I see the nature of the Wicks drops, I won't jump to a conclusion.

That said, I like Doubs as a player, and I hope he comes back fully committed, because it seems Wicks is not yet ready to assume a primary WR role.

First of all, what kind of fan are you anyway, not jumping to conclusions?

Secondly, this Wicks dropsies thing is odd in that so many players and/or coaches seemed to think he was primed for a big breakout year. Let's hope this is a glitch, like Davante Adams's second year, and not a feature, like the MVS dropsies.

And where, oh where, has Bo Melton been? He was also a big breakout star at the end of last season, but he's been pretty quiet - the game plan seemed to call for Heath, the blocking receiver, moreso than Melton, whom I thought might take Watson's snaps as far as a deep threat.

[NewsBruin]

I’d say it’s a “both” problem. MLF needs to use his diplomatic skills here. He needs to assure Doubs of his importance to the team, remind him that being a good teammate will get him a bigger payday than sitting out, and also let it be known (without being too harsh) that Doubs’s behavior ain’t gonna fly.

This is a big part of being a great coach - getting your players to buy in. Now, you can’t MAKE a guy buy in, but if you’re skilled at it you can help guys like Doubs. I get a sense Doubs isn’t so much a narcissistic jerk as he is a proud, intense guy who never learned to talk it out. In the sixties, you could trade his ass and be the Tough Coach Autocrat, but times are different. MLF needs to take Doubs on a journey of self-discovery.

I can’t believe I wrote that. Not something I’d have said fifteen years ago.

If it makes you feel better, one of Maraniss' main points was that Lombardi played up the hardass image, but used whatever approach helped individual players on a case-by-case basis

[Joemailman]

If it makes you feel better, one of Maraniss' main points was that Lombardi played up the hardass image, but used whatever approach helped individual players on a case-by-case basis

Yep. Long before Maraniss wrote his book, I believe it was Jerry Kramer who said Lombardi was a master at knowing when a guy need a pat on the back and when he needed a kick in the ass.

[ThunderDan]

Yep. Long before Maraniss wrote his book, I believe it was Jerry Kramer who said Lombardi was a master at knowing when a guy need a pat on the back and when he needed a kick in the ass.

Bart Starr told a story about that. Lombardi ripped him a new one in front of the team. He went to Lombardi's office and told him never to do that again to him. He said just bring me into your office and tell me what is wrong. Lombardi never did it again.

[red]

Perhaps I didn't state it well, because you both seem to have misunderstood what I meant. I agree that MLF needs to go to Doubs and try to get Doubs back onboard. I did not mean Doubs was on his own to come back or be traded.

My comment was in response to Red writing:



which I thought implied that there is a management problem with the Packers and/or a problem with team discipline, evidenced by what Doubs has done. I don't think there is evidence that either exists. I think the problem is specific to Doubs, not the result of a team problem or something wrong in the organization.

Doubs' problem BECOMES a team problem, but it's a "Doubs problem" not the result of or caused by a management problem or team discipline issue (i.e. "team problem").

there was also the weird jaire going rogue thing last year

there was the odd trading of rasul douglas last year who by all accounts was a locker room leader at the time

no preseason= another sloppy start to the season

there was the rodgers drama

the adams drama before that

dumping fan favorite and ultra packer aaron jones to save about 1 million against the cap

all the stupid penalties made over and over again by the same players

the odd kicking battle this preseason, where no one won

watson and stokes having to go out of network to get the hamsting issues figured out

yeah, theres some odd shit going on in the building, and i'm sure i'm forgetting some or not even hearing about some. don't know if its the front office, or coaches, or players or what, but the last few years, things seem to be a bit off to me

[Joemailman]

Jeremy Fowler
@JFowlerESPN

#Packers WR Romeo Doubs plans to attend Wednesday’s practice coming out of his meeting with the team today, per source. The meeting ‘went well,’ the source added.

[run pMc]

I don't really have much to say about it since I don't know the facts. We may never.

Doubs would have helped yesterday vs. the Rams.

Until this week the perception was these guys all cheered each other on, and that seemed to be the case. Not sure what changed, if someone got in Doubs' ear or if Tank's suggestion of dodging LA gangs has any legs. Nobody outside the building knows.

If MLF has a game plan and one player doesn't like it, I don't think there's a lot MLF can do about it if the player doesn't say anything and just skips practice. There has to be something else going on.
Either way, the team has publicly made it seem they are open to conversation and welcoming Doubs back, and it would seem both sides are in the process of moving forward in a positive way. That's encouraging.

Every team has weird shit going on in the building, it's a matter of whether you can keep the team together and not have your season go off the rails. I'm confident they can do that.

[Fritz]

I don't really have much to say about it since I don't know the facts. We may never.

Doubs would have helped yesterday vs. the Rams.

Until this week the perception was these guys all cheered each other on, and that seemed to be the case. Not sure what changed, if someone got in Doubs' ear or if Tank's suggestion of dodging LA gangs has any legs. Nobody outside the building knows.

If MLF has a game plan and one player doesn't like it, I don't think there's a lot MLF can do about it if the player doesn't say anything and just skips practice. There has to be something else going on.
Either way, the team has publicly made it seem they are open to conversation and welcoming Doubs back, and it would seem both sides are in the process of moving forward in a positive way. That's encouraging.

Every team has weird shit going on in the building, it's a matter of whether you can keep the team together and not have your season go off the rails. I'm confident they can do that.


To me, this is the real key to being a successful coach, moreso than the X's and O's. Think about it: You've got seventy players (53 active, 17 PS) spending months and months and months of pretty intense time together. It's more than just show up at work five days a week at nine, and leave at five or six. They travel together, they live together, and it's all under a spotlight. Or think about baseball. Fewer guys, but 162 games together. Wow. Forget that it's sports, that's a lot of time with other humans. Managing that, and getting guys to buy in and play hard and practice hard and eat right - holy smokes, that would be tough.

[texaspackerbacker]

Whether this is much ado about nothing or something significant still depends on facts that we don't know, and the media pukes also don't know.

It seems to me like LaFleur handled things pretty well. The people who probably do know what's going on, of course, are the players and coaching staff. If there is discontent there, then LaFleur didn't do a very good job and has a problem. I tend to doubt that is the case, though. I'm thinking Doubs is back playing this week and doing good.

[Patler]

Just for the heck of it, I'm going to throw out another thought. Every now and then, players comment about how little direct contact they really have with the HC. That's understandable. Just in direct game planning and prep, MLF has 28 coaches and 70+ players to deal with.

IF, and this is a big IF, because maybe Doubs action came out of the blue, the guy who should have sensed the problem and dealt with it from the start is the WR Coach, Ryan Mahaffey. Did he fail to deal effectively with an issue he knew existed; did he fail to see a problem he should have seen growing, or was he blind-sided by Doubs actions? We'll never know, but these are questions LaFleur has to be asking.

[Joemailman]

Just for the heck of it, I'm going to throw out another thought. Every now and then, players comment about how little direct contact they really have with the HC. That's understandable. Just in direct game planning and prep, MLF has 28 coaches and 70+ players to deal with.

IF, and this is a big IF, because maybe Doubs action came out of the blue, the guy who should have sensed the problem and dealt with it from the start is the WR Coach, Ryan Mahaffey. Did he fail to deal effectively with an issue he knew existed; did he fail to see a problem he should have seen growing, or was he blind-sided by Doubs actions? We'll never know, but these are questions LaFleur has to be asking.

Both Mahaffey and passing game coordinator Jason Vrable are guys receivers should be able to communicate with. Mahaffey is new this year, so Doubs would know Vrable better.

[Patler]

Both Mahaffey and passing game coordinator Jason Vrable are guys receivers should be able to communicate with. Mahaffey is new this year, so Doubs would know Vrable better.

Agreed, from Doubs perspective. Vrable was more directly with Doubs for Doubs' first two years; and Mahaffey came from the o-line room to the receivers this past offseason. But, Mahaffey is now the one directly with Doubs in every meeting and on the field throughout all of the practices. MLF has to ask if Mahaffey has control of the WR room, the respect and confidence of his players and an understanding of his player concerns, moods and attitudes. Something went wrong. Mahaffey may have no blame for it, but MLF has to find out, because Mahaffey is new in this job.

[call_me_ishmael]

I think it's highly unlikely Romeo will be on the team next year. Do you agree, or disagree, and why?

[texaspackerbacker]

Put me on record as disagreeing. Why? Because he is a good player, and he will still be cheap - rookie contract (I think) next season.

[King Friday]

I would expect him to be on the team next year. This was a major screwup, but as long as he comes back and doesn’t have a relapse, this incident will be forgotten rather quickly…at least until contract negotiations come up.

[MadtownPacker]

Yeah if he goes back to doing his thing on the field and doesn’t pull this shit again all is forgiven. For it to all get wrapped up in one week is interesting. At least he didn’t go to the media and start talking shit.

[Fritz]

Yeah if he goes back to doing his thing on the field and doesn’t pull this shit again all is forgiven. For it to all get wrapped up in one week is interesting. At least he didn’t go to the media and start talking shit.

When you read this, it sure sounds like Doubs might have some mental health challenges right now - he says it wasn't about the team or the organization, just his own issues that he did not handle well.

So yes, he can come back from this.

https://lombardiave.com/matt-lafleur-sends-blunt-message-packers-players-after-romeo-doubs-suspension-01j9t0yd6js6

[texaspackerbacker]

I said it halfway sarcastically before, but based on his saying that, maybe it really did have to do with a gang thing, the game being in L.A. where he came from and his family still lives and could be threatened.

[Joemailman]

At one point yesterday Doubs said he was "going through some things mentally". At another point he said his mental health is fine. Could be he's in denial about his mental health. Yet if the Packers felt he had a mental health problem, they wouldn't have suspended him. Most likely a combination of frustration with his season so far, and problems at home got him to the point where he felt he needed some time off. Problem was he didn't communicate that to the Packers.

[MadtownPacker]

Or maybe the Packers didn’t bother to notice? Like that new WR coach.

[Patler]

If you haven't heard Doubs' interview, listen to it. Only 6 minutes:

https://www.jsonline.com/videos/sports/nfl/packers/2024/10/11/packers-romeo-doubs-speaks-publicly-since-skipping-practice-last-week/75633743007/

Been a long time since I have seen anyone choose their words this carefully, and look so uncomfortable answering questions.

About half the questions were answered with some version of: "I'm not comfortable talking about that."

For the few questions that he did respond to, he said the right things, but it is difficult to tell if he meant it, or said what he knew he should say. He contradicted himself a few times, too.


For me, this made the situation even more confusing and difficult to understand

[Patler]

I think it's highly unlikely Romeo will be on the team next year. Do you agree, or disagree, and why?

After watching the video of his locker room Q&A with the media, I'm not convinced he will still be in GB in November, let alone next year. Something still isn't right. If he remains as unhappy and distant as he seemed in that video, it might be best for him and the team to go their separate ways.

[Joemailman]

After watching the video of his locker room Q&A with the media, I'm not convinced he will still be in GB in November, let alone next year. Something still isn't right. If he remains as unhappy and distant as he seemed in that video, it might be best for him and the team to go their separate ways.

I think that's just his demeanor. From what I've seen, he never looks happy on camera. I suspect he's an introverted guy who doesn't feel comfortable with a lot of attention. That may have been part of the reason why the Packers were caught off guard. If he was unhappy it would have been hard to tell. I think he'll be okay unless this incident affects his play going forwardand he goes onto a real downward spiral.
https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSkX03gXOg7pvC9DgXhOj6uH1swkfT8q NDnawISYM2ivhaPV7vf8ufQl1TVypbAXCRHTt4&usqp=CAUhttps://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSogL-dmcfsnlXFUaizshWA8RmGWq9veIyKJu_cJly6t5kNyIu7lzb-08r1dez8o30Ssgg&usqp=CAUhttps://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQFrU4iUMEzPqvPf85k_ovTKkLrQNwWJ ps1QCOvyexrKedq-ZTmnyZfKO7f80qITjNmK3I&usqp=CAU

[Patler]

I think that's just his demeanor. From what I've seen, he never looks happy on camera. I suspect he's an introverted guy who doesn't feel comfortable with a lot of attention. That may have been part of the reason why the Packers were caught off guard. If he was unhappy it would have been hard to tell. I think he'll be okay unless this incident affects his play and he goes onto a real downward spiral.

... or if it affects how others play, or act. How might that happen? I know Doubs said this wasn't about his role on the team, but if it was....

- Supposedly Doubs and Love have been friends since college, when both trained at the same place during the summers. Might Love now start forcing the ball to Doubs to give him the "boost" he needs or is looking for?

- How do others REALLY feel about Doubs actions? If Doubs thinks he should have gotten more targets, at the expense of whom? The easy answer is Wicks, but that was just a game or two. To be pushed to boycott the team, did he also resent the emergence of Reed last year? Kraft last year and this? The seemingly higher public profile granted Watson? How do they feel about that?

- Do coaches or players have to walk on eggshells around him now?

- Watson was much more "ignored" than Doubs, and he was seemingly OK with it? Does that change to, "Hey, what about ME??

- Does the "All for one" WR room become "All for one...except one"?


A delicate balance of egos may have been disrupted by this.

[texaspackerbacker]

Enough with the psycho-babble already. sheeeesh

[Joemailman]

Enough with the psycho-babble already. sheeeesh

Yah. I hope Doubs play real good.

[Patler]

Enough with the psycho-babble already. sheeeesh

Gosh, I'm so sorry you didn't appreciate my post. My main objective is to give you the content in posts that you seek.

[MadtownPacker]

In the middle a bit but I’m with Patler on this. Like I already said the whole thing is weird so would love to know what the hell happened. Which of course we will never know until the Romeo movie premieres on Lifetime Network.

[Bretsky]

After watching the video of his locker room Q&A with the media, I'm not convinced he will still be in GB in November, let alone next year. Something still isn't right. If he remains as unhappy and distant as he seemed in that video, it might be best for him and the team to go their separate ways.

I'm also not at all convinced he'll be in GB next season. I think Walker made a comment in an interview that it's "awkward".

As a Head Coach, I am a bit disappointed that MLF didn't give him a condition for his return, which should have been for Romeo to apologize to the team and pledge that he's all in going forward.

I would think this is his last season in GB

[Joemailman]

I'm also not at all convinced he'll be in GB next season. I think Walker made a comment in an interview that it's "awkward".

As a Head Coach, I am a bit disappointed that MLF didn't give him a condition for his return, which should have been for Romeo to apologize to the team and pledge that he's all in going forward.

I would think this is his last season in GB

According to Christian Watson, Doubs did address the team. So we don't know for sure, but maybe MLF did give him the condition you're talking about. We'll likely never know for sure.

[MadtownPacker]

According to Christian Watson, Doubs did address the team. So we don't know for sure, but maybe MLF did give him the condition you're talking about. We'll likely never know for sure.
As much shit as I give LeFleur I have to give him props for the cleanup. The fact we don’t know shit is a credit to him for keeping it in house. If Doubs spoke to the team that’s good enough for me.

[Patler]

I'm also not at all convinced he'll be in GB next season. I think Walker made a comment in an interview that it's "awkward".


One of the reporters mentioned also that several players seemed frustrated on Wednesday when Doubs didn't come to the locker room to answer reporters' questions himself, forcing them to have to continue talking about the situation.

[texaspackerbacker]

God DAMN those media pukes - AGAIN trying to stir up trouble. Vince woulda told bastards like them to get out and never come back.

[Joemailman]

God DAMN those media pukes - AGAIN trying to stir up trouble. Vince woulda told bastards like them to get out and never come back.

Yeah, sure he would.

https://media.gettyimages.com/id/515535812/photo/vince-lombardi-head-coach-of-green-bay-packers-shown-being-interviewed-by-newsmen-after-his.jpg?s=612x612&w=gi&k=20&c=_12zdKBbyP-ld-NbQENX1JZCOX-6BERuESXGSL5QfVU=

[Patler]

God DAMN those media pukes - AGAIN trying to stir up trouble. Vince woulda told bastards like them to get out and never come back.

I think it is far better to know the truth, than to go blindly through life believing in a world that does not exist.

[Bretsky]

God DAMN those media pukes - AGAIN trying to stir up trouble. Vince woulda told bastards like them to get out and never come back.


How DARE they note that Doubbs intentionaly skipped two practices and was suspended

Oh wait...that happened

[Bretsky]

One of the reporters mentioned also that several players seemed frustrated on Wednesday when Doubs didn't come to the locker room to answer reporters' questions himself, forcing them to have to continue talking about the situation.


Wilde and Taucher went into details on the same thing. He skipped the media session and didn't apologize to the team on day he came back. Awkward

[texaspackerbacker]

I think it is far better to know the truth, than to go blindly through life believing in a world that does not exist.

You're making the extremely shaky assumption that those God damned fake news shitheads are actually telling the truth.

[Patler]

You're making the extremely shaky assumption that those God damned fake news shitheads are actually telling the truth.

Most do. They have few reasons not to have at least some foundation in truth. It is then the responsibility of reasonably intelligent, fair-minded adults to reach their own conclusions. Without information, they can not.

[texaspackerbacker]

Undoubtedly they aren't gonna lie about stats or other easy to check facts. But this crap that was cited, basically INTENSIONALLY creating dissension among players - "this guy said something about that guy", the media shithead needs to shut up about that. The bastard probably asked some kind of leading question or whatever anyway, even if it isn't a total misquote.

People need to see the God damned media as the enemy, as their default anyway. Of course I'm just talking about sports hahahaha - let not anybody say otherwise.

[Patler]

Undoubtedly they aren't gonna lie about stats or other easy to check facts. But this crap that was cited, basically INTENSIONALLY creating dissension among players - "this guy said something about that guy", the media shithead needs to shut up about that. The bastard probably asked some kind of leading question or whatever anyway, even if it isn't a total misquote.

People need to see the God damned media as the enemy, as their default anyway. Of course I'm just talking about sports hahahaha - let not anybody say otherwise.

Well...if you see or hear the question and the answer, as you can easily do in today's video-centric world, you can easily determine the quality and nature of the questions.

No, you do not have to view the media as the enemy. It is easy to review numerous sources, and thereby separate facts from opinions, reality from storytelling. All you have to do is read, listen and think. More sources generally lead to better conclusions.

[texaspackerbacker]

That's not the point. Those media bastards sewing seeds of dissension on the team with misleading quotes (or even correct quotes), that's what it is about. They are doing their damnedest to harm the Packers. That's a helluva lot more important that reading those ENEMY assholes' version of "the truth".

[Joemailman]

That's not the point. Those media bastards sewing seeds of dissension on the team with misleading quotes (or even correct quotes), that's what it is about. They are doing their damnedest to harm the Packers. That's a helluva lot more important that reading those ENEMY assholes' version of "the truth".

The only one who did anything to harm the Packers was Doubs by not showing up for work.

[Patler]

That's not the point. Those media bastards sewing seeds of dissension on the team with misleading quotes (or even correct quotes), that's what it is about. They are doing their damnedest to harm the Packers. That's a helluva lot more important that reading those ENEMY assholes' version of "the truth".

What would be their motivation to do that? There is none.

[Fritz]

Where was Romeo today? In the end zone. Twice.

[red]

team was really around him celebrating each time. not the thing you would expect from from guys whos teammate just quit on them

sounds like the guy has some major mental issues, and he might have just freaked out last week

there were apparently some mental red flags at the combine when he kind of freaked out

hope the guy goes and gets some kind of help. he's a hell of a player and seems like a great kid, but we just can't have him breaking like that in the future

[MadtownPacker]

So you’re saying he is the Red of PackerRats?

[MadtownPacker]

Where was Romeo today? In the end zone. Twice.
Yeah how much of Patler’s forgiveness did those 2 earn him? People want to know.

[red]

So you’re saying he is the Red of PackerRats?

lol, yeah pretty much

[George Cumby]

That's not the point. Those media bastards sewing seeds of dissension on the team with misleading quotes (or even correct quotes), that's what it is about. They are doing their damnedest to harm the Packers. That's a helluva lot more important that reading those ENEMY assholes' version of "the truth".

Fucking deranged.

[texaspackerbacker]

Cumby, you fucking stupid piece of shit, I was gonna let Patler's last post stand about why would the God damned ENEMY - the piece of shit media pukes would intentionally try to mess with/harm the Packers. That's dead obvious. Because those shitheads are from somewhere else, fans of some other team. If I had the ability to stir up trouble for the Vikings or Bears or just about anybody else, I damn well would. That's just human nature and why they are the enemy, although probably a few stupid fools in here would deny that.

[call_me_ishmael]

Where was Romeo today? In the end zone. Twice.

It wasn't lost on me that he was nowhere near 11 when he caught his TD, though.

[George Cumby]

Cumby, you fucking stupid piece of shit, I was gonna let Patler's last post stand about why would the God damned ENEMY - the piece of shit media pukes would intentionally try to mess with/harm the Packers. That's dead obvious. Because those shitheads are from somewhere else, fans of some other team. If I had the ability to stir up trouble for the Vikings or Bears or just about anybody else, I damn well would. That's just human nature and why they are the enemy, although probably a few stupid fools in here would deny that.

I rest my case.

[Fritz]

team was really around him celebrating each time. not the thing you would expect from from guys whos teammate just quit on them

sounds like the guy has some major mental issues, and he might have just freaked out last week

there were apparently some mental red flags at the combine when he kind of freaked out

hope the guy goes and gets some kind of help. he's a hell of a player and seems like a great kid, but we just can't have him breaking like that in the future

I agree, Red. I feel kinda bad for the young man - he seems to struggle with processing his feelings and communcating in that regard. On the other hand, you can't have anyone who suffers from mental issues that are not addressed causing issues on the team.

So I hope he gets the help he needs. If he doesn't, and can't work through this, the Packers will not offer him a second contract.

In the meantime, I am hoping the support of teammates and the two TD's will help as a salve on everyone's wounds.

[bobblehead]

I'm with Red and Fritz on this a bit. Its normal for team mates to kinda celebrate the return of the malcontent, but that isn't what I saw. I saw a bunch of guys reaching out to someone who is struggling to try and give him reassurance they were there for him. The story line may have been blurred a bit to cover for some issues Doubs seems to have.

Am I reading a lot into it. Yes, but that doesn't mean something doesn't seem "normal" about the idea he pouted about his role.

[Patler]

Cumby, you fucking stupid piece of shit, I was gonna let Patler's last post stand about why would the God damned ENEMY - the piece of shit media pukes would intentionally try to mess with/harm the Packers. That's dead obvious. Because those shitheads are from somewhere else, fans of some other team. If I had the ability to stir up trouble for the Vikings or Bears or just about anybody else, I damn well would. That's just human nature and why they are the enemy, although probably a few stupid fools in here would deny that.

Wrong again. Many of the Packer beat reporters are/have been Wisconsin kids.

Why would any reasonably intelligent professional jeopardize their career for a silly "loyalty" to a professional sports franchise that has no real impact on their life?

I have to admit, you almost had me convinced. Your name-calling and profanity are just SO persuasive.

[Patler]

Yeah how much of Patler’s forgiveness did those 2 earn him? People want to know.

Nah, he never needed forgiveness, just needs to demonstrate he won't continue to be a detriment to the locker room. Walking out on the team is not a small thing.

I'm actually a bit worried for the young man. He looked almost emotionless yesterday, especially the sideline shots right after his TDs. He didn't LOOK like he was enjoying himself. I hope he finds what he is looking for/wants/needs. If that is with the Packets, great. If it is not, I hope he finds it elsewhere.

[run pMc]

Wrong again. Many of the Packer beat reporters are/have been Wisconsin kids.

Why would any reasonably intelligent professional jeopardize their career for a silly "loyalty" to a professional sports franchise that has no real impact on their life?

I have to admit, you almost had me convinced. Your name-calling and profanity are just SO persuasive.

LOL. True.
Do NOT confuse ESPN talking heads or Twitterverse "reporters" with the actual journalists who cover the team. If they were making a things up or trying to stir dissention with falsehoods, they could be held accountable - either legally, in the court of public opinion, or by simply getting their press credentials withdrawn by the team. The team decides who they allow come to the press conferences, watch the open-to-media portions of practice, and access to players in the locker rooms. They have PR staff standing right there while interviews happen.

I don't understand this weird stance of media being the enemy. What's next, teachers and postal workers?

Also - because the world is more connected than ever, it's easy for lies or misinformation to spread quickly. Patler is spot-on when he says to look at multiple (reputable) sources and think for yourself.
"A lie can travel around the world and back again while the truth is lacing up its boots" -- Mark Twain, allegedly, a little before Rappaport was tweeting.

[NewsBruin]

Cumby, you fucking stupid piece of shit, I was gonna let Patler's last post stand about why would the God damned ENEMY - the piece of shit media pukes would intentionally try to mess with/harm the Packers. That's dead obvious. Because those shitheads are from somewhere else, fans of some other team. If I had the ability to stir up trouble for the Vikings or Bears or just about anybody else, I damn well would. That's just human nature and why they are the enemy, although probably a few stupid fools in here would deny that.

I just don't believe the "media pukes," even the hot-takes gasbags, give half a fart about one team over the other. If you've been around a newsroom's sports desk, you see a bunch of guys who know they're part of the machine and are doing their part to chug through the week and cover all their bases (crap, different sports metaphor). The biggest team fantasy these guys have is joining the "bigs" and getting enough to cover a mortgage, but even that gets put into perspective over the years.

Especially when you see coaches and players cycle through, as well as your colleagues cycle through their employers. It's not like these guys have matching Chicago Bears pj's and sheet sets. I don't know how someone can watch or listen to sports for more than a decade and think there's some hero/villain fanboy conspiracy afoot.

[Fritz]

I just don't believe the "media pukes," even the hot-takes gasbags, give half a fart about one team over the other. If you've been around a newsroom's sports desk, you see a bunch of guys who know they're part of the machine and are doing their part to chug through the week and cover all their bases (crap, different sports metaphor). The biggest team fantasy these guys have is joining the "bigs" and getting enough to cover a mortgage, but even that gets put into perspective over the years.

Especially when you see coaches and players cycle through, as well as your colleagues cycle through their employers. It's not like these guys have matching Chicago Bears pj's and sheet sets. I don't know how someone can watch or listen to sports for more than a decade and think there's some hero/villain fanboy conspiracy afoot.

Me too. But Tex is black/white, yes/no, all/nothing. That's the world his brain lives in. Which is fine except he keeps insisting that it's the real world and everyone who doesn't see it his way is a media puke/asshole/other Tex words to denigrate-peope-who-don't-agree-with-him.

[sharpe1027]

Debating Tex is like picking a scab. You know you shouldn't do it, but sometimes you can't help yourself. Afterwards, you regret it and hope you don't end up scarred.

[MadtownPacker]

Wow Tex, these FORUM pukes are really letting you have it. Might turn into a ROAST like Brady.

[texaspackerbacker]

Don't worry about me, at least not tonight. I had a little same day medical procedure, and I'm high as a kite right now.