More Banjo - Packers vs. Lions

[Joemailman]

Jordan Love - 273 passing yards, 0 TD's, pick 6

Josh Jacobs - 108 total yards before injury

Jayden Reed - 5 catches, 113 yards

Packers receivers with at least 5 drops

Packers with 10 penalties

Discuss. If you want to.

[pittstang5]

Shitty game and shitty weather. Seems the Pack was affected, but Detroit wasn't. Detroit even lost one of their best defensive players early and the Packers still couldn't do shit.

So many years watching Detroit suck, pains me to say that they're a legit SB team.

[red]

screw this game

boy that was ugly

[Joemailman]

Bye week comes at a good time. Get Love, Williams, Jacobs and Alexander healthy.

[Fritz]

Can MLF get Love to pull his head out of his ass? That might take some doing; it’s stuffed up there pretty far.

[Rastak]

Can MLF get Love to pull his head out of his ass? That might take some doing; it’s stuffed up there pretty far.


I may be accused of being a troll and maybe I am while not intending too. Love got a huge contract, huge, but only after a pretty great half a season. Thought it was risky when it happened. That said, he is clearly hurt right now.

[red]

I may be accused of being a troll and maybe I am while not intending too. Love got a huge contract, huge, but only after a pretty great half a season. Thought it was risky when it happened. That said, he is clearly hurt right now.

i think theres a few of us that are worried about the fact that love looks more like he did the first half of last season then he did the second half

and it is a littlescary that we just gave him a huge contract when we aren't 100% that he is the second coming, or third coming

he is hurt, but he's making some really stupid mistakes

[bobblehead]

We got beat by a better team. Hopefully we improve and its not the case when 2025 kicks off.

[MadtownPacker]

I may be accused of being a troll and maybe I am while not intending too. Love got a huge contract, huge, but only after a pretty great half a season. Thought it was risky when it happened. That said, he is clearly hurt right now.
You are a troll but you ain’t wrong. Let’s just be honest. Love has been so bad that Skinbasket will be showing up soon to say I told you so. But you can’t blame him for the Willis not getting in the game that falls directly on Pepe LePew. He doesn’t have the balls to sit Love and teach him a lesson.

[Joemailman]

You are a troll but you ain’t wrong. Let’s just be honest. Love has been so bad that Skinbasket will be showing up soon to say I told you so. But you can’t blame him for the Willis not getting in the game that falls directly on Pepe LePew. He doesn’t have the balls to sit Love and teach him a lesson.

The thing is the injury gave him the option of sitting Love without getting the public blowback you get from "benching" the starting QB. Love was obviously very limited and I was surprised he came out for the 2nd half.

[Teamcheez1]

6-3 at the bye is not a bad place to be.
Great timing to get some guys healthy, especially Love.
MLF/Love need to refocus and clean up the decision-making in the passing game down the stretch.
We have shown we can compete with Vikings and Lions, we just need to reduce mistakes and learn to play 4 qtrs.
I wonder if we make any moves?

We have a very young team that has a lot of potential.

[King Friday]

The weather favored the Lions, who have a great OL and multiple dynamic backs.

I honestly think the Packers, like last year, may have a better chance of winning in their place. The largest item hindering us right now is not understanding who our best 5 are on the OL and where they should slot in.

[red]

We got beat by a better team. Hopefully we improve and its not the case when 2025 kicks off.

it does help knowing that they are very good

but we still played very poorly

[bobblehead]

I'll add that I don't give 2 flying fucks about draft status....quay needs to sit and wilson needs to play.

[MadtownPacker]

The thing is the injury gave him the option of sitting Love without getting the public blowback you get from "benching" the starting QB. Love was obviously very limited and I was surprised he came out for the 2nd half.Exactly!! If he doesn’t have the nerve to do it when it is obviously needs to be done I have to question what he expected to happen. He looked lost out there and the best part of his day was Brady calling him handsome.

[ThunderDan]

Tough game to watch.

The D played very well for most of the game. The pick 6 by Love was a killer.

It was light rain, windy and cool in the first half. At the start of the 2nd half it started pouring. We got soaked and I was in my good rain gear.

I can’t wait to watch the replay to get better angles on what really happened.

My overall impression was we needed more pressure from our D line. We really need to get one stud who can disrupt things.

On O, Love needs to stop taking unnecessary risks and take what is given. There were a lot of plays were a TE or RB was wide open in the flat on 3rd downs and would keep a drive alive but Love would try to hit a 15-20 yarder down the field.

[ThunderDan]

Jacobs ran like a beast and it seemed like the new OL opened a lot more space to run than normal.

Once again that is hard to see from the sidelines without the benefit of a view from the end zone.

[QBME]

Exactly!! If he doesn’t have the nerve to do it when it is obviously needs to be done I have to question what he expected to happen. He looked lost out there and the best part of his day was Brady calling him handsome.

That bit was absolutely cringe bizarre

[red]

why did we run so much shotgun?

a guy playing center who isn't a center, in those horrible conditions. he was having problems with snapping

i would think you would go under center, or is that harder for a new center?

or is i just because love is hurt?

[Joemailman]

why did we run so much shotgun?

a guy playing center who isn't a center, in those horrible conditions. he was having problems with snapping

i would think you would go under center, or is that harder for a new center?

or is i just because love is hurt?

I think it's all because of Love's lack of mobility. They weren't running any QB bootleg stuff either.

[MadtownPacker]

I think it's all because of Love's lack of mobility. They weren't running any QB bootleg stuff either.But you felt he should play even if not 100%.

[Joemailman]

But you felt he should play even if not 100%.

I felt he should play if he could help the team win. But it turns out he was so physically limited that they would have been better off playing Willis. I didn't have any way of knowing how healthy he was.

[MadtownPacker]

I felt he should play if he could help the team win. But it turns out he was so physically limited that they would have been better off playing Willis. I didn't have any way of knowing how healthy he was.We are just a little mouse today aren’t we :lol:. If you couldn’t see by the way he was moving you probably need some glasses old timer.

Are we in agreement that this might’ve been a win if Willis had started? It seemed like there was a lot of space to run and ThunderDan said it was very clear from the end zone angle. He could see a lot of open space.

[texaspackerbacker]

It was a rotten game. Love did all right - with one colossal mental error that I doubt had anything to do with his injury. He had Jacobs there but he shoulda done a better job (or not even tried) to get the ball over the defender who picked it. Jacobs ran great at times. The interior of the line blocked about as good without Myers, definitely not better. The guy several fools in here love to hate I'm fairly sure would not have fucked up 2 or 3 shotgun snaps, though. I wonder how much the new Center had to do with the false starts.

I thought LaFleur was not up to his usual standard in play calling. And I think they missed Evan Williams more than they missed Jaire.

If they had gotten the TD when they got down near the goal line, and if they hadn't missed yet another makeable FG, it might have been different. Detroit is good, but not clearly better than the Packers, In a closer game, we coulda and probably woulda put more pressure on Goff, who I still say isn't as good as his stats make him seem.

As somebody said, 6-3 half way through the season ain't too bad. At least we aren't the Bears who still suck - increasingly it seems. The Vikings are doing their usual collapse when the get off to a good start, and the Lions aren't near as bad as they traditionally have been, but they certainly are beatable.

[Joemailman]

We are just a little mouse today aren’t we :lol:. If you couldn’t see by the way he was moving you probably need some glasses old timer.

Are we in agreement that this might’ve been a win if Willis had started? It seemed like there was a lot of space to run and ThunderDan said it was very clear from the end zone angle. He could see a lot of open space.

On Saturday I said this:

If the Packers want to win the division, they have to win this game. You don't sit anyone who is cleared to play and can help you win.

I stand by that. But as limited as Love was, I don't think he was the guy who could best help them win. But I had no way of knowing that on Saturday.

[MadtownPacker]

The fact he was walking around like a grandpa probably should have told you! Don’t worry man, it wasn’t your call. It was that handsome perfect mustache goatee, motherfucker Pepe LePew who caused this shit. He was probably mad that he had to wear a hat and not have his hair shine.

[King Friday]

The weather should’ve been the ultimate factor in starting Willis. The ability to sustain a deep passing game in 20-30 mph winds in the middle of a downpour meant that Willis would’ve been the better option Sunday. He practiced with the first team all week and wasn’t going to be counted on to throw the ball 30 times in that weather.

[Fritz]

The fact he was walking around like a grandpa probably should have told you! Don’t worry man, it wasn’t your call. It was that handsome perfect mustache goatee, motherfucker Pepe LePew who caused this shit. He was probably mad that he had to wear a hat and not have his hair shine.

The Packers looked like the dome team that freaked out having to play in the elements. Christ.

Dan is right; the pass rush is lame - not getting much pressure on Goff. It's a problem, perhaps the team's biggest because it seems less fixable than the penalties, the drops, the interceptions. The defensive scheme was supposed to allow them to pin their ears back, etc. But they're not getting home with four rushers. Blitz more and you open yourself up to problems, but they might not have a choice if Gary & Co. can't get more pressure than they are. And how bad must Brenton Cox be if he can't get activated for a game when they really need pass rushing help? Dude's in year two now.

The penalties. Jaysus. I'm getting nervous about all this "we've got to get this cleaned up" talk because first, it sounds like the MM soundtrack, and second, it sounds like cuck talk. Why are they so fucking sloppy all the timed? Youth? WTF. This is on The Flower.

And Love's interceptions. Also on The Flower as well as Love. Love needs to get his shit together and play smarter. And clearly it was a mistake to play him.

Oh, the wide receiver drops. Did they spend all offseason reading their press about how awesome they all were? Except for Jayden Reed, they've been a huge disappointment. I'd say that Doubs has been good, but that hiccup with him skipping out sucked. Dontayvion Wicks can't catch a cold right now. Watson seems invisible - I'm not sure why he's not getting more targets. Fire the wide receivers coach now!! Or something.

Is this a young team that got overly confident about how cool and great they were?

And finally, I'm annoyed with Pepe Le Pew getting annoyed at reporters' questions. What, they shouldn't ask why Love's interceptions are getting out-of-control? Fuck you, Pepe. Quit being so fucking arrogant and ask yourself what the hell is going on that Love seems to be regressing here.

[bobblehead]

Tough game to watch.

The D played very well for most of the game. The pick 6 by Love was a killer.

It was light rain, windy and cool in the first half. At the start of the 2nd half it started pouring. We got soaked and I was in my good rain gear.

I can’t wait to watch the replay to get better angles on what really happened.

My overall impression was we needed more pressure from our D line. We really need to get one stud who can disrupt things.

On O, Love needs to stop taking unnecessary risks and take what is given. There were a lot of plays were a TE or RB was wide open in the flat on 3rd downs and would keep a drive alive but Love would try to hit a 15-20 yarder down the field.

What we truly need is better red zone offense however it comes about. I am the anti Tex in that I believe in OLine being the most important aspect to a successful offense and ours hasn't been as good as it should be for awhile. Morgan was a bad pick if we wanted a RG, there were probably 2 guys we could have gotten in the 2nd that will be good guards. Rhyan is a failed pick. Myers isn't very good when healthy. Walker is up and down, if he can get consistent he has all the tools. Jenkins, from what I now have several years to opine on is good at LT or LG, but hasn't been great on the right side. Tom can play anywhere and didn't need to put on weight. He should get back to 300 where is superior movement/leverage gave him an edge. They have made a mess of it and I don't see a quick fix to be honest. I have no idea how Morgan would be at RT, but his skills don't align with guard (guys projected him at guard based on body type, not skill set.)

So how do we fix it (and our Red zone offense with it). I have no fast answer. My answer will NEVER happen. Walker, Jenkins, Tom, high priced FA, Morgan(if morgan can play the right side....big if). What if we just let Morgan play his natural position. Morgan, Jenkins, 2 high priced FA, Tom.

Like I said, they have made a mess.

[bobblehead]

why did we run so much shotgun?

a guy playing center who isn't a center, in those horrible conditions. he was having problems with snapping

i would think you would go under center, or is that harder for a new center?

or is i just because love is hurt?

Agree, and I said it multiple times. If Love can't/won't lineup under center we lose play action and a lot of options. Is it the injury? Preference? MiLFs play calling? I don't care the reason, it was atrocious to watch.

[run pMc]

Some numbers

400 yards of offense, one TD
10 penalties
5 drops
2 consecutive bad snaps
1 pick six

oh and a missed FG

Too many drives got killed by sloppy execution.
Going 3-12 on 3rd downs and 1-4 in the RZ isn't going to win many games.

[run pMc]

Defense was ok - that's an offense that put up a pair of 50 burgers in recent weeks. The pass rush just isn't getting home. I also don't think the OL was terrible. (FWIW, I think Gute spends early picks in 2025 draft on DL, EDGE, and CB.)

Love was clearly hampered by his injury but of course he's going to want to play. It's a home game against a division opponent and you're fighting for first place.
The idea of starting Willis is interesting - I would have rejected it outright except the weather could have changed that calculus. Problem is by halftime they were in catchup mode. That pick-six was really costly and was the pivotal play in the game IMO.

There's a lot of "well this time last season they stunk and got it together after the bye", which I'm afraid could just be copium or optimism. Love HAS to take better care of the ball, his health and decision-making have to improve. The receivers have to stop dropping the ball. The team has to clean up the penalties and mental mistakes.

I don't think they have played anywhere near their best ball, nor have they come close to their ceiling. Here's hoping they can get it together and be approaching their peak when December comes around.

They will have 2 weeks to stew on this before they get the Bears, whose easy early schedule is turning into the tough stretch. Let's see how they respond.

[Sparkey]

I'll add that I don't give 2 flying fucks about draft status....quay needs to sit and wilson needs to play.

Wilson didn't not play well yesterday.

[Tony Oday]

I still do not understand how the Packers went for it on the 4th down when we need two TDs and a FG.

[bobblehead]

Wilson didn't not play well yesterday.

I confess I didn't watch him that close, but Quay certainly didn't play well.

[MadtownPacker]

I still do not understand how the Packers went for it on the 4th down when we need two TDs and a FG.
Yeah that pretty much ended all hope. And that FG was the 2 score difference at the end. But then we could say the McManus miss was too.

[Joemailman]

I confess I didn't watch him that close, but Quay certainly didn't play well.

Packers have 2 players, Quay and Cooper who are ideally suited to play Will. They don't have a legit MLB. Trading Quay in offseason to a team looking for a Will might make sense.

[call_me_ishmael]

What a bust Quay is turning out to be.

Tucker Kraft is possibly the best TE in the league.

Josh Jones is doing pretty good.

Wicks has to catch the ball. How many drops can a homie have? Devante Adams two point oh. Maybe he'll have a huge bounce back late.

I still think the Packers will be much better in January than they are today.

[run pMc]

I actually don't think Quay is a bust. I do think he was overdrafted though. He would have been perfectly fine as a R3 pick.
He's improved since his rookie year, but his FB instincts are still inconsistent.

Gute has done wonders in his last few drafts, but his R1 history is a bit spotty.

[Joemailman]

What a bust Quay is turning out to be.

Tucker Kraft is possibly the best TE in the league.

Josh Jones is doing pretty good.

Wicks has to catch the ball. How many drops can a homie have? Devante Adams two point oh. Maybe he'll have a huge bounce back late.

I still think the Packers will be much better in January than they are today.

Josh Jones? :confused:

[ThunderDan]

Josh Jones? :confused:

Jingleheimer Schmidt.

[Fritz]

I actually don't think Quay is a bust. I do think he was overdrafted though. He would have been perfectly fine as a R3 pick.
He's improved since his rookie year, but his FB instincts are still inconsistent.

Gute has done wonders in his last few drafts, but his R1 history is a bit spotty.

First round, third round - he seems often to be out of position and he doesn't seem to cover all that well. What do you like about Quay's play?

[bobblehead]

Josh Jones? :confused:

For the 11th time its JACOBS

[ThunderDan]

Yeah that pretty much ended all hope. And that FG was the 2 score difference at the end. But then we could say the McManus miss was too.

Nobody has really said this. But I can't remember tougher kicking conditions at Lambeau. One direction the kickers couldn't make it to the endzone.

In the 2nd half it was pouring on top of cold and windy as hell. Kickers were struggling hitting 45 yarders warming up after halftime.

[run pMc]

First round, third round - he seems often to be out of position and he doesn't seem to cover all that well. What do you like about Quay's play?

I think some of the plays that people are blaming on Quay are actually the DL's fault. Kenny Clark is adjusting to the 4-3 and has found himself out of position more than we're used to. Quay's taking better steps, still too many false steps and hesitation.
My suspicion is that Cooper becomes the player they hoped Quay would be.

Quay is above average athlete and a little below average as a pure football player. A lot of ILBs and TEs take time to develop, and I think Quay needs to work on a few things and if he does can still be good. At worst he's serviceable and a step up from Oren Burks, Jake Ryan, or Ty Summers. I think we'd be fine with him if he was a R3-4 pick.

[run pMc]

For the 11th time its JACOBS

THIS

Josh Jones hasn't been on this team since the 2018 season.

[MadtownPacker]

Nobody has really said this. But I can't remember tougher kicking conditions at Lambeau. One direction the kickers couldn't make it to the endzone.

In the 2nd half it was pouring on top of cold and windy as hell. Kickers were struggling hitting 45 yarders warming up after halftime.
I don’t have issue with the miss just pointing it out in regards to the final score. That’s when you can understand unlike the youngsters shanking XPs on a sunny day. I believe during the missed FG I felt Pepe should have gone for it because it seemed like bad FG odds..

[MadtownPacker]

THIS

Josh Jones hasn't been on this team since the 2018 season.
But Partial aka CMI has been the ultimate troll since 2003. :lol: He is so damn sneaky about it, that shit starter.

[Teamcheez1]

Bill Huber of Sports Illustrated notes that of 1,050 players who have had at least 40 targets in a season over the last ten years, Wicks’ catch rate ranks 1,045th. That’s some pretty dismal company to keep.

[Sparkey]

Bill Huber of Sports Illustrated notes that of 1,050 players who have had at least 40 targets in a season over the last ten years, Wicks’ catch rate ranks 1,045th. That’s some pretty dismal company to keep.

So does he have KY hands or is he just trying to do too much with the ball before he actually has it controlled ? I recall a few plays where it appeared he tried to make a move too suddenly.

[bobblehead]

But Partial aka CMI has been the ultimate troll since 2003. :lol: He is so damn sneaky about it, that shit starter.

If he's trolling me, kudos, he got me. I actually think he just can't remember.

[bobblehead]

Bill Huber of Sports Illustrated notes that of 1,050 players who have had at least 40 targets in a season over the last ten years, Wicks’ catch rate ranks 1,045th. That’s some pretty dismal company to keep.

I actually LOLed this. In a sad ironic way. Dude is constantly open. You have to be for your QB to keep tossing the rock your way with that metric.

[bobblehead]

So does he have KY hands or is he just trying to do too much with the ball before he actually has it controlled ? I recall a few plays where it appeared he tried to make a move too suddenly.

I don't recall reading anywhere that drops were a concern of his in college so I would say its combination of that and its in his head now. Hands can be fixed. Gaining massive separation is a gift.

[run pMc]

I don't recall reading anywhere that drops were a concern of his in college so I would say its combination of that and its in his head now. Hands can be fixed. Gaining massive separation is a gift.

In Wicks last CFB season he had a really bad drop rate. Chalked it up then to concentration drops. I think that's what this is also - concentration and confidence. Some of his drops you can see he's trying to make a move with the ball before he secures it.
It absolutely can be fixed, but he's going to really have to work hard on it. I'd be surprised if they aren't making him work on it over the bye.

His separation skills are very very good and if he can fix the drops could be a top 15 WR.

He's not the only one with the dropsies. GB has something like 20 official drops this season, DET has 1. Jordan Love's completion % would be much higher (along with their 3rd down conversion and RZ TD %) if there weren't so many drops.

Drops, penalties, and dumb mistakes are holding this team back.

[Patler]

I don't recall reading anywhere that drops were a concern of his in college so I would say its combination of that and its in his head now. Hands can be fixed. Gaining massive separation is a gift.

It was a major concern coming out of college and referred to in 2023 training camp. I was pleased the end of last season thinking it might be behind him.

Did some research, he had 14 drops his last two seasons in college, to go with 86 receptions.

[sharpe1027]

I don't think Wicks will fix the dropsies. It's not like he hasn't been working on it everyday in practice already, probably was doing the same in college.

He's fine for a WR4. I'm not holding my breath for him to out it all together and become a really good starting WR at this point.

[Fosco33]

How bad was Adams in early years in terms of drops/routes/production vs someone like Wicks?

[King Friday]

Adams dropped 12 of 96 passes in 2015. It was a considerable issue, but Adams worked to correct it. The same latitude should be given to Wicks, and he should be encouraged to seek out a guy like Devante to figure out what he needs to do to correct the issue.

[Fritz]

In Wicks last CFB season he had a really bad drop rate. Chalked it up then to concentration drops. I think that's what this is also - concentration and confidence. Some of his drops you can see he's trying to make a move with the ball before he secures it.
It absolutely can be fixed, but he's going to really have to work hard on it. I'd be surprised if they aren't making him work on it over the bye.

His separation skills are very very good and if he can fix the drops could be a top 15 WR.

He's not the only one with the dropsies. GB has something like 20 official drops this season, DET has 1. Jordan Love's completion % would be much higher (along with their 3rd down conversion and RZ TD %) if there weren't so many drops.

Drops, penalties, and dumb mistakes are holding this team back.

It occurs to me that if the wide receivers didn't drop so many balls, the team would be in better positions offensively, and maybe, just maybe, Love wouldn't throw so many interceptions. It's like he's trying to make up for teammates' mistakes.

Man, I know Pepe don't like it, but Love's attitude reminds me a lot of Favre's.

[MadtownPacker]

The drops seems mental all the way. Some dump passes and let him work the field to bring his confidence back because at this point it’s slumping.

[MadtownPacker]

It occurs to me that if the wide receivers didn't drop so many balls, the team would be in better positions offensively, and maybe, just maybe, Love wouldn't throw so many interceptions. It's like he's trying to make up for teammates' mistakes.

Man, I know Pepe don't like it, but Love's attitude reminds me a lot of Favre's.
He needs to apply some touch. Many of the drops Sunday were bullets glancing off the forearms of receivers. Even Kraft had it happen. It’s what Geofff did instead of drilling it in and his guys had no problems. It was one of the things Rodgers was best at.

[bobblehead]

Dionte Johnson of the steelers and I'm not sure where he is now dropped too many passes as well. He also was a separation champ. He didn't fix it and he is an afterthought now. Wicks needs to figure it out.

[Fosco33]

How about Tuckers as press secretary?

[sharpe1027]

Adams dropped 12 of 96 passes in 2015. It was a considerable issue, but Adams worked to correct it. The same latitude should be given to Wicks, and he should be encouraged to seek out a guy like Devante to figure out what he needs to do to correct the issue.

I'm more than willing to give him a chance. I just am not optimistic it will get fixed.