Greg Jennings

[the_idle_threat]

Greg Jennings finished tonight's game with 5 catches for 86 yards. That gives him 15 catches for 259 yards after 4 games. At this pace, he would have 60 catches for 1036 yards for the season.

People basically said I was crazy when I opined that Jennings had a very good shot at a 1000-yard rookie season. Things are looking pretty good now.

Yes, I started this thread to pat myself on the back. But also, Jennings' play is a small positive we can look to after a game full of negatives.

[Bretsky]

Yes, Kudos to you. I think I predicted around 700yds and now agree Jennings will have a 1,000 yard season.

Why has my view changed ?

1. Green Bay is going to be behind in nearly every game.
2. Jennings is the only other player to throw to behind Donald Driver.


B

[Patler]

The point is, it is still a long way to 60 catches and 1000 yards. One of the things that makes it difficult for rookies is that by the time they finish the 12 or so games they have been used to through college, they are only half way through the NFL season (4 preseason and 8 regular season). Often thay are not prepared for the wear and tear, mentally and physically, of an NFL season.

Jennings is doing well, but he has barely gotten started.

[vince]

The point is, it is still a long way to 60 catches and 1000 yards. One of the things that makes it difficult for rookies is that by the time they finish the 12 or so games they have been used to through college, they are only half way through the NFL season (4 preseason and 8 regular season). Often thay are not prepared for the wear and tear, mentally and physically, of an NFL season.

Jennings is doing well, but he has barely gotten started.

Patler, Cadillac Williams got off to a fast start and slowed down as the year progressed. Can you cite other examples? I think Jennings will only get better as the season progresses, assuming of course, that he remains healthy. He won't slow down... Plus, he had what, 1 catch in his debut? That won't happen again for him, not in this offensive system...

[chewy-bacca]

Heck, I like the WR set we have now. K-Rob is looking good too. Now DD needs to keep his play at a high level. With the TEs in to block, we need them to have big games every time.

[Patler]

Patler, Cadillac Williams got off to a fast start and slowed down as the year progressed. Can you cite other examples? I think Jennings will only get better as the season progresses, assuming of course, that he remains healthy. He won't slow down... Plus, he had what, 1 catch in his debut? That won't happen again for him, not in this offensive system...

I can't think of another off hand, but rookies mention it frequently. They often comment on how hard it is to continue playing as the bumps, brusies and small injuries continue to build and never have a chance to heal during the season. They have to learn to play when they are really beat-up, physically and mentally.

I'm not criticizing Jennings at all. He certainly looks like the real deal, with a solid future. As you said, he will see lots of passes and have opportunities each game, so who knows how far he can take it this year? We just shouldn't lose sight of how hard it can be for rookies. He has started out well, which many rookie WRs do NOT do. Many do not even figure into the offense until later, as they learn it better, so Jennings has an advantage in that regard. He's not fighting with an established veteran for playing time or to be a target. Favre seems more than willing to throw to him.

My point was simply that extrapolating a season's performance from the first four games is pushing the limits of objectivity, in my opinion. I am certainly hopeful regarding Jennings' future, I just hate to establish expectations. Expecting 60 catches and 1000+ yards because of four games is not being objective. After 4 games last year, Favre was "on pace" for 36 TD passes. Through 7 games he had 15 TD passes. In the last 9 games he had 5 TD passes.

[Tarlam!]

Patler, would you agree that you don't get nervous tension about when he lines up? Would he be the first rookie we have drafted in a LONG time (not named A.J. Hawk) where you feel confident he can make plays?

I mean, this is a rookie WR we're talking about. As far as I understand, that's the 2nd most difficult position to play as a rookie.

I think this guy has already proven he's no bust, even after a measley 4 starts.

[Patler]

Patler, would you agree that you don't get nervous tension about when he lines up? Would he be the first rookie we have drafted in a LONG time (not named A.J. Hawk) where you feel confident he can make plays?

I mean, this is a rookie WR we're talking about. As far as I understand, that's the 2nd most difficult position to play as a rookie.

I think this guy has already proven he's no bust, even after a measley 4 starts.

Who said he would be bust, or even hinted at it? Sometimes its difficult to say anything other than glowing remarks about fan favorites, as Jennings has become, because people want to see it as a criticism of the player..

My whole point is that I will be more than pleased if he finishes at 40+ receptions and 600 yards. He doesn't have to get 50+ receptions and 1000 yards for me to be satisfied.

As for other rookies the Packers have had who I had confidence in as rookies once they got in and played, I can name a quite a few. Vonnie Holliday was very good as a rookie, and was headed toward double digit sacks until he was injured and missed a few games. Mike McKenzie made plays and had my confidence as a rookie (6 interceptions). Clifton, Tauscher, Franks and Diggs all played very well as rookies and I quit worrying about what they would do long before the end of the season. Even Nick Barnett was very solid for a rookie.

A guy I really liked as a rookie, who made several heads up plays, started a bunch of games and looked to have a decent future was Marques Anderson. However, unlike those mentioned above, I probably worried when he was in there the whole season. He never seemed to progress after that.

One thing that is helping Jennings tremendously is that he came into a situation where a starting spot was wide open, with a disappointing veteran (Ferguson) penciled into it. That is NOT a criticism of Jennings, far from it. He has made the most of an opportunity that was there. But he really wasn't competing against much to get a starting spot. To his credit, he has grabbed onto it with gusto! Some don't really get the same chance as a rookie.

[oregonpackfan]

2. Jennings is the only other player to throw to behind Donald Driver.


B[/quote]

Bretsky,

I disagree with the above statement. I though Koren Robinson played well last night. He showed good field sense when twice he broke up a short pass that could have been intercepted by his defender.

His stay with the Packers could be shortened by his legal troubles but the guy has shown talent.

OPF

[jack's smirking revenge]

I'm liking our top 3 WRs if we could get consistency. DD, Jennings, and K-Rob are a pretty talented group of WRs. I still think we need another playmaker, but, if we brough someone in, that may stunt Jennings' growth. I love K-Rob in a 4-wide. I don't think he could be covered by the secondary depth of most teams... The TEs are definitely a problem though. Far more inconsistent than the WRs.

tyler

[RashanGary]

The point is, it is still a long way to 60 catches and 1000 yards. One of the things that makes it difficult for rookies is that by the time they finish the 12 or so games they have been used to through college, they are only half way through the NFL season (4 preseason and 8 regular season). Often thay are not prepared for the wear and tear, mentally and physically, of an NFL season.

Jennings is doing well, but he has barely gotten started.

Oh come on. He's playing lights out. He's done it through his whole college career, all though Minicamps and TC, then lead teh league in preseason and now is doing it on the biggest stage.

When do you plan on quitting. YOu just had it in your head that he wans't a great pick and now your sticking to it as stubbornly as Tank is to TT hating. From day one, you've done nothing but argue that he's not doing as well as people say. YOu said Murph had just as good of praise when you were clearly incorrect. You said he would be lucky to get 500 yards and he's already half way there. When are you going to stop? Do you have a point when you recognize that maybe you were wrong or does this just go on forever?

[RashanGary]

1 Marvin Harrison IND 29 413 14.2 0 38
2 Laveranues Coles NYJ 30 412 13.7 1 46
3 Andre Johnson HOU 30 410 13.7 2 53
4 Roy Williams DET 25 384 15.4 1 42
5 Reggie Wayne IND 18 358 19.9 0 41
6 Marques Colston NO 20 336 16.8 3 86
7 Torry Holt STL 26 332 12.8 3 42
8 Santana Moss WAS 17 326 19.2 3 68
9 Braylon Edwards CLE 17 324 19.1 1 75
10 Muhsin Muhammad CHI 24 324 13.5 1 27
11 Isaac Bruce STL 20 320 16.0 1 45
12 Donald Driver GB 23 319 13.9 1 48
13 Larry Fitzgerald ARI 22 316 14.4 1 46
14 Bernard Berrian CHI 15 316 21.1 3 49
15 Antonio Bryant SF 14 310 22.1 1 72
16 Keyshawn Johnson CAR 22 306 13.9 1 40
17 Anquan Boldin ARI 24 295 12.3 1 34
18 Darrell Jackson SEA 22 293 13.3 3 49
19 Jerricho Cotchery NYJ 18 284 15.8 3 71
20 Derrick Mason BAL 20 265 13.3 0 38
21 Greg Jennings GB 15 259 17.3 2 75
22 Javon Walker DEN 11 250 22.7 2 83
23 Donte' Stallworth PHI 12 248 20.7 2 42
24 Drew Bennett TEN 18 245 13.6 1 36
25 Troy Williamson MIN 16 245 15.3 0 46
26 Reggie Williams JAC 21 243 11.6 3 48
27 Mike Furrey DET 22 242 11.0 2 25
28 Lee Evans BUF 19 241 12.7 0 27
29 Desmond Clark CHI 15 232 15.5 1 33
30 Eric Moulds HOU 18 230 12.8 1 29

[Partial]

The point is, it is still a long way to 60 catches and 1000 yards. One of the things that makes it difficult for rookies is that by the time they finish the 12 or so games they have been used to through college, they are only half way through the NFL season (4 preseason and 8 regular season). Often thay are not prepared for the wear and tear, mentally and physically, of an NFL season.

Jennings is doing well, but he has barely gotten started.

Oh come on. He's playing lights out. He's done it through his whole college career, all though Minicamps and TC, then lead teh league in preseason and now is doing it on the biggest stage.

When do you plan on quitting. YOu just had it in your head that he wans't a great pick and now your sticking to it as stubbornly as Tank is to TT hating. From day one, you've done nothing but argue that he's not doing as well as people say. YOu said Murph had just as good of praise when you were clearly full of shit. You said he would be lucky to get 500 yards and he's already half way there. When are you going to stop? Do you have a point when you recognize that maybe you were wrong or does this just go on forever?

You've never heard of the rookie wall? I 100% agree with Patler. Rookies historically have a very difficult time according to THEM because the season is 20 weeks insead of 12. I see him getting 1000 yards, but I also wouldn't be surprised at all if he doesn't.

[Badgepack]

I though Koren Robinson played well last night. He showed good field sense when twice he broke up a short pass that could have been intercepted by his defender.

OPF

Good point about breaking up possible interceptions, good heads up play.
Helping out the QB when they see bad throws should be done more often.

Jennings is a stud and continues to improve, great pick.

[the_idle_threat]

I am aware of the rookie wall. I am also aware that 254 of Jennings' 259 yards came in the past 3 games. This means his pace over the last 3 games puts him somewhere north of 1250 yards for the year---well ahead of the goal. I figured I was being realistic by including the Chicago game, because he is bound to have an off game again here or there down the stretch.

The point is: 1) Jennings is well ahead of most rookie WRs in his development, 2) he has a wide-open opportunity for playing time, 3) he has Brett's trust, 4) the team will be throwing the ball a lot, and 5) teams will probably roll extra coverage to DD, the known veteran threat, which will give Jennings lots of single coverage.

All of these things I foresaw when I predicted he had a great opportunity for a 1000-yard rookie season. This is not a guarantee. He could hit the rookie wall really hard, or he could get hurt (often, these are one and the same). Also, monkeys could fly out of his butt. :mrgreen: I'll continue to root for him all the way though.

[RashanGary]

I see the rookie wall thing too.

I'm just saying that Patler has been constantly sighting reasons for why Jennings production could be a sham or not something to be excited about.

Each arguement has some backing, but when you put all of Patlers doubt against Jennings on a wall and examine it, most of it holds little water and Jennings just keeps poking holes while Patler plugs them wiht new reasosn for why Jennings might not be a great player.

Whatever though...I guess I'm partial to Jennings.

[the_idle_threat]

I agree with you completely on this one, GJ. My post was a response to Patler. :idea:

[mission]

Greg Jennings > Chuck Norris

[the_idle_threat]

Greg Jennings > Chuck Norris

Blasphemy! :lol: :lol: :lol:

Beware the wrath of Norris!

[wist43]

Jennings is going to be a very good player... If he keeps improving, and putting up better numbers, he could challenge for ROY.

[Patler]

When do you plan on quitting. YOu just had it in your head that he wans't a great pick and now your sticking to it as stubbornly as Tank is to TT hating. From day one, you've done nothing but argue that he's not doing as well as people say. YOu said Murph had just as good of praise when you were clearly incorrect. You said he would be lucky to get 500 yards and he's already half way there. When are you going to stop? Do you have a point when you recognize that maybe you were wrong or does this just go on forever?

Thank you for proving the point I made earlier this morning. See, YOU are a prime example of they type of fan who jumps to conclusions if I don't lavish praise on a player. You assume I dislike the player. I have never, ever criticized the pick of Jennings. I liked the pick at the time, I liked him in camp and I like him now. Just because I don't fall head over heals praising the guy doesn't mean I don't like him. I have always said he will be a good player, all I said that was at all "negative" is that 50+/1000+ is not likely. I am a staunch realist and I recognize that Jennings can be a great pick EVEN IF he is not a 50+/1000+ receiver as a rookie. I also recognize that 4 games is a long way from 16. He might stay on pace, he might taper off, he might even get better as the season rolls on. He might play a few more games, get injured and not play the rest of the year. Those are just some of the reasons why it makes little sense to extrapolate a years performance from 4 games. There are too many variables. Personally, I prefer to wait, and judge now for now. I never assume that things may not change. Usually they do, some times good, sometimes bad.

I have not said he isn't doing well, I have stated that he is. I will not admit I was wrong about Murphy, because I wasn't wrong about him based on the time at which I stated it. I still believe he could have made the same type of impact that Jennings has. He was a bit bigger, a bit faster, and was learning the offense well. But, his career ended and the team moves on, just as when Tim Lewis was injured, or LeRoy Butler, or countless others. What if the same thing happened to Jennings next week? Does that mean he was no longer any good? Of course not.

You are an example of the "all or nothing" fan that gets under my skin. If I don't think a Packer is the best player in the league at his position, than I obviously dislike him in your mind. Some of the same people who thought Nick Collins was borderline All-Pro last year now rip him. I tried to be realistic about Collins, saying he did well as a rookie, had great potential, but missed more tackles than Roman and played the ball quite poorly. I still think he has great potential. He still plays the ball rather poorly, hasn't missed a lot of tackles this year, but has looked poor in basic coverage a couple times. But guess what? In spite of all that, I still like Collins a lot, I think he was a very good draft pick, and I think he can still be an extremely good safety.

I have liked Jennings from when he was picked and I like him now. I will be very satisfied with 40+ catches and 600+ yards. Anything more is icing on the cake. I think Jennings can be another Donald Driver, but perhaps with better y.a.c. numbers than Driver, because that looks to be a strength of his. Tacklers sort of "fall off" him at times.

Let me ask you this. How many catches and yards would Jennings have if Walker was still in GB? What kind of numbers would he put up for the year? Would he be any "worse" just because Walker was here and Jennings numbers were not as good? Again, of course not. But that just shows how outside factors can influence the impact that a rookie will have. If Murphy had not gotten hurt, he would have had the opportunity last year. If Walker stayed in GB, Jennings would not have the same opportunity he has right now. So far, things are aligning for Jennings to have a very good rookie season. BUT, through no fault of his, that can change. If he stays healthy, if Favre stays healthy, if the running game stays mediocre, and if the Packers are behind a lot, he very well might make 60/1000. But things can and do change, which is why rookies don't typically reach those numbers.

[BF4MVP]

he came into a situation where a starting spot was wide open, with a disappointing veteran (Ferguson) penciled into it.
Speaking of Fergie, what a nightmarish season he is having. After not doing ANYTHING the first three games, now he may have broken his foot..And frankly, with the emergence of K-Rob, I really don't think it'll really make a difference, because he wasn't making any type of an impact anyways (offensively at least. He has made some plays on ST). :sad:

[BF4MVP]

P.S. Jennings has made plays all through the minicamps, the OTAs, the preseason, and the regular season thus far. Will it continue? No one knows for sure, but he's doing great so far.

[BF4MVP]

1 Marvin Harrison IND 29 413 14.2 0 38
2 Laveranues Coles NYJ 30 412 13.7 1 46
3 Andre Johnson HOU 30 410 13.7 2 53
4 Roy Williams DET 25 384 15.4 1 42
5 Reggie Wayne IND 18 358 19.9 0 41
6 Marques Colston NO 20 336 16.8 3 86
7 Torry Holt STL 26 332 12.8 3 42
8 Santana Moss WAS 17 326 19.2 3 68
9 Braylon Edwards CLE 17 324 19.1 1 75
10 Muhsin Muhammad CHI 24 324 13.5 1 27
11 Isaac Bruce STL 20 320 16.0 1 45
12 Donald Driver GB 23 319 13.9 1 48
13 Larry Fitzgerald ARI 22 316 14.4 1 46
14 Bernard Berrian CHI 15 316 21.1 3 49
15 Antonio Bryant SF 14 310 22.1 1 72
16 Keyshawn Johnson CAR 22 306 13.9 1 40
17 Anquan Boldin ARI 24 295 12.3 1 34
18 Darrell Jackson SEA 22 293 13.3 3 49
19 Jerricho Cotchery NYJ 18 284 15.8 3 71
20 Derrick Mason BAL 20 265 13.3 0 38
21 Greg Jennings GB 15 259 17.3 2 75
22 Javon Walker DEN 11 250 22.7 2 83
23 Donte' Stallworth PHI 12 248 20.7 2 42
24 Drew Bennett TEN 18 245 13.6 1 36
25 Troy Williamson MIN 16 245 15.3 0 46
26 Reggie Williams JAC 21 243 11.6 3 48
27 Mike Furrey DET 22 242 11.0 2 25
28 Lee Evans BUF 19 241 12.7 0 27
29 Desmond Clark CHI 15 232 15.5 1 33
30 Eric Moulds HOU 18 230 12.8 1 29
That's priceless :lol:

[Patler]

I see the rookie wall thing too.

I'm just saying that Patler has been constantly sighting reasons for why Jennings production could be a sham or not something to be excited about.

Each arguement has some backing, but when you put all of Patlers doubt against Jennings on a wall and examine it, most of it holds little water and Jennings just keeps poking holes while Patler plugs them wiht new reasosn for why Jennings might not be a great player.

Whatever though...I guess I'm partial to Jennings.

I have never said a single one of those things!
I have never said his production was a sham.
I don't get excited about ANYONE'S performance. I just accept it for what it is.
If you think I have not liked Jennings as a player, you do not read my writings very closely. There is just too many years of coaching in me to get overly excited about any player, or predict season or career performances. About the time you do they tear up a knee or something and are never the same again.

It still remains unlikely that Jennings will get 60 catches and 1000 yards, simply because so few rookies do. If he does, great! But guess what?If he gets 80 catches and 1500 yeards as a rookie, it doesn't mean he will make the Hall of Fame, even though it would project to 1280 catches for 24,000 yards over a 16 year career.

Accept the now for the now, and don't set yourself up for disappointment by expectations for the future. As coaches always say, take it one game at a time.

I sincerely hope Jennings becomes an All-Pro. Hawk, Colledge and Spitz, too. However, I'm not about to predict it for anyone of them after just four games.

[Patler]

Speaking of Fergie, what a nightmarish season he is having. After not doing ANYTHING the first three games, now he may have broken his foot..And frankly, with the emergence of K-Rob, I really don't think it'll really make a difference, because he wasn't making any type of an impact anyways (offensively at least. He has made some plays on ST). :sad:

You can pretty much say the same thing for his whole career.

[Patler]

P.S. Jennings has made plays all through the minicamps, the OTAs, the preseason, and the regular season thus far. Will it continue? No one knows for sure, but he's doing great so far.

I agree with that completely.

[BF4MVP]

Speaking of Fergie, what a nightmarish season he is having. After not doing ANYTHING the first three games, now he may have broken his foot..And frankly, with the emergence of K-Rob, I really don't think it'll really make a difference, because he wasn't making any type of an impact anyways (offensively at least. He has made some plays on ST). :sad:

You can pretty much say the same thing for his whole career.
I can't disagree with you..But I mean, come on..He has like 30 yards through 4 game..

[RashanGary]

Well, you only had the preseason games to watch. I saw multiple hours of practice and watched the guy catch everything thrown his way.

I appologize for being an ignorant fan and assuming that route running and pass catching would transfer to the field.

[Patler]

Well, you only had the preseason games to watch. I saw multiple hours of practice and watched the guy catch everything thrown his way.

I appologize for being an ignorant fan and assuming that route running and pass catching would transfer to the field.

I haven't the slightest clue where that comment is coming from. Who said they wouldn't transfer to the field? But those alone are not enough for a great season, because external factors over which the player has absolutely no control also enter into the final result. Ask Javon Walker last year.

[the_idle_threat]

It still remains unlikely that Jennings will get 60 catches and 1000 yards, simply because so few rookies do.

I'm sorry Patler, but you have traded in your trademark rationality for sheer stubbornness here. I'm disappointed that you would make a statement like the one above, which so completely lacks critical thought. Who cares about the Jennings' specific circumstances, right? He's a rookie, and that seems to be all you need to know.

Did you read my 5-point reasoning above? For that matter, let me add a sixth reason why Jennings has a good chance of getting 1000 yards this season: The pass interference rules that have been enforced more often than not over the past couple of seasons have made it even easier than before for WRs to pile up yardage. 1000 yards is not All-Pro anymore ... 24 guys reached that mark in 2004 (including 3 guys on the same team) and 20 guys did it last year. Jennings got mugged on a non-call last night, but in general, it's a hands-off league more so than ever. He should benefit from the rules as much as any other player.

[mission]

It still remains unlikely that Jennings will get 60 catches and 1000 yards, simply because so few rookies do.

I'm sorry Patler, but you have traded in your trademark rationality for sheer stubbornness here. I'm disappointed that you would make a statement like the one above, which so completely lacks critical thought. Who cares about the Jennings' specific circumstances, right? He's a rookie, and that seems to be all you need to know.

Did you read my 5-point reasoning above? For that matter, let me add a sixth reason why Jennings has a good chance of getting 1000 yards this season: The pass interference rules that have been enforced more often than not over the past couple of seasons have made it even easier than before for WRs to pile up yardage. 1000 yards is not All-Pro anymore ... 24 guys reached that mark in 2004 (including 3 guys on the same team) and 20 guys did it last year. Jennings got mugged on a non-call last night, but in general, it's a hands-off league more so than ever. He should benefit from the rules as much as any other player.

and BTW: did you see his moves to get off the line on that play? that's something that a lot of vets dont even have. he has that shake and bake in his hips that is simply immeasurable.

im not even sure chuck norris could do that. :?:

[Guiness]

I haven't the slightest clue where that comment is coming from. Who said they wouldn't transfer to the field? But those alone are not enough for a great season, because external factors over which the player has absolutely no control also enter into the final result. ASk Javon Walker last year.

I know what you're trying to say Patty, but I wish you wouldn't bring JW into this conversation, except to mention that he's doing a decent job of making up forget about him. What happened to JW last year was a brutal injury, and I don't even want to think of Jennings this way.

FWIW I agree that it's unlikely GJ will see 60 catches/1000yds. He's been playing great up until now, but I think a couple of factors will prevent him from hitting those milestones.

The first is what you mentioned - the 'rookie wall' - it is a big deal, and pretty tough on the system I would think. I would think the coaching staff would be watching rookies for signs of overtraining, and cutting back their reps, both in practice and games, if necessary to preserver their health. I know I played a year of junior hockey, and lost ~25lbs over the course of the year. I literaly couldn't eat enough.

The second is the emergence of KRob - if he continues to play as he is, and stays out of jail, Favre will spread the ball around to all three guys. This would be very good for the team - I'd love to see all three of those guys over 700 yards.

OTOH what might push the WR numbers up a bit is if the TE's continue to play the way they are. They won't get many looks outside of checkdown passes if this continues. Less balls for them means more for the WRs.

[Patler]

It still remains unlikely that Jennings will get 60 catches and 1000 yards, simply because so few rookies do.

I'm sorry Patler, but you have traded in your trademark rationality for sheer stubbornness here. I'm disappointed that you would make a statement like the one above, which so completely lacks critical thought. Who cares about the Jennings' specific circumstances, right? He's a rookie, and that seems to be all you need to know.

Did you read my 5-point reasoning above? For that matter, let me add a sixth reason why Jennings has a good chance of getting 1000 yards this season: The pass interference rules that have been enforced more often than not over the past couple of seasons have made it even easier than before for WRs to pile up yardage. 1000 yards is not All-Pro anymore ... 24 guys reached that mark in 2004 (including 3 guys on the same team) and 20 guys did it last year. Jennings got mugged on a non-call last night, but in general, it's a hands-off league more so than ever. He should benefit from the rules as much as any other player.

You guys continue to take isolated statements and interpret an overall attitude that is NOT what I have said. I not only agree with your points in Jennings favor, I said pretty much the same thing myself. I quote:

"If Walker stayed in GB, Jennings would not have the same opportunity he has right now. So far, things are aligning for Jennings to have a very good rookie season. BUT, through no fault of his, that can change. If he stays healthy, if Favre stays healthy, if the running game stays mediocre, and if the Packers are behind a lot, he very well might make 60/1000. But things can and do change, which is why rookies don't typically reach those numbers."

I agree with you, but I also see the flip side. Right now, Jennings is in a prime position to perform. But, what if instead of a stinger, Favre had a broken collar bone and would be out the next 8 or 10 games? Would your outlook for Jennings numbers for the season change at all? What if Jennings turns an ankle and misses just 2 games? 1000 yarsd becomes a lot tougher. What if (a BIG IF, here) the running game takes off, and all of a sudden Favre is only throwing 25-30 passes a game? Jennings would have far fewer opportunities. What if the run defense collapses, and opponents routinely knock of 7-8 minute drives so the Packers have fewer oppoertunities with the ball?

For all of these reasons, I don't assume that Driver will get a 1000 yards this year. Why should I assume that Jennings will? Just too many outside factors.

[Patler]

Let me ask a few more questions:

With 376 TDs in his last 14 seasons, averaging 27 a season, Did you assume Favre would get more than 20 last year? To be honest, I sort of did.

When he had 15 after 7 games and was at or near the league leaders, did it seem 25-30 was a likely total, and 20 a "cinch" for the season? Again, to be honest, I did, because I figured they would pass up a storm trailing game after game.

Did you ever in your wildest dreams expect Favre to go 9 games and throw for only 5 TDs, or throw for just 1 in his last 5 games after having routine strings of 20+ games in a row with TD passes? He would end one long string and immediately start another. With 19 Tds after 11 games, did you ever think it would be a struggle for him to get 20 for the season in 2005? As it was it took him to the end of the 3rd qtr. in the last game of the year, against Seattle who was playing for nothing before Favre got #20.

Things happen. Sometimes good, sometimes bad. Thats why significant accomplishments, like 1000 yards for a receiver, are uncommon. Very good players do not always achieve them.

Do I think Jennings CAN do it-Yes. Do I EXPECT him to do it? - No. As I said, I don't EXPECT Driver to do it either, and he has proven that he can.

[Packers4Ever]

Greg Jennings finished tonight's game with 5 catches for 86 yards. That gives him 15 catches for 259 yards after 4 games. At this pace, he would have 60 catches for 1036 yards for the season.

People basically said I was crazy when I opined that Jennings had a very good shot at a 1000-yard rookie season. Things are looking pretty good now.

Yes, I started this thread to pat myself on the back. But also, Jennings' play is a small positive we can look to after a game full of negatives.
.................................................. .......
I didn't know, IDT that you had made this prediction for Greg Jennings but looks like you may hit it on the buzzer or better! Congrats !! The first time I saw him making some pretty fantastic catches I couldn't believe he was a rookie WR, but man, he is good and I think can only get better. He's going to be fun to watch.
.................................................. ......

[Patler]

Just to be clear. I have said in the past that 50 receptions, maybe even 60 is a more reachable target for Jennings than 1000 receiving yards. Generally, there are about twice as many receivers with 50 or more catches than there are with 1000 or more yards. Typically, to get 1000 yards you have to have at least about 70 catches.

To discuss his positives. I've tried to watch to see why he picks up yards after a catch as well as he does.. He's not exceptionally fast, nor exceptionally shifty. What I first noticed on his TD last week, and watched for last night is this: He makes a cut or change in direction on his first step after he hits the ground. Many receivers take a step or two before they can make another change in direction. When he jumps to catch a ball, he seems to do it by twisting his body as he comes down so he can plant one foot and go in an unexpected direction with his first stride running. When he catches it on the ground, his first stride as he secures the ball is a change in direction. A defender right on top of him often doesn't get the clean shot at a tackle that he thinks he will get.

Now I'm not saying he is another Sharpe, he has to prove that, but Sharpe did the same thing, but not usually jumping. He could catch a square out and cut simultaneously. Of course, he would occassionally drop an easy one because of the quick move. He could alos simply run over most cornerbacks and many of the safeties.

[the_idle_threat]

Let me ask a few more questions:

With 376 TDs in his last 14 seasons, averaging 27 a season, Did you assume Favre would get more than 20 last year? To be honest, I sort of did.

When he had 15 after 7 games and was at or near the league leaders, did it seem 25-30 was a likely total, and 20 a "cinch" for the season? Again, to be honest, I did, because I figured they would pass up a storm trailing game after game.

Did you ever in your wildest dreams expect Favre to go 9 games and throw for only 5 TDs, or throw for just 1 in his last 5 games after having routine strings of 20+ games in a row with TD passes? He would end one long string and immediately start another. With 19 Tds after 11 games, did you ever think it would be a struggle for him to get 20 for the season in 2005? As it was it took him to the end of the 3rd qtr. in the last game of the year, against Seattle who was playing for nothing before Favre got #20.

Things happen. Sometimes good, sometimes bad. Thats why significant accomplishments, like 1000 yards for a receiver, are uncommon. Very good players do not always achieve them.

Do I think Jennings CAN do it-Yes. Do I EXPECT him to do it? - No. As I said, I don't EXPECT Driver to do it either, and he has proven that he can.

Maybe that's our issue here, my friend. If you read my posts, you will see I'm not assuming nor expecting anything, nor am I asking you to assume or expect anything. I'm just saying Jennings has a good shot. A good shot means that it might happen, but then again it might not. Sounds like we are in agreement after all. So will you stop crapping in my cornflakes already? :razz:

[Patler]

Sounds like we are in agreement after all. So will you stop crapping in my cornflakes already? :razz:

Absolutely not. You leave those cornflakes out there, and they are a fair target! :mrgreen: :mrgreen:

Actually, I think you and I, (or maybe someone else) reached this conclusion about Jennings once before.

[the_idle_threat]

Sounds like we are in agreement after all. So will you stop crapping in my cornflakes already? :razz:

Absolutely not. You leave those cornflakes out there, and they are a fair target! :mrgreen: :mrgreen:

Actually, I think you and I, (or maybe someone else) reached this conclusion about Jennings once before.

Probably was us. I said at the beginning of the season (before the Bear game) that I thought Jennings had a great chance to be a 1000-yard rookie receiver, so this all has been hashed out before. Things have developed for Jennings just about as I expected so far, so I threw this thread out there.

I acknowledge that circumstances can change, however, so it remains to be seen whether Jennings can keep it up. It's a long season, as I have said to the "Bears are gonna go to the Super Bowl" folks.

[Guiness]

Interesting observation Patler re: cut on first step. Not something I noticed. You see a lot of guys try and cut as they're catching the ball, and get drops because they fail to haul it in before making the move. I'll have to get a look at some of the catches where he get decent YAC and watch for that.

One thing I have noticed though, that has helped him at least twice - great downfield blocking by that consumate pro, DD. On his 5yd catch and run for a TD, Driver threw a beautiful block on Bly a full 30+ yards beyond the line of scrimage. That's what I call playing until the whistle!

[red]

jennings looks like he's become bretts new go-to-guy. driver has been dropping some big passes lately, and jennings seems to be stepping up more

[red]

he came into a situation where a starting spot was wide open, with a disappointing veteran (Ferguson) penciled into it.
Speaking of Fergie, what a nightmarish season he is having. After not doing ANYTHING the first three games, now he may have broken his foot..And frankly, with the emergence of K-Rob, I really don't think it'll really make a difference, because he wasn't making any type of an impact anyways (offensively at least. He has made some plays on ST). :sad:

the problem is, we might have seen the last of k-rob for awhile. his probation hearing is this week i think

wasn't it great to see a wr knock down not one, but 2 bad passes out of the cb's hands. unlike fergy who would try to help the cb catch the ball. it was just really nice to see a wr turn into a db for a change when he had to

[Guiness]

Ya, those plays by Krob were pretty nice. Showed good presence of mind.

I just had a flashback of Fergy getting his pocket picked last year - can't remember which game it was, but he caught the ball, I think he was holding it against his hip. The DB came up, stripped it from him and took off running.

[HarveyWallbangers]

jennings looks like he's become bretts new go-to-guy. driver has been dropping some big passes lately, and jennings seems to be stepping up more

Nah, Driver dropped a couple of balls, but he's still #1 by a longshot. Even last night, Driver had more "looks" than Jennings. For the year, Driver has 19 more "looks" than Jennings.

[PaCkFan_n_MD]

For the year, Driver has 19 more "looks" than Jennings.


When you say “looks”, I’m guessing you mean pass attempts because that would be pretty freaky is they started keeping track of the number of times Brett (or any qb for that matter) looks your way during a game. :razz:

[GrnBay007]

For the year, Driver has 19 more "looks" than Jennings.


When you say “looks”, I’m guessing you mean pass attempts because that would be pretty freaky is they started keeping track of the number of times Brett (or any qb for that matter) looks your way during a game. :razz:


I was at a game once and I'm pretty sure he looked my way twice. :razz: :wink:

[HarveyWallbangers]

When you say “looks”, I’m guessing you mean pass attempts because that would be pretty freaky is they started keeping track of the number of times Brett (or any qb for that matter) looks your way during a game. :razz:

:D

Actually, he has 9 more looks (not 19) than Jennings. As Jennings does better, it would likely open up more opportunities (and fewer double teams) for Driver.

http://fantasysports.yahoo.com/analysis/news?slug=mb-lookstouches-week4-2006&prov=yhoo&type=lgns&league=fantasy/nfl

[PaCkFan_n_MD]

Yep, I hope kepps getting better, great pick by TT.

[Bretsky]

2. Jennings is the only other player to throw to behind Donald Driver.


B

Bretsky,

I disagree with the above statement. I though Koren Robinson played well last night. He showed good field sense when twice he broke up a short pass that could have been intercepted by his defender.

His stay with the Packers could be shortened by his legal troubles but the guy has shown talent.

OPF[/quote]

We'll have to agree to disagree; I like KROB, but I don't think his route running ability is nearly as polished as Driver or even Jennings. My argument against him now is that he's not showing a solid ability to get open.

But he's only been around a bit so I'll cut him some slack and consider him adequate. Still need to replace the Fraud though.

B

[Bretsky]

he came into a situation where a starting spot was wide open, with a disappointing veteran (Ferguson) penciled into it.
Speaking of Fergie, what a nightmarish season he is having. After not doing ANYTHING the first three games, now he may have broken his foot..And frankly, with the emergence of K-Rob, I really don't think it'll really make a difference, because he wasn't making any type of an impact anyways (offensively at least. He has made some plays on ST). :sad:




Be like most of us. Expect nothing from Fergy as a WR and at least then you can count on him coming through. This will be the Fraud's last season as a Green Bay Packer.

[Bretsky]

Speaking of Fergie, what a nightmarish season he is having. After not doing ANYTHING the first three games, now he may have broken his foot..And frankly, with the emergence of K-Rob, I really don't think it'll really make a difference, because he wasn't making any type of an impact anyways (offensively at least. He has made some plays on ST). :sad:

You can pretty much say the same thing for his whole career.
I can't disagree with you..But I mean, come on..He has like 30 yards through 4 game..

That's a bonus; kind of like the ugly guy scoring a date with the perfect 10. We'll take what we can from him.

[SD GB fan]

jennings and that rookie in NO are impressive.